jason123:

It affect everyone except you are in government. Try spending a year in Lagos and see what I am talking about.

Hopefully one day I'll get the chance to stay in Lagos for an extended period of time and see for myself.

asha 80:


why do i get the feeling that the question of getting there is actually because of the system/structure we are running?

LWMKD

Is that a rhetorical question? You know the answer to that.

Beaf:

That is a roundabout argument. There is punishment for corruption in Nigeria, there are laws and there is a constitution. If these are not being adhered to, it is because the system allows or even encourages such breaches. Nobody is born corrupt, the system IS inefectual and was designed by corrupt generals so they could continue to milk the economy after they had left power.
In Lagos you have given as an example, Fashola has completely changed the system to get a few things working (the emphasis is on "few". It would require a total systemic change to get Lagos to operate even at West African standards; outside West Africa (talkless of the West), the organisation of Lagos is a disgrace, there is still a very long way to go.

Improve the system and you kill corruption. The sharing of free money at Abuja is the number one reason for our shabby values. We need true federalism that will allow the people to actually generate money. Nigeria is a total embarrassment as far as development is concerned, we are an absolute disgrace.

@ bolded. Gbam! These would[b] DEFINATELY[/b] REDUUCE CORRUPTION AND ABOUT 60% OF OUR COLLECTIVE PROBLEMS.

eku_bear:

Fair enough. If I'm wrong I'm wrong. I guess I've been lucky not to experience the negative parts of police in Nigeria, who knows. Or maybe it doesn't affect you if you are above some level of wealth.

Una don hear am. Eku, your type (noveau riche) are many in the jokes/forum games/romance section.

I still don't know why you feel at home in this section. These section is for PROPER Nigerians.

I hope most see that rich dudes sleeping with young girls is not an example of corruption, though. Power and wealth disparities yes, corruption no.

ola olabiy:

Una don hear am. Eku, your type (noveau riche) are many in the jokes/forum games/romance section.

I still don't know why you feel at home in this section. These section is for PROPER Nigerians.

Omo, relax now! Must you try to show everyone that you made a point?

eku_bear:

I hope most see that rich dudes sleeping with young girls is not an example of corruption, though. Power and wealth disparities yes, corruption no.

Are you trying to justify flirting with Isale gangan

[size=15pt]do something about electricity in nigeria[/size]

eku_bear:

I hope most see that rich dudes sleeping with young girls is not an example of corruption, though. Power and wealth disparities yes, corruption no.

What about lecturers sleeping with students for marks?

eku_bear:

Fair enough. If I'm wrong I'm wrong. I guess I've been lucky not to experience the negative parts of police in Nigeria, who knows. Or maybe it doesn't affect you if you are above some level of wealth.

eku_bear, Let me ask; (for my own sanity)

The only experience you've had with the Nigerian Police system was when you went to Nigeria for a short visit and drove on our highways, probably inside a Family Vehicle driven by a Nigeria savvy Personal driver, right?

You've never really interacted with A Nigerian Civil servant in their natural habitat(offices, institutions, etc) all by yourself before, right?

eku_bear:

Fair enough. If I'm wrong I'm wrong. I guess I've been lucky not to experience the negative parts of police in Nigeria, who knows. Or maybe it doesn't affect you if you are above some level of wealth.

if you are  in the right level of wealth, YOU WILL GET AWAY WITH ANYTHING in this country. you will be what our police call 'pesin'

jsut driving a late model car sends a message to the police that you probably have the numbers of some ogas

Some questions for you to ponder.
1. What is the magnitude of young girls doing in Nigeria as compared to other places, notably developed sociities?
2. Can a corrupt poltician use his ill-gotten wealth to entice a young girl?
3. Do you think the women who left their husbands for OBJ would have done so without his position, power, and wealth?
4. At the end of the day, what do you do with ill-gotten wealth? Do you give it away to charity?

first, young girls sleeping in Nigeria cannot be reasonably compared to other places as there arent convenient or logical measures in place to effectively make such comparison.  In Brazil, more than 6 in every 8 girls you meet are likely to sleep with you irrespective of your age as long as you have the money.

Second, a corrupt politician, just like an average man will respond to his sexual pull as he deems fit.  The fact that he's corrupt does not make the process itself corrupt.  men who make their money legitimately also entice young girls with wealth, it will be absurd to call it corruption, especially if the process is not in breach of a constitution.

Third, those women who left their husbands for OBJ demonstrated their freedom of choice and free will as allowed within the boundaries of the national constitution, the fact that OBJ has power and wealth is immaterial, it's a part of being human, women will naturally move on to somewhere they feel safer and more secure. . . again, it will be absurd to tag this in line with corruption, except if of course they were blackmailed into doing so.

Fourth, people do whatever they wish with ill gotten wealth and it's not every corrupt politician that has a habit of engaging in multiple sexual partners or having young mistresses.  many even give a sizable sum of their loot to charity!. . .


It is totally unreasonable to say I am corrupt simply because I am rich and my girlfriend is way younger than me, this should even be a norm to begin with!

.

Beaf:

That is a roundabout argument. There is punishment for corruption in Nigeria, there are laws and there is a constitution. If these are not being adhered to, it is because the system allows or even encourages such breaches. Nobody is born corrupt, the system IS inefectual and was designed by corrupt generals so they could continue to milk the economy after they had left power.
In Lagos you have given as an example, Fashola has completely changed the system to get a few things working (the emphasis is on "few". It would require a total systemic change to get Lagos to operate even at West African standards; outside West Africa (talkless of the West), the organisation of Lagos is a disgrace, there is still a very long way to go.

Improve the system and you kill corruption. The sharing of free money at Abuja is the number one reason for our shabby values. We need true federalism that will allow the people to actually generate money. Nigeria is a total embarrassment as far as development is concerned, we are an absolute disgrace.

You can still have a corrupt system with true federalism, confederationism, or any other political structure for that matter. Surely you are not suggesting that all unitary political systems are as corrupt as Nigeria. Federalism will solve some problems but there is no guarantee it will tackle corruption.

For instance, will corruption suddenly disappear from places that already oil resources once true federalism is in place?

eku_bear:

I hope most see that rich dudes sleeping with young girls is not an example of corruption, though. Power and wealth disparities yes, corruption no.

dude, did you see pot bellied old men coming into campus every day to pick up girls?

do you see your classmates going to party with governors every weekend?

do you see them doing prostitution on the side

do you see your classmates seeing absolutely nothing wrong with fecking old men for money?

Katsumoto:

You can still have a corrupt system with true federalism, confederationism, or any other political structure for that matter. Surely you are not suggesting that all unitary political systems are as corrupt as Nigeria. Federalism will solve some problems but there is no guarantee it will tackle corruption.

For instance, will corruption suddenly disappear from places that already oil resources once true federalism is in place?

At least, they would be able to put their form of "jungle" justice to act as a deterrent.

Kilode?!:

eku_bear, Let me ask; (for my own sanity)

The only experience you've had with the Nigerian Police system was when you went to Nigeria for a short visit and rode on our highways, probably inside a Family Vehicle driven by a Nigeria savvy Personal driver, right?

Mostly correct, yeah. Longest I've stayed at a time is 1.5 months.

You've never really interacted with A Nigerian Civil servant in their natural habitat(offices, institutions, etc) all by yourself before, right?

Yes. I had to get a new passport one time, but that is about it. . . and I didn't do it by myself.

-double post-

all this noise about federalism

are those banks where ibru and co robbed depositors blind federal in nature?

jason123:

At least, they would be able to put their form of "jungle" justice to act as a deterrent.

You mean like MEND getting new leadership every two days after the last leader is settled? What jungle justice have you seen in Nigeria against pen robbers. I see it against leg robbers.

oyb:

all this noise about federalism

are those banks where ibru and co robbed depositors blind federal in nature?

Thanks for asking him o.

It seems these people don't understand the magnitude and how endemic this corruption is.

eku_bear:

Mostly correct, yeah. Longest I've stayed at a time is 1.5 months.
Yes. I had to get a new passport one time, but that is about it. . . and I didn't do it by myself.

corruption right there  

rest assured some shishi changed hands

I'm kinda glad you are interested in Nigeria politics, We need more people like you to show interest. You naivety and innocence might just turn you into a good, effective change maker.

no offense intended to anyone - dimeji bankole, our minister of finance, bukola saraki, bred and buttered in uk. just sayin'

nigerian corrupption and the culture of impunity have a way of wearing off on people

corruption right there

rest assured some shishi changed hands

haha!

oyb:

dude, did you see pot bellied old men coming into campus every day to pick up girls?

do you see your classmates going to party with governors every weekend?

do you see them doing prostitution on the side

do you see your classmates seeing absolutely nothing wrong with fecking old men for money?

The school I went to, most of the kids are pretty well-off and thus the fraction of those who have sugardaddies is small.

With that said, I know from personal experience that there are girls who do those things. I could even name the name of the (somewhat famous) strip club that these girls I went to college with worked at.

I don't understand why this is being made into some sort of corruption/morality play. Strips clubs, escort work, prostitution all over the world pays a lot of money. Having a sugar daddy also is pretty lucrative. If you are rich or well-off, you are less likely to do these things. If poor, then more likely.

I don't see what any of this has to do with corruption.

Katsumoto:

You mean like MEND getting new leadership every two days after the last leader is settled? What jungle justice have you seen in Nigeria against pen robbers. I see it against leg robbers.

None for now (pen robbers). That's because most of them are supported and sponsored by the abuja cabal. Moreover, they use illiterates and thugs to fight for them that's why I said I support ACN to at least try the education polices used in the old west in Nigeria. Even the west has the highest number of thugs in Nigeria since the education policies has been removed which is caused by the centralisation of power. Let every region grow at their pace to reduce corruption. Things would naturally evolve( both, politically and economically) from there on.

violent:

first, young girls sleeping in Nigeria cannot be reasonably compared to other places as there arent convenient or logical measures in place to effectively make such comparison.  In Brazil, more than 6 in every 8 girls you meet are likely to sleep with you irrespective of your age as long as you have the money.

Second, a corrupt politician, just like an average man will respond to his sexual pull as he deems fit.  The fact that he's corrupt does not make the process itself corrupt.  men who make their money legitimately also entice young girls with wealth, it will be absurd to call it corruption, especially if the process is not in breach of a constitution.

Third, those women who left their husbands for OBJ demonstrated their freedom of choice and free will as allowed within the boundaries of the national constitution, the fact that OBJ has power and wealth is immaterial, it's a part of being human, women will naturally move on to somewhere they feel safer and more secure. . . again, it will be absurd to tag this in line with corruption, except if of course they were blackmailed into doing so.

Fourth, people do whatever they wish with ill gotten wealth and it's not every corrupt politician that has a habit of engaging in multiple sexual partners or having young mistresses.  many even give a sizable sum of their loot to charity!. . .


It is totally unreasonable to say I am corrupt simply because I am rich and my girlfriend is way younger than me, this should even be a norm to begin with!

.

You miss the point; being rich and having a young girlfriend is not the issue here. The issue here is a generation of young girls who are doing it. What was the percentage of girls doing this in the early 80s (when corruption was not at the magnitude it is at today) when compared to now? The boys can't do the same, hence why they are into Yahoo yahoo. Please compare the prepondrance of this issue in Nigeria with more developed societies. Brazil is not a good example due to the level of poverty in it (though the situation has improved in the last 8 years thanks to Lula)

Katsumoto:

You can still have a corrupt system with true federalism, confederationism, or any other political structure for that matter. Surely you are not suggesting that all unitary political systems are as corrupt as Nigeria. Federalism will solve some problems but there is no guarantee it will tackle corruption.

For instance, will corruption suddenly disappear from places that already oil resources once true federalism is in place?

you cannot totally eradicate corruption.even in uk some level of corruption exists.however as you are trying to fight corruption why not set up a system that does not encourage corruption?take yourself as an example if you are inherenlty corrrupt person which scenario will you prefer?

1.i simply sit my arse in my state capital and get assured allocation to run my state without actually doing anything

  or

2.i have to be proactiave in generating revenue to run my state whether oyo,anambra kogi bornu?i have to stress myself to marshall a plan that will bring money into the state(ok minus oil states).now in this scenario Katsumoto tell me what will make a man like akala and ohakim want to be a governor?

the scenario 2 helps to eliminate the daft and visionless corrupt person and now leaves visionary corrupt person to still seek power.this now in turn makes fighting these corrupt remnants a bit easier.

eku_bear:

Mostly correct, yeah. Longest I've stayed at a time is 1.5 months.
Yes. I had to get a new passport one time, but that is about it. . . and I didn't do it by myself.

. Eku, Dad asked a driver to go and pick it up abi? And the Director there complied straight away. Eku my Ekuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

oyb:

corruption right there  

rest assured some shishi changed hands

You go kill pesin oooooooooooooooooooooo

eku_bear:

The school I went to, most of the kids are pretty well-off and thus the fraction of those who have sugardaddies is small.

With that said, I know from personal experience that there are girls who do those things. I could even name the name of the (somewhat famous) strip club that these girls I went to college with worked at.

I don't understand why this is being made into some sort of corruption/morality play. Strips clubs, escort work, prostitution all over the world pays a lot of money. Having a sugar daddy also is pretty lucrative. If you are rich or well-off, you are less likely to do these things. If poor, then more likely.

I don't see what any of this has to do with corruption.

u never see awon bigz girlz  

oyb:

all this noise about federalism

are those banks where ibru and co robbed depositors blind federal in nature?

Read what I posted earlier:

Actually, what we call corruption may not be what it actually is. What I mean is, people just prefer favoritism or as the oyibo people call it nepotism. If you are in a very good position to help the people close to you, would you not? If your uncle is the MD of Shell in Nigeria and you need a job, would he not fix up? Is that corruption?
Bribery is encouraged by a strong centered government. We need to handle our business our own way. What you call "eguje" may be cool in other parts of Nigeria. We need to decentralise the government, resources and Security.
The reasons are :

1) Government: If the government is decentralised, the power these cabals have would be greatly reduced so as the access to money. The would reduce their influence greatly although  they would still have some n their regions and since its the people that elected them (not over-lorded on them like in present Nigeria), they can be removed or punished by these same electorates
2) Resources: If regions control their incomes and revenue then how would their leaders be more corrupt than what we have in Nigeria. What I mean is, take for example ND, if the regional leader of ND is corrupt and does not develop his environment, would it not affect him. Another argument is, if a yoruba, hausa or igbo man does have access to the oil in ND, he would not care for the people of ND thus being "more" corrupt than he needs to be.
3) Security: different groups have various ways of castigating their corrupt leaders. What might be a good way of punishment to you might be seen as an ethnic punishment or a wrong way of doing things by me.

All in all, a good way to tackle corruption is a combination of these 3 factors.MO.

ps: I might have made some typos so bear with me.

These are measures to reduce it not remove it.

ola olabiy:

What about lecturers sleeping with students for marks?

Yeah, that is corruption. But hopefully it is clear how this is different with a student sleeping with some rich dude for money.

In the case of the former, the lecturer is violating the duties of his job by exchanging grades for sex. It isn't his prerogative to trade away grades for anything.

In the latter, no corruption is happening. . . just an exchange of money for sex.

oyb:

corruption right there  

rest assured some shishi changed hands

LOL

no offense intended to anyone - dimeji bankole, our minister of finance, bukola saraki, bred and buttered in uk. just sayin'

nigerian corrupption and the culture of impunity have a way of wearing off on people

I agree. Dimeji Bankole is a disappointment. But I'm just holding out hope that it might be because those people are from Nigerian families with deep links into the corrupt structures we have. Some of those kids went to Harvard, Cambridge and Oxford on Stolen Public Money. They come on NL sometimes to defend their Daddy

I said that because I doubt eku_bear has a Federal minister in his lineage, so he might not see the Nigerian corrupt system as his bread and butter. I hope he doesn't. Eku defend yaself.

Katsumoto:

You can still have a corrupt system with true federalism, confederationism, or any other political structure for that matter. Surely you are not suggesting that all unitary political systems are as corrupt as Nigeria. Federalism will solve some problems but there is no guarantee it will tackle corruption.

For instance, will corruption suddenly disappear from places that already oil resources once true federalism is in place?

You can have corruption in true federalism, but representation of the citizen will be so much greater that it would dilute the possibility of corruption to the barest minimum.
One thing for you to really consider, is that there is no country half as big or as complex as Nigeria that practices a unitary system of govt. Unitary govt is suited to smaller, more ethnically and religiously homogenous countries.
Another thing to have in mind, is the fact the there is no unitary govt the World over, that distributes money from the centre; it is always from the provinces and municipalities upward.

Just as there are oil resources in some parts of the country, so there are gold, uranium, precious stones etc in other parts. What will change will be the way revenues and ownership are apportioned; under true federalism, there will no longer be one almighty, corruption attracting owner (FG), rather wealth centres will be distributed and corruption diluted.