Onlytruth:

So how did it end up in African lexicon? Abi somebody de call us monkey indirectly.
hehehe!  

It's not just used in relation to Africans.  I've heard Oyinbos refer to themselves or others as being tribal.  For example, amongst the elite who guard their territory and their social standings, they'll refer to themselves as being tribal, or others will call them "tribal."  Or sometimes, the word tribal will be substituted for the word "clannish."  I'm not a linguist and won't get bogged down with the evolution of the word, but I do believe it is used for a variety of groups not just monkeys. lol

Europeans use the term tribe for people they consider themselves inferior. They use tribe for Africans, even though many of our ethnicities are much larger than their own group. How come the Welsh with a population of 5 million people be considered an ethnicity, while the Igbo are considered a tribe with a population of 25+ million.

I have even heard the term in U.S. media to describe the various "tribes" of Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Abagworo's perspective is pretty easy to understand. He believes that Igbo are better off in Nigeria than outside of it. Now, perhaps this belief is something you disagree with. But if you agree with that belief, then 75% of what Abagworo says naturally follows from it.

Of course, the issue is that many Igbo here don't have this same belief.

EzeUche_:

They use tribe for Africans, even though many of our ethnicities are much larger than their own group. How come the Welsh with a population of 5 million people be considered an ethnicity, while the Igbo are considered a tribe with a population of 25+ million.

I've always hated the word tribe for that reason. Just seems disrespectful somehow. An entire nation of people shouldn't be called a tribe.

Posted by: isale_gan2

It's not just used in relation to Africans.  I've heard Oyinbos refer to themselves or others as being tribal.  For example, amongst the elite who guard their territory and their social standings, they'll refer to themselves as being tribal, or others will call them "tribal."  Or sometimes, the word tribal will be substituted for the word "clannish."  I'm not a linguist and won't get bogged down with the evolution of the word, but I do believe it is used for a variety of groups not just monkeys. lol

Frankly, I've never researched this. You sound correct honestly.
But how did it become African almost exclusively? I have heard "ethnicity" more than "tribe".

ethnocentrism is the correct term in my opinion.

tribalism sound like racism  

EzeUche_:

Abagworo has really fallen to great depths. Being labeled a tribalist has hurt his pysche. He needs to be healed.

what

do u not think it is u that needs healing here

alj harem:

what

do u not think it is u that needs healing here

I too need healing. The healing comfort of a Northern woman. Preferably of Kanuri or Fulani stock.

EzeUche_:

I never denied my love for the Igbo. But my love extends to Ibibios as well. Because they too, I consider my brothers and sisters, not only through cultural similarities, but by blood.

If I was a tribalist as some would say, I would only love the Igbo and nothing more. How can I love another ethnicity?

Do I hate the Yoruba? No. I dislike a few Yorubas.

Do I hate the Hausa? No. I actually admire their tenacity. Their single devotion to their God.

You don't hate Yorubas, yet you have spent countless hours on Nairaland calling them names! You never mentioned a few names, it's always all Yorubas are cowards, all yorubas are backstabbers and countless other epithets

If you love Yorubas, you certainly have a weird way of showing it.

We should stop being too thin skinned.

EVen in the bible they referred to Isreal as the 12 TRIBES of Israel.

Does that mean they were inferior too? Never for once did I hear the Ethnic group of Judah rather it was the tribe of Judah

dayokanu:

We should stop being too thin skinned.

EVen in the bible they referred to Isreal as the 12 TRIBES of Israel.

Does that mean they were inferior too? Never for once did I hear the Ethnic group of Judah rather it was the tribe of Judah

When did the bible become a universal measure for the meaning of English words?
If we need the etymology of a word, we research it, not look in the bible. English wasn't invented in Isreal, neither is the bible an authority in the language.

Should we also open the Torah and the Quran?

[size=14pt]@Alj Harem,[/size]

http://odili.net/news/source/2011/jan/25/512.html

Abagworo's assertion is quite right. You people are the confused ones because of the lack of depth and your getting bogged down by semantics.

To you people, tribalism is the same as bigotry and being recalcitrant when the issue of other tribes comes into play at any level. You also believe that tribalists are inherently anti-other tribes. You are mistaking people who are protecting the interest of their "tribes" as bigots. This is wrong.

It is obvious that people like Ibime cannot be classified as a bigots. Ibime, like every Nigerian, will verbally protect the interest of his ethnic group and probably that of his wife's ethnic group (assuming he is married and to someone from a different ethnic group). Does that make him a tribalist? I think not.

The "tribalists" on this forum using the definition of you peons, will never say anything positive about ethnic groups other than his, is unable to criticise any leader from his ethnic group, vigorously attack anyone who offers criticisms of leaders from his/region (never mind that it is constructive), and suffers from inferiority complex.

Abagworo is right.

Now, if people like Beaf are classified as detribalized, then one would be blatantly wrong, to say the least. Beaf wadooo.

ndu_chucks:

Abagworo's assertion is quite right. You people are the confused ones because of the lack of depth and your getting bogged down by semantics.

To you people, tribalism is the same as bigotry and being recalcitrant when the issue of other tribes comes into play at any level. You also believe that tribalists are inherently anti-other tribes. You are mistaking people who are protecting the interest of their "tribes" as bigots. This is wrong.

It is obvious that people like Ibime cannot be classified as a bigots. Ibime, like every Nigerian, will verbally protect the interest of his ethnic group and probably that of his wife's ethnic group (assuming he is married and to someone from a different ethnic group). Does that make him a tribalist? I think not.

The "tribalists" on this forum using the definition of you peons, will never say anything positive about ethnic groups other than his, is unable to criticise any leader from his ethnic group, vigorously attack anyone who offers criticisms of leaders from his/region (never mind that it is constructive), and suffers from inferiority complex.

Abagworo is right.

Now, if people like Beaf are classified as detribalized, then one would be blatantly wrong, to say the least. Beaf wadooo.

Poor you!
Abagworo is your replica. He was voted as one of NL's top "tribalists," a devastating event he seems not to have been able to recover from.
https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-549104.224.html

www.nairaland.com/attachments/180447_ROTFLMAO_gif3d0c775232c7f27cf80592785b9635b6

It makes this thread and your views seem very comical. But in the meantime, I have found you a girlfriend as a reward for your rubbish post:



www.nairaland.com/attachments/180447_ROTFLMAO_gif3d0c775232c7f27cf80592785b9635b6

Beaf . .

Beaf:

Poor you!
Abagworo is your replica. He was voted as one of NL's top "tribalists," a devastating event he seems not to have been able to recover from.
https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-549104.224.html

www.nairaland.com/attachments/180447_ROTFLMAO_gif3d0c775232c7f27cf80592785b9635b6

It makes this thread and your views seem very comical. But in the meantime, I have found you a girlfriend as a reward for your rubbish post:



www.nairaland.com/attachments/180447_ROTFLMAO_gif3d0c775232c7f27cf80592785b9635b6

Why I'm I giving you sleepless nights?That poll proved otherwise so it is not a good reference.I don't want to start with you because I have proven you a clown time without number.So just go siddon for gutter and eat the crumbs off GEJ's table.

Abagworo:

Why I'm I giving you sleepless nights?That poll proved otherwise so it is not a good reference.I don't want to start with you because I have proven you a clown time without number.So just go siddon for gutter and eat the crumbs off GEJ's table.

Dude, my post wasn't meant to make you hangry na! Why you de vex?
Is is because I gave ndu_chucks a babe that you are showing your hanger and jealousy? If that is the case, I found you a special one (what are friends for?); she was made specially for tribalists, you see. She even look like hidiot!

Enjoy!



www.nairaland.com/attachments/180447_ROTFLMAO_gif3d0c775232c7f27cf80592785b9635b6

There is no any form of scholastic imprint when one equates tribe with monkey. In fact, it is an indulgence devoid of intellectual pedigree. There are many tribes in Europe, America and Asia as well as Africa. The word, tribe, is not native to Africa and as such was a reference connotation used by the inventors to identify themselves.

In Europe for example, there were Visigoths, Frankish, Angles-Saxons, Slavs, Ostrogoths and Lombards. Fortunately for the Europeans, many of these tribal people grew into powerful nations. However, Africa was unfortunate to have experienced and continues to suffer under the weight of colonialism. If the tribal enclaves were allowed to grow into nations, we should be discussing nationalities instead of tribalism.

@Dede1, your analysis is right on the money.


@Beaf, what is the matter with you, are you unable to take a tiny lil' shot without going nuts? Very funny guy. By the way, your comment about Abagworo has nothing to do with the opinion he expressed

Beaf:

The word "tribe" originally meant a pack of monkey's.
Nuff said.

So when they call the tribes of Israel they were referring to Israelis as Monkeys?

The Anglo Saxon , Bavarian tribes are they referring to them as Monkeys also?

EzeUche_:

Europeans use the term tribe for people they consider themselves inferior. They use tribe for Africans, even though many of our ethnicities are much larger than their own group. How come the Welsh with a population of 5 million people be considered an ethnicity, while the Igbo are considered a tribe with a population of 25+ million.

I have even heard the term in U.S. media to describe the various "tribes" of Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Did you hear The 12 tribes of Israel? Do they consider Jews as inferior too? When they refer to Anglo Saxon and Bavarian as tribes do they mean they are inferior too?

dayokanu:

Did you hear The 12 tribes of Israel? Do they consider Jews as inferior too? When they refer to Anglo Saxon and Bavarian as tribes do they mean they are inferior too?

The 12 tribes of Israel are used to describe the descendants of the 12 sons of Jacob. That is all. Sort of what we call clans. I see no difference between clan or tribes. I consider my tribe Aro-Igbo, but my ethnicity is Igbo. Igbos are not a tribe.

And yes they are using tribe as a term of inferiority, because most English see their Anglo-Saxon ancestors as barbarians, who became civilized once William the Conqueror and his Normans created a new English hybrid.

And it all starts again


New day same shiot!

Aigbofa:

If you love Yorubas, you certainly have a weird way of showing it.

It's parsing, but he didn't say he loves Yorubas.  He'll be greeted with loud guffaws.    He said he does not hate Yorubas.

EzeUche_:

The 12 tribes of Israel are used to describe the descendants of the 12 sons of Jacob. That is all. Sort of what we call clans. I see no difference between clan or tribes. I consider my tribe Aro-Igbo, but my ethnicity is Igbo. Igbos are not a tribe.

Clan is not the same as tribe.  It would be considered a subset of tribe. Smaller and fitting into a specific tribe which in turn will fit into an ethnic group which will fit info a racial group.  Some consider ethnic group and race the same thing.

fstranger1:

And it all starts again

New day same shiot!

  Hope you have a good day.

isale_gan2:

Clan is not the same as tribe. It would be considered a subset of tribe. Smaller and fitting into a specific tribe which in turn will fit into an ethnic group which will fit info a racial group. Some consider ethnic group and race the same thing.

I can understand why too. Both ethnicity and race are social constructs, they convey much of the same thing, and in many instances (if not all) they're interchangeable.

ChinenyeN:

I can understand why too. Both ethnicity and race are social constructs, they convey much of the same thing, and in many instances (if not all) they're interchangeable.

I know, right?  Each society decides their own racial classification.  In America, where their whole history is bound by the relationship between the black slaves and white "oppressors" the truly lasting construct is your skin color and what percentage of your ancestry is black.  They had that 1/12(?) black blood disctinction in Louisiana, didn't they?

Americans, Black and White, will look at someone any other society will consider caucasian and proclaim her black. 

We're so used to the black vs white racial classification, that's why sometimes when an Igbo calls a Yoruba racist (or vice versa), he'll say, "why am I racist, we're the same color, you mean tribalist right," but in actuality, race can be any group/cultural distinction.

Or do you agree with the clsassification that the only racial groups are, Caucasian, Negroid and Mongoloid?  I'm asking with sincerity.

isale_gan2:

I know, right?  Each society decides their own racial classification.  In America, where their whole history is bound by the relationship between the black slaves and white "oppressors" the truly lasting construct is your skin color and what percentage of your ancestry is black.  They had that 1/12(?) black blood disctinction in Louisiana, didn't they?

Americans, Black and White, will look at someone any other society will consider caucasian and proclaim her black. 

We're so used to the black vs white racial classification, that's why sometimes when an Igbo calls a Yoruba racist (or vice versa), he'll say, "why am I racist, we're the same color, you mean tribalist right," but in actuality, race can be any group/cultural distinction.

Or do you agree with the clsassification that the only racial groups are, Caucasian, Negroid and Mongoloid?  I'm asking with sincerity. 

You and I are on the same page, here. I agree 100%. As for your last question, no. I don't really agree with those classification. In fact, I've always found the whole Caucasian, Negroid and Mongoloid thing difficult and at the same time, overly simplistic.

A couple of "tribe" references in science and a picture of a 'tribesman'.

Mol Biol Evol. 1992 Jan;9(1):1-13.

[size=14pt]Mitochondrial DNA phylogeny of the Old-World monkey tribe Papionini.[/size]
Disotell TR, Honeycutt RL, Ruvolo M.

Department of Anthropology, Harvard University, Cambridge, Massachusetts.

Abstract
The evolution of the Old World monkey tribe Papionini, composed of macaques, baboons, mandrills, drills, and mangabeys, was examined using mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) sequence data on the cytochrome oxidase subunit II gene. When analyzed cladistically, these data support a baboon clade of savannah (Papio) plus gelada (Theropithecus) baboons, as well as a clade containing drill (Mandrillus) plus mangabey (Cerocebus) genera. This result stands in opposition to most morphological phylogenies, which break up the baboon clade by placing Papio and Mandrillus as sister taxa and Theropithecus as a more distantly related lineage. Analyses of COII gene sequences also suggest that the papionin ancestral stock divided into two lineages, one leading to macaques and the other to the purely African genera. From a molecular evolutionary perspective, the papionin COII gene sequences reveal a pattern of amino acid replacements concentrated in the regions spanning the mitochondrial membrane.

PMID: 1313138 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1313138

[size=14pt]Molecular systematics of the Old World monkey tribe Papionini: analysis of the total available genetic sequences[/size]

References and further reading may be available for this article. To view references and further reading you must purchase this article.

Eugene E. Harrisf1

Department of Anthropology, 25 Waverly Place, New York University, New York, NY, 10003, U.S.A.

Received 23 March 1998;  revised 20 January 1999;  accepted 10 April 1999. ; Available online 9 April 2002.

Abstract
The phylogenetic relationships among the genera of the tribe Papionini are inferred using a taxonomic congruence approach in which gene trees derived for eight unlinked genetic sequence datasets are compared. Population genetics theory predicts that species relationships will be revealed with greater probability when the topology of gene trees from many unlinked loci are found to be congruent. The theory underlying this approach is described.

Monophyly of the mangabeys is not supported by any of the gene trees; instead, they are polyphyletic with Cercocebus found to be the sister taxon toMandrillus in five gene trees (with no conflicting trees), and Lophocebus found to be closely related toPapio and/or Theropithecus in all trees. Theropithecus and Papio are not strongly supported as sister taxa (present in one or two trees only);Lophocebus and Papio are supported as sister taxa in the majority of trees. A close relationship between Mandrillus and Papio is not supported in any of the trees.

The relationships among Papio, Lophocebus, and Theropithecus cannot be resolved by congruence, probably due to the short time interval estimated between their divergences. The mtDNA COII sequences are used to estimate divergence dates within the papionins. The internode between the divergences of these species is estimated to be between 290 ka and 370 ka. Lastly, the evolution of morphological features such as long faces, suborbital facial fossae, and terrestrial skeletal adaptations is discussed.

Author Keywords: Old World monkeys, Papionini, molecular phylogeny, systematics, mangabeys, Papio, Theropithecus,Mandrillus , Lophocebus, Cercocebus, Macaca

f1 Present address and address for correspondence: Eugene E. Harris, Department of Genetics, Nelson Biological Labs, 604 Allison Road, Busch Campus, Rutgers University, Piscataway, NJ 08855-1059, U.S.A,  Tel: (732)-445-2681; Fax: (732)-445-5870; E-mail:eeharris@rci.rutgers.edu


http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6WJS-45JBB1F-1&_user=10&_coverDate=02%2F29%2F2000&_rdoc=1&_fmt=high&_orig=search&_origin=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=bfae0e1f10b199cd8fb70e55d26b88fa&searchtype=a

@Beaf, what's the point of your last post? Are you not bright enough to understand what is being discussed here? Does the word context mean anything to you?

Do you suffer from Munchausen Syndrome, an attention-seeking personality disorder? Answers to these questions will go a long way in providing for your healing. And please stop defacing this thread with those horrendous photographs. olodo

[size=28pt]ANGLO-SAXON CULTURE[/size]

The Anglo-Saxon social structure consisted of [size=18pt]tribal units[/size] led by chieftains ("kings," or "lords" who, theoretically at least, earned their respect from their warriors (or "retainers," or "thanes," the group being called a "comitatus". Kings should display the heroic ideal and be known for an extraordinary and courageous feat or for success in war, all preceded by some boasting. The king must be a generous "ring-giver" too -- that is, he must dish out the spoils of war to his thanes rather than hoard the treasures won in tribal warfare (a practice that has survived in diluted form, says Tom Garbaty, with the Queen giving medals to the Beatles and such). These weapons and treasures are important too. The craftsmanship is always elaborate and stories accrue about each ding. Although theoretically the thanes freely agreed to join a king, it was nevertheless vital for one's sense of self to be part of a [size=18pt]tribe.[/size] The thane shouldn't survive the king, and the worst fate for these people was to be exiled or to outlast all one's fellow warriors. The sense of identity came from the warrior community.

http://www.wsu.edu/~delahoyd/medieval/anglo-saxon.html

So we can say the Caucasians also described their amcestors as MONKEYS

[size=28pt]The Lost Tribes of Europe[/size]

http://www.time.com/time/europe/html/050829/story.html

http://www.paradoxplace.com/Perspectives/Maps/Euro-Tribes%20in%20500AD.htm

http://www.historyworld.net/wrldhis/PlainTextHistories.asp?historyid=ab06

ndu_chucks:

@Beaf, what's the point of your last post? Are you not bright enough to understand what is being discussed here? Does the word context mean anything to you?

Do you suffer from Munchausen Syndrome, an attention-seeking personality disorder? Answers to these questions will go a long way in providing for your healing. And please stop defacing this thread with those horrendous photographs. olodo

Maybe you think this is the jokes or romance section or just blind to the discussion.
If you can't follow, its ok for you to continue laughing at yourself and arguing with the floor; someone will call the doctor. Okpe mumu.