₦airaland Forum

Eastlink:
Nowhere in Iboland weaved the Akwa until the Ndokki came into the picture. The Aro’s interacted with the Ndoki and Ubani. It was from that interaction that the Akwaete was taken into the hinterlands. Akwaocha is weaven in the same mold of Akwete. Anything you want to call it, you can call, the Ndokki were the originators of any weaved Ibo native wears. However, today that method of weaving have been replaced by the ncontemporary wax George fabrics. And the Aro, by nature of their travels ferried those cloths to the other parts of Iboland.

TAO11:
Hahaha! My job is done. Benin kingdom have been murdered and given a befitting funeral in broad day light.

I have forced my dullard slave to run back to upholding Ife-Benin connection which his signature ironically opposes.

But instead of upholding the true historical and academically confirmed connection of Ife’s suzerainty over Benin, our dullard friend became insecure and clung instead to the fictitious Izoduwa narrative of Erediauwa and his band of 1970s revisionists — a narrative which has been thoroughly debunked in academia as an interesting nonsense. See link below for an example:

https://www.nairaland.com/6048841/how-unveil-promote-ancient-igbo/16#92824839

I won’t push this page any further for now so that this particular last page that destroyed Benin kingdom won’t lose the necessary views. I know that’s your last desperate strategy now.

I really wonder how you will ever recover from the PTSD and the cognitive dissonance you’ve gotten from this page alone. Benin kingdom my fat black arse .

Even Tinubu laughed hard!
www.nairaland.com/attachments/12281274_99e0a1b6124842cabcf04ce2ca79bd4f_jpeg_jpegf9fd0a9be1b03aeefb053f51896e9126

Bye-bye and stop begging for likes. People won’t waste their time liking your crap.

Even your Edo brothers and your Igbo friends didn’t see the need to waste their likes on your bull craps.

And btw, @OfoIgbo where are your replies to my refutation of your nRi propaganda ?? Hahaha E be things.

Modified:
The ‘bronze’ figure of the then Ooni of Ife which was excavated from the palace of Benin kingdom dates to c. A.D. 1300. ~ Refer to the above-embedded image of the figure culled from S.P Blier, 2012:77.

While on the other hand, the earliest of the earliest dates obtained for both non-Ife Yoruba artworks and Benin artworks is c. A.D. 1420. ~ Refer to the already cited reference to Robin Horton above.

In conclusion: This bronze figure found in the place of Benin kingdom could therefore not logically or historically have come from another Yoruba polity considering the dates.

Moreover, the regalia — as has already been fully and thoroughly demonstrated — matches ONLY the regalia of the ancient Kings of Ife.

Q.E.D.

Eastlink:
Show us evidence of Ogwashiukwu, Asaba, Isele Ukwu weaving cloths in the 18/19th century and I’ll [s]show you pictures of their Bini overlords roaming naked[/s]. Akwette were the first weaved cloths in Iboland. Others who began wearing cloths learn’t from them.

Eastlink:
I read all and observed the following.
1. Forefathers weaved, yet no date. Among all the respondents no one can point the date of when (the so-called ancient) Akwaocha began. People should not confuse the wearing of animal skins to weaving of cloth.

Who didn’t know that Asaba was the administrative capital of the Royal Niger Company. I even saw where clans like Ogwashi-uku, Isele-uku were dragging the origin of Alwaocha with Ubulu-uku. It’s even possible that the fore fathers were those whom the Royal Niger Company in Asaba used their lands for cotton plantation.

2. A dude was trying to link Benin to make us believe it’s ancient outlook. Yet, even the Benin’s themselves never had any of such industry as about that time. Now, you see where inferiority complex is fitting in the brains of these folks.

2. They used cotton to weave cloths, different from Akwaete people whose weaving were gotten from palm fronds, sea weeds and other indigenous crops. Even till now, Ibo masquerade wears is still sourced mainly from palmfronds. The use of cotton in Akwaete batik was added to increase commercial quantity inorder to mass produce. What does it tells you?

gregyboy:
[s]need pictures of the Maltese cross found on ife sculpture,

I need a dahomey website agreeing to ife as a supreme kingdom fron the east

You fool, ryder was not working with oba eweka11 statement although maybe he did he made use of old documents from benins to have know or determine the location of oghene

Eweka11 statements were said, for political and cultural gains from yorubas which Ryder and Thornton noted, ryder was fully aware of eweka11 statements so definitely he was not confused he consider it too, and it know that the benis were altering their history for reasons known to them

Even if ryder had the evidence on dahomey acknowledging ife as east that wont still chsnge anything because dahomey is not benin, the Portuguese never stood in dahomey when the benins gave them that information,

Anway still i want to see the evidence from dahomey acknowledging it, for my curiosity and for me to determine the degree of your lies and desperation because it wont still alter a thing from ryders work if found to be true


Finding wiskers on ife or owo artwork still wouldn't alter anything the only people in osun that has the cat whiskers are not from ife,
Nevertheless, owo cultures has nothing to do with whiskers in their culture but we have seen some owo Terre cotta sculpture with whiskers same could be said for ife..... This again boils to my fact that this various non cultural features to this sculptures was because the artsains who made and sold the sculptures to ife and owo were not msking them to Refrence the culture of both tribes but to his own taste olowo made it know that art merchants in the Olds sold this sculptures to them and it was not unique to their people unlike the benin, this same purchasing can be associated with ife because of lack of evidence of artesians at ife who made the artworks , and also lack of cultural identities of the sculpture from the ife people, willams also made it known in his article



Again i need to see pictures and articles supoirting ife sculptures dating from 1100 above
And further evidence that shows ife to be older than benin and owo because the last evidence i read was owo palace was the oldest palace amongst all other Yorubas palace

So bring evidence to all this to meI need pictures of the Maltese cross found on ife sculpture,

I need a dahomey website agreeing to ife as a supreme kingdom fron the east

You fool, ryder was not working with oba eweka11 statement although maybe he did he made use of old documents from benins to have know or determine the location of oghene

Eweka11 statements were said, for political and cultural gains from yorubas which Ryder and Thornton noted, ryder was fully aware of eweka11 statements so definitely he was not confused he consider it too, and it know that the benis were altering their history for reasons known to them

Even if ryder had the evidence on dahomey acknowledging ife as east that wont still chsnge anything because dahomey is not benin, the Portuguese never stood in dahomey when the benins gave them that information,

Anway still i want to see the evidence from dahomey acknowledging it, for my curiosity and for me to determine the degree of your lies and desperation because it wont still alter a thing from ryders work if found to be true


Finding wiskers on ife or owo artwork still wouldn't alter anything the only people in osun that has the cat whiskers are not from ife,
Nevertheless, owo cultures has nothing to do with whiskers in their culture but we have seen some owo Terre cotta sculpture with whiskers same could be said for ife..... This again boils to my fact that this various non cultural features to this sculptures was because the artsains who made and sold the sculptures to ife and owo were not msking them to Refrence the culture of both tribes but to his own taste olowo made it know that art merchants in the Olds sold this sculptures to them and it was not unique to their people unlike the benin, this same purchasing can be associated with ife because of lack of evidence of artesians at ife who made the artworks , and also lack of cultural identities of the sculpture from the ife people, willams also made it known in his article



Again i need to see pictures and articles supoirting ife sculptures dating from 1100 above
And further evidence that shows ife to be older than benin and owo because the last evidence i read was owo palace was the oldest palace amongst all other Yorubas palace

So bring evidence to all this to meI need pictures of the Maltese cross found on ife sculpture,

I need a dahomey website agreeing to ife as a supreme kingdom fron the east

You fool, ryder was not working with oba eweka11 statement although maybe he did he made use of old documents from benins to have know or determine the location of oghene

Eweka11 statements were said, for political and cultural gains from yorubas which Ryder and Thornton noted, ryder was fully aware of eweka11 statements so definitely he was not confused he consider it too, and it know that the benis were altering their history for reasons known to them

Even if ryder had the evidence on dahomey acknowledging ife as east that wont still chsnge anything because dahomey is not benin, the Portuguese never stood in dahomey when the benins gave them that information,

Anway still i want to see the evidence from dahomey acknowledging it, for my curiosity and for me to determine the degree of your lies and desperation because it wont still alter a thing from ryders work if found to be true


Finding wiskers on ife or owo artwork still wouldn't alter anything the only people in osun that has the cat whiskers are not from ife,
Nevertheless, owo cultures has nothing to do with whiskers in their culture but we have seen some owo Terre cotta sculpture with whiskers same could be said for ife..... This again boils to my fact that this various non cultural features to this sculptures was because the artsains who made and sold the sculptures to ife and owo were not msking them to Refrence the culture of both tribes but to his own taste olowo made it know that art merchants in the Olds sold this sculptures to them and it was not unique to their people unlike the benin, this same purchasing can be associated with ife because of lack of evidence of artesians at ife who made the artworks , and also lack of cultural identities of the sculpture from the ife people, willams also made it known in his article



Again i need to see pictures and articles supoirting ife sculptures dating from 1100 above
And further evidence that shows ife to be older than benin and owo because the last evidence i read was owo palace was the oldest palace amongst all other Yorubas palace

So bring evidence to all this to me[/s]

Omanambala:
First of , let me introduce my person and tell you who you maybe speaking to. I am from Umuoji in IDENMILI NORTH! My home town belong to the Okodu clan comprising Abatete-Ezeodu , Umuoji-Igwulube Ododu and Nkpor-Idike and we migrated from Nri towns including Agukwu , Ogbunike , Umudioka. The Idenmili's including Nnokwa , Ojoto , Okodus' ,Obosi all have Nri migrations and strong elements. The Onicha , Oyi's , Nnewi's and even Ekwusigo has Nri migrations and elements. That much is proven through cultural practices. The Anioma is littered by Nri and related groups like I mentioned earlier and even the Agbor has Ufie wooden gong , and I dont expect your cultureless mind to know what that is used for.

Arochukwu has no culture of note , they are slave trade hustlers..danm you! Awka and the whole Anambra was influenced by Nri and anthropologists wrote extensively about this and even Nsukka acknowledged Nri influenced through age long chants you cultureless bbastard! How dare you !

Items and practices like Ikenga , eke , oye , afor and nkwo were introduced by Nri/Awka groups you cultureless bbastard! Your women dance like strippers in front of your elders without nobility , you danm cultureless bbastard ! We gave you something to brag about , you cultureless nonentity ! Nze na Ozo , Nso ani , Ijele , otu odu , agbalanze , ichi igba ndi eze etc are all Nr/Awka and related cultures, you culturless nonentity!


Nso ani , ife eke ,ifejioku are Nri and related groups practices..are you sick or what. I am from Idenmili in Umuoji and Nwankwo Onyeogu of the blessed memory is is the chief priest of Eke Idenmili in Umuoji while the Idenmili shrine is located at Nnobi...danm you cultureless sslut !


Yes , Anambra has a homogeneous culture unlike your Imo state with a billion autonomous community...ffuck off you pig! Anambra is Nri and Nri is Anambra. Abeg , go down south and play with your mates. You can never divide Anambra, I will be here till eternity giving your southern Igbos sleepless nights

Karanka:
Your mouth is filled with so much vile that makes one want to puke in utter disgust. You should be thoroughly ashamed of yourself for what you wrote up there and immediately apologize for it unreservedly.

IDENNAA:
This is all you got ?

Omanambala:
Nso ani , Ife eke , Ufejioku , Ikpu alu , Ikenga , eke ,oye , afor , nkwo , Ijele, Akwunecheenyi , Abi ulor, Otu odu ,Ichi , Anyanwu , Nze na ozo ,ngbu ito , ito ogbo ,nna ito for Nze initiates ,Ibe ugwu etc are Nr/Awka and Anambra practices you ffucking dreg ! We , ndi Anambra share these traditions and we recognize Nri as the foundation of our culture ! Go to Imo and play with prostitutes !

We will continue tomorow , reetard !

ayoola27:
U nor see say her footsoldiers don dey defend am
.. the mumu dey talk of life progress
Person spend all him life resources Jus to look for loopholes for another man story... now the thing don affect am ..she come want make we do send off party for am

lmao ...

OfoIgbo:
Thanks for sending out that picture. I need it for the reply that I am preparing.

By the way, Oraeri is centuries older than Igala kingdom. The traditional ruler of Oraeri also goes by the title EZE NRI, because they are related to the core Nri people of Agukwu, ENugwu-Ukwu, Enugwu-Agid and Nawfia.

Oraeri is an offshoot of Nri, and in fact they are the people directly responsible for the Igbo-Ukwu artifacts.

Oraeri is centuries older than Ife. Oraeri is centuries older than Benin. Oraeri is centuries older than the Igala kingdom.

Oraeri is possibly about the same age mate with Igodomigodo, both set up by the Nris.

The artifacts that they were responsible for, have already proven the fact that they predate these other kingdoms/empires.

The day Igbos will start taking Benin and Ife claims of matching Igbos in historical sophistication serious, is the day Benin and Ife can prove that they are as old as Igodomigodo or Oraeri (both of which are younger than the core Nri).

OfoIgbo:
I don't believe you even raised the first question, especially after you had already determined that Ife is 19 moons away.

Just by mere looking at the position and distance of any of the core Nri towns, and comparing that against the position and the distance of Ife, it is clear you have no point.

On a straight line, Ife to Benin, is slightly a little longer than Nri to Benin. What does that tell you, vis-a-vis the calculation you made for Ife, in which you came up with a figure of 19 moons?

1, Ife is to the northwest of Benin while Nri is to the EAST OF BENIN (Nri's direction matches the records of early Portuguese)
2. Ife is about 19 moons away from Benin, while Nri is also approximately 19 moons away from Benin, according to your calculations for Ife (both Ife and Nri are near enough to the distance/time noted by the early Portuguese)

So from the above, the score is 2 - 1 in favour of Nri

However in my estimation, these journeys were not straight-forward, so one had to know the towns they stop over to rest and stay in. What this means is that it requires a little bit more sophisticated mathematics to determine. One will need knowledge of the towns they stop over in, the knowledge of Pythagoras theorem, sine, cosine and tangent rules. And to determine the curves in the journey, one needs an appreciable knowledge of calculus.

In my estimation, if a more exact science is applied, it may extend the trip to Nri to a little over 20 moons, while the journey to Ife, will then take about 21 moons

So basically the OGHENE n'NRI (NSHI) resided and still resides in a kingdom to the EAST OF BENIN, and is APPROXIMATELY 20 MOONS JOURNEY away.

The OGHENE n'UHE resided and still resides in a kingdom to the NORTHWEST OF BENIN, and is APPROXIMATELY 20 MOONS JOURNEY away.

NRI gets it.


Now getting to the other points you raised which I am sure you brought up just to throw up some dust so that people will miss the point, which is that the kingdom to the EAST OF BENIN remains NRI.

First of all, I noticed you did not mention the staff that the Eze Nri also issued to the past Obas. Well, we refer to it as OFO or OVO or OWHO. Nice to know that the Portuguese explorers noted that. Even up till today, a very few number of Igbo monarchs still collect their OFO from Nri. That is about the only major thing that is given, as Nri is no longer as sovereign as it once was, and as such is totally dependent on the paltry allowance the governments provide, and he receives about the same amount as any meaningless warrant chief in Anambra, so with that in mind, it will be difficult for the Nris to go all out to bestow more regal paraphernalia on deserving monarchs.

Head piece is not necessarily worn on the head. The first two picture attachments prove this point.
The head pieces that both the Attah of Igala and Ezenri of Oraeri wear are made of BRASS, and could be said to be shaped like SPANISH HELMETS of that period. In Nri, the head piece is called NWATA ONA. Now, whether it was placed on the head, or have always been worn around the neck, we will never know unless more evidence emerges, but for the moment, let us assume it was always worn around the neck, or maybe the Benin monarch wore his on his head.

THE ASSIGNMENT I WILL GIVE YOU IS THIS: Find a picture of the Oba of Benin wearing a piece of brass helmet on his head, and a cross around his neck, and I will show you a picture of a brass helmet and a cross, the ancient Eze Nris issued the ancient Obas.

It's very clear that the ancient Eze Nris most probably gave these brass masks to rulers under the Nri sphere of influence, which obviously included the OBA of BENIN. Haven't you noticed that NWATA ONA looks suspiciously like the FESTAC official mask?
So basically, the Nris still crept into the mainstream African arts extravaganza, without the powers that be, knowing about it.

It is officially known that Oraeri kingdom predates the Ife, Igala and Benin kingdom by many centuries, so the NWATA ONA worn by the monarch of Oraeri was definitely not copied from any of these other kingdoms, and as a matter of fact, bronze/brass casting was practiced in Igboland centuries before Yorubas and Benin got into the practice..

It will be interesting to find out when the Eze Nri of Agukwu-Nri stopped issuing some of these royal items, which includes the head piece and the cross item to these traditional rulers.

Lest I forget, take a look at the last picture of the Oraeri regent. You will notice a bit of scarification on his forehead. So don't think that the white chalk applied to the face of a Benin oba being crowned, signifies Yoruba scarification. The Nris also had that practice only that our scarification works were so professionally executed. Much better than the Yoruba tiger claw marks.

If you need more anthropological and historical evidence of the Nri cultural, spiritual and political overlordship over Benin, then I suggest you read this passage from the Portuguese explorers/historian one more time.

"Joao de Barros in his accounts wrote of a possible pre-Christian influence in ancient Benin Kingdom:- “Among the many things which the king D. Jodo learnt from the ambassador of the king of Benin and also from Joao Afonso d Aveiro of what they had been told by the inhabitants of these regions was that to the east of Benin Kingdom at twenty moons journey which according to their account and the short journeys they made would be about two hundred and fifty of our leagues (5.556km or 3.456 is a league) there lived the most powerful monarch of these parts who was called “Ogane”. Among the pagan chiefs of the territories of Benin, Ogane was held in as great veneration as is the supreme Pontif with us.

“In accordance with a very ancient custom, the King of Benin, on ascending the throne, sends ambassadors to Ogane with rich gifts to announce that by the decease of his predecessor, he has succeeded to the Kingdom of Benin and request confirmation.

To signify his assent, the Prince Ogane sends the King a staff and a head piece of shining brass fashioned like a Spanish helment in place of a crown and scepter. He also sends a cross, likewise of brass to be worn round the neck, a holy and religious emblem similar to that worn by the KNIGHTS of the order of Saint JOHN.
Without these emblems the people do not recognize the King as lawful ruler, nor can he call himself truly king.”

“All the time this ambassador is at the court of Ogane, he never sees the Prince, but only the curtains of silk behind which he sits, for he is regarded as sacred. When the ambassador is leaving, he is shown a foot below the curtains as a sign that the Prince is within and agrees to the matters that he has raised; this foot they reverence as thought it were a sacred relic”

“As a kind of reward for the hardships of such a journey, the ambassador receives a small CROSS, similar to that sent to the King, which is thrown around his neck to signify that he is free and exempt from all servitudes and privileged in his native country as the KNIGHTS are with us.

“In the year 1510 A.D Certain ambassadors of the king of Benin came to this kingdom, among whom was a man about seventy years of age who was wearing one of these CROSSES. I asked him the reason and he gave me an explanation similar to the above."

letu:
I think both Igbo, Igala (Manus the Igalas of Jukun ancestral origin) together with the Benin people of Igodomigodo are of the same origin with same ancestors eg the image of the necklace, when compared especially the hair style of the image with the photos of natives from present day Sudan, Abyssinian, ancient Egypt and ancient Kush there someone can easily see the resemblance eg the picture below.

Osagyefo98:
What are you still doing under igbo issues Mr?

I thought u guys have floated new ethnic nationalityv

letu:
I know what you want but I'm not going to entertain you .

gwafaeziokwu:
The Nsude Pyramids.

Igbo civilization is far older than we thought. There are so much to learn.

letu:
well let me add more with some pictures that illustrates both the Cross sign and Staff which makes the story about it been sent to Oba of Benin in the past a possible reality.

I USED A DOTTED RED COLOUR FOR A CLEARER VIEW OF THE CROSS.

letu:
Those that lives in a glass house should not throw stones, so much for the unclothedness/ rags / the original TARZAN below is Yoruba land before they introduce the new dressing to the Yoruba's inwhich the Yoruba's now tags/ calls it Agbada .

TheLionofLasigi:
You guys are so parasitic in nature that you'll claim the Edos, Isreali, Guinea and very soon you'll say that na una get South Africa... I've never seen such inferiority complex in my entire life...the most pathetic thing a man can do is to twist history to suit his ego, the igbos were basically a savage bush tribe with no concrete history, but you guys make the loudest noise, if not for christianity brought by a yoruba man to your savage lands you guys would still be naked tribesmen...set of culture vultures, imagine some idiat saying the binis came from the igbos nonsense.....you guys have no history, conquered no lands and built no empires

IDENNAA:
Nobody cares if you get crushed by a moving train because of your pains. Igbo tribe is a billion years ahead of your tribe , learn history and stop crying all over the place.

TheLionofLasigi:
I don't know what bush tribe is that, but whatever

IDENNAA:
Bini boy with invincible empire

How is your native doctor..aka oba bini.

IDENNAA:
Go do something better with your life. I am not responsible for your bitterness. Look at the trash you wrote up there. You are a sicko !

Etrusen:
Benin empire remain the only one in Nigeria that can told without dispute because there are evidence of it thanks to Europeans and how do you think the "city" always added to Benin came to be? (Benin city) or you think it was done by binis or your fucking Nigeria government?


only someone who is lost to history that will call the Oba of Benin a native doctor king, if you want to learn history, ask and we will educate you for free. the OBA OF BENIN is strictly a king not native doctor like other kings in Nigeria.


hopefully very soon you Igbo's will start claiming America because of the land occupied by igbo slaves that were sold by binis during slave trade
just as the Afonja republic is doing to Brazil and the rest because the both of your tribes were undeniably sold into slavery by Benin


for example Anthony Joshua,Dele Alli and other prominent Igbo's and Afonja in America and others, have Benin to thank for selling their coward ancestors as slave.

Oga learn history and stop confusing yourself