OfoIgbo:
[s]”If, as has been suggested, Nri theocratic sway could be identified with the culture whose material symbols Shaw recovered in his Igbo-Ukwu excavations, then that factor must be dated to between the 9th and 11th century A.D. or indeed earlier. In that case, Nri influence would be much older than the political and military hegemony centered around Benin and Idah. It may indeed have contributed something to their rise. There are suggestions of this in the tradition, found not only amongst the Nri but also amongst the Bini and the Igala that Nri ritual priests had important parts to play in ceremonies connected with the coronation of the Oba of Benin and the Attah of Igala. Both Jeffreys and Lawton, administrative officers, unearthed evidence to this effect. Thus, it would appear, Nri activities linked much of Igbo-land with the West Niger region up to Benin, and with the region occupied by the Igala and perhaps it also linked Igboland with Idoma land. Many of these links survived, at least, until the 1930s and may still be there in form of the activities of Nri and related traditional medicine man.”

Afigbo 1987

With the above, Afigbo has shown himself to be superior to Knobler, the white man. Trust an Igbo man to show excellent scholarly mien
Please bear in mind that the researcher that wrote the above was not aware of the Portuguese exploration of Benin in the 1400s

Yoruba attempt to change EAST to WEST will be pulled down
MinorityOpinion, TAO11 and the other. Oya food don land[/s]

Let me know when any scholar identifies the Ogane as an Igbo King. You seem to be quickly forgetting what your actual home-work really is.

And for the umpteenth time, Adam Knobler, just like anyone else, simply echoed the already established conclusion of ethnographic/historical scholarship. Please stop pretending to be dyslexia and autistic.

The following are some of the names you should, at a go, be replacing Knobler’s with going forward if you really want to go that route:

Stoll 1902:161-166; Roth 1903:6n1; Marquart 1913:52; Talbot 1926:1:155-156, 281-282, 3:573; Schurhammer 1928:28-30; Bradbury 1964:151, Paula Marti 1960:63, Mauny 1961:182; Akinjogbin 1967:41-43; Ryder 1969: 31; Law 1973:17-19; Willett 1973:137-138; Obayemi 1976:247; Horton 1979; Bondarenko 2003; Akintoye 2010:141-142.

Good luck to you.

LegendHero:


This OfoIgbo don suffer today. He will cry to the mods soon to close down the thread.

He is obviously Pazienza, I have dealt with him before to the extent that he had to beg the mod to close down the thread he created.

igbo people and wayo

TAO11:
Let me know when any scholar identifies the Ogane as an Igbo King.

You seem to be forgetting what your home-work really is.

My homework is to identify the KINGDOM TO THE EAST. I have done that now.

So in spite of the fact they Afigbo, and the colonisers Jeffreys and Lawton had no access to the writings of the Portuguese explorers, they correctly identified the kingdom that performed coronation rituals on the Oba of Benin and Attah of Igala.

All the works done by Knobler and his fellow journey men in trying to change EAST to WEST, and changing OGANE to OGHENE are totally meaningless, and the KINGDOM TO THE EAST is not IFE, as IFE is to the WEST

OfoIgbo:
“If, as has been suggested, Nri theocratic sway could be identified with the culture whose material symbols Shaw recovered in his Igbo-Ukwu excavations, then that factor must be dated to between the 9th and 11th century A.D. or indeed earlier. In that case, Nri influence would be much older than the political and military hegemony centered around Benin and Idah. It may indeed have contributed something to their rise. There are suggestions of this in the tradition, found not only amongst the Nri but also amongst the Bini and the Igala that Nri ritual priests had important parts to play in ceremonies connected with the coronation of the Oba of Benin and the Attah of Igala. Both Jeffreys and Lawton, administrative officers, unearthed evidence to this effect. Thus, it would appear, Nri activities linked much of Igbo-land with the West Niger region up to Benin, and with the region occupied by the Igala and perhaps it also linked Igboland with Idoma land. Many of these links survived, at least, until the 1930s and may still be there in form of the activities of Nri and related traditional medicine man.”

Afigbo 1987

With the above, Afigbo has shown himself to be superior to Knobler, the white man. Trust an Igbo man to show excellent scholarly mien
Please bear in mind that the researcher that wrote the above was not aware of the Portuguese exploration of Benin in the 1400s

Yoruba attempt to change EAST to WEST will be pulled down
MinorityOpinion, TAO11 and the other. Oya food don land

Hellraiser77 nwannem nwoke, I got them by their shriveled balls now. They will have to counter Jeffreys, Lawton and Prof. Afigbo,

The KINGDOM TO THE EAST is gradually and unstoppably showing its hands

The only person that has said oghene is nri is metaphysical.

Let me copy the rascal to explain himself.

Cc
metaphysical
You don give omoibo a new straw to clutch for historical relevance. Come and explain yasef here.

OfoIgbo:


My homework is to identify the KINGDOM TO THE EAST. I have done that now.

So in spite of the fact they Afigbo, and the colonisers Jeffreys and Lawton had no access to the writings of the Portuguese explorers, they correctly identified the kingdom that performed coronation rituals on the Oba of Benin and Attah of Igala.

All the works done by Knobler and his fellow journey men in trying to change EAST to WEST, and changing OGANE to OGHENE are totally meaningless, and the KINGDOM TO THE EAST is not IFE, as IFE is to the WEST

Of course, several kingdoms lie to the East including up to Cameroon and beyond.

So your assignment is to identify one scholar (just one) who goes against historical scholarship to identify the Ogane as an Igbo king. That is the home work I gave you.

Good luck boy.

I will advice BENIN people to disregard this revisionism that intends to foist unmerited Ife overlordship over Benin.

It is totally false and a 419 move

Yorubas are known for such moves, and Sir Willink made it quite clear that Yorubas are proficient in setting up SHADOWY fronts.

The KINGDOM TO THE EAST, remains A KINGDOM IN THE EAST, known as NRI.

So not only did neutral explorers from Portugal write about a KINGDOM IN THE EAST, proper research with evidence, was put forward by Prof. Afigbo, with him referring to earlier works done by Europeans Jeffreys and Lawton.

Do not let Yorubas soil your history. Nri was, is and will always be that KINGDOM TO THE EAST OF BENIN

I will advise every Igboman and Benin person in this forum to copy and save this.

”If, as has been suggested, Nri theocratic sway could be identified with the culture whose material symbols Shaw recovered in his Igbo-Ukwu excavations, then that factor must be dated to between the 9th and 11th century A.D. or indeed earlier. In that case, Nri influence would be much older than the political and military hegemony centered around Benin and Idah. It may indeed have contributed something to their rise. There are suggestions of this in the tradition, found not only amongst the Nri but also amongst the Bini and the Igala that Nri ritual priests had important parts to play in ceremonies connected with the coronation of the Oba of Benin and the Attah of Igala. Both Jeffreys and Lawton, administrative officers, unearthed evidence to this effect. Thus, it would appear, Nri activities linked much of Igbo-land with the West Niger region up to Benin, and with the region occupied by the Igala and perhaps it also linked Igboland with Idoma land. Many of these links survived, at least, until the 1930s and may still be there in form of the activities of Nri and related traditional medicine man.”

Afigbo 1987

TAO11:
Of course, several kingdoms lie to the East including up to Cameroon and beyond.

So your assignment is to identify one scholar (just one) who goes against historical scholarship to identify the Ogane as an Igbo king. That is the home work I gave you.

Good luck boy.

Good luck girl, in changing EAST to WEST.

OGANE was an Eze Nri.

OGANE is not OGHENE, and the EAST is not WEST.

TAO11:
Of course, several kingdoms lie to the East including up to Cameroon and beyond.

So your assignment is to identify one scholar (just one) who goes against historical scholarship to identify the Ogane as an Igbo king. That is the home work I gave you.

Good luck boy.

Except that Prof. Afigbo correctly identified the Nri kingdom as the kingdom that played a part in the coronation of not just the Oba of Benin, but also the Attah of Igala.

EAST is EAST
EAST is not WEST
OGANE is not a Yoruba name
OGANE is not OGHENE

OfoIgbo:
Good luck girl, in changing EAST to WEST. OGANE was an Eze Nri.
OGANE is not OGHENE, and the EAST is not WEST

OfoIgbo:
Except that Prof. Afigbo correctly identified the Nri kingdom as the kingdom that played a part in the coronation of not just the Oba of Benin, but also the Attah of Igala.

EAST is EAST
EAST is not WEST
OGANE is not a Yoruba name
OGANE is not OGHENE

Lol. I perfectly understand how you feel.

But my job to present fact in an ocean of confusion is verifiably done.

LegendHero:


This OfoIgbo don suffer today. He will cry to the mods soon to close down the thread.

He is obviously Pazienza, I have dealt with him before to the extent that he had to beg the mod to close down the thread he created.

LegendHero, how far?

I am historically obliterating your champion TAO11

Please read

”If, as has been suggested, Nri theocratic sway could be identified with the culture whose material symbols Shaw recovered in his Igbo-Ukwu excavations, then that factor must be dated to between the 9th and 11th century A.D. or indeed earlier. In that case, Nri influence would be much older than the political and military hegemony centered around Benin and Idah. It may indeed have contributed something to their rise. There are suggestions of this in the tradition, found not only amongst the Nri but also amongst the Bini and the Igala that Nri ritual priests had important parts to play in ceremonies connected with the coronation of the Oba of Benin and the Attah of Igala. Both Jeffreys and Lawton, administrative officers, unearthed evidence to this effect. Thus, it would appear, Nri activities linked much of Igbo-land with the West Niger region up to Benin, and with the region occupied by the Igala and perhaps it also linked Igboland with Idoma land. Many of these links survived, at least, until the 1930s and may still be there in form of the activities of Nri and related traditional medicine man.”

Afigbo 1987

TAO11:


Lol. I perfectly understand how you feel.

But my job to present fact in an ocean of confusion is verifiably done .

Unsuccessfully, I might add.

As you retire for the evening, Please go through this one more time, for the road

”If, as has been suggested, Nri theocratic sway could be identified with the culture whose material symbols Shaw recovered in his Igbo-Ukwu excavations, then that factor must be dated to between the 9th and 11th century A.D. or indeed earlier. In that case, Nri influence would be much older than the political and military hegemony centered around Benin and Idah. It may indeed have contributed something to their rise. There are suggestions of this in the tradition, found not only amongst the Nri but also amongst the Bini and the Igala that Nri ritual priests had important parts to play in ceremonies connected with the coronation of the Oba of Benin and the Attah of Igala. Both Jeffreys and Lawton, administrative officers, unearthed evidence to this effect. Thus, it would appear, Nri activities linked much of Igbo-land with the West Niger region up to Benin, and with the region occupied by the Igala and perhaps it also linked Igboland with Idoma land. Many of these links survived, at least, until the 1930s and may still be there in form of the activities of Nri and related traditional medicine man.”

Afigbo 1987

SW almajiris, is TAO11 the best you guys can do? The little girl has been hurt so badly with this Prof. Afigbo cactus d!ldo.

I repeat once again that NRI JI OFO and NRI BU ISI IGBO

You are incoherent and repetitive, ogane was not igbo priest or king! Peace

OfoIgbo:


Unfortunately for you, Yorubaland is not to the EAST OF BENIN. Your revisionism won't work.

Knobler is about to go down. A more worthy research effort will be done to obliterate his work

The incident reported as oghene in East was chronicled on the submission by a Portuguese man who was with the Oba when he rose to offer prayer and adulation to his ancestors in Ife. The ritual observed was that thr Oba faced looked out the window facing East, the Sun.
If the Sun rose from South, he would have faced South. So separate the act of veneration from the ritual of worship.

When muslims in Benin pray they face East where Sun rises. Same protocol. Abi Mohammed is an Iboman?


Cc
Tao11
Minorityopinion
Legendhero
Metaphysical

Hellraiser77:
What a dull person ..... you are Contradicting yourself without remorse.....Now lemme clear you on you misconceptions about Igbo kingship;

1: Rulers in ancient igboland where regarded as priests rather than kings, They were revered and feared for their mystical powers, but their authority was not absolute like in other cultures.

2:All Clans had this priest kings but the EZE NRI was the supreme, he is regarded as the embodiment of spirit and the connection of the physical to the spiritual.

3: Decisions are taken after consultation with the OZO and NZE title holders

4: The British simply came and turned this Ezes into their subordinates, even installing new Ezes in place of republican leadership found in some clans.

Igbos always had rulers, just not in the sense you are used to in yorubaland

You mean Eze Nri was only supreme over Igbo's leaving within the Omanbala River or region.

BabaRamota1980:

The incident reported as oghene in East was chronicled on the submission by a Portuguese man who was with the Oba when he rose to offer prayer and adulation to his ancestors in Ife. The ritual observed was that thr Oba faced looked out the window facing East, the Sun.
If the Sun rose from South, he would have faced South. So separate the act of veneration from the ritual of worship.

When muslims in Benin pray they face East where Sun rises. Same protocol. Abi Mohammed is an Iboman?


Cc
Tao11
Minorityopinion
Legendhero
Metaphysical

Which oba? Be specific. The Portuguese visited when Ewuare the first, was on the throne. They also visited when Oba Ozolua was on the throne. Be specific so I can tackle the points you are trying to make.

Meanwhile.........

“If, as has been suggested, Nri theocratic sway could be identified with the culture whose material symbols Shaw recovered in his Igbo-Ukwu excavations, then that factor must be dated to between the 9th and 11th century A.D. or indeed earlier. In that case, Nri influence would be much older than the political and military hegemony centered around Benin and Idah. It may indeed have contributed something to their rise. There are suggestions of this in the tradition, found not only amongst the Nri but also amongst the Bini and the Igala that Nri ritual priests had important parts to play in ceremonies connected with the coronation of the Oba of Benin and the Attah of Igala. Both Jeffreys and Lawton, administrative officers, unearthed evidence to this effect. Thus, it would appear, Nri activities linked much of Igbo-land with the West Niger region up to Benin, and with the region occupied by the Igala and perhaps it also linked Igboland with Idoma land. Many of these links survived, at least, until the 1930s and may still be there in form of the activities of Nri and related traditional medicine man.”

Afigbo 1987

The paragraph above tallied perfectly with the notes of the visiting Portuguese explorers of the 1400s. The Kingdom to the east of Benin, that was the cultural and spiritual overlord of Benin. This is undoubtedly, my clan NRI

BabaRamota1980:

The incident reported as oghene in East was chronicled on the submission by a Portuguese man who was with the Oba when he rose to offer prayer and adulation to his ancestors in Ife. The ritual observed was that thr Oba faced looked out the window facing East, the Sun.
If the Sun rose from South, he would have faced South. So separate the act of veneration from the ritual of worship.

When muslims in Benin pray they face East where Sun rises. Same protocol. Abi Mohammed is an Iboman?


Cc
Tao11
Minorityopinion
Legendhero
Metaphysical

You lies are brazen , Slow down with contortions, Ogane was eastward from Bini ,there was no mention of Sunrise anywhere bros, IFE is clearly the opposite way to the west why y'all lying through your teeth without shame? , The Europeans clearly discarded the idea of Ooni as the Ogane

MinorityOpinion:
You are incoherent and repetitive, ogane was not igbo priest or king! Peace

Was that why you wanted to make East west? Just so the Ogane can be from Ife?.... Yoruba history is based on Dubiousness

TAO11:


Lol. I perfectly understand how you feel.

But my job to present fact in an ocean of confusion is verifiably done.

You present Lies and half truths as facts , Fraud historian,

Ogane had nothing to do with IFE

Ogane ruled from the east of Bini.....The Europeans summarily dismissed the Ooni as a possible candidate

letu:
You mean Eze Nri was only supreme over Igbo's leaving within the Omanbala River or region.

Any place that observed the 4 Nri market days, were obviously within the Nri sphere of influence. Both Benin and Igala observed those 4 market days. The same goes with the majority of Igbo areas.

Anywhere names such as Okoye, Okoroafor, Nwankwo and Mgbeke e.t.c are used, before the coming of the white man, were areas under Nri influence. An appreciable chunk of Igboland had such names.
So every area in the Omambala axis were was under Nri hegemony, including Aguleri that is currently trying to rewrite Igbo history and culture. Nri will descend on them, when the time comes. These are the people that are doing their best to skew Igbo history and culture and make Igbos look cheap, just like the Ikwerres and Ogba are doing.

TAO11:
Of course, several kingdoms lie to the East including up to Cameroon and beyond.

So your assignment is to identify one scholar (just one) who goes against historical scholarship to identify the Ogane as an Igbo king. That is the home work I gave you.

Good luck boy.

But why did you attempt to show us with concorted fables of East being west? and bringing sunrise into the argument.....you will make a good scammer....chai

[s]

TAO11:
Let me know when any scholar identifies the Ogane as an Igbo King. You seem to be quickly forgetting what your actual home-work really is.

And for the umpteenth time, Adam Knobler, just like anyone else, simply echoed the already established conclusion of ethnographic/historical scholarship. Please stop pretending to be dyslexia and autistic.

The following are some of the names you should, at a go, be replacing Knobler’s with going forward if you really want to go that route:

Stoll 1902:161-166; Roth 1903:6n1; Marquart 1913:52; Talbot 1926:1:155-156, 281-282, 3:573; Schurhammer 1928:28-30; Bradbury 1964:151, Paula Marti 1960:63, Mauny 1961:182; Akinjogbin 1967:41-43; Ryder 1969: 31; Law 1973:17-19; Willett 1973:137-138; Obayemi 1976:247; Horton 1979; Bondarenko 2003; Akintoye 2010:141-142.

Good luck to you.

[/s] Twash

Ogane came from an easterly direction , A very early Igbo king

[s]

TAO11:
Do you mind convincing me on why we must disregard that screenshot of the conclusion of historical scholarship and trust you instead?? Thank you.

Also, the understanding that the “east” in the Portuguese account is of a religious significance in relation to Ife, rather than literal, is according to historical scholarship. I cited all the sources in that same comment. Read the comment again, but this time more slowly.

Regarding Ife’s supremacy, it is sufficient to quote from Suzanne P. Blier’s “Art and Risk in Ancient Yoruba”. She noted rightly that:

“During the era of Ife’s greatest historic power, the twelfth to the fifteenth centuries C.E., its influence spanned eastward to the Niger River and westward to what is today Southern Togo.”

I guess Benin Kingdom is outside of the above geographical delineation. Lol. Moreover, in 1897 Captain Roupell collected accounts from Benin Kingdom which says that Benin’s first king [Eweka (I)] is a Yoruba man from Ife. — Roupell’s Official cited in H.L. Roth, 1903, p.7.

Furthermore, a c.1300 ‘bronze’ figure of the Ooni of Ife was excavated from the palace of Benin Kingdom. See attached. The attached screenshot is from Professor Suzanne P. Blier’s “Art in Ancient Ife”.

Like I have educated you before, the Igbos and their western neighbors, the Binis did have engagements. You just have to read. Similarly, the Yoruba also engaged their Easter neighbors, the Binis. Wars are natural part of human history. You didn’t know that.

[/s] You can't force East to become west so Ogane can be Ooni bros, The Bini obas never moved their army East cos Ogane was there, it was always west

OfoIgbo:
“If, as has been suggested, Nri theocratic sway could be identified with the culture whose material symbols Shaw recovered in his Igbo-Ukwu excavations, then that factor must be dated to between the 9th and 11th century A.D. or indeed earlier. In that case, Nri influence would be much older than the political and military hegemony centered around Benin and Idah. It may indeed have contributed something to their rise. There are suggestions of this in the tradition, found not only amongst the Nri but also amongst the Bini and the Igala that Nri ritual priests had important parts to play in ceremonies connected with the coronation of the Oba of Benin and the Attah of Igala. Both Jeffreys and Lawton, administrative officers, unearthed evidence to this effect. Thus, it would appear, Nri activities linked much of Igbo-land with the West Niger region up to Benin, and with the region occupied by the Igala and perhaps it also linked Igboland with Idoma land. Many of these links survived, at least, until the 1930s and may still be there in form of the activities of Nri and related traditional medicine man.”

Afigbo 1987

With the above, Afigbo has shown himself to be superior to Knobler, the white man. Trust an Igbo man to show excellent scholarly mien
Please bear in mind that the researcher that wrote the above was not aware of the Portuguese exploration of Benin in the 1400s

Yoruba attempt to change EAST to WEST will be pulled down
MinorityOpinion, TAO11 and the other. Oya food don land

Hellraiser77 nwannem nwoke, I got them by their shriveled balls now. They will have to counter Jeffreys, Lawton and Prof. Afigbo,

The KINGDOM TO THE EAST is gradually and unstoppably showing its hands

Yeroba and their history is irredeemably dubious , Realising their folly they have moved the argument to sunrise and sunset, Ogane can't be anything apart from a very Early Igbo ruler

Cc legendhero, Sammy07, ThatFairGuy, Etinosa1234, obalatule, babaramota1980 and others Pls open a new thread and all comments must have reference, no insult and joking, straight facts. This is getting annoying I want to see where the Nri now become ogane. Create new thread Pls.

To further make it simple so others can prepare their facts, let us make it tomorrow night.

TAO11:
Do you mind convincing me on why we must disregard that screenshot of the conclusion of historical scholarship and trust you instead?? Thank you.

Also, the understanding that the “east” in the Portuguese account is of a religious significance in relation to Ife, rather than literal, is according to historical scholarship. I cited all the sources in that same comment. Read the comment again, but this time more slowly.

Regarding Ife’s supremacy, it is sufficient to quote from Suzanne P. Blier’s “Art and Risk in Ancient Yoruba”. She noted rightly that:

“During the era of Ife’s greatest historic power, the twelfth to the fifteenth centuries C.E., its influence spanned eastward to the Niger River and westward to what is today Southern Togo.”

I guess Benin Kingdom is outside of the above geographical delineation. Lol. Moreover, in 1897 Captain Roupell collected accounts from Benin Kingdom which says that Benin’s first king [Eweka (I)] is a Yoruba man from Ife. — Roupell’s Official cited in H.L. Roth, 1903, p.7.

Furthermore, a c.1300 ‘bronze’ figure of the Ooni of Ife was excavated from the palace of Benin Kingdom. See attached. The attached screenshot is from Professor Suzanne P. Blier’s “Art in Ancient Ife”.

Like I have educated you before, the Igbos and their western neighbors, the Binis did have engagements. You just have to read. Similarly, the Yoruba also engaged their Easter neighbors, the Binis. Wars are natural part of human history. You didn’t know that.

IFE is sub-ordinate to Bini, stop trying to dupe Bini of their heritage , ThankGod they woke up on time to your antics, Pikin wan senior im papa

Hellraiser77:
IFE is sub-ordinate to Bini, stop trying to dupe Bini of their heritage , ThankGod they woke up on time to your antics, Pikin wan senior im papa

You’re obviously an illiterate that simply managed to master some spellings. The very screenshot you attached debunks the comment you wrote.

You can read below for more details and be educated:

(1) The idea that Ekaladerhan (Ogiso Owodo’s last son) is one and the same person as Oduduwa was first made-up out of inferiority complex by the Edos in the 1970s.

The Edo guys involved in this fabrication are:

(a) S.B. Omoregie in "Edo History", 1970 (b) E. Akenzua in “Benin was never a Republic", 1971 (c) D.U. Edebiri in "Whence the Igodomidos", 1970, and (d) A. Iyare in "Bini, Ife Dynasties", 1973.

As is to be expected in their amateurish works, they could not name a single source or informant for their totally strange account.

To make it all worse, during his coronation of 1978-9, the incoming Omo N'Oba N'Edo (Oba Erediauwa) announced this unsubstantiated fabrication for the first time to the Edo public. He also did that out of a mix inferiority as well as political/legal necessity against the Ogiamen lawsuit.

(2) However, this fabrication of attempting to equate Ekaladerhan as one and the same person as Oduduwa has been debunked and trashed (in academia) as a hoax, that is -- an interesting nonsense.

For example, D. M. Bondarenko who is the world's leading authority on precolonial Benin History today has the following to say on pages 67-68 of his "Advent of the Second (Oba) Dynasty (2003)" in relation to this fabricated account:

"Finally, there are the apocryphal versions of Benin oral tradition [wherein] Ekaladerhan ... later ... left Gwato for Ife. ... and became her first ruler under the name of Oduduwa.

However, a student of ancient Benin might feel obliged to reject the apocryphal versions without hesitation as deliberately unauthentic.

There are no their records made before the early 1970s*, while among common people the story of Ekaladerhan that ends with the Prince's banishing from Benin and subsequent dethronement of his father, the last Ogiso Owodo, is known (and was recorded hundred years ago)*. There is no doubt that the apocryphal versions are not ancient and are not popular. Their authors are representatives of the nationalistically-minded part of the Bini intelligentsia who are seeking to ground the idea of an exceptional antiquity for their people and claims for its exclusive part in the sociopolitical life of independent Nigeria*. Behind such pseudohistorical studies by intellectuals, as if harmless, one can make out serious problems of the country, interests of political clans based on their members' ethnic community*. Not accidentally, the apocryphal versions were first published in a Benin City newspaper and then, as academic debates around the founder of the Oba dynasty took the shape of severe polemics (political by its nature) between the Bini and Yoruba historians in the central Nigerian press*.

(3) On the contrary to the above obvious 1970s fabrication on Ekaladerhan, Bini traditions has long been recorded by Europeaans to the effect that the Oba dynasty of Benin originated from Ife.

For example, H. Ling Roth (1903) quoted Captain Roupell’s Officials 1897 account gathered from Benin that the first king of Benin was a Yoruba man from Ife.

Another example is of Oba Eweka(II) who in the 1920s informed an European visitor, H.L. Ward-Price that his great-lord (Oghene) lives in Ife.

He added that he must pray to this "Oghene" every morning (at the illumination of the first sun rays at dawn), before he prays to the Alaafin, before he then prays for himself, and then for all Yoruba kings.

See: H.L. Ward-Price, Dark Subjects (London, 1939), p.238.

(4) A final example will be on the tradition of sending certain remains of deceased Benin Kings (their heads to be precise) back to Ife for burial at a designated site for the purpose.

(a) The Bini traditional Chief J. Uwadiae Egharevba (who is the first indigenous Edo to document Bini traditions from the 1930s) documented this custom too. He writes:

"The head of the royal corpse was subsequently exhumed and taken to the royal ancestral grave at Ile-Ife; but this was done in every third reign."

J.U. Egharevba, Benin Law and Custom, (CMS Niger Press, Port Harcourt, 1946), p.72.

(b) Dr. R.E. Bradbury (who devoted years to intensive anthropological field work on Benin and the Edo-speaking peoples, and who is the outstanding authority on the subject) is also said to have documented similar customs while among the Binis.

A.F.C. Ryder notes on footnote 10 of his "A Reconsideration of the Ife and Benin Relationship" as follows:

"In a personal communication, Dr R.E. Bradbury points out that 'the Edo speak of the messengers who carried the Oba's remains to Ife taking about three years over the journey."

(c) Frank Willett is also noted to have said that the last ocassion of the practice of sending the exhumed heads of Benin Kings to Ife was in the year 1888.

D.M. Bondarenko makes a note of this statement in his "Advent of the Second (Oba) Dynasty" as follows:

"These sources point at the Benin Oba's succession from the Ooni of Ife expressed in ritual forms. Particularly, "as a recognition of this fact deceased rulers' heads were sent to Ife for burial at Orun-Oba-Ado site ... last time this happened in 1888. In its turn, a bronze depiction of the head was usually sent back from Ife to Benin" (Willett 1982:22)."

cc: LegendHero, MinorityOpinion, BabaRamota1980

MinorityOpinion:
Cc legendhero, Sammy07, ThatFairGuy, Etinosa1234, obalatule, babaramota1980 and others Pls open a new thread and all comments must have reference, no insult and joking, straight facts. This is getting annoying I want to see where the Nri now become ogane. Create new thread Pls.

To further make it simple so others can prepare their facts, let us make it tomorrow night.

Thank you for that link , It buries you IFE argument for the origin of The Ogane ruler....Ogane ruled the east from where the Bini obas received their Ofor

[s]

TAO11:
You’re obviously a miseducated rookie. Read and be educated:

(1) The idea that Ekaladerhan is Oduduwa was first made-up out of inferiority complex by the Edos in the 1970s.

The Edo guys involved in this fabrication are:
(a) S.B. Omoregie' "Edo History", 1970 (b) E. Akenzua's "Benin was never a Republic", 1971 (c) D.U. Edebiri's "Whence the Igodomidos", 1970, and (d) A. Iyare's "Bini, Ife Dynasties", 1973.

As is to be expected in their amateurish works, they could not name a single source or informant for their totally strange account.

To make it all worse, during his coronation of 1978-9, the incoming Omo N'Oba N'Edo (Oba Erediauwa) announced this unsubstantiated fabrication for the first time to the Edo public. He also did that out of a mix inferiority as well as political/legal necessity against the Ogiamen lawsuit.

(2) However, this fabrication of attempting to equate Ekaladerhan as one and the same person as Oduduwa has been debunked and trashed (in academia) as a hoax, that is -- an interesting nonsense.

For example, D. M. Bondarenko who is the world's leading authority on precolonial Benin History today has the following to say on pages 67-68 of his "Advent of the Second (Oba) Dynasty" in relation to this fabricated account:

"Finally, there are the apocryphal versions of Benin oral tradition [wherein] Ekaladerhan ... later ... left Gwato for Ife. ... and became her first ruler under the name of Oduduwa.

However, a student of ancient Benin might feel obliged to reject the apocryphal versions without hesitation as deliberately unauthentic.

There are no their records made before the early 1970s* , while among common people the story of Ekaladerhan that ends with the Prince's banishing from Benin and subsequent dethronement of his father, the last Ogiso Owodo, is known (and was recorded hundred years ago)*. There is no doubt that the apocryphal versions are not ancient and are not popular. Their authors are representatives of the nationalistically-minded part of the Bini intelligentsia who are seeking to ground the idea of an exceptional antiquity for their people and claims for its exclusive part in the sociopolitical life of independent Nigeria*. Behind such pseudohistorical studies by intellectuals, as if harmless, one can make out serious problems of the country, interests of political clans based on their members' ethnic community*."

(3) On the contrary to the above obvious 1970s fabrication on Ekaladerhan, Bini traditions has long been recorded by Europeaans to the effect that the Oba dynasty of Benin originated from Ife.

For example, Oba EwekaII in the 1920s had informed an European visitor, H.L. Ward-Price that his Lord&God (in human flesh) lives in Ife.

He added that he must pray to this "Oghene" every morning (at the illumination of the first sun rays at dawn), before he prays to the Alaafin, before he then prays for himself, and then for all Yoruba kings.

See: H.L. Ward-Price, Dark Subjects (London, 1939), p.238.

(4) A final example will be on the tradition of sending certain remains of deceased Benin Kings (their heads to be precise) back to Ife for burial at a designated site for the purpose.

(a) The Bini traditional Chief J. Uwadiae Egharevba (who is the first indigenous Edo to document Bini traditions from the 1930s) documented this custom too. He writes:

"The head of the royal corpse was subsequently exhumed and taken to the royal ancestral grave at Ile-Ife; but this was done in every third reign."

J.U. Egharevba, Benin Law and Custom, (CMS Niger Press, Port Harcourt, 1946), p.72.

(b) Dr. R.E. Bradbury (who devoted years to intensive anthropological field work on Benin and the Edo-speaking peoples, and who is the outstanding authority on the subject) is also said to have documented similar customs while among the Binis.

A.F.C. Ryder notes on footnote 10 of his "A Reconsideration of the Ife and Benin Relationship" as follows:

"In a personal communication, Dr R.E. Bradbury points out that 'the Edo speak of the messengers who carried the Oba's remains to Ife taking about three years over the journey."

(c) Frank Willett is also noted to have said that the last ocassion of the practice of sending the exhumed heads of Benin Kings to Ife was in the year 1888.

D.M. Bondarenko makes a note of this statement in his "Advent of the Second (Oba) Dynasty" as follows:

"These sources point at the Benin Oba's succession from the Ooni of Ife expressed in ritual forms. Particularly, "as a recognition of this fact deceased rulers' heads were sent to Ife for burial at Orun-Oba-Ado site ... last time this happened in 1888. In its turn, a bronze depiction of the head was usually sent back from Ife to Benin" (Willett 1982:22)."

[/s] Cc Etinosa come see, this clown has Brought up their Dubious IFE claim on Bini lands again

Anyway tell me again how IFE lies to the East of bini because the sun rises from the west in your own weird little world , You are especially skilled in concorting lies, I like your stories

Hellraiser77:
Thank you for that link , It buries you IFE argument for the origin of The Ogane ruler....Ogane ruled the east from where the Bini obas received their Ofor

Read it finish before conclusion. Point out where ogane is igbo King. Bring it here bro

What happen to Nri kingdom? Why is it not relevant today? Why did Benin disconnect from the Nri?

Do you know the relationship between Ooni and oba Benin? These are the things that will solidify that igbo have superiority over Benin. You have to prove it

MinorityOpinion:


Read it finish before conclusion. Point out where ogane is igbo King. Bring it here bro

What happen to Nri kingdom? Why is it not relevant today? Why did Benin disconnect from the Nri?

Do you know the relationship between Ooni and oba Benin? These are the things that will solidify that igbo have superiority over Benin. You have to prove it

I had to simplify this geographic headache for you, this is what you will get from Bini if you go east, Now you know where Ogane ruled from