BluntTheApostle:
Where in those verses were Christians even remotely required to tithe?
If you can read, you would realize that the verses were contrasting the covenant of work (which includes tithing) with the covenant of grace which the death of Christ ushered in. The covenant of work never perfected humanity. They were profitless, and so were done away with. If the covenant of work was profitable, Jesus Christ wouldn't have needed to die.
Now, tithing cannot save you because you are no longer under such a law. You are now saved only by grace.
When the Israelites were bound by the covenant of work (also known as the Sinai covenant), they were saved by works (or duties such as tithing, and the blood of bulls). The covenant had curses which transgressors suffered for not keeping the covenant.
But when Christ died, a new covenant was ushered in. The covenant of grace. You are no longer saved by works, but by grace. So, your salvation is not of your own doing (your works) but of grace (unmerited favor). No one can therefore boast that his salvation is due to his tithing.
You can't emotionally blackmail me by using Bible verses that you don't understand  My spiritual journey did not start today.
You haven't.
Because I didn't see how Hebrews 7 supports tithing as a financial investment. It does not even remotely ask us to tithe.
Abraham did not even tithe to invest financially. He tithed to appreciate God's help in getting him victory at that war. And as wealthy as Abraham was, there are no records of him ever tithing until that very incident. And there were no records of him ever tithing after that. Moreover, Abraham did not tithe out of his properties.
I am not interested in the covenant of works as far as tithing is concerned. ThothHermes:
Okay [img] https://s5/images/ezgif-2-bb81ab7ea10d.gif[/img]
MuttleyLaff:
Before answering the question, let's acknowledge and get a few things into perspective first
1/ Abram, before becoming Abraham, was a worshipper of idols, an idolater, in short.
2/ Child sacrificing to these idols was a common and prevailing practice then and Abram was accustomed to it
3/ Deuteronomy 12:30-31 was formalized 400 years plus after the historic Abraham's near-sacrifice of his son Isaac
4/ It is a well known historical and documentated fact that Abram tithed in line with the prevailing Mesopotamia custom to tithe
Artifacts shows and testifies to heathens practice of tithing. Like few other things, tithing was a status quo, same as child sacrifices and/or ritualistic killing of children with Abraham then. MuttleyLaff:
Tithing originated from a Mesopotamia practice that prevailed pre and post the Abraham's living days. Abraham paid tithe after winning a fighting battle over four kings. The practice and onus was upon the victor of such or any battle/war to give a tenth of the spoils of war to a reputable priest cum ruler of his/her choice. Abraham decided that Melchizedek is his choice, so paid the tenth/tithe to him, received a blessing, and the rest of the story is now history.
Melchizedek was a ruler cum priest of the Most God, but didn't know God same way Abraham did or have the same kind of relationship Abraham had with God. This is evidenced on how Abraham corrected Melchizedek after he misaddressed God
MuttleyLaff:
Christians and believers can tithe if they so decided in their heart and are not coerced, being forced people to give, aren't getting threatened with fear of curses, calamity or misfortune if they don't give an imposed and/or obligatory ecclesiastical monitised tithe giving. As long as specified financial demands aren't forced on people, it isn't a prob. If people willing and on their own initiative give tithe, that's OK
Let's just go there. There really is no stipulated/specific percentage on giving, for believers. All God requires, is a cheerful giving, that you decide in your heart without being forced or coerced to give. As a matter of fact, it is any amount that you're comfortable with and be in accordance to the level of grace you've received, only that there is a caveat that whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously
The Greek original word, "die", used in Matthew 23:23, means, it is necessary, to tithe
and so when that necessity is over, that obligation, duty or responsibility to tithe, is no longer required or needed
It was under that or those then present circumstances, that people like al\BHAGDADI dont understand, that Jesus says to tithe, and not the thereafter
People like al\BHAGDADI and others, dont want to recognise that the only tithes used to be given to God were:
1) the Levitical tithe aka Mosaic Law tithe, which are given to God via the priest (e.g. Levite)
and
2) the Abraham type of tithe, given to God, via a priest cum king (e.g. Melchizedek)
- see #3 below
Other tithes in a secular world context (i.e. tenth, 1/10, 10% and possibly 0.1) also given are:
1) At pagan temples to priest(s) (note al\BHAGDADI extra biblical references will be provided upon your request, same with #3 below)
2) Upon the king's demand's (note al\BHAGDADI bible references also will be provided upon your request)
3) To a local ruler cum priest of a god or God, worthy of the consideration, after taking up arms, go to fight and winning battle fight(s) or war slaughering enemies
Now this is breaking it further down for easier understanding for the likes of al\BHAGDADI and others
1) There is obligatory tithe imposed by the Mosaic law (i.e. the Levitical tithe also known as the Mosaic Law tithe)
2) There is obligatory tithe imposed by the christian gatherings law
(i.e. ecclesiastical tithe, where christian gatherings, taxes its members tenth, 1/10, 10% and possibly 0.1 too, of their financial income)
3) There is obligatory tithe imposed by custom law (i.e. Abraham's tithing was done, due to the social setting of that time)
4) There is obligatory tithe imposed by monarchy law (i.e. tenth of seed and of vineyards, given to the king's officials and servants)
Now, there is another, which is voluntary tithe,
The nuance in this sort of tithe or tithing, is that it isn't imposed by the Mosaic law, not by christian gatherings law or by any custom law. For the attention of Horlufemi, this one, this so called "voluntary tithe" happens or occurs, when FREELY, one DECIDES to GIVE, a tenth of one's financial standing, as a form of contribution or donation toward's any Kingdom purposes, aid or means. In fact, the beauty and tithing subtle difference, is that, it is NOT obligatory or imposed
Bible writers and God use the terms, tenth and tithe interchangeably. So if I voluntarily give 10%, a tenth or 10 out 100 of my money contribution or donation toward's Kingdom purposes, aid or means, I technically have given a tithe. Considering that it is not a taxed, obligatory or imposition tithe, then I am free, to go ahead voluntarily giving it
All tithes or tithings, are a form of giving but NOT all giving are a tenth, tithe or tithing because the giving could be more or less than a tenth, tithe or tithing
The Bible's message today, is about a revolutionary way of giving, where believers are instructed or urged as in 2 Corinthians 9:7 above
Giving could be 50% today, as in 50% equals half of your money
Giving could be 10% next month, as in 10% equals a tithe, tenth, or 10 out 100 of your money
(i.e. voluntary tithe, voluntarily giving 10%)
Giving could be 100% following month, as in 100%, equals all of your money
Giving could be 0% following month after, as in 0%, equals zero goes out of your money
Could decide to give 1% month following after, as in 1%, equals 1 out 100 of your money
The giving cycle is not fixed, it might repeat or not repeat itself
How much you give, changes according to the amount or percentage, you willingly over the passage of time, decide to give
It is the freedom, to give whatever you're comfortable with cheerfully. This sort of giving regardless of the percentages is desirable but not obligatory. Without stipulating amounts to give, you're are being trusted to know, to do the 3 right things
You must each decide in your heart how much to give.
And don't give reluctantly or in response to pressure.
(i.e. you shouldn't be sorry that you gave or feel forced to give)
"For God loves a person who gives cheerfully."
- 2 Corinthians 9:7
It is obligatory, taxed or imposed tithing that Christians cannot tithe
It is imposed tithing, it is dead with the law and believers are not obligated to perform any form of imposed tithing
What al\BHAGDADI and others he is in cahoot with dont want to correctively preach, is that the Bible teaches the "church" the revolutionary way of giving, where believers are instructed or urged in 2 Corinthians 9:7 above, to do
2 Corinthians 9:7, by the way actually, is a rehashed principle God HAS always endorsed, as evident in Exodus 25:2, Exodus 35:29, Deuteronomy 15:10 & 1 Chronicles 29:9
al\BHAGDADI and anyone can go check out Exodus 25:2, Exodus 35:29, Deuteronomy 15:10 & 1 Chronicles 29:9 to find out that God is doing a full circle with this give as you determine in your heart without being under compulsion
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