10mobile:

You are the funniest ape I ever saw. Why, all of a sudden, you started speaking King James English?

The spirit didst take hold of me and whereof did I speak!

Myer:

Christ may have chosen them before they believed him. But they chose to follow him after seeing his signs.

And this is where my answer on "fair weather friends" did not cover, for I was
well aware of the disciples status and standing with The Lord.

Therefore, my comment was strictly directed to those who only come to Christ for miracles alone, but they reject His Person, eg those people in John 6:26

That's all.

Myer:

My point here afterall is that it is not wrong to ask for signs since God clearly obliged those who asked for signs.

Have you not heard, "Only an evil generation asks for signs?"

This is also the basis of my opposition to your stance above.

Omooba77:
Why are we not seeing Miracles as of Old?

Your pastor doesn't have the power to perform miracles. Extraordinary miracles still happen in my Church almost everyday.

MaxInDHouse:




Please just quote one place in the Bible where one single miracle occur without the involvement of an Israelite!

This is not about Interpretation to suit lacking because the OP openly throw the question to everyone, so if you know where real miracles are happening there are lots of sick people perhaps we should invite them to test the authenticity of your miracles!

Seems you keep coming up with new ways to excuse church's lack of miracles.
Which one is without involvement of a Jew again biko?
When even Jesus said in Mark 16:17 signs will follow those who believe and not Jews who believe.

Jesus healed a centurion's daughter.luke 7:8-10
He was a Roman (Gentile)
Jesus healed the daughter of a Canaanite woman even after trying for dismiss her with the famous words, is it meet to give the children's bread and toss it to the dogs? (Another Gentlile)

Paul and Barnabas healed the lame man in Lystra (a Greek). Even lystrans wanted to start worshipping both of them.
Paul and Barnabas were sent to Gentiles specifically meaning almost all miracles recorded of them were performed on Gentiles in gentiles lands.
Philip likewise performed miracles to Gentiles.

Dtruthspeaker:


And this is where my answer on "fair weather friends" did not cover, for I was
well aware of the disciples status and standing with The Lord.

Therefore, my comment was strictly directed to those who only come to Christ for miracles alone, but they reject His Person, eg those people in John 6:26

That's all.



Have you not heard, "Only an evil generation asks for signs?"

This is also the basis of my opposition to your stance above.

The Pharisees and Sadducees came to Jesus and tested him by asking him to show them a sign from heaven. Matthew 16:1

A wicked and adulterous generation looks for a sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah.” Jesus then left them and went away. Matthew 16:4

He was referring specifically to the Pharisees and Saduccess knowing they only seek the signs to entrap him.

Because we definitely see him perform more miracles after that statement up till the last chapter of Matthew. And his Apostles continued performing miracles after him.
In fact Jesus assured them that signs will follow those who believe. Mark 16:17

Whenever people were down with sicknesses or disabled, our of compassion Jesus or his disciples performed miracles by healing them. Some did not ask while some specifically asked to be healed.

Myer:

He was referring specifically to the Pharisees and Saduccess knowing they only seek the signs to entrap him.

Aren't the people's of the world exactly like the Pharisees and Sadducees, doing exactly those same things, like laying traps for others?

Myer:

Because we definitely see him perform more miracles after that statement up till the last chapter of Matthew. And his Apostles continued performing miracles after him.
In fact Jesus assured them that signs will follow those who believe. Mark 16:17.

Remember, this part is not in issue for I have already laid the basis of my comment earlier and you have no objection to it, so no problem.

Dtruthspeaker:


Aren't the people's of the world exactly like the Pharisees and Sadducees, doing exactly those same things, like laying traps for others?



Remember, this part is not in issue for I have already laid the basis of my comment earlier and you have no objection to it, so no problem.

It's just a very convenient excuse for anyone who isn't performing any miracles.

Jesus and the apostles performed miracles nonetheless. That's my own point.

Myer:

It's just a very convenient excuse for anyone who isn't performing any miracles.

That is because you do not want to take cognizance of A Person's Rights exactly as David/Wizz Kid may exercise their rights to come to your wedding to sing for you.

And when they do not, you knew you had no right to complain about their absence.

So it is with God, He has the Rights to Refuse to do Miracles exactly as John 6:26 points out.

Jesus, Paul, Barnabas, Philip are all Israelites!
I said one single miracle that doesn't involve a Jew!
For instance Adeboye Is not a Jew so if he performs any miracle that's exactly what i'm saying.
Can you relate such in the Bible?
The miracles were the signs God promised the Israelites that will mark the sealing of the New Covenant as the ceremony will not take place on planet earth where anyone can see how the High Priest (Jesus) PRESENT the ultimate sacrifice before the 24 elders in heaven! Revelations 11:16

So those promised signs were to alert the Israelites that the New Covenant has been sealed in heaven! Joel 2:28-30 compare to Act 2:16-18

After that all those signs will cease because it's purpose has been met! 1Corinthians 13:8-10

That's why there's no miracles anymore after the death of the last Apostle John!

May you have PEACE!

Myer:

Seems you keep coming up with new ways to excuse church's lack of miracles.
Which one is without involvement of a Jew again biko?
When even Jesus said in Mark 16:17 signs will follow those who believe and not Jews who believe.

Jesus healed a centurion's daughter.luke 7:8-10
He was a Roman (Gentile)
Jesus healed the daughter of a Canaanite woman even after trying for dismiss her with the famous words, is it meet to give the children's bread and toss it to the dogs? (Another Gentlile)

Paul and Barnabas healed the lame man in Lystra (a Greek). Even lystrans wanted to start worshipping both of them.
Paul and Barnabas were sent to Gentiles specifically meaning almost all miracles recorded of them were performed on Gentiles in gentiles lands.
Philip likewise performed miracles to Gentiles.

What most people don't understand while reading the Bible is how God's word often distinguish between supernatural signs performed by the Israelites and those performed by non Israelites.
Whenever supernatural signs comes from an Israelite it is called "MIRACLE" but when such occures in the case of a non Israelites it's called "MAGIC"
WHY?
Because the true God had no dealings with non Israelites so He won't support them with His Holy Spirit to perform such supernatural signs, that's why He warned Israelites not to seek such powers {Deuteronomy 18:10} because He is the one and only SPIRIT BEING who gives it for benefitial purposes, but demons also do the same just to distract people from doing God's will!

For instance, after God has empowered Moses with supernatural signs He asked Moses to go and confront the world's most powerful ruler of that time Pharaoh Ramses of Egypt.
God's word referred to signs performed by the man Moses as "MIRACLES" but what about the signs performed by the Egyptians? Exodus 8:1-18

WHY is that so?
Well it's because God's Holy Spirit is the source of the supernatural signs performed by God's own people but since God never promised any other nation that they'll be a blessing {Genesis 12:1-3} they have to rely on the chosen race "Israelites" Zechariah 8:23

God's word is consistent on this but it's like many just want their problems solved anyway so they're not interested in the TRUTH!

MaxInDHouse:
Jesus, Paul, Barnabas, Philip are all Israelites!
I said one single miracle that doesn't involve a Jew!
For instance Adeboye Is not a Jew so if he performs any miracle that's exactly what i'm saying.
Can you relate such in the Bible?
The miracles were the signs God promised the Israelites that will mark the sealing of the New Covenant as the ceremony will not take place on planet earth where anyone can see how the High Priest (Jesus) PRESENT the ultimate sacrifice before the 24 elders in heaven! Revelations 11:16

So those promised signs were to alert the Israelites that the New Covenant has been sealed in heaven! Joel 2:28-30 compare to Act 2:16-18

After that all those signs will cease because it's purpose has been met! 1Corinthians 13:8-10

That's why there's no miracles anymore after the death of the last Apostle John!

May you have PEACE!

Did you see any book in the bible about non-Jews?
Did you see any portion of the bible that says only Jews will be given God's spiritual gifts?

Your spiritual gift must be divine ways of finding new excuses.

Myer:

Did you see any book in the bible about non-Jews?

YES!
The Bible book of Jonah had nothing to do with God's people so no miracles was performed for any observers, only Jonah alone knew what Jehovah did to him in the belle of the fish for three days while the Ninevites saw no miracles at all! Matthew 16:4

Did you see any portion of the bible that says only Jews will be given God's spiritual gifts?

YES!
God promised Abraham that it's through his lineage that other peoples will be blessed {Genesis 12:1-3} and the same promise was repeated after God brought the Israelites out of Egypt! Exodus 19:3-6

Your spiritual gift must be divine ways of finding new excuses.

It's just the truth to enlighten followers of this thread on the topic raised by the OP.
So if you don't want it others who are lovers of truth will make use of it! John 8:32

Kobojunkie:
They have ceased? But wasn't it the same faith that Jesus Christ declared we would move mountains with?

Yes, by faith and through prayers God can do wonders in our lives... But no man has the gifts as of the early Christian times, because they have ceased. No one in our times has received laying on of hands from the early apostles in other to receive these gifts, as we see in Acts 8:13-20, Rom 1:11, that's why 1cor 13 aptly tells us already that these gifts will cease and all left for us today will be faith, hope and love. With these, we should be content

aytuns:

Yes, by faith and through prayers God can do wonders in our lives... But no man has the gifts as of the early Christian times, because they have ceased. No one in our times has received laying on of hands from the early apostles in other to receive these gifts, as we see in Acts 8:13-20, Rom 1:11, that's why 1cor 13 aptly tells us already that these gifts will cease and all left for us today will be faith, hope and love. With these, we should be content

I see what you assume of Paul's statement there in 1 Corinthians 13, but the authority you speak came, not by Paul but by Jesus Christ, the one who is God's New Covenant and Law in the Kingdom of God.

Jesus Christ by decree gave power to all those who believe in Him. Surely, if such a decree is to be revoked or ended, there ought to be a follow up edict by Jesus Christ, or God Himself, declaring this. So where, in scripture, are you told by Jesus Christ that this authority has been revoked?

4 Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous, it does not brag, and it is not proud.
5 Love is not rude, it is not selfish, and it cannot be made angry easily. Love does not remember wrongs done against it.
6 Love is never happy when others do wrong, but it is always happy with the truth.
7 Love never gives up on people. It never stops trusting, never loses hope, and never quits.

8 Love will never end. But all those gifts will come to an end—even the gift of prophecy, the gift of speaking in different kinds of languages, and the gift of knowledge.
9 These will all end because this knowledge and these prophecies we have are not complete.
10 But when perfection comes, the things that are not complete will end. - 1 Corinthians 13 vs 4 - 10

Now, on the issue of your understanding of what Paul says in 1 Corinthians 13, according to his claim, perfection is to come before the cessation. So has the perfection he spoke of come? If so, when?

MaxInDHouse:


YES!
The Bible book of Jonah had nothing to do with God's people so no miracles was performed for any observers, only Jonah alone knew what Jehovah did to him in the belle of the fish for three days while the Ninevites saw no miracles at all! Matthew 16:4


YES!
God promised Abraham that it's through his lineage that other peoples will be blessed {Genesis 12:1-3} and the same promise was repeated after God brought the Israelites out of Egypt! Exodus 19:3-6


It's just the truth to enlighten followers of this thread on the topic raised by the OP.
So if you don't want it others who are lovers of truth will make use of it! John 8:32

The book of Jonah?
Was Jonah not a Jew? You argue irrationally just defend your fallacy.

God performed miracles in the land of Philistines simply because of Samson, in Egypt simply because of Joseph. So your pount that God did not perform miracles in Nineveh is actually pointless.

The promise of the Holy Spirit was to the Jews but Cornelius and his household confirmed that it was to extend to the rest of the world since God himself sent Peter to impart them with the Holyspirit.

The promise is First to the Jews then the rest of the world.
The promise is not only to the Jews.

I'm curious as to your next line of defense cos unknown to you, your spiritual gift is actually to discover divine ways of making up excuses.

God only perform miracles whenever Israelites are involved!

The case of Nineveh has nothing to do with the Israelites that's why they never saw any miracles!

Myer:

The book of Jonah?
Was Jonah not a Jew? You argue irrationally just defend your fallacy.
God performed miracles in the land of Philistines simply because of Samson, in Egypt simply because of Joseph. So your pount that God did not perform miracles in Nineveh is actually pointless.
The promise of the Holy Spirit was to the Jews but Cornelius and his household confirmed that it was to extend to the rest of the world since God himself sent Peter to impart them with the Holyspirit.
The promise is First to the Jews then the rest of the world.
The promise is not only to the Jews.
I'm curious as to your next line of defense cos unknown to you, your spiritual gift is actually to discover divine ways of making up excuses.

MaxInDHouse:
God only perform miracles whenever Israelites are involved!

The case of Nineveh has nothing to do with the Israelites that's why they never saw any miracles!

The point youre still not getting is that you're not making any point.

The old testament was according to the old covenant where God seemed to focus on Abraham and his offspring, the Jews.
Clearly the books and miracles in the old testament were centred around Jews.

The new testament was according to the new covenant of God's holistic plan to eventually save the whole world through Jesus Christ.
To save the Jews first (which Jesus acknowledged he was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.) Then to save the Gentiles which as I clearly stated God confirmed through Peter being sent to Cornelius and his household. Both Cornelius and everyone of his household received the Holyspirit and even spoke in tongues.
False Jehovah's witnesses like you likewise challenged Peter for allowing bloody gentiles (who they seemed inferior and unclean) to receive the Holyspirit like them the Jews. But he was able to explain that he was obeying God's instruction.
How do you explain that?

Jesus himself after his crucifixion and before ascension extended the Promise from only the Jews to the whole world which is why the gospel got to a gentile like you. He sent them to share the gospel and the Promise to the world.
Mark 16:17 clearly also states it's not only the gospel but all the signs will follow anyone who believes in Christ.

The new testament goes beyond the Jews. There is nothing the Jews can receive in Christ that the Gentiles (Non-Jews) cannot receive including the Spiritual gifts and Fruit.

Your argument is clearly baseless cos it according to you, only Jews can bear the fruit of the spirit since it is likewise a product of the Holy spirit. Does that make any sense to you?
You do understand that the Fruit is Love and as detailed in Gal 5:22-23

Myer:


The point youre still not getting is that you're not making any point.

The old testament was according to the old covenant where God seemed to focus on Abraham and his offspring, the Jews.
Clearly the books and miracles in the old testament were centred around Jews.

The new testament was according to the new covenant of God's holistic plan to eventually save the whole world through Jesus Christ.
To save the Jews first (which Jesus acknowledged he was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.) Then to save the Gentiles which as I clearly stated God confirmed through Peter being sent to Cornelius and his household. Both Cornelius and everyone of his household received the Holyspirit and even spoke in tongues.
False Jehovah's witnesses like you likewise challenged Peter for allowing bloody gentiles (who they seemed inferior and unclean) to receive the Holyspirit like them the Jews. But he was able to explain that he was obeying God's instruction.
How do you explain that?

Jesus himself after his crucifixion and before ascension extended the Promise from only the Jews to the whole world which is why the gospel got to a gentile like you. He sent them to share the gospel and the Promise to the world.
Mark 16:17 clearly also states it's not only the gospel but all the signs will follow anyone who believes in Christ.

The new testament goes beyond the Jews. There is nothing the Jews can receive in Christ that the Gentiles (Non-Jews) cannot receive including the Spiritual gifts and Fruit.

Your argument is clearly baseless cos it according to you, only Jews can bear the fruit of the spirit since it is likewise a product of the Holy spirit. Does that make any sense to you?
You do understand that the Fruit is Love and as detailed in Gal 5:22-23

Can you help me with any amount of money?



I will be grateful

Jesus emphasized that miracles are primarily for the Jews:

And look! a Phoe·niʹcian woman from that region came and cried out: “Have mercy on me, Lord, Son of David. My daughter is cruelly demon possessed.” But he did not say a word in answer to her. So his disciples came and began to urge him: “Send her away, because she keeps crying out after us.” He answered: “I was not sent to anyone except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” But the woman came and did obeisance to him, saying: “Lord, help me!” In answer he said: “It is not right to take the bread of the children and throw it to the little dogs.” Matthew 15:22-26

Peter confirmed that the GIFTS of God's Holy Spirit was God's promise to proof that the New Covenant has been sealed! Act 2:16-18 compare to Joel 2:28-30

Paul confirmed that after the completion of God's word the GIFTS will cease! 1Corinthians 13:8-10

As for the FRUIT of God's Holy Spirit these has nothing to do with spectacular display so it could only be observed in the midst of Jesus' true followers {Matthew 7:16-18} note that Jesus didn't say only his followers will produce FRUITS rather he meant they will be the only group bearing fine FRUIT (WORKS) {Galatians 5:22-23} that's why James emphasized that it's the WORKS of faith that matters not just faith without FINE WORKS! James 2:18-26

The OP's question is clear enough and this answer is straightforward enough!

Myer:

The point youre still not getting is that you're not making any point.
The old testament was according to the old covenant where God seemed to focus on Abraham and his offspring, the Jews.
Clearly the books and miracles in the old testament were centred around Jews.
The new testament was according to the new covenant of God's holistic plan to eventually save the whole world through Jesus Christ.
To save the Jews first (which Jesus acknowledged he was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.) Then to save the Gentiles which as I clearly stated God confirmed through Peter being sent to Cornelius and his household. Both Cornelius and everyone of his household received the Holyspirit and even spoke in tongues.
False Jehovah's witnesses like you likewise challenged Peter for allowing bloody gentiles (who they seemed inferior and unclean) to receive the Holyspirit like them the Jews. But he was able to explain that he was obeying God's instruction.
How do you explain that?
Jesus himself after his crucifixion and before ascension extended the Promise from only the Jews to the whole world which is why the gospel got to a gentile like you. He sent them to share the gospel and the Promise to the world.
Mark 16:17 clearly also states it's not only the gospel but all the signs will follow anyone who believes in Christ.
The new testament goes beyond the Jews. There is nothing the Jews can receive in Christ that the Gentiles (Non-Jews) cannot receive including the Spiritual gifts and Fruit.
Your argument is clearly baseless cos it according to you, only Jews can bear the fruit of the spirit since it is likewise a product of the Holy spirit. Does that make any sense to you?
You do understand that the Fruit is Love and as detailed in Gal 5:22-23

Omooba77:
Why are we not seeing Miracles as of Old?

It is because the " Miracles as of old" never happened or were not real stories

Nobody has parted the red sea or any sea. Manna has never fallen from the sky and no one has ever turned water into wine in a wedding ceremony in the past.


The miraculous accounts recorded in the Bible or any other religious text, were written by highly evolved individuals in the past who wanted to use those stories to achieve a particular end.

They say, "the end justify the means". That is it

Once you know what they were seeking to achieve with those stories ,you will immediately see the point of it all.

You shouldn't take the miraculous accounts in the Bible or any religious text literarily. Anyone who does so, is being stupid.

Unfortunately, Christians and believers elsewhere don't have the proper guidance to know the truth of what they read in those text. They just follow what they are told or what they assume.