Religion lives with two OBIOUS but NECESSARY contradictions for her existence.
OBVIOUS:
If God already knows everything from start to finish, it mean, he has the beginning to the end like a video clip before him. So whatever seems to change, he already knows they will change. Which means, we are a robot with consciousness; therefore, our FREEWILL is an illusion because it is predetermined already. You are really not making those choices that look apparent you're making. Which mean, there is no YOU really. All actions are involuntary. Your body chemicals and hormones has been programmed to take those actions to the exact degree you get angry, love, laugh …. Of course it's possible because God should be able to make more classic robot that the ones you want to use as a basis for your argument for FREE WILL.
NECESSARY:
Religion has no choice but to claim God knows everything because if he doesn't, we need not worry about him because he's just like us. Limited knowledge. Remember, God should only punish us if he doesn't know everything from start to finish. You can't punish someone you already know will rape a woman on June 23, 2023 by 10:31 pm no matter how he tries not to, because that's his destiny. If this person has a choice, then God doesn't know everything which is fine with me because it's possible he doesn't.
In order for God to punish us, it must mean that we have FREE WILL, because if we don't, it will be evil to punish a robot. And we shouldn't have FREE WILL since he knows all the outcomes already). But religion says we still have free will even when God knows all the outcomes.
Now religion has to take these two contradictory position simultaneously because she has no choice.
What is your take on this.

Another New Moniker!

Sirsesan:
Religion lives with two OBIOUS but NECESSARY contradictions for her existence.
OBVIOUS:
If God already knows everything from start to finish, it mean, he has the beginning to the end like a video clip before him.

Thank God you said "if" which is because you took in what Liars/Mistaken people have said.

Whereas It is Written "the eyes of the LORD run to and fro throughout the whole earth," 2 Chronicles 16:9

What for? if it is not see what is Going on Directly!

Know this: God can know the future, but He does not Look into it

And that is where Freewill, is free to choose from the available options.

Sirsesan:
Religion lives with two OBIOUS but NECESSARY contradictions for her existence.
OBVIOUS:
If God already knows everything from start to finish, it mean, he has the beginning to the end like a video clip before him. So whatever seems to change, he already knows they will change. Which means, we are a robot with consciousness; therefore, our FREEWILL is an illusion because it is predetermined already. You are really not making those choices that look apparent you're making. Which mean, there is no YOU really. All actions are involuntary. Your body chemicals and hormones has been programmed to take those actions to the exact degree you get angry, love, laugh …. Of course it's possible because God should be able to make more classic robot that the ones you want to use as a basis for your argument for FREE WILL.
NECESSARY:
Religion has no choice but to claim God knows everything because if he doesn't, we need not worry about him because he's just like us. Limited knowledge. Remember, God should only punish us if he doesn't know everything from start to finish. You can't punish someone you already know will rape a woman on June 23, 2023 by 10:31 pm no matter how he tries not to, because that's his destiny. If this person has a choice, then God doesn't know everything which is fine with me because it's possible he doesn't.
In order for God to punish us, it must mean that we have FREE WILL, because if we don't, it will be evil to punish a robot. And we shouldn't have FREE WILL since he knows all the outcomes already). But religion says we still have free will even when God knows all the outcomes.
Now religion has to take these two contradictory position simultaneously because she has no choice.
What is your take on this.

I think you lean towards fallacy a bit...
Just becos God knows what will happen doesn’t make our freewill an illusion, neither does it make us a robot.... look at this way..

A one year old is crawling towards fire... as an adult.. u know the end of that course is destruction...but that’s not the only end...the child can stop, turn back, someone can pick the child up etc..but just becos u can predict that the child might die doesn’t automatically means that’s what will happen...

Like the theory of multiverse....humans don’t have one outcome becos we have freewill to make numerous choices which can lead to different outcomes

....for example...a person can decide to commit suicide today and not become anything...and can also become a doctor and save lives in the medical field....

u think a drug addict was programmed by God to die of drugs when he could have become something greater?? He made a choice that aligned with many other choices made by others that led to his end

Someone designed cocaine...
Another person decided to get high
Someone overdosed...someone died before their time..

My theory is this, God doesn’t technically know your final outcome as if you were programmed to make one decision and one decision only... or no mater what...

On the contrary and even better, I feel What God knows is all the possible outcomes there is, leaving us with all the power to make a choice and turn out well...

Why did I say so... why will God Ask you to repent? if he already knows your end is hell or destruction or whatever, why ask for your repentance if you don’t have a say or free will??

Bible recorded concerning Nineveh....If you’ve read the story of the book of Jonah...the prophecy was that the city would be destroyed....butthey changed their outcome...... we don’t have one outcome...they are numerous....your final outcome is in your hands

advanceDNA:

A one year old is crawling towards fire... as an adult.. u know the end of that course is destruction...but that’s not the only end...the child can stop, turn back, someone can pick the child up etc..but just becos u can predict that the child might die doesn’t automatically means that’s what will happen...

Oh oh! My day is made! Sweet sweet words!

My people are Seeing and Thinking!

[quote author=advanceDNA post=107211394]

I think you lean towards fallacy a bit...
Just becos God knows what will happen doesn’t make our freewill an illusion, neither does it make us a robot.... look at this way..

A one year old is crawling towards fire... as an adult.. u know the end of that course is destruction...but that’s not the only end...the child can stop, turn back, someone can pick the child up etc..but just becos u can predict that the child might die doesn’t automatically means that’s what will happen...

Like the theory of multiverse....humans don’t have one outcome becos we have freewill to make numerous choices which can lead to different outcomes

....for example...a person can decide to commit suicide today and not become anything...and can also become a doctor and save lives in the medical field....

u think a drug addict was programmed by God to die of drugs when he could have become something greater?? He made a choice that aligned with many other choices made by others that led to his end

Someone designed cocaine...
Another person decided to get high
Someone overdosed...someone died before their time..

My theory is this, God doesn’t technically know your final outcome as if you were programmed to make one decision and one decision only... or no mater what...

On the contrary and even better, I feel What God knows is all the possible outcomes there is, leaving us with all the power to make a choice and turn out well...

Why did I say so... why will God Ask you to repent? if he already knows your end is hell or destruction or whatever, why ask for your repentance if you don’t have a say or free will??

Bible recorded concerning Nineveh....If you’ve read the story of the book of Jonah...the prophecy was that the city would be destroyed....butthey changed their outcome...... we don’t have one outcome...they are numerous....your final outcome is in your hands



[I enjoy this your response so much. You dealt with it like an academic exercise. But your position as good as it looks, is not what the scripture teaches. Is like shifting the goal post. When you sensed an opponent will soon score a goal, you ran away with the goal post. The bible said, before you were conceived, i knew you. I am the Alpha and Omega. The bible at every junction categorically claimed God knows everything in every details. I am not asking for personal opinions, because we only know God through the bible, you don't know him personally. There is no where the bible accepted this your famous claim "God doesn’t technically know your final outcome as if you were programmed to make one decision and one decision only... or no mater what..."

[quote author=advanceDNA post=107211394]

I think you lean towards fallacy a bit...
Just becos God knows what will happen doesn’t make our freewill an illusion, neither does it make us a robot.... look at this way..

A one year old is crawling towards fire... as an adult.. u know the end of that course is destruction...but that’s not the only end...the child can stop, turn back, someone can pick the child up etc..but just becos u can predict that the child might die doesn’t automatically means that’s what will happen...

Like the theory of multiverse....humans don’t have one outcome becos we have freewill to make numerous choices which can lead to different outcomes

....for example...a person can decide to commit suicide today and not become anything...and can also become a doctor and save lives in the medical field....

u think a drug addict was programmed by God to die of drugs when he could have become something greater?? He made a choice that aligned with many other choices made by others that led to his end

Someone designed cocaine...
Another person decided to get high
Someone overdosed...someone died before their time..

My theory is this, God doesn’t technically know your final outcome as if you were programmed to make one decision and one decision only... or no mater what...

On the contrary and even better, I feel What God knows is all the possible outcomes there is, leaving us with all the power to make a choice and turn out well...

Why did I say so... why will God Ask you to repent? if he already knows your end is hell or destruction or whatever, why ask for your repentance if you don’t have a say or free will??

Bible recorded concerning Nineveh....If you’ve read the story of the book of Jonah...the prophecy was that the city would be destroyed....butthey changed their outcome...... we don’t have one outcome...they are numerous....your final outcome is in your hands



[You lean toward fallacy when you brought God down to the level of relationship between a human being and a child. That analogous is a fallacy because God knows more than just that according to the bible. He has forecasted a lots of people future in the bible that happened nonetheless regarding their contribution. And there is no where the bible claimed God decided he doesn't want to know the future. According to you, ""u think a drug addict was programmed by God to die of drugs when he could have become something greater?? He made a choice that aligned with many other choices made by others that led to his end" My problem with this is, That FREEWILL might be predetermined; you finds it difficult to accept because it looks like you are in fact in charge. But your position is a personal ideal not the bible position.
]

[quote author=Sirsesan post=107235164][/quote]

Why would God ask for your repentannce if you are going to hell anyways??

It's simple logic...

You can't give someone free will and also know what exactly they will do....you can all they are capable of in the confines of their capability....that's why I said God know all possible outcomes l but leaves the decision in our hands....

Did u read in genesis where scripture said concerning Abraham after he wantedto sacrifice issac..."now I know you fear me" ...didn't God know what Abraham would do...?? Why say so...because. Abraham had so many outcomes, there's an outxome that Abraham won't choose to do what God wanted....

Sirsesan:

The bible said, before you were conceived, i knew you. I am the Alpha and Omega. The bible at every junction categorically claimed God knows everything in every details. I am not asking for personal opinions, because we only know God through the bible, you don't know him personally

I wonder where you are getting the bold from. You cut away a section of the Bible to give a meaning. Am not sure this is how you read newspaper or books in school. You should read all and read it properly.

Jeremiah 1:5
4 Now the word of the Lord came to me (JEREMIAH) , saying,
5 “Before I formed you (JEREMIAH) in the womb I knew YOU (JEREMIAH),
and before YOU (JEREMIAH) were born I consecrated YOU (JEREMIAH);
I appointed you (JEREMIAH) a prophet to the nations.”


I have helped you added the name of the person there so that you aren't reading it to mean everyone you meet on the road. That word was for Jeremiah who was a prophet.


If you pay attention well, he mentioned that he is A PROPHET. Am sure you are not and not everyone is one.

So, the interpretation you gave referencing this was wrong. If you are pointing to God's knowing all, find another scriptures, this one is out of context Sir. You didn't read it before or read it well.

Same as the ALPHA AND OMEGA you referenced.

Please Bro read Bible well before starting argument on what you aren't sure of. And even if you have been taught wrongly, right the wrong by reading well now.

Your problem is complicated due to the things those pastors infused in your skull, but that's no problem if you widen out to gain accurate knowledge of God's word! 1Timothy 2:4

God can know everything happening in the universe but as for planet earth He has chosen not to focus on all the events happening here because it's making Him feel sad {Genesis 6:6} so He empowered His spirit messengers (angels) with the ability to see everything happening anywhere they are {Ezekiel 10:12; Revelations 4:8} these are the ones bringing all the reports {Genesis 18:20-21} as for Him His eyes are too Holy (too pure) to keep on looking at what is evil {Habakkuk 1:13} so He doesn't know many of the evil things happening now.
According to the Bible book of Revelation his Son whom He has put in charge of everything said:

"Let the one who is unrighteous continue in unrighteousness, and let the filthy one continue in his filth; but let the righteous one continue in righteousness, and let the holy one continue in holiness" Revelations 22:11

This means whatever evil people are doing presently God is no more aware except those who are discussing about how to draw close to Him, these are the only accounts the angels are recording {Malachi 3:16 compare to Revelations 20:15} as for the rest of mankind who aren't interested in God's righteousness or humble enough to know {Zephaniah 2:2-3} they're like walking corpse before Him {Matthew 8:22} that means God doesn't even know anything about them presently because from His standpoint they are dead already!

So God has the ability to see all things but for now there are many things He is not aware of at all!

hupernikao:


I wonder where you are getting the bold from. You cut away a section of the Bible to give a meaning. Am not sure this is how you read newspaper or books in school. You should read all and read it properly.

Jeremiah 1:5
4 Now the word of the Lord came to me (JEREMIAH) , saying,
5 “Before I formed you (JEREMIAH) in the womb I knew YOU (JEREMIAH),
and before YOU (JEREMIAH) were born I consecrated YOU (JEREMIAH);
I appointed you (JEREMIAH) a prophet to the nations.”


I have helped you added the name of the person there so that you aren't reading it to mean everyone you meet on the road. That word was for Jeremiah who was a prophet.


If you pay attention well, he mentioned that he is A PROPHET. Am sure you are not and not everyone is one.

So, the interpretation you gave referencing this was wrong. If you are pointing to God's knowing all, find another scriptures, this one is out of context Sir. You didn't read it before or read it well.

Same as the ALPHA AND OMEGA you referenced.

Please Bro read Bible well before starting argument on what you aren't sure of. And even if you have been taught wrongly, right the wrong by reading well now.

Whats your point..?? .that in this whole world, it’s only Jeremiah God knew before he was formed in the womb??

advanceDNA:


Whats your point..?? .that in this whole world, it’s only Jeremiah God knew before he was formed in the womb??

Well, what i want you to do first is to stay on context. Dont lift text and give it your own meaning. It leads to dishonesty which i am sure you arent. That is the correction here. No scriptures backs what you said and you used a very wrong text. So correct that.

hupernikao:


Well, what i want you to do first is to stay on context. Dont lift text and give it your own meaning. It leads to dishonesty which i am sure you arent. That is the correction here. No scriptures backs what you said and you used a very wrong text. So correct that.

Some used Jerimiah 1v5 to explain that God knows everyone...u said he sued that verse out of context..because God was speaking and referring to Jerimiah specifically......so I asked u a simple question: is it only Jerimiah God new before he was formed??

U ddnt answer the question...
There’s no crime in saying you don’t know..
But all u did I find fault in my question...and run away from answering it

advanceDNA:


Some used Jerimiah 1v5 to explain that God knows everyone...u said he sued that verse out of context..because God was speaking and referring to Jerimiah specifically......so I asked u a simple question: is it only Jerimiah God new before he was formed??

U ddnt answer the question...
There’s no crime in saying you don’t know..
But all u did I find fault in my question...and run away from answering it

He Answered that way because of this Evil thread raised by An Enemy!

He is not your enemy and I believe you know and get the point he was making to address the enemy.

He was not addressing you.

Which is why he said "stay on context"

He knows the Answer, I know the Answer and you too know the Answer, but right now, it is not about us and our understandings BUT ABOUT WHAT IS RIGHT AND TRUE WITH GOD.

advanceDNA:


Some used Jerimiah 1v5 to explain that God knows everyone...u said he sued that verse out of context..because God was speaking and referring to Jerimiah specifically......so I asked u a simple question: is it only Jerimiah God new before he was formed??

U ddnt answer the question...
There’s no crime in saying you don’t know..
But all u did I find fault in my question...and run away from answering it

You will know that the question you are asking will become irrelevant if you agree to read the text and imtepret it the way you will interpret any text written in English.


You were told, from the context that He was refering to Jeremiah. That wasn't my interpretation, that is what you saw yourself.

Yet you are asking if it's for everyone. Do you now see that you are the one who want to choose and accept a wrong interpretation or explanation.


The text is clear enough even for an unbeliever to know that he was referring to Jeremiah.


I expect you to question anyone who told you that the text applies to you or everyone. But here you are questioning me on whether it can apply to everyone even when the text is so clear to you.


What you are doing now, is one of the most cruel thing ever done to the Bible. To try to bring our imagination into a clear text. Trying to justify a meaning that wasn't given.

If you have read this in a letter written to you and your name is stated there, will you have been asking if it's speaking about your neighbor or everyone in the world?


Take simple text simple. Don't loose your reading skills when reading the Bible.

That text is clear, so clear your mind and take it as it is, even if it's dissolved your earlier stand it shouldn't matter. What matter is honesty in interpretation even if you don't believe in the writer.

Jeremiah is the subject and that's the interpretation. Any other one is imagination.

Omniscience and freewill are incapatible.
There's no need for big grammars and long articles.

Religion is just ridiculous and that's not surprising

[quote author=Workch post=107339159]Omniscience and freewill are incapatible.
There's no need for big grammars and long articles.

Religion is just ridiculous and that's not surprising

[You have finished this whole discussion. They are incompatible. People on this platform have all attempted to reconcile the 2. And mind u anything can be reconciled, all you need to do is come up with an implausible case scenario to do that. That doesn't help anyone.]