obanioluorun:
Ife initiated bini bronze casting, since the Oba Eweka of bini kingdom, his head buried in Ife and the Bronze head sent to bini for representative.

What is this Afonja melt saying?
What are you blabbing?
Wait! Can you tell nairaland community the reason why you're wailing?
Infact ehn!! Explain to us the reason why you're crying?

brain54:

Puncher well done...just dont go and punch someone that will beat the crap out of you. I was actually reading your comments until you started throwing unprintables...try to make your points with facts. Besides the guy didn't attack you or your traditional/custom. You were just being emotional.

I believe you lack the ability to understand the problem, just like people who don't have children can't understand that there are certain things you don't tell a father. This ignorance from you guys is the reason I told you guys to kindly mind your business and stop making our affairs your rhetorical game.
You are free to worship the whites and uncritically repeat neocolonialist talking points, but do so on your own business, not on our cultural heritage.
If you want to beat me up, then perhaps you might need five years of boxing training before it could become legal for me to beat the sh*t out of you.

Ghostwon6511:

I believe you lack the ability to understand the problem, just like people who don't have children can't understand that there are certain things you don't tell a father. This ignorance from you guys is the reason I told you guys to kindly mind your business and stop making our affairs your rhetorical game.
You are free to worship the whites and uncritically repeat neocolonialist talking points, but do so on your own business, not on our cultural heritage.
If you want to beat me up, then perhaps you might need five years of boxing training before it could become legal for me to beat the sh*t out of you.

Hahaha...now i understand you. Apart from being a mathematician and a puncher...you are also a comedian. You such a clown. You cracked me up.

brain54:

Hahaha...now i understand you. Apart from being a mathematician and a puncher...you are also a comedian. You such a clown. You cracked me up.

Being a mathematician doesn't stop me from loving and practicing boxing. Some people can do more than one thing: my dad used to be a soldier and before that he was a sportsman and he studied computer science, I have his genes. Becoming a mathematician didn't turn me into a weakling and boxing didn't turn me into a dumb person. I know it is hard for you to understand how someone could be at the same time smarter than you and stronger than you. But, if we meet and it is legal for me to knock you out, then I will do so, afterwards I will give you a lecture on category theory to help you get some sense.

Ghostwon6511:
Being s mathematician doesn't stop me from loving and practicing boxing. Some people can do more than one thing: my dad used to be a soldier and before that he was a sportsman and he studied computer science, I have his genes. Becoming a mathematician didn't turn me into a weakling and boxing didn't turn me into a dumb person. I know it is hard for you to understand how someone could be at the same time smarter than you and stronger than you. But, if we meet and it is legal for me to knock you out, then I will do so, afterwards I will give you a lecture on category theory to help you get some sense.

Hahaha...i never said it was a crime to be multi talented. You misunderstood me. Now i am weary of ever meeting you,so you dont knock my tooth out. I am sure your dad's genes are very strong. But i could actually learn a move or two from you both on and off the boxing ring. You sound like an elderly person...i know what they say about age and wisdom.

Archworld:
It's a beautiful feeling but I think the whites would value it more than us. In fact they were the ones that even made us to know such thing exist because they took care of it over the years. Whites attach values to many things . The ones that were not stolen by the whites , where are they today? I guess dust has finished them . Africa lack maintenance culture . We only begin to value things when they are stolen

the ones not stolen by the whites and are still in the palace, in the palace in Benin kingdom, there are artifacts that predates the existence of Nigeria don't and the binis hold them in high esteem

Ghostwon6511:


1)You still don't know how to quote properly, this shows your lack of intelligence
2) I repeat, Ife was a small village untill 1912 when the British started urbanising it. I am not saying this as an insult, this is on record. It is a proven fact.
3) every story of people migrating from Ife is a myth created to elevate the status of the Oni of Ife.
4) no head of any Oba of Benin was buried in Ife and no bronze was sent to Benin from Ife. Benin royal court had its own guild which the British interrupted and which was later revived by Oba Eweka II.
5)Benin emperors were buried in the palace except for Oba Ovonramwen who was buried in Calabar.

6) The thing with you guys yoruba is that you believe you know us better than we know ourselves, your entire self-worth revolves around claims about us. Quite basically you are historical parasites. Look how you guys are flocking here out of jealousy and trying to claim Benin heritage and also promote Ife myths on this topic which has nothing to do with you.

Pride in you will allow you to accept the truth and reality, go to Ife and see things, I came from Ile- ALARA the sharer of Oduduwa properties but crowns and the deities, the Oranmiyan that established the bini kingdom obaship was never a direct son or blood to Oduduwa, Oduduwa son was only Akanbi it was Akanbi that has Seven sons and one daughter, which are Orangun, Owa Obokun, Ajero, ALARA, Aketu, isabe and popo.the only daughter was owu,. Oranmiyan was Ogun onire son the commander of Ife army, the igidomigodo throne rejected him because he had no trace to royal blood, then he slept with igidomigodo princess to have Omo Oba Eweka, he Oranmiyan left Bini to Nupe for another royal blood, the Nupe princess gave him Ajaka and songo to become Alaafin before he finally return to Ile- Ife.

obanioluorun:
Pride in you will allow you to accept the truth and reality, go to Ife and see things, I came from Ile- ALARA the sharer of Oduduwa properties but crowns and the deities, the Oranmiyan that established the bini kingdom obaship was never a direct son or blood to Oduduwa, Oduduwa son was only Akanbi it was Akanbi that has Seven sons and one daughter, which are Orangun, Owa Obokun, Ajero, ALARA, Aketu, isabe and popo.the only daughter was owu,. Oranmiyan was Ogun onire son the commander of Ife army, the igidomigodo throne rejected him because he had no trace to royal blood, then he slept with igidomigodo princess to have Omo Oba Eweka, he Oranmiyan left Bini to Nupe for another royal blood, the Nupe princess gave him Ajaka and songo to become Alaafin before he finally return to Ile- Ife.

Stop saying rubbish. Try and base your thinking in logics and facts rather than dogma and ignorance.

1) there was no oduduwa
2) there was no orammiyan
3) there was no ogiso
4) nobody migrated from Ife
5) Ife was a small village until 1912 when the British started developing it !
6) it seems you yoruba need fairytales as "history" so please try and make sure your fairytales do not revolve around my people. Because then it causes the nonesense we see today in which you are talking total illogical nonsense and speaking as if you witnessed my ancestors and yours...stop, get well in your head.

All these oyinbo sef , them dey thief uooo..

Archworld:



Your are deviating by raising a different argument entirely . No one argued that whatever they stole doesn't belong to Benin people . If I were to argue blindly with you , I would remind you that there is not part of Nigeria that is greater that the whole country, the constituents make up the whole. There is nothing like the sovereign Benin kingdom, but the Sovereign Federal Republic of Nigeria. I agree that every kingdom had their sovereignty, but that was in the past. In our current constitution, even your chiefs and kingdoms are now under the local governments , no matter the relevance you attach to it. The past is history , stop arguing with emotion because you are from Bini. The law of Nigeria takes hold of all

All we were talking about was about maintenance, I expected you to argue on this , not raise a different argument that you can't win

And who told you that the Benin artefacts that were not stolen by the British were not maintained and preserved? Stop speaking out of ignorance and jumping to conclusions. Go to the Oba of Benin palace and you will see treasures and artefacts that are more than 100 years old. I repeat, "More than 100 years old. Some are way way older. How old is Nigeria as a country?

Keep your talk on "lack of maintainance culture" bla bla bla for other sectors or regions in Nigeria. In Benin Kingdom, our heritage and artefacts are well preserved!

Thank you!

Coldie:

His point is, Britain took some, what about the ones Britain didn’t take why are they not in museum. Where are they right now? If not for them this present one somebody go don burn am say na witch or they would have thrown it away as trash a long time ago

You too made a salient point. Nonetheless, we are now aware of their values. We gonna harness them.

Meninmen:


And who told you that the Benin artefacts that were not stolen by the British were not maintained and preserved? Stop speaking out of ignorance and jumping to conclusions. Go to the Oba of Benin palace and you will see treasures and artefacts that are more than 100 years old. I repeat, "More than 100 years old. Some are way way older. How old is Nigeria as a country?

Keep your talk on "lack of maintainance culture" bla bla bla for other sectors or regions in Nigeria. In Benin Kingdom, our heritage and artefacts are well preserved!

Thank you!

Well said bro. Benin to the world

Archworld:
It's a beautiful feeling but I think the whites would value it more than us. In fact they were the ones that even made us to know such thing exist because they took care of it over the years. Whites attach values to many things . The ones that were not stolen by the whites , where are they today? I guess dust has finished them . Africa lack maintenance culture . We only begin to value things when they are stolen

Please Sir kindly say what you know or understand.

Coldie:

His point is, Britain took some, what about the ones Britain didn’t take why are they not in museum. Where are they right now? If not for them this present one somebody go don burn am say na witch or they would have thrown it away as trash a long time ago

Please try and educate yourself before talking out of ignorance.

1) after Britain won the war against Benin, Britain looted the palace of the Oba and the chiefs and burnt everything they couldn't carry to the ground (Benin city, capital of the kingdom was burnt to the ground). You see, do you begin to understand how ridiculous your question is ?

2) the British returned some of the artefacts in The 1930's (like the beeded traditional attire of the Oba of Benin) and those were very well kept.

3) Benin had these artefacts for hundreds of years before they were looted by the British, so I really don't get your "point"

4) stop repeating uncritically British neocolonialist talking points, it doesn't make you smart to just be parroting people whom you assume are smart.

5) given your total ignorance of Benin matters, shouldn't you be quiet ? Could you mind your own business ?

jude33084:



Please Sir kindly say what you know or understand.

He doesn't know nor understand anything, he is repeating word for word the talking points of the British neocolonialist who want to hang on to Benin treasures. The guy has 0 knowledge about Benin or Benin history, he assumes the British are smart and that repeating their rhetoric makes him smart and civilized.

aribisala0:


They value it more than us?

Why didn't they make it?

See mentality!!

Are you from Benin? Who is the "US"

Are you among?

I was extremely surprised last year when I saw a journalist from Europe interviewing Nigerians about how important the Benin bronzes are to them and if they should be returned or not:

1)None of the people being interviewed was Edo.
2) the interviewees were all either yoruba, Igbo or hausa.
3) they spoke as if we Edo people designated them as our spokespersons, as if we can't talk for ourselves.
4) I noticed them saying "we" a lot as if they believed themselves to be Edo people.
5) imagine a yoruba boy saying "those our artefacts, we do not value them, it is best the Europeans keep them"...the same with a guy from Enugu, saying "we should live them in Britain and have Britain compensate us".
6) basically, non-Edo feel entitled to our Edo ancestral heritage...this is just madness.

Ghostwon6511:


I was extremely surprised last year when I saw a journalist from Europe interviewing Nigerians about how important the Benin bronzes are to them and if they should be returned or not:

1)None of the people being interviewed was Edo.
2) the interviewees were all either yoruba, Igbo or hausa.
3) they spoke as we Edo people designated them as our spokespersons, as if we can't talk for ourselves.
4) I noticed them saying "we" a lot as if they believed themselves to be Edo people.
5) imagine a yoruba man saying "those our artefacts, we do not value them, it is best the Europeans keep them"...the same with a guy from Enugu, saying "we should live them in Britain and have Britain compensate us".
6) basically, non-Edo feel entitled to our Edo ancestral heritage...this is just madness.

The items are very beautiful so everyone would like to attach themselves That is human nature. It is offensive to suggest they should be kept in Europe and not returned to the rightful owners

Anyhow you are derailing when you mention Yoruba men and all that stuff

Was any of those interviewed whether Yoruba or not speaking for Yoruba folk or their personal opinion?

I am proud to be Yoruba and I have raised the question that Benin people are the best to speak for themselves. I do not think Europeans should keep them
Even at that I believe not every Edo person will say the same thing Some Edos might say Europeans should keep them
Part of the issue would be security and concern that they do not get looted again > Do we have the facilities to keep them safe?
That is going to cost money and I hope there is a good plan

You ae being petty I must tell you . What do you mean non-Edo feel entitled? Is it only Edo that fought for their return? There is no need to create unnecessary quarrels. Without the efforts of other Nigerians those items might not have been returned now
The items are Edo but that does not mean humanity not just Nigerians, cannot enjoy them.

What I would like to see is investment so that those skills are revived and supported so they can continue the good work

aribisala0:
The items are very beautiful so everyone would like to attach themselves That is human nature. It is offensive to suggest they should be kept in Europe and not returned to the rightful owners

Anyhow you are derailing when you mention Yoruba men and all that stuff

Was any of those interviewed whether Yoruba or not speaking for Yoruba folk or their personal opinion?

I am proud to be Yoruba and I have raised the question that Benin people are the best to speak for themselves. Even at that I believe not every Edo person will say the same thing .

You ae being petty I must tell you . What do you mean non-Edo feel entitled? Is it only Edo that fought for their return? There is no need to create unnecessary quarrels. Without the efforts of other Nigerians those items might not have been returned now
The items are Edo but that does not mean humanity not just Nigerians, cannot enjoy them.

What I would like to see is investment so that those skills are revived and supported so they can continue the good work

it would be more interesting if you would actually name some of the non Edos who fought for the return of Benin artefacts, all I have witnessed over the years are Nigerians (whom are not Edo) trying to stop the bronze from being returned to the Oba.


I am not being petty, I am only being territorial about my ancestral heritage. Even non-Edo can appreciate my ancestral heritage, but they need to stop being provocative and trying to have their way on Benin treasures.
In other words: if you guys don't have any supportive words for the Edo people of Benin empire, then just mind your business and leave us alone. Also we don't need lecturing from you, thanks.

One of the importance of these treasures is the fact they carry with them the memory of our ancestors. I wouldn't even care if we could make treasures of that same quality today, these ones are my history, the testimony of my ancestors and their country precolonial Benin Kingdom.

I just hope you realise my ancestors fought in Benin army and died to protect Benin empire, it's people and it's treasures, these objects are not just money to us, this is the blood of our ancestors, because it literally required from the British that they take our lives to get these objects. Our capital city was burnt to the ground ! What the British did to us is nothing less than a genocide. These artefacts are just priceless to us, I don't expect outsiders to understand.

Ghostwon6511:
it would be more interesting if you would actually name some of the non Edos who fought for the return of Benin artefacts, all I have witnessed over the years are Nigerians (whom are not Edo) trying to stop the bronze from being returned to the Oba.


I am not being petty, I am only being territorial about my ancestral heritage. Even non-Edo can appreciate my ancestral heritage, but they need to stop being provocative and trying to have their way on Benin treasures.
In other words: if you guys don't have any supportive words for the Edo people of Benin empire, then just mind your business and leave us alone. Also we don't need lecturing from you, thanks.

One of the importance of these treasures is the fact they carry with them the memory of our ancestors. I wouldn't even care if we could make treasures of that same quality today, these ones are my history, the testimony of my ancestors and their country precolonial Benin Kingdom.

I just hope you realise my ancestors fought in Benin army and died to protect Benin empire, it's people and it's treasures, these objects are not just money to us, this is the blood of our ancestors, because it literally required from the British that they take our lives to get these objects. Our capital city was burnt to the ground ! What the British did to us is nothing less than a genocide. These artefacts are just priceless to us, I don't expect outsiders to understand.

Well I am not the person to rant at
If you need to rant find someone else

Who are "you guys"?
And yes you are being petty

Is the Attorney General Edo, Is the Foreign Minister Edo?
If you think they were returned only because of the efforts of Edos fair play and good luck

I really do not want to be having a toxic conversation

I am a Yoruba and I am pleased they are returned to Edo people I do not speak for Yoruba and if a Yoruba person said they should not be returned he was not speaking for Yoruba
When Edo people do criminal things do they represent you?
Are you saying Edo people do not say things others do not like so why should that be the responsibility of all Edos?
What do you mean by you don't need lecturing from me
How have I lectured anyone?

People inflicted pain on others during history and the Benin Empire too was not innocent in causing pan to others too so spare me the pontificating .
The bronzes are back where they should be and that is all I care about

aribisala0:


Well I am not the person to rant at
If you need to rant find someone else

Who are "you guys"?
And yes you are being petty

Is the Attorney General Edo, Is the Foreign Minister Edo?
If you think they were returned only because of the efforts of Edos fair play and good luck

I really do not want to be having a toxic conversation

I am a Yoruba and I am pleased they are returned to Edo people I do not speak for Yoruba and if a Yoruba person said they should not be returned he was not speaking for Yoruba
When Edo people do criminal things do they represent you?
Are you saying Edo people do not say things others do not like so why should that be the responsibility of all Edos?
What do you mean by you don't need lecturing from me
How have I lectured anyone?

People inflicted pain on others during history and the Benin Empire too was not innocent in causing pan to others too so spare me the pontificating .
The bronzes are back where they should be and that is all I care about

Are the south-south and Lagos part of Nigeria ? Are federal offices within Nigeria owned by ethnic groups or do they represent everybody within Nigeria including the Edo people ?
You see, you are starting to show your anti Edo bias, it didn't take too long.

Ghostwon6511:


Are the south-south and Lagos part of Nigeria ? Are federal offices within Nigeria owned by ethnic groups or do they represent everybody within Nigeria including the Edo people ?
You see, you are starting to show your anti Edo bias, it didn't take too long.

OK
Goodbye

Archworld:
It's a beautiful feeling but I think the whites would value it more than us. In fact they were the ones that even made us to know such thing exist because they took care of it over the years. Whites attach values to many things . The ones that were not stolen by the whites , where are they today? I guess dust has finished them . Africa lack maintenance culture . We only begin to value things when they are stolen

I don’t know where you are from, we the Binis value our artifacts and I am glad this one’s returns back home.
Oba khato kpere. Ise.

Ghostwon6511:


Are the south-south and Lagos part of Nigeria ? Are federal offices within Nigeria owned by ethnic groups or do they represent everybody within Nigeria including the Edo people ?
You see, you are starting to show your anti Edo bias, it didn't take too long.

Guy, your comments here are becoming too baseless to bear. I don't know why you are feeling so entitled and biased.
The bone of contention here was "Are these precious artefacts going to be properly preserved for future generations to relish". You are just arguing blindly and speculating without listening and comprehending other people's input. And also you are also asserting that ancient Bini kingdom didn't commit crimes against humanity , like all other ancient African empires, inorder to become stupendously rich, you have to attack and cart away several men, women and children from other African states so as to sell to the slavers, the Europeans. So no kingdom then was innocent including "your" ancient Bini kingdom.

Akinola100:


Guy, your comments here are becoming too baseless to bear. I don't know why you are feeling so entitled and biased.
The bone of contention here was "Are these precious artefacts going to be properly preserved for future generations to relish". You are just arguing blindly and speculating without listening and comprehending other people's input. And also you are also asserting that ancient Bini kingdom didn't commit crimes against humanity , like all other ancient African empires, inorder to become stupendously rich, you have to attack and cart away several men, women and children from other African states so as to sell to the slavers, the Europeans. So no kingdom then was innocent including "your" ancient Bini kingdom.

Read all my comments before assuming I didn't answer your silly questions. Unless you expected every comment of mine to be the answer to that one silly question.

Also, don't confuse the bight of Benin with the slave coast. And stop overgeneralizing, not every African kingdom was heavily involved with the slave trade and some African kingdoms only sold their condemned criminals as slaves.
People like you are just repeating word for word what the British said as justification to keep looted Benin treasures, you can't even make your own argument. Also what is your business in Benin affairs ? Mind your business, this is my ancestral heritage, I did not sell you as a slave, so what do you want from me ?

Ghostwon6511:
For the many Nigerians without history nor ancestral treasures, you will never be able to understand the love the Edo people of Benin empire have for their history and ancestral heritage. So please just keep your mouths shut and learn from us instead of acting as if you can read our minds.

man you already made your point , you shouldn't have included " Nigeria without history " no where in Nigeria doesn't have peculiar and distinctive culture. Because the white man happened to cherish the bounty from a powerful kingdom is why it's a topic today. If you say so then you agree with the writer that said Africa is a dark continent.

Realist12:
man you already made your point , you shouldn't have included " Nigeria without history " no where in Nigeria doesn't have peculiar and distinctive culture. Because the white man happened to cherish the bounty from a powerful kingdom is why it's a topic today. If you say so then you agree with the writer that said Africa is a dark continent.

History: the study of eyewitness writing documents detailing passed events. The ethnicity of the eyewitness is irrelevant.
Everybody has a past, but not everybody has history.
Anyways, peace and love to all, those who want to celebrate with us are welcome, those who want to lecture us can shove it.

Ghostwon6511:

Read all my comments before assuming I didn't answer your silly questions. Unless you expected every comment of mine to be the answer to that one silly question.

Also, don't confuse the bight of Benin with the slave coast. And stop overgeneralizing, not every African kingdom was heavily involved with the slave trade and some African kingdoms only sold their condemned criminals as slaves.
People like you are just repeating word for word what the British said as justification to keep looted Benin treasures, you can't event make your own argument. Also what is your business in Benin affairs ? Mind your business, this is my ancestral heritage, I did not sell you as a slave, so what do you want from me ?

Now that the artworks are back, what are your plans for them. You suppose to have a blueprint for them, right? How can these artworks develop Edo state, what job opportunities can these artworks provide, how can these artefacts make people interested in art and accept it as a way of life? How can it attract tourists into Edo and Nigeria as a whole and serve as revenue generation for the federal republic? You see, pokenosing into Edo affairs can really bring a lot of changes and developments, but I realized talking about the history of Edo and it's people is seen as meddling into your affairs by you. Remember as humans, we might need each sometimes irrespective of race, religion, ethnicity to solve global problems like for example Climate change. Don't think doing things alone or trying to hide details from people can bring developments. This might not be offpoint, but I know I'm passing a message

Garbage..... hungry people don't value art.

MindHacker9000:
Someone said it was the powers in the Bronze that developed Europe, so now we just need to relax and let it develop our land too. Welcome home Bronze and remember to develop our land and people too like you developed Europe.

Fake bronze.

BSsniffer:
Garbage..... hungry people don't value art.

Stop been a bitter/insufferable loser and allow the Benin people to celebrate their artefacts, a primitive yeribanza pig whose people revel in the ritualistic murders of human beings and mine skulls and body parts as a fetish should be the last subhumans to talk about been "hungry".

Kwashiman:

Stop been a bitter/insufferable loser and allow the Benin people to celebrate their artefacts, a primitive yeribanza pig whose people revel in the ritualistic murders of human beings and mine skulls and body parts as a fetish should be the last subhumans to talk about been "hungry".

Stop crying like a wvtched wh0re.....am not the cause of your life's peoblems

BSsniffer:


Stop crying like a wvtched wh0re.....am not the cause of your life's peoblems

Tell that to your useless mother who was screaming my name as I strafed her fat arse in one of my rendezvous spots.

And it's "I'm not the cause of" not "am" you daft Yeribanza illiterate pig