Beync:

You can go read again. They wanted to make him the King but he refused and told them 'My kingdom is not of this world' If it were, Jesus would hav accepted. U can imagine crowning you the presidency withou you spending a dim to campaign.
It's not by force to rule, like you said, take it like it's a personal thing. we hav taken it like it's our personal thing, no big deal. cheers!

do you vote? If no what happens to those who do?

The Title Son of God was lifted from Daniel Chapter 9 - Jesus was saying that he was the one spoken of in Daniel - The Jews of his day understood the reference as they were familiar with that title and the FACT that "the Son of Man" was a reference to the Messiah. 

Also Jesus and the Holy Spirit is not a manifestation but a PERSON within the TRIUNE God.  This is plainly obvious in that thru time and space they have existed as distinct persons as shown in Genesis 2 - Let US create man in our image - since God and no other thing was doing the creation of any one thing or things and the FACT that it then says  in Gen 1: 27 So God created mankind in his own image,  in the image of God he created them;   male and female he created them.
So the book drops from PLURAL to singular - no problem here since ELOHIM as used here as the name of God is a SINGULAR PLURAL word. God was already dropping hints way back when.

So even though God gave enough clues as to one of the great mysteries of his Eternal personhood the Christ reveals this in John 1 which should really be a verbose statement of the first verse of Genesis 1

My two pense or kobo - help it helps someone get closer to the truth

I used to think - Wine - in the bible means both alcoholic and non-alcoholic, not until I read this chapter; Proverb 31:6 (Give strong drink unto him that is ready to perish and wine unto those that be of heavy heart) , now I know the difference.
As per the issue of removing and adding from the bible, my witness friends tell me the bible was in hebrew translate before 'someone' english-translated it and they told me the --- Thou, Lo, Lest, Cometh and all the what's not --- are old-english. Who knows what that 'someone' has actually removed or added from the bible. God Help Us.

TO PELEZICO AND 1STCITIZEN,
Ihave this for you and I want you to use your mouth to confess the truth that CT RUSELL was never a MASSONIST, and that he was not the founder of Jehovah;s witnesses. You all can see how Satan works, he want millions right hearted pple to get confussed
As for the pyramid and Masons, keep reading: This is what the anti-Watchtower fault-finders do not want you to see. The internet is full of false stories about Pastor Russell, this is just one of them. But you already know that, now don't you? Charles Taze Russell died in 1916, the Pyramid marker was installed in 1921 (5 years after his death), and the The Masonic Temple was built in the mid 1990s, these items have nothing to do with Pastor Russell's grave. The Masonic Temple is not even on the cemetery grounds, it is a different property altogether. In fact, the Rosemont United Cemetery was never a Masonic cemetery. Many do not want you to see the first photo from 1916, showing that Pastor Russell was dead long before the Masonic Temple was built. And others do not want you to see the second photo, because some people teach that Russell is buried "under the Pyramid", or "in the Pyramid", or that the Pyramid is "his grave marker." Now, how can that be, see Russell's headstone, see the Pyramid marker, they are in two different locations, with other graves in between them. The pyramid marker was used as a marker for all (275) of the Watchtower Society burial plots in the Cemetery, nothing more. People visiting the Cemetery could look for the pyramid marker to locate the (275) burial plots. Jehovah’s Witnesses do not revere burial places, but some desire to visit the Watch Tower Society’s burial plot where C. T. Russell was buried. Turn right off Perrysville Avenue on to Cemetery Lane. The United Cemetery is the last cemetery on this road. A few yards beyond the replica of a pyramid is a driveway that takes one near the Society’s plot.

TO PELEZICO AND 1STCITIZEN,
Ihave this for you and I want you to use your mouth to confess the truth that CT RUSSELL was never a MASSONIST, and that he was not the founder of Jehovah;s witnesses. You all can see how Satan works, he want millions right hearted pple to get distracted from the truth, trying to find fault in the life of CT Russell. I will give you more about the lies that has been cooked by Catholics just to eliminate JW'S and CT Russell.
Read:
As for the pyramid and Masons, keep reading: This is what the anti-Watchtower fault-finders do not want you to see. The internet is full of false stories about Pastor Russell, this is just one of them. But you already know that, now don't you? Charles Taze Russell died in 1916, the Pyramid marker was installed in 1921 (5 years after his death), and the The Masonic Temple was built in the mid 1990s, these items have nothing to do with Pastor Russell's grave. The Masonic Temple is not even on the cemetery grounds, it is a different property altogether. In fact, the Rosemont United Cemetery was never a Masonic cemetery. Many do not want you to see the first photo from 1916, showing that Pastor Russell was dead long before the Masonic Temple was built. And others do not want you to see the second photo, because some people teach that Russell is buried "under the Pyramid", or "in the Pyramid", or that the Pyramid is "his grave marker." Now, how can that be, see Russell's headstone, see the Pyramid marker, they are in two different locations, with other graves in between them. The pyramid marker was used as a marker for all (275) of the Watchtower Society burial plots in the Cemetery, nothing more. People visiting the Cemetery could look for the pyramid marker to locate the (275) burial plots. Jehovah’s Witnesses do not revere burial places, but some desire to visit the Watch Tower Society’s burial plot where C. T. Russell was buried. Turn right off Perrysville Avenue on to Cemetery Lane. The United Cemetery is the last cemetery on this road. A few yards beyond the replica of a pyramid is a driveway that takes one near the Society’s plot.

This next comment about Charles Taze Russell not belonging to the Masons is from ex-JW Barbara Anderson. Because some people simply believe what others have told them about Russell and the Masons, without doing any research for themselves, I have included (4) links to Mrs. Anderson’s post. These links will take you directly to the original source that she has referenced in her comments.

I just posted the following information on Bleep under the subject, Beliefs, Doctrines & Practices, in the hope that as many people as possible will see the facts, although, as other posters have observed, if some people want to believe Russell was a Freemason, nothing will change their mind. Apparently, some of us don't want to be confused by the facts! RUSSELL WAS NOT A PENNSYLVANIA FREEMASON! Back in 2001, I requested historical information from the ANCIENT ACCEPTED SCOTTISH RITE OF FREEMASONRY, VALLEY OF PITTSBURGH, PENNSYLVANIA, asking if Charles Russell, his father, Joseph Lytel Russell, and his uncle, Charles Tays Russell, were Freemasons. This is the answer I received in a letter: "AFTER A SEARCH OF OUR RECORDS, WE DETERMINED THAT THE THREE RUSSELL'S WERE NOT MEMBERS OF OUR ORGANIZATION." http://www.valleyofpittsburgh.org/ In their letter, the Pittsburgh Chapter recommended that I send an inquiry asking for further research on this question to the Grand Lodge of Pennsylvania located in Philadelphia, which I did. On April 27, 2001, I received this reply: "THE RECORD BOOKS IN THE GRAND SECRETARY'S OFFICE ARE UNAVAILABLE AT THIS TIME AS THEY ARE BEING CONSERVED AND SHOULD BE BACK SOME TIME IN THE FALL." Inasmuch as I was very involved with other, more pressing, things then, I did not follow-up and eventually my desire for resolution of this question faded out of my mind. That is, until today, when I saw that this subject has not been resolved to the satisfaction of some posters, so I sent a follow-up email to the Masonic Temple, Grand Lodge of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia. Just a few minutes ago, I received this reply: DEAR MS. ANDERSON,CHARLES TAZE RUSSELL WAS NOT A PENNSYLVANIA FREEMASON. NOR DOES HE APPEAR IN THE RECORDS OF ENGLAND OR IRELAND. http://www.pagrandlodge.org/ Also See: http://www.ugle.org.uk/ And: http://www.irish-freemasons.org/ I SHALL CHECK THE RECORDS FOR THE OTHER TWO RUSSELLS. BEST, GLENYS A. WALDMAN LIBRARIAN If and when I receive the answer from the Grand Lodge of Pennsylvania about the other two Russells, I will post it. In any event, I would hope that this answer from a search of the original records will forever put this issue to rest that Charles Taze Russell was never a Pennslyvania Freemason. Barbara Anderson - (she posted these comments on an ex-JW board on 9/23/2005, the links are from me) http://www.scribd.com/doc/8770138/No-Charles-Taze-Russell-Was-Not-a-Pennsylvania-Freemason

@Anu Yakubu and Ibukun Obi

@1stCitizen: Well well well, the research that confirmed that white blood cells pass from mother to baby in the mother's milk, is from Man, right?
fine, the law that says you should refrain from blood is from Man, right? No, it's from God.(Acts 15:28,29).
No matter how wise men could be, his wisdom cannot surpass that of God. Let us place God's reasoning and thoughts above ours. Do not lean upon your own understanding, neither that of a man like you, but trust in God(prov 3;5).

Thanks for the response above. Just what I expected.

In recent times transfusions are not just of whole blood but of one of its primary components: (1) red cells; (2) white cells; (3) platelets; (4) plasma (serum), the fluid part. Jehovah's Witnesses maintain that accepting whole blood or any of those four MAJOR  components violates God's law."—The Watchtower, June 15, 2000, p. 29

So NOW you are inferring that the prohibition from accepting its constituents above which are based on MAN's research ARE NOT FROM GOD so why did your leaders ban such medical intervention?

Bible nowhere makes mention of blood constituents such as platelets and white cells . So what is the basis for Watchtower’s position in respect to these products from blood?

To further buttress my point, I have gone into your literature and discovered many inconsistencies in the position of watchtower with regards to these prohibitions. see below

Blood Serum
1954 - Unacceptable Awake! 1954 January 8 p.24
1958 - Acceptable Watchtower 1958 September 15 p.575
1963 - Unacceptable Watchtower 1963 February 15 p.124
1965 - Acceptable Watchtower 1964 November 15 pp.680-3
1974 - Conscience matter Watchtower 1974 June 1 p.352

Hemodilution
1972 - Unacceptable Awake! 1972 April 8 p.30
1982 - Objectionable Awake! 1982 June 22 p.25
1983 - Acceptable Awake! 1983 March 22 p.16

Vaccinations
Prior to 1921 - Acceptable
1921- Unacceptable Golden Age 1921 October 12 p.17
1952 - Acceptable Watchtower 1952 December 15 p.764

Organ transplants
Prior to 1967 - Acceptable Awake! 1949 December 22
1967 - Unacceptable Watchtower 1967 November 15 pp.702-704
1980 - Acceptable Watchtower 1980 March 15 p.31)

Blood transfusions
Prior to 1945 - Acceptable Golden Age 1925 July 29 p.683, Golden Age 1929 May 1 p.502, Consolation 1940 December 25 p.19
1945 - Unacceptable in every form, including hemoglobin, own stored blood and every form of fractionation Watchtower 1961 September 15 p.559 stated that "Whether whole or fractional, one's own or someone else's, transfused or injected, it is wrong."
1982 - Minor components acceptable Awake! 1982 June 22 p.25
1989 - Autologous, Acute Normovolemic Hemodilution (ANH - use of ones own blood). Storage of own blood unacceptable, acceptable if circulation not interupted - Watchtower89 March 1 p.30
2000 - Major change to blood policy, with all of blood acceptable when converted to[b] minor fractions[/b] - Watchtower 2000 June 15 pp.29-31
2004 - Hemoglobin specifically listed as acceptable - Watchtower 2004 June 15

How can you decide what is a major or minor constituent of blood when there is no Scriptural guideline on blood to indicate it is made up of components. The Watchtower division between major and minor fractions is arbitrary, unfortunate and dangerous.

Now let me ask you, do the consciences of your leadership not prick them due to the lives that were lost within the period of each change in policy stated above?

Ibukun Obi and others, from the above we now know more truth. Please I beg you all. WAKE UP!

Pastor Russell had this to say about the Freemasons: http://www.ctrussell.us/ "We note also that the Order of Free Masons, if judged by its past history, has some secret object or scheme, more than fraternity and financial aid in time of sickness or death. And, so far as we can judge, there is a certain amount of worship or mummery connected with the rites of this order and some others, which the members do not comprehend, but which, in many cases, serves to satisfy the cravings of the natural mind for worship, and thus hinders it from seeking the worship of God in spirit and in truth—through Christ, the only appointed Mediator and Grand Master. In proportion as such societies consume valuable time in foolish, senseless rites and ceremonies, and in substituting the worship of their officers, and the use of words and symbols which have no meaning to them, for the worship of God, in his appointed way—through Christ, and according to knowledge and the spirit of a sound mind—in that proportion these societies are grievous evils, regardless of the financial gains or losses connected with membership in them." — June, 1895, Zion's Watch Tower, page 143 ________________________________________________________________________________________

"There are certain conditions,—the low gate, the narrow way, the difficult path. Although I have never been a Mason, I have heard that in Masonry they have something which very closely illustrates this" , "Many Masons shake hands with me and give me what I know is their grip; they don't know me from a Mason. Something I do seems to be the same as Masons do, I don't know what it is; but they often give me all kinds of grips and I give them back, then I tell them I don't know anything about it except just a few grips that have come to me naturally." — June, 1913; Convention discourse. - "The Temple of God" - "Convention Report Sermons" pg. 362 ________________________________________________________________________________________

He emphasizes this, saying, "A new commandment I give unto you, that ye love one another as I have loved you." (#Joh 13:34.) Ah, we get the thought that the Church is a blessed brotherhood of all those who not only love God supremely, so that they delight to do His will, even at the cost of self-interest, but who also love one another as Christ loved them, which signifies to the extent of willingness to lay down their lives for one another! We look in vain for such an organization amongst men. We perceive various bundles or organizations under various names, all professing love, but none of them even dreaming of union with such bonds of love. We are not forgetting the Masons, the Odd Fellows, the Presbyterians, the Methodists, the Episcopalians, the Lutherans, the Roman Catholics, etc. But none of these claim to be such a brotherhood as our Lord has described. They do indeed claim to give special attention to each other’s interests, and to have certain reverence for God, but not to the extent that our Master intimated—not to the extent of laying down their lives in doing the will of the Father and in their love for the brethren. - Sermon Book / SM697 - The Brotherhood of Christ

Continuation of Russell speech about Masson in 1904. This bears witness against the liars who says he was a member.

"This brings before us the whole question of orders, societies, etc., and what privileges the New Creation has in connection with such organizations. Is it right for them to be members of these societies? We answer that while Church associations are purely religious, and labor and beneficial organizations in general are purely secular, there are still other orders which combine the religious and the secular features. As we understand the matter, for instance, the Free Masons, Odd Fellows, Knights of Pythias, etc., perform certain rites and ceremonies of a religious kind, We place upon one level all of those who have any religious ceremonies, teachings, etc., and consider them all as parts of Babylon , We admonish the New Creation to have nothing whatever to do with any of these semi-religious societies, clubs, orders, churches; but to "Come out from amongst them, and be ye separate, and touch not the unclean thing." (`2 Cor. 6:17`)" —1904; "The New Creation", pp. 580-581 ________________________________________________________________________________________

I am not judging at all, I am merely saying, so far as I can tell. But my understanding is, that all of these are bundles, and each bundle is getting tighter. Some of you know a great deal more about Freemasonry than I do, and I am not here to say anything against it, because I do not know anything to say, and I do not know as I would say it if I did know it. The Lord did not send me to preach against Masonry or Odd Fellowship, nor against Presbyterianism or Methodism. Our opportunity is to tell the truth, to preach the true gospel of Christ, and the Lord says that this message is to have its effects on the different hearts. Now, if you find yourself in any kind of a bundle, you know that is not the program so far as the wheat is concerned. The wheat is to he gathered into the garner; it is not to be put into bundles in the present life. The wheat is to be free. If you find yourself in any kind of a bundle, better get out of the bundle. Trust in the Lord, and be in harmony with Him, and this will take you out of all kinds of bundles and human organizations, I believe. I should, perhaps, say a cautionary word here to the effect that I would understand this would mean, for instance, that if I were a carpenter I would prefer to be at liberty, but if it were demanded of me that I should join a union before I could have work, and that I must pay so much of my money into that union's coffers, I should join. I should understand that I was making so much of a contribution to the general weal of the carpenters, and I would have no hesitation in the matter, because there is nothing of a religious kind there. There is nothing that would fetter my heart or mind. But if that organization should do anything I could not approve, I would feel perfectly free to withdraw at any time. So I would make that limitation. But, so far as wheat and tares are concerned, I think there are plenty of bundles all around you, and I notice, too, that these different worldly organizations, if we may so call them in contradistinction to church organizations, are also taking the same methods the church people are taking. It used to be very easy to withdraw from one of the churches and you could say, "I will thank you for a letter," and then they would take the letter and never deposit it, but burn it up, if they desired. And so with the Masons; they had a method by which anyone desiring to leave the order could ask for a demit and he would get that without any particular question. I have been informed that now this is changed somewhat. If you are a Presbyterian, and you wish a letter, they say, "To which church do you wish the letter addressed?" You say, "Oh, just make it out anyway." "Oh we do not do that now; we will give you a letter to a certain, particular church and it is to he deposited there--good when deposited there." And so I am informed that our Freemason friends are doing the same thing; they do not give demits now. If you wish to be transferred to another lodge they will transfer you, but they do not give demits now in the same way they formerly did. A Brother: Brother Russell, I am a Mason and, unfortunately, hold a high position in the order, and I would like to make a little correction on that. A Mason is perfectly free to leave when he feels so disposed. No restraint whatever is placed upon him. Brother Russell: I told you in the beginning that I did not know about it myself; I was only relating what a brother told me. Another Brother: I was a Mason in a different jurisdiction from that of the brother. It may he all right in his particular jurisdiction, but it is not the same in other jurisdictions, as I know. Brother Russell: You will notice that we never have anything to say against any of these. We have not said an unkind word about Freemasonry, and you never read anything unkind that we have ever said about it, and I do not wish to say anything unkind about Presbyterianism, or Methodism. I think that many of the dear friends in these denominations are good people, and I appreciate their characters. What I talk about sometimes is Presbyterian doctrine, and they talk about it, too. And I have read things they have said about Presbyterian doctrines far harder than anything I have ever said. I sometimes quote in the Watch Tower some things Presbyterians say about their own doctrine, and I occasionally quote in the Watch Tower something the Methodists say about their doctrine, because they say it stronger than I should wish to say it.- 1908, Convention Question Meeting - "The Question Book", pp. 318 - 319

Pastor Russell's true headstone as seen in 2010: Charles Taze Russell said that he was not a Mason. Jehovah's Witnesses, Bible Students, the Masons, and even ex-JW researchers have all said that Russell was not a Mason. So why do some anti-Watchtower antagonists still teach this falsehood? The answer is simple, because this is what they must do. They need to fabricate stories about others to try and justify their own self worth. After all, how hard can it be to attack a dead man, how sad. With over 200 posts on this site covering a number of subjects, this story about Charles Taze Russell and the Masons is always the most read post on this blog, I wonder why? Could it be that some people just love a good story? Even if it is based on a total fallacy!

It troubles me when folks have to copy paste so much goggle stuff - its a sign of weakness (sometimes)

@ibukun obi you should be more concise since anyone can spout many words as if they by itself can prove a point

As far as im concerned he called them "brothers " - how can light and darkness dwell together - read the book of Jude - scathing and damnable rebuke to FALSE teachers - read what Jesus said about FALSE worshippers of God - he said they were children of the devil - he didnt say "hey Brother Sadduceas, Scribes, Wah Gwan"

Im also concerned that you refer to Watchtower and not the bible so with same zeal as Muslims refer to Mohammed - but im not surprised. If you were to read the bible itself and not the watchtower you would know the truth. The Hold Spirit will open your eyes and thats FACT.

Try and be more concise next time -

Mr Russel was a Mason full stop - He says that his doctrine and theres have a common boundary - Ummmm Christians do not worship Satan. Mason is as dangerous as it comes to false religion - do your research on them

Receive Christ - repent and experience being Born Again - once you are you will then know the truth and it will set you free

Love

To pelezico,
It gladens my heart that Your Falacies will only benefits you.
You earliar come to this site copying and pasted a falacious website to assasinate the character a neutral religous group JEHOVAH's Witnesses
Now I have bombarded you with every facts to show your parochial and Myopic understanding of the people you claimed you know very well,
are you not ashamed of yourself now?
Can you just humble yourself and learn why these pple dont carry Guns or any amunition to destroy others
First you need to first Know what a Masson is before you condemn them. READ this comment again and tell someone to interprete it for you:He emphasizes this, saying, "A new commandment I give unto you, that ye love one another as I have loved you." (#Joh 13:34.) Ah, we get the thought that the Church is a blessed brotherhood of all those who not only love God supremely, so that they delight to do His will, even at the cost of self-interest, but who also love one another as Christ loved them, which signifies to the extent of willingness to lay down their lives for one another! We look in vain for such an organization amongst men. We perceive various bundles or organizations under various names, all professing love, but none of them even dreaming of union with such bonds of love. We are not forgetting the Masons, the Odd Fellows, the Presbyterians, the Methodists, the Episcopalians, the Lutherans, the Roman Catholics, etc. But none of these claim to be such a brotherhood as our Lord has described. They do indeed claim to give special attention to each other’s interests, and to have certain reverence for God, but not to the extent that our Master intimated—not to the extent of laying down their lives in doing the will of the Father and in their love for the brethren. - Sermon Book

You have been defeated inside your mind, all I will advise you is "dont die in your foolishness" It is not a sin to be a foolish person but when you add stuborness to your foolishness, it may lead you to destruction.
SO STOP ASSASINATING JW else you will see the wrath of GOD.

To pelezico,
It gladens my heart that Your Falacies will only benefits you AND JUST ONLY YOU.
You earlier come to this site copying and pasted a falacious website to assasinate the character of a neutral religous group JEHOVAH's Witnesses
Now I have bombarded you with every facts to show your parochial and Myopic understanding of the people you claimed you know very well,
are you not ashamed of yourself now?
Can you just humble yourself and learn why these pple dont kill,steals, embezzle money or use amunition to destroy others like your pple does, why can't u learn to be separate from the world while still in the world?
First you need to first Know what a Masson is before you condemn them. READ this comment again and tell someone to interprete it for you:He emphasizes this, saying, "A new commandment I give unto you, that ye love one another as I have loved you." (#Joh 13:34.) Ah, we get the thought that the Church is a blessed brotherhood of all those who not only love God supremely, so that they delight to do His will, even at the cost of self-interest, but who also love one another as Christ loved them, which signifies to the extent of willingness to lay down their lives for one another! We look in vain for such an organization amongst men. We perceive various bundles or organizations under various names, all professing love, but none of them even dreaming of union with such bonds of love. We are not forgetting the Masons, the Odd Fellows, the Presbyterians, the Methodists, the Episcopalians, the Lutherans, the Roman Catholics, etc. But none of these claim to be such a brotherhood as our Lord has described. They do indeed claim to give special attention to each other’s interests, and to have certain reverence for God, but not to the extent that our Master intimated—not to the extent of laying down their lives in doing the will of the Father and in their love for the brethren. - Sermon Book

You have been defeated inside your mind, all I will advise you is "dont die in your foolishness" It is not a sin to be a foolish person but when you add stuborness to your foolishness, it may lead you to destruction.
SO STOP ASSASINATING JW else you will see the wrath of GOD.

@pelezico, devil has succeeded in blinding u, u r d one who need to wake up and embrase truth, stop spreading propaganda! It dint start today, i no d JW u r talking abt ok!

So you include Masons as Bible believing Christians of you at lest include them as people who profess faith (is the world this dump down that it has overtaken Nigerians too)- Oh my oh my indeed

You preach love but you talk of "watching out for Gods wrath ". Why not turn the other cheek. But im not surprised.

John 13:34 finds its home only in the regenerate heart - in those who have repented and received Christ as Savior. The unregenerate cannot love as commanded by Christ. We who are saved are not perfect neither will we ever be until we are transformed into the likeness of Christ at his return. Though we are commanded to strive for perfection (Be you perfect for I am perfect) it is the Spirit in us that compels us to that perfection). We who are saved are a work in progress

If you are not saved you do not belong to Christ no matter how richly you claim you love man. As i said before JW is a work based religion (must do this must do that must do this must do that and if im not doing i cant be a real JW).

Why not surrender those tiresome works (Matthew 11:28) and receive Christ by faith for by faith you are saved and not of WORKS lest any man BOAST.

A man who loves God will love man. A man who does not love man does not love God is unregenerate as the book of 1st John says quite well.

Try putting Watchtower false teaching down for a month and get yourself a proper Bible and read it - you will then know that what i have said is a reality. Ask God to reveal it to you He always does and will not fail you

God speed -

PS you are right i am very foolish very foolish but would rather be the worlds fool than Gods fool

1stCitizen:

@Anu Yakubu and Ibukun Obi

Thanks for the response above. Just what I expected.

In recent times transfusions are not just of whole blood but of one of its primary components: (1) red cells; (2) white cells; (3) platelets; (4) plasma (serum), the fluid part. Jehovah's Witnesses maintain that accepting whole blood or any of those four MAJOR  components violates God's law."—The Watchtower, June 15, 2000, p. 29

So NOW you are inferring that the prohibition from accepting its constituents above which are based on MAN's research ARE NOT FROM GOD so why did your leaders ban such medical intervention?

Bible nowhere makes mention of blood constituents such as platelets and white cells . So what is the basis for Watchtower’s position in respect to these products from blood?

To further buttress my point, I have gone into your literature and discovered many inconsistencies in the position of watchtower with regards to these prohibitions. see below

Blood Serum
1954 - Unacceptable Awake! 1954 January 8 p.24
1958 - Acceptable Watchtower 1958 September 15 p.575
1963 - Unacceptable Watchtower 1963 February 15 p.124
1965 - Acceptable Watchtower 1964 November 15 pp.680-3
1974 - Conscience matter Watchtower 1974 June 1 p.352

Hemodilution
1972 - Unacceptable Awake! 1972 April 8 p.30
1982 - Objectionable Awake! 1982 June 22 p.25
1983 - Acceptable Awake! 1983 March 22 p.16

Vaccinations
Prior to 1921 - Acceptable
1921- Unacceptable Golden Age 1921 October 12 p.17
1952 - Acceptable Watchtower 1952 December 15 p.764

Organ transplants
Prior to 1967 - Acceptable Awake! 1949 December 22
1967 - Unacceptable Watchtower 1967 November 15 pp.702-704
1980 - Acceptable Watchtower 1980 March 15 p.31)

Blood transfusions
Prior to 1945 - Acceptable Golden Age 1925 July 29 p.683, Golden Age 1929 May 1 p.502, Consolation 1940 December 25 p.19
1945 - Unacceptable in every form, including hemoglobin, own stored blood and every form of fractionation Watchtower 1961 September 15 p.559 stated that "Whether whole or fractional, one's own or someone else's, transfused or injected, it is wrong."
1982 - Minor components acceptable Awake! 1982 June 22 p.25
1989 - Autologous, Acute Normovolemic Hemodilution (ANH - use of ones own blood). Storage of own blood unacceptable, acceptable if circulation not interupted - Watchtower89 March 1 p.30
2000 - Major change to blood policy, with all of blood acceptable when converted to[b] minor fractions[/b] - Watchtower 2000 June 15 pp.29-31
2004 - Hemoglobin specifically listed as acceptable - Watchtower 2004 June 15

How can you decide what is a major or minor constituent of blood when there is no Scriptural guideline on blood to indicate it is made up of components. The Watchtower division between major and minor fractions is arbitrary, unfortunate and dangerous.

Now let me ask you, do the consciences of your leadership not prick them due to the lives that were lost within the period of each change in policy stated above?

Ibukun Obi and others, from the above we now know more truth. Please I beg you all. WAKE UP!

@1st Citizen: As you can see, i am not a man of too many words, and argument is not my best option. In view of your take on the blood issue, kindly explain to me what you expect me to understand by God saying i should abstain from not only strangled animals, but blood too.

Please read along in your bible as you receve these few points:

Noah was told that blood was sacred, was the life(Gen 9:4, 16), and in the days of israelites, the law covenant prohibited intake of blood(Lev 17:14, & Lev 7:26,27).
Nevertheless, prohibition on blood is repeated to christians (Acts 15:28,29), (Acts 21:25). Hence, transfussion violates sacredness of blood.

These bible principles found in (1Sam 15:22), (Mark 12:33) and (Mark 8:35,36), helps to understand that question of saving life does not justify breaking God's law.
In simple terms, obedience is better than sacrifice, and putting one's life ahead of God's law is fatal.

For JWs, death is not a problem when it comes to obeying Jehovah's intructions, just the same way it wasn't for Jesus. Jesus chose to die just to make make God happy and fulfill his purposes and prove the devil a liar. In like manner, JWs consider death nothing, when it comes to making the heart of thier creator glad, and proving the devil a liar. At the end, what happens, Jehovah would ressurect(John 5:28,29) and bless his obedidient servants with everlasting life just the way he did to Jesus.
John 12:25 says and i quote, "he that is fond of his soul destroys it, but he that hates his soul in this world will safeguard it for everlasting life".


The best of physicians in the world are coming into agreement with JWs take on the issue of blood, moreover, alternatives to blood is gaining acceptance everywhere. You know what, if only we could be attentive to our creator, numerous people who had contacted HIV through blood transfusion would not have hurt themeselves real bad. Really, God does not force people to listen to him, free will he has given to us all, if you chose to ignore his instruction on the issue of blood, live your life, no JW is going to criticize you on that, and if a JW chose to hear and adhere the VOICE of his/creator, just let him or her be, it is not as if he or she is forcing you against your will. I wish all your researches on consistency and non-consistency are done out of positive motive. The truth is that, if God has not mentioned or instructed on the issue of blood, JWs would have totally agreed with you. And lest i didnt add, if you could show me reasonably, not from your scientific knowledge, but from the Bible(cuz God is the highest source of wisdom),  why i shoul take blood, then, i would humbly submit to your view.

And take note, JW is not about some leaders, it's about our love for and obedience to our loving creator - JEHOVAH.

pelezico:


As i said before JW is a work based religion (must do this must do that must do this must do that and if im not doing i cant be a real JW).

Why not surrender those tiresome works (Matthew 11:28) and receive Christ by faith for by faith you are saved and not of WORKS lest any man BOAST.

@pelezico:
Please read along in your Bible. Faith without work is death, (James 2:26), woe is me, if i did not declare the good news(1Cor 9:16). The good news of the kingdom will be preached in all the inhabited earth, for a witness to all the nation, and then the end will come(Matt 24:14).

First century xtians faced similar opposition, to stop preaching the good news, but they never get tired even though some were jailed and perscuted, same is happening down till our day. JWs dont find it tiresome to declare the good news. It is not by our strenght, but Jehovah is actually the one, energizing us.

Mathew 11:28, you quoted says "Come to me, all you who are tolling and loaded down, and i will refresh you". JWs all around the globe are trying all thier best to direct peoples'attention to that Jesus invitation.

Doing the right thing at times might look tiresome to people that dont value obedience and righteousness(am not implying you), but in the real sense of it, God's love means we obey his commandments, and yet His commandments are not burdensome(1 John 5:3).

4reigningqueen:

do you vote? If no what happens to those who do?

@4reigningqueen: JWs maintain absolute neutrality to world's poltical affair. JWs are not in position to declare what happens to those who do. They are in position to expose you you to what the Bible really teach.

Anu Yakubu:

@pelezico:
Please read along in your Bible. Faith without work is death, (James 2:26), woe is me, if i did not declare the good news(1Cor 9:16). The good news of the kingdom will be preached in all the inhabited earth, for a witness to all the nation, and then the end will come(Matt 24:14).

First century xtians faced similar opposition, to stop preaching the good news, but they never get tired even though some were jailed and perscuted, same is happening down till our day. JWs dont find it tiresome to declare the good news. It is not by our strenght, but Jehovah is actually the one, energizing us.

Mathew 11:28, you quoted says "Come to me, all you who are tolling and loaded down, and i will refresh you". JWs all around the globe are trying all thier best to direct peoples'attention to that Jesus invitation.

Doing the right thing at times might look tiresome to people that dont value obedience and righteousness(am not implying you), but in the real sense of it, God's love means we obey his commandments, and yet His commandments are not burdensome(1 John 5:3). 

@Anu Yakubu
The condition for SALVATION is FAITH and FAITH alone Ephesians 2:8 New Living Translation "God saved you by his grace when you believed. And you can’t take credit for this; it is a gift from God. 9Salvation is not a reward for the good things we have done, so none of us can boast about it. 10For we are God’s masterpiece. He has created us anew in Christ Jesus, so we can do the good things he planned for us long ago."

Since Jesus said that the word of God cannot be broken James therefore is not saving that your works will save you but it is the EVIDENCE of SAVING FAITH.  No works no faith. However SAVING FAITH or JUSTIFICATION by which God treats a repentant sinner as he would his SON yet treated his SON by pouring his WRATH on him as is meet for a sinner (substitutionary grace) saves us.

James talks of SANCTIFICATION - works after salvation as opposed to works that justify which is contrary to Biblical teaching.  This is what separates Christianity and idolatry.  We are saved by Gods merits and not ours. 

Remember when trying to understand the Bible your context is the Bible and not just verses taken out of context. The Word of God is explored as a whole and not random verses here and there

Ask God to help you understand it because many trip over this because of our twisted SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS.  That includes me by the way


I pray this helps

@Anu Yakubu

Do you realize that Christians are still being persecuted in places like China, North Korea, Nigerias North, Saudi Arabia, Philippines, Pakistan, Afganistan, Vietnam

This persecution has been continual since the church began at Pentecost. It has not really abated since. Infact it got worse under Constantines reign and the Crusades

I was puzzled why you did not mention this.

Just passing

Who are those involved in this discus, ok, Anu Yakubu, You defend the witnesses are you one ortherwise which denormination do you belong to? Pelezico and you which? Ist citizen which is your group? Pls I want to address you all and the issues raised. I have a few question for you all. Before my questions I want to know your groups.

pelezico:

@Anu Yakubu
The condition for SALVATION is FAITH and FAITH alone Ephesians 2:8 New Living Translation "God saved you by his grace when you believed. And you can’t take credit for this; it is a gift from God. 9Salvation is not a reward for the good things we have done, so none of us can boast about it. 10For we are God’s masterpiece. He has created us anew in Christ Jesus, so we can do the good things he planned for us long ago."

Since Jesus said that the word of God cannot be broken James therefore is not saving that your works will save you but it is the EVIDENCE of SAVING FAITH. No works no faith. However SAVING FAITH or JUSTIFICATION by which God treats a repentant sinner as he would his SON yet treated his SON by pouring his WRATH on him as is meet for a sinner (substitutionary grace) saves us.

James talks of SANCTIFICATION - works after salvation as opposed to works that justify which is contrary to Biblical teaching. This is what separates Christianity and idolatry. We are saved by Gods merits and not ours.

Remember when trying to understand the Bible your context is the Bible and not just verses taken out of context. The Word of God is explored as a whole and not random verses here and there

Ask God to help you understand it because many trip over this because of our twisted SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS. That includes me by the way


I pray this helps

@Pelezico: U can be rest assured that your shared knowledge helps. And i really like the fact that you are dishing out your points with bible verses to buttress them, unlike some. No matter what we believe in, God is watching us as we put these points together, and i am optimistic that he is interested in us coming to the accurate knowledge of his words.

However, in addition to your points, these few points we would certainly not want to ignore, pls follow me along, once again with your Bible and let's hear from the Horse's(God's) mouth;

Eph. 2:8, 9, RS: “By grace [“undeserved kindness,” NW] you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God—not because of works, lest any man should boast.” (The entire provision for salvation is an expression of God’s undeserved kindness. There is no way that a descendant of Adam can gain salvation on his own, no matter how noble his works are. Salvation is a gift from God given to those who put faith in the sin-atoning value of the sacrifice of his Son.)
Heb. 5:9, RS: “He [Jesus] became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him.” (Does this conflict with the statement that Christians are “saved through faith”? Not at all. Obedience simply demonstrates that their faith is genuine.)
James. 2:14, 26, RS: “What does it profit, my brethren, if a man says he has faith but has not works? Can his faith save him? For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead.” (A person does not earn salvation by his works. But anyone who has genuine faith will have works to go with it—works of obedience to the commands of God and Christ, works that demonstrate his faith and love. Without such works, his faith is dead.)

Consider Jesus' answer to the pharisees and sducees of his own days:
(Mathew 22:34-40) And one of them, versed in the Law, asked, testing him: “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” He said to him: “‘You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind.’ This is the greatest and first commandment. The second, like it, is this, ‘You must love your neighbor as yourself.’ On these two commandments the whole Law hangs, and the Prophets.”
“This is what the love of God means, that we observe his commandments; and yet his commandments are not burdensome.”—1 JOHN 5:3.

From these points, most especially, the points in James. 2:14, 26. If a non-christian asks you that ''Is anything more than faith needed in order to gain salvation?''. What would you say?

@niviso,

Most of these people did "declare their religious affiliation" in some earlier pages.
You can go ahead and make your contributions.

Cheers.

@Anu Yakubu,

I note with extreme satisfaction that you have tried to avoid the issue of your Watchtower taking a position on blood today and tomorrow changing thesame position. Hope you get scared of the prospect of the current position being changed again after all your defence

Secondly you have failed to explain whether God gave you people the capacity to decide for him that which is minor blood component and major blood component. God said refrain from blood abi? So which one be the minor and major inside? Okay na science una depend on for that one? Open your eyes!!!

Please tackle the two issues above and no digression this time.

Hi Anu Yakubu

I would tell him that for salvation - having your sins forgiven forever , being fully justified (though i woudn't say that since its a big word), being adopted as a son of God, being heir to God inheritance as his children, having the right to approach Gods throne, having the right to call oneself a son of God - its IS BY FAITH. 

Hebrew 11  1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good testimony.
3 By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.

So I would tell them by FAITH since saving grace which is appropriated by FAITH now gives us the power thru Gods spirit to address sin and our behaviour.

If like the Galations we use works as our JUSTIFICATION then we either have fallen from GRACE or we still have a VEIL over our eyes as do teh Jews and Muslims and any other person who seeks justification thru the  moral law. A veil signifies ignorance of true faith

So practically speaking if someone who calls them-self a believer yet lives no differently than they did before they they were saved:  for instance he still beats up on his wife or cusses her out, or still gets drunk, or still sleeps around, or still 419s no matter how small, or hates his mum or dad etc etc then they are in peril of Gods wrath which is hell not annihilation.

Because of revelation though we do whats right not because it saves us but because of our LOVE which is motivated by what he has done for us.

So i would tell them by FAITH - and Romans 10:9 says that if they confess (repent and put confidence in Christ) they are saved.

pelezico:

@Anu Yakubu

Do you realize that Christians are still being persecuted in places like China, North Korea, Nigerias North, Saudi  Arabia, Philippines, Pakistan, Afganistan, Vietnam

This persecution has been continual since the church began at Pentecost.  It has not really abated since.  Infact it got worse under Constantines reign and the Crusades

I was puzzled why you did not mention this.  

This is an issue of serious concern
Pls who are the christians persecuted in the places mentioned above eg Nigerias North? What is there reaction to the persecutions? Can there reaction be compared to those of the followers of Jesus Christ just after his death? Who did not counter violence with violence. It beats my imagination to see the way professed christians fight back. During the days of the apostles they fled the troubled areas.

pelezico:

Hi Anu Yakubu

I would tell him that for salvation - having your sins forgiven forever , being fully justified (though i woudn't say that since its a big word), being adopted as a son of God, being heir to God inheritance as his children, having the right to approach Gods throne, having the right to call oneself a son of God - its IS BY FAITH. 

Hebrew 11  1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good testimony.
3 By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.

So I would tell them by FAITH since saving grace which is appropriated by FAITH now gives us the power thru Gods spirit to address sin and our behaviour.

If like the Galations we use works as our JUSTIFICATION then we either have fallen from GRACE or we still have a VEIL over our eyes as do teh Jews and Muslims and any other person who seeks justification thru the  moral law. A veil signifies ignorance of true faith

So practically speaking if someone who calls them-self a believer yet lives no differently than they did before they they were saved:  for instance he still beats up on his wife or cusses her out, or still gets drunk, or still sleeps around, or still 419s no matter how small, or hates his mum or dad etc etc then they are in peril of Gods wrath which is hell not annihilation.

Because of revelation though we do whats right not because it saves us but because of our LOVE which is motivated by what he has done for us.

So i would tell them by FAITH - and Romans 10:9 says that if they confess (repent and put confidence in Christ) they are saved.

Pls what is required to remain in an approved condition before God? Is it the faith you had when you repented or is it the your effort at remainng pure? What is that effort you put? What does Mat. 24 :13 call for? Just faith? Pls lets think.
Pls who has other translations of James 2:4. I want to see them pls, pls.

niviso:

Pls what is required to remain in an approved condition before God? Is it the faith you had when you repented or is it the your effort at remainng pure? What is that effort you put? What does Mat. 24 :13 call for? Just faith? Pls lets think.
Pls who has other translations of James 2:4. I want to see them pls, pls.

Very simple - its all Gods effort and Gods alone. Its is the faith that you had when you repented. Your efforts aside from true faith which appropriates Gods is totally useless.

Remember when using scripture you interpret based upon WHOLE revelation. When you isolate verses you will invariably end up in all kinds of trouble. Its not that difficult if you are saved since as 1 John puts it you are given an unction or anointing of the Spirit to know truth.

Anything other than faith is dead. In fact the whole book of Romans is about JUSTIFICATION by faith. The LAW cannot save you faith does.

Faith means you rest from your works and striving for perfection. Your perfection was settled on the Cross - that the sole reason why Jesus dies on the Cross for our sins. Surely you understand this right?

pelezico:

Very simple - its all Gods effort and Gods alone. Its is the faith that you had when you repented. Your efforts aside from true faith which appropriates Gods is totally useless.

Remember when using scripture you interpret based upon WHOLE revelation. When you isolate verses you will invariably end up in all kinds of trouble. Its not that difficult if you are saved since as 1 John puts it you are given an unction or anointing of the Spirit to know truth.

@Pelezico: from what i could gather so far, you are the one that isolate verses and refuse to interpret based upon WHOLE revelation.
You have refused to agree with God's voice in James 2: 14,26. which says and i quote
''Of what benefit is it, my brothers, if a certain one says he has faith but he does not have works? That faith cannot save him, can it? 15 If a brother or a sister is in a naked state and lacking the food sufficient for the day, 16 yet a certain one of YOU says to them: “Go in peace, keep warm and well fed,” but YOU do not give them the necessities for [their] body, of what benefit is it? 17 Thus, too, faith, if it does not have works, is dead in itself.''[/i]

You have chosen to quote only Ephe 2;8,9 which to the very best of my understanding has not implied that just faith without work is enough for your salvation. Take a look at it again, as i quote it:

''By this undeserved kindness, indeed, YOU have been saved through faith; and this not owing to YOU, it is God’s gift. 9 No, it is not owing to works, in order that no man should have ground for boasting''[i]

One more thing i need you to do is to read the next two verses namely Ephe 2:10,11. quoted below:
''For we are a product of his work and were created in union with Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared in advance for us to walk in them.''[/i]

The idea of faith alone makes it sound as though God was dump. God is not such unorgnised such that when you profess you have faith, then you gain salvation no matter what you do. last but not the least, pick your bible and read along in Zephaniah 2:2,3, and i quote below:

2 Before [the] statute gives birth to [anything], [before the] day has passed by just like chaff, before there comes upon YOU people the burning anger of Jehovah, before there comes upon YOU the day of Jehovah’s anger, 3 seek Jehovah, all YOU meek ones of the earth, who have practiced His own judicial decision. Seek righteousness, seek meekness. Probably YOU may be concealed in the day of Jehovah’s anger.[i]

If by now, you still insist on that your same opinion, then i rest my discussion on it, cuz further discussion on it would seem to me like argument, which i would not want.

@Anu Yakubu

I've explained myself very well and rather concisely but the problem is is that you do not understand what GRACE is.  If you did then you would not have replied as you did above.

Anu Yakubu said "The idea of faith alone makes it sound as though God was dump. God is not such unorgnised such that when you profess you have faith, then you gain salvation no matter what you do. last but not the least, pick your bible and read along in Zephaniah 2:2,3, and i quote below:"

Thats a straw man argument.  Re-read what I said regarding faith.

If you dont understand faith apart from works then you will never understand the rest. Even the things that you profess to understand you will stumble on.

My question to you - are you saved by faith or by your works

Which is it ?

Your rendering of Ephesians 2:10 reads very wrong

When i read it it did not sit well with me - the original greek does nto use teh word union

Heres the proper translation based on the extant greek texts

10 For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.