Maynman:


So listen to your advice, and answer my questions

Are you taking all what science said as possible and not possible to be FACT, before we go on?

You said:

Maynman:


By the way, scientists says they don’t know.

TenQ:

You said:

Yes, i Answered your question.
So listen to your advice, and answer my questions

Are you taking all what science said as possible and not possible to be FACT, before we go on?

And do you also know an effect can occur before a cause? Is it logically and scientifically possible?

GodsOwnMan:


Show me evidence of atheists attacking christians in Nigeria. I can show you evidence of muslims attacking (and even killing) non-believers. I can show you evidence of Christians destroying the properties of traditional worshippers. Show me evidence of atheists attacking non-atheists in Nigeria.

Sir.. i think you misunderstood me. I said some theists.. that is .. believers.. are willing to attack atheists.. that is .. non-believers.. or even believers in another faith. Certain parts of northern Nigeria are a good example

thesicilian:

That's not a fair answer. It's almost as if we're fighting. Your answer suggests that every theist is unreasonable or immature in terms of reasoning faculty. I believe you should be able to make your point without trying to bring down others at the same time.

It IS unreasonable to believe in fairy tales as an adult.

Maynman:


Who said “faith is mindless believing” you are a LIAR.
Faith is base on probability and your points says it.

I can be sure that I fathered my kids with a DNA test.
So many generals has resigned in russia.
Everyone travels on a plane with faith, but they don’t KNOW!
I eat in restaurants but I don’t KNOW that it’s poisoned or not.
So many people has gone to a restaurant that the food was poisoned, they also had “faith”
People in plane crash also had “faith”

Your logic is cheap

I wonder where you got the phrase mindless believing and this took off in tangent!

I have explained what FAITH is:
A TRUST in the Integrity of a Personality or a System!

If you have any other definition, spill it out.

Unfortunately, you have not done the DNA test!

When a person completely KNOWs, he doesn't need FAITH .
Even the scripture attest that we know only in PART as NO man has ever seen God

I think I've explained it clear enough here!

TenQ:

Atheism is a belief!

A belief is a position a person takes when he has sufficient but incomplete information to truly know!

I know that 2+4 is SIX
I don't have to believe that 2+4 is six because I have a complete information of how 2+4 is six. I will be correct 100% of the time for this position!


A belief is based on a probability howbeit high but not 100%

Does an atheist truly KNOW that the Creator doesn't exist OR he has come to a position he considers as reasonable probability to take a position?

Rosrozz:
Most atheists are never bold to come out, just some online gragra but in reality they hide their heads in shame which brings me to ask why would a sane person practice what he/she isn’t proud of?

You can’t come out because of stereotyping by dead head religious people who don’t have the ability to reason here in Africa

Maynman:


No.
Theism will be the acceptance of dieties.!
And take note of “believe”. When a theist goes further to “worship” these deities what does it mean?

Okay

If
-Theism is NOT the acknowledgement of Deities!
Then
-Atheism is NOT the rejection of Deities!

Can you please redefine what these words mean?

TenQ:

So you believe in the Spectacular Miracle that everything that exist including their programmings came out of NOTHING!?

This argument doesn’t in anyway prove the Christian myths in the Bible

Maynman:


Do you believe in the big bang theory?

Of course!
I only believe in addition that God initiated what we scientists call the Big bang effect/inflation of the Universe!

TenQ:

I wonder where you got the phrase mindless believing and this took off in tangent!

I have explained what FAITH is:
A TRUST in the Integrity of a Personality or a System!

If you have any other definition, spill it out.

Unfortunately, you have not done the DNA test!

When a person completely KNOWs, he doesn't need FAITH .
Even the scripture attest that we know only in PART as NO man has ever seen God

I think I've explained it clear enough here!

I wonder why you are lying, is that what Chrestians does?
How do you know I haven’t done the dna test?
Believers always believing..

Why do we need to assume what “faith” means, when we can just look up the origin of the word.

mid-13c., faith, feith, fei, fai "faithfulness to a trust or promise; loyalty to a person; honesty, truthfulness," from Anglo-French and Old French feid, foi "faith, belief, trust, confidence; pledge" (11c.), from Latin fides "trust, faith, confidence, reliance, credence, belief," from root of fidere "to trust,"from ...

Exactly, you have faith in things you are not sure of!

Maynman:


Orunmila is the first child of olorun.
It was obatala that created humans and earth in yoruba mythology
Keep laughing in ignorance

I hear you!
LOL!

TenQ:

Of course!
I only believe in addition that God initiated what we scientists call the Big bang effect/inflation of the Universe!

So the tanakh lied?

TenQ:

I wonder where you got the phrase mindless believing and this took off in tangent!

I have explained what FAITH is:
A TRUST in the Integrity of a Personality or a System!

If you have any other definition, spill it out.

Unfortunately, you have not done the DNA test!

When a person completely KNOWs, he doesn't need FAITH .
Even the scripture attest that we know only in PART as NO man has ever seen God

I think I've explained it clear enough here!

Atheism is not a belief, it’s a disbelief.

I don’t believe your god claims, that’s simply atheism.

The person who makes claims provides evidence and there is no evidence for god so I don’t believe it

Maynman:


Yes.

Help yourself and free yourself from indoctrination.
“Miracle” is simply a word, it existed before your religion was created.

Learn.
A miracle is generally defined, according to the etymology of the word—it comes from the Greek thaumasion and the Latin miraculum—as that which causes wonder and astonishment, being extraordinary in itself and amazing or inexplicable by normal standards.

The root word for magic (Greek: mageia; Latin: magia) derives from the Greek term magoi, which refers to a Median tribe in Persia and their religion, Zoroastrianism.


magus, plural Magi, member of an ancient Persian clan specializing in cultic activities. The name is the Latinized form of magoi (e.g., in Herodotus 1:101), the ancient Greek transliteration of the Iranian original. From it the word magic is derived.

Your religion thrives on ignorance

That's why I asked you a simple question:

Does magician perform miracles?

Maynman:


Exactly, he doesn’t KNOW if he’ll be alive by next week, so he uses FAITH

He plans even for the next 20 years based on FAITH!

Maynman:


You lack knowledge of what you are spewing.
There’s nothing like “Yahweh of Christians and jews”
Jews religion is called Judaism, and Judaism comes from yahwism.
Christianity and Islam both worship Abrahamaic gods.
Who is the father of Judaism?
When your “jesus” was alive as a jew he worshipped the judaist god!

There are thousands of deities that does that, have you read greek mythology, or where do you think “hades” come from?

Your religion thrives on ignorance

I laugh at you!

TenQ:

I hear you!
LOL!

I know it doesn’t go with your religion agenda
Hope you also know that esu is not same with devil/satan.
And in yoruba religion, esu is a very important deity to olorun.

TenQ:

He plans even for the next 20 years based on FAITH!

Exactly, faith. He doesn’t KNOW.

TenQ:

Of course!
I only believe in addition that God initiated what we scientists call the Big bang effect/inflation of the Universe!

Maybe, but it’s mere beliefs without evidence

TenQ:

That's why I asked you a simple question:

Does magician perform miracles?

I said YES, like 2/3 times now.
Can’t you comprehend this simple answer.
Why bring your religion into it bwahahahah
It’s a mere word!

A miracle is generally defined, according to the etymology of the word—it comes from the Greek thaumasion and the Latin miraculum—as that which causes wonder and astonishment, being extraordinary in itself and amazing or inexplicable by normal standards.

Your argument holds no weight, it only makes sense when we're assuming religion isn't forced upon us all and we're all just neutral.. I don't see no hindu converting to Christianity.. So definitely if you're born hindu, you're not even part of our discussion.
Mathematically, 55% of the population are already damned.. And your logic only applies to the 15% that are athiest.
That alot of people going to hell for being born into the wrong family, and don't tell me about conversions. We both know that the rates are just not showing up on the chart.
You seem smart, and believe me when i say this i don't want you to become an athiest. I just ask that you religions folks don't demonize us, it only fuels our irritation and confirm our stance.. It's not like I'm disbelieving in a law like that of motion and thermodynamics, religion is not factual and if i go to hell for not believing in something no one can prove, then so be it.. You and I don't believe in dragons and unicorns , now imagine being looked at like the anti-chtist for this? E no pure nah

TenQ:

LOL!

At least, I have burst the so-called monstrous problem: from several thousand to two or maximum three!

You should give me credit for that. LOL!

At least your problem is NOW manageable!
LOL!!

TenQ:

I laugh at you!

Laugh at your ignorance, yahweh worshipper.
It just shows you’ve never done research about this before you ended up with “yahweh of Christians and jews” bwahahahah

Your religion thrives on ignorance

TenQ:
Unfortunately for you sir,The Sky is NOT blue Sir. Your evidence just failed you.Sunlight reaches Earth's atmosphere and is scattered in all directions by all the gases and particles in the air. Blue light is scattered more than the other colors because it travels as shorter, smaller waves. This is why we see a blue sky most of the time.You planning for the future is simply an act of FAITH: do you know if you'll be alive by next week Saturday?

Blue light is scattered more than the other colors because it travels as shorter, smaller waves is the explanation for why the sky is blue.

No need for word games. The sky is blue is an empirical fact and real. Unlike the faith that your palestinian god exist which may or may not be real.

Wilgrea7:


When I said scientific, i meant something that was at least testable or observable. I'm not saying the conclusion you arrived at.. the one of the uncaused first cause.. isn't logical. It can be.

That's why i made reference to the Kalam cosmological argument. If something can exist without beginning to exist, the it can be likened to an uncaused first cause. I don't disagree with that.

But the fact that we have not encountered or verified the existence of such a thing/things .. is what bothers me

1. The fact that something is NOT testable is not a proof that it doesn't exist. It may be the limitation of your scientific instrument.
Imagine someone trying to measure the weight of a bacteria with bathroom scale and then concluding that since he can't weigh anything bacterias don't exist
2. If God is physically measurable, it means that He is subject to the laws of physics and he is made up of Matter. This mean that such cannot be the creator of matter and the laws that govern matter interaction.
3. Logic is very simple
If A>B (Postulate 1)
AND
If B>C (Postulate 2)
THEN
C>A (Conclusion)

The conclusion can only be wrong if either of the two postulates are wrong.
From the knowledge, we have are the postulates surrounding infinite regress false?

Until they are PROVEN FALSE, the CONCLUSION is TRUE

Wilgrea7:

Coming to the issue of logic.. I'm always cautious because a lot of things can sound logical, until you find out the real story behind them.

It was a completely logical stance at a certain time, that the sun revolved around the earth. Afterall, who wouldn't think so when you see the sun rising in the east and setting in the west? But we know better today.

I'm not denying your argument on the grounds of logic. That, i would gladly give you. But i don't want to make a mistake of going with something that sounds logical based on my limited knowledge.

The sun revolving around the earth was a completely logical thing based on our knowledge back then. But as our knowledge grew, the once logical thing didn't really make as much sense anymore.

But from the best information you have at hand, are the postulates WRONG?

If they are not wrong, why the exertion of these great force to REJECT that which CORRECT

Wilgrea7:


You're a theist who actually cares to look at science. That's something i respect. You once told me about Arvin Ash on YouTube.

Do you know about PBS spacetime? Similar to Arvin.. but more complex and more indepth.. i would suggest going through their videos on the big bang.

The reason i brought them up, is because they've shown me how little we actually know about the nature of the big bang.

All things regarding cause and effect trace themselves back to the big bang.. because that's the origin of all matter as we know it.

Time, Space, Matter AND all the laws of Physics occured simultaneously at/after big bang.
You know the implication!?

It means that however we try Scientifically, we cannot probe beyond (before) the big bang.

The Uncaused First Cause must of course be beyond (before/ the big bang) meaning that He cannot be subject either to the laws of physics nor be of material/matter origin.

The Uncaused First Cause is an ENIGMA!

Wilgrea7:

My issue with the big bang is how little we know about it. There are many theories that try to explain why and how it happened. Inflation theory is one.. but it's not the only theory trying to explain it. There is still so much we don't know about the origin of the universe, for us to say that it was caused by a first cause, or unmoved mover.

Going by our current knowledge.. the idea of an uncaused first cause makes sense. But that knowledge is incredibly limited. That's my point.

That being said, I'm willing to accept the conclusion of an uncaused first cause for the sake of this argument

The question is :
Is it possible to probe beyond time t=o?

If Gravitational Singularity is eternal, then it must be a CONSTANT! If it is a constant, why did it suddenly expand 13.8 billion years ago.

The Uncaused First Cause CANNOT be "fully known" UNLESS He reveals Himself to Humans.
Unfortunately, there is also an opposing force that make a person irresponsible to the purpose for which he was created!

TenQ:

Okay according to you!
Unfortunately, scientific knowledge contradicts you.

The Universe has been expanding from an infinitesimally small gravitational singularity from 13.8 billion years ago. At the same instance, time, space and matter were simultaneously created.

Too bad!

Very good. Just as scientific knowledge does not support your claim that your palestinian god created the universe.

Maynman:

Yes, i Answered your question.
So listen to your advice, and answer my questions

Are you taking all what science said as possible and not possible to be FACT, before we go on?

And do you also know an effect can occur before a cause? Is it logically and scientifically possible?

I only respond to your queries, don't put words in my mouth

Workch:
This argument doesn’t in anyway prove the Christian myths in the Bible

Of course, I am not Preaching Christ to you.
It's not my objective!

TenQ:

I only respond to your queries, don't put words in my mouth

Are you confused?
I’m asking a question the same way you asked me a question, remember?
It was you that brought in “ is infinite regress of cause and effect scientifically or logically possible?”

So listen to your advice, and answer my questions

Are you taking all what science said as possible and not possible to be FACT, before we go on?

And do you also know an effect can occur before a cause? Is it logically and scientifically possible?

Maynman:


I wonder why you are lying, is that what Chrestians does?
How do you know I haven’t done the dna test?
Believers always believing..

Why do we need to assume what “faith” means, when we can just look up the origin of the word.

mid-13c., faith, feith, fei, fai "faithfulness to a trust or promise; loyalty to a person; honesty, truthfulness," from Anglo-French and Old French feid, foi "faith, belief, trust, confidence; pledge" (11c.), from Latin fides "trust, faith, confidence, reliance, credence, belief," from root of fidere "to trust,"from ...

Did you actually do a DNA test for your children?

Maynman:

Exactly, you have faith in things you are not sure of!

I did not define faith as such: check my post!

It is a TRUST in the integrity of a Personality or a System.

If You are not SURE of the Integrity of a Parachute, would you JUMP from a plane!?

TenQ:

Did you actually do a DNA test for your children?


I did not define faith as such: check my post!

It is a TRUST in the integrity of a Personality or a System.

If You are not SURE of the Integrity of a Parachute, would you JUMP from a plane!?

It’s not of your business, Chrestian. You already had “faith” that i did not do it, so good!
The examples you used said it, you are using examples of things i have no control or even knowledge about.

Parachute fails. Do you know how many people that die of parachute accident yearly?
They also had “faith” in it.

Jennygold111:
Is it wise to play along with been a Christian as an Atheist? I am finding it difficult to fake, it seems like a major blow to myself to lie to myself.

You have nothing to lose as a Christian. It's a religion with freedom of speech and democracy, you are even free to think free, forget what some pastors say. You can be a Christian and also a free thinker but been an atheist is loneliness in the spirit.

Maynman:


So the tanakh lied?

Gen 1:1:
"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth."

How did the Tanakh lie?

Heb 11:3:
"Through faith we understand that the universe were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear."