jaephoenix:

Ummmm… How exactly does a baby do yahweh's will?

oteneaaron:

Simple.
By becoming a baptized Jehovah's Witness and swearing allegiance to the 9 members of the Governing Body in the USA.

MaxInDHouse:
Death is for sinners as in God's enemies that's what Paul meant when he said:
"All have sinned and fallen short of God's glory" Romans 3:23

So if God decided to make friends with Adam's descendants it's because we found ourselves in a situation where we are helpless {Psalms 49:7-9} but the fact remains that all of us are sinners: sentenced to death right from the day we were conceived in our mother's womb! Psalms 51:5 compare to Romans 6:23

tctrills:

Yes we all would die and we all commit sin yet Jesus Christ stated that the children would inherit the kingdom of Heaven. So for a common man to declare them enemies of God, that man is a false teacher. Enemies of God do not inherit his kingdom.

MaxInDHouse:


So are you saying they're not SINNERS who deserves to die according to Romans 6:23?

If they're not sinners then why do they grow old, get sick and die?

bobestman:
You are always twisting and ignorant. If those babies die without having knowledge of sin. And you also know we will all give account on the last day. All will be judged according to their works. What works or sins will they use to condemn this babies who have no knowledge of sin? It is only when you know what sin is and do it, that it is counted as sin. You can't be judged when you commited no sin - murder, lie, adultery etc. Babies have no knowledge of all that. That is why they can't be called sinners. You may read bible from cover to cover but if you don't have knowledge, you can't understand. Your pastor is wrong. You are wrong too. Accept it or go to court.

MaxInDHouse:


You missed the import of Jesus' comment!

Children who knew nothing about God's Kingdom aren't inheriting God's Kingdom they will be destroyed along with their disobedient parents the same way they were destroyed in the days of Noah, Sodom and Gomorrah, Jericho and Amalek. Luke 17:26-27
Jesus' illustration is about people who makes themselves teachable like children {Matthew 11:25} not literal children whose salvation largely depends on circumstances, if they're not old enough to make the right choice they will be destroyed along with their parents but if they have chosen the path of life then they will be saved just like Noah's daughters in law, Lots daughters and Rahab in Jericho!

tctrills:

I am already enjoying this topic but before I put up any argument, let me learn from you.
So if a faithful JW family loses a 3 months baby, clearly, the baby knows nothing about God, is that baby an enemy of God?

tctrills:

Also, you keep talking about people who died in the days of Noah, Sodom and Gomorrah, and so on, are you saying that no JW member has ever lost his life to a flood or natural disaster, or war? If they have, then how are these examples relevant? How are they different from the people of the days of Noah?

tctrills:

Lastly, you agree that the condition for us to enter the Kingdom of Heaven is to make ourselves teachable like little children yet you believe that these same little children do not qualify for Heaven. Explain yourself. I want you to explain yourself clearly before I take you into the scripture. So boss lets have it.

MaxInDHouse:

Such a baby hasn't built a personality that we can remember so it will be a stranger in God's Kingdom, we can have another baby we don't need the one that hasn't build any relationship with us nah!

Whether death due to oldage, sickness or accident it still boils down to the punishment of Adamic sin so there's going to be a resurrection of faithful people but as for the wicked (those God destroyed in His anger) they have been forgotten for good! Psalms 9:17

When Jesus used illustration of sheep and goat do you conclude that all literal sheep will be in God's Kingdom while all literal goats will be destroyed?
Ọmọ Jesus used children to illustrate the act of being humble and teachable not that all literal babies are sinless jọọ!

tctrills:

When he asked us to be like children, he was literally referring to children as we know them.

tctrills:

So you are wrong and Jesus Christ is right the evil would also be resurrected.

tctrills:

I advise you to abandon your God who would destroy your child for no reason if the child does not live old enough to discover him. Your God really has no love for you. And he does not deserve your respect.

tctrills:


Now I understand your position. Let's start with your last point. When Jesus used sheep and goats, he was speaking in parables. I am sure you don't need me to tell you what a parable is. On the other hand, when he asked us to be like children, he was literally referring to children as we know them. When he said that children are the inheritors of his kingdom, it was not a parable. When we learn from the Book of Psalms that children are an heritage of the Lord: and the fruit of the womb is his reward. He is literally talking about children.

To the next point, since you say that we all would die, then why have you been talking about the people in the time of Noah as if their death was special? But then you again made a mistake. Listen to the words of Christ to find out who would be resurrected.

28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,

29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
So you are wrong and Jesus Christ is right the evil would also be resurrected.

Now to your first point. I remember you once told me that the JW members worship a different God. Clearly, the God you worship is unfair and has zero sense of justice. He creates a child, allows the child to live for 3 months, and destroys the child. On the other hand, he gives a different child an opportunity to grow up and discover Him and worship Him.
My own God is clearly fairer, more just, and more intelligent than that.
I advise you to abandon your God who would destroy your child for no reason if the child does not live old enough to discover him. Your God really has no love for you. And he does not deserve your respect.

Mumu post & empty rants of Tctrill.

Did the children of evildoers and wickedness survive the flood of Noah's day?



Come and be LYING that Genesis 7:21-23 is not in your own Bible.


Jesus Christ is referencing the children of Noah & young Timothy who follow their faithful parents footsteps.

Stop deceiving yourself ,Oga Tc.

Janosky:


Mumu post & empty rants of Tctrill.

Did the children of evildoers and wickedness survive the flood of Noah's day?



Come and be LYING that Genesis 7:21-23 is not in your own Bible.


Jesus Christ is referencing the children of Noah & Timothy who follow their faithful parents footsteps.

Stop deceiving yourself ,Oga Tc.

MaxInDHouse:


Funny nepotist!

Go and force your opinion on Jesus who said only those who have the same line of thought with him are his real families! Matthew 12:46-50

Do you think Jesus didn't love his mother and brothers?

MaxInDHouse:
When Jesus talked about sheep and goat he was talking in parables so it's the same thing he did when talking about children.

“I publicly praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and intellectual ones and have revealed them to young children" Matthew 11:25

Please who are those Jesus is referring to in the above quote, humble and teachable adults or literal children? Matthew 15:26 compare to 1John 2:1; 3:18; 5:21




Just humbly request a free home Bible study and we will teach you what is written in our book (Bible)

There are three categories of people:
The RIGHTEOUS
The UNRIGHTEOUS
The WICKED

Righteous are faithful servants of God in ancient times who knew God and proved to be righteous from His standpoint!

Unrighteous are people who don't know the true God but lived their lives by conscience so God will remember them for making use of their God's given conscience!

Wicked are people who don't care about what they do so even when they know it's evil they will continue as they render their conscience dead!

So the first and second categories are the ones Jesus is talking about regarding resurrection but as for the third category they've been forgotten forever! Psalms 9:17

tctrills:
Jesus Christ never said that his mother and brothers would be destroyed again sir you are off-point. Please come back to the topic

tctrills:

I always laugh whenever I read your post. You always talk out of anger. But it's ok. Now let me ask you a question. If a JW member dies in a flood, what is the difference?

tctrills:

You always get yourself confused.
Now you said only the faithful would resurrect. But now you change the goalpost.
Now are these your definition from the bible or dictionary or did you just make them up as you always do?
Finally which verse in the bible speaks of the first second or 3rd category?
Are you saying that the scriptures are wrong for teaching that all men would be resurrected?
Do I believe you or believe the word of God?

Janosky:

Useless , invalid question.
Do I have to remind you that the flood of Noah's day was a punishment the God Almighty executed against evildoers wickedness at that time?

MaxInDHouse:


That's what you supposed to ask instead of arguing blindly!

Category A
All ancient faithful servants of God have built a solid relationship with God so their names are in line for the RIGHTEOUS to be remembered! Hebrews 11:4-12:1

Category B
Pagans who lived by conscience have proved that their God's given conscience is working in them like a compass so during the resurrection they will be remembered! Romans 2:14-16

Category C
Apart from Adamic sin which leads to death of all humans whether righteous or unrighteous many have rendered their conscience dead.
Some even knew God's standard but defied it while others deliberately chose to be evil not minding what their God's given conscience say so at death they've been judged no resurrection for them! Psalms 9:17

Janosky:


Useless , invalid question.

Do I have to remind you that the flood of Noah's day was a punishment the God Almighty executed against evildoers wickedness at that time?

MaxInDHouse:


Well for your information that's what he meant by calling those having the same line of thought with him his family. Matthew 12:46-50 compare to John 17:22
All those that has different opinion from Jesus are damned! John 3:16

oteneaaron:
What the video below for better context:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVvdu1DsHxs

If you watched the video above, you didn't hear wrongly.

Stephen Lett, a current member of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses has called babies "enemies of god" .

Here are his exact words quoted:



What do you think about this line of reasoning?

Do you truly agree with Jehovah's Witnesses that Babies are enemies of god?

I look forward to your comments.

Have a great Sunday.

MaxInDHouse:


That's what you supposed to ask instead of arguing blindly!

Category A
All ancient faithful servants of God have built a solid relationship with God so their names are in line for the RIGHTEOUS to be remembered! Hebrews 11:4-12:1

Category B
Pagans who lived by conscience have proved that their God's given conscience is working in them like a compass so during the resurrection they will be remembered! Romans 2:14-16

Category C
Apart from Adamic sin which leads to death of all humans whether righteous or unrighteous many have rendered their conscience dead.
Some even knew God's standard but defied it while others deliberately chose to be evil not minding what their God's given conscience say so at death they've been judged no resurrection for them! Psalms 9:17

MaxInDHouse:


That's what you supposed to ask instead of arguing blindly!

Category A
All ancient faithful servants of God have built a solid relationship with God so their names are in line for the RIGHTEOUS to be remembered! Hebrews 11:4-12:1

Category B
Pagans who lived by conscience have proved that their God's given conscience is working in them like a compass so during the resurrection they will be remembered! Romans 2:14-16

Category C
Apart from Adamic sin which leads to death of all humans whether righteous or unrighteous many have rendered their conscience dead.
Some even knew God's standard but defied it while others deliberately chose to be evil not minding what their God's given conscience say so at death they've been judged no resurrection for them! Psalms 9:17

tctrills:
Hence my question, if a JW member dies from a flood today, what is the difference? Both floods come from God that's why it's called a natural disasters.

Janosky:


The flood of Noah's day was not a natural disaster,it was divine judgement, announced by God many years before it began.

The flood did not cause harm to Noah.

A natural disaster doesn't distinguish evildoers and righteous servants of God.

tctrills:

\Oga don't be confused. God is in control of nature and the elements.
So let's see how weak your answer is.
You claim that the flood in the days of Noah is different from a flood that kills an innocent JW member. But they both come from God and they both accomplish the same result. Both the JW member and the sinner in Noah's time suffer the same death. I am sure it makes no sense even to you. You boys should learn to question your leaders. They are men like you. Don't just accept their false teachings.

tctrills:

From the verses you wrote its clear it make this up. Now, Jesus Christ said all would resurrect not category A, B C. the faithful and the evildoers. Please read John 5

tctrills:

What does this have to do with the topic on the ground? Please let's not distract ourselves. Jesus Christ said children would inherit his kingdom. He is not unjust or stupid. We can take his words to the bank

tctrills:

Question for you sir.
What Category, A, B, or C would you place these people?
Revelation 21:8
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone
: which is the second death.

Note: Idolaters are basically pagans