TheLequte:


With the addition of Sancho I’m inclined to agree with your point. If we pick the best of the best, we’re better attack wise.

However if you think about quality squad depth, City just about edges United. And in the long run it’s quality squad depth that matters, not the starting XI.

Because if the best attacker of both teams gets injured, loses form or gets fatigued, we know who’s going to suffer more.

You are correct that quality depth comes in handy in the long run, however you are avoiding the appropriate use of the squad as factor. For eg Lampard had the squad but couldn't use it well until Tuchel came, same with Flick and Kovac

TheLequte:
Capitalce

The midfield is where the worry is.

There’s a reason no one is debating the gulf in quality between both teams in that department.

The gulf in class? A team with Bruno and Pogba at their peaks can match any team in terms of class, I know that Mctom and Fred are not up to notch but they are not absolute duds, they can do a job on their day. City might be considerably bettet in Midfield but their is no gulf in class.

TheLequte:


Their quality and contribution in the last 2 years. And this is relative to the contribution of the top player for each position (who gets a 10).



This is wrong.

The only department where we're better is in defense. - CB and LB. And they're not far behind us there.

The gap is huge in midfield - They have way better quality squad depth at DM, CM and AM

In attack, they have the better quality squad depth but we're closer. (Just like the CB position)

Abeg what's City's squad depth in the DM position? Fernandinho and Rodri? Depth? Jesus Christ!

What are their options in CM? We have Pogba, Fred, VDB...City have only Gundogan and Rodri (More a DM)...Pep fielding KDB, Silva, Foden and the likes in CM is down to his ingenuity and the trust he has for them...What stops Ole from playing Fred as a CM? What stops him from finding a system that suits VDB? If they had joined City, the argument would have been different...

City have better quality and depth? Bruno cancels out KDB, most of you think he is even better...Pogba as an AM is better than Grealish...Let Ole set us up to attack like City do and you'll see that Pogba and Bruno will dust Grealish and KDB...Silva is an unproductive player, good with the ball at his feet but he is not good at scoring nor creating chances...Foden is a forward in my books as his first instinct is to score, no way will I pick Gundogan and Foden over VDB as my AM...

We are better in defense and attack, they're arguably better in midfield...Your attempt at breaking the midfield into DM, CM and AM as well as defense into RCB, RB etc changes nothing...

They're better at RB, whilst we are better at RCB and LB...The LCB is a tie...

In midfield, they're better at DM, but the CM and AM a tie...

In attack, we are better at CF, the LWF and REF position is a tie...Anything else is you arguing against the quality of each side on display...

Interesting! Are you ever out of these kinds of ideas?

nitrogen:
Some City players are average players, pep’s system makes those players look world class. We have bought more ready-made players in the last few years, yet, our fans/supporters are saying that City’s quality is higher. Also, we’ve signed lots of players in the last few years with most of them still around. Squad depth and quality are there, you guys are just trying to find an excuse for OGS, in case he doesn’t win anything.

It’s not fair on the owners and scouts spending and working respectively round the clock to bring in the players.

TheLequte:



In defense, we are ahead but they are not far behind. In attack they are ahead but we are close behind.

You can say we’re “close to each other” in attack and defense but that midfield, we are way behind them. It’s clear for all to see.

How exactly are City ahead in attack?

TheLequte:


That’s not a blanket statement. That’s reality.

Comparing either team’s first or second team is erroneous. That’s why I said you don’t get it.

Why would you play your “second team” alone when your first team players are also available?

No manager fields their second team alone. They only do so in special situations- like if the opposition is of very lower quality or some other reason.

What they usually do is make few changes so that there isn’t too much drop in quality.

I seriously don’t get the idea of comparing first or second team alone. It’s so very erroneous and doesn’t even compare the quality between both teams.

Then you should know it also applies to us...

GloryIsaac:


If you still can’t see the point, Good luck.

Where none exist, you can't blame me...

benji93:
Interesting! Are you ever out of these kinds of ideas?

That’s the fact. Jesus, Gundogan, Rodri, Silva, etc are not world class players. You guys should just stop abeg.

KingAlabi:

Lolz

E get some arguments that are not worth going into, nobody in that team can do what Bruno does from that AM role, nobody!!!!!!!!!.
An injury to him won't necessarily spell doom, but the drop in quality will be world-class.

For the McT and Rodri debate, na who no know ball go talk that rubbish, even current matic (except on his day) isn't better than Rodri.

Maguire sef. If he gets injured we’re doomed. And AWB too.

Maguire, Bruno and AWB. The drop in quality when compared with their replacements is huuuuge.

City has almost nothing like that. KDB gets injured? Graelish or Gundogan will slot in and the drop in quality will not he huuuuge.

GloryIsaac:


Lmaooooo... mentioned earlier that this was the real root of all these claim about United and City being on par.

Didn’t take long to spout it.

If Afrodoc didn’t halt the claim of McTom being on par with Rodri, you guys would have ridden on that too. Continue twisting stuff to fit.

That doesn't render the fact that UTD squad is star studded untrue. Why do you keep hammering on a single position as if games are solely won on who has the better DM, you guys make it sound as if Fred and Mctoms are Sunday league standards. It is very ridiculous that you will quickly rush to downplay the quality of the team so as to shield the manager from upping his game. No team in the EPL has the quality of players utd have in defence. Utd attack is better than everyone else, Bruno is literally the best AM in the league with no question and a generational talent Sancho has just been added. What's with all these back and forth?

GloryIsaac:


Lmaooooo... mentioned earlier that this was the real root of all these claim about United and City being on par.

Didn’t take long to spout it.

If Afrodoc didn’t halt the claim of McTom being on par with Rodri, you guys would have ridden on that too. Continue twisting stuff to fit.

Of course, we will definitely talk bout the manager. Everything is on him, if we win trophies this season, I will def praise the manager first before the players.

We can’t take away the manager’s input in all of this, which means even if the squad looks good, the manager must get the best out of the players to win trophies.

CapitalCee:


The gulf in class? A team with Bruno and Pogba at their peaks can match any team in terms of class, I know that Mctom and Fred are not up to notch but they are not absolute duds, they can do a job on their day. City might be considerably bettet in Midfield but their is no gulf in class.

Over the course of a season when players get injured, lose form or become fatigued, it will be obvious.

Remember when McTom (and Pogba) got injured and we had to make do with Pereira in midfield? Thank God those days are gone. We now have Fred

CapitalCee:


That doesn't render the fact that UTD squad is star studded untrue. Why do you keep hammering on a single position as if games are solely won on who has the better DM, you guys make it sound as if Fred and Mctoms are Sunday league standards. It is very ridiculous that you will quickly rush to downplay the quality of the team so as to shield the manager from upping his game. No team in the EPL has the quality of players utd have in defence. Utd attack is better than everyone else, Bruno is literally the best AM in the league with no question and a generational talent Sancho has just been added. What's with all these back and forth?

Absolutely ridiculous. Just watch them come out later to say that they don’t care if Ole is the manager or not, acting like saints and neutrals, when infact (deep within themselves) they have no faith in the manager to the needful.

Just doesn’t make sense.

ChristineC:
it's always a two way street when you make blanket conclusions like this.
like someone already pointed out, every debate here ends up on an Ole baseline which becomes boring.
conclusion can also be made from the other angle, which is you are trying to overrate the squad quality, should in case they win something then you can say the quality was responsible and OGS didn't do anything

Because Ole is the weak link, and I will def praise Ole, if we win trophies. Let’s win first, this season is our chance, the team looks really good. The Glazers have done the needful (re: player acquisitions and ‘structure’). It’s Ole’s turn to do the needful.

CapitalCee:


That doesn't render the fact that UTD squad is star studded untrue. Why do you keep hammering on a single position as if games are solely won on who has the better DM, you guys make it sound as if Fred and Mctoms are Sunday league standards. It is very ridiculous that you will quickly rush to downplay the quality of the team so as to shield the manager from upping his game. No team in the EPL has the quality of players utd have in defence. Utd attack is better than everyone else, Bruno is literally the best AM in the league with no question and a generational talent Sancho has just been added. What's with all these back and forth?

He has picked that position to argue all day like that's the only area of concern...Ask him about the RCB, LB, CF and he goes mute...

patrickmuf:
Lol Maguire to Bailly is drop in quality but Dias to Ake is improvement...

AWB to Dalot is drop in quality but Zichenko to Mendy is improvement abi?

Ederson to Steffen is improvement abi?

Mahrez to Silva is improvement abi?

Who be City CF sef? Greenwood is better than any you bring up talk less of Cavani but no, let's trash ours...

Lol

AWB to Dalot compared to Walker to Cancelo?

Shaw to Telles is worse that Zichenko to Mendy

We don't have Goalkeeper right now.

Mahrez to Silva is not much drop in quality compared to Rashford/Martial to James.
Maguire to Bailly = Dias to Ake

Whilst Greenwood is better, he is still young and quite inexperienced. Why is Pep hesitating to play Liam Delap more often?

chidexxy007:

Lol

AWB to Dalot compared to Walker to Cancelo?

Shaw to Telles is worse that Zichenko to Mendy

We don't have Goalkeeper right now.

Mahrez to Silva is not much drop in quality compared to Rashford/Martial to James.
Maguire to Bailly = Dias to Ake

Whilst Greenwood is better, he is still young and quite inexperienced. Why is Pep hesitating to play Liam Delap more often?

What do you mean we don’t have a keeper? Geez! De Gea and Henderson nko? Who is Emerson? Because he’s won trophies under a manager that is very good?

Nawa o!

At LWF, is Grealish, Sterling, Torres and Foden better than Rashford, Martial, Sancho and James? No way...

At RWF is Mahrez, Sterling, Silva and Foden better than Sancho, Greenwood, Rashford and James? No way...

At CF, is Jesus, Sterling and Torres better than Cavani, Greenwood or Martial? Hell no...

How then are City better in attack?

CapitalCee:


Nobody is saying Mctoms is better than Rodri. The question is does City have more depth by far than Man Utd? Its by all means a capital NO.

They are just dwelling on DM.

Omo e weak me

nitrogen:


Because Ole is the weak link, and I will def praise Ole, if we win trophies. Let’s win first, this season is our chance, the team looks really good. The Glazers have done the needful (re: player acquisitions and ‘structure’). It’s Ole’s turn to do the needful.

true

GloryIsaac:


Pep swaps players week in week out and it’s like nothing happened. Even the almighty De Bruyne

Swap out Bruno for VDB, and come read the comments on this thread that day.

“He’s too slow” “He plays too safe” “He likes passing” “He’s not aggressive”.... tears upon tears. Funniest aspect is it’ll be from the same camp that believes we’re on par with City

I feel he knows it but just doesn't want to admit because it will seem like giving Ole an already made excuse should he fail.

Everything is about Ole you know.

nitrogen:


What do you mean we don’t have a keeper? Geez! De Gea and Henderson nko? Who is Emerson? Because he’s won trophies under a manager that is very good?

Nawa o!

It's shocking even the present De Gea is on par with Ederson...Henderson too is not far behind...Ederson makes as much error (if not more) as DE Gea a but they wouldn't know...

patrickmuf:
At LWF, is Grealish, Sterling, Torres and Foden better than Rashford, Martial, Sancho and James? No way...

At RWF is Mahrez, Sterling, Silva and Foden better than Sancho, Greenwood, Rashford and James? No way...

At CF, is Jesus, Sterling and Torres better than Cavani, Greenwood or Martial? Hell no...

How then are City better in attack?

Exactly. City attackers are just there, they are not in any way better than our players. A good tactic/system ensures that their output makes sense vs Utd’s. Does not necessarily mean that they are better.

patrickmuf:
Abeg what's City's squad depth in the DM position? Fernandinho and Rodri? Depth? Jesus Christ!

What are their options in CM? We have Pogba, Fred, VDB...City have only Gundogan and Rodri (More a DM)...Pep fielding KDB, Silva, Foden and the likes in CM is down to his ingenuity and the trust he has for them...What stops Ole from playing Fred as a CM? What stops him from finding a system that suits VDB? If they had joined City, the argument would have been different...

City have better quality and depth? Bruno cancels out KDB, most of you think he is even better...Pogba as an AM is better than Grealish...Let Ole set us up to attack like City do and you'll see that Pogba and Bruno will dust Grealish and KDB...Silva is an unproductive player, good with the ball at his feet but he is not good at scoring nor creating chances...Foden is a forward in my books as his first instinct is to score, no way will I pick Gundogan and Foden over VDB as my AM...

We are better in defense and attack, they're arguably better in midfield...Your attempt at breaking the midfield into DM, CM and AM as well as defense into RCB, RB etc changes nothing...

They're better at RB, whilst we are better at RCB and LB...The LCB is a tie...

In midfield, they're better at DM, but the CM and Amis a tie...

In attack, we are better at CF, the LWF and REF position is a tie...Anything else is you arguing against the quality of each side on display...

LMAO.

Everything you said here is laughable.

You’ll pick VDB aka e no spoil for my hand over Gundogan and Foden at AM?? Lemao

Rodri as a CM is not better than McTok or Fred. That was well taken into consideration. Gundogan as a CM is better than both of them. Facts.

And also, it’s not a 1v1 situation. Pogba and Bruno “canceling out” KDB and Graelish. The important question is what will be the drop in quality if these key players get injured or loses form? Because that’s what usually happens over the course of a season!

Like I said, you’re looking at one-match performances, I’m looking over the stretch of a season.

When logical, cogent thinking stares you in the face, the only thing you can use to battle it is logical, cogent thinking. Not tantrums, gbas gbos, “McTom is better than Rodri” or talks about Ole’s cluelessness.

LMAO

“Let Ole set us up to attack like City do”, what about “let Ole set City to attack like we do”?

LeEMaOo

chidexxy007:

I feel he knows it but just doesn't want to admit because it will seem like giving Ole an already made excuse should he fail.

Everything is about Ole you know.

Why not swap Bruno with Pogba? I get, it doesn't suit the narrative...

ChristineC:
true

Honestly, I am not doing Ole out or anything. I just want a trophy this season. No excuse. He has the tools, he’s built his team over the last three years. It’s now or never for him because the board will sack him if we don’t win a trophy.

patrickmuf:
Why not swap Bruno with Pogba? I get, it doesn't suit the narrative...

Square peg, round holes.
Na you go still come here come rant.

Not like it's something they haven't tried before though.

TheLequte:


LMAO.

Everything you said here is laughable.

You’ll pick VDB aka e no spoil for my hand over Gundogan and Foden at AM?? Lemao

Rodri as a CM is not better than McTok or Fred. That was well taken into consideration. Gundogan as a CM is better than both of them. Facts.

And also, it’s not a 1v1 situation. Pogba and Bruno “canceling out” KDB and Graelish. The important question is what will be the drop in quality if these key players get injured or loses form? Because that’s what usually happens over the course of a season!

Like I said, you’re looking at one-match performances, I’m looking over the stretch of a season.

When logical, cogent thinking stares you in the face, the only thing you can use to battle it is logical, cogent thinking. Not tantrums, gbas gbos, “McTom is better than Rodri” or talks about Ole’s cluelessness.

LMAO

“Let Ole set us up to attack like City do”, what about “let Ole set City to attack like we do”?

LeEMaOo

Martial/Rashford - Sancho - Greenwood behind Cavani won't work abi? You guys see all the possibilities with City but turn blind when looking at your own team...

Ole is criticized here most times because he doesn't make good use of his squad, pray tell, if the squad is devoid of quality, why the criticism? It shows majority on these board acknowledge the quality I our ranks that's why they expect Ole to use the squad more rather than stick to a preferred 11...

chidexxy007:

Square peg, round holes.
Na you go still come here come rant.

Not like it's something they haven't tried before though.

Bruno has a free role at Utd, forget the AM story. Pogba can also do very well if given the same role. No square peg in any round hole.

patrickmuf:
At LWF, is Grealish, Sterling, Torres and Foden better than Rashford, Martial, Sancho and James? No way...

At RWF is Mahrez, Sterling, Silva and Foden better than Sancho, Greenwood, Rashford and James? No way...

At CF, is Jesus, Sterling and Torres better than Cavani, Greenwood or Martial? Hell no...

How then are City better in attack?

It’s as if you read to attack, not to understand.

So you’ll take Rashford and James at RWF over Silva and Foden? And if Rashford is already at LWF, how’s he playing at RWF.

You’re picking pieces to prove a narrative.

If you take a holistic look at the whole picture, your position will be different.

Having said that, City just about edges United in attack. It’s almost the same squad strength. And United also just about edges City in defense. It’s about the same thing. The midfield is where the gulf is. Cos City has quite a lot of players who can give a decent performance there. United don’t. That’s why there’s a gulf there.

Also, I don’t see you having a problem with United being slightly better than City in defense but look at you viciously fighting the same conclusion at the other end.

And also- United just bought Sancho and Varane to close the gap/get a little bit forward in attack and defense.

If you have a logical objection against the methods or want to rate some players differently, you can. You will still arrive at the same conclusions.

chidexxy007:

Square peg, round holes.
Na you go still come here come rant.

Not like it's something they haven't tried before though.

Tried when?

We used to be behind them some 2 seasons ago but not anymore...The gap (if any exist) is negligible...