@soladnet,

soladnet:

If am to answer the Question (which is not asked rightly) as it is being asked, then the answer is a capital "NO".
Your Question needs to be re-framed because u have asked it with the level of your understanding of the two religions Most especially The Christianity.

Quoting, prigrim.1: " WHERE did ALLAH ever refer to Muhammad as "THE SPIRIT"?!?"

If only you had carefully followed the discussion, you would have no problem with the way I framed my question. I had carefully discussed this and demonstrated that the verses under review between chapters 14 and 16 of John's Gospel lead to the incontrovertible conclusion that the Comforter is indeed the Holy Spirit (John 14:16 & 26).

John 14 vs. 16 & 26
(16)  And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter,
that he may abide with you for ever . . .
(26) But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will
send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to
your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Following that, I also demonstrated that the phrase "the Holy Spirit" is also used in both the Qur'an and the Hadith; see below:

~ Qur'an

Sura 2 vs 87 (also vs. 253)
"We gave Jesus the son of Mary Clear (Signs)
and strengthened him with the holy spirit."

Sura 16 vs 102
"Say, the Holy Spirit has brought the revelation from
thy Lord in Truth, in order to strengthen those who believe,
and as a Guide and Glad Tidings to Muslims."

- - - - -

~ Hadith

Sahih Bukhari, Vol. 1, Bk. 8, Num. 444:
"O Allah! Help him with the Holy Spirit."

Sahih Bukhari, Vol. 4, Bk. 54, Num. 434:
"O Allah! Support him (i.e. Hassan) with the Holy Spirit?"

Sahih Bukhari, Vol. 8, Bk. 73, Num. 173:
"O Allah ! Support him (Hassan) with the Holy Spirit (Gabriel).'?"


However, we can see that the references in both the Qur'an and the Hadith not in reference to the Spirit of God, but rather interpreted for the angel Gabriel (Jibril).

When babs787 insisted that John 14:16 could not be referring to the Holy Spirit but rather to none other than to Muhammad, I initially posed a single question to him; and then later added two more:

(a) WHERE did Allah ever refer to Muhammad as "THE HOLYSPIRIT"?

(b) Has Muhammad been in existence since the beginning of the creation of heaven and earth?

(c) Does John 14:16 & 26 identify "the Comforter" to be "the Holy Spirit", or it does not?

The Muslim apologists who have fabricated the dubious fallacy to interprete "Muhammad" into John 14:16 & 26 seriously need to address those queries, rather than trying to entertain us with re-arranged excuses that are vacant of thought and honest regard for integrity.

@soladnet,

soladnet:

I surpose your are refering to this Biblical Quote,

John 14:16 & 17
"And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you."

I believe, definatly u passed through school and u understand English very much. The spirit in the bible Qoute here does not mean the comforter Himself but the spirit of the truth: which will abide with everyone 4ever!!!

The Spirit of Truth abides only with those who are willing to receive and not deny His Truth.

One does not need a Harvard degree to see the simple statements identifying the Comforter to be none other than the Holy Spirit - John 14:16 & 26. I have pointed it out before, and I will yet point it out again. It is amazing how you dear Muslims could blind yourselves to naked truth - and if English is not a difficult language for you, please take another look at those verses again and simply answer this question as posed earlier:

(c) Does John 14:16 & 26 identify "the Comforter" to be "the Holy Spirit", or it does not?

Now, as regards the appellation "the Spirit of Truth", we notice yet again that an akin or similar term is used in the Qur'an by various translators in the English language:

Sura 26 vs 193 - [Yusuf Ali]
"With it came down the spirit of Faith and Truth"

Another question, soladnet:

(d) does that verse in the Qur'an refer to Muhammad?

soladnet:

Now The Answer To Your Question

Muhammed is the comforter and the message he brought is the truth which will be with everyone 4ever!!!

(e1) Is Muhammad ever referred to as "THE SPIRIT of TRUTH" in the Qur'an or the Hadith?

(e2) Did Allah anywhere refer to Muhammad in the Qur'an as "The SPIRIT of Truth"?

Those questions are just tow sides of the same - and if you have an answer to them without dramatizing any further fallacy, please post the verses from the Qur'an or Hadith where Allah ever referred to Muhammad as your claim above.

Cheers.

@soladnet,

soladnet:

Thanks for asking the lettered Questions and I will be very happy to answer your Q without missing anyone out,

I'm grateful that you took the time to offer answers as objectively as you could, rather than play the Muslim games of "oya answer me first. . . after that, you MUST answer more questions!"

soladnet:

first,

Do u have a proof that Muhammed warned that graves should not be build in the mosque?
you see you have mis-interprete the whole thing!!! there is difference between grave and a cementry/graveyard!

the prophet warned against building a mosq on a Cementry and a Bathroom Nor is it permissible for a Muslim to offer his prayer facing a grave or a tomb or any burial place. The Prophet curses the children of Israel for having "turned the graves of their prophets into praying places."

As fot the stones which are used in place of the Muhammed's footprint, these are fabricated!!! its obvious you have never been into a mosque, what ever you see in the mosq arround the Imam (leader) is not a grave but either where the Imam stays or sits down,

In the first place, there's no essential difference between the graves and what you have tried to conveniently describe as 'Cementry'. The term 'cemetery' is simply a tract of land used for burials, and it connotes such things as a graveyard and burial site.

I have dealt extensively with that query and given evidence from the Hadiths to buttress my answers. So, I'll just once again post them for your consideration.

We know that Muhammad cursed the Jews and Christians in his assumptions that they had taken the graves of the Prophets as places of worship (Sahih Bukhari, Vol. 4, Bk. 56, Num. 660). My question has been: if Muslims are happy that Muhammad could utter such curses from Allah, will they be happy as well that Allah would curse the Muslims for taking the graves of their own prophets or religious figures as places of worship? If Muslims are not happy with that, then the so-called curse of 'Allah' from Muhammad is null and void.

But just to show you: the very same thing that Muhammad warned against and expressed disdain about, has actually become part of Islam. Please consider the following:

(a) This is what Muhammad warned against:

Sahih Bukhari Vol. 2, Bk. 23, Num. 472:
Narrated 'Aisha: Allah's Apostle in his fatal illness said,
"Allah cursed the Jews and the Christians, for they built
the places of worship at the graves of their prophets."
And if that had not been the case, then the Prophet's grave
would have been made prominent before the people.
So (the Prophet ) was afraid, or the people were afraid that
his grave might be taken as a place for worship.

Sahih Muslim Book 004, Num. 1083:
Jundub reported: I heard from the Apostle of Allah (may peace
be upon him) five days before his death and he said: I stand
acquitted before Allah that I took any one of you as friend,
for Allah has taken me as His friend, as he took Ibrahim as His friend.
Had I taken any one of my Ummah as a friend, I would have taken
Abu Bakr as a friend. Beware of those who preceded you and used
to take the graves of their prophets and righteous men as
places of worship, but you must not take graves as mosques;
I forbid you to do that.

Sahih Muslim Book 004, Num. 2116:
Jabir said: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) forbade that
the graves should be plastered or they be used as sitting places
(for the people), or a building should be built over them.

Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 20, Num. 3230:
Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas: The Apostle of Allah
(peace_be_upon_him) cursed women who visit graves,
those who built mosques over them and erected lamps (there).

Of course there are many more such references; but I've limited myself to the few above to demonstrate that Muhammad forbade Muslims from erecting any building (including mosques over graves). But what has happened in reality?


(b) Muslims themselves have thrashed every single warning of Muhammad.

I don't have the time now in my very busy schedule to discuss this issue at length; but suffice to say that Muslims themselves have built a mosque over the grave or tomb of Muhammad - which is precisely the very same thing as building mosques over cemeteries!

Do you remember where Muhammad's grave is located? Is it in a mosque or actually very far from the mosque?

Just so that you don't waste your time trying to impress anyone with clever denials, let me remind you that Muhammad was buried in the mosque known as Masjid-Al-Nabi in Madinah (Medinah), Saudi Arabia. By the 8th century, the rooms in which his companions Abu Bakr and Omar had been buried were incorporated into the mosque and a dome had been built over the rooms. (here's an Islamic source with a bit of info to confirm).

Please see picture below for Muhammad's Mosque in Madinah which is said to "contain the chamber in which the Prophet Muhammad is buried" (source):



Rare picture of the tomb of Muhammad: [img]http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:D_iJHMQE6uSpBM:http://www.deenislam.co.uk/gallery/artefacts/Rauza-e-Rasool2.jpg[/img] click here for larger view.

I could add more to that; but for the very short time on my hands. The point is that you query is now laid to rest about Muhammad's warning against building mosques over graves/tombs.

@soladnet,

soladnet:

Secondly

The prophet warned against Status because it is widely used as and Idol (isnt that resonable enough?) and he also warned against pictures not being place in front of a praying person (someone performing salat), this is because it will definatly cause distraction (which is not allowed in salat (prayer)). Now, its ok for someone to have a picture or draw and image so far it not placed in front of you while prayin,

I'm sorry that all these warnings have been hugely thrashed by Muslims themselves. No long storylines - just view these pictures:





Besides that, you already know (if you're keeping abreast with develops in the Islamic world), that there are relics of Muhammad (such as his shirt, shoes, and even hair or beards) that are kept inside Mosques - such as the relics in Husyan Mosque in Cairo, Egypt.

soladnet:

Implication

Ofcourse there are implication for puting or using status in one's home! And it just that angels will never enter such houses where images (Status) are placed, so u c y He (Prohphet Muhammed) has preach, not realy against, but he strongly recomend not to have a status. and if you have one, no stress

I hope this is clear to you now.

Well, if what Muhammad preached were a mere admonition, we would simply have noded in his direction for commiserations.

However, I very much doubt that you could treat Muhammad's threats and warnings as mere advice! If a man wielding a sword bellows out that you as an artist or picture maker will face the most terrible judgement from Allah on the day of resurrection, then I guess you'd better pay him some good heed!

Enjoy.

@soladnet,

Please go through my rejoinders and let me know your thoughts - especially where I might have been wrong.

Thanks.

Pilgrim.1 what a smart challenge!! lol

Your Images does not look real to me! Can you prove to me and to the blogers of nairaland that this image you posted was not from an anti-islamic site? lol

The internet world has always been a place of scam! there are alot of sites online that blackmails islam (Muslims to be precise). I will start an investigation on the site you have provided and get back to you.

As for the relics stuff, they must be out of their minds!! Muhammed's shirt (we are talking of a thousand year and more! of course you know what cloths are made of) in CAIRO, EGYPT!!! Not SAUDI ARABIA!!! what in GOD's Name are YOU THNIKING! You must be Kiding me!!! lol you know this is not true!!! Cotton decays! To prove to you that this is the Second-Greatest lie that have ever come to existence. No matter what, the shirt (in perticular) from the date the prophet died to about 200 years later, there have not been any presavative of whatsoever. So there is not point trying to make a false claim the "truth"!!! ofcourse the level of technology "now" is as high as you may think of, but not then lol. (This is a fast money making archeological museum!)

@soladnet,

soladnet:

Pilgrim.1 what a smart challenge!! lol

Your Images does not look real to me! Can you prove to me and to the blogers of nairaland that this image you posted was not from an anti-islamic site? lol

Even if I did not post any images, what have you said of the FACT that the tomb of Muhammad is in the Mosque in Medinah, Saudi Arabia?

davidylan:

God called Abraham into a covenant - to make him the father of all nations (and the line of Isreal) . . . no where do we read of Abraham prophesying to all nations. you must be reading upside down.
[/qoute]

lol, dozing, right?
Abrahams mission is to become father of all nation, lol

Have you forgotten the religion of Abraham's parent? lol and u think he will be raised as the father of all nation as you have said by GOD? , when he told his father to stop Idol worhiping, was he acomplishing his mission as father of all nations? lol, i still recomend you go back to you bible and if the story is still half told, then you should know there is sometin fishing lol

davidylan link=topic=88347.msg1651447#msg1651447 date=1194274981:

lol what a liar!! Did your quran tell you it was Ishmael replaced with a ram or Isaac?
[/qoute]

Yes it did, The bible has frames it up by pointin it to Isaac.

[quote author=davidylan link=topic=88347.msg1651447#msg1651447 date=1194274981]
Show us the truth from the quran or produce allah's own "original" version of the torah first!
[/qoute]

There is no doubt about the fact that commandment of GOD in the Taorah is well placed in the qur'an and the very important issues of the past are all contained in the Qur'an what original "Version" are u looking for.

The fact that an Unlettered Person, (Muhammad) some one throughout his whole life does not know how to read nor write, was able to tell what is in the Taorah, Injeel and Zabur (The whole previous scriptures) has made the Qur'an Authentic. He has never lied, he also keep what is entrusted on Him. Since his childhood till he died, he was known to have a calm attitude toward all endevour. In History, he is the most successful of all. he was able to call people to His religion even though he is a poor man! what other Qualities do you need to justify some1 being truthful? I think its High time you got-up from you endless dream,


[quote author=pilgrim.1 link=topic=88347.msg1654528#msg1654528 date=1194355705]
@soladnet,

Even if I did not post any images, what have you said of the FACT that the tomb of Muhammad is in the Mosque in Medinah, Saudi Arabia?

The tomb of Muhammed was in the mosque of Medinah simply because of its expansion - the house of th prophet was near the mosq and he was burried inside HIS house!

[/quote][/quote]

Soladnet has proven himself to be an incorrigible liar.

Funny how he talks so much about Abraham and YET NOT a single one of his references come from his much vaunted quran.

@soladnet,

soladnet:

The tomb of Muhammed was in the mosque of Medinah simply because of its expansion - the house of th prophet was near the mosq and he was burried inside HIS house!

Lol. . . you sabi defend wetin you never understand!

The question in the Hadith was simple:

[list][li](1) Muhammad warned that Muslims should not take the the graves of prophets as places of worship: specifically, that they should NOT "take graves as mosques; I forbid you to do that" (Sahih Muslim, Book 004, Num. 1083)[/li][/list]

[list][li](2) Muhammad also cursed those who "built mosques over" graves (Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 20, Num. 3230)[/li][/list]

Haven't you just admitted that "the tomb of Muhammed was in the mosque of Medinah" (for whatever reason)?!?

Kai! Na wah for una apologetics!

Muhammad said:

(a) NO, don't do it;

(b) you're cursed if you do it!


Muslims today say:

(a) nothing go happen - we don do am!

(b) infact sef, we don expand am!!

Am I missing something?

The Prophet Muhammed tried at first to popularize the name Rahman instead of Allah. Rahman was the word used in the southern part of Arabia for God. However the name Allah prevailed.

The Hebrews also had several names for God including El Shaddai and El Eyon. As for the Holy Ghost, it is female noun in Hebrew.

Muhammed declared he was not trying to make a new religion but to restore the original purified religion of Abraham.

Well, the Arabic word for God is Ilah not Allah. Though, many Arabs refer to God as Allah, I believe it does not really matter. God knows.

Arab christians call God-All'ah because that is God's proper name in Arabic. What do you expect them to call Jesus or God when they only speak Arabic

@pilgrim.1 , I don't really know why and where all this will take you to. If your are a christian -DOES BIBLE ENCOURAGE WHAT YOUR DOING, FINDINGS AND POSTING. WHERE WILL IT TAKE YOU TO.

WHY NOT DO THE RIGHT THING. Must you prove others wrong and the other figers pointing on you.

HOLY BIBLE SAID PREACH THE WORD OF GOD. Do not fight for JESUS. He has done a great thing for you. Emulate CHRISt.  All your pictures are nonsence. YOU PROVE NOTHING BUT DISOBIDENCE TO THE WORD OF GOD.

http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/symbols3_index.htm



Illuminati / Freemasonry / Satanic Symbolism


Fez

One of the most widely recognized symbols in all of Shrinedom is the red fez. The Shrine fez, adopted by the Shrine's founders in 1872.



As a Mason goes through the 32 degrees of the Scottish rite, he ends up giving worship to every Egyptian pagan god, the gods of Persia, gods of India, Greek gods, Babylonian gods, and others. As you come to the 17th degree, the Masons claim that they will give you the password that will give him entrance at the judgment day to the Masonic deity, the great architect of the universe. It is very interesting that this secret password is "Abaddon".

Revelation chapter 9;11 it says, "The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key to the shaft of the Abyss [the bottomless pit], and smoke came out of the Abyss like that of a great furnace, " (It goes on to describe those in the abyss, then continues) They had a king over them, the angel of the Abyss, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, " The 'angel' of the Abyss (Hell) is really the chief demon whose name is Abaddon. Masons claim then, that the deity they worship is Abaddon!

In order for a person to become a Shriner, he must not only go through all the degrees of Masonry, make all those blood-curdling oaths, worship gods who are not gods except they are of Satan, but he must make a blood both of allegiance to a.l.lah as his god and mohammmed as his prophet. The Shriner is then given a red fez with an i's.lamic sword and crescent jeweled on the front of it. This originates from 7th century Arabia when the Moslems, under the leadership of mohammmed, slaughtered all Christians who would not bow down to a.l.lah. a.l.lah, by the way, was not another (generic) name given to God by mohammmed; a.l.lah is the tribal deity --the moon god-- of mohammmed; it was the name of the god in the tribe that mohammmed was born into. That is why every mosque today has a crescent moon on the top of its spire.

Now when mohammmed's army of men, out to slaughter all the 'infidels', came to the city of Fez, in Morocco, they found a community of Christians. After killing all the Christians there with their i's.lamic-style swords, they took their hats (called a fez) and dipped them in the blood of the Christians, and wore the fezzes throughout the land glorying in their victory over Christianity. Today Shriner's put on red fezzes (representing the hats dipped in the blood of Christians) with the i's.lamic sword and crescent showing their allegiance to a.l.lah and mohammmed (and the defeat of Christianity). Men in Obscene Red Fezzes!

SysUser:

http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/symbols3_index.htm
Illuminati / Freemasonry / Satanic Symbolism
Fez
One of the most widely recognized symbols in all of Shrinedom is the red fez. The Shrine fez, adopted by the Shrine's founders in 1872.

Useless to read. meant for Pagans only.

You guys are very funny cos no matter how long we intelligenly or foolishly argue, it doesn't change the FACT that there is ONLY ONE TRUE God in Heaven who created the Heavens, the Earth and Everything else we can think of and that God is certainly NOT an "Author of Confussion" so if there is a single line of conflict btw the Bible and the Quaran then the same God can't possibly be the author of both books.

So let us hold firm to our Conviction and not blind in our Action nor gullible in our Decision but let us ask Questions with the Intension to walk in the right Direction but remember, it is only God that knows who TRUELY SERVES HIM. As for me and my household, We shall continue to serve the Lord. God bless you All!

There are many gods while there is only One true and living God who is the God of Israel YHWH.

Please go to www.reluctant-messenger.com and read The Forgotton Books of Adam and Eve; First and Second and Enoch's Book of Secrets 1 &2, which can be found under the Misc. link on the left side if the page. Gain a better understanding just how decietful and conieving satan really is.

Learn how the white man stole our religion and mingled their Christian religion with our teachings; Jesus is the Antichrist and is not the Son of God nor is he an Israelite.

You can learn better of their deception by first understanding how all of this confusion came into play. Please go to:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDukq8npXBk - The History of Slavery In America.

You will read in the Forgotton Books of Adam and Eve that God is an Israelite and the He has not come down in the flesh (as the so called Christians) would have one to believe in a man the call Jesus Christ; because the 8th day (Apocalypse) not yet come nor has the promise the God if Israel made to Adam been fulfilled.

When you read Enoch's Book of Secrets 1 & 2, you will see how the Christians Holy Bible has reversed many things opposite to what is witnessed by Enoch and what God Himself has said. No wonder why death and destruction is all around us and there is so much confusion. The God of Israels children can understand their God and my God whom is the God if Israel is very much alive. He is not an Iron Age God, nor has He forsaken His people. Jesus Christ is not God's people, because if he was then he'd know that the God if Israel woukd NEVER foresake His chis r n people.

Satan is all of our master because Adam sinned in the Garden if Eden and obeyed satan, therefore satan becane his master and if all life came from Adam then our master is satan. ..however because God lived Adam he protected him from satan and GAVE us a choice to serve Him (God of Israel) and have protection from satan or serve satan and die. You can not serve two masters, you either love one and hate the other but you can't serve both.

Christians says "It's not robbery to be equal to God" but if this is true, then why was satan kicked out of heaven? And if it not been robbery to be equal with God, then why did the God of Israel kick Adam out of the Garden if Eden...could it be becsuse satan promised Adam the godhead? Then comes along this Jesus (a white man a leper) that the Christian world worships as God and an Israelite is a figment of whiteman's deceitful imagination.

There is no God in all the land but in Israel...so here we are prisoners if the land (America), enslaved and robbed of our heritage and basic human rights as we where and still are considered nonhumans in the eyes of the whiteman. All nations are being encouraged to forsake their God YHWh for Christianity...if you want freedom of religion come to America...the problem is you are serving satan willfully you just didn't know it up til now.

Muslims can't ever make any sense in all of ther claims. They don't just understand YHWH as much as they don't understand their god called allah... Muslim will object to limiting God but all they do is exactly what they deny! I dnt need to rebut much of the pouting of this muslim folks! I realise this thread is atleast worn out now!
Just a few questions though

John 16:7-10

Nevertheless, I tell you the truth: it is to your advantage that I go away, for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you. But if I go, I will send him to you. 8 And when he comes, he will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment: 9 concerning sin, because they do not believe in me; 10 concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father, and you will see me no longer; 11 concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

John 15:26

26 "But when the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, he will bear witness about me.

John 14:16-17

16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever, 17 even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you.

John 14:26

But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.

John 16:12-15

"I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. 14 He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you. 15 All that the Father has is mine; therefore I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to you.


So from the foregoing the question arises from the islamic/muslim view of muhammed as the comforter

#1: Is Muhammed sent by Jesus?
#2: did Muhammed Glorify Jesus? In what way?
#3: did Muhammed reminded the Disciples wat Jesus said?
#4 did Muhammed lived inside the Disciple? And abides forever?
#5 so all if muhammed is the comforter he was simply saying and declaring what belongs to Jesus?

Let me rest my case here! And I hope I won't be getting any response that the verse are corrupted! Then u will tell us why u applied those corrupt texts to identigy muhammed and perhaps tell us which texts are corrupted and which is not! Ofcos with evidences! Thanks!

We were all created by the same God - Yes, His name is certainly not allah.
We are all descendants of Adam - Yes, but some of us have become sons of the new Adam that ye know not of.

Muslims worship a god, same as the hindus, shango worshippers e.t.c. sorry if it sounds extreme but we cant continue sweeping facts under the carpet to avoid offending you. The God of the bible has nothing to do with the demon in the quran.



We dont forget at all, we only like to remind you to STOP reading only the part of history that suits your false idea of islam. The crusades were clearly aimed at taking back Europe from the bands of robbers and brigands called muslims who 400 yrs earlier had laid siege to it and burned it down with the sword.

YOU ARE AN EDUCATED ILLITERATE

FactorChic:
there are arab christians?

arab christians?? of course, wetin religion you think Islam ripped off the most?