Kay 17: The basis of morality is left to the individual not left to nothing.

Read this yourself and see if it makes sense. If the basis for morality is left to the individual then why do you put a child s[i]e[/i]x offender in prison? Afterall his own standards for morality might just include underage s[i]e[/i]x no?

Kay 17: The basis of morality is left to the individual not left to nothing.

My point exactly. Stalin is justified. As an atheist, he has done nothing wrong.
How then can you justly refer to religion as evil?

davidylan:

Read this yourself and see if it makes sense. If the basis for morality is left to the individual then why do you put a child s[i]e[/i]x offender in prison? Afterall his own standards for morality might just include underage s[i]e[/i]x no?

First of all, you are an empty barrel. Second, I was making a point that atheists are such because they don't believe in supernatural gods, and it doesn't extend to morality. At morality, individual atheists adopt their philosophy. At this point, I'm not saying I agree with whatever ethical code they pick up. If not, I would be agreeing with the Pope's doctrines because an atheist believes its morally sound.

Its insulting to claim all atheists support Communism, atheists like George Orwell desperately despise Communism just like the Pope does.

The problem with you and your crew is: you believe atheism is a rival religion and don't pay attention to its pecularities.

Kay 17:

First of all, you are an empty barrel. Second, I was making a point that atheists are such because they don't believe in supernatural gods, and it doesn't extend to morality. At morality, individual atheists adopt their philosophy. At this point, I'm not saying I agree with whatever ethical code they pick up. If not, I would be agreeing with the Pope's doctrines because an atheist believes its morally sound.

Its insulting to claim all atheists support Communism, atheists like George Orwell desperately despise Communism just like the Pope does.

The problem with you and your crew is: you believe atheism is a rival religion and don't pay attention to its pecularities.

The problem with you and your crew is that you believe Christianity is a religion and don't pay attention to the glaring dissimilarities

Mr_Anony:
Lol, I wish I had seen this earlier.....

Te problem is, If God showed Himself to you, would you recognize Him at all? or will you immediately say "there must be a scientific explanation for this!" and proceed to seek your elusive "scientific explanation" until the day you leave this world?

I didn't say show himself to me alone. Why is "theophany in front of multitudes of people" hard?
He supposedly wandered around the desert with some jews, he hung out with adam and eve, he talks to all these MOGs and pastors..........lol


Which brings up another question from that jewish mythology. If yahweh is omniscient, how come he didn't know that the snake was talking to the ribwoman?

noetic16:
God appeared in these forms to aid the children of Israel, by His own discretion at His own will and time and for His own purpose. This implies that He has a mind of His own to make his own decisions. The implication is that, while God is capable of theophany (as we can see from the bible), appearing to you (martian) in such form may not be according to his will and purpose, perharps because you have been destined for HELL fire or (just assuming)[or destined to be saved through another means. Hence, this appearance contradicts His will and ontology.

I guffawed when I read this part.

So according to you, god won't appear because he has already destined me for his torture chamber. And despite the fact that theophany is part of his nature, it will contradict his his will and ontology if he appears in front of multitudes?

You're just "assuming" that, that is the way your god feels because you're god feelings are the same as yours. Even the so called theophany in eodus never happened..............even the jews admit that there is no evidence that they ever roamed the desert with their tribal god.
Anyway,if god can't perform a theophany, then he isn't omnipotent.

Martian:

I didn't say show himself to me alone. Why is "theophany in front of multitudes of people" hard?
He supposedly wandered around the desert with some jews, he hung out with adam and eve, he talks to all these MOGs and pastors..........lol

So you agree that the theophany is infront of multitudes of people your problem is really that you are not among that multitude

Martian: Which brings up another question from that jewish mythology. If yahweh is omniscient, how come he didn't know that the snake was talking to the ribwoman?

How do you know that He didn't know?

Mr_Anony:
So you agree that the theophany is infront of multitudes of people[b] your problem is really that you are not among that multitude[/b]

No,do you comprehend at all??!! Multitudes of people at the same time will include me and it won't be excused as the hallucinations of one person.

Mr_Anony: How do you know that He didn't know?

And they heard the sound of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day(lol, is the creator of the sun concerned about hot weather?), and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the Lord God among the trees of the garden.

9 Then the Lord God called to Adam and said to him, “Where are you?”( his omniscience deosn't know)

10 So he said, “I heard Your voice in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked; and I hid myself.”

11 And He said, “Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree of which I commanded you that you should not eat?” (very omniscient)

12 Then the man said, “The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I ate.”

13 And the Lord God said to the woman, “What is this you have done?”( the dude asks a lot of questions for someone with omniscience)

The woman said, “The serpent deceived me, and I ate.”

musKeeto:
Well, maybe Yahweh already planned for me to go to hell, cos for months before dropping Christianity, I studied the Bible, asked him for answers and came up with nothing. If He has given you answers, I hold no grudges. He's our creator, right?

Am happy 2 really hear dt u were once a christian!u mind if I wanna know wat u ask God 2 do 4 u?so I might intercede on ur behalf?b honest wit me,k

Martian:

No,do you comprehend at all??!! Multitudes of people at the same time will include me and it won't be excused as the hallucinations of one person.

Actually He did that when He came, lived, died on the cross, rose from the dead after three days, and ascended into Heaven. This particular "theophany" lasted more than 30 years and still some doubted.
Now you are demanding that God show up again just because you feel like it? Perhaps He should appear every 10 years just in case people like martian forget.
Dude, what you are really asking is that God succumb to your will. Unfortunately for you, you'll need to be more powerful that God to rightfully make that demand.

Martian:

And they heard the sound of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day(lol, is the creator of the sun concerned about hot weather?), and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the Lord God among the trees of the garden.

9 Then the Lord God called to Adam and said to him, “Where are you?”( his omniscience deosn't know)

10 So he said, “I heard Your voice in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked; and I hid myself.”

11 And He said, “Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree of which I commanded you that you should not eat?” (very omniscient)

12 Then the man said, “The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I ate.”

13 And the Lord God said to the woman, “What is this you have done?”( the dude asks a lot of questions for someone with omniscience)

The woman said, “The serpent deceived me, and I ate.”

Of course, because every question you ask is born from ignorance. Perhaps rhetorical questions also don't exist in your worldview. What a pathetic way to make a point.

Mr Anony, what do you consider as religion?? And why Christianity isn't one against general beliefs.

Mr_Anony:
Actually He did that when He came, lived, died on the cross, rose from the dead after three days, and ascended into Heaven. This particular "theophany" lasted more than 30 years and still some doubted.
Now you are demanding that God show up again just because you feel like it? Perhaps He should appear every 10 years just in case people like martian forget.
Dude, what you are really asking is that God succumb to your will. Unfortunately for you, you'll need to be more powerful that God to rightfully make that demand.

Ishtar also came down from heaven and tried to seduce Gilgamesh.

Nevertheless, here you're trying to redefine theophany like you you tried to do with slavery. Jesus' story wasn't a theophany.

Martian:

I guffawed when I read this part.

So according to you, god won't appear because he has already destined me for his torture chamber.

that was to humour you. Good to know you are aware of the torture chamber.

And despite the fact that theophany is part of his nature, it will contradict his his will and ontology if he appears in front of multitudes?

You can walk, why have you not chosen to walk from lagos to kano? you can eat, why have you not chosen to eat a live-lizard?
God can, but by the liberty of His consciousness, He chooses not to.

You're just "assuming" that, that is the way your god feels because you're god feelings are the same as yours. Even the so called theophany in eodus never happened..............even the jews admit that there is no evidence that they ever roamed the desert with their tribal god.
Anyway,if god can't perform a theophany, then he isn't omnipotent.

Whats your point?

Mr_Anony:
Of course, because every question you ask is born from ignorance. Perhaps rhetorical questions also don't exist in your worldview. What a pathetic way to make a point.

So "where are you" is a rhetorical question?

Didn't his omniscience know they were hiding after talking to a snake..........lol talking snakes.

noetic16:
that was to humour you. Good to know you are aware of the torture chamber.
You can walk, why have you not chosen to walk from lagos to kano? you can eat, why have you not chosen to eat a live-lizard?
God can, but by the liberty of His consciousness, He chooses not to.

Of course he chooses not to. He chooses not to because he resides in your mind and "God's" will, ontology and convictions are whatever you want them to be.

Martian:
So "where are you" is a rhetorical question?
Didn't his omniscience know they were hiding after talking to a snake..........lol talking snakes.

lol, this doesn't even deserve an answer

Mr_Anony:
lol, this doesn't even deserve an answer

lmao, be original with your responses.....but that would be be difficult for someone who believes in talking snakes

Is your black a$$ going to be an obedient slave to your jewish masters in heaven.............sorry, not "slavery" but "service"

Martian:

lmao, be original with your responses.....but that would be be difficult for someone who believes in talking snakes

Is your black a$$ going to be an obedient slave to your jewish masters in heaven.............sorry, not "slavery" but "service"

Lol, I didn't know your comments were now patented. Why so insecure?

Mr_Anony:
Lol, I didn't know your comments were now patented. Why so insecure?

you had no resonable reply to talking snakes and were trying to be clever........... not exactly in your stong suit. lol

Martian:

you had no resonable reply to talking snakes and were trying to be clever........... not exactly in your stong suit. lol

Lol, why should I argue with you over whether a snake talked or not when you already don't believe in miracles or a supernatural? What you refuse to believe is simply your problem.

Mr_Anony:
Lol, why should I argue with you over whether a snake talked or not when you already don't believe in miracles or a supernatural? What you refuse to believe is simply your problem.

Lol, don't expect you to argue either because only crazy people think snakes talk.Besides you're just a deluded negro who should have been born an obedient slave on a plantation somewhere..........like it commands in the bible.

Martian:

Lol, don't expect you to argue either because only crazy people think snakes talk.Besides you're just a deluded negro who should have been born an obedient slave on a plantation somewhere..........like it commands in the bible.

I think we have now slipped from the realm of the logical to the realm of insults. I won't go down that road with you. You are welcome to the last word.

Mr_Anony:
I think we have now slipped from the realm of the logical to the realm of insults. I won't go down that road with you. You are welcome to the last word.

Slipped from the realm of the logical? As if your views involve any ounce of logic. Isn't that what faith is for?( that is a rhetorical question) lol

Mr_Anony:

What Martian is demanding is unreasonable as it reduces God to some sort of mechanism that can be summoned at will, somewhat like a genie from a magic lamp.........but God is not subject to mans will.
What martian wants as proof for God cannot be God. What Martian wants is an idol.

Mr_Anony:
Martian wants proof on his terms but God is not subject to Martian's terms.

Judges 6:36-40

King James Version (KJV)

36 And Gideon said unto God, If thou wilt save Israel by mine hand, as thou hast said,

37 Behold, I will put a fleece of wool in the floor; and if the dew be on the fleece only, and it be dry upon all the earth beside, then shall I know that thou wilt save Israel by mine hand, as thou hast said.

38 And it was so: for he rose up early on the morrow, and thrust the fleece together, and wringed the dew out of the fleece, a bowl full of water.

39 And Gideon said unto God, Let not thine anger be hot against me, and I will speak but this once: let me prove, I pray thee, but this once with the fleece; let it now be dry only upon the fleece, and upon all the ground let there be dew.

40 And God did so that night: for it was dry upon the fleece only, and there was dew on all the ground.

Martian, change your name to Gideon.

davidylan:

If the basis for morality is left to the individual then why do you put a child s[i]e[/i]x offender in prison? Afterall his own standards for morality might just include underage s[i]e[/i]x no?

Because there is a difference between law and morality.

Mr_Anony:
Lol, I am doing nothing of the sort, I believe Martian will be convicted of the Holy Spirit in God's time.
What Martian is demanding is unreasonable as it reduces God to some sort of mechanism that can be summoned at will, somewhat like a genie from a magic lamp.........but God is not subject to mans will.
What martian wants as proof for God cannot be God. What Martian wants is an idol.

Every time you come up with you non arguments you end up shooting your self in the foot. . .Your god was summoned at will in the bible, no?. . .Remember Elijah and the prophets of baal? He was summoned to prove his superiority against the other gods, no?. . .God is not subject to man's will but he was subject to the will of the ancient jews, no?. . .Why is it that your god ONLY does incredible things in the pages of a story book?. . .

mazaje:

Every time you come up with you non arguments you end up shooting your self in the foot. . .Your god was summoned at will in the bible, no?. . .Remember Elijah and the prophets of baal? He was summoned to prove his superiority against the other gods, no?. . .God is not subject to man's will but he was subject to the will of the ancient jews, no?. . .Why is it that your god ONLY does incredible things in the pages of a story book?. . .

As expected, you have come up with another theory laden with a pre-assumption. How does the story of Elijah prove that God is subject to man's will? Elijah believed in God. He called God and God answered. It was God's choice whether He wished to answer or not. Others have called God at some times and He chose not to answer. If God didn't answer, He would still have been God. You are only speculating as usual.

@ mazaje, concerning these religionists, you need to understand....

Mr_Anony:
As expected, you have come up with another theory laden with a pre-assumption. How does the story of Elijah prove that God is subject to man's will? Elijah believed in God. He called God and God answered. It was God's choice whether He wished to answer or not. Others have called God at some times and He chose not to answer. If God didn't answer, He would still have been God. You are only speculating as usual.

He didn't answer because he is imaginary and COULD NOT answer; but smart Christians like you have been very good at making excuses for him.

simple and plain

Mr_Anony:
As expected, you have come up with another theory laden with a pre-assumption. How does the story of Elijah prove that God is subject to man's will? Elijah believed in God. He called God and God answered. It was God's choice whether He wished to answer or not. Others have called God at some times and He chose not to answer. If God didn't answer, He would still have been God. You are only speculating as usual.

You clearly stated that your god can not be summoned at will because that takes him of the god category. . .I clearly showed you where he was summoned at will to prove himself just the way martins talked about and you are here blabbing and throwing more excuses. . .In the pages of story books which happen to be the only place where your god exist, he is always doing incredible things, he can be summoned at will to prove himself, Elija summoned him at will. . . Gideon and many others. . .In fact in the pages of story book were read that your god once addressed men through public speech. . .God is the same yesterday to day and forever no?. . .Keep on making excuses. . .If your god truly exist you will NOT be here telling us about his existence and what he wants because you have failed miserably, he will do it himself. . .