ijawkid:

Little questions for you??

Do the words hell and hell fire mean d same thing

What about the lake of fire?
What is it?

What does everlasting fire mean??

Where is adam and eve the chief rebels of God??

I wanna know where adam and eve are now as we speak......

When exactly was hell fire created if it is infact a real place ?

@ least we know in d beginning God created the heavens,what about hell fire??


If persons will spend eternity burning in hell and still be alive then it means @ d end of the day both evil doers have d prospect of living forever....



You forget that d gift God gives is everlasting life,but d wages of sin is death......
Romans 6:23


And there is no way evil doers are gonna get that gift wether in torment or in enjoyment


Answer these questions my bro...

cyrexx: @ alexleo,
can you reconcile the idea of a good God according to the Bible with what you had been teaching here. you urself, can you stand to witness a man screaming in pain for billions and billions of years and offering no help to such a person, even though you have the full capacity to do so, does the crime of rational thinking enough to justify this hell you are describing. that is not justice, that is sheer wickedness. you might say God didnt create it for man, but he still send people there according to your beliefs.

i'm sure you yourself are scared of hell that is why you close your eyes to this glaring wickedness you are ascribing to God according to your understanding of the Bible. a true God(if there is one, anyway) will not threaten his creatures like this. open ur mind and think for second. and stop this hell-mongering business.

imagine a man that proposes love to a lady and says "i love you so much that i will lay down my life for you, pls believe me for what i'm saying. BUT if you dont believe, i have a secret torture chamber originally created for my enemy. i will lock you there forever with no hope of escaping at all, even if you eventually realise that i love and you change your mind about me, i will never forgive you for disbelieveing me. NEVER."
tell me is that love. which right thinking woman will willingly chose to marry such man

the truth you dont know is that Paul and the New Testament authors invented the notion of Hell to control people. (Islamic religion later adopted it too, cos it works in controlling their followers).Theologians today still debate whether it is a state of mind, or a real place, and whether souls really burn in it. Parents, ministers, pastors, clerics, and priests, don’t seem to debate it. Hell works great for them and they throw it around to scare everyone. Pastors love hell. Parents love hell. Televangelists love hell. For all of them, it makes their job easier and takes away much of the need to explain right and wrong. its simple: don’t do what I say and you’ll go to hell. None of them will question why God did not tell the Chinese, the Jews, Africans, Asians, Indians, or anyone born before the Apostle Paul about hell. It works too well for them to consider that it was made up for their benefit.

alexleo:

Hell is the same thing as what we sometimes call hell fire in the sense that if you read the story of the rich man lazarus in the book of john 16: 22-31 you ll see that-
1. Hell is real.
2. Its a place of torment.
3. The rich man in hell said he was tormented by the flame
4. The man in hell also requested Abraham to send one from among the dead to go and preach to His 5 brothers that are still alive.
My brother dont allow the enemy to deceive you about this thing. There is no death that is worse than the spirit man being in everlasting torment of the lake of fire.
Lake of fire is the final place for both satan and sinners where they will burn forever after the final judgment. Even death will be cast there too.
All this flimsy explanations you people are here giving about hell is the devil' deceit. Why dont you keep yourself pure at all times thru the blood of Jesus and free yourself from the fear of hell which is probably why you are trying to paint an easy picture of hell.
Or you think that God will change things because you dont see it the way it is?

buzugee: the story of lazarus is not real. it is a parable


par·a·ble   [par-uh-buhl]
noun
1.
a short allegorical story designed to illustrate or teach some truth, religious principle, or moral lesson.
2.
a statement or comment that conveys a meaning indirectly by the use of comparison, analogy, or the like.

alexleo:


My friend go and read that portion again. There was no mention of parable there. Wherever Jesus told a parable in the bible it was clearly indicated that its a parable. It usually starts with - 'and he told them a parable'. Did you see any such statement in this portion?
Again did Abraham not exist as a man in the bible times and did Lazarus not exist too? So why are you talking as if they were just ficticious names that never existed but were used for illustrations only?
Its a pity how you people are panel beating the bible just to satisfy your whims and caprices.
Go and read John 16: 21-31 again.

belabela: @ Poster,

Let me shock you by saying there is nothing like Hellfire. There is hell and there is lake of fire. They are two different things according to the bible.
According to the bible when a man dies he goes into a place of the dead.This is generally called Hades.(Notes Hades is sometimes used interchangeably as grave). Hades as a place where the souls of the dead go is divided into two parts - Hell and paradise.
Hell is a place of torment ( that may include fire, flames, bugs, worms,etc) according to Jesus (Luke 16:23) but it will be emptied on the great day of the Lord. All the souls in hell will be resurrected and they shall be given their body.

The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. - Revelation 20:13

They will be judged and then thrown into the lake of fire. So they will be thrown into the lake of fire in their body.

Hell is not a place where Satan lives. It is a place where the souls of unrighteous men are kept until the day of judgement. Satan himself would be thrown into the lake of fire.

And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. - Rev. 20:10

If anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire. - Rev. 20:15

That's what the bible says. I know there are many popular lies out there but just get a bible and your questions are answered there

alexleo:

Hell is the same thing as what we sometimes call hell fire in the sense that if you read the story of the rich man lazarus in the book of john 16: 22-31 you ll see that-
1. Hell is real.
2. Its a place of torment.
3. The rich man in hell said he was tormented by the flame
4. The man in hell also requested Abraham to send one from among the dead to go and preach to His 5 brothers that are still alive.
My brother dont allow the enemy to deceive you about this thing. There is no death that is worse than the spirit man being in everlasting torment of the lake of fire.
Lake of fire is the final place for both satan and sinners where they will burn forever after the final judgment. Even death will be cast there too.
All this flimsy explanations you people are here giving about hell is the devil' deceit. Why dont you keep yourself pure at all times thru the blood of Jesus and free yourself from the fear of hell which is probably why you are trying to paint an easy picture of hell.
Or you think that God will change things because you dont see it the way it is?

buzugee:

hades is another name for GRAVE.

Physical death will remain but you will live to be as old as trees ( i am guessing a tree lives to a thousand years like it was in the beginning like methuselah and them ) instead of the 120 years maximum we have now ( genesis 6 vs 3 ) ( isaiah 65 vs 22 )

satan is not a seperate entity. satan resides in every man. everyman has a satanic and a holy spirit. this is how you can indulge your freewill. when Jesus was being tempted by satan do you think some man named satan walked up to him and started talking to him and tempting him ? that was him fighting temptations within himself. christ was fighting his own satanic side and he prospered.

america is a special place because it is the light bearer of the world. it is lucifer. it controls and runs the world. over 200 million native americans and over 100 million negros were slaughtered to establish the place. scripture says america is the home to every vile and hateful spirit in the world. this is why america has a special date with destruction and extinction. read the book of jeremiah, isaiah and revelation. you will get a proper insight

and let me complete that your last statement. it goes like this ' death and hell will be thrown in the lake of fire when christ kingdom is established on earth ' this translates symbolically to ' spiritual death and suffering will be eliminated when christ rules the earth ' basically hell will be transformed to heaven. no more pain and suffering. pain and suffering make conditions on earth a hellish existence. this will stop when christ establishes his kingdom. so in essence hell will be cast into the lake of fire. hell is a condition on earth that will be eradicated when christ reign on earth. as well as spiritual death ( death) cuz as explained earlier, faith will no longer be a requirement because you will see him. this will eradicate lack of faith which causes spiritual death.

cyrexx:
i am not an atheist, but such a wicked God you are describing does not deserve any true worship or recognition. even African Gods dont threaten hell fire.

jmoore:

what do you offer? You are not this, you are not that. It seems you can't even communicate to whatever you believe in. Always stating what your god should be able to do, who is your god?

cyrexx:

i dont have a god. im not an atheist in the sense of stating that "there is no God"
i believe if there is God. he is definitely not the one described by Bible or Quran, who burns men alive for eternity.
i am what you will describe as an agnostic.
i have not found any evidence to prove the existence of God. but i am open to the possiblity of an Intelligent Designer of Nature

you nko, what do you offer.

jmoore:

I am a christian, my message is that of Jesus Christ.

Like you said above, your god can't create hell. How do you know he can't create hell? You have [b]setup boundaries that your god [/b]must not cross for him to be god. How can a creature set a standard for the creator?

How open are you to a true God? Everything that needs to be said has been said over and over again. Ask and you shall receive, many have done it and God revealed himself to them.

cyrexx:

where did i make such statements you accused me of (bolded)
I thought Christians dont lie
i just told you subscribe to no god, doesn't mean Intelligent Deigner MAY not be

cyrexx: i believe if there is God. he is definitely not the one described by Bible or Quran, who burns men alive for eternity.

ijawkid:

Grave will go away but physical death will remain??v?

How come?

If there are no graves,then there should be no death....

Or do u hope some1 would die in Gods kingdom
Lol


Yes in Gods kingdom our life span would be like that of a tree in that we will love forever....

The only thing hindering us from living forver is death and it is that death that will be thrown into d lake of fire....

Meaning death will be swallowed up forever,meaning there will be no more death(rev 21:3 $ 4)........

Like I asked u na for america too wey death either spiritual or physical would be thrown into??
Lol....


Abi america na gehenna?
Lol

I agree wit ur point to an extent but the america as d location is where I dis agree....

Everlasting destruction is what d lake of fire symbolizes....

Because america too will be thrown into d lake of fire too....

Jenwitemi: If the burning is happening in the spiritual form, how will the pain be felt since spirits do not possess tactile sensors to feel anything, never mind unbearable pain of burning.

Jenwitemi: A small sketch:

The christian God is twisting the arm of one of his beloved creation, a man.

BIBLE GOD: Love me!!

MAN; Aaaaaaargh!!! (in excruciating pain)

BIBLE GOD: Love me, bi-tch!!! (twisting the poor man's arm even more)

MAN: Aaaaaaaaaaaaargh!!!! You are hurting me!!!

BIBLE GOD: What? You think that hurts?! How about some FIRE?!

cyrexx: i wish not to derail this thread, several threads have dealt with the issue of Intelligent Design/Evolution/Creation story.

what i am saying is that, to me as a[b] free thinking agnostic[/b], the idea of Vindictive God described by christians is unnacceptable to me, and i give rational proofs (check my earlier posts)

we are talking about eternal hell here, not creation. do you believe hell is eternal and never ending continual excruciating pain made by God to punish people without hope of ever finishing their sentence. i need a yes or no.

emöfine2:

Interesting point...perhaps “hellfire” is just a metaphor i.e. if one lost everything and everyone they loved they may accord that a state of being in hell (at least that was one out of many definitions of this supposed hell that was offered to me by an orthodox)

Just curious do you reckon spirits possess sentiments? i.e. joy/sorrow etc Or would they just exhibit one state of emotion?



Lol..."he" should have used reverse psychology.

I think there is a propaganda when it comes to the preaching of hell and that may have affected the image of the biblical god.

alexleo:

[size=15pt]Again you are deceiving yourself here. Read John 16: 21- 31. Psalm 16:10. Mathew 10:28. This were the words of Jesus in the new testament so dont talk about paul using hell to scare you. Was it also paul that wrote the book of psalm and even the book of Matthew and John?
You said that for years people have been dying and none of them has come back to life to say that there is another life after death. Havent you read of several testimonies of people who had a near death experience and some others who were clinically proven dead who later came back to life to testify that heaven and hell are real did you believe any of them? There were even testimonies posted here sometime ago of an atheist who had this same experience and came back to life and repented did you atheists believe? Does this not confirm what was written in John 16 that i asked you to read where the rich man was told that even if one of the dead was sent to go and talk to his brothers they still will not believe. What you people are doing is equivalent to somebody in Nigeria protesting against a policy of the US president. The person ends up wasting his time because his protest will neither scratch Obama nor remove him as president. If you like protest against God all the days of your life. When you die you will see that you only did your self harm and you face the consequences.
And if you think am afraid of hell you are missing it. The bible says - " there is therefore no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. It is when your relationship with God is stained with sin that you become afraid of hell.
God made it clear that He is a God of mercy and God of judgment so why are you now quoting that he said he is God of love only. What about the Judgment aspect? You people are deceiving yourselves. Jesus said that there are two ways, one is the broad way that leads to destruction and another is the narrow way that leads to eternal life. He then said that we should follow the narrow way even though there are few that follow it unlike the broad way that has many people following it. The issue of somebody going to hell is not God that choose for you. It is the choice that you make while alive that determines where you end up. If you walk in the broad way surely you end up in hell and if you walk in the narrow way you end up in heaven period. If you want to go to Lagos from Enugu and you follow the way that leads to porthacourt you will definitely find yourself in ph. This things are clear but you people are just hiding in your deceit. [/size]

cyrexx: .

buzugee: you have to be mindful what bible you read. do you read the KJV ? because hades and hell and grave are used interchangeably in some bibles. take for example http://bible.cc/acts/2-27.htm look at all the interpretations in that verse, some bible call it hades, some hell, some grave.

grave will not go away, suffering ( hell ) will go away. you will still die but after you have lived to the age of a tree ( methuselah type age ) ISAIAH 65 VS 22 "They will not build and another inhabit, They will not plant and another eat; For as the lifetime of a tree, so will be the days of My people, And My chosen ones will wear out the work of their hands. SO IF YOU MAKE IT TO THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN ON EARTH, THIS IS WHAT YOU CAN LOOK FORWARD TO. A LONG LIFE.

NO YOU WILL NOT LIVE FOREVER IN GODS KINGDOM -ISAIAH 65 VS 20[b] “Never again will there be in it an infant who lives but a few days,or an old man who does not live out his years; the one who fails to reach[a] a hundred will be considered accursed.[/b] ( THIS IS DESCRIBING LIFE ON EARTH ( HEAVEN ) WHEN CHRIST IS RULING FROM JERUSALEM. NOBODY LIVES FOREVER. BUT THERE WILL NO LONGER BE INFANT DEATHS OR OLD MEN NOT LIVING OUT THEIR YEARS. YOU THOUGHT YOU WOULD LIVE FOREVER ?

THE DEATH THAT WILL BE THROWN IN THE LAKE OF FIRE IS SPIRITUAL DEATH NOT PHYSICAL DEATH. YOU HAVE A LOT OF SPIRITUALLY DEAD PEOPLE WALKING AROUND CALLING THEMSELVES ATHEISTS. THESE PEOPLE WILL NOT EXIST WHEN CHRIST RETURNS. THEY WILL BE DESTROYED OR RENEWED. ( THIS IS A SYMBOLIC STATEMENT. ANYTIME YOU SEE LAKE OF FIRE USED IT MEANS WHATEVER IS ASSOCIATED WITH IT WILL BE TOTALLY ERADICATED AND DESTROYED )

REVELATION 21 VS 4 ; YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL NOT TO INTERPRET THE BIBLE LITERALLY. THAT VERSE SAYS GOD WILL WIPE AWAY THEIR TEARS AND THEIR SHALL BE NO MORE DEATH AND PAIN AND SORROW. THIS IS SPIRITUAL DEATH NOT PHYSICAL DEATH. ALL THESE EMOTIONS ARE SPIRITUAL EMOTIONS. GOD ONLY DEALS WITH THE SPIRIT. MAN DEALS WITH THE BODY. YOUR SPIRIT IS THE ONE THAT SORROWS AND MOURNS AND PAINS AND DIES. WHEN YOUR SPIRIT DIES, IT MEANS IT IS ISOLATED FROM GOD AND LEFT IN DARKNESS. GOD HAS REJECTED YOUR SPIRIT AND AS SUCH YOU ARE IN SPIRITUAL DARKNESS, SPIRITUAL DEATH. WELL ALL THAT WILL STOP IN THE KINGDOM. YOU WILL FOREVER BE SPIRITUALLY CONNECTED TO GOD. ( IF THAT WAS PHYSICAL DEATH, THE BIBLE ALWAYS SPECIFIES THAT. IT SAYS STUFF LIKE, YOU WILL NO LONGER LIVE ETC ETC. BIBLE DOES NOT REFER TO PHYSICAL DEMISE AS DEATH BECAUSE PHYSICAL DEMISE IS NOT DEATH. YOUR SPIRIT STILL LIVES )

DEATH WILL BE THROWN INTO THE LAKE OF FIRE ( LIKE I SAID INITIALLY IT IS A SYMBOLIC STATEMENT ) IT MEANS SPIRITUAL DEATH WILL BE DESTROYED.

GEHENNA IS A GARBAGE COLLECTION POINT IN ANCIENT ISRAEL WHERE GARBAGE IS BURNED. THIS IS WHERE THE NAME 'HELLFIRE' CAME FROM. THIS IS THE MYTH OF HELL FIRE. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS HELLFIRE. HOWEVER THERE IS A LAKE OF FIRE THAT WILL CONSUME BABYLON.

THIS IS WHAT SPIRITUAL DEATH IS ALL ABOUT GENESIS 2 VS 17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. ( SPIRITUAL DEATH NOT PHYSICAL )

ijawkid:


Was d story about d rich man and lazarus a true story or an illustration?


What was d rich mans offense that took him to hell fire??


From that illustraion if we are to look @ it literally d way ur viewing it then it means all rich persons will go to hell fire.....

Isn't it?


Because that rich man did nothing to deserve going to d hell fire......

Also abraham is or was not in heaven when Jesus gave this story....

So back to d main discussion:::::

Is hell fire symbolic or literal??


For ur information if u shuld knw d lake of fire and hell fire are not d same things....

So also hell and hell fire are not d same things too.....


Jesus went to hell......
Do you agree


Hell is d common grave of man(hades,sheol)
Jesus stayed in hell for 3days....


Hell fire is a dogma that came after d 1st century.......

Like I said earlier with d quoting of revelations lake of fire symbolizes total destruction,2nd death...

Death itself will be thrown into d lake of fire,so how can that fire be a real one?

Death death death!!!!!!
Not literally burning up somewhere like as if its an oven....

cyrexx: .

ijawkid:

So u indirectly just cancelled d hope of eternal life here on earth....

Abi??

Please how would u explain psalms 37:29?


If we live like methuselah and then die then why did Jesus die in d 1st place?

I thought d reason was for us to gain eternal life...........

Oboy physical death will not be heard of in Gods kingdom....
Not @ alll....

Ptolomeus:
TROLL SPRAY !