₦airaland Forum

MaxInDHouse:
You can't just expect me to join you people in some fruitless arguments that's of no practical benefits. 1Timothy 6:4; Titus 3:9
©What does the Bible really teach on the topic? 2Timothy 3:16-17
©Which group of people are practicing it according? Matthew 5:13-16
©How can people identify them? Matthew 7:16-18
These are meaningful subjects that should be discussed along with the topic not just some useless, worthless and hopeless arguments. 1Corinthians 14:33

First settle with your fellow Churchgoers before calling me because i'm not part of you people, i belong to another camp totally different from all of you. John 15:19
In my own camp we are orderly and well organized therefore we have agreed on the topic globally. John 17:20-23 compare to Romans 15:5-6; 1Corinthians 1:10; Ephesians 4:3
So when you're through with your brethren then let me know exactly where i should come in because i'll speak in behalf of all my entire family of faith globally not just arguing blindly.

Thanks, God bless you and may you have PEACE!

You are only praising your church by your own standards and not God's standards, becos when you do with God's standard(word), you will find out that you do not measure up.

What God sees as his true Church or people are those obeying his commandments.

And not just those doing charity works and brotherhood.

No matter your charity,brotherly love and whatever without obeying the commandments of God,one would not go to Heaven.


1 John 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.

1 John 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

2 John 1:6 And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

MaxInDHouse:
I guess you're through with your people 'cause since we started chatting they've all deserted the thread.
Now this is how my own answer to your question will go. I'll tell you how a global group of beleivers Interpreted it, how they're PRACTICALLY APPLYING it and the benefits of their Interpretation because Jesus said "by their FRUITS you will recognize them" {Matthew 7:16} which means different religious groups may come up with different Interpretations of Jesus' message but the group that got it correctly will surely yield positive results in their gathering! Matthew 5:13-16

Now back to your question:
What is Mosaic laws and is it in the Bible?

The Mosaic laws were the 613 laws God commaded Moses to present to the nation He (God) brought out of Egypt, God will be their ruler not man so whoever wants to live in that camp which will eventually become a mighty nation must be prepared to adhere strictly to all the requirements set in those laws.
Moses is a human like all other people, he is 80 years old as at the time God gave him those laws, so the people might be thinking that this old man doesn't want them to be free after bringing them out of Egypt, the restraint may seem to high for them that's why God penned down ten out of those laws on stone tablets for the people to believe that it wasn't Moses's fabrication but God's commad!
It is called Mosaic laws because Moses was the mediator between God and the Israelites back then!

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

MaxInDHouse:
I guess you're through with your people 'cause since we started chatting they've all deserted the thread.
Now this is how my own answer to your question will go. I'll tell you how a global group of beleivers Interpreted it, how they're PRACTICALLY APPLYING it and the benefits of their Interpretation because Jesus said "by their FRUITS you will recognize them" {Matthew 7:16} which means different religious groups may come up with different Interpretations of Jesus' message but the group that got it correctly will surely yield positive results in their gathering! Matthew 5:13-16

Now back to your question:
What is Mosaic laws and is it in the Bible?

The Mosaic laws were the 613 laws God commaded Moses to present to the nation He (God) brought out of Egypt, God will be their ruler not man so whoever wants to live in that camp which will eventually become a mighty nation must be prepared to adhere strictly to all the requirements set in those laws.
Moses is a human like all other people, he is 80 years old as at the time God gave him those laws, so the people might be thinking that this old man doesn't want them to be free after bringing them out of Egypt, the restraint may seem to high for them that's why God penned down ten out of those laws on stone tablets for the people to believe that it wasn't Moses's fabrication but God's commad!
It is called Mosaic laws because Moses was the mediator between God and the Israelites back then!

Pure story telling.

Your points are baseless without facts.
I have clearly shown how God's commandments differ from Moses law in many ways,

God's 10commandments are a reflection of who God is,

It would not take God 1secs to write all the laws in the world on stones how much less 613.
But he choose to write only 10 that are different and not only writing it but commanding the people directly himself to observe,and also wrote it on an unperisharble material (stone) and preserved inside the Ark of Convenant that is below the seat of God.

Do you know that even in Heaven the 10commandments was still in the Ark of Convenant In God's temple? but no where was the law of Moses seen in Heaven.

Revelation 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.


Does that look like what God has abolished ?

Exodus 25:16 And thou shalt put into the ark the testimony which I shall give thee.

Exodus 25:21 And thou shalt put the mercy seat above upon the ark; and in the ark thou shalt put the testimony that I shall give thee.

Exodus 26:34 And thou shalt put the mercy seat upon the ark of the testimony in the most holy place.



The same laws or testimony that were put inside the Ark of Convenant are the same seen by John.

God cannot change.

MaxInDHouse:
You can't just expect me to join you people in some fruitless arguments that's of no practical benefits. 1Timothy 6:4; Titus 3:9
©What does the Bible really teach on the topic? 2Timothy 3:16-17
©Which group of people are practicing it according? Matthew 5:13-16
©How can people identify them? Matthew 7:16-18
These are meaningful subjects that should be discussed along with the topic not just some useless, worthless and hopeless arguments. 1Corinthians 14:33

First settle with your fellow Churchgoers before calling me because i'm not part of you people, i belong to another camp totally different from all of you. John 15:19
In my own camp we are orderly and well organized therefore we have agreed on the topic globally. John 17:20-23 compare to Romans 15:5-6; 1Corinthians 1:10; Ephesians 4:3
So when you're through with your brethren then let me know exactly where i should come in because i'll speak in behalf of all my entire family of faith globally not just arguing blindly.

Thanks, God bless you and may you have PEACE!

You are giving excuses inorder not to face the truth.

Back to your question.
What is Mosaic law and is it in the Bible?

MaxInDHouse:
The topic of your thread is:
"The 10Commandments And Laws Of Moses Are They The Same Law"
After arguing with your fellow Churchgoers for some times you purposely mentioned me in connection with your question.
So get it straight that if you never mentioned me here you and i have no business!


This is not the question you've been debating with others so next time before you call me THINK because as i've told you i'm not on the same page with you and your fellow Churchgoers!

So what topic where we debating?

I mentioned U with regards to the topic of the thread and not becos of what others commented.

My interest is to show you that God's 10commandments are quite different from the laws of Moses and hence the 10commandments,all of them still stand.

MaxInDHouse:
You're not consistent with your findings so you can continue arguing with your fellow Churchgoers!

When next you want to tag me along with your write-up please address me not as one of your brethren because you're not my brother in faith. Just call me out as a worshiper of the God of Jehovah's Witnesses.
When next you tag me along with your fellow Churchgoers i'll just ignore you.
I purposely came to discuss about the Mosaic laws but it's obvious you don't know what you want to ask me yet!

What has the Mosaic laws has to do with my question?

Do JW believe in the mosiac law and yet do not believe in the Christain Bible?

MaxInDHouse:
It's like the coast is clear now as your fellow argumenators you call brethren have left the thread for more than three hours.

So if you want me to chat with you on this you have to make it snappy i don't have time for fruitless arguments.

Now what exactly do you need to know about the Mosaic laws?

I asked you a question, since your god is different from the Christain god, do you guys JW still use the bible?

MaxInDHouse:
That's a welcome development! Matthew 10:25
So when you're through with your fellow Churchgoers or brethren, call me because my own God totally differ from yours!

Do your church or sect use the Christian Bible or not?

MaxInDHouse:
First settle the differences between you and your fellow Churchgoers before calling me.

Remember i am Maximus one of JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES, my own God totally differs from yours!
So when you're through with your fellow Churchgoers or brethren as you often refer to one another you can call me. My camp is no part of you people! John 15:19

May you have PEACE!

So your own God is different from the Christian God?

No wonder people call JW a cult.

livingchrist:
you are funny, the law of moses refers to those law given to the israelities through moses.

2 Chronicles 34:14
And when they brought out the money that was brought into the house of the LORD, Hilkiah the priest found a book of the law of the LORD given by Moses.

John 1:17
For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Which included the ten commandment.

So, mr blueagent, 'the law' as used in the scriptures covers both the one moses wrote and the one God wrote at mount Sinai.

The ten commandment is called the ministration of death.

2 Corinthians 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

Look at what paul said,

Galatians 3:21
Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.

According to paul, no law exist prior to the coming of Christ that could give life.
So, the ten commandment does not give life that is why Christ came to establish a new covenant.

I would not wasting my time explaining 2corinthains3:7 becos I have done more than enough in previous thread to prove that the ministration( law of Moses) is what was done away with and not the 10commandments.


It was the law of Moses that contained Ordinances and commands on how sin which is the transgression of the 10commandments was to be dealt with.

livingchrist:
you are funny, the law of moses refers to those law given to the israelities through moses.

2 Chronicles 34:14
And when they brought out the money that was brought into the house of the LORD, Hilkiah the priest found a book of the law of the LORD given by Moses.

John 1:17
For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Which included the ten commandment.

So, mr blueagent, 'the law' as used in the scriptures covers both the one moses wrote and the one God wrote at mount Sinai.

The ten commandment is called the ministration of death.

2 Corinthians 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

Look at what paul said,

Galatians 3:21
Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.

According to paul, no law exist prior to the coming of Christ that could give life.
So, the ten commandment does not give life that is why Christ came to establish a new covenant.

Even apostle Paul never referred to all the laws as the same here is evidence.

1 Corinthians 7:19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.


Circumcision is contained in the laws of Moses, while the commandments of God here is obviously the 10commandments.

Paul is telling the people that been circumcised or not what is important is keeping the commandments of God(10commandments)

livingchrist:
you are funny, the law of moses refers to those law given to the israelities through moses.

2 Chronicles 34:14
And when they brought out the money that was brought into the house of the LORD, Hilkiah the priest found a book of the law of the LORD given by Moses.

John 1:17
For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Which included the ten commandment.

So, mr blueagent, 'the law' as used in the scriptures covers both the one moses wrote and the one God wrote at mount Sinai.

The ten commandment is called the ministration of death.

2 Corinthians 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

Look at what paul said,

Galatians 3:21
Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.

According to paul, no law exist prior to the coming of Christ that could give life.
So, the ten commandment does not give life that is why Christ came to establish a new covenant.

Was the 10commandments given by God or Moses?

BassReeves:
James 2:10-11
'10For the person who keeps all of the laws except one,
is as guilty as a person who has broken all of God’s laws.
11For the same God who said, “You must not commit adultery,”
also said, “You must not murder.”
So if you murder someone but do not commit adultery, you have still broken the law.

10Whoever breaks one commandment is guilty of breaking them all.
11 For the same one who said, “Do not commit adultery,”
also said, “Do not commit murder.”
Even if you do not commit adultery, you have become a lawbreaker if you commit murder.'

More evidence.

If all the laws (10commandments and laws of Moses) must be obeyed, than why is Paul preaching to the people that Circumcision is not important but keeping of God's commandments.

We know that Circumcision is contained in the laws of Moses and the 10commandments were given by God.

Does it mean that Paul is teaching something contrary to God's word? Or he knows that both laws are different and have different timelines


Romans 2:25 For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.

Romans 2:26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?

Romans 2:27 And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

Romans 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?

Romans 3:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

1 Corinthians 7:19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

livingchrist:
you are funny, the law of moses refers to those law given to the israelities through moses.

2 Chronicles 34:14
And when they brought out the money that was brought into the house of the LORD, Hilkiah the priest found a book of the law of the LORD given by Moses.

John 1:17
For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Which included the ten commandment.

So, mr blueagent, 'the law' as used in the scriptures covers both the one moses wrote and the one God wrote at mount Sinai.

The ten commandment is called the ministration of death.

2 Corinthians 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

Look at what paul said,

Galatians 3:21
Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.

According to paul, no law exist prior to the coming of Christ that could give life.
So, the ten commandment does not give life that is why Christ came to establish a new covenant.

You are still referring banishing law as all the laws.

That yours trick to cover your false lies.

Is like me saying the laws in Nigeria has been abolished when what was abolished was only the laws regulating food.

Does it make sense?

You have not shown any evidence that the law when used in the Bible refers to all the laws.

That's childish for one to assume.

Where did I write that the 10commandments give life?

Of course Paul in Galatians 3:21 was referring to the Laws of Moses not the 10commandments.

BassReeves:
James 2:10-11
'10For the person who keeps all of the laws except one,
is as guilty as a person who has broken all of God’s laws.
11For the same God who said, “You must not commit adultery,”
also said, “You must not murder.”
So if you murder someone but do not commit adultery, you have still broken the law.

10Whoever breaks one commandment is guilty of breaking them all.
11 For the same one who said, “Do not commit adultery,”
also said, “Do not commit murder.”
Even if you do not commit adultery, you have become a lawbreaker if you commit murder.'

You just read out of context.

"All the law" here is the 10commandments he is referring to , he also gave examples by quoting 2 of the laws "Thou shall not murder" and " thou shall not commit adultery"

The 10commandments is a set of laws and hence it can be called "All".

Apostle James also concluded by commanding us to keep the law.

James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law. 2:12 So speak ye, and SO DO, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.



James 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

You ignored that.

He was not referring to the entire laws in the Bible.

More evidence is given here by Paul equating one loving God and his neighbours as keeping the 10commandments.


Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.


Do you want us to believe that Paul and God wanted us to obey none or few of the law, hence love God and our neighbours partially?

Goshen360:
If the 10 commandments is different from the law of Moses, how come you break one law is equal to break all?

Where is it written, that when you break one you break all?

Dtruthspeaker:
See, now you have altered the question.

You asked only 1 question, as seen below



I answered, as the records show,
" as Lawyer Paul told you, THE PRIEST TO UNDERTAKE THE SACRIFICE TOO MUST BE CLEAN (SANCTIFIED/HOLY), so where is a dirty sinner gonna find a clean priest that is to help him carry out the sin sacrifice?

FOR THE PRIESTS TOO ARE DEFILED AND DIRTY AND UNHOLY!

This is where Christ is better than The Priests for He Can Not Be Unholy IN FULFILMENT OF THE LAW!"

Now that I have finished giving the answer, and you could not rebut.

You then Lied by saying that I did not answer your question. I then showed you your question for you to see that there is only ONE Question.

Now you are still maintaining your Lie that I did not answer whereas, I have truly answered,THEN YOU HAVE FRAUDULENTLY ADDED A SECOND QUESTION (why I we not expected to do circumcision)WHICH WAS NOT THERE IN THE BEGINNING.

Even in a simple thing as a dispute, you are not above Lying, Scheming and Cheating, how then shall you be when you are entrusted with little?

Yet, you would claim that you are a Christ Follower and not a Law Breaker and you expect that God should take you into His Kingdom.

After all these, it is apparent why you would seek to Dispose God's own Law, because, you already know that you shall never obey them, so you have made a way for thy own self, as is in your power.

You can continue in your own way, I bother you no more. (I hope!)

You think you are smart?

So does that mean that Moses law is still in effect?

Dtruthspeaker:
See, now you have altered the question.

You asked only 1 question, as seen below



I answered, as the records show,
" as Lawyer Paul told you, THE PRIEST TO UNDERTAKE THE SACRIFICE TOO MUST BE CLEAN (SANCTIFIED/HOLY), so where is a dirty sinner gonna find a clean priest that is to help him carry out the sin sacrifice?

FOR THE PRIESTS TOO ARE DEFILED AND DIRTY AND UNHOLY!

This is where Christ is better than The Priests for He Can Not Be Unholy IN FULFILMENT OF THE LAW!"

Now that I have finished giving the answer, and you could not rebut.

You then Lied by saying that I did not answer your question. I then showed you your question for you to see that there is only ONE Question.

Now you are still maintaining your Lie that I did not answer whereas, I have truly answered,THEN YOU HAVE FRAUDULENTLY ADDED A SECOND QUESTION (why I we not expected to do circumcision)WHICH WAS NOT THERE IN THE BEGINNING.

Even in a simple thing as a dispute, you are not above Lying, Scheming and Cheating, how then shall you be when you are entrusted with little?

Yet, you would claim that you are a Christ Follower and not a Law Breaker and you expect that God should take you into His Kingdom.

After all these, it is apparent why you would seek to Dispose God's own Law, because, you already know that you shall never obey them, so you have made a way for thy own self, as is in your power.

You can continue in your own way, I bother you no more. (I hope!)

You are really confused.


Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law. 7:13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.

MaxInDHouse's,livingchrist.

I wrote this article to disprove your arguments that God has abolished his 10commandments together with the law of Moses and to show that both laws are separate.

You cannot claim you have not seen the evidence or facts.

Dtruthspeaker:
I have fully answered the question because if I did not, you would have raised up the REMAINING PART of the question, WHICH YOU HAD ASKED, Which I have not yet answered, by now.

But, because I fully did answer it, you did not have any REMAINING question, in your question, "why are we not required to scarifice lambs for sin?" For there is none.

You did not answer me, If the law of Moses is still valid, why our we not expected to do circumcision and offer lamb for sin?

Dtruthspeaker:
as Lawyer Paul told you, THE PRIEST TO UNDERTAKE THE SACRIFICE TOO MUST BE CLEAN (SANCTIFIED/HOLY), so where is a dirty sinner gonna find a clean priest that is to help him carry out the sin sacrifice?

FOR THE PRIESTS TOO ARE DEFILED AND DIRTY AND UNHOLY!

This is where Christ is better than The Priests for He Can Not Be Unholy in fulfilment of The Law!

You are yet to finish.
You have not answered my question fully.

HedwigesMaduro:
How many times was tithes paid before the law of Moses? With examples. Also, how many of those were commanded by God?

I just gave you two examples,Abraham and Jacob.
2 men God spoke to directly and had personal convenant with.
Do you think those men did it by their own inspiration?

Hebrews 7:5 And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:

Hebrews 7:6 But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.

Hebrews 7:9 And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.

HedwigesMaduro:
Stoning adulterers was commanded by Go in the Bible too. Why are you not doing that now?
The mental gymnastics that you guys go through to come to the conclusion that Christ was asking His followers to pay tithes using that scripture you quoted is beyond mind boggling.

And which law contained that?, I mean the stoning of sins.

The 10commandments or the laws of Moses?

Do you know that paying of tithes was done before God gave the 10commandments and the law of Moses?


Abraham paid tithes and Jacob did so.


Genesis 14:20 And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And he gave him tithes of all.


Genesis 28:17 And he was afraid, and said, How dreadful is this place! this is none other but the house of God, and this is the gate of heaven. 28:20 And Jacob vowed a vow, saying, If God will be with me, and will keep me in this way that I go, and will give me bread to eat, and raiment to put on, 28:21 So that I come again to my father's house in peace; then shall the LORD be my God: 28:22 And this stone, which I have set for a pillar, shall be God's house: and of all that thou shalt give me I will surely give the tenth unto thee.

You can prove to us that Jesus was saying otherwise.

Dtruthspeaker:
I never said you said, "man created law", I clearly said "Where do you think Law comes from?"

Now that you admit that The Law comes from God and not man, therefore I can definitely talk about those Laws.

Which I have raised up for you to examine yourself to which you can now see that you do not have any thing valid to say in opposition of those clear Facts.



Now you can see, you Truly have nothing valid to say so like Jws and atheists, you see you are clearly conered therefore, you are only expressing your wish and desire to be rid of God's Laws.

See another example, God Cursed women in Genesis 3, till tomorrow, women have issues with conception and are always going to be lesser than men as God had Law's.

"In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread" all of these Laws are still running till tomorrow, men sweat to eat.

Genesis 9, God Law'd that we could eat both herbs and flesh.

None of these Laws were revoked and till tomorrow they remain in force.

Unless and Until The Law Giver Directly and Expressly Revokes His Law, The Law will continue to be in Force!

You confusing yourself and mixing things up.

My focus and yours should be on the 10commandments and the laws of Moses.

If the law should still be in force, then why are we not required to scarifice lambs for sin?

HedwigesMaduro:
Are the laws involving tithes also good examples on such contextual reading?

Paying Tithes are commanded by God in the Bible, even in new testament Jesus still acknowledge payment of tithes.

Matthew 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. Luke 11:42 But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

ObiOfOnistha:
Not really

How?
What is not really God's law or that it was not abolished?

Dtruthspeaker:
Where do you think Law comes from? Did Adam or your father bring Law with him?

Do you not see that Adam was under Law already and that Law was applied to him when he broke it?

You ought not be nasty even if it is because you do not have any valid counter to make and you are unable bear the real-eyeity of it.

I never said man created law, what I mean is that you should stop explaining God's law using human limited knowledge or scope.

There is sufficient evidence showing that God annuled the laws of Moses, but the 10commandments would exist for all eternity.

Dtruthspeaker:
Yes, I am! I think I did tell you before in your other thread of the righteousness of The Law where I also showed you the connection that Christ, is Also The Law.

That's what lawyers have seen and made many of them stop practicing Law or bend their practice of law, for they saw that they were doing their rubbishes right in front of God's Eyes.

Thus, based on the highlight, I respectfully say you are making an uninformed error because by the Eyes and Power of The Law, they are One.

If you had stuck to the differences you have observed alone it would have been perfect.

But because you supplied your interpretation of it, you set yourself at variance with me and other lawyers here, for your interpretation fell into errors because of you do not know the other laws which you trespassed and shall trespass in giving your interpretation.

The 10 Commandments is a Short Summary and Direction of the All Encompassing Body of Laws given to Moses.

Therefore, from Leviticus 20 till Deuteronomy when Moses made an end of writing out the Instructions, (Commandments), all these form the Single Document which we would have called "The Constitution of The Peoples of Israel and the earth (The Law of Nations)" as we call that unlawful, illegal and no power man made and issued law "the Nigerian constitution, U.S Constitution etc".

Therefore, under your limited knowledge of Law, you erroneously say that God "did away" his Law, which in the Eye of Law, that Never ever Happened.

For the practice of Law comes from God Too and Every Move He made, we lawyers, know The Law He was applying and why He Did so.

Which is why, there are several examples of when He gave a Law and when He Repealed that Law, plus when He Amended/Altered a Law

Examples of Laws Issued and Repealed and Amended
1) Genesis 1:26,28 and 29 (Law Issued)
Amended and Repealed in Genesis 9:1 (Dominion in Genesis 1:26 and 28 was repealed and replaced (amended) with "the fear of you and the dread of you"

2) Genesis 1:29 was amended to include the eating of flesh in Genesis 9:3 where men then were only able to eat fruits and herbs (vegetables)

3) Genesis 3:17 "Curse of the ground only" (other curses remain in force) was amended in Genesis 8:21.

All these were done in accordance with The Laws of "Repeals and Amendments of Laws" which you would not know.

Therefore, God never repealed The Commandments, neither the Preamble (The Preamble having 10 Paragraphs) nor the Encompassing Body of Laws, For God is A God of Law and He Shall Definitely Apply The Law if and when He wanted to Repeal it, which He did not take any step to repeal it.

So you err to say that a part, the Body of The Law is Repealed, Whereas, the Body of Law is an Insevarable Part of The Whole.

This is the whole Truth!

Stop confusing God's law and ways with Man's way.

Dtruthspeaker:
I Love Laws, so when a Topic on Law comes up, you can be sure that I will be there (if ...)

I love your analysis and it is beautifully put together, however forgive me, I love things being accurate, thus, I intend putting in some amendments.

Firstly, you did not avert your mind to The "Source of Law" and pay the due respect to it.

Which is where neither Laws do not have "different functions, purposes and jurisdiction."

For the 10 Commandments are simply, "A Brief and Precise Summary of The Whole Body of Laws Given THROUGH Moses".

What we call "Preamble" in Law.

And a Preamble is no different from the main body of the law, it is part of the law.

And it is the preamble which states the purpose, direction and the intentions of the Law Maker.

Thus, the 10 Commandments is a 10 Paragraph Preamble to the main body of laws still given to Moses, which would have contained Parts, Sections and Sub-sections as we would have done it today. (Mmh that's an idea, may be I'll take some time out to draw up how it would look like in today's law drafting style).

Secondly,
"How they were recorded.
a)The 10commandments were written by God himself...

b)While the laws of Moses WERE WRITTEN by Moses (and not created or formulated by Moses) ."

Here, Based on Source of Law, both emanated from God, The Same Law Giver.

Thus, the Laws are One.



Correction: it should accurately read "and the One I Commanded Moses to give you". as you rightly observed in Nehemiah 1:7 We have dealt very corruptly against thee, and have not kept the commandments, nor the statutes, nor the judgments, which thou commandedst thy servant Moses.

Moses, does not own The Law therefore it is a misrepresentation to say "law of Moses".



Exodus 20: 5 is the Punishment for the offence of bowing down to other gods in breach of Preamble 1, Section 1 of The Laws of the Territory of Israel and the whole earth, which both and all belongeth to God, Most High!



No sir! Every body of Law has its Preamble and A well Made Law must have its preamble.

Why?

Because The Preamble Leads and the body of Laws follow after it.

That is why God replaced it.

And this is even besides the fact that it was meant to be a Physical Proof and Evidence To World that Indeed God is Up there Watching us (for those who claim to not know that He is Up there watching us) and He indeed once directly and physical communicate with one of us, which evil people will never want people to know, therefore they have covered and hidden it.



All the things you laid out are also obtainable from the main body of The Law.

2.it convicts us of our sins,

3. It teaches... (for those who want to learn)

4. It prescribes

5. It recommended.

"Its primary purpose was to deal with sin and its consequences hence it was added becos of sin."

The Primary Purpose of God's Law is to attend and address every evil work, which brings about an offence (sin).



As I said earlier, what you call 2 Laws, is actually, One Law!



Like a carpenter teaching car engines and engine failures is surely teaching errors, so also is it when non-lawyers teach law.

There are many errors here breaking many other laws you do not know, because you do not know all the relevant laws in play and how they intersect with each other thereby leading to misleading outcomes.

Thus, your little absorption of law, does not qualify you to teach Law, for you will mislead your unlearned listeners and cause them to err.

So, your presentation looks right and has good spirits but it is not Fully Right (Right Full) because of fundamental errors, which you must commit because youare not an expert in it, exactly as you would not believe a painter who is giving a lecture on open heart surgery.

Nevertheless, lawyers would have been impressed with your presentation like the doctors would have been by the painters presentation of open heart surgery.

Good , Am not disputing some of your points.its true, both laws were given by God and both laws are intertwined.

My purpose of this article is to distinguish the two laws as separate but related laws and to show that what God did away with through the death of Jesus was the law of Moses and not the 10commandments.

Judging from your writeup or insights on law I presume you are a lawyer?

Splinz:
To help readers with one of such context, Galatians comes handy.

In chapter 3:1, Paul called the Christian Galatians then as foolish. This was because they wanted to continue in the "works of the law" which brings a curse. These works were those ones written in the "book of the law" (verse 10). In other words, these were works as contained in the law that Moses wrote.

In fact, there's a specific law being discussed here, as was written in the book of the law. And that law or works is that of circumcision. It was this law that the Galatians tried to keep, which made Paul to called them foolish (see Galatians 2). Indeed, the law of circumcision and the book of the law has been abolished. Or is there anyone, a supposed Christian, who is circumcised in the flesh as part of his/her salvation process? So since no one is keeping up with that works of the law, it is wrong as some people do, to quote such verses completely out of context, as supposed proofs that the law (ten commandments inclusive) has been abolished.



So that's it. A good example on contextual reading.

I totally agree.

Any honest person would acknowledge that Paul was referring to the law of Moses as the
10commandments does not contain curses.

It would be ironic for one to claim Paul was referring to the 10commandments, the question is
How would one not bowing to Idol,not using the name of God in vain,Not killing or committing adueltry bring curse to the person?

Which means Paul was never referring to the 10commandments

Splinz:
Hello BlueAgent, longest time. Good to see you.

You did justice to the topic. Well done.

Thank you bro.

Many people confuse the 10commandments with the laws of Moses, they assume that they are all one and the same law and that they have the same functions, hence many of them are led to believe that all the laws were blotted out by Christ's death.

These assumptions are wrong, the laws are quite different and have different functions, purposes and jurisdiction.

Some key differences between these set of laws are.

1.How they were recorded.
a)The 10commandments were written by God himself.
Exodus 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.


b)Why the laws of Moses were written by Moses .
Deuteronomy 31:9 And Moses wrote this law, and delivered it unto the priests the sons of Levi, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and unto all the elders of Israel.

2.How they were given.
a)The 10commandments were spoken to the people directly by God.

Deuteronomy 4:36 Out of heaven he made thee to hear his voice, that he might instruct thee: and upon earth he shewed thee his great fire; and thou heardest his words out of the midst of the fire,
Deuteronomy 5:22 These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: and he added no more. And he wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me, Exdous20:1-21


b) While the laws of Moses was spoken to Moses alone who wrote them and instructed the people.

Deuteronomy 5:1 And Moses called all Israel, and said unto them, Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your ears this day, that ye may learn them, and keep, and do them.
Exodus 34:31 And Moses called unto them; and Aaron and all the rulers of the congregation returned unto him: and Moses talked with them. 34:32 And afterward all the children of Israel came nigh: and he gave them in commandment all that the LORD had spoken with him in mount Sinai. 34:33 And till Moses had done speaking with them, he put a vail on his face.

Exdous 33:9,Deuteronomy 31:9.



3,God himself made a distinction between the 2 set of laws.

Deuteronomy 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone. 4:14 And the LORD commanded me at that time to teach you statutes and judgments, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go over to possess it.

Please observe and the following words.
"He commanded you" and "He commanded me".Also read Exdous19:7,39:1,5,7,21,26,29,31,42,43. and Leviticus 7:38,8:9,13,17,21,29,9:10.

*** 2Kings 21:8 Neither will I make the feet of Israel move any more out of the land which I gave their fathers; only if they will observe to do according to all that I have commanded them, and according to all the law that my servant Moses commanded them.

In the above example God speaks of 2 laws the one "I commanded " and the one "Moses commanded "(law of Moses)other examples are Leviticus 9:5, Deuteronomy 33:4, Deut6:2,8:11,27,28 Rev12:17 and 14:12 for the commandments of God.



4,Prophets like Daniel,Nehemiah ,Ezra distinguish between the 2 laws.

Daniel 9:10 Neither have we obeyed the voice of the LORD our God, to walk in his laws, which he set before us by his servants the prophets. 9:11 Yea, all Israel have transgressed thy law, even by departing, that they might not obey thy voice; therefore the curse is poured upon us, and the oath that is written in the law of Moses the servant of God, because we have sinned against him.

Nehemiah 1:7 We have dealt very corruptly against thee, and have not kept the commandments, nor the statutes, nor the judgments, which thou commandedst thy servant Moses.

Nehemiah 9:14 And madest known unto them thy holy sabbath, and commandedst them precepts, statutes, and laws, by the hand of Moses thy servant:

Note:!
The 10commandments contained no curses or punishment for its offenders.
Deut29:20,21,27, 2Chronicles 34:20.
See Exdous 20:6.


5, The 2 laws were kept in different locations.
a)The 10commandments were kept inside the Ark of Convenant.

Exodus 40:20 And he took and put the testimony into the ark, and set the staves on the ark, and put the mercy seat above upon the ark:

b)The laws of Moses were kept by the side of the Ark.
Deuteronomy 31:24 And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
Deuteronomy 31:25 That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying, 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.



6. God himself wrote the 10commandments twice this shows how important and serious God takes it.

Exodus 34:1 And the LORD said unto Moses, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first: and I will write upon these tables the words that were in the first tables, which thou brakest.

Deuteronomy 10:1 At that time the LORD said unto me, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first, and come up unto me into the mount, and make thee an ark of wood.


After Moses broke the first tablets of stone God re-wrote the 10commandments the second time, note the law of Moses was already in existence and was already been observed .
This proves that God saw his 10commandments different from the laws of Moses.

**The laws are aslo different in there contents and functions .

The 10commandments.
1.Reveals or defines what God condemns as sin.Romans 7:7,Isaiah 42:24.

2.it convicts us of our sins, 1john3:4,
Rom5:13.

3. It teaches righteousness ,Psalms 37:31,psalm94:12

4.It makes one wise. psalm19:7

5.it teaches us how to love God and ones neighbour.1john 5:2,Roman 13:8

6.It reveals the character of God.
psalms 119:142,Romans7:12.

7. A condition for God's blessings.
Psalm 119:1,psalm94:12.

**The Law of Moses had a different function it consists of set of laws that regulated.

1.preisthood Exdous40: 15, hebrews7:12., Exdous 21:1-end, Exodus 30:7-8

2.Rituals and sacrifices, Exdous 29:1-end, Exdous 30

3.Sin offering:Leviticus 12:6-8, Leviticus 4:2-4,Leviticus 4:22-23, Leviticus 16:5, Leviticus 5:5-6

4.Feasts, meat and drink offerings:Leviticus 23:2,Leviticus 23:2,4, Leviticus 23:38,44
Deuteronomy 16:16,17,Leviticus 2:1,3, 14,Leviticus 6:14,Leviticus 7:37,

5.Customs and traditions of the people eg. circumcision:Acts15:5, John7:22, on purification, Luke 2:22,

6.Civil and Judicial laws e.g punishment for offenders, disputes and other civil matters. Deuteronomy 19,20,21,all to the end, Deuteronomy 22:1-end,
Capital punishment Leviticus 20:10, Leviticus 24:17-22 , Exodus 21:12

7.Ordinances :numbers 31:21

Its primary purpose was to deal with sin and its consequences hence it was added becos of sin.

Galatians 3:19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.


****Which law was abolished or blotted out on the cross?

Although the 10commandments reveals or convicts one of his sins, it had no saving power, their was no provision or instruction contained in the 10commandments on how one could be saved or cleanse from sin. Hence the need for the law of Moses.

The laws of Moses were temporary and a shadow of things to come, they pointed to Christ, who by his death and blood, cleansed all humanity of sin.
Unlike the blood of lambs and bulls offered for sin as required by the scarifical laws of Moses,which could never make one perfect(Hebrews10:1)
Christ offered himself once as the scarifical offering for all sins, weather past, present or future , that through his death and resurrection all would come to the perfect knowledge of God.

Hebrews 7:27 Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.


The law of Moses is the law that was blotted out on the cross, been contrary and a witness against us.
God had to change his covenant with his people, but while God changed the ministration of how sin was dealt with which was before according to the laws of Moses(with its capital punishment, Sacrifices, preisthood,ceremonies and rituals). God never changed what his definition of sin is.

For example the present Abolishment of capital punishment as the penalty for murder or any offense in most western countries does not mean that those countries has abolished the law prohibiting murder or that they have legalized murder.

What changed was how the punishment or justice was served to offenders and not the offence, neither was the law prohibiting such offence abolished.
Same principle applies to God's 10commandments and the laws of Moses.

Conclusion.
With this points and evidence it should be obvious to any honest person that the 10commandments and the laws of Moses are 2 different laws written by 2 different authors,kept in different places,had different content and functions ,written on 2 different materials and were to last differently.

Revelation 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

While the law of Moses has been blotted out on the cross by Christ death, the 10commandments remains and still stands forever.
As its giver and author (God) cannot change so also the 10commandments can never be changed or altered.

Psalms 89:34 My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Note: The word Law in the Bible can refer to any of the 2 laws in the Bible either the 10commandments or laws of Moses.

To identify the law been referred to one needs to read in context of what is been said.

The 10commandments is also called The law of God, the testimony,Commandments the Royal law,the law of liberty.

The laws of Moses is also called ,Book of Moses, commandments contained in Ordinances,Law, judgments,law of the LORD, commandments, decree.


Thanks


God bless.