xendra:
you opened a thread and made a comment about a God you believe does not exist. seriously I also wonder why they mentioned you to rant because of your comment instead of asking you why you care atall since to you He doesn't exist

tryna understand the thread jare....it has nothing to do with believing or not believing

lordnicklaus:


Thank you! You have perfectly laid your argument from quite a concrete premise. The universe is only self supplementary because of being already programmed to follow a set of conventional laws of Maths and Physics. Theism or religion doesn't prohibit understanding the universe. Itself has only made us to search for more answers to its stated facts, the proof of a master designer and also to come to understand His work.

well said

interesting topic op...to quickly add my own point...as is well known the human and some lesser animals always search for the cause of every occurrence(effect) .

and as science as proclaimed from its various findings,everything in nature follows s well defined and precise mathematics, mathematics so elegant that it take only the finest minds to unravel them .

so do we say this precision that we observe in nature is simply the product of chaos

"this is second to accepting that a 6month old made a perfect work of art by randomly moving his pencil on a piece of paper"

how about defending your ph.d and the only thing you could come out with is " I randomly mixed this element with that element and wow a got this amazing creature"

just using these instances to show that it is almost impossible for the human mind to conceive an opulent grandeur,a master design without a master designer. so intelligent design is the work of an intelligent designer and there is no mathematics without a mathematician

to cap my point up, after years of calculative and carefull analysis, rebranding and remodelling the most advanced robot could only possess cockroach like intelligence....and this is due to some very complex mathematics and design....so why say the more complex human( and the universe as a whole) is the result of an unintelligent "designer" the product of mere chance?

4everGod:



sorry to say this but I think you are slow on the uptake!

apology accepted...but I'm not sorry to tell you likewise actually think ure worse than slow

Smallville10:
look just go to wikipedia and read an article titled problem of evil. Then u will understand my post abeg

lol...you didn't say dat did you?...now is that an escapist attempt, so you can't even defend what you posted

Oh I say you expect us to read and accept without questioning ...Nice one

Smallville10:
ur dad introduced u to ur grand parents. If he didnt u would never know them.
God has not introduced me to his parents

so there is a possibility that God had parents?..and hence a possible that he isn't eternal and even a possibility that he isn't god?

Smallville10:
Butterfly88 it seems u have problem readin english language. I stated dat good and evil can not co exist by themselves without a source and dat was why i told u THALES said all things are derived from a single first cause. Which means good and evil has its source which is no other than potent entities

lol..but you really don't have to insult me ...well you directed me to the thales stuff...my argument was never about it only about the pandoras box you created with your logic...kindly read my post this time carefully

ifenes:



God(Good)=Devil(Evil) This went in!


Thread closed!

lol..that the problem..his argument is as incorrect and illogical as it is old..maybe he didn't sit down to and undertake the rigour of pondering upon it or try...here again we find the sentiment " because God is vindicated then it must be correct regardless of how illogical it is"

Smallville10:
Butterfly88 knows notin abt d history of God and Lucifer

the history of God ..thought God had no history

trapQ:
Go back and read the part where he said all things came from a single source.

hmmm ....kinda lost...please help clarify the statement of thales of and how it resolves this

To clearify a little more i would show u this:
1. If there is a God then there is no evil
GOD- EVIL
2. If there is Good then there is no devil
DEVIL - GOOD
3. If there is evil then there is no God
GOD - EVIL
4. IF THEre is devil then there is no good
DEVIL- GOOD
From d above where does dat leave us? It leaves us with prove dat there is good and evil, GOD AND DEVIL; it is obvious dat God is Good, the extra 'O' signifies his grace upon us despite his presence. It is also clear that d devil is evil even though he is decitful and tries to hide his cruelty be removing d 'D' from Evil but we are no fools not to know the devil is EVIL...

In other words there exist two creators.a creator of good and a creator of evil

Now if taken a step forward this means there are two gods,
*The god of God (that we call God)
*The god of evil (the devil)

And the god of evil "built" evil in the heart of men.

This concept completely shatters the view of God as the "only creator"....

Also to think of it God created the devil...so us it that this God of good created the god of evil because he needed a competition?

lanicky:
Lanicky appeared in ur post sir
What has my name got to do with science stuff?

maybe the gods of physics has something in stock for you,

Who knows maybe they want you as their next Nobel price winner

So we've talked about gravity which enables us to calculate the motion of planets,the mechanics set up by newton helped to unleash the industrial revolution.

Michael faraday worked out the electromagnetic force which gave us the wonders of the electric age.

So let's proceed to the next forces

The nuclear strong and nuclear weak forces (nuclear age)

Soberdrunk-what is it all about?

** the stars and the sun

Lanicky--humm!!

**the ancient was also fascinated by the sun apollo was called the god who rode the heavens in his flaming chariots.

Thanks to physics we now know that the sun is just a burning fuel
W
Lennycool-like the burning oil or coal?

**yeah..But hey!! If we are to calculate how long coal or oil as massive as the sun will burn out,we'll realise that it will take just a few hundred years.

Donnffd-so what could possibly make the sun last for billions of years?

**new forces, the nuclear forces. the secrets of this forces were unravelled by Einstein's and others

The nuclear forces comes in two forms

1-the weak and the strong

Wiegraf- what are these nuclear forces ?

**the nuclear weak- it governs radioactive decay,Because radioactive materials emit heat when they decay or break apart, the weak nuclear force contributes to heating the radioactive rock deep within the earth's interior. This heat, in turn, contributes to the heat that drives the volcanoes, the rare but powerful eruptions of molten rock that reach the earth's surface. The weak and electromagnetic forces are also exploited to treat serious diseases: Radioactive iodine is used to kill tumours of the thyroid gland and fight certain forms of cancer. The force of radioactive decay can also be deadly: It wreaked havoc at Three Mile Island and Chernobyl; it also creates radioactive waste, the inevitable by-product of nuclear weapons production and commercial nuclear power plants, which may remain harmful for millions of years. It also plays a vital role in the formation of the elements in stars and the early universe. We don’t, however, come into contact with this force in our everyday lives,and is the second weakest force after the force of gravity

The nuclear strong force- a very strong force so strong that it binds the atoms together in the nucleus since genesis. It provides the energy that fuels the stars; it makes the stars shine and creates the brilliant, life-giving rays of the sun. If the strong force suddenly vanished, the sun would darken, ending all life on earth.

mynd44-so how did Einsteine unravel these forces ?

**using a simple idea,that energy can be transformed into mass(the faster you move the heavier you get) ,and he expressed this in mathematical term using the famous equation E=mc^2.almost every science student know about this equation but very few know of its important and it is Infact the most important equation in physics

And this theory called the theory of General Relativity is still reshaping how the scientific community thinks as they search for a grand Theory of Everything

Because of this theory which didn't win him a Nobel price but helped lots of physicists in winning Nobel prices,we now understand the concept of the expansion of the universe,understand light,the Big Bang theory,black holes, wormholes and other concepts yet to be unravelled such as the

The quest for unification ( theory of everything)

I want to know how God created this world. I am not interested in this or that phenomenon. I want to know His thoughts, the rest are details-Albert Einstein

Einstein made a tremendous and radical change in the world of physics with his theories of relativity but he was not satisfied ,He would try one last time to produce another world-class theory. But on his third try, he failed. His third and final theory was to have been the crowning achievement of his lifetime. He was searching for the theory of everything, a theory that would explain all the familiar forces found in nature, including light and gravity. He coined this theory the unified field theory. Alas, his search for a unified theory of light and gravity was fruitless. When he died, he left only the unfinished ideas of various manuscripts on his desk

coolusername- hmm!!

**yeah!!and for 30 years, he was disturbed by a fundamental flaw in this formulation. On one side of the equation was the curvature of space-time, which he likened to "marble" because of its beautiful geometric structure. To Einstein, the curvature of space-time was like the epitome of Greek architecture, beautiful and serene. However, he hated the other side of this equation, describing matter-energy, which he considered to be ugly and which he compared to "wood." While the "marble" of space-time was clean and elegant, the "wood" of matter-energy was a horrible jumble of confused, seemingly random forms, from subatomic particles, atoms, polymers, and crystals to rocks, trees, planets,and stars

So his quest was to turn wood into marble but failed died in the attempt!!

And many scientists(physicists and mathematicians and biologists) have followed in his steps and are on the quest to discover the theory of everything, with it we will become the gods of the universe

In the quest for this we have the kaluza-klien theory,the higgs fields,yang mills,Guts, quantum electrodynamics and today we have the string theory.

So if you need a Nobel price find the theory of everything

seun- so physics isn't all about crazy calculations after all, and have helped immensely in modern civilization and technological prowess

Most people who haven't been trained in physics probably think of what physicists do as a question of incredibly complicated calculations, but that's not really the essence of it. The essence of it is that physics is about concepts, wanting to understand the concepts, the principles by which the world works-edward witten( pioneer of the super spring theory)

Thanks...more topics to follow

johnydon22:


Nope breaking science for the lay people with a butter of philosophy and ancient myths for maximum entertainment.

ValentineMary-that remind of the word of alexamdra Pope

"Nature and nature's laws lay hidden in night
God said let newton be and there was light"

**yeah!! LOL
So let's proceed ,the next great force which revolutionised the course of history
Electro-magnetic Force
Ever since humans saw lightning bolts light up the sky,ever since they've been terrified by the sound of thunder, they've always asked.

Do the gods propel lightning bolts and create thunder? Are they angry at us?
And they've believed in this fallacious myth for millennia. And was not until the 1800s that physicists start to unravel the mysteries of lightning and thunder and help free the ancient from his shackles

Ifenes-so how did physicists achieve this feat?

** from the discovery of electromagnetism,so the next aspects of the universe for which a law or model was discovered were the electric and magnetic forces. These behave like gravity, with the important difference that two electric charges or two magnets of the same kind repel each other, while unlike charges or unlike magnets attract. Electric and magnetic forces are far stronger than gravity


Plaetton-if they are stronger than gravity why don't we notice their effects in our every day life's the way we notices the effect of gravity ?

**we don’t usually notice them in everyday life because a macroscopic body contains almost equal numbers of positive and negative electrical charges. This means that the electric and magnetic forces between two macroscopic bodies nearly cancel each other out, unlike the gravitational forces, which all add up.

Raphiemontella-oh!! Okay,ride on please !!

**One of the most important discoveries was that electrical and magnetic forces are related: A moving electrical charge causes a force on magnets, and a moving magnet causes a force on electrical charges. The first to realize there was some connection was Danish physicist Hans Christian Ørsted

Ørsted noticed that the electric current from the battery he was using deflected a nearby compass needle. He soon realized that moving electricity created a magnetic force, and coined the term “electromagnetism

few years later British scientist Michael Faraday reasoned that—expressed in modern terms—if an electric current could cause a magnetic field, a magnetic field should be able to produce an electric current. He demonstrated that effect in 1831,years later he also discovered a connection between electromagnetism and light when he showed that intense magnetism can affect the nature of polarized light

And then he gave a law, now known as the faraday' law of electromagnetism,
a moving wire in a magnetic field has it electrons agitated creating electric current

This simple idea unleashed the electric revolution,because of it we have the hydroelectric power statations,dams, the nuclelar power plants, and thanks to this simple idea we have electricity in our homes

But that wasn't all

For several decades the understanding of electromagnetism remained stalled, amounting to no more than the knowledge of a few empirical laws: the hint that electricity and magnetism were closely, if mysteriously, related; the notion that they had some sort of connection to light; and the embryonic concept of fields.

Many theories of electromagnetism existed, every one of them flawed. Then, over a period of years in the 1860s, Scottish physicist James Clerk Maxwell developed Faraday’s thinking into a mathematical framework that explained the intimate and mysterious relation among electricity, magnetism, and light .describing both electric and magnetic forces as manifestations of the same physical entity, the electromagnetic field. Maxwell had unified electricity and magnetism into one force. Moreover, he showed that electromagnetic fields could propagate through space as a wave. The speed of that wave is governed by a number that appeared in his equations, To his astonishment the speed he calculated equaled the speed of light, He had discovered that light itself is an electromagnetic wave

Today the equations that describe electric and magnetic fields are called Maxwell’s equations. Few people have heard of them, but they are probably the most commercially important equations we know. Not only do they govern the working of everything from household appliances to computers, but they also describe waves other than light, such as microwaves, radio waves, infrared light, and X-rays

Physics once again comes to our aid and rescued us from our boat that was made from clay

Urahara- so this time it is God said the four equations of James Clark Maxwell and there was light. Haha

**So from gravitational force to electromagnetic force

Next are the strong and the weak nuclear forces
Stay tuned

sorry for the delay oh...will post the remaining topics in no time..

Habiodunz:
Em nuh here to talk about a workn fire extinguisher

me neither!
just saying his statement is cwarect regardless of who he is

I comment my reserve

what me I know is he is correct, fire extinguishers work for atheists,pagans and even satanists.

Gpdwise:

u should tell me!!! cos the last time I checked it all started with a big bang!! there must be an action before a reaction isnt that science or has that law changed. something has to cause the bang!!!

your question said "what" the answer is the singularity an infinitely hot,infinitely dense and infinitely small(unstable) entity

Gpdwise:

and u forgot abt what caused the big bang!!! we all are product of our believe

"what" caused the big bang? what caused the cause of the big bang..and the cause of the cause?

and finally what are your proves?

Gpdwise:
Atheists a group of people that BELIEVES that God doesn't exist and here are Christians who BELIEVE in God. I have often wondered which is more easy to believe in. A God up there who has your best interest at heart and who sometimes just sit quietly while you struggle through some difficult stuff OR
To believe you are self sufficient and you owe nobody nothing to be either good or bad. I have followed most trends on nairaland. I admire the steadfast devotion of some Atheists and there indebt knowledge and I just can't fail to draw a similarity that both religion are based in BELIEVE. If u believe the big bang happened billions of years ago while is it hard for you to accept another persons believe that God is just and loving.
if his believes makes him a better person what right do you have to take that away from him!
the world without Atheists I Dont know how it be but am greatful to them because for each of there criticism about Christianity they have made me study more about Christianity and each time I feel blessed being a Christian. so thank you Atheists for making me a better Christain

That's the difference the athiest works with evidence send proof not what another person believes or disbelieve, the Big Bang theory has been scientifically proven and it hasn't been falsified at least not yet

so you see the atheist didn't believe in the big bang because it is a form of myth,but because it is based on careful scientific and inductive studies

Not because one man claims without logical prove that it is true

@johnnydon22..I really admire your logic and style,your eloquence your ability to reason beyond sentiments and free your self from intellectual stagnation

may have not been able to comprehend your post completely but a agree with most of what you've sighted here

But I will like to be a bit unscientific and chose philosophy as my brother here

first in philosophy creation is different from invention (though both means making a thing which does not exist before creation differs from invention in the sense that invention uses already existing materials and creation doesn't!)

although that's not where the main issue lies and certainly not my problem...my problem is this

Albert Einstein's once lamented that "the most incomprehensible thing about the universe is that it is comprehensible"

why is the universe so compressible should be the question on everyone's lips? here Stephen hawkings replies-our universe is so comphrensible because it is governed by precise mathematical laws!!

and some of these laws have been unraveled by some of the greatest minds of all time

so here lies the big problem...if the universe is governed by precise mathematical laws isn't there a mathematician behind it?...yeah the cause and effect thing creeps in again

and we will be quick to ask who invented/created that mathematician and hence the infinitum

well I don't know too but I for one think there is a mathematician in play or what kepler called the geometer

Again we will ask who/what/where is this mathematician?
why is he/she/it hiding?

well I don't know,and no one knows(as far as science is concerned), as far as I know the laws of physics breaks down at the singularity

so there are lots of questions about what was before the big bang and until science with all it limitations is able to unravel this paradox I keep my hands crossed

like the Schrodinger's cat paradox how do you know if a cat is dead or alife if you haven't observed??

the answer is it is both dead and alife...but
what if we can't observe this cat?

sorry if I have swayed from the subject matter bro...still on still beautiful write up

DoctorAlien:


Let's clarify it: The only risk GOD took was creating a powerful being with freewill--the power to decide whether to obey Him or to rebel against Him.

You get it?

I don't....he took a risk and was hoping for a good outcome..but he also knew before hand that no good will come out of this risk and hope

how contradicting

DoctorAlien:


Wrong. Risk is not a product. You don't take risk because you don't know the outcome. You take risk because you hope everything works out fine even though it could go wrong.

By that definition, people who know very well that children do turn into criminals should stop giving birth to avoid producing criminals.

LOL. Nice discussing with you, anyway.

lol...so God was hoping that Satan with turn out well?

lol bro....where is the knowledge and certitude then?

and again that's not the logic..omg..how many time

well it's not nice discussing with you

lol..just kidding...have fun

DoctorAlien:




Every parent surely knows that their ward can either be a very good person or a very bad person. They try their best, however, to make their wards toe the right part.

still sailing in this your ship made of clay...

If I say something will either be good or bad that mean I'm uncertain about the outcome but have to take the "risk"
that's being human

this logic will only old true for God if he also is imperfect...so is God imperfect?

DoctorAlien:


The people that turn out to be criminals and rapists and murderers and armed robbers are people's children. People even give birth to children that eventually kill them. The people that gave birth to them never planned for them to become criminals. Therefore there is the risk in giving birth to a child: you might actually give birth to someone who would kill you.

Should people consider the risk and stop giving birth to children?

like I said risk is the product of uncertainty and imperfect knowledge,, just try this and that and see if it works out

by this logic do you mean God doesn't know beforehand that Satan will become a criminal?

lol..bros ure just bent on killing my battery,there is no point rearranging the seats of a sinking boat I guess....

DoctorAlien:


The computer logic is mine, remember?

Now, a scientist gave birth to a son. This son became rebellious and disdained his father. Now this scientist invented a beautiful technology for spreading information about his scientific work but his rebellious son turned it into a device for spreading libellous messages and intensifying his rebellion against his father.

Who is to blame in this case?

yeah you started the computer logic Lol...tryna to use it to support you claim but in the wrong context then I tried to correct it but you persisted...

.now another twisting.....

but here is the point again is the father aware before hand that his soon while cause such troubles? even before given birth to him?

is the father aware that his son will lead millions into the abyss of no return....if yes then the father is to be held responsible

if no then your logic holds no water...cause it simply means that God has no perfect knowledge

DoctorAlien:




GOD created Lucifer to glorify Himself. However, GOD didn't create him a robot. If He did, there wouldn't have been any possibility for Lucifer to disobey GOD. And so GOD creating Lucifer with freewill to choose either obedience or rebellion was a risk. Satan choosing to disobey would endanger creation. And he did. GOD however showed that He is wise by providing for the redemption of creation.

Yes. A careful study of the Bible reveals that Satan is much more powerful than man can conceive. Very powerful.

did God know he will dis obey?...is God all knowing?

cause from all you've stated it's as if God is not all-knowing

cause if I intend to create something to my taste and I'm the greatest designer there is how come my design ends up giving me headache?

Omg..cant you see?

DoctorAlien:


GOD created Lucifer before He created man. I only know as much as the Scriptures reveal, but Satan was cast out from Heaven even before man was created. He then proceeded to deceive man.

Now, the computer can be used to send an appointment letter over the internet. The computer can also be used to send a letter of threat over the internet. Is this the fault of the computer or the fault of the people created technology?

don't try to twist the logic I made with the computer the loopholes existed cause of the imperfection of the scientist but on a nutshell the computer is a wonderful device

so now if the devil is the computer and God the scientist...now thus is another type of computer I purely dangerous computer ...now is the scientist in this case God imperfect for creating a totally bad computer when he Infact intended to create a magnificent device?

so who do you blame for the creation of a bad computer? the inventor or the computer that is what my question is

DoctorAlien:


He was aware of it. You see, GOD actually took a very big risk in creating Lucifer- a very beautiful, mighty and powerful angel next in rank in all ramifications only to Himself. On top of it all, this being was not created a robot but was created with freewill: he could actually choose to serve and remain loyal to His Creator. He could also choose to rebel. GOD knew that Satan choosing to rebel and deceiving the rest of creation into rebellion would cost Him a lot--even His own life. When the first seeds of pride began germinating in Lucifer's heart, GOD knew a very big problem was imminent.

GOD created Satan with freewill. He chose to rebel.

lol..god took a big risk?...I risk not a product of uncertainty and imperfect knowledge

so Satan is next in rank to God? so God is not even all powerful and Satan to can be ranked second in command...

and all these makes sense to you?