₦airaland Forum

Osagyefo98:
The fact remains that you can't tell people their history. They are the ones in right position to do so.

Even the academics needs to consult their before drawing conclusions.

Ogba people have always made it clear their Benin origin and ancestry.

Stop foisting your ethnicity on them.

The fact remains that history isn’t a decision it is a fact. Academics do not “consult” in order before drawing a conclusion in the sense that they do not draw a conclusion that doesnt allign with their own. They refer to the the claims of the people are surrounding factors to consider. It is another source, just like the other pieces of information and it is subject to scrutiny just like other pieces of information. The fact of the matter is history is about truth and truth isn’t based on your opinion or wishes.

AliseKazah:
I am on Facebook and Israeli's complain about IPOB posting on their page.

I agree that posting on their page is a problem. It needs to stop honestly.
But even if some think we are from Israel and they have every right to say that. Why do I say this? You people have no problem with even supporting lies that OBJECTIVELY Ikwerre are from Benin only based on the fact that they say it. And that despite the overwhelming evidence Anioma are primarily Igbos based on the fact a few say otherwise you’d support that. I SUBJECTIVELY say I can accept that out of respect for their choice. However you guys feel the need to stop Igbo people from saying they are Jews due to the fact that you know it’s objectively untrue however you are fine with feeding lies to Igbo subgroups.

Stop the hypocrisy. Igbos are not Jews but if you aren’t Igbo let Igbo themselves deal with it if you simultaneously believe Ikwerre should not be recognised as Igbo. I myself when speaking academically will say Igbos are not Hebrews and Ikwerre are Igbos.

Edit: wasn’t speaking to OP in particular. I was speaking to the majority of Nigerians.

Why did I bring in that topic? Because I feel it is something overlooked, it is within the topic of Igbo identity. I think the attitudes people have to our identity as a whole need to be addressed logically without being emotionally charged.

RedboneSmith:
A linguistic group. Like Celts or Slavs or Nguni or Akan.

Close, but I still feel linguistic group is a bit too loose as apart from Ejagham we are older than all our neighbours. It is more like a group of people with common ancestry and values (one of which is independence) whom over thousands of years those values further diversified them. Linguistic group has the suggestion that similarly to Yoruba and Igbo they aren’t of the same ethnicity. However your examples apart from Slavs is great. This is just my opinion.

I have seen many claims about Igboland and a lot of identity crisis in Igboid people. I have come to the conclusion that most people who have heard of the people Igbo (including Igbos themselves) do not know what Igbo is in the first place.

For example, certain parts of Igboland which are not in the 5 SE states would look at how their dialect has a lot of differences from institutionalised Igbo. They will see the difference in culture with what is known as “Igbo culture” and they will remember a few oral pieces of knowledge that describes migration into their land. Then they will look at the fact that they are not in an “Igbo state” and say “we are not Igbo”. Now this is a clear signal that they never new what Igbo was. Because nearly every single one of the tribes in Igboland have all the different factors mentioned here and could have made an even more convincing argument if let’s say Anioma was in the 5 core states and Ibibio-Efik-Ejagham related Igbo were not.

Since Ndigbo were always decentralised yet are a large body, Igbo neighbours could be considered similarly to non-Igbo neighbours to a clan. They clan considered themselves individually and could form partners with anyone they pleased and also find enemies in anyone they pleased. They could also accommodate anyone they pleased. Hence western Igbo could accommodate Edoid people. Southern, Ijoid - you get the point. But also they could grow and develop alongside whoever they want.

Other tribes do not get reprimanded for “copying” yet Igbo because we are considered as a monolith. People can understand why Yakurr, Ejagham, Ibibio and Efik have similar culture but with Igbo clans who lived with them and developed with them suddenly the similarities are called “copies”. If they have something that is clearly Igbo derived that is called Igbo “oppression”. With the west side of Igboland people cannot see why western Igbo utilise coral beads. As if they were there to see how coral beads spread. Forgetting that it has always been a large myriad of tribes who wore coral beads and the vast majority don’t have nearly as much evidence of wearing it in pre-colonial as Igbo do.

Then the idea that there is this standard “Igbo” clothing. Igbo people have worn all manners of clothing and different tribes of Igbo wore clothes differently. And in fact a small few were inspired by more northern traders. However there seems to be an unwritten rule that Igbo are not allowed to be influenced by more Northern people. Yet Yoruba can, with things such as the agbada which has roots in Tuareg clothes. Igbo clothes were also indigenous and Igbo tailors and weavers could replicate any thing they saw. Including indigenously made pantaloons.

Then the ridiculous Igala origin theory for parts of Igboland when in reality Igala is a baby ethnicity compared to Igbo. As it was created in the 14th century by Wukari migration into Igboland and other ethnicities(it wasn’t only Igboland). And they even recognise that Igbo consisted of part of their creation.

Igbo is an identity marked by common ancestors, the Igboid language group, the 4 market days, the Igbo religion etc. It is the best way of describing this mass of ancestry and culture.

Tranquill:
Why can't you people just mind your business?
Are you from Ogba?
What is Igboid Kingdom?
You guys can just continue wailing and writing bs on nairaland and wikipedia but what you can not do is to force Ibo identity on any tribe.

You are mixing things up. The whole point of the forum is to discuss about the topics posted. What you cannot do is pretend that you don’t see what is obvious. The things we are saying are obvious. We could also argue that Ogba is not your business as most likely you aren’t from Ogba.

Cushite people

They are the ppl who speak the Cushitic branch of Afroasiatic language and primarily inhabit the Horn of Africa (Ethiopia, Eritrea, Somalia and Djibouti), but some are also found in Sudan, Egypt, Kenya and Tanzania.

They are a very ancient stock and some of the major ethnic groups are Beja, Agew, Somalia, Oromo, Afar and Sidama. There diverse languages are subdivided as:-
- North Cushitic (Beja)
- Central Cushitic (Agew)
- East Cushitic
- South Cushitic

In the Bible and other ancient texts, the term "Cush" was interchangeable by "Ethiopia" and was used to refer "Nubians" and the ancestors of present day Cushite ppl.

For more, check:-
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cush_(Bible)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cushitic_languages

Mistake. The Cush in the Bible discussed the more northern and western people of Sudan and South Sudan not Ethiopia, Somalia, Eritrea.

Osagyefo98:
They are also Yorubas since they say kini and other related words going by your logic.

So Ogba people are mixtures of Benin, Yoruba and Igbo so in that case your logic flows.

How people will wake to summarily categorize people who has stated their history clearly as Igbo is mind boggling.

Let’s be honest, you know as well as we do that Ogba people are Igbo when it comes to historical, genetic and language matter. If any odd influence turns you into your influencer then supposedly there is no Nigerian that cannot claim to be Igbo, Yoruba and Hausa. That’s not how it works. We know the reason people have English, Hebrew and Arabic names. Religion and colonisation. It isn’t the same in this case. English, Hebrew names in this part of the world are new and do not go back more than 4 generations.

As for me if Ogba people want to call themselves Edo, I won’t argue. But when we are looking from an ACADEMIA point of view don’t pretend that they aren’t Igbo. There is a difference. I won’t pretend that the facts point otherwise just because I respect their wishes.

The problem is really about jealousy, envy and fear. This is how their great grand fathers were acting in the early colonial era, no day passed without one or two accusations against the Oba of Benin by non-Edo monarchs and non-Edo commoners.
The hysteria against and fear of the empire is coming back.

Whilst I can see people going overboard in their comments. I can assure you that no one fears Benin. People are more likely very disturbed and it is even more disturbing when we see that you guys are seemingly oblivious to the extent of evil being done. I have nothing against Edo people. Despite that frankly this Oba is immoral. Well done for getting back your bronzes and it is infact something to be proud of.

godofuck231:
History is written in blood , like it or not , it's the truth and its told with emotions ,war and conflicts has always been a part of man and history

Not like in nairaland. Of cause emotions are involved. But it doesn’t justify the attitude here. I can tell the difference. As in straight up unneeded argument seeking.

Sixfiguresmart:
Since women are fighting for equality, should men also embrace this equality campaign? Since some men are subtly embracing it in dress code and using picture filters and photoshop.
Men now shave all parts and corners and cause scarcity of veet which previously were used by women only.
Men bleach and apply all sorts of lotions now. They now wear jewelry, necklace and bangles. Raising the cost of beauty for women.
Now, men wear wigs to cover baldness. Some wear six packs underwears causing manufacturing companies to raise the costs of camel toes.
Men now do manucure and pedicure. Aboki is charging over the roof now.

Men have always worn jewellery. And men have always shaved a lot. The others are a phenomenon.

AjaanaOka:
I think this may be the single most neglected theme in early Aro history: a deep connection with the Abiriba blacksmiths. This connection appears to go back to the founding of Arochukwu. The traditions of the Aro appear to be all but silent on this. It is largely among the Abiriba that we obtain traditions that make explicit statements about this connection.

Abiriba traditions claim that while their ancestors were still living at Usukpam (somewhere in the present Cross River), the ancestors of the Aro broke off, went south and founded Arochukwu. Information from Abiriba sources also says the Abiriba and the Aro still use the term "nwadi m" to refer to one another. The term loosely translates as "my relative". But besides these traditions, there are current structures and ethnographic details that speak loudly of a solid link between the two peoples.

I suggest (tentatively) that Arochukwu started life as a colony of blacksmiths who were either Abiriba or of the same stock as the Abiriba; that the early Aro were itinerant blacksmiths like their Abiriba kinsmen, operating up and down the Cross River Valley, alongside the blacksmiths from Abiriba with whom they apparently maintained cordial relations; that the Aro largely abandoned blacksmithing in the course of the 18th century, to focus on trading in slaves, local and European products.

Aro traditions themselves hint at the town's blacksmithing past. Agwu Inobia, traditionally the first Igbo settler in the lands that became Arochukwu, is said to have been a powerful blacksmith. Some traditions go further to identify the place he came from as Abiriba. But it is from outside Arochukwu that we get even clear indications that the early Arochukwu people might have been blacksmiths.

For example, from the town of Ugep in the Middle Cross River Region, we get this bit of history: "About the 1680s, the Aros had a settlement in Ugep called Lete kom (blacksmiths’ village). About 1736, these Aros betrayed the trust of the Ugep when it was found out that the Aros used deceitful means to sell Ugep citizens into slavery in the guise that such persons were eaten by the Aro oracle. In 1736, the Aros were forcefully sent out of Ugep in what is called the Bikobiko incident". (Otu Abam Ubi, "The Yakurr of the Middle Cross River Region" )

Similar traditions of early settlements established by Arochukwu blacksmiths have been recorded at Afikpo, also in the Middle Cross River Region: “Amuzu (place-blacksmiths) was apparently the second main ward formed in the village [i.e., a village in Afikpo]. Its first compound (Ezi Chukwu) was established by two Aro men and their families, who brought with them a special blacksmiths’ shrine. Although they no longer practise this occupation, the shrine is still in use." (Simon Ottenberg, "Leadership and Authority in an African Society: The Afikpo Village-Group". )

Aro colonies that were established farther west, in the Igbo hinterland (Aro Ndizuogu, Aro Ndikelionwu, etc), appear not to make any references in their traditions to blacksmithing and blacksmiths, suggesting that by the time Aro expansion extended out of the Cross River area and into the Igbo hinterland (probably in the 18th century) itinerant iron-working had ceased to be their stock-in-trade.

But granted that Arochukwu was in the 17th century an important centre of blacksmithery, are there tangible suggestions of a specific link with Abiriba, besides the fragments of traditions already referred to? Several structural and cultural parallels between Arochukwu and Abiriba would suggest so:

1. The top stratum of Arochukwu society is referred to as Amadi Nkume Asaa (Amadi of the Seven Stones). These are the, as it were, the elite of Aro society, the 'blue-blooded' descendants of the founders of Arochukwu, not latter-day naturalised immigrants and slaves.

In Abiriba, the blacksmithing guild is known as Nkuma Asaa (the Seven Stones), so named after the traditional seven blacksmithing kindreds in Abiriba. (See, O. Chidiebere, "Origin of Iron Technology in Africa: The Abiriba Blacksmiths in Focus, 2017). A hypothesis that suggests itself is that Abiriba members of this guild founded Arochukwu and passed the name down to their descendants, and the name endured long after blacksmithing had ceased to be their profession.

2. The government of both towns follow a similar tripartite or troika system, which in Arochukwu is called Nna Ato (Three Fathers), and in Abiriba is called Ekwu Eto (Three-Legged Stand). The troika system recognizes three clan heads. One of the clan heads is then recognised as a 'first among equals', and thus the 'king' of the whole town.

In Arochukwu the three clan heads are the Eze Ezeagwu, the Eze Ibom Isii, and the Eze Okennachi. The Eze Okennachi as the 'primus inter pares' is the Eze Aro, 'king' of Arochukwu. In Abiriba, the three clan heads are the Eze Agboji (known as Iffa), the Eze Amogudu (known as Ukpaghari), and the Eze Ameke. The Eze Ameke as the 'primus inter pares' is the 'king' of Abiriba, known as the Enachioken.

3. The title of the 'king' of Abiriba draws yet another parallel. Abiriba traditions say the title of their 'king' Enachioken derives from an ancestor named Nnachi Oke. (The linguistic connection between Enachioken and Nnachi Oke would be fairly easy to see, even if traditions didn't connect them.) Arochukwu traditions also mentions an Nnachi Oke, a medicine man who played a key role in driving the native Ibibio out of Arochukwu. This Nnachi Oke had a son, called Oke Nnachi, who established the line from which the present 'kings' of Arochukwu come (i.e., the Okennachi line). But instead of Abiriba, Aro traditions say Nnachi Oke came from Edda, a town right next to Abiriba.

One possible resolution is that a priest-doctor originally from Edda (Nnachi Oke) had established himself in Abiriba, had played some role in the Aro-Ibibio struggles, and that a branch of his family had established the ruling Okennachi clan in Arochukwu. This is only a hypothesis, however. What is almost certain however, is that the Enachioken/Okennachi parallel points to some common link between Abiriba and Arochukwu.

It should probably be noted that Abiriba traditions explicitly say the Abiriba played a role in the Aro-Ibibio struggles. On one occasion, the Enachioken was said to have sent 7 of his best warriors to wade off the Ibibio who were waging guerilla warfare (using a fearsome masquerade to terrorise the people) on the new town of Arochukwu (Chidume and Nmaju, "The Aro Hegemony: Dissecting the Myth and Reality", 2019)

4. A peculiar practice that features in the festivals of both towns is something called Itu Eye. The meaning of Itu Eye differs somewhat in the two towns, but they probably have common roots. In Abiriba, Itu Eye is an annual review of the laws governing the community. In Arochukwu, Itu Eye is an annual review of communal history and genealogy.

If I were to offer a re-interpretation of the traditions of Aro origin, based on a possible connection with the Abiriba, it would go like this:

The land was originally occupied by Ibibio-id groups. A group of itinerant blacksmiths (represented by Agwu Inobia) of Abiriba origins came and settled among the earlier Ibibio-id groups. The settler-group had a fall-out with the aboriginal groups and reached out to the 'mother town' of Abiriba (under the hegemony of a chieftain/priest/doctor of possibly Edda origins) for help. The 'mother town' enlisted the help of their Yakurr allies and 'kin' (the Akpa of Aro traditions). Seeking military aid from the Yakurr was most logical. Not only do the Abiriba claim Yakurr ancestry, the Yakurr in turn claim that their kings are descended from an Abiriba 'princess' named Obia. Real or fictitious, such claims of kinship did come in handy when one community needed the co-operation of the other. Osim, the name of one the Akpa mercenaries definitely points to Yakurr roots. Nna-Ubi, the last name of another of the Akpa mercenaries is possibly part-Yakurr as well, Ubi being a common name among the Yakurr.

The Abiriba settlers and their allies prevailed against the Ibibio natives and established a society closely modeled on the 'mother town' , Abiriba, and by the latter part of the 17th century, they were setting up small colonies of blacksmiths up the Cross River (exemplified by those at Afikpo and Ugep.) The trans-Atlantic slave trade received a major boom around the turn of the 18th century. The Arochukwu travelling smiths realised that they were suitably situated and had the contacts/network (at least along the Cross River valley) to benefit from the booming trade. In any case, they probably already did some trading alongside blacksmithing (just like every other itinerant blacksmithing group in that region - - - the Nkwerre, the Awka, the Abiriba). And so began the shift from artisans to full-time merchants.

This is the kind of critical thinking I like to see.

I have looked through this forum and have noticed. If there is a thread on Igbo history some Yoruba will come to denigrate. If there is one on Yoruba, some Igbo will come to denigrate. This is one example. I have noticed this also between Yoruba with bini and Igbo with Fulani(and vice versa). Or you’d have one person come and purposefully instigate these conflicts by masquerading as an ethnicity they are not.

It is simple to end this problem. If someone from another ethnicity denigrates yours, reprimand him rather than then denigrating their own ethnic group and report the comment. Also seek truth. Let’s be honest, sometimes we have sentiment that causes us to be either overly skeptical or overly gullible.

Many Thanks

ChebeNdigboCalm:
Finally to the allegations of trying to “use” AkwaCross people. People claim to have captured one or more parts of Igboland and it doesn’t make their ethnic group untrustworthy yet this is supposedly revealing some evil plan to take over AkwaCross people. Think about it.

On this point. Benin is trying to create partnership with Anioma part of Igboland. But they warred against several parts of Aniomaland. And they are very proud of what they view as subjugation of the Anioma people. Now no one comes and reprimands them. Yoruba people did the same to Nupe. No warning that they are trying to take over Nupeland. Edit: And believe me backstabbing was a major feature of these “conquests”.

Now Igbo tries to make partnerships (that already exists) with AkwaCross and SOME Izon (who majorly slave raided surrounding settlements) and SOME Yoruba (who slave raided and subjugated their Dahomey relatives), tell them to look at what the Aro did in Arochukwu.

YonkijiSappo:
Extent of the Eredo Wall and Moat system (In Red)

https://aaa.revues.org/docannexe/image/284/img-10.jpg

I was wondering does anyone have any reputable sources on this topic. For example, I want to know why it was suggested that the system enclosed a massive city rather than a series of villages and a few large towns. No offence intended.

OneCorner:
Igbos asking the essence of these thread because the narrative doesn’t pamper their ego...
These people are hypocrites of the first order and u wonder why they all have slanted head

I have looked through this post and I have found a few things.

Ndigbo do not run from this post. Instead address it with facts.
Arochukwu is a complex place and Aro a complex identity, but to say Aro is not Igbo is plainly false.
Here are indisputable facts.
1. The main language in Arochukwu is Igbo.
2. Arochukwu and neighbours BELIEVE that the events of Aro-Ibibio war occurred meaning that Arochukwu is officially Igbo.
3. Just because those events took place does not mean Arochukwu is ONLY Igbo. Ibibio is still well respected and other ethnicities in Arochukwu.

Now Aro history doesn’t always make us proud. But neither will all of your own histories including Ibibio, Ijaw, Yoruba, Edo etc. They sold other Igbo (but also non-Igbo) peoples as slaves. But then I saw someone gloating that everyone sold Igbo people into slavery. Isn’t that an example which you SHOULDNT be proud of? Why are you contradicting yourself.

Then the mistake of including Ikwerre into the conversation. The consensus is that despite the history Ikwerre doesn’t see themselves as Igbo so they aren’t Igbo (I agree with this, despite everything else lining up if the people vehemently reject it it cancels all history) but then Aro see themselves as Igbo (in fact are seen as core igbo) so why are people coming here to claim Aro are not Igbo? Yet they claim they are trying to respect the wishes of Ikwerre people yet won’t apply the same courtesy to the Aro.

This exposes something deeper. It exposes that people do not even know what Igbo is in the first place! This is something a I have thought of a while and it also exposes the foolishness of claiming Igbo “copied” things from their neighbours. Since Igbo is very decentralised yet VERY large. It is more like the acknowledgement of kinship (the name Igbo) for many people. For example. People would not say that the Akwunakwuna copies Efik+Ejagham+Ibibio because they recognise that they have kinship with Efik+Ejagham+Ibibio and grew aside and are related to them. But the Igbo sections that have done the same with Efik+Ejagham+Ibibio will be considered as copying them when in reality they have always been similar to them and are genetically and historically intertwined. They literally developed together. Similar to Ogba, Ekpeye, Ikwerre with Izon. Ika, Ukwani, etc with Edoid people (culture involves coral bead etc). Nsukka with Igala (except people are forgetting Igala is extremely new compared to Ndigbo).

So basically people just discovered that if the same standards used on Anioma and Rivers was used on the rest of Igboland, most clans would be supposedly not Igbo. And now literally you are seeing people challenging that status of people who were recently considered the core of Ndigbo.

Finally to the allegations of trying to “use” AkwaCross people. People claim to have captured one or more parts of Igboland and it doesn’t make their ethnic group untrustworthy yet this is supposedly revealing some evil plan to take over AkwaCross people. Think about it.