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European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 6:27pm On May 24, 2020
Expert17:
The finger inside the pot was for fashion.

cheesy cheesy
I have addressed this before, that some stupid_ people believe that killing other people or burying nasty filth in their home would fulfil their heart desires doesn't make it true.

They are partaking in such ignorant evil deeds because of the rampant ignorance that run amok in their immediate society.

If I ask you now to provide proof and evidence as the correlation between people partaking in rituals and it's efficacy on the wealth of the individual, you will crawl into your shell.

That people do nasty things doesn't mean it works.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 6:20pm On May 24, 2020
nitrogen:
@gensteejay, what level of research is really sufficient to prove that juju, demons and others are BS?

Can you tell us hypothesis, methodology, and analysis carried out for a sample research.

You could post a link. I just wanna try to understand how you guys were able to reach a premise on this topic.
The onus is not on us to prove, it is on you to prove what you say exist.

If I told you my teacher is a witch, the burden of proof rest on me to prove how the teacher is a witch, not on you to prove whether the teacher is not a witch. I hope you get the logic.

YOU are telling me that God is real and that Juju is real, I tell you I don't believe you, that that claim is ridiculous, it is now left for you to give me verifiable incontrovertible proof that they are real.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 4:02pm On May 24, 2020
airmark:
What is wily wily?

Donjazet, will want to know what beliefs you have in wily wily. grin
You can't even spot his sarcasm.
airmark, you believe in ghosts right?

First of all, what is a ghost?
have you seen one with your eyes?
How did it look? What form does it have?

If I go to a mortuary as you are asking me to do, what steps can I take to see and talk with this so-called ghosts?
Coherent answers will be appreciated.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 2:45pm On May 24, 2020
izzou:
[color=royalblue]Isn't it funny, that Africans, living in Africa are asking for proof online?

The person get village, e get parents, relatives, towns people, but na YouTube e wan see evidence?

There are questions I won't bother asking online. If I reach my village, na to ask for where them dey worship Idenmili or Arobunaagu and make my findings grin[/color]
I sincerely don't know how to answer you if you are really asking why we should seek proof from a platform that has over 10 billion videos. A platform the whole world uses. If you are asking me to choose between that and a small sample of fellow ignorant village people. You don't deserve an answer.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 2:37pm On May 24, 2020
izzou:
[color=royalblue]North bro[/color]
What town?
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 2:36pm On May 24, 2020
airmark:
grin

And the blood supply to the limbs ceased that same night of that nightmare.
When you want to urinate while sleeping, don't you have dreams visualizing you urinating??
So why do you think this would be different?
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 2:34pm On May 24, 2020
izzou:
[color=royalblue]You don see am na cheesy

They don't kill it in my village[/color]
North or south?
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 2:26pm On May 24, 2020
raumdeuter:
Most of those Kola Olawuyi stories were just fabrications

Pls all these rain makers, have they heard of Sahara desert before? There are some places there that have not seen raindrops in years abi this rain makers only work in rain forest region
grin grin I don ask am this same question. grin
Did you watch the video he shared? grin
You go laugh tire.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 2:20pm On May 24, 2020
Victornezzar:
During the days of secondary school when we were staying in the Barracks.... I saw things... Then Momsy wil wake us up by 12a.m to fire prayer but we shouldn't be so loud cheesy cheesy
You saw all those things because your minds were conditioned to see them. If you had looked at those things logically, you wouldn't have been scared of them.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 2:18pm On May 24, 2020
Amoto94:
During the heyday of political and communal crises in Okene where I hail from you'll see guys receiving bullets some will die but majority of them will repel the bullets with little or no harm touching them. The thing is jazz works but it also fails sometimes just like how drugs works sometimes and other times fail to work.

Just like how science relies on certain premises to bring about results which sometimes still fail so also is juju.
That's why we now have social media and video platform like YouTube.
We now live in world where almost everyone owns a smart phone to capture events.
You are armed with knowledge on your fingertips.

If you wanted to know how a baby was formed from the zygote to its embryonic stage to its infancy, I could provide evidence and videos detailing every stage of its development.
I use this particular example because many years ago, the idea of giving birth to twins was one phenomenon our ancestors didn't understand and ignorantly killed twins in irrational fear of the unknown.

If you wanted to know how I know it would rain heavily in my location next tomorrow, I would present you with videos that show how information is processed by horoscopes aligned with satellites in orbits that is viewing weather patterns live at all times.

Any claim you make can be verified with videos now, it's not magic. Show me videos detailing precisely how someone can be unaffected by bullets or pictures of how a man with a missing penis_ looks like.
We should have outgrown the stages of heresay that only induces fear without proof.

Is it that the skin becomes so hard that nothing can penetrate it? or that the bullet disappears entirely? Or that the bullets casing becomes soft? How exactly does the magic work? Prove it to me! Show me a video proof not just words of mouth.

If you ask me for any scientific proof, I will present you with video guides to show you how you can recreate the answer to your question.
Now show me the precise process of how odeshi magic works or stolen joysticks.
Also show me a complete transformation from a human being to a cat or animal like many people will like us to believe they have always existed.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 1:53pm On May 24, 2020
Greatihex:
you know these in bold yet you still think that men came to be through a bang? Okay.
What is happening to you is what is called "strong holds and false imaginations".
"We use God’s mighty weapons, not worldly weapons, to knock down the strongholds of human reasoning and to destroy false arguments."
The devil also uses it to deceive God's chosen one's and take them away from the path so that they will never be able to come back to God and do the assignment by which he sent them on earth to fulfill.
You may be the priest of God for your people, to liberate your territory from the bondage of darkness, but the devil saw it early, and then he gave you a false strong hold to believe.
"Do not be ignorant of the devices of the devil"
The devil sometimes presents himself as the angel of light to deceive even the children of God.
He uses, religion, false doctrine, etc to deceive many.
He is the Lucifer (deceiver)
I pray for you today that the Almighty God will have mercy on you and bring you to himself by destroying every strong hold of the enemy in your life. That you will arise and take your mandate, and liberate your people from the bondage of darkness, in Jesus Christ name. Amen.
Your testimony is near. I see it.
lols. grin grin grin grin
Reading this your post was just soo funny.
I just couldn't stop laughing at your shallow ignorance.
You remind me of my younger self.
The fact is until you gain better exposure, you would continue to live ignorantly in your own bubble.

It's just like tribalists or nationalists. If you travel to many different places and get to see many different people, you realize that there is nothing special about your own tribe or culture, you wouldn't care about whether one people are better than the other because you would have seen how vast the world is.

Same applies to religion, if only you would get to invest your time and learn about other people's religious beliefs and their own Gods, you would get to see there is nothing special about your belief and your God.

Did you know that Hindus, one of the oldest and major global religion believe that the world was created from the navel of a snake. That one of their major Gods Brahma is immortalized in snakes. That is why they worship snakes and revere them in many parts of India and Asia.
Same with Buddhists with their revered cows who is their own representation of Buddha.

Have you heard of Zoroastrianism, ishkism, yarsanism, yazidism etc. These are religions still standing today that predates Christianity, as a matter of fact, aspects of Christianity were forged from those religions.

You really need to snap out of the bubble that you have been living in and outgrow the indoctrination you have undergone till this present day.

Stop being scared of asking logical questions of your belief.
You said I believe the world was made by Big Bang, well guess what, I don't believe it fully. It is just a working THEORY. but it is certainly more logical than your theory that says the whole world was formed in only 6 days.

That theory flies in the face of logic and if I ask you too about the creation of your GOD, you begin to mumble jargons.
The truth is no one can lay claim to the knowledge of the creation or beginning of our universe and existence RIGHT NOW. but that doesn't mean that man wouldn't eventually get those answers, a series of events and progress of science and technology can aid in further unraveling these mysteries in the future.

You having to start outgrowing the indoctrination you have been through and start asking logical questions. Put your beliefs to test of logic.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 11:55am On May 24, 2020
Segedinho:
Critical thinkers don't go with "gestures"
As u opined earlier,u deal with verifiable fact...
Don't forget in a rush sir
Dont u think there is something unusual with this vid??

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DPZmdHyar4i8&ved=2ahUKEwixj5jilszpAhXj8OAKHWskDVkQwqsBMAB6BAgJEAM&usg=AOvVaw33AvE0xSV3KbJjb9Eu5qmW
Really, how low can you go? cheesy cheesy
You brought a video where a guy tries to prove the veracity of a rain maker's claim but then uses only ten seconds to show the man hitting his gong, then the scene moves to show a drizzle with the host now further commenting that weather reports confirmed it was to actually rain that day. grin grin
I was expecting such an experiment to be carried out during dry season when we are sure there isn't supposed to be rain and the so-called rainmaker giving a complete breakdown and analysis of his procedures for the whole world to learn from him.
Rather, we are shown a very poor researcher who claims to want to verify something leaving more confused than he came.
As a matter of fact, that you would present that caricature of a video as proof of your belief doesn't speak well of you to be honest.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:57am On May 24, 2020
gensteejay:
You got the drill about the etymology of your god's name. One of these days, I will discuss this better on the appropriate thread.
You have to learn to ignore trolls. You have since stated that you don't really want to make your position on this issue clear here, so why the unnecessary back and forth? You have to realize you are surely exposing yourself to useless banter.
If you don't want to talk about the issue, simply ignore.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:50am On May 24, 2020
Segedinho:
So since you belbelieve there is a scientific method.

Can you tell us how it is done with verifiable facts?so we can juxtapose it with our traditional way of making rainshuh
As I stated very clearly in my post, I said "i guessed". I told you that since there is already a scientific method of withholding rain, maybe our own African traditional scientists were able to discover it much earlier.
If you know of the precise mechanism via which they did it, you can publish your postulation here.
You just can't ignorantly continue to ascribe anything you don't understand as a supernatural out-of-world experience.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:30am On May 24, 2020
Segedinho:
Look for a nearby mortuary/cemetery

Ask the neccessary questions

And if u aint satisfied,carry out a research by sleeping there for atleast 3nights for maximum result.

If you aint doing thishuhno need for your curiosity
By the way do u believe in rain makers huh?
Yes, I do believe in rain makers because even today, there are scientific methods of making rain fall or withholding it.
I believe China was able to fully utilize this during the Beijing Olympic Games in 2008 or so. They sprayed chemicals in the sky to withhold the rain from falling.

My guess is our own African traditional scientists were able to discover and utilize such phenomena much earlier. They didn't do it by invoking any supernatural being as you are most likely alluding to.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:12am On May 24, 2020
nitrogen:
Why should they be in shock and fear because a neighbour died?
Also, there are accounts of ghosts from the village visiting individuals in the city. cheesy
First of all, the feeling of sadness and loss of someone who you know personally dying can be overwhelming and shocking.
When you see someone today and the next day, you hear of the persons death and realize that you will never see or hear from that person ever again, that shock and loss can trigger your brain to manifest hallucinations or dreams about the person as a coping mechanism.

Secondly, that a lot of people share a belief doesn't make it true.

I too as a kid and teen used to believe and fear ghosts because everyone around me taught me so and also believed in it.
I remember when we traveled to my village for my grandmother's burial, the night after the burial, I fell asleep atop her grave, it was an elevated concrete surface so I fell asleep on it and because every one was tired and busy they forgot about me, that night I dreamt heavily about her and when I woke up late in the night outside, I was scared shitless, even the breeze outside made me believe it was her ghost still trying to talk to me. I ran into the house crying and screaming, The worst part about this is that after narrating the whole thing to my parents and relatives, they believed she must have been there and was trying to pass a message to me.
Looking back now, remembering that episode fills me with shame as to how educated people seriously believe in superstitions.

The brain is indeed a powerful complex mechanism.
Hallucinations are real, that is a medical and scientific fact. In extreme emotional or stressful stages, one can begin to hear and see things that are not there.

We humans haven't been able to fully decode the creation and enactment of dreams by our brain.
We are yet to understand how the brain is able to produce a visual environment where your innermost feelings are manifested. Or how if you are feeling pressed in the night, you see yourself urinating in your dreams.

As a matter of fact, when I was small I used to feel like a prophet who saw the future because I was experiencing moments I believe i had felt or seen before, it's much later I would get to realize that it was a very common feeling called dejavu, which everyone one felt. We haven't even fully decoded it yet.

As I said earlier, that we don't fully understand something doesn't mean we have to ascribe it a supernatural phenomenon.

Eventually we would be able to define it logically. It's just a matter of TIME.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 12:47am On May 24, 2020
nitrogen:
https://www.nairaland.com/5868271/please-apartment-being-haunted-ghost

This one is strong o, is this sh1t ever possible? Ghost Ke?
There is nothing like ghost or apparitions.

The human brain is the most complex biological mechanism ever seen.
Unfortunately because we humans haven't been able to fully decode and understand this complex mechanism, as usual we humans chalk it's unexplained phenomenons as "supernatural events".
People take dreams as supernatural messages.

What that O.P and other neighbors are claiming is most likely self induced delusion or hallucinations.
Because of such strange untimely death, the shock and fear will most likely induce such hallucinations.
I repeat, there is nothing like ghosts. It's just our brain doing it's thing.
We always want to fear the unknown rather than find the logic behind such phenomenas.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m):
nitrogen:
Watch the video below, I think it has the answers you are seeking. I thought Ojukwu messed up sha.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JCvIvb8PpY&t=1822s
Nice video, the narrator was unbiased and analyzed the issues well.
However he still couldn't answer the contentious question as to who released Awo.
Anyways, my opinion and summation on this whole issue is this;
The whole problem started with zik and awolowo. These were 2 brilliant men who couldn't work together to achieve a common goal.
Although, I blame azikiwe more for both pettiness, desperation and self aggrandizement.
Zik studied in America in the 20's and saw first hand the brutal racism which all blacks suffered, in America they didn't care which tribe or country a black man came from, all were deemed inferior and treated as such.
So when zik came back he was very determined to liberate Nigeria from the hands of the white man irrespective of tribe.
In his determination and desperation to do so he had to make a lot of concessions to the north who were not ready to be independent because the current structure favoured them. He and Awo should have fought for just the South's independence.

He was petty because for such a smart man, he should have found a way to work together with Awo to form the 1st government, instead his decision to team up with the north that always suspected the east is one bad move that continues to boomerang till this day.
If both zik and awolowo worked together rather than suspect themselves, Nigeria would be a much better place.

Moving away from that,
The ifeajuna coup was a pure example of a good plan gone horribly wrong with devastating consequence.
Don't forget that people actually clamoured for the military to intervene, chinua Achebe's there was a country and Obasanjos book states this.

The generally accepted aim of the coup was to eliminate all corrupt politicians and senior military personnel and install Awolowo as the leader of Nigeria.
However, while the operations in the north and south were successful, Ojukwu and ironsi successfully aborted the coup and mounted a defense eventually culminating in ironsi using the opportunity to assume power.

Now for a moment, imagine a group of individuals eliminating buhari, tinubu, babangida, ty danjuma, atiku, wike, lai Mohammed and other cabal members and installing a better candidate like fashola or Peter Obi. People would rejoice.

But the results of the failed coup which appeared skewed in favor of the igbos set us on a path of destruction which we seem to be unable to recover from.

My hope is that eventually, Nigeria would become a true Federal Republic, one where all states are able to generate their own income and send their quota to the federal government and not what we have now where one region is providing for the whole country.

The north is blessed with an abundance of natural resources just waiting to be mined.
Their grounds are rich in iron ore used for steel, columbite, tin ore, lead deposits and large gold deposits. They also rear cattles which can provide provide enough dairy factories, leather factories and protein for the nation.
The west has the most fertile soil and can feed the entire West Africa also having the most educated population.
The east are the backbone of commerce and industries.
If we all pulled together, nothing will stop us from becoming a great beacon for Africa but first we must be able to gather round, discuss our problems and chart a way forward.
On this note I rest my case.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 11:27am On May 23, 2020
BlueRayDick:
Now this is so unnecessary.
Remember the other day when u opined the problem of Nigeria is majorly Religion/religious bigotry we told u that's not totally true because tribalism which was sowed since the 1966 coup is the major problem.
The main reason most people run away from discussing the war is because the war itself is not the main issue but circumstances/events that led to it. A military coup that had tribal coloration, counter coup, reprisal attacks etc.
Do u know that while Hausas were attacking people of Eastern origin in the north, easterners also killed people of Northern origin residing in the East?

The tribal sentiments that goes into telling these tales and how some people will not agree with others' account of history is why most people just let sleeping dogs lie and move on. Until every decision maker up there are ready to discuss the way forward, stuff like a group or tribe seceding will continue to be a dream labeled as treason
I do believe that many of us here are above deep tribal sentiments as evidenced by the conversations already had.
Anyways I rest my case here.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 11:22am On May 23, 2020
Victornezzar:
Assuming this Topic was in the Politics section

All those tribal lords would have turned it into an Afonja and IPOB war
That's the beauty of this thread, when we fight we fight dirty cheesy but most of the time, we are learning important lessons from each other, in the last 24 hours, we have learnt bond investments, chloroquine's efficacy, the devolution of state powers and more details of civil war. This community here is the best on nairaland sha.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 11:17am On May 23, 2020
odizeey:
You came here with your own solid opinion and made up mind and you say you want to learn.
Go youtube. Videos full there.
yes I already had my opinion about it but that's not saying it cannot be bent or reshaped.
already I have gone to research the differences between decree8 and aburi accord which nihilist was talking about it and it further enlightened me. As I've said the aim is to learn from others here.

anyways I rest my case.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:27am On May 23, 2020
larride:
It’s a very sensitive matter that shouldn’t have been brought here. angry
afrodoc2:
Don Jazzy like fight pass anything. If you leave him alone he can argue with himself.

I had 2 close friends in Uni (1 Igbo, 1 Bini), and we were all history buffs.
We discussed everything from the Peloponnesian War to the Battle of Prokhorovka.
We pretty much left the Biafran war alone.
I have told you that my reason for bringing this topic here was to further learn history as none of us here were taught history in school.
Knowing the past is very vital in shaping the future as we try not to repeat same mistakes.

Yes as you can see so far, we have been perfectly civil in our discourse, nobody has insulted or disrespected the other despite having contrary opinions on this sensitive topic.

This thread has proven to be a community of intellectuals and we have learnt a lot from each other. If this group is so afraid that it cannot even discuss the matters of the war, the single most important historical period of our country, it reflects the mentality in our society that we are not ready to move forward together and that is pitiful.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 11:42pm On May 22, 2020
Unfortunately, I have to retire to bed, we can pick up tomorrow.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 11:41pm On May 22, 2020
raumdeuter:
In life you can only control your action, you cannot control the other parties reaction

Do you know what caused many wars in history were little disputes and egos of some people bruised? E.g Igwe of Enugu snatch the wife of Igwe of Ohafia, or someone in Oyo Kingdon killed someone important in Bini kingdom, next thing 2 kingdoms are fighting and killing in thousands because of 4 people dead.

From history, what caused world war 1? The killing of 1 person Archduke Ferdinand. Do you know many people killed in that war didnt even know or hear of ArchDuke Ferdinand?

Do you know what caused the ruins of Iraq and Afghanistan? Possibly 9-11. Do you know many Iraqis and Afghans did not support the Talibans and AlQaeda yet they were victims,

Do you think America said since we lost x amount of people, we will also kill the equal amount back as revenge?

Unfortunately Life doesnt work that way

Think of any way and what led to it and you will see that the outcome was never proportionate to the cause

That is why wars and any action that could lead to it must be avoided at all cost
That is a poor rebuttal in my opinion. A poor attempt to justify genocide.
If the easterners had declared war after the counter coup, then your rebuttal would have strength.
After the counter coup, the regional leaders embarked on a campaign of misinformation and hate. They unleashed a barrage of propaganda against the igbos.
You have to ask yourself why this was? Why did the leaders see fit to stimulate masses against innocent citizens.

And you must never forget that biafra did not declare war.
After most appeals to end the genocide and an abrogation of the aburi accord, Ojukwu had to declare a safe space for the igbos to which the north vehemently opposed,why?
You don't want or like a people but you also don't want to let them go, what sense did that make?
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 11:17pm On May 22, 2020
raumdeuter:
There is no way anyone can discuss the civil war and its fallout without starting from the January 1966 coup

The summary of the coup is this

The coup was planned and executed by majority Ibo soldiers

Nigeria had 4 regions

2 ruled by non Ibos, 2 ruled by Ibos

The 2 non Ibo premiers were killed, the 2 Ibo premiers were spared
There was a president(Ibo) and a Prime minister(non Ibo). The Prime minister was killed and the president spared

There were several Ibo cabinet members None of them was killed. Actua[b]lly some of the coupist saw them when they were on rampage and did not touch them

And regarding whether Ojukwu released Awolowo or not. I will leave you to make your own deduction. Awolowo was a Federal Prisoner, He was released and welcome by Gowon.

Let's look at the 2 possible scenarios

Ojukwu released Awolowo. What do you think would have happened to Awolowo if his release was not sanctioned by Gowon when he entered Lagos. e.g if Buhari as President jails someone say Nnamdi Kanu in Port Harcourt jail, Can Wike release him? If he was released by Wike, what do you think will happen to Kanu the moment he steps back into Abuja? Do you think Buhari will go and welcome him? And let him become a free walking man and even appoint him in his cabinet
You must take into account that Awo was a recognized Yoruba leader jailed by balewa who had just been killed.
Once Ojukwu released Awo to much fan fare, it was very wise of gowon to immediately negotiate with Awo in order to cement his hold on power which he has just gained and secure a powerful ally.

Secondly, as I stated earlier, that the coup had an ethnic coloration doesn't justify the extinction of a whole tribe.
The bloody counter coup should have been enough revenge for it, not killing entire innocent average men.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 11:00pm On May 22, 2020
larride:
Easy fam, Easy.
But that is the blatant truth, believe you me it's not an exaggeration.
Being igbo as of that particular point in time meant you were good only for one thing, death.

I have read accounts of where group of men armed to the teeth would move from house to house and shop to shop hunting for igbos to kill. Such a dangerous time sha.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:43pm On May 22, 2020
nihilistjnr:
The way I see it, Ojukwu had no leverage, and didn't have the military power to take on the FG.

Decree 8 is described by many analysts as being up to 90% of the Aburi accord.
The sheer breadth of concessions to Aburi made in Decree 8 made it a massive massive W for Ojukwu

If you don't know, even the title of Commander-in-Chief that we call the president today, was formulated as a concession to Ojukwu.
Politics is about pragmatism and compromise. Ojukwu showed neither. 3 million people died for it.
This is where I end my involvement.
Anyway I would read up on this decree 8 to understand your point. Good night.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:37pm On May 22, 2020
BlueRayDick:
You are not getting it. Irrespective of who was supposed to be installed if the coup succeeded, the coup had an ethnic coloration. That was the reality. On top of this a military head of state of Eastern origin emerged.
You know how northerners can throw caution to the wind when gbé feel they have been cheated? Their Sadauna ( crown prince) was even killed only for an igbó man to emerge head of state.
Honestly progroms,resltant civil war were deeply rooted in that coup misadventure
True, the coup had an ethnic coloration which soured opinions, however that isn't justification for the mass extinction of the igbos that was taking place. And it wasn't only in the north, even the west partook.

The bloody counter coup should have been enough revenge, not taking it out on ordinary citizens.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:29pm On May 22, 2020
nihilistjnr:
As far as I'm aware, FG wanted to retain the right to declare state-of-emergency over any region with a quorum of 3 out of the 4 military governors.
FG also explicitly wanted to prevent and disincentivise any Military Governor from jeapoardising the integrity of the country.
Eastern Region were given a very good deal with Decree 8. Ojukwu's moves were then motivated by self-interest, because he was concerned the quorum could conspire with FG to replace him.
Ojukwu didn't have to go to war he knew from the start he had no chance of winning. He had just scored a massive W, but he wanted it all - full control, or nothing.
He got nothing
All these one's are just narratives to justify the war.
The fact is that Ojukwu and Gowon had both AGREED in Ghana on the Aburi accord.
Coming back now to start renegotiating a deal that had already been agreed upon and witnessed by international diplomats is plain dishonesty and disingenuous.

Imagine that we both have problems, we call in a mutually accepted credible third party to help us solve the problem and eventually AGREE on a solution signed by the third party, then we both go home and you start renegotiating terms.
Tell me how many people would accept such? What would stop you from endlessly renogotiating terms?
Gowon caused that war.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:19pm On May 22, 2020
BlueRayDick:
No military government will allow a federating unit to break off from a union just like that.

The easterners as a part of the fed rating unit ordinarily should have a right to self determination that allows them to decide if they want to continue with the union or not, but events that led to the declaration of Biafra makes it seem like Ojukwu is part of some military big boys that want to abandon the ship after making it to founder. The 1966 coup claimed the lives of Northerner and few southerners that are not majorly Igbos ; there's a spirit of vengeance in the air.

Ojukwu declaration of Biafra as a sovereign nation would've been better received if the 1966 coup never happened.

In Nigeria of today, I belive Nigeria is a forced union that should be dissolved with all federating units/ regions coming to the table to discuss on a peaceful dissolution not via arms and ammunition
Don't forget that the aim of the coup was to install awolowo as the leader of Nigeria.
A lot of average Nigerians actually supported the coup attempt based on its initial premise which was to eliminate all corrupt government politicians.
Even today, I'm sure people will be very happy if people wiped out the likes of Obj, babangida, ty danjuma, wike etc etc.

Yes I agree firmly with you that the current setting of Nigeria is not working and there should be a total restructuring of Nigeria and its components.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:10pm On May 22, 2020
nihilistjnr:
Ojukwu was given decree 8. It wasn't everything they had agreed at Aburi, but it was largely in spirit with the Aburi accord.

There was a pragmatic choice to be had here - take some(most) of what you asked for, or start a war you simply can't win, get a lot of people killed, and end up with nothing.

Ojukwu sacrificed millions at the altarof his personal ambition, and then came back to shit on the war dead by accepting a pardon and running for presidency.
What "personal ambition"? The declaration of biafra was not a decision carried out by one man or even the government alone.
It had the unflinching support of more than 95% of the entire eastern population.


The major reason for the seccesion was primarily SAFETY. The firm belief that foreigners wouldn't enter their land and still kill them.
There was nothing like personal ambition here, Ojukwu was already the military governor, so naturally he was the leader of the seccesion effort.
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga)Re: Official Chelsea Fan Thread: Club World Cup Champions 2025-2029 by donjazet(m): 10:04pm On May 22, 2020
nihilistjnr:
It's crazy that Aburi accord and subsequently Decree 8 actually addressed these issues in bold.

A golden opportunity squandered, and almost 50 years later we're still looking for SNC
So why did gowon renage on the aburi accord which they both signed?
Gowon is the cause of the war in my opinion.

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