₦airaland Forum

hopefulLandlord:
Don't for a second think they don't understand what you're saying, they actually do but are just pretending to be obtuse so you can say something they can latch on lol

I've totally wasted my time so far

ScienceWatch:
OOOps. Did I really do that. Na, please be kind enough to show me the error of my ways.

I believe u can scroll up to ur post at 9:25

ScienceWatch:
I am sad to say that Butterflyl1on wont answer this type of questions Sir. He has more important things to deal with here.

Meanwhile can you please answer this question for the benefit of millions of anxious readers world wide:
Can you tell me what Atheists are offering A suffering world, or am I wrong to believe that their are billions of suffering humanity?

I didn't even ask a question.

butterflyl1on:
But we can assume a tree fell in the forest without us seeing or hearing it right?

Your unicorn comment is still on about BELIEF and not sensory perception. Besides are we talking about UNICORNS?

"I" am saying the fact that we didn't observe that a tree fell does not change the fact that it fell in the 1st place if it fell at all.
If we don't 'see' or 'hear' unicorns, that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
I'm just trying to say that it goes both ways

ScienceWatch:
You have made that very, very clear to him. Even a lower grade student will get it first time. Why are Atheists so thick skulled?

If he want to swerve away from scientific embarrassment, over to belief, I will be happy to accommodate him for 15 mins before I go for Coffee.

Dude throughout this argument, I didn't insult ur intelligence.

butterflyl1on:
NO.

They said a God can exist without us PERCEIVING ITS EXISTENCE and not BELIEVING ITS EXISTENCE. note the difference.

This was why i said that if this is their position then why are they asking for OBJECTIVE EVIDENCE FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD or is sensory perception not objectivity?

NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT BELIEF HERE. WE ARE ON ABOUT SENSORY PERCEPTION.

OK man, sensory perception
Look at what I said about unicorns
We can't just assume God exists because he can exist without us sensing him.

butterflyl1on:
NO.

They said a God can exist without us PERCEIVING ITS EXISTENCE and not BELIEVING ITS EXISTENCE. note the difference.

This was why i said that if this is their position then why are they asking for OBJECTIVE EVIDENCE FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD or is sensory perception not objectivity?

NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT BELIEF HERE. WE ARE ON ABOUT SENSORY PERCEPTION.

OK man, sensory perception
Look at what I said about unicorns

butterflyl1on:
Budaatum already answered you.



Even you already answered yourself and I quote you directly




This echoes budaatums comment and BOTH OF YOU ARE ATHEISTS?

so objectively God can exist with or without your perception right?

So why asking for evidence if you said the above?

Like I said, face a mirror and curse who you see in the mirror for exposing you

Come on man, yes they said something can exist without you believing it exists. They didn't say it definitely exists if u don't believe in it.
So I say a god can exist without us believing it exists, not that it definitely exists.
What do we do then, we find proof to cement our stance that it exists not just assume that it exists.
Unicorns might exist if u don't believe they do, but we don't just assume they do, we have to find proof for certain that they exist.
The argument that hopefulLandlord and Budatuum brought does not support the theistic stance, it goes both ways
I think this is the 3rd time I'm typing this;
People believing a god doesn't exist does not stop him from existing if he already does, so also people believing he exists does not make him exist if he doesn't.

butterflyl1on:
You are imploding bro.

We are talking about God and not unicorns or teapots in space or aliens or spaghetti monsters (stay on track)

First you say Gods CAN EXIST WITHOUT ANYONE SEEING, FEELING HIM, ETC

then from saying THEY CAN EXIST you jumped eons forward and declared THE FACT IS THAT THOUGH THEY CAN EXIST THEY CATEGORICALLY DO NOT EXIST

you are sweating up a storm right now I can tell

If one does not need to have a sensory perception of something before that thing would exist why they is God an exception? Is he not also seen as an object in our objective world? (according to you)?

How can God not categorically exist when you said and I quote



Can God not stand in His own right and have nothing to do with the eye of the beholder?

The argument can go both ways
The fact that I have no proof that God exists does not stop him from existing
But also, the fact you believe that he exists does not make him exist

butterflyl1on:
How can God not exist when you already said something can exist without us experiencing it?

So I ask again is this not your statement?
Based on your declaration can God exist without you experiencing him?

I might not be getting the discussion fully, but I'd like to drop my 2 cents
I feel something can exist without you observing it, but that does not mean it definitely exist.
So there 'could' be a god without us experiencing it, but that doesn't mean there is.
But the chances of that god(if it exists) being the Christian God is slim.
So what I get here is that saying god doesn't exist does not stop him from existing(if he does), and saying that god exists does not make him exist if he doesn't.

All in all, I feel this arguments are of little use for the parties involved cause no matter the points given whether in favour of theists or atheists, there is always going to be a way around it.

ScienceWatch:
JacksonD7, I take my hat off to you in public Sir. I have shown your study on Atheism to many of my Atheist friends and they say you have found the Holy Grail of Atheism. They are impressed and afraid at the same time.

I sincerely doubt if you have atheist friends

Can the Christians in the thread not disagree with anything sciencewatch says.
Because he's a Christian, you are Christians and are arguing against atheists, that doesn't mean you'll agree with everything he says.
There's no way you can't at least find a few statements he makes ridiculous.

If you've been converted to Christianity or become an atheist from any of these arguments pls signify.

I'm not talking on behalf of all atheists, but I used to argue against religion, but mostly Christianity.
I had my reasons
I live in a Christian environment, my parents are Christians, and it affects me so much, from my point of view, it has it's benefits but has it's disadvantages (which I think is more[personal opinion]).
I'm forced to go to church, I don't force people not to go to church, my mum is the most religious person I know, she can pay her full salary in church with no back up 4 the month, it affects her.I'm forced to stay up 4 vigils cuz of something I don't believe in.If I tell my parents I'm an atheist, our relationship is as good as dead. Everything is taken in the spiritual context. You are busy during the weekdays, you have just Saturdays and Sundays to relax or do whatever, but one of the days would be sacrificed, you might even go 4 one practice or the other on Saturday too. I know other people that'll be doing far better without christianity, so I just try to make people see reason. I don't really know any Muslims so I tried to reason with the religious people around me(who were Christians).
I bet if I came from a Muslim background and I became an atheist I'd be arguing against Islam and all.
But then everything is a waste of time. Everyone thinks they are right and everyone else is wrong. I might be wrong 4 all I care, I'm an atheist because I feel the evidence points to the fact that there is no God, but I could be wrong, no one knows 4 sure.
I think it's very rare 4 an atheist to become a Christian and vice versa from just arguments, cuz everyone is just trying to defend their own view no matter what. The argument is started with the attitude of I'm right and you're wrong. I feel anyone that becomes an atheist or Christian has to do his own thinking, so all this is a waste of time(my opinion)

On behalf of some atheists, we agree with you that we are not free thinkers.
You are absolutely right, we agree with everything you said and we hereby cancel every other possibility, opinion and the likes.

1Sharon:
Have you actually considered that oledepo and adebole may be atheists?

Yeah, very very likely

HardMirror:
He is on the right track anyway, i just hope he does not limit his scrutiny to pastors but all what he believes as a christian.

Truth is one can only remain a christian by being dishonest and non-inquisitive

True that

I've actually thought of the possibility of him being an atheist in disguise, but I doubt that.

But I'll be surprised if he ends up still practicing Christianity

ScienceWatch:
What plain truth are you offering a suffering humanity? I notice you can not even solve for x which is a mundane secular low-level thing. X+3/X-2 - 1-X/x =17/4

How on earth can you even dream of challenging Christians on their far superior thinking and beliefs?

Christians are superior in thinking to atheists?

EVarn:
Yeah, suit yourself.

Argument Ended

Nice one bruv

Is it ur breast?

Good for him
I think as long as the python is well fed, there's no danger cuz they don't eat often

jamariwolf:
Rubbish thread. Una go just dey imagine nonsense. Wait, So you'd actually sleep with your wife's sister? Tueh. Men are scum for real.

Oml, I'm tired of seeing this shii, stop classifying everybody into one freaking group, many humans are 'scum', males and females, but not all.

In the comments, everybody just trolled this guy

Is that not Efosa?

1. Being A Pedestrian
2. Being A Driver
3. Being A Cyclist
4. Having A Phone
5. Being A Youth
6. Not Being A Youth
7. Living

FlySly05:
SleekBack, is that you niqqur

Nope, it's A love-vendor Named SleekBack

Couldn't have put it any better

pu7pl3:
Lol I know people have prescriptions to take weed from doctors and I know alchohol is more devastating than weed but my argument is where he said weed doesn't make you high that its just your mindset and that the only thing weed makes you do is fall asleep...bruh that's a blatant lie

It makes you high, but personally, what I feel is that weed does not make one run mad, it only triggers it

What I mean is that, the person already has it in his/her genes, like he might be schizophrenic or have tendencies, but the weed will only cause the "manifestation".

Besides, I'm still in the university, studying optometry, a 6 years course, and on a 1st class

I take weed from time to time, and it has had no effect on my studies

Everything you do in school is simply time management