₦airaland Forum

UMUAZEE:
Like you said, everyone has a past, if they decide to document their past it becomes history.

You still don't get it. You can't wake up today and start documenting things which took place 600 years ago.
You need to be an eyewitness to the era which you are describing for your "documentation" to be historical.

You still can't understand that there is a known past and an unknown one. The known past is known thanks to eyewitness-written documents. The unknown past is unknown due to lack of such documents for that period of time.

You seem to believe in magic 🪄, how else would you have "oral accounts" of a period of time which is located more than 600 years in the past ? You are confusing mere stories no different from science fiction or fantastic novels with actual history and actual past.

The fact you think you are as educated and intellectually actif as me is a little bit insulting to say the least. I'm trying to educate you and you seem to believe I'm debating you.

AutomaticMotors:
Bro let's connect I need to discuss with you outside nairaland

I left social media some time ago, but I will send you a new email address. I have to make a new email address in order to avoid giving my identity away in this platform.

Arabk25:
He made some valued point here but unfortunately Nigeria is in the hands of hoodlums and criminals thereby making it difficult for the technocrat to come in.
Nigeria is in the hands of those hooligans who sat at the back or on the window during lecture time. Unfortunate situation

If you are smart, then it's best you sit at the back or else you would have all eyes on you 🤣
You should have kept "sat at the window" and removed "sat at the back". It is a rookie mistake to sit at the front when you are going to interject in the lecture a lot.

AreaFada2:
Dude, I ignored your previous rant. I am not your student. Please stay on your lane. Where exactly do you teach? I am happy to invite you to where I do my work. Mentoring the very brightest minds of their generation.

First go and undo what Oba Ewuare II said about Oranmiyan at his coronation and remove Oranmiyan from The Red Book. Then come back and argue. Have you written your own book on the topic yet? Do so and dismiss everything the palace has said on Oranmiyan and present it to the palace.

Write whatever you know and leave it at that. Don't seek to monopolise knowledge. You are too small to even attempt that. NEVER quote me again.

Thank you.

Your lazy brain and your pride. Bad combo.
You seem to think your "knowledge" is worth mine, while you should have been learning from me and you should have left your toxic pride far far away.
You are at the level of confusing fairytales with actual history. I was trying to bring you up to the level of knowing the difference between fairytale and history. But somehow you thought both of us lived in parallel universes and therefore in your universe, you could be right ?

madjune:
Ukraine is known to supply 70% of the world's wheat and other food commodities;

You need to be smart enough to distinguish war propaganda from actual facts. Russia has more grain than Ukraine, so how can Ukraine be supplying 70% of the world's wheat ?
Make it make sense. When reading, use your brain to analyse what you read before just believing it.
Nigerians used to be better at analysing information, but your current generation of Nigerians is just like a bunch of brain-dead zombies.

Benin, a true emperor, a true history.
Not the 419 yarri.ba monarchy and "history".
https://uniquemaps.eu/products/rare-old-map-of-africa-1747-by-emanuel-bowen-pre-colonial-handcoloured-slave-trade-negroland-ethiopia-barbary-nubia?currency=EUR&variant=43501503971558&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google%20Shopping&cmp_id=21218862151&adg_id=&kwd=&device=m&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw57exBhAsEiwAaIxaZq1XzZWLmjRymmGc7jWcpTKshT4k9mklhU4qkyzGkSRh9qVqrw4XnxoC9ZIQAvD_BwE


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aELM8h_euNI?feature=shared

AnambraPikinSel:
Tame ooni of ife?what is there to be obsessed about inferior Yoruba king called Oku opolo in Benin palace? We don't come to your palace to claim anything,your people came to ile ife because they know their Origin yet you still audacity to blame us.

Authenticity check:
1. Locate bight of Ife
2. Locate Ife republic.
3. Show me a precolonial map of Ife
4. What battle against the British did Ife do ?
5. Show me the ancient palace of Ife ?

Even your own brothers admitted on nairaland that Ife is just a place which the yoruba chose in awolowo's era as their "source". It has nothing to do with actual history, it is just politics. The oni of ife is just a priest with a small priest-dom called ife.

Benin Empire and even oyo kingdom have many such priests and the oni was just one of such priests under the alafin of oyo.

The oni isn't even fit to be a king, but you guys want to call him emperor 🤣
And you want to compare him with an actual emperor whose treasures are still sitting in multiple museums accros western Europe and America ?

If you want to locate oni of ife's crown, look at the picture below:

Instead of talking about real history, some would rather be talking about Spiderman oh sorry oduduwa.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aELM8h_euNI?feature=shared

AreaFada2:
So, a matrilineal guy (with a bit of money) from Ogiamien family and with the recognised Chief Ogiamien missing for years now tells a story and that is your plausible version of history? First ask them to present the young man installed as chief Ogiamien to come and tell his family history. There is a full book on Ogiamien in Benin. Go and read it in full, not this online nonsense you see.

My point is that there are too many versions of Oduduwa. The Ooni can say anything just like anybody else but we need a consistent version. I have a stake in it. I have a direct Oduduwa link through a different Yoruba dynasty.

Areafada, your brain is lazy. I've tried to give you respect in the past, but I can only notice your inability to learn.
Once again, oduduwa never existed, it is just a made up story, a fairytale.
Why didn't you learn after all I posted in front of your eyes ?
You are not a kid! just stop living in fairytales!
You've seen precolonial maps and texts, you ignored those and chose to dwell on stories?
Those stories were made to take Benin's prestige away from Benin and give them to the oni of Ife, but your brain doesn't comprehend this ! The oni is nothing but a village priest, and thanks to intellectually lazy people like you, he is parading himself as an emperor in 2024, a year in which education is cheap.
You just can't rise your iq up a little bit, can you ?

Remember this sentence:
"A fool and his money are soon parted".
You foolishly let the yoruba steal your heritage while believing you are the smart one. You make me think of this Andrew in the story below:

Kevin had no money and Andrew was rich, so Kevin went to Andrew and said "Andrew all your money belongs to me, give it to me", Andrew replied "no you are a liar, only half of my money belongs to you, I will give you only half". Andrew thought he was being smart and he was happy that he was able to keep half of his original wealth, while Kevin had actually gained half of Andrew's wealth without doing any work for it.

Having a lazy brain is the worse curse of all. I can't articulate how disappointed I am in you, what a disgrace, after I spent years spreading education on nairaland... What a pity.

Olu317:
You haven't changed a bit with your false views.

Ooni will always state the obvious fact. But oba biini with multifaceted incoherent irritant falsehood can ne'er stand the test of time.

Authenticity check:
1. Locate bight of Ife
2. Locate Ife republic.
3. Show me a precolonial map of Ife
4. What battle against the British did Ife do ?
5. Show me the ancient palace of Ife ?

Even your own brothers admitted on nairaland that Ife is just a place which the yoruba chose in awolowo's era as their "source". It has nothing to do with actual history, it is just politics. The oni of ife is just a priest with a small priest-dom called ife.

Benin Empire and even oyo kingdom have many such priests and the oni was just one of such priests under the alafin of oyo.

The oni isn't even fit to be a king, but you guys want to call him emperor 🤣
And you want to compare him with an actual emperor whose treasures are still sitting in multiple museums accros western Europe and America ?

If you want to locate oni of ife's crown, look at the picture below:

Guys listen well: there was no odudiwa, there was no oranmiyan, all these are stories like Peter Pan story, like spider man story...

This is 2024, for God's sake.

@UMUAZEE
The thing which people like you fail to understand is the concept of "unknown past". You guys seem to believe that whatever happened in the past must be known today by people born several hundred years after that past ?

I don't know if you've followed the hard work which specialists do in order to unearth the past of Egypt. Yet you think you and "elders" can just as easily as that unearth the history of Benin, without doing any work ?

And in the case of Egypt, the Egyptians have had a written language for more than 2000 years !
Reading the scriptures left behind is what constitutes the history of Egypt.

History needs eyewitness written documents, that is the basis of history ! Benin has a history which started around the 1400's: that means eyewitness written documents describing Benin were written as early as the 1400's. It doesn't mean we didn't exist prior to the 1400's. Stop trying to fill the unknown past with fairytales! That is just nonsense!
(The yoruba do not have any history, that is why they are pretending fairytales are their history)
Our known past (History: based on eyewitness written documents) is too long for us to be wasting time on fairytales about unknown past which would be more than 600 years backward !

samuk:
...

I know you get it, you understand what history is, but it seems many of our brothers just can't make the intellectual effort.
It is not that they have bad intentions or that they are not trying to defend our cultural heritage, it is just that they refuse to evolve intellectually and remain stuck at a semi-literate state which was the norm around 60 years ago.
How on hell do people still believe those fairytales in 2024 ?

Guys listen well: there was no odudiwa, there was no oranmiyan, all these are stories like Peter Pan story, like spider man story...

I tried to teach this to our media savvy brother (I won't say his name to avoid backlash on him, but I think you know whom I'm talking about), he ended up insulting me on facebook, for the crime of trying to bring education to him.

UMUAZEE:
Bro our history did not start with the first visit of the westerners/Europeans.. The Europeans documented what they saw or met on ground and we have all seen that.
I was referring to our history long before the coming of the Europeans, that history wasn't documented.. we rely on oral accounts.

I'm not using kid's gloves with you anymore.
You don't know what history is.
Your intellectual laziness is killing our culture !
"History" and "past" are two different things.
Everybody has a past ! But not everybody has a history ! Do you understand that ?
History is a bunch of events which are proven, not a bunch of fairytales told by story tellers describing a period of time which is hundreds of years before their birth.

You can't understand this because you are not using your brain fully. You believe "elders" have magical powers to do some time travel and see what took place hundreds of years before they were born ?
History is the study of eyewitness-written documents. You don't need to be a genius to understand this.

This is 2024 and your brain is stuck in 1970. Your brain is lazy, very lazy.

RedboneSmith:
There are only two Benin people I have met on this platform who I can say I have learnt from. Both of them have left this forum: PhysicsQED and Bokohalal. Now these two guys (especially the former) knew their stuff. Exceptionally well-read and able to articulate their points with proper academic references. I didn't always agree with them, but at least I could respect their opinions. But as for the rest of you, there's nothing to choose between you all and the guy in a beer parlour talking about how Nnamdi Azikiwe turned into a fly and flew into a bottle.

Dude, what exactly makes you think I value your judgement ? 🤣
This is as if after a physicist tries to teach some physics to a 6 year old, the six year old comes and tells the physicist that the physicist sucks at physics and some other guy is much better than him 🤣
Ok dummy.

RedboneSmith:
Lmao. So without being familiar with his work (a man widely acclaimed as one of the greatest Africanists of the 20th century, by the way), you've called him an idiot and a crook. How logical. How scholarly. How intellectually unlazy. 😂

If a guy wrote a book of how you can get to the moon by jumping very high, I would also disregard his book and call him a lunatic without reading his book, so long I know the crazy and false thesis which his book defends.
If a mathematician writes a book of how 1=2, I will also disregard that book without reading it and call him a lunatic, because I already have proof of
not(1=2).

You are intellectually disabled, I'm not. You are food for crooks like the white guy whom you quoted, I'm not.
I'm smart, you're dumb. We don't go by the same rules. I don't care about people's names or reputations, I look at the logic of what they are saying. I've had some of the best mathematicians in the world as my professors, I never hesitated to contradict them while I was their student, and guess what, I was right each time. I am never impressed with people's names or reputations. None of that matters to me.

We don't operate at the same levels of knowledge, you are a consumer of created knowledge, I'm a creator of knowledge.
I spend more time writing books than reading anything. Right now I've got three books which I'm writing. Two of them are in pause, I've almost finished the third one.
Me and you, not the same species in terms of intelligence.

vikaosi:
Significant amount of the money will be spent in US industries producing arms. It is not like all of it is free cash to those countries.

In that case what is the difference with just distributing that money to the poor citizens of the USA for free ? It would be even better than giving the money to billionaires and having the billionaires give crumbs to a few selected poor people known as "the workers".
You could also use that money to build bridges, or to rebuild the failing infrastructure or for health-care. What does making bombs for Ukraine add to the lives of average poor USA citizens ?

If the USA wants to use it's money to build stuff to send abroad to non Americans for no benefit to americans, then they should send me some billions worth of apple computers 💻 That would be more useful than building bombs for people whom are about to be defeated and to surrender those bombs to Russia.

RedboneSmith:
Show me your peer-reviewed papers. Where have you been published?

"Not as dumb as you". More of that over-inflated sense of importance. I've seen your discussions here; and no you're not very bright. But I understand why you think you are. People who have only seen their d.icks will swear they have the biggest one.

🤣🤣
Dude, I'm not going to reveal my identity. I'm not interested in being harassed by an army of Nigerian trolls.
By the way some years ago, I was schooling you on nairaland with an other handle.

RedboneSmith:
One question: Have you read any of Vansina's books? I am not asking if you buy into his ideas or not. Scholars disagree and that's okay.

I just want to know: Have you read any of his books, especially "Oral Tradition as History"?

You have described his ideas to me enough for me to know he's a crook, I don't have time to read the rantings of foolish crooks.

"Oral tradition as history", the title gives it away, oral "tradition" is not history, just fairytales told by storytellers.

RedboneSmith:
Jan Vansina did not spend his entire professional career developing an elaborate methodology for mining historical truth from tradition for you to be saying this in 2024.

Jan Vansina was an idiot and a crook, he may have fooled you, but I'm not as dumb as you.
How silly of you to think that just throwing in someone's name without actual logical arguments would win your arguments. You don't think with logic, you think with name recognition, your proof is "Jan Vansina" not actual logic. Grow up !

Remember the expression:
"A fool and his money are soon parted"
So please let us not be fools.

UMUAZEE:
Benin history wasn't documented on paper by our ancestors, we can only make sense of the oral accounts given by our elders.

This is what I am talking about, you don't even know that our region has been recieving frequent visits from Europeans right from the 1400's. Those guys had a written language, they wrote down what they saw and made maps of the region. It is like you never even heard of this.
History is the study of eyewitness written documents, not the study of tales told by people who were born hundreds of years after the period of time which they are describing.

How many years have I spent posting such documents on nairaland and explaining what history actually is, yet each time I leave, you guys just forget everything and revert back to fairytales. This is what I meant by intellectual laziness.

LegendHero:
Yes what’s wrong with my statement? Oba of Benin spoke carelessly and we insulted him so his sense can go back to default.

Ever since then, have you seen him speak carelessly again about Yorubaland?

Oh, do you remember that gay slave you call Oni (or ho.rny) of ife ? Yeah, the guy who wears a dil.do as a crown.
Mr man, your Yorubaland is in Brazil in which your ancestors were slaves before they were deported to our land. In Brazil your ancestors were working the plantations of the whites.

Oni crown below:

Sorry to say this, but you guys are very intellectually lazy. And that is a threat to keeping or even knowing your ancestral heritage.
Benin Empire has such a great and eyewitness-written history, but instead of tapping into that, you guys would rather discuss fairytales and whatever story anybody says, you guys believe at least half of the story. This is pitiful.

UMUAZEE:
Ogiamen has no claim to the throne, he is just spitting rubbish. He was never meant to be on the throne and even if he ruled, it wasn't going to be forever. So that family now claiming after almost 900years to be the rightful ruler of Benin is nonsense.

The point which you are missing is that ogiamien story is a fairytale which doesn't have any historical basis. But you guys are devaluating the authenticity of Benin by dwelling on fairytales. That is why ogiamien is able to create a claim for himself, and look at you, you are already half-believing him.
Intellectual laziness will have you and your heritage taking different paths, 419 will take your heritage while you will keep dwelling in fairytales.
Ogiamien family is a traitor's family, they betrayed Oba Ovonramwen, that is why the invading British troops burnt down all Benin city's houses except that of the ogiamien. That non burnt ancient Benin house and the intellectual laziness of our youths is what fuels the ogiamien.
Being smart is not a thing which you only do when you are at school and you want to get a good grade, you need to be smart everyday or you lose what belongs to you.

@Areafada, why don't you ever use the historical documents which I shared (precolonial maps and precolonial texts). As soon as I leave nairaland, the level of discussions about history goes back to that of discussing fairytales.
Why would you want to remain at the level of the yoruba fairytale peddlers when properly researched history proves Benin supremacy ?
Yoruba have no history beyond their past as slaves in Brazil, that is why they pretend fairytales are their history, that is a good excuse for them. My question is therefore why would a noble Edo person also go into confusing fairytales with history while he could just do the proper research with proper logic and be vindicated ?

I even laid down how historical research is done, I brought out historical documents and sources for more historical documents, but you guys just can't learn, as soon as I leave, you dumb down to yoruba level of confusing fairytale and history. The yoruba do it because their ancestors were slaves, you do it because you are too lazy.

You people's intellectual laziness is what will destroy us all.

@Areafada
@Samuk

Guys, there is a video of some impostors dressed in Benin attire who go to the meet the Oni of ife call him their father and give him greetings reserved to the Oba of Benin. The impostors also recount that oranmiyan fairytale and call it "what we know". The impostors are part of a theatrical group, but the video online is claiming the Oba of Benin sent them. The ennemies of Benin are already using it as propaganda. Why have nobody addressed that ? This is yet an other attack on us and you guys just let it go ? Someone needs to tame the Oni of ife and his obsession with Benin monarchy.

I've said it many times before that it were time to put those fairytales to death, and use true scientific research of history instead. Nobody listened, and now you have some impostors calling themselves "ogiso" and trying to discredit the Benin throne.

You don't fight a fairytale with your own fairytale when you can just do proper historical research and you would be vindicated ! But for that, you need to be willing to use your brains and not be intellectually lazy.

I have to get back to ignoring some nonentities in here. Indeed, I talk to one person, an other person replies, then I reply then a third person jumps in...
At the end of the day, I'm taking to 10 people...
I really don't have time for this rubbish.

I give up on trying to educate you on this, most Nigerians (you included) are too arrogant to be educated. I've wasted enough time already. I'm not going to repeat my arguments which you apparently need to reread several times until you manage to grasp them.

Take care.

Appleyard:
The term "power to all the people" means the right of all the citizens to participate in the business of government, and that right basically manifest from electing their leaders during elections, which MUST be free and fair to reinforce the notion that real power resides with the people--the sovereign, and it's only through them can the government derive its legitimacy. But, ALL of the people can NEVER agree on one thing in toto, hence the majority factor in order to reach a compromise. This is what every sane country that practice democracy is practicing. Anything else like the American EC system is not a democracy.

There is what is called "representative democracy," which is best demonstrated by the federal system of government under which the social, economic, and political interests of units with less demographies are protected. Representative democracy through the auspices of popular voting does not nullify the power of those smaller demographies, nor does it relegate them to the background, like the die-hard EC system fans wants you to believe. Even the US practice representative democracy, with the EC system being the only aberration.






You just made me laugh. Using Nigeria to measure the efficacy of the majority vote pattern that defines a true democracy does not negate the fact that the system works perfectly elsewhere. The issue with Nigeria goes beyond mere demographic battle. When you have a political society where the political ideologies of the politicians are driven by greed and corruption, there is always going to be rigging, whether or not you divide the national voting pattern equally. That Nigeria is like this doesn't mean that the popular voting is trash. Mexico, Germany, Brazil, Switzerland, and Canada are typical examples of countries that operate a federal system where the president or prime minister or whatever name they call him/her is chosen through a majority voting pattern, which, of course, differ among the aforementioned countries. And they are doing great by it. And all of them by operations agrees and conform to the idea that democracy is simply the government of the people in a majority format.

The idea of nationally distributing the voting rights equally does not exist anywhere operationally, and I can tell you that the American EC model actually create the problems you think it was meant to solve. I can update you more on this point.

WriiterNg:
⚡Meanwhile on French TV, they are discussing how French soldiers can fight in Ukraine against Russian Army.

French Army Colonel Vincent Arbaretier talks about two scenarios for the actions of French troops in Ukraine:

The first is to concentrate troops along the Dnieper River.

The second scenario: Troops are concentrated on the border with Belarus.

“I think that these two options can be mixed, that is, send French troops along the Dnieper and around Kyiv to tell the Russians: do not go further, otherwise you risk coming under our fire, including our unconventional fire.”

Gambling with the lives of soldiers and also with nuclear war 😟
It seems these guys don't take into account that Russia has the world's biggest nuclear arsenal and biggest land mass.
This guy doesn't know that general iskander and colonel khinzal arrive at the war front before russian regulars do.