Controlv: Apologies for the long epistle, but this is the shortest piece I could think of!
After paying nearly £50k in DEAD MONEY rent over the last 4 years (thanks to IHS and visa fees on graduate and work visas, which apparently does not count as contributing to the British economy), I am excited to announce that we collected the keys to our new home last week.
It still feels surreal. Not only is the house in a choice neighbourhood, it is bigger than every place we’ve ever rented here, more beautiful, and far better value for money.
Many thanks to @Semmyk for starting this thread, @justwise, @Ticha, @Solumtoya, @Santa2 for all the wisdom shared along the way, and of course, oga @Lexusgs430 for the consistent reminder that rent money is dead money.
I consider myself very lucky to have found this thread early. We keyed into LISA since 2023, and very piece of information shared here played a big role in making our mortgage journey smooth. This thread, and indeed Nairaland, is a goldmine of knowledge.
A number of people advised us not to buy because of the COS/ILR rogbodiyan flying around, but the thought of losing another £12k a year paying our landlord’s mortgage + profit was all the conviction we needed. If you still have a good time on your COS and still hesitating, my honest advice is JUST DO IT (not a financial advise). Worst case, you lose a small amount (in transaction fees) if we are all asked to leave tomorrow but it is nothing compared to years of rent disappearing into thin air. All die na die.
The journey was not smooth. We would have bought last year, but our COS arrived late and the landlord had already served a S.21 notice. That forced us into another fixed‑term tenancy (agents refused a 6‑month break clause, and we had limited options anyway). But despite all the bumps, we made it in the end.
Goke7: The thing shock me gan. It’s a deliberate fabricated system to actually keep the London economy going 😂 and we say it’s the third world countries or whatever they call it that are corrupt? Issorite
As for Reform am just waiting for the PM himself to finally tell us who he is instead of all this drama, he needs to come outside finally 😂
Starmer is dodging bullets.
Funny thing is that he appears to be a decent chap that tried to make some measured decisions but then, the people want radical change and change it would be. To me, Starmer had only one major job which he struggled at- which was to guide our recent entrants to ILR.
BTW, what's the update with Mahmoods 10-30yr ILR bill? Seems suicide bombers in labour have halted her. Most of those MPs know they're going down- they might as well cause wahala.
Seems Aunty K is still missing from the dance floor. With the poor performance by Labour, one would have expected her popularity to increase but she's still not part of the equation.
Goke7: 😂 It’s just better to avoid listening to things like this cos abeg I no wan get headache!
The same rich folks are the ones saying the country has been invaded by foreigners to continue to distract from criminal activities like this! They are also the major sponsors of the reform party, na average Brits I just pity especially the ones that rely majorly on welfare from the govt
Hehe...
Seriously, without seeing this, I'd have struggled to conceptualise how well entrenched such a system is. We all know those Islands as tax havens but we never really see the British part of them. It's an eye-opener.
As per Reform, our British Trump seems locked in. The funny thing is that most reform voters hate Trump but like it when Trumpian policies are applied locally. Some things do seem inevitable at this stage- certain lessons could always to be learned twice.
justwise: This video is an eye opener, the UK tax system is a system within a system
What surprises me is that a well-established system like this gets very little media attention.
I've always wondered why those islands were popular. Appear they are a sophisticated state-sanctioned means of tax evasion or whitewashing global wealth. The nation has done an almost perfect job of keeping them at arms length while still reaping the benefits of their action
Like I've always said, these summits are disgraceful.
African leaders need to understand that nobody wil develop Africa for us. We need to do that ourselves. There is now a long list of individual countries organising 'summits' with Africa only to parade leaders as trophies while handing them crumbs. How would we get respected with such display?
These summits should better be done between African nations on how to improve intercontinental trade, transport and integration.
A good section of the UK certainly runs on tax avoidance. I remember reading something similar on how the now defunct non-dom status was set up by the UK to fleece India and other colonies of taxing certain british folks. Imagine if it was another country had this vast set-up of tax avoidance.... it'd be constant stories of xyz
Goodenoch: To be honest I don’t know why people are taking someone who signs their initials on Nairaland posts seriously 😄
E say na ‘TV’😂 On this same NL? come on nau. TV nìkan kọ́, Television ni
What more proof do you need that posturing on Nairaland and writing those long-winded, pompous but essentially meaningless posts is how they derive satisfaction in life?
Arguing with him and his like will just stress you out for no reason because they clearly just love to hear themselves talk and everything you say will just be seen as an opportunity to bloviate some more.
Oddly, I didn’t bother reading the last post. Looked at how long it was and said 'not worth the time'
The funny thing is that 3-5yrs ago, if I encountered a similar post on NL, I'd be wondering to myself who this person is. But with what I know of the UK today, I'm over 90% certain that bloke lives off benefits. I can just about imagine him speak. It's the pomposity of such people that did my head in
jedisco: Now that spambot abi mods don free me... mk I continue my mussings.
Talking about 'we groups'. Two things have always got me wondering.
First- At what point in the psyche of some first/second gen migrants do they start seeing themselves as the 'chosen group' 'better than others' or 'gatekeepers'? This is rampant even in politics today- folks whose parents came on a boat or as asylum seekers (not that any of that matters) would turn around and say 'my parents were not like them' when referring to perfectly legal residents. What's worse is that it's mainly on recent migrants dem dey get power.
It's no longer enough to be here or even be a citizen. You now have to be part of their special group of ever-increasing senselessness. We'd soon be hearing phrases with 'we the Brits hardcore', Brit XL, Brit promax. Abi Brit-Roman, Brit-AngloSaxon, Brit-Jute e.t.c. Personally, na Brit-landlord group I dey wait. Na that one be my calling.
In all, opinions are like a**holes... everybody has one. ...
The second is like unto the first.
Is there something they put in certain British kpali that people get high when they receive it? Always wondered... one on NL was annoyed that it was getting easier for Nigerians to migrate to the UK saying the UK has lost it's mojo. The other said we were insulting Brits for raising concerns. Now its 'we Brits'..
I just don't get it. There's definitely more to life than a kpali. I shared here yrs back how it took me several weeks of contemplating to decide if I should stay back for my kpali after almost 4yrs in. A friend of mine who I had been encouraging to buy a place while waiting for his woke one morning and japa'd. Since then, I have seen an increasing number of colleagues contest thesame dilema. Oddly, after I saw the 'we Brits' post, I went one of my 'we groups' on FB and saw the post screenshoted below.
I usually remember my kpali when it's time to travel or for certain ID checks. What is in this kpali that makes folks see it as their greatest achievement to the extent of bragging endlessly about it? Is it underachieving in facets of life that matter? Those who have received theirs, please share let me know if I'm missing something.
[quote author=justwise post=139313819][/quote]The NL spambot is set up in an awkward manner. The criteria upon which it bans words is quite vague and varied. For a while, I noticed words like st0cks, e.t.c related to investing can attract a ban in a weird in a non-specific manner. NL is the only fora where I see this happening.
Even if a post is automatically banned, it should be reviewed by a human and if valid, the ban extended. If not (and recurrent), the coding for the bot looked into. There should be AI spambots that get better with time. Let Seun know to look into this.
Now that spambot abi mods don free me... mk I continue my mussings.
Talking about 'we groups'. Two things have always got me wondering.
First- At what point in the psyche of some first/second gen migrants do they start seeing themselves as the 'chosen group' 'better than others' or 'gatekeepers'? This is rampant even in politics today- folks whose parents came on a boat or as asylum seekers (not that any of that matters) would turn around and say 'my parents were not like them' when referring to perfectly legal residents. What's worse is that it's mainly on recent migrants dem dey get power.
It's no longer enough to be here or even be a citizen. You now have to be part of their special group of ever-increasing senselessness. We'd soon be hearing phrases with 'we the Brits hardcore', Brit XL, Brit promax. Abi Brit-Roman, Brit-AngloSaxon, Brit-Jute e.t.c. Personally, na Brit-landlord group I dey wait. Na that one be my calling.
In all, opinions are like a**holes... everybody has one. ...
TV01: It must be hard. Living in what is a spiralling situation . Knowing what average, good or even great would look like. Knowing that it isn't even new and can't be that hard. But everyday you seem to be moving further away from what shouldn't be too difficult or take too long to achieve.
Nigeria has been your lived experience and yet you have no idea when it will get better, let alone good. You can't say with any confidence when and how it will get better or admit that it is fast deteriorating?
The cope must be painful. The strawman of "white-skin good, black skin bad" gives one a nice out and even the smugness of sounding virtuous, but it doesn't answer any questions.
No one is making the race argument, but the fact remains that societies arising out of the western cultural milieu are altogether better, generally more ordered, better administered and more advanced. The question of why that is and, how and when Nigeria will level up still remains.
If it helps, move away from Nigeria, Africa even. Indian nationals run Mag7 companies. Have high ranking operators in all the western nations where they have a significant presence. So it's clear it's nothing about them as humans beings, or their skin tone. But their home nation is still relatively backward.
"Why" is not an unreasonable question to ask? How India will level up should be in view. Especially when Indian nationals are flocking to the West. Because if those questions are not asked and Indians continue to migrate, what is that saying exactly?
On the contrary, no one said you had no history , culture or traditions. The question is "what in that culture, those traditions or the history suggest what Nigeria may have developed into in lieu of slavery, or absent colonialism.
I have heard all sorts. That left alone, Africans would have been launching satellites. The science "white" people used to advance, was stolen from "black" people. I hear it casually mentioned in black settings that black people have "better genes" or superior intellects - to nods of agreement.
Listen carefully. At the time of slavery, Africans were trading people for beads, mirrors and umbrellas. Nothing near the apex technologies or innovations the west had even then. Does that suggest an advanced technological society? Or one that would have produced automobiles before the west - if at all?
That's not true though is it? "Guesstimating" is not required. Modern developing economies can project, model, track indices, map strategies, set goals and objectives, review metrics. No guessing required sir.
"Nigeria would have hers" - when, how on what basis. Your whole spiel is assertion. Mere hope as best. Like I noted in my earlier response, you say a lot but make no cogent points. Nothing that is actionable or can be pinned down, tracked or reviewed.
Your point about "tremendous development being achieved in a single generation" makes the case against Nigeria, not for. The nations that "achieved" development of this nature, did it simply happen for them spontaneously, or out of nowhere? No roadmap, no vision, no blueprints?
All the developed nations had an upward trajectory. SA reverted to black-majority rule barely a generation ago. Is it as good today? Is it better? What is its trajectory?
I'll give you double for your money. If you admit people from less-developed nations into a functional society at scale, it will experience rapid deterioration - whatever their colour.
Yep, if TV01 says Jedisco can't progress, and Jedisco doesn't progress, it's TV01's fault for being a naysayer. Listen to yourself.
TV
I'd respond to both your quotes at once.
Your writings are too verbose' rash and scattered for someone who considers his 'we group' to be the 'true Brits'. One thing I appreciate about the British is their use of the language. A properly educated Brit would say/write same thing you said but in few lines while still passing across the same meaning.
It must take a special form of emptiness to feel the need to always voice ones nationality on a faceless forum. One would ask- is that all there is to your life?
The problem we have in the UK today is when folks like you who are probably on benefits with little or no economic contribution have an overinflated ego thinking we're still in the days of the British empire when in actual fact that's long gone and the current generation face the prospect of having poorer outcomes than their parents.
geekybabe: Hate Trump all you want. Trump is not the prime minister of Canada. Canada has its own deep seated problems that even inter-provincial trade is a bottle neck. Thousands of job are at stake if the US Canada negotiations do not go well. [/b]Several businesses in manufacturing , automobile and other industries are already feeling it. The canadian govt can 'Elbows up' all they want, but they will not replace the lost jobs because as we all know, the job situation is already a big problem. Instead, all they can do is keep giving handouts and temporary tax reliefs that are not sustainable. Increasing debts and budget deficit.
And please lets move on from this 51st state narrative. [b]It was a political jab/ banter that was never gonna happen.. Canada is a sovereign nation, a great and rich country. But Its also a nation that must start working to improve the quality of life for its people.
You're still struggling to appreciate how bullies behave. Yes, thousands of jobs rely on that deal but we'd lose those and much more if we get a bad deal. Quite convenient to excuse Trumps statements which continously belittled a close partner even before being sworn into office. Going ahead to even meet seperatists e.t.c. That's not something any serious country would take lightly. Even the UK who tried to appease Trump had to draw a line when their war veterans were insulted. They have also declined getting actively involved in the Iran war. By the way, should Canada send boots to Iran to please Trump?
Let me ask, If you were in the negotiating room with the Canadian side, how would you approach discussions?
What specific things do you expect Carney to do that he's currently failing at?
hazel01: they consume too much conservative propaganda. The US is our largest partner but Canada is also US second largest partner, losing the free trade would affect them greatly too especially with the expensive war and low approval ratings… losing the trade would make things way more expensive for them too.. this is a negotiation, they use propaganda and all to sway public opinion. The complainants on this thread don’t have all the information. You cannot know more than the current prime minister of Canada, you don’t have access to all the data and classified information they have. Yes, there is an affordability issue, but it’s everywhere, no country is spared, talking like Canada is the worst country on earth is just frustration speaking….
Hehe @conservative propaganda. It always surprises me that the default for many here is to moan about Canada, always blame Carney and praise Trump/Maga.
Negotiating a good trade deal involves wrangling and weighing strengths and weaknesses on both sides. Despite very strong ties, it still took the UK and Australia several years to eck out a deal. Arriving on a bent knee is not a national solution to Trump. The UK with much leverage tried it and got little or nothing out. The EU started on that path until it became obvious they were getting nothing out.
If Canada acquiesces and gets a very bad deal, you can be sure those asking Carney to bend the knee would still blame him
Goke7: 😂 they were all deceiving themselves that the orange man was a changed man or will be a totally different person in the second term, me I just like how everyone who told us he was the chosen one Dey collect left right and centre, from all the MAGA podcasters to the European leaders including the uk who aligned with him from the onset, everywhere blur so tey the Argentines are being encouraged to fight for Falkland Islands the uk fought for and won years ago! Na to sit down chop popcorn Dey enjoy all the movie o!
Saw the Falklands headline and though I haven't read thru, it'd sure be an interesting narrative for Trump to push - one that'd sure anger the British Another shooting it seems. This Trumps presidency is a daily opera
TV01: I mean those who live here ancestrally, by birth-right or a regulated migration pathway, who love this nation and appreciate its history and traditions. Who strive for the nations good, and contribute at a minimum by being law-abiding and being or adopting the courteous, polite, warm and welcoming nature that is the hallmark of everyday British life. We are British and Britain is ours .
I do not mean I don't mean the passport ho's or the papers tarts, or the grifters, the mercenaries, who are only here for what they can gain. Who care not for the traditions, the history or the sacrifices that built this nation. Who don't really give a toss about continuing or building on that legacy, and the ongoing flourishing of this country. Those who could not care less what direction the nation goes as long as they prosper personally.
Not those who seek to introduce or impose inimical practices from alien lands, or insist that regressive foreign behaviour can be normalised, or that backward religious legal codes can or should be enforced over our native jurisprudence.
Nor those who hail from backward countries, but are ungrateful, entitled and demanding. Those who expect everything to bend to suit them. I don't mean those who arrive here from places were lawlessness is widely accepted and cry foul and play the victim when there is pushback, who can't accept that their lawlessness in not at least winked at, if not outright celebrated.
Neither those deluded, who keep telling us there is nothing here, but won't return to the utopias they fled from . Who deride what they find, but can't point to anything worth mimicking back home.
Hope that's clear. I'll be back to respond to your earlier mewling cum tap-out later.
We permit entry to people from diverse backgrounds and with dffering beliefs - in large numbers. It's quite clear, that for many of those, politically at least, conduct and participation vary in ways that are inimical to our long-held tradition and practices. Even if that wasn't clear previously, it is now.
And, I accept, there are some that would fit right in. But the protection of our institutions and systems is paramount. A few generations to settle in and understand won't hurt .
writetopoka: Getting our independence in 1960 is the biggest mistake we have made you should have waited 2060 to request for it
People who think like you are the reason Nigeria has struggled to develop. Very low self-esteem. Colonialists only acted in their best interest and if you think they'd have ever developed Nigeria, think again and show me one place they did.
TV01: Just calling it as I see it. I have watched - mostly from afar - Nigeria for decades. All nations have challenges. That's what humans are here for - to overcome them. The question is how and when will Nigeria develop to a degree that it's citizens are are able to live decent lives and be mostly content to live there.
Fine as far as it goes, but what does it mean? What does it tell us about the when and how for Nigeria?
I did'nt say the western model was the only solution. And I did ask what native "development would look like". However the case remains that the west could at least be used as a measure. And, like the wedding adage "something old, something new, something borrowed, something blue", Nigeria can look within or take anything from anywhere and incorporate it. There isn't even the need to invent anything new.
You didn't respond to my opener?
The first of the last 2, I don't know? Who can tell. Giving the benefit of hindsight and the knowledge of how we were, in what way is it likely that we would have developed?
I see nothing that gives me the belief that Nigeria can. And so far, it hasn't. It's for whoever believes Nigeria can, to describe how and when.
TV
You're asking me to guesstimate the future which no one can. I haven't watched Nigeria from afar - it's been my lived experience.
To insinuate that we had no history or would have amounted to nothing without colonialism is frankly absurd and belittling. The imperialists acted in their own best interests and while somethings were picked up during that exchange, much more was lost. I don't see any indigenous people that were colonised who think the imperialists were their saviours. If you're asking for a when i.e guesstimating the future, you'd get better luck gazing at glass crystals. Just like lots of societies had peaks in the past, Nigeria would have hers and recent history has shown tremendous development can be achieved quickly- even in a single generation.
It's quite telling that you belive a group of people lack the inate ability to build a functional society. I'd end by saying one great impediment to our progress is sadly a group of people who think like you- folks who think others are inately better than them.
ednut1: word salad. Carney = Tinubu . All the talks of divesting from the USA are unrealistic.
For example below of the map of Canada pipelines. 80% of the crude produced are sold to the USA at a discount. How do you replace such a market when you dont build more pipelines to the west or build refining capacity 😆
Also 70% of cars manufactured in Canada are exported to USA. How do you replace that market?
Unfavourable deal is better than no deal at this point 😆
What would you call as an 'unfavourable deal'? If Carney =Tunubu, then Trump = ?. Or rather, tell me one world leader you'd prefer to be in charge of Canada today. For example, with the pipelines, he's been working quite hard to get one built to the westcoast but the way Canada is structured doesn't make it easy. I'm fairly new to Canada and can even appreciate that. What would you have him do on this?
No matter how unfavourable you want the next deal between Canada and the U.S to be, acquiescing to Trump at every juncture is not the way to get there. Basic knowledge of deal-making and western politics shows that. Even recent history with Trump has confirmed that he despises weakness.
Talking about an unfavourable deal, Trump has asked Canada to become America's 51st state, is openly courting Alberta's seperation. How much unfavourable a deal would you accept? 80% discount on exported oil or even shutting down our oil production if they ask. How about a special tax on Canadians to be sent over to the U.S to reduce trade deficits?
The complete disconnect I sometimes encounter here when compared to everday Canadians is telling. That we moved to Canada doesn’t mean bending the knee at every corner should be our default.
geekybabe: lol. Canada is about to find out why you don’t throw off your biggest trading partner for vibes and elbows up. Like the country that gives you a whopping 75% of your trade exports. $800 billion dollars a year! In 20 years , canada will still not be able to replace the value the US brings to its economy if CUSMA negotiations with the U.S. fails.
It’s 1 year, and we are all still waiting for the change that the greatest Economist of all prime ministers , Mark Carney promised. Travelling all over the world to sign ‘memorandum of understanding’ and sprinkling vain promises that translate to nothing tangible. While still donating millions in foreign aids to other countries while Canadians live under heavy tax burdens and inflation is at an all time high. Unemployment is at an all time high.
Let the media and the Canadian boomers keep deceiving you all. One day, you’ll all realize it was never about Trump. It’s just failed Liberal politicians using the media to manipulate you while they absolve themselves of every sense of responsibility.
U.S. is a weakness yet a Canadian just itched a ride to the moon on a trip that the U.S. heavily invested in.
We will be here again in 3 years when the elbows are down and completely paralyzed.
First inflation and unemployment are not at all time high.
Secondly, Canada has a lower tax burden than most of its western peers.
So Trump isn't to blame but Carney who's trying to foster a solution should carry the blame
One question- what do you think Canada/Carney should do at this time? Specific and economically significant examples please
Goke7: You’re talking based on principles and data but we know the current policy makers are not thinking from that perspective in fact on national television one of them admitted they are not following what the data actually tells. All they need is for one migrant to fall short of the law and begin to leverage on that for future hostilities. Just look at that bbc reportage on those claiming to be gay to seek asylum that’s all they need to convince their base like the same way the tamiyu saga by the same bbc was used to finally justify curtailing student visas!
These guys don’t care about any shortage any longer it’s about what they can spin to either get into power or remain in power! They know the universities are bleeding in fact some universities up north are beginning to open London campuses to get by still the news out there is that they are selling fake degrees 😂 perhaps now that the uk is back into the EU Erasmus program may be that can help. It’s funny sha denying British youngsters for years from such program when folks like braverman enjoyed such in their time but today are shouting not to get back to the EU, the thunder wey go fire some of these Uk politicians Dey do press up honestly!
Since the bolded is the case, we'd be setting ourselves an unattainable bar by trying to carry the guilt of every migrant who has committed a crime. Of all the millions of migrants world over, some have, are and would commit crimes. If governments already have a motive and are seeking excuses, history has shown us they'd always find one even if all migrants were saints.
Asides the continuous strive to build better communities, I'd only begin to unduly chastise my people if there was evidence that we were overrepresented in certain vices. Even at that, I'd ne clear not to bear responsibility for other peoples actions. I'd say our energies are better focused correcting untrue narratives such as that above about children recent of migrants preventing British born kids from getting school slots.
TV01: Let me start by doing the most annoying but typical of things - answering a question with a question . "The level of development Nigeria currently experiences, how did it come about?"
But to attempt as brief and succinct a reply as possible, I'll offer this - my opinion.
There are some compounding issue, which I consider second order, like the entrenched tribalism, which is further exacerbated by extreme sectarianism, which would hinder any group of people.
But for me, the main issue is that the development most have in mind is a facsimile of what obtains in the West. And what obtains in the West is due to a combination of it's socio-cultural heritage, and all the things that informed that, particularly in my view the religion.
What is there, that is natal to Nigeria, Africa more widely, or any individual people group within it, that suggests if left to their own devices, over time an advanced western style liberal democracy would emerge?
Asked based on 2 scenarios. The first, if there had never been any western interference, what would development look like? The second, after the fact that there has been, which however viewed, left a modicum of "development", why couldn't it be maintained or built upon in any meaningful way.
TV
I'm hoping you're not alluding to what I think it is. Yes Nigeria does have its challenges- some of which may be unique bust so does every society. Thruout human history, different economies have risen and fallen with many building on the remnants of the last. The coming of the industrial revolution was a huge breakthrough but that also did not arise from a vacuum. For much of human history, alot of economic activity/development was centred in Asia. European dominance is relatively a recent phenomenon - that too is changing.
The only solution to development is not an 'advanced western style liberal democracy' Today, we have examples of advanced societies that have not blindly copied the west- some needed to deviate from some preachings of the west to develop. Like I have said many times, the ultimate yardstick of measuring governments should be their ability to bring good to their people and also foster greater improvement to the human race.
Regarding your last two questions, I'd prefer you first answer those.
CodeTemplar: most unnatural deaths involve someone who knows there is a windfall waiting if the victims goes. Not a good idea for Africans. Without death self, people are already estimating windfall if a bigwig dies.
This has nothing to do with Africans and we should not look at ourselves as unable to find a decent economic solution to things.
In the next 100 yrs, almost all Nigerians alive today would be dead. Death is inevitable and some would die inestate. This is a solid plan by the nation to manage that. I'm yet to see a reasonable alternative to this being proposed. If folks don't want the government spending their money when they're gone, then they should make plans while alive.
Nigerians should learn to have a will. It's not a death wish. Also, family of dead folks should be able to reach out to banks. The CBN should create an easy means to verify all accounts held with financial institutions by a person once its verified that they're dead. With BVN and NIN, this shouldn't be hard. Folks can't hide all your wealth from family, make no plans and expect banks to work miracles when theyre gone.
It could be advocated that before this money is transferred over (if not already the case), the banks should not just try reaching out to the client but also their next of kin and follow probate rules if their dead.
Not too long ago, names of a few Nigerians who owned properties in the UK but have since died with no means to contact their NOK was published. Those properties are transferred to a central body and managed- not left vacant for centuries.
Nothing wrong with this. Provided the original owners can always reclaim their money (which they can), these unclaimed funds are better used for our collective gain rather than remain in the hands of private entities.