₦airaland Forum

thotsofnaij:
My question to you is this. Assuming he had a machine gun could he have overpowered all the soldiers with him if they did not agree to the coup? A coup was a treasonable act and yes they would have been justified in shooting him IF he refused to surrender.

The unruliness in the army started with babangida. Go and read former chief of army staff Ali's book, he called it an army of anything goes putting the blame squarely on babangida.

Guy, you are the one who needs to read plenty of materials. The military is nothing without discipline. One of the tenets is obeying orders of a superior. Shoot a superior? As I stated, Nzeogwu's actions (along with his gang - Ifeajuna, Anuforo, Nwuategwu, ...) killed the discipline in the military. July of 1966, you had junior officers arresting superiors and shooting them dead. January of 1966 had set a precedent.

thotsofnaij:
It was called Confederacy and simple was a recognition that Nigeria is in reality a continent.

Beautiful idea! Now, tell me what Nigeria operated before Ironsi promulgated Decree 34...

TheGoodJoe:
And I said, even though the Superiors were Ibos, they can not other soldiers from other tribes to go on a killing spree for an Ibo coup. It is not true.

Even after coming up with the whole coup idea, there would still be planning of the mission, which will take some time. It was not an Ibo coup because they were actors from different tribes who were also high ranking officers.

...and what were the roles of those other actors? As I said, you can hang on to your preconceived notions; that can't change facts. Some Majors lied to their subordinates, then you make those subordinates appear to be part of the plot. I'm sure you've read the lie Nzeogwu initially told his troops (that it was a mere military exercise)?

thotsofnaij:
OMG! You're unbelievable It started as a night time exercise. A casual night time training exercise. Nzeogwu was not armed at that point. While on the exercise he informed the troops with him what the real mission was. He could have been shot at that point if they did not agree with him. He wasn't cause they agreed. Those troops where the ones who shelled the premiers lodge. Before the premier was eventually killed when he was found hiding in his wives quarters.

Oh, a machine gun mysteriously jumped into his hand. And I'm unbelievable? Shoot a superior? This was the Army we are talking about; not the unruly bunch we have now (though eventually Nzeogwu's actions led to the unruliness we now have in the military). I have told you how to conduct a Google search if you want to read more. Stop regurgitating wives tales. If they didn't agree they would have shot him? You missed where I mentioned the soldier and guard he personally shot?

TheGoodJoe:

It is a lie. It does not work like that in coup because it is against the system they work with. If you plan coup and involve a soldier. If the Soldier is not loyal to the cause.

If it was an Ibo coup, those who partook in it can not be of different tribes of Nigeria based on order. Anyone blowing the whistle can destroy the project.

Guy, like I told the other guy the full report of the police investigation of the coup is online for public reading. It details how the plot was initiated in 1965 up till execution. None of these guys you mentioned was EVER present at any of their meetings. These were mere foot soldiers who were deceived by their superiors to thinking they were following legitimate orders in a military drill.

TheGoodJoe:


I did not say they were equal in ranks. I mean these were not people that could easily be kicked around to support a coup against their people.

These soldiers were major part of the coup and it shows it was not an Ibo coup. Simple.

You can color it however you wish to suit your views, but if you know how the military works and your superior gives an order those who know better will tell you your argument doesn't hold water. By the way, I hope you've read about the reaction of many of these soldiers in the aftermath of the coup and on realizing the clear pattern of killings.

thotsofnaij:
Amazing logic? The people who shot Bello were northern soldiers. Nzeogwu himself had no weapons the night of the coup and that has been well documented and if the officers cause thats what they were had not agreed to it he Nzeogwu would have been shot. Every plot has leaders, and they are all guilty by association if they take part. Go ask babangida, Gideon orkar et all.

Jezuz! Where do you get your tales from? The police report of the coup is publicly available on the Internet. Just do a Google search for "Nzeogwu coup police report". Nzeogwu was not just armed (with a machine gun according to the report), he personally shot and killed one of his men (a Yoruba soldier who didn't follow orders), a member of The Sardauna's guard who didn't surrender, The Sardauna and one of his wives. I suppose he killed them with his bare hands?

TheGoodJoe:

These guys played part in it. So, it was not like some Igbo boys came together to cleanse. You can clearly see this was a coup and people from different tribes were in on it. It was not a normal or regular military operation.

These were Lieutenants and Captains. Men with rank.

Men with rank up to Major abi? Which one of them was equal or superior to Major rank?

southpole:
Let us try and differentiate plotters from executioners these are all different and I want to believe that the list you posted consist of mainly executioners not plotters. plotters constitute the initiators, designers and planners who know why something or an order is being carried out which the executioner may not have privilege to know. in the security sector many times subordinate carry out instruction without really knowing the overall aim or the real intention. This is why most literature pay emphasis on the 4 or 5 majors as the plotters.

Thanks. Apparently I don't need any further response.

thotsofnaij:
Friend you are dreaming if you actually believe that 180 held back 7000 men. With what? A nuclear bomb? The fact is the only resistance they met on their march was cleared away quickly before BAnjo for no reason halted their match. Another officer of igbo extraction who could not understand why Banjo halted the march when the only defense between them and Gowon(at the seat of power) had been cleared away was ordered arrested by Banjo. The officer had to escape when his arrest was about to be affected.

Banjo was asked many times by his commander-in-chief why the hold up and he kept lieing that everything was still progressing while all the time betraying his commander who had in good faith given him command of this strategic and brilliant move.

Go get some understanding.

Laughable a man who has DEFINITELY not read widely on this subject but merely holding on to tales told by his uncles and father telling me to get understanding. The man who led the group that held up Biafran soldiers at a bridge at Ore told his story just last year and it was widely published in the dailies. I don't have to do your research for you. You can keep on holding to pipe dreams as fact; your cup of tea.

TheGoodJoe:

Here are the names and tribes of other plotters of January 15, 1966 military coup apart from Man. Chukwuma Kaduna Nzeogwu who was Delta Igbo and Ifeajuna.

1. Maj. Adewale Ademoyega (Yoruba) author of "Why We Struck".

2. Capt. G. Adeleke (Yoruba).

3. Lt. Fola Oyewole (Yoruba) author of "The Reluctant Rebel".

4. Lt. R. Egbiko (Ishan).

5. Lt. Tijani Kastina (Hausa Fulani).

6. Lt O. Olafemiyan(Yoruba).

7. Capt Gibson Jalo (Bali).

8. Capt. J. Swanton (Middle Belt).

9. Lt. Hope Haris Eghagha (Urhobo).

10. Lt. Dag Warribor (Ijaw).

11. 2nd Lt. Saleh Dambo (Hausa).

12. 2nd Lt. John Atom Kpera (Tiv).

Sorry but this is a bogus list. We know about 5 Majors. Those were the leaders; but the truth is the 5th Major (Ademoyega) was the last to be recruited into the plot just a few months to the execution. You are trying to make foot soldiers appear as the leaders.

thotsofnaij:
You're wrong cause that action happened at the beginning on the war. In 1967 so had it worked and chased the hausa-fulani away lives would have been saved and Nigeria would be a better place for it. But a traitor was entrusted with this task.

Read your own post and tell me what that phrase in bold means. "Had it worked". You are speaking of the likely success of a dubious move; when a trained mind like Victor Banjo had seen differently. You actually expect 7000 men marching to Lagos to succeed? Do you know they were initially held up at Ore by just 180 men? Your naivety is really refreshing.

Oh, and on the first coup (January 1966), you have Ifeajuna and this co-travelers to thank for where we find ourselves. Obasanjo, Buhari, Babangida, Abacha...we will probably never have heard of these names if not for their misadventure in January 1966. And the man who thinks they were nationalistic isn't well acquainted with History or logic. The pattern of the coup in several ways pointed at Azikiwe (who was conveniently out of the country at the time of execution and was Ifeajuna's cousin). The story of helping the South West many people regurgitate is simply the lies sold to the only Yoruba amongst them - Ademoyega; and who was the only one to live long enough to tell his side of the story. Maimalari, Ademulegun (and his pregnant wife) and several other high ranking soldiers where murdered in their bedrooms. Were they politicians?

Someone said the NCOs used to execute the coup were mostly Northerners. It appears you don't know what the military is about. Your superiors issue commands, and they are supposed to not follow those commands? Are you aware of the Yoruba soldier Nzeogwu personally shot for not carrying out his orders when he attacked the Sardauna's Palace?

I just had to make this post to clear up questions people who actually want to learn have asked.

The simple reason Victor Banjo did not proceed to Lagos and stopped at Ore was because he could see he and his men would NOT make it as far as Lagos before being completely annihilated. He had asked for "safe passage" from Yoruba leaders (I think Awolowo was involved) but he actually met and spoke with Olusegun Obasanjo. Obasanjo told him point blank to go through the waterways and not proceed into Yoruba land.

The fact is, the mission was a suicide mission: either die trying to get to Lagos, or die with a placard "SABO" hanging on your neck. Victor Banjo despite being a smart tactician fell into a trap set for him by Ojukwu. They were rivals and never truly saw eye to eye. It was simply an opportunity to eliminate his perceived rivals. Simple.