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LoveKing's Posts

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Christianity Etc › The Difference Between Paradise And Heaven? by LoveKing(op): 1:52am On May 04, 2010
So many people talking about heaven and no one is mentioning Paradise. so is paradise a different place or heaven?
Business › Re: Small Scale Business by LoveKing(m): 1:44am On May 04, 2010
sad
Business › Re: Do I Need To Register With Any Association To Be Able To Publish A Magazin? by LoveKing(m): 1:41am On May 04, 2010
@oseenice how tight is your magazine design? any prototype we can see?
Politics › Re: Man Sells Vultures As Chicken In Rivers State by LoveKing(m): 10:49am On May 01, 2010
Hmm, this is wicked, How can we identify chicken from roasted Vultures?
Politics › Re: Reps Okay 10 New States by LoveKing(m): 10:42am On May 01, 2010
This is a sure way to shut the mouths of 'BREAK UP NIGERIA' advocates,
Politics › Re: FG Considers Sacking Sanusi ! by LoveKing(m): 10:37am On May 01, 2010
Really Sanusi should go. We need someone to throw enough money around.
Politics › Re: Donald Duke Quits PDP by LoveKing(m): 10:13am On May 01, 2010
This gonna be old news tommorrow. Lets enjoy it while it last.
Politics › Re: Don't Rule Out Yar Adua 2011. by LoveKing(m): 10:05am On May 01, 2010
Ibime:
There is no stochasticity in the polity.

Jonathan's machine is in full swing, and he will definitely run in 2011.

First of all, he's trying to grab a hold of PDP so that the machinery will select him for 2011.

Ogbulafor is being hounded by the PDP reform forum and is to be replaced by Sam Egwu, a pro-OBJ/Jonathan candidate. . . remember that Ogbulafor beat OBJ to the chairmanship of the PDP thanks to machinations by Yaradua and Saraki.

Bankole is being flushed out to grab control of the House of Reps.

Ibori (and all his dollars) are being chased to stop him deploying his considerable resources against Jonathan.

EFCC is all over Sylva in Bayelsa, trying to checkmate him from posing a threat.

Iwu has been sacked. . . and will be replaced by someone just as bad.

Sanusi is under threat. . . money must flow to the plutocrats and oligarchs ahead of the election.

The OBJ/Danjuma/Jonathan machine is in full swing.


Only two spanners remain in the works. . .


IBB, who seems to be out of sync with the incumbent powers that be. . . his dalliance with Oshiomole shows that he is not in control of PDP.

Yaradua's kitchen cabinet. . . . Saraki, Northern Governors Forum etc. . . they are becoming less of a factor with Aondaoka and the FEC no longer able to do their bidding. . . however Jonathan will not dare go after them like he is going after Sylva, Ibori etc. . . that may inflame tensions in the North.

Atiku is not a factor at present, neither is Duke or anyone else.
You finish work! Nice analytics!
Politics › Re: Ibb On Firing Squad At 'one-man-one-vote' Rally by LoveKing(m): 9:57am On May 01, 2010
Why would IBB be at "one man one vote rally", Oshiomhole get sense at all? or na for Cameroun dem born am?
Politics › Re: 2011 Jamb/utme To Be Conducted Online - FG by LoveKing(m): 9:47am On May 01, 2010
Deep Soul:
Big White Elephant Project!
Some people had to pay thru their noses before they miraculously finished Secondary school. Where do u want them to "go and get" computer literacy from?

Is the Government planning to equip schools with computers?? Is the Government planning to set up IT centers?

In as much as this might sound like a good idea, it really isnt logical for it to be executed in Nigeria right now
It's simply a case of putting the cart before the horse!!
There are just too many basic things lacking in the Educational sector for this to be even considered
This is a country where we still have students who learn under trees, learn in classrooms without roofs etc.
The Universities are a total mess (@least the one I went to was and still is!).
The quality of education is appalling and rather than concentrate on training teachers and lecturers to improve on it, they are talking of writing Jamb online!
Infact, I dey vex! angry

And oh, we havent even considered the yahoo boys grin
Jamb is just waiting to be hacked into!

Some hungry people are just looking for a new way to eat money angry
Why you dey yan long thing? Dont you know they are just postulating theorems?
Christianity Etc › Re: Touch Not My Anointed? Really? by LoveKing(m): 12:43am On May 01, 2010
@OP

Good! On point!

There is no twisting of scriptures for this one i guess from Joagbaje.
Christianity Etc › Re: Is Jesus Christ Really Archangel Micheal? by LoveKing(m): 12:33am On May 01, 2010
@Joagbaje If we twist it from another angle, what makes you so right and the Witnesses so wrong? How true is your judgement or should i call it reasoning?

Who is the Archangel Michael?

Some critics get very upset about Jehovah's Witnesses' teaching that the Archangel Michael and Jesus are the same person. Is this idea supported in the Bible?

Michael is mentioned five times in the Bible. Here are the references. All scripture citations in this essay are from the King James Version.


Daniel 10:13 - But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia.

Daniel 10:21 - But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince.

Daniel 12:1 - And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Jude 9 - Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

Revelation 12:7-9 - And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

One site, critical of Jehovah's Witnesses, says: "in all of these verses nothing remotely hints to Jesus being Michael". Is that the case?

What can we learn from the above verses about Michael?

He is “one of the chief princes”. (Hebrew: sarim)

He helped an angel stand against the 'prince of the kingdom of Persia'.

He is referred to as “Michael your Prince” (the 'your' being plural in Hebrew)

He will be 'standing for the children of [Daniel's] people.

He will 'stand up' just before the greatest ever 'time of trouble'.

He is called 'the archangel'

He contended with the devil.

He did not dare bring about a 'railing accusation'.

He left it to God to rebuke the devil.

He has 'his angels'.

He battled against the devil.

He threw the devil and his angels out of heaven.


What other references are there to an archangel in the Bible?

1 Thessalonians 4:16 - For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: (This is the only other reference to an archangel in the Bible.)



What Some Commentators Have Said

Many who criticise Jehovah's Witnesses for their views don't realise that a number of Protestant sources agree with the Witness position.

“As we stated yesterday, Michael may mean an angel; but I embrace the opinion of those who refer this to the person of Christ, because it suits the subject best to represent him as standing forward for the defense of his elect people.” - John Calvin. (See Calvin's writings online at http://www.ccel.org/c/calvin/comment3/comm_vol25/htm/vii.htm)

“Michael - Christ alone is the protector of his church, when all the princes of the earth desert or oppose it.” - John Wesley's commentary on Daniel 10:21. (See Wesley's writings online at http://wesley.nnu.edu/john_wesley/notes/daniel.htm)

“a) The angel here notes two things: first that the Church will be in great affliction and trouble at Christ's coming, and next that God will send his angel to deliver it, whom he here calls Michael, meaning Christ, who is proclaimed by the preaching of the Gospel.” - Geneva Bible Commentary. (See http://www.ccel.org/g/geneva/notes/Daniel/12.html)



Putting the Pieces together

Michael will 'stand up'. Note that in verses 2, 3, 21 those standing up are said to be kings. Likewise, Michael's 'standing up' in Daniel 12:1 is appropriate, because he, too, is a King. Daniel 7:13, 14 foretell how the 'Son of Man' - Christ - would become a King.


When Michael 'stands up' a time of distress begins. This time - mentioned in Daniel 12:1 is indisputably the 'great tribulation' referred to in Matthew 24:21. The language used shows there can be only one such event. Jesus told of this great tribulation in answer to the disciples' question: “What shall be the sign of thy [i.e. Jesus'] coming and the end of the world?” (Matthew 24:3). This is a very strong indication that Michael is Jesus. When Michael 'stands up', Christ 'comes', and then there is a 'great tribulation'.


Whose angels - Michael's or Christ's?




Revelation 12:7 refers to 'Michael and his angels.' Similarly, “the Son of Man shall send forth his angels” (Matthew 13:41), the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels (Matthew 16:27); “he [the Son of Man] shall send his angels” (Matthew 24:31). 2 Thessalonians 1:7 tells us that: the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels.” The fact that this expression ('his angels') is used with regard to both Michael and Christ, strongly suggests that they are one and the same.


Michael is “the great Prince” (Daniel 12:1) or “your [Israel's] Prince” (Daniel 10:21); also “one of the chief princes” (Daniel 10:13). The Hebrew term sar, prince, is used prophetically of the Messiah in Isaiah 9:6, 7.


Michael is the Prince “which standeth for the children of [Daniel's] people”, i.e. Israel. This identifies him with the “captain [Hebrew: sar] of the host of the LORD” who met Joshua (Joshua 5:14). Jehovah's Witnesses and evangelical Bible commentators alike agree that this was the prehuman Word of God.


The fact that Michael is “one of the chief princes” (Daniel 10:13) does not rule out his being Christ in his prehuman existence. It does not even preclude his being unique, as some critics claim! Why should all princes have equal rank? England's Prince Charles doesn't have the same rank as Prince Andrew or Edward! 'Princes' (plural) implies at least two. Since God himself is called “the Prince of the host” and “the Prince of princes” (Daniel 8:11, 25), there is no reason why the two “chief princes” should not be God and Christ.


The fact that Michael 'disputed about the body of Moses with the devil', presumably during the lifetime of Joshua, also strongly indicates that he was the 'captain of the host of the LORD' referred to in Joshua 5:14.


The fact that he did not dare 'bring against [the devil] a railing accusation' does not prove that Michael is not Christ. True, Christ did rebuke the demons, but he certainly did not bring about 'railing accusations' against them. The Greek κρισιν βλασφημιας (krisin blasphemias) has been rendered 'slanderous judgment' (Analytical-Literal Translation), 'abusive condemnation' (Amplified Bible), 'insulting words' (Good News Translation), 'slanderous accusation' (New International Version). Michael refused to lower himself to the level of the opposers mentioned in Jude's letter, who did dare to bring 'railing accusations' against those who deserved glory. In fact, he would not even resort to abusive speech against the devil himself. That is all.


The word 'archangel' means chief angel. The word is only used in the singular in the Bible - in connection with Michael and with Christ. This strongly suggests that they are the same person.


The fact that Strong's Dictionary calls Gabriel an 'archangel' is neither here nor there, because the Bible doesn't!


The fact that Daniel 10:13 in An American Translation and Moffat's translation uses the expression 'one of the archangels' is likewise irrelevant, because the Hebrew does not say 'archangels,' but rather 'chief [or first] princes'.


Jesus will “descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel” (1 Thessalonians 4:16). As Hal Flemings commented: “If Jesus is not the archangel in this event and he is superior to the archangel, then why would he perform this act as though he was someone of lower rank? Wouldn't he be using an archangel's voice because he is an archangel?”


It is really straining the sense of 1 Thessalonians 4:16 to say that he is just accompanied by an archangel, who calls out. When we say: “He ran in with a shout,” we understand that it is the same person who is running and shouting! If you say: “He walked in with a trumpet blast,” on the other hand, you are not implying that it is he who was blowing the trumpet (although he might be). The two cases are clearly different.
According to 1 Thessalonians 4:16, the dead are raised when they hear the archangel's voice. But John 5:28 states that the voice they hear is Christ's!



A reasonably close parallel to 'εν φωνη αρχαγγελου, en phone archangelou' (with an/the archangel's voice) in 1 Thessalonians 4:16 is at 2 Peter 2:16: “the dumb ass speaking with man's voice”. Here we have 'εν φωνη, en phone' (with the/a voice) together with a genitive. The donkey was speaking with a man's voice - but it was the donkey that was speaking, not a man nearby. Likewise, in all other cases where 'en phone' is used in the NT, the voice in question always belongs to the subject of the sentence, not some unspecified third person. - See Revelation 5:2; 14:7, 9; 18:1.


When the archangel's voice is heard, “the dead in Christ shall rise first” (1 Thessalonians 4:16). But John 5:28, 29 tells us: “all that are in the graves shall hear his [Christ's, not just any angel's] voice and shall come forth.” Both verses use the Greek word φωνη phone - once for the archangel's voice, once for the Son of Man's voice, following which the resurrection takes place. One voice, not two, is heard. Logically, then, we must conclude that there is one voice because there is one person.


When Revelation 12 says that Michael and his angels fought with the devil and his angels, throwing them out of heaven, this is a clear reference to Jesus Christ. It is Christ, not just an angel, who destroys him that had the power of death, that is, the devil. (Hebrews 2:14) According to Matthew Henry's commentary: “The parties-Michael and his angels on one side, and the dragon and his angels on the other: Christ, the great Angel of the covenant, and his faithful followers; and Satan and all his instruments.”


Isaiah 9:6 refers to Christ as 'Wonderful, Counselor'. Interestingly, the Greek Septuagint refers to Christ as 'μεγαλης βουλης αγγελος, megales boules aggelos' - 'Messenger (or Angel) of Great Counsel.'


The demons know who is going to abyss them. They said: “What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?” (Matthew 8:29) “And they besought him that he would not command them to go out into the deep [Greek: αβυσσος, abyssos].” In Revelation 20:1-3, John tells us: “And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, And cast him into the bottomless pit [Greek: αβυσσος, abyssos]”. Thus, we see that the Bible implies that Christ the angel of the abyss.


The objection that Christ can not be called an angel, because Hebrews 1:4 says that he was “made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they” is unfounded. Note that he inherited, obtained the name, not that he always had it. When Hebrews chapter 1 refers to the angels, it means the angels in general. It does not necessarily have to imply that Christ can't be called an angel. When Luke 21:29 refers to “the fig tree and all the trees”, it doesn't mean that the fig tree isn't a tree too. Likewise, when the Bible refers to Christ and the angels, it doesn't have to imply that he's not an angel.


Clearly, although Jesus is called an angel in the Bible, he is far from being like the other angels. The Watchtower commented: “The basic meaning of “angel” (Hebrew, mal·'akh´; Greek, ag´ge·los) is “messenger.” As the “Word” (Greek, lo´gos), Jesus is God's messenger par excellence.” (15/12/1984, page 29.)
Christianity Etc › Will The World End? by LoveKing(op): 12:20am On May 01, 2010
But will this world end as the bible prophecies it would turn out and as many other faith believe or is it the end of the system of things - that is politics, religion, entertainment, etc and not the apocalyptic sense of it?

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