Heathen777
1. Darwin and other evolutionist knew the flaw of their theory would lie on the lack of transitional fossils or last common ancestor (aside other flaws) when propounding the theory.. See below:

"Because of the incompleteness of the fossil record, there is usually no way to know exactly how close a transitional fossil is to the point of divergence. Therefore, it cannot be assumed that transitional fossils are direct ancestors of more recent groups, though they are frequently used as models for such ancestors.

In 1859, when Charles Darwin's On the Origin of Species was first published, the fossil record was poorly known. Darwin described the perceived lack of transitional fossils as, "... the most obvious and gravest objection which can be urged against my theory,"
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transitional_fossil



2. Transitional fossil/last common ancestor LCA aka missing links not forth coming despite centuries. See below:

"Scientists have been on the trail of the LCA for decades, and they still have not found it. But many are convinced that they have established enough information to make the hunt a lot easier. They think they know roughly when and where the LCA lived. They even have a reasonable idea of what it looked like and how it behaved."
http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20170517-we-have-still-not-found-the-missing-link-between-us-and-apes



3. Despite overwhelming evidence not in support of the last common ancestor or even the possibility of discovering any vital transitional fossil, evolutionist still hang on by the thread for a life line to justify the theory. See below:

"Today it is recognized that the relationship of modern humans to the present anthropoid apes (e.g., chimpanzees) is through common ancestors rather than through direct descent. These ancestors have yet to be identified, but ape-hominid divergence MAY have occurred 6 to 10 million years ago."
http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20170517-we-have-still-not-found-the-missing-link-between-us-and-apes

Heathen777:


Newton believed in Alchemy, Einstein doubted the big bang despite his theory supporting it, He also doubted the validity of Quantum Mechanics despite his contributions to it. We also have Charles darwin, who made racist claims. This in no way disproved the theories they laid out.


Did you even read my last post where I said " racism in no way disproves the theory of evolution". We've come a long way in our understanding of the theory of evolution since the days of Darwin and even corrected some of his previous misconceptions on it . We now understand we are one specie, HOMO SAPIEN, and all other HOMO species have now become extinct (thanks to us by the way).

In fact evolution tells us that despite our different "races", we are one specie called HOMO SAPIEN that migrated out of africa 50,000 years ago, (wiping off other Human Species along the way e.g Homo Neanderthalis), and over the millenia, our bodies got modified slightly different to better survive in different climatic and geographical locations, giving rise to what we now call "races".


If you know all these I see no reason why you would think the theory of evolution causes racism.

Let me address some of the scientific fraud in evolution

You need to realise that the mathematically odds of one specie jumping to another or formed by mutation and natural selection as is taught in EVOLUTION is less than one chance out of a trillion, trillion, trillion, trillion, trillion!

Now this supposedly happened several times over for all the different species we have under EVOLUTION, which is simply an impossible odd, it's a computing disaster!

Fossil records doesn't also support it, as their are vital "missing links/ transitional fossils" and "important missing link/transitional fossil frauds". I will mention only notably ones by genuine scientist, others are ongoing currently. Examples are Piltdown Man, Nebraska Man, Archaeoraptor, Cardiff Giant, Alyoshenka, Fake Fannia Fly, Amphicoelias fragillimus, Piluxy River Tracks, Fiji Mermaid amongst others.
Today it is recognized that the relationship of modern humans to the present anthropoid apes (e.g., chimpanzees) is through common ancestors rather than through direct descent. These ancestors have yet to be identified, but it is believed ape-hominid divergence may have occurred 6 to 10 million years ago.

Without these vital missing links evolution is based on poor evidence.

Heathen777:
You're conflating social issues with scientific theories,

Even if people in past time used the theory of evolution (by natural selection) for racism, racism in no way disproves the theory of evoltion. People distort scienctific theory to push about political agendas. This is nothing new. It doesn't mean the science is wrong, it just means that ignorant/decietful people like to peddle disinformation.

All humans we see today are the same specie, look it up. If you actually understood the theory of evolution you wouldn'tbe posting this garbage .

"At some future period, not very distant as measured by centuries, the civilised races of man will almost certainly exterminate and replace throughout the world the savage races. At the same time the anthropomorphous apes … will no doubt be exterminated. The break will then be rendered wider, for it will intervene between man in a more civilised state, as we may hope, than the Caucasian, and some ape as low as a baboon, instead of as at present between the negro or Australian and the gorilla." -- Charles Darwin

"more for the progress of civilization than you seem inclined to admit. Remember what risk the nations of Europe ran, not so many centuries ago of being overwhelmed by the Turks, and how ridiculous such an idea now is! The more civilised so-called Caucasian races have beaten the Turkish hollow in the struggle for existence. Looking to the world at no very distant date, what an endless number of the lower races will have been eliminated by the higher civilized races throughout the world".
- Charles Darwin

LordReed:


Well too bad you didn't have the impact you thought it would. The suffering or otherwise of slaves is not why atheists object to slavery in the Bible.

If it didn't have an impact on you, it's fine. Others will judge for themselves.

LordReed:


It doesn't matter how well you think the slaves were treated that is not the primary objection.

That was what I wrote about, it is clear from my post

hakeem4:
I don't have anything to respond to what you wrote up there.

The bone of contention is why did god permit those hideous acts before the common era, then secular humanist brought about the abolition of these atrocities in the common era?

Slavery from warfare has reduced but still persists. Captives are still taken from regional conflicts. Modern slavery still exist as:
Sex Trafficking,
Child Sex Trafficking.
Forced Labor.
Bonded Labor or Debt Bondage.
Domestic Servitude.
Forced Child Labor.
Unlawful Recruitment and UseofChildSoldiers.etc

The International Labour Organization estimates that, by their definitions, over 40 million people are in some form of slavery today. 24.9 million people are in forced labor, of whom 16 million people are exploited in the private sector such as domestic work, construction or agriculture; 4.8 million persons in forced sexual exploitation, and 4 million persons in forced labor imposed by state authorities. 15.4 million people are in forced marriage.

hakeem4:
I don't have anything to respond to what you wrote up there.

The bone of contention is why did god permit those hideous acts before the common era, then secular humanist brought about the abolition of these atrocities in the common era?

Slavery from warfare has reduced but still persists. Captives are still taken from regional conflicts. Modern slavery still exist as:
Sex Trafficking,
Child Sex Trafficking.
Forced Labor.
Bonded Labor or Debt Bondage.
Domestic Servitude.
Forced Child Labor.
Unlawful Recruitment and UseofChildSoldiers.etc

The International Labour Organization estimates that, by their definitions, over 40 million people are in some form of slavery today. 24.9 million people are in forced labor, of whom 16 million people are exploited in the private sector such as domestic work, construction or agriculture; 4.8 million persons in forced sexual exploitation, and 4 million persons in forced labor imposed by state authorities. 15.4 million people are in forced marriage.

hakeem4:
Haaaaa these guys have started twisting the definition to suit their hidden agenda

Be specific please, pick a place and show workings to the twisting and hidden agenda

LordReed:


Then you didn't show we have any misconception about slavery. Slavery is owning people as property which your Bible clearly allows.

The general idea as to slavery and it's cruelty has been misapplied to the Bible. A slave was treated with regard and not cruelty in the bible and there were clear exit plans form slavery, that is the misconception and not the owning of slaves.

LordReed:


So your god had no hand in abolishing slavery, is that not an indictment on your god?

The title of this post is MISCONCEPTIONS ABOUT SLAVERY IN THE BIBLE FOR ATHEIST/THEIST.

This I have explained in details above. The abolishing of slavery is yet another topic that has answers in the Bible. As you have brought it up, I will like to address it in a subsequent post but a topic at a time.

LordReed:


So we go from you have misconceptions to full on justifying slavery, wow. As I said if this is what your god could do then he is no better than a barbarian warlord so I don't see why you owe such a being any allegiance unless of course you like the things this being does.

What I posted was an extract from the first post I made here.

The peaceful nature of today's was not the reality of the past. Conflicts existed a lot in ancient times.

Steady global peace is a driving factor for the abolution of slavery even though it may persist in other forms called modern slavery.
Sex Trafficking,
Child Sex Trafficking.
Forced Labor.
Bonded Labor or Debt Bondage.
Domestic Servitude.
Forced Child Labor.
Unlawful Recruitment and Use of Child Soldiers.etc

LordReed:


It doesn't matter one bit because nobody should have the power to enslave another human being. If your god could not instruct the Hebrews to find some other solution then your god is not only not an all wise god, he is no better than a barbarian warlord.

Thank you

LordReed:


Also not only did it support slavery within the Hebrew nation, it supported slavery elsewhere because it tells them they can go and buy slaves from other nations. Where are those people going to get slaves if not to go enslave some other people. This is not a good scenario by any stretch of the imagination.

Before the Common Era. War, poverty, and crime were the basic factors that reduced persons to a state of servitude. Captives of war were often constituted slaves by their captors or were sold into slavery by them. (Compare 2Ki 5:2; Joe 3:6.)
The Israelites experienced being captives many times, unlike in modern times where little captives are taken during warfare and almost everyone is killed. Taking captives were a more humane way of stopping the needless killings and wasting of human lives. International peace organizations like the UNO have done a lot in trying to maintain global peace as such, war is no longer a prominent factor that reduced person's into a state of servitude.

LordReed:


Wow. So enslave someone then when he converts to your religion he becomes free? You don't see what the problem with this is?

The summary of the pathway to freedom for a non Hebrew slave based on what I have said can be summarised as three, which ever came first.

1. The master can break the cycle at any time and let him go
2. The master hurts him and must let him go
3. The slave becomes a proselyte and his master must grant him all the rights of a Hebrew slave which includes letting him go when due.

LordReed:


Still means a non Hebrew was considered property. How many people were going to beat their slaves to death or put out their eye? What is that compared to owning a person and their offspring perpetually?

Not beating a slave to cause injury or loss of life was a sign of humane treatment given to them, unlike how servants are maltreated today in some places.

Like I said the perpetual ownership of a none Hebrew slave was not a MUST, can or may are used in other translations to show this circle can be broken at any time the master decides upon it.

In most cases the slaves later became Proselyte's (A convert, that is, one who embraced Judaism, getting circumcised, if a male.) Non-Hebrew or a non-Israelite who desired to serve Jehovah according to the requirements of true worship had to become a proselyte. A proselyte was responsible to obey all of the Law, and he was to be treated by natural Jews as a BROTHER (Le 19:33, 34; 24:22; Ga 5:3) By becoming a Proselyte, the privileges given to a Hebrew slave can also be extended to them seeing that they are now BROTHERS.

LordReed:


Only applies to Hebrew slaves and not to non Hebrew slaves.

Protection of slaves were universal in the law code. no distinction is made between Hebrew and none Hebrew slave, as regards protection from harm or maltreatment under the law code -Ex. 21: 20, 32

Dantedasz:



I REPEAT,CHRISTIANS LIKE YOU MAKE ME SICK!
I AM NOT READY TO DISCUSS YOUR PERVERSION WITH YOU!!

As you prefer.

Dantedasz:



You guys are just sickening and people like you completely disgust me.
This is why I avoid talking to Christian's because you people can justify any sick thing as long as it is written in your silly comic book.

Don't attack me, I didn't attack you. Let's focus on the topic. I have explained the concept of slavery in the Bible and it is fair. If a master killed a slave, he was guilty of death no matter his status. You should argue on how unfair it is.

Bacteriologist:
If verses like Exodus 21 were found in the Qur'an or any other religious book for that matter. Christians would talk down on it for as long as forever.

But look at how they dickride slavery, rape and misogyny and attempt to twist it as justifiable just because their bible supports it. Religion breeds evil.

Bacteriologist, I understand your genuine concerns and I will address them in other post. But let's take it one at a time. I'm dealing with slavery now.

Dantedasz:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_of_L%C3%BCbeck#:~:text=Jesus%20of%20L%C3%BCbeck%20was%20a


The first slave ship was named Jesus and slave traders justified slavery by quoting passages from the Christian bible!

Jesus never owned slaves, so their justification was wrong in that sense.

Dantedasz:



I read where you wrote for a slave to have a master is a blessing!
How slavery can be a blessing to a slave boggles the mind!
How being exchanged for money and having no rights being a blessing to the slave is just sickening and derogatory!

A Christian master was not to treat his slave harshky but righteously. The summary points to their rights.

In summary,the highlight of the Bible's dealing with slaves showed it was more than fair. All slaves had a chance of being repurchased at anytime or released at the 7th year of servitude or at the jubilee year, whichever came first (majorly Hebrew slaves) . If they were injured in servitude they were to be released immediately, if they were killed in servitude by the master, the master was to be killed in return. They were also to be given a gift on their release to help them not fall back into servitude ( all slaves) .

Dantedasz:
Before they will come and LIE that it is only in the old testament, here is the new testament of the bible condoning SLAVERY.


EPHESIANS CHAPTER 6 VERSE 5.





EPHESIANS,6 VERSE 5: Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.

Did you read the post above? You would have found references to the NEW TESTAMENT. go and read it.

LordReed:
Exodus 21
2 “If you buy a Hebrew servant, he is to serve you for six years. But in the seventh year, he shall go free, without paying anything. 3 If he comes alone, he is to go free alone; but if he has a wife when he comes, she is to go with him. 4 If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the woman and her children shall belong to her master, and only the man shall go free.

5 “But if the servant declares, ‘I love my master and my wife and children and do not want to go free,’ 6 then his master must take him before the judges.[a] He shall take him to the door or the doorpost and pierce his ear with an awl. Then he will be his servant for life.

Leviticus 25
44 “‘Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. 45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. 46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.

It is very clear that slaves were considered property and that there was a difference between a slave that was an Israelite and one that was not.

1. EX 21: 2 - 5. At times slaves held a position of great trust and honor in a household. Giving a slave a wife was not an obligation of his master during his servitude, it was a privilege to be given such. A hebrew slave during his servitude years was aware of the law governing receiving a wife from his master during his servitude years or bearing children from such a wife during his servitude. It was not COMPULSORY he married her but was VOLUNTARY. if he voluntarily chose to exercise this right by marrying her he had the option to leave at the end of his servitude or be a slave for life with his master.

Under the Law governing FREEMEN such still applied. If a man was not able to bear an heir until his death, his brother was to marry his widow and bear male heirs for him. The male child or heir was legally the child of the deceased brother and not the brother who impregnated his widow.—Ge 38:8; De 25:5.

2. Lev. 25: 44-46 - Yes none Hebrew slave could be owned for life and even passed on, but the LAW governing slavery did not make this a MUST, that is why words like CAN are used. It was left at the discretion of the master to decide how to handle his affairs. Other than the right to freedom for the Hebrew slave after 7 years of servitude or at the jubilee year, whichever came first - all other laws governing the privileges and treatment of slaves or servants where the same. If they were injured in servitude Hebrew or no Hebrew they were to be released immediately, if they were killed in servitude by the master, the master was to be killed in return.

"more for the progress of civilization than you seem inclined to admit. Remember what risk the nations of Europe ran, not so many centuries ago of being overwhelmed by the Turks, and how ridiculous such an idea now is! The more civilised so-called Caucasian races have beaten the Turkish hollow in the struggle for existence. Looking to the world at no very distant date, what an endless number of the lower races will have been eliminated by the higher civilized races throughout the world".
- Charles Darwin

"Of all the problems which will have to be faced in the future, in my opinion, the most difficult will be those concerning the treatment of the inferior races of mankind".
- Leonard Darwin

Illustration of a Roman slave owner and his servants

LordReed,

Go live your life now, I have had my fun. It's a new day and I have moved on.

You are free to live in the past if you like it so much. Shalom.

LordReed:


[img]https://media1./images/55e35003771247ca2f2f8fc5b0b0c4e0/tenor.gif?itemid=5000256[/img]

But sadly you are missing something up there joker/clown.

LordReed:



[img]https://media1./images/2fb0f0ef34c37a25c3e798b88cab019c/tenor.gif?itemid=14863643[/img]

RIP joker

LordReed:


[img]https://media./images/73e40b7f7efc1e8afa28f9c49d33942d/tenor.gif[/img]

They are insulting your mates in front page clown/joker...dinosaur stuff. I'm sure they will like to have a go at you. Dont be upset here okay

LordReed:


[img]https://media./images/5bf346798cbf5d4708ef31cc374c0090/tenor.gif[/img]

At least you found your humour joker

LordReed:



[img]https://media1./images/9225b196ed4f06c9ac4ee4171bea0a5d/tenor.gif?itemid=10802854[/img]

RIP joker

LordReed:


[img]https://media./images/8ebdfdaf5e045e4dd43d717653e51db1/tenor.gif[/img]

I didn't mean to upset you joker/clown...dont feel attacked