₦airaland Forum

Ubenedictus: dis isnt abt ignorance or self hatred, he made d thread becos of obadiah who claim, d black men of africa are d isrealites of d bible, (dis was made as a slipt of obadiahs thread) d passage used by d op is obadiah's classics defence, even a dumb bible student will acknowledge dat in d above passage "black of skin" had with it serious suffering. This is an arguement in progress, i dnt see why u are geting emotional.

alexis: Dude, when you talk about any material - you should reference it. At least the 77 books should have an online version. Something at least we can refer to. I can find the online Quran. Can you reference the 77 books. Something to verify your claim. Is that too much to ask?




Can you tell us where we can find the one the is not corrupt? Or the one that author of the Quran quoted from?



How did this God inform the prophet of the Torah and Zabur? History said the prophet was unlearned and an illiterate and couldn't read. How did he come about them?



Apparently the author of the Quran doesn't know much about Jesus Christ of history. The "Jesus" of the Quran has no cross. He never died and therefore did not resurrect. While there are over 43 beautiful illustrative parables in the Gospel accounts, the "Jesus" of the Quran spoke not one parable. The beautiful Sermon on the Mount is absent in the Quran. Perhaps the author of the Quran is talking about another "Jesus" because it knows very little about Jesus Christ in history. The Quranic "Jesus" is a "Jesus" who receives a query in heaven for allowing people to worship him as God. We see this "Jesus" trembling before God, denying a claim of his deity. For reference check Surah 5:116. Such a "Jesus" is not the Jesus Christ of history. He is a personal imagination of the author of the Quran.However, the Jesus in the Quran is still born of the Virgin Mary, is blessed by God (Surah 43:61,63; 19:30) and is strengthened by the Holy Spirit (Surah 2:253). He is the Word of God, knowing the unknown. He spoke in the cradle (a story taken from a book of fables) - Surah 3:46; 5:110. He healed the lepers and raised the dead and created a bird (Surah 3:49, 5:110).

A sincere Muslim will realize that even in the Quran Jesus is more than a prophet. He is mentioned 97 times, to Muhammeds 25. Jesus is the only sinless man in the Quran (Surah 19:19). Adam sinned (Surah 2:36; 7:22-23). Abraham sinned (Surah 26:82). Moses sinned (Surah 28:15-16). Jonah sinned (Surah 37:142). David sinned (Surah 38:24-25). Muhammed constantly asked for forgiveness of his own personal sins (Surah 33:36-38; 47:19; 48:1-2).No muslim can know the real Jesus except he/she studies the Bible. From the Bible, you will see clearly a 30 year old man who in 3 years of ministry, changed the course of man's history forever. He didn't even use ONE sword. How can the author of the Quran have created Jesus when in it, all the major aspects of Christ's life and teaching are missing?. The author probably created another "Jesus", I can tell you confidently, it's not the Jesus Christ that Christians believe in.

The editor of the Hadith says:

"The Quran is the greatest wonder among the wonders of the world. It repeatedly challenged the people of the world to bring a chapter like it, but they failed and the challenge remains unanswered up to this day". For reference, please check - Mishkat'ul Masabih, Vol3, p.664. I hope you wouldn't claim this Hadith is defective or weak.The Quran could indeed be a wonder to the 7th century Arabs because of the illiteracy of the people of Arabia at the time. Unfortunately, we are not in 7th century Arabia. It's the same wonder that the Quran claim and confused the 7th century Arabians with "wonders" that the sun sets in a pool of warm water. To the primitive Arabs, this was a fantastic revelation from Allah, the all-knowing and it was proof of Muhammed's prophet-hood. So, the author of the Quran may have created another "Jesus"; definitely not Jesus Christ in history



Of Jesus life, death and resurrection? Yes I can.



You swept it under the carpet. However, it doesn't matter to me. I have made my point.



WOW, that is the only thing I can say. Whenever Muslims are faced with HARD FACTS; it is always the "Weak Hadith" that comes to the rescue.



Omo, you can dispute it or ignore it. However, Shiite Muslims have also consistently alleged that portions of even the present Quran are wrong. These are the areas where they believe the Quran is speaking of Ali or their beliefs concerning the authority and succession of Imams. Shiite books that allege that the present Quran circulating among muslims are grossly corrupted include:

1. The Mirror of the Minds - By Al-Majlisi
2. The Corruption - By Ahmad Ibn Muhammad
3. Corruption And Substitution - By Muhammad Ibn Hassan Al-Sairafi
4. The Abridgment on the Corruption of the Book of the Lord of Lords - By Imam Al-Nuri

Other Shi'ite scholars who have conclusively established the case of corruption of the present Quran. Again, history is not on your side

F00028: you find its fulfillment in the hadith you quoted from the sunan of Abu Dawud above.



look madam plappville, there are about 16 messianic prophesies in the ot. find another one that fits Jesus.
forget dat Isaiah 53 cos dat one no go ever fit Jesus Christ unless you rewrite am.



Alah is the aramaic word for God (Arabic: Allah) and You say he called out to God before he was killed on the cross. so since you say Allah/Alah is a false deity, well.....

proo212: Before they begin to try and disprove the tafsir, you can see the chain of narrations (Ibn Jurayj narrated from Wahb bin Sulayman, from Shu`ayb Al-Jaba'i,) this proves its authenticity because its not just one person speaking it...

2 questions regarding this Surah 36:14 verse is who sent these messengers? Is it Allah or is it the Messiah? Clearly not Allah because we know that Simon and John and Paul were Apostles of Christ. But a prophet CANNOT send messengers! Mohammed did not send any messengers but Christ sent messengers and the Quran confirms this!

So if Christ can send messengers, that means Christ is God.

Second question Hadeeth Narrated Abu Huraira(RA) that the Prophet(SAW) said:



But Christ sent these messengers and they came before the messenger of Allah. Either Christ did not send these messengers or the messenger of Allah got his revelations mixed up. They cannot both be true.

Stalwert and F00028 please answer

There is no prophet between me and him, that is, Jesus (peace be upon him). He will descent (to the earth). When you see him, recognize him: a man of medium height, reddish fair, wearing two light yellow garments, looking as if drops were falling down from his head though it will not be wet. He will fight the people for the cause of Islam. He will break the cross, kill swine, and abolish jizyah. Allah will perish all religions except Islam.[size=16pt] He will destroy the Antichrist and will live on the earth for forty years and then he will die. The Muslims will pray over him. [/size]
(Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 37, No. 4310)

FXKing2012: I will help your ignorance, when reading the Bible pray for wisdom then try reading it in context otherwise...

Now, man turned black only when in mourning, pain, affliction, being tortured or being punished by God. The following verses prove it:

Song of Solomon 1:6
6 Look not upon me, because I am
black, because the sun hath looked
upon me: my mother's children were
angry with me; they made me the
keeper of the vineyards; but mine
own vineyard have I not kept.

Lamentation 5:10
10 Our skin was black like an oven
because of the terrible famine.

Lamentation 4:8
Their visage is blacker than a coal;
they are not known in the streets:
their skin cleaveth to their bones; it is
withered, it is become like a stick.

Jeremiah 14:2
2 Judah mourns, and the gates
thereof languish; they are black to the
ground; and the cry of Jerusalem is
gone up.

Job 30:30-31
30 My skin is black upon me, and my
bones are burned with heat.
31 My harp also is turned to
mourning, and my flute into the voice
of them that weep.

The following verses show that man was originally created in the colour of the Israelites:

JEREMIAH 10: 16 - The portion of Jacob is not like them: for he is the former of all things; and Israel is the rod of his inheritance: The LORD of hosts is his name.

EXODUS 4: 22 - Israel is my son, even my firstborn

Reading the verses in context or reading the entire chapters from where the quoted verses were lifted will further reveal to you that man turned black only as a result of affliction, pain, suffering, mourning or punishment by God.
So please do away with the lie and misinformation that man was created black or that Jesus was black - that is simply not true.

obadiah777: I SPEAK NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH HUN. WE ARE A DEMOTED PEOPLE. MALACHI 2 VS 9 "So I have caused you to be despised and humiliated before all the people, because you have not followed my ways but have shown partiality in matters of the law." HOWEVER NOT FOR TOO LONG ISAIAH 14 VS 1 But the LORD will have mercy on the descendants of Jacob. He will choose Israel as his special people once again <<< COMING REAL SOON AFTER WW3, THE BATTLE OF ARMAGEDDON IN THE VALLEY OF JEHOSHAPHAT ( THE MIDDLE EAST ). THE BATTLE IS BREWING NOW AS WE SPEAK. IRAN AND CHINA AND RUSSIA VS THE WEST. ARMAGEDDON. THEY WILL DESTROY EACH OTHER. A HEATHEN IMPLOSION. AND THEN THE LORD WILL RISE OUT OF ISRAEL AND WE WILL TAKE CONTROL AND THE KINGDOM WILL BE HANDED TO THE ELECT OF THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL ( LETS HOPE I AM ONE OF THEM ) I WILL LIKE TO PUT MY FOOT UP A FEW PEOPLES BUTT. I WILL START WITH THE SLAVERS AND LYNCHERS FOLLOWED BY THE AFRICAN LEADERS. THIS DUTY DOES THE ELECT HAVE AS THEY WILL BREAK THE NATIONS WITH A ROD OF IRON ( REV 2 VS 26 ).

obadiah777: HOW DO WE HAVE WHITE YELLOW AND BROWN FROM BLACK ? SEVERAL REASONS
1-THE CURSE OF CAIN WHICH IS LEPROSY OR WHITE SKIN ( BANISHING THE WORST OF THE ISRAELITES TO MT SEIR AND TAKING THEIR MELANIN. MT SEIR IS AN AREA WITH EXTREME CLIMES AND THOSE BANISHED THEIR LIVED IN CAVES. SO THEY NEVER SAY SUNLIGHT FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS. THEY EVENTUALLY CAME OUT AND GOT UPLIFTED AS A NATION IN WHAT IS KNOWN AS THE GREEK AND ROMAN EMPIRE )
2- THE PROVERBIAL SLEEPING OF LOTS TWO DAUGHTERS WITH HIM MEANS A LOT OF THE BLACK PEOPLE ON THE LAND OF SHEM WERE COMMITTING INCESTRY AND THEN ON THAT LANDMASS THE ONES WITH THE CURSE OF CAIN ( NO MELANIN ) LATER RELOCATED THERE TO THE LAND OF EDOM AND THEY INTERMINGLED. THIS IS HOW YOU GET THE CHINESE ( MOABITES ) AND JAPANESE ( AMMONITES ). THATS WHY THEY BOTH LOOK RE-TARDED. THEY ARE PRODUCTS OF INCESTRY AND THE CURSE OF CAIN
3-ISHMAELITES ( ARABS ) ARE A MIXTURE OF THE CURSE OF CAIN AND THE BLACK HEATHENS ON THE LAND OF SHEM. THEY ARE MIXED RACE.
ALSO FACTOR IN DIFFERENT DIETARY HABITS AND DIFFERENT WEATHER ADAPTATION ETC ETC AND THATS HOW YOU GET EVERYONE ON EARTH TODAY FROM BLACK.

ibsmooth: ha ha ha ha ha ha.peace-1.the bible has seen many addition,multiplication,deletion and all have you.
imagine the bible saying prophets noah and david may Allah be pleased with all of them accusing them of
incest,rape and adultery.genesis9:23-24 for noah and 2samuel1:4-5.no wonder a french scientist and and philosopher
opined in his book,the bible,qur'an and science,that the most dangerous book on earth is the bible and should be thrown
in the dustbin. some are true and correct but many are wrong.

advocate666: ^^^ see vex.

You really should stop reading about the Quran and actually read the Quran if you want to keep attempting to use it against Muslims. God's last revelation states quite clearly Jesus is the Christ! Quran 4:171 if you are looking for people who deny Jesus is the Christ, the look to every living jew alive today.

and when you say Allah is just a moon god then Jesus was calling to a false god on the cross because

F00028: why are you deliberately over stretching it? we have gone over this already. no way Isaiah 53 is talking about the Jesus the son of Mary (peace be upon them) unless you use your fertile imagination like you did a few posts ago.


I am not suggesting anything, Jeremiah is saying it quite openly:
"How is it that you say, We are wise and the law of the Lord is with us? But see, the false pen of the scribes has made it false." Jer. 8:8


Then Jesus being the "son of God is not that special especially when you look at the son of God, Adam.

Jesus was made to be in the womb of a young jewish girl, Mary 2000 years ago. in Adam's case there wasn't even a womb to carry him to term.


You really should stop reading about the Quran and actually read the Quran if you want to keep attempting to use it against Muslims.
God's last revelation states quite clearly Jesus is the Christ! Quran 4:171
if you are looking for people who deny Jesus is the Christ, the look to every living jew alive today.

and when you say Allah is just a moon god then Jesus was calling to a false god on the cross because

Bidam: YOUR LIES AND HYPOCRISY IS GETTING ON MY NERVES ALREADY..PLS KEEP YOUR BELIEFS TO YOURSELF ABEG

Stalwert: ^
Looks like the trinity the father, the son and the holy spirit, similar to Hindu trinity which came way before Paul fantasies indeed. as usual they can defend their religion without rushing to hide behind the Qur'an! The greatest tragedy of the bible remains all the authors are anonymous individuals, infact the gospel bears no name of the writer, christians simply named anonymous book by any name they thought fit, I wonder what the gospel according to Luke means? Why not the gospel by luke? Off course those who print the bible would tell u point black, we really don't know who wrote what, yet Christians stake their salvation on anonymous individuals . . . Confusion galore indeed!

BARRISTERS: @Bidam

plappville:

JESUS SAYS HE SPEAKS WHAT GOD PUT IN HIS MOUTH. HE did lie did he?


John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father who sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.

Deuteronomy 18:18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers; I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him.


Infact, when Jesus Is talking It is Yahweh Talking. Jesus is not claiming to be the Father, the oga kpatapkata,

the over all. Because He does not speaks words of His own.

do you note this superior answer above that beat all sorts of concortions that trinitarians have hung on 'the person' of jesus? and this is just an answer to a question. jesus before coming to the earth have been under the instruction of God his father, can you see the futuristic use of the words used ''I will raise up for them a prophet like you'' and ''I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him''. this evidence here has knocked out every insinuation that jesus is the same almighty God

popping up again Bidam reply this!

Bidam: MY RESPECT FOR YOU HAS DIMINISH IN SECS..CAN YOU QUOTE WORD FOR WORD WAT I SAID PLS? THESE ARE MERE LIES FORM THE PIT OF HELL

Bidam: WRONG! the bible actually says Jesus is almighty. The term “the almighty” is used 44 times in the Bible. The last verse referring to the almighty is Jesus claiming to be the almighty. How many almighties do we have? Only one and He Jesus, sits on the throne alone!

Rev 1:8
8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

alienvirus: Christianity is such a deception . A load of crap. Why? Because Jesus was only sent to the lost sheep of israel not Nigerians.

proo212: This is supposed to be word of God. Umar bin Al-Khattab tells Mohammed something, Mohammed likes it and suddenly Allah reveals it to Mohammed JUST AS UMAR SAID IT. Allah must have liked what Umar mentioned to Mohammed. Is he all knowing and wise?

F00028: what original bible?
you didn’t compile the bible until about 300 years after Jesus Christ was gone. don’t you know your history?

any lay person can figure out the bible has been changed by just looking at the 73 books of the roman catholic bible as against the 66 books of the protestants and wonder: is it 7 books more or 7 books less?


really? your background in arabic enabled you to come up with that? because i know a certain website that would be offended by you claiming their credit.

anyway,many a Prophet did fight and many a prophet was killed.

God’s last Prophet stated “this Quran has been revealed in seven different ways so recite it in the way easiest for you”.

F00028: where please?

or they were talking about someone else (e.g Isaiah 53),or it doesn't mean what you think it means, or that's not what the Prophets actually said. remember Jeremiah 8:8?

God has other sons in your bible
ex 4:22, jer 31:9, ps 2:7

so did Jeremiah. read jer 1:5

Bidam: no matter how you twist that scripture to suit your belief.. Jesus Christ is still your mighty God and everlasting father in that scripture..ok

Boomark:
I can see you are back. Welcome.

Bidam: wrong again..isaiah 9 CLEARLY SHOWED THAT scripture is talking about Jesus..don't be obstinate and hell bent in not accepting it.other bible scholar have confirmed it..dats another prob you have..you refuse to see that scripture in the light of wat God is saying.

frosbel: best to leave this discussion, it will never end , might continue till the rapture

Boomark: ^^So Mr Barristers, this is why he is called the word of God?

The revelation of Jesus Christ which God "gave" him in Rev 1:1 also points to the fact that Christ spoke the word of God when he said, "I am the alpha and the omega...." Rev 1:8. Interesting!

BARRISTERS: malachi 3:1
"See, I will send my messenger, who will prepare the way before me. Then suddenly[size=20pt] the Lord you are seeking will come to his temple; the messenger of the covenant, whom you desire, will come," says the LORD Almighty.[/size]

another fact of two separate persons but one is superior and confirmed with the use of word 'The LORD Almighty' here is it:

''the Lord you are seeking will come'' says ''the LORD Almighty''.

this are clearly stated facts!

BARRISTERS: @Bidam



do you note this superior answer above that beat all sorts of concortions that trinitarians have hung on 'the person' of jesus? and this is just an answer to a question. jesus before coming to the earth have been under the instruction of God his father, can you see the futuristic use of the words used ''I will raise up for them a prophet like you'' and ''I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him''. this evidence here has knocked out every insinuation that jesus is the same almighty God

popping up again Bidam reply this!

enilove: Am enjoying your thread but not your hard unchanged heart .I was expecting you to say,thank my brothers but,what do we get instead? No way No way i no go agree for them even say na true dem dey talk.

Tell me the meaning of these verses:

Revelation: 2:18 These things saith the son of God........
Revelation:3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God,and he shall go no more out : and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God,which is a new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God.
Revelation 3: 21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne,even as I also overcame ,and am set with my father in his throne.

Who is the speaker in the above verses?
Why the phrase"the son of God" mentioned again in heaven .
What is the meaning of"my God"

Please be thruthful with yourself, because every unrighteousness is a sin.

Boomark: Actually, what i wanted you to do is to tell him that Jesus is not the same person as the Father with whatever you have.

You can explain trinity to those that don't read their bible who don't know their left and right. With the things we know and the questions we have, you can't explain trinity to us.