helpee:
Church growth is measured by empty seat. Since the pastor is so passionate about God, why is he collecting salary from the church with empty seats? He shouldnt be collecting salary now. He doesn't even need oyedepo. Now that they sacked him....since empty churches means church growth, he should just continue to pastor those empty seats without oyedepo now. Oyedepo sacked you..God that you are working for didn't sack you,. why not continue. You didn't even think for once that the pastor is crying fowl because he lost the salary ....is he doing it for God or for salary?

I don't know the pastor. I am only pointing out the deceit in church and how you guys have upended the word of God.

A soul that gives his life to Christ has no meaning to you again because it's all about the money. You will rather have a church filled with unbelievers. I repeat, there is so much celebrations among Angels in heaven over just ONE soul that gives his life to Christ.

jeremiah123:
Living Faith Church aka Winners Chapel is in a move of soul winning from Oyedepo who is d presiding bishop to active members everyone must engage. Our pastor once told us that they were called by leadership of the church to give dem their convert details, he told dem he doesn't have and was warned, according to him he started engaging in soul winning, if not he would have been sacked also.

The said pastor must have been warned to engage in soul winning but refused, the consequence is what he got. Papa nor dey play with soul winning for now.

I guess my explanation would do, but if u are not satisfy break ur head or employ d pastor after all e get result Bsc or HND

Are u mistaking "soul winning" for inviting people to church/increasing membership?

MT:
I lost interest in most of the Nigeria pastors, especially David Oyedepo. Check all his antics in the past, he is so arrogant, and he behaves as if he is above the law.

One thing that constantly surprises me is that, once a father becomes the head of the church in Nigeria, God must call his children and wife by default. Go and check where all their children are pastoring, if not a very well established church in a posh zone in Nigeria, it will be in the western world like the US, UK.

Oyedepo should put his son Muyiwa Oyedepo, who he has positioned to take over his church after his demise, in any of these church branches where these pastors were sacked and let us see the magic he will use to pull crowd. So much for God of men parading as men of God.

I lost interest in Christianity as a whole when this rubbish prosperity gospel started gaining ground over 30 years ago. And I never regretted it since.

I had thought Christianity could not go lower. Men of God or rather God of Men have now come up with a new one - Church Growth Index. Abeg which one is Church Growth Index again? How do you measure it? Is it by shear numbers, income generated, number of people truly saved? Where in the Bible is it written?

I believe the emphasis on material prosperity as against spiritual or moral prosperity is responsible for the moral decadence we have in all facets of the Nigerian society today.

Lifestone:

My believe is that the entire Churches belong to the same body of Christ. However how is this Pastor to be measured? By what his leadership requested him to do in the Kingdom for which he's also to be held accountable.

I didn't ask u what u believe. This is what I asked u and u haven't answered:

1. How is he prejudiced?

2. Can u negate d biblical angle he gave?

3. Should d content of d letter supersede biblical principles on d matter?

4. What is d church? Is it a denomination built by a man?

When God pronounced blessing of fruitfulness to mankind in Genesis, He was not referring to children alone, it cut across everything in life. Financially, spiritually, biologically etc.

nyiamfrank:
Mr. Reno, can you link the fruitfulness of a tree to human attributes?
Is the pastor not bearing children?

Church growth? Financially or in population?

When some people left Jesus as he was preaching, did he drag them back? He even turned to the disciples and asked why they remained with him!

Winners must not mention money in that letter. Be fair, man.

Odidigboigbo:
You have indirectly support Reno, soul winning is all about church growth. In the letter, nothing like finance was mentioned but rather Church growth/soul winning.

Church is not a building, CHURCH refers to believers and their growth is in God's knowledge not finance or numbers

Lifestone:

In Christiandom we know fruits to mean converts and spiritual growths

But in Pentecostal Churches kingdom it's means how much money you can generate/target from your members, irrespective of how they got it....it doesn't matter if the money are ill gotten....
Operation by all means

When Reno turn pastor? Whether right or wrong. My penny will not fall to scam again.

What the bible is preaching is winning souls, not winning members. If we can get people back to God and have righteousness in them, the denomination is not the matter. When you are more interested in what you have in terms of members and other things you have gone to be the rich man who is interested in himself only. Therefore we can say Heaven is far from you. Because if you say it is membership that is more important do we say that Heaven will be filled with Nigerians? As it stands now, Nigeria has the highest number membership in terms of going to Church.

advanceDNA:


I don’t think this is about money..

In winners, the main duty of resident pastor is church growth i.e in numbers of people...

the fact is...no pastor can force people to give...Increase in number of people doesn’t necessarily translate to increase in money...

For example...if number of women( mothers are on the increase in a particular month. Automatically that’s double or triple because mothers will come with kids... but that won’t mean increase in offering or tithe...as children don’t give...

A pastor can’t drag rich people to church or force them to give so really he has no control over increase in money....

My opinion shaa

lexy2014:


I didn't ask u what u believe. This is what I asked u and u haven't answered:

1. How is he prejudiced?

2. Can u negate d biblical angle he gave?

3. Should d content of d letter supersede biblical principles on d matter?

4. What is d church? Is it a denomination built by a man?

Did you read his post? Juxtapose his conclusion, I am not here for vain arguments

Except they have a reason to believe the pastors had not done enough or are even working against the potential growth of the church by stealing money or their bad behaviours, I don't think they have valid reason to sack them.

In the time of Jesus, the gospel was at the initial stage and their were enough ground cover in preaching the gospel.

Now, there are church in almost every streets and more kepps springing up. It highLy competitive. That's why some pastors are preparing their miracles. Maybe that's what Winners want to to do

What does this Reno Omokri guy do for a living? He sniff's around everywhere, idleness made him pick talking for a hobby

Lifestone:
Some lazy anti church elements never bothered to read the letter anyway, they ran to town screaming Church is a Business.
What's in a Pastor that could not bring in souls into the Kingdom of God? What was he hired to do?
Am not surprised where we are today as a nation when we could not hold people accountable for the assignments that they were given.
The attitude of the Pastor is the more reason he failed, an entitlement mentality and he was rightly sacked.

winning souls for Christ is not quantified by the number of people that end up going to your church. It is the number of people that understand and follow the tenets of Christ and are able to preach same to others. So if the church sacked the pastors because the number of church members did not increase, then they should accept the flack they get.

MT:


I don't know the pastor. I am only pointing out the deceit in church and how you guys have upended the word of God.

A soul that gives his life to Christ has no meaning to you again because it's all about the money. You will rather have a church filled with unbelievers. I repeat, there is so much celebrations among Angels in heaven over just ONE soul that gives his life to Christ.

We all know this but are you saying the pastor should be getting updates from angels in heaven? What is the essence of a soul saved that was not watered. salvation is not a days job. if you win a soul, the soul will be lost if it is not nurtured. That is why they are pastors not evangelist. A pastor means a shepherd that daily feeds the sheep. So where is the sheep? They are in heaven according to you so is it not better to allow the angels to keep feeding the sheep while the pastor is sacked. so if you employ fulani herdsmen without cows, you won't sack them because the cows are in sabo ? A pastor without a sheep has lost his job already...oyedepo only confirmed it by sacking him. We are too holy in this country. A pastor can't be sacked for having no congregation to pastor...so why is he a pastor? Abeg

sammyuche:
This man Reno is a snake. I do respect some of his articles buy this one I disagree. Make we no dey lie to ourselves. The pastor was sacked because he didn't bring enough money.
Is bringing enough money now equivalent to soul winning?
Why didn't they say ok try and do more evangelism? What crime did he comit? Is it now about money money money?
Damn

I personally don't pay my employees for unproductivity. Where will the GO pay him from. The Pastor has to work for his pay.

lexy2014:


Are u mistaking "soul winning" for inviting people to church/increasing membership?

Yes....they have exchange soul winning with winning members......
It's all about crowd/population.....even if they are all criminals......
The reason we keep asking why are there so many evil in the society today despite churches all over the place?

MT:


I don't know the pastor. I am only pointing out the deceit in church and how you guys have upended the word of God.

A soul that gives his life to Christ has no meaning to you again because it's all about the money. You will rather have a church filled with unbelievers. I repeat, there is so much celebrations among Angels in heaven over just ONE soul that gives his life to Christ.

Exactly! I had though that it was written in the Bible that "where two or three is gathered in my name, I would be in their midst". I now realize that it's about Church Growth Index.

ubola:
I personally don't pay my employees for unproductivity. Where will the GO pay him from. The Pastor has to work for his pay.

You now agree that church is a business enterprise and not a spiritual non governmental organization dedicated to spiritual and moral growth of it's members.

As a business man, how can you expect productivity growth during a pandemic? How many businesses has grown within the last 2 year's?

wacuc0:
What the bible is preaching is winning souls, not winning members. If we can get people back to God and have righteousness in them, the denomination is not the matter. When you are more interested in what you have in terms of members and other things you have gone to be the rich man who is interested in himself only. Therefore we can say Heaven is far from you. Because if you say it is membership that is more important do we say that Heaven will be filled with Nigerians? As it stands now, Nigeria has the highest number membership in terms of going to Church.

So when the apostles that started the church won souls they ddnt make disciples of them and continue in fellowship daily?? They ddnt keep the numbers of their people at all?? Or u ddnt see increase in tacts and other letters of Paul??

So who were the people Paul and peter kept visiting in Macedonia, Rome,corinth, etc..

Second ...be true to urself ...u claimed I said membership is more important....when did I say so?? U can show me in my text without reconstructing or misinterpreting my statement....

U even said heaven is far from me...lol...u are just a funny human being...all this self righteous people

thesicilian:
But should "church growth" only be measured by the number of new comers in the church? If a church has 20 members and they're all growing spirituality through the teachings and guidance of the pastor, isn't that worthy of commendation as well?

may be the pastor failed in that aspect too sir ,there is no place in the letter where money is been mentioned ,but the man rush online to draw public attention ,if he is truly a pastor ,he will focus on his God given assignment not man given task ,most of them are only doing the job cos of the salary not because of soul .God will help us sir

helpee:
We all know this but are you saying the pastor should be getting updates from angels in heaven? What is the essence of a soul saved that was not watered. salvation is not a days job. if you win a soul, the soul will be lost if it is not nurtured. That is why they are pastors not evangelist. A pastor means a shepherd that daily feeds the sheep. So where is the sheep? They are in heaven according to you so is it not better to allow the angels to keep feeding the sheep while the pastor is sacked. so if you employ fulani herdsmen without cows, you won't sack them because the cows are in sabo ? A pastor without a sheep has lost his job already...oyedepo only confirmed it by sacking him. We are too holy in this country. A pastor can't be sacked for having no congregation to pastor...so why is he a pastor? Abeg

"A pastor without a sheep has lost his job already.."

Can I have a Bible reference for this? Why did you discount the fact that when a pastor preaches and God wins a soul through him, it is NOT compulsory for that soul to worship in that church?; He could go away and worship somewhere else.

While at that, point me to a reference in the bible where God commands us to be doing growth index by number of worshippers in church.

When we talk of politics, we talk of constitution, when we talk of God, we should talk about the bible, not your own assumption.

Lifestone:

Bro he's a Pastor, "filled with the Holy Sprirt"

Corinthians 3:6 says it is the lord that maketh the growth... check it out

Wiseandtrue:
I wasn't going to comment on this topic until Oyedepo himself address this issue!

But Reno, got this all wrong!

You guys have become fishers of money and not fishers of men chai! God must be a patient God oooo!

Now if the growth you are talking about is the physical growth:

Did the apostles win souls for Christ when He was with them I mean they were always going about with Jesus

And if the monetary aspect, many of the disciples STOPPED working when they met Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ has been taking care of every of their needs! Go and read Matthew 4:18–22, Mark 3:16-20 and Luke 5:1–11 , John 1:35–51!

So if BISHOP Oyedepo is really like Christ and is doing the work of Jesus Christ why can't he take care of his pastors need Or is God Almighty not a great provider again

Is Oyedepo now God Stop making mockery of God's name all in the name of looking for money!
Modified:

Did you read at all

Did Oyedepo ordained these men without hearing from God

God cannot contradict Himself!

Who is Oyedepo to sack those who wish to serve God

Even when the apostles were trying to stop those worshipping God simply because they are not part of them

Jesus Christ said "leave them! If they are not against us, they are with us!

How do you sack a pastor who is not stealing, going diabolical As a pastor, was he not prayerful Is he found wanted as a leader at home

Common!

In your mind, you think you were making sense.

There are many churches he can serve God.

He must not serve God in winner.

If he has a calling, he should prove his ministry.

Better still he can start his own ministry. as a pastor he is not call to winner's. He is called for service to God and it must not be winners. It can be done anywhere

wirinet:


Exactly! I had though that it was written in the Bible that "where two or three is gathered in my name, I would be in their midst". I now realize that it's about Church Growth Index.

This is a very good reference. The bible says two or three gathered in my name. See the threshold that is even stated in the bible!, Not thousands or millions gathered in my name.

Christianity has gone to the dogs in Nigeria.

nyiamfrank:
Reno Omokri wrote on his Facebook page


https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=310019004236878&id=111647580740689

can I ask a question please I don't know much about all this church rules but if they were sacked and the church they were serving before the sack some of their love once follows them to their own church dey established at times we should be patient oooooo they will loose more members since the pastor has gift and anointing too

Wiseandtrue:
I wasn't going to comment on this topic until Oyedepo himself address this issue!

But Reno, got this all wrong!

You guys have become fishers of money and not fishers of men chai! God must be a patient God oooo!

Now if the growth you are talking about is the physical growth:

Did the apostles win souls for Christ when He was with them I mean they were always going about with Jesus

And if the monetary aspect, many of the disciples STOPPED working when they met Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ has been taking care of every of their needs! Go and read Matthew 4:18–22, Mark 3:16-20 and Luke 5:1–11 , John 1:35–51!

So if BISHOP Oyedepo is really like Christ and is doing the work of Jesus Christ why can't he take care of his pastors need Or is God Almighty not a great provider again

Is Oyedepo now God Stop making mockery of God's name all in the name of looking for money!
Modified:

Did you read at all

Did Oyedepo ordained these men without hearing from God

God cannot contradict Himself!

Who is Oyedepo to sack those who wish to serve God

Even when the apostles were trying to stop those worshipping God simply because they are not part of them

Jesus Christ said "leave them! If they are not against us, they are with us!

How do you sack a pastor who is not stealing, going diabolical As a pastor, was he not prayerful Is he found wanted as a leader at home

Common!

U nailed it bro.
They won’t see sense in the write up now, only to come here and spew trash supporting their god of men.

Since it’s the Father’s job we all are doing and we all are his son’s, can you stop me from working in my father’s house the way I wish too? As long as I am doing my bit.
Lastly you said something sensible that since he heard from God to ordain them why then will he sack them without hearing from God too abi Na God tell ham to sack them? U see this people ehn, just Dey look them as Dem Dey display their foolishness with religion.

You made sense bro.

Goat

This is for those defending the decision of winners chapel in sacking its pastors

What is the actual source of the money used in paying employed pastors in winners chapel? How does the church make money to pay its pastors? Is the money coming from God directly?

Answer the above questions honestly to wake up from your sleep .

temmyyem:
If you know anything about Christ, nothing can convince you otherwise that Oyedepo is an end tilme false pastor.

False Pastor For over 40 years in ministry and still going stronger, tell your self the truth and don't be a buzu critic's.

unmask:
winning souls for Christ is not quantified by the number of people that end up going to your church. It is the number of people that understand and follow the tenets of Christ and are able to preach same to others. So if the church sacked the pastors because the number of church members did not increase, then they should accept the flack they get.

What most of you haven't said is how this Pastor is to be held accountable. He collects salary, stay in the Church apartment and when it's time to account for his performance, he suddenly becomes a Pastor at large !

advanceDNA:


I don’t think this is about money..

In winners, the main duty of resident pastor is church growth i.e in numbers of people...

the fact is...no pastor can force people to give...Increase in number of people doesn’t necessarily translate to increase in money...

For example...if number of women( mothers are on the increase in a particular month. Automatically that’s double or triple because mothers will come with kids... but that won’t mean increase in offering or tithe...as children don’t give...

A pastor can’t drag rich people to church or force them to give so really he has no control over increase in money....

My opinion shaa

Church growth can also be linked to how the pastor manages the church account, members and the church at large.


Maybe his actions were causing friction and affection the membership negatively.