OkaiCorne:


Bros calm down and answer me on these especially if you agree there is a limitation on our 5 senses as humans

1) Do you have a better Vision than an Eagle, or Cat (Dog at Night)?
2) Do you have a stronger sense of smell than a Dog?

Look, there is no limitation there. I will only agree with you that there are limitations if you can tell us categorically that cats and dogs see this God with their eyes. Do you know what cats and dogs see? Do you know if they see God or not?

But you cannot compare cats and dogs eyes to humans eyes when it comes to God because you don't know what they see.

Please take note that I have answeres your questions, and take your time to answer mine too. Don't avoid them as you have been avoiding Akin's questions.

OkaiCorne:


Mr. Scientific Atheist... can you please quote anywhere I stated discovering God on INTUITION ALONE?

Nairaland is waiting for you sir

I'm not surprised at your bolded reply because you cannot do anything apart from:
a) Proving people wrong since you have never made a mistake in your life
b) Insulting people ...which shows a fantastic job your parents did raising you up

Yes, I can, you said you don't have complete information about this God, which means your perceived logi is illogical which means zero.

So intuition + zero logic = intuition. Must it be spelled out in capitals before you can process it?

Stop calling Nairaland, they have started seeing you shame already.

Yes, I am glad to prove you right, and also prove you as a coward running for questions.
You started insulting, and bringing my parents into this won't help you. You only drag people's parents into argument when yours are useless. Keep it up sir.

Graycoder:


Look, there is no limitation there. I will only agree with you that there are limitations if you can tell us categorically that cats and dogs see this God with their eyes. Do you know what cats and dogs see? Do you know if they see God or not?

But you cannot compare cats and dogs eyes to humans eyes when it comes to God because you don't know what they see.

Please take note that I have answeres your questions, and take your time to answer mine too. Don't avoid them as you have been avoiding Akin's questions.

Very good, now we are getting somewhere with the Human-Ant Analogy. If you agree our sense of sight and smell is limited compared to lower creatures I just mentioned...what is the basis for using these senses to conclude that an Eternal Creator DOES NOT EXIST?

Do you go to a gun fight (Universal level) with a Knife (Limited Senses)?

To be honest, you are stimulating me intellectually with your clear and concise response (no sarcasm intended).

Can we continue this discussion here if you are not concerned with derailing the thread further? or Would you prefer I open another thread and leave Akin1212 playground (at least the thread has over 25 pages in less than a week )

Akin1212:


Yes, I can, you said you don't have complete information about this God, which means your perceived logi is illogical which means zero.

So intuition + zero logic = intuition. Must it be spelled out in capitals before you can process it?

Stop calling Nairaland, they have started seeing you shame already.

Yes, I am glad to prove you right, and also prove you as a coward running for questions.
You started insulting, and bringing my parents into this won't help you. You only drag people's parents into argument when yours are useless. Keep it up sir.

Do you want us to continue here or do I open another thread for us to continue there? Since I am in your playground...SET THE RULES

Akin1212:


Actually, bro, I have just been trying to help him think. Since he cannot do it all by himself. I am not sure he is oriented scientifically since he has demonstrated it here with his false scientific claims. But unfortunately, he can counter scientific logic despite not having prior knowledge of science. He thinks science is an assumed ideology and unintelligent being like him can just talk about.

I am not trolling him, I am helping him. He has really derailed this thread with jargons. Thanks for noticing.

You are supposed to lecture him on the basics of science and then pick up from there. He has shown zero knowledge of science, what do you expect from him? I am disappointed you now resorted to exchanging insults with him. If you check well, he does not really have good points that's why he will use trolling and insult as his strength, you should not have gone down that path with him. I am not here to support him but I can see who is lost and who is correct. Just stop the insulting please.

Graycoder:


You are supposed to lecture him on the basics of science and then pick up from there. He has shown zero knowledge of science, what do you expect from him? I am disappointed you now resorted to exchanging insults with him. If you check well, he does not really have good points that's why he will use trolling and insult as his strength, you should not have gone down that path with him. I am not here to support him but I can see who is lost and who is correct. Just stop the insulting please.

I wonder if Science KNOWS EVERYTHING about the Universe...

I wonder what Atheists will do when Science catches up with Intuition to discover the Eternal Creator...

Atheism fanboys ... let's ride on

Someone is about to use the basics of science to explain how Life can exist without a Creator...WITH A BASIC EXAMPLE







Dear Akin1212, Graycoder and all Nairalanders, let us go back to the basics of logic and Science;

MY LOGIC
If at the basic level, humans (conscious & intelligent life form) needs ENERGY to get things done therefore;
At the advanced level, An Eternal Creator (also a conscious & intelligent life form) needs ENERGY (Universal Energy) to get things done (create the Earth, Other Planets and Stars)

AKIN1212 LOGIC
If at the basic level, humans (conscious & intelligent life form) needs ENERGY to get things done therefore;
At the advanced level, Energy plays a key role in creating the Earth, Other Planets and stars without the input of an intelligent life form (Eternal Creator). Because the 5 senses (alone) of a Human (which is not the best standard anyways) cannot visualize the Eternal Creator.

OkaiCorne:


Very good, now we are getting somewhere with the Human-Ant Analogy. If you agree our sense of sight and smell is limited compared to lower creatures I just mentioned...what is the basis for using these senses to conclude that an Eternal Creator DOES NOT EXIST?

Do you go to a gun fight (Universal level) with a Knife (Limited Senses)?

To be honest, you are stimulating me intellectually with your clear and concise response (no sarcasm intended).

Can we continue this discussion here if you are not concerned with derailing the thread further? or Would you prefer I open another thread and leave Akin1212 playground (at least the thread has over 25 pages in less than a week )

I reminded you that I answered your questions and you needed to answer mine. You have not answered my questions and this is one thing I have seen in your discussions with Akin. With all due respect sir, not answering questions is an attribute of unintelligent people. What's so hard in answering my questions? Are we discussing or you are interviewing me. I would like to continue if you answer my questions, if you won't I will not like to drag it further because I am not Akin1212. Answer my questions too as I have done yours. Let's be fair.

OkaiCorne:


The person you are arguing with is a Scientist with a background in Biology and Chemistry. If you don't give him links to articles from global leading scientists...He will still disagree with you.

but those examples I employed above simple or common knowledge. Experience has taught fulanis for example how to use a culture or a small quantity of soured milk to change a bowl of fresh milk to yoghurt. so what rocket science is in that incubation? When I'm bit free this evening I shall answer him. can you please quote me where I said a force is responsible for yoghurt making? I said while you sleep , you are not the one controlling your processes but a force whose existence who have laboured so hard to deny. Do you plan to dream the dreams you experience Mr scientist? can you control what you dream about? What is the science behind dreams?

Graycoder:


Look, there is no limitation there. I will only agree with you that there are limitations if you can tell us categorically that cats and dogs see this God with their eyes. Do you know what cats and dogs see? Do you know if they see God or not?

But you cannot compare cats and dogs eyes to humans eyes when it comes to God because you don't know what they see.

Please take note that I have answeres your questions, and take your time to answer mine too. Don't avoid them as you have been avoiding Akin's questions.

I humbly ask sir...Can you give one basic example of how Life can exist without a Creator?

Graycoder:


You are supposed to lecture him on the basics of science and then pick up from there. He has shown zero knowledge of science, what do you expect from him? I am disappointed you now resorted to exchanging insults with him. If you check well, he does not really have good points that's why he will use trolling and insult as his strength, you should not have gone down that path with him. I am not here to support him but I can see who is lost and who is correct. Just stop the insulting please.

Did you read the thread from when he came in? This guy is backward. I actually taught him some lessons on energy. But he is very backward. You cannot teach someone who doesn't want to learn. His scientific knowledge is absolute zero, I agree. I will stop insulting him, I'm not the type that likes insulting people online. But he must also behave himself.

OkaiCorne:


I humbly ask sir...Can you give one basic example of how Life can exist without a Creator?

This has not answered my question. I am writing in the words that you can read. Why do you do this? Do you want to discuss or you want to troll?

I answered your questions, answer mine. Let's discover the truth together, please.

Graycoder:


I reminded you that I answered your questions and you needed to answer mine. You have not answered my questions and this is one thing I have seen in your discussions with Akin. With all due respect sir, not answering questions is an attribute of unintelligent people. What's so hard in answering my questions? Are we discussing or you are interviewing me. I would like to continue if you answer my questions, if you won't I will not like to drag it further because I am not Akin1212. Answer my questions too as I have done yours. Let's be fair.

Fair enough ... you are seem more mature and composed, so I can relate well with you and perhaps get the point Akin1212 might have failed to pass across.

Back to your question. I CANNOT CONCLUDE whether Cats or Dogs or Eagles have seen the Eternal Creator because I do not have their vision nor sense of smell.

BUT THEY STAND A BETTER CHANCE because they have a better sense of Vision and Smell...

Back to my questions sir. Thank you

Babacele:
but those examples I employed above simple or common knowledge. Experience has taught fulanis for example how to use a culture or a small quantity of soured milk to change a bowl of fresh milk to yoghurt. so what rocket science is in that incubation? When I'm bit free this evening I shall answer him.

But you cannot give examples of the things you don't understand. I will like to discuss scientifically with someone who understands the basic laws of science. You cannot just come here and be saying a force is responsible for something, all forces have attributed names in science. Besides, a force is not responsible for anything metabolic. It will be a shame to me if I don't correct that wack knowledge. I am a trained scientist for crying out loud. Will I not correct you when you understand science upside down?

Graycoder:


This has not answered my question. I am writing in the words that you can read. Why do you do this? Do you want to discuss or you want to troll?

I answered your questions, answer mine. Let's discover the truth together, please.

I've answered you boss...I kindly await yours...

Akin1212:


Did you read the thread from when he came in? This guy is backward. I actually taught him some lessons on energy. But he is very backward. You cannot teach someone who doesn't want to learn. His scientific knowledge is absolute zero, I agree. I will stop insulting him, I'm not the type that likes insulting people online. But he must also behave himself.

Yup...you stated Energy (which is unintelligent and unconscious) is responsible for the Universe which is full of conscious and intelligent creatures...

But nobody can see the clear link between how something unintelligent and unconscious is responsible for conscious and intelligent life without an Intelligent life form manipulating energy to make this possible...

IF YOU CANNOT GIVE ONE BASIC EXAMPLE OF LIFE EXISTING WITHOUT A CONSCIOUS OR INTELLIGENT CREATOR...AT LEAST let Graycoder give it a shot. I hope he stands a better chance than you.

OkaiCorne:


Yup...you stated Energy (which is unintelligent and unconscious) is responsible for the Universe which is full of conscious and intelligent creatures...

But nobody can see the clear link between how something unintelligent and unconscious is responsible for conscious and intelligent life without an Intelligent life form manipulating energy to make this possible...

You cannot see the link because you cannot know what you don't know. How do you want me to help you understand? Have you seen Bermuda triangle? Is that intelligent to you? That's one feature of the unconscious energy.

Akin1212:


You cannot see the link because you cannot know what you don't know. How do you want me to help you understand? Have you seen Bermuda triangle? Is that intelligent to you? That's one feature of the unconscious energy.

Did you get to know Science from your first day on Earth or did you learn it over time?

I THOUGHT THERE IS SOMETHING CALLED LEARNING IN LIFE...

The average human mind would get to know things it didn't know initially with TIME

OkaiCorne:


Fair enough ... you are seem more mature and composed, so I can relate well with you and perhaps get the point Akin1212 might have failed to pass across.

Back to your question. I CANNOT CONCLUDE whether Cats or Dogs or Eagles have seen the Eternal Creator because I do not have their vision nor sense of smell.

BUT THEY STAND A BETTER CHANCE because they have a better sense of Vision and Smell...

Back to my questions sir. Thank you

I wonder why you brought it up then when you cannot conclude. That being said, that you don't know what cats and dogs see, and it has been established that whatever they see, their eyes is still part of the 5 senses of every animal on earth.

Before answering your question, let me quickly bring something to light. Sight is a function of electromagnetic waves, which includes several types of waves, I won't mention, you can check them up. But the visible light spectrum is what humans use to see. Other animals use ultraviolet, infrared and other types to see. No animal has a better chance than the another when it comes to sight. No waves is better than the other. There are many things we see that Dogs, cats and, eagles cannot see. But there is nothing they can see that we cannot see. And this is because we have devised instruments that can see in other wavelengths. This means we can see what dogs and cats or eagles can see, but they still cannot see what we see. But to be clear, Dogs still see in visible light spectrum.


Now to answer your question, You asked this: Do you go to a gun fight (Universal level) with a Knife (Limited Senses)?

My answer is NO. You fight a gun fight with a gun and a knife fight with a knife.
And that is where science comes in. I just told you up there, that we don't have limited senses because we can now see what other animals can see. Do you know that a snake sees with infrared rays(heat). There are scientific instruments that can see with infrared rays everywhere these days, you can order for one. There are scientific instruments that can see with ultraviolet rays. We are fighting this gun battle with guns. Science has gone beyond what you can chew without knowing about it.

Graycoder:


I wonder why you brought it up then when you cannot conclude. That being said, that you don't know what cats and dogs see, and it has been established that whatever they see, their eyes is still part of the 5 senses of every animal on earth.

Before answering your question, let me quickly bring something to light. Sight is a function of electromagnetic waves, which includes several types of waves, I won't mention, you can check them up. But the visible light spectrum is what humans use to see. Other animals use ultraviolet, infrared and other types to see. No animal has a better chance than the another when it comes to sight. No waves is better than the other. There are many things we see that Dogs, cats and, eagles cannot see. But there is nothing they can see that we cannot see. And this is because we have devised instruments that can see in other wavelengths. This means we can see what dogs and cats or eagles can see, but they still cannot see what we see. But to be clear, Dogs still see in visible light spectrum.


Now to answer your question, You asked this: Do you go to a gun fight (Universal level) with a Knife (Limited Senses)?

My answer is NO. You fight a gun fight with a gun and a knife fight with a knife.
And that is where science comes in. I just told you up there, that we don't have limited senses because we can now see what other animals can see. Do you know that a snake sees with infrared rays(heat). There are scientific instruments that can see with infrared rays everywhere these days, you can order for one. There are scientific instruments that can see with ultraviolet rays. We are fighting this gun battle with guns. Science has gone beyond what you can chew without knowing about it.

Very good...now my next set of questions please...

1) Can you use Science to give me one basic example of life existing without a creator?
2) Does Science have all the answers to life?

OkaiCorne:


Did you get to know Science from your first day on Earth or did you learn it over time?

I THOUGHT THERE IS SOMETHING CALLED LEARNING IN LIFE...

The average human mind would get to know things it didn't know initially with TIME

Did you not think there is also something called basic science in life? My friend, until you know, accept you don't know.

Bermuda triangle that has killed millions of people, is that a creation of an intelligent mighty being to you?

OkaiCorne:


Very good...now my next set of questions please...

1) Can you use Science to give me one basic example of life existing without a creator?
2) Does Science have all the answers to life?

Before we proceed, I need to be sure that you are digesting my points and I am digesting yours. I am not here to argue and I am not here for an interview either.

Did you read my epistle and do you agree that humans now do not have limited sight due to the instruments we have developed? We need to know what we are doing.

Akin1212:


Did you not think there is also something called basic science in life? My friend, until you know, accept you don't know.

Bermuda triangle that has killed millions of people, is that a creation of an intelligent mighty being to you?

There is basic science in life. Do you know why Science thrives, because the brains behind the profession are WILLING TO LEARN through reearch, observations, hypothesis and theories, e.t.c. With all due respect...you have not demonstrated this basic trait as a Scientist.

Your question is going to take us back to the parallel Universe theory of Stephen Dawkins you rejected. That will lead us to the parallel planes of existence. I am getting somewhere with Graycoder. I will continue from here once I'm through with him...

Graycoder:


Before we proceed, I need to be sure that you are digesting my points and I am digesting yours. I am not here to argue and I am not here for an interview either.

Did you read my epistle and do you agree that humans now do not have limited sight due to the instruments we have developed? We need to know what we are doing.

The summary of your message is the relevance of Science to advancing the cause of Humanity which I do not disagree with.

I am really comfortable with your style. Please continue with my questions

OkaiCorne:


There is basic science in life. Do you know why Science thrives, because the brains behind the profession are WILLING TO LEARN through reearch, observations, hypothesis and theories, e.t.c. With all due respect...you have not demonstrated this basic trait as a Scientist.

Your question is going to take us back to the parallel Universe theory of Stephen Dawkins you rejected. That will lead us to the parallel planes of existence. I am getting somewhere with Graycoder. I will continue from here once I'm through with him...

And what have you demonstrated here? What exactly? At least I have demonstrated basic knowledge to you but you refused it.

There is no way I am going back with you to a parallel universe and the planes of existence. I have proved it to you that the former is a fiction and the latter is based on religious beliefs. None of them has a scientific basis, so please keep them to yourself.

A problem you have is you speak the things you don't know about. Do you even know that atheists have different reasons for being atheists? Do you even know or realize that not all atheists are scientifically oriented? Do you even know that some people are atheists because they hate the character called God for all his atrocities? My brother, use this brain please, use it.

Not all atheists must follow Stephen Dawkins for his set of beliefs, that's why atheism is not a religion. It's just a disbelief in the God concept. Get that straight.

OkaiCorne:


The summary of your message is the relevance of Science to advancing the cause of Humanity which I do not disagree with.

I am really comfortable with your style. Please continue with my questions

No sir, the summary of my message is that, other animals do not have an ADVANTAGE of detecting God with their senses than us in the scientific world. We study them, we reproduce their living processes and we can sense what they sense due to instruments we have created. Do you agree? Let's be clear please.

Akin1212:


And what have you demonstrated here? What exactly? At least I have demonstrated basic knowledge to you but you refused it.

There is no way I am going back with you to a parallel universe and the planes of existence. I have proved it to you that the former is a fiction and the latter is based on religious beliefs. None of them has a religious basis, so please keep them to yourself.

A problem you have is you speak the things you don't know about. Do you even know that atheists have different reasons for being atheists? Do you even know or realize that not all atheists are scientifically oriented? Do you even know that some people are atheists because they hate the character called God for all his atrocities? My brother, use this brain please, use it.

Not all atheists must follow Stephen Dawkins for his set of beliefs, that's why atheism is not a religion. It's just a disbelief in the God concept. Get that straight.

I do not have a problem with the conclusion from the basic knowledge you displayed.

I just need a basic example to back up the possibility of Life existing out of nothing. That is what I ask for...just one basic example.

You have only tried to prove me wrong but with no basic example with your thought process from the scratch from your end...

Graycoder:

No sir, the summary of my message is that, other animals do not have an ADVANTAGE of detecting God with their senses than us in the scientific world. We study them, we reproduce their living processes and we can sense what they sense due to instruments we have created. Do you agree? Let's be clear please.

How did you arrive at this conclusion? Can you see the world through the eyes of a Dog or Cat to arrive at this conclusion?

I am not certain of this...but you are.

I am really curious.

OkaiCorne:


How did you arrive at this conclusion? Can you see the world through the eyes of a Dog or Cat to arrive at this conclusion?

I am not certain of this...but you are.

I am really curious.

Please sir, let us be clear and always read each other's post to hold on to the truth and learn a great deal.

Asking me this question is as a consequence of you not reading my epistle. I explained a lot there. I explained how cats and dogs and other animals alike see. And I went further to explain how we have been able to see what they see using the radiation they use. Please, go back to the epistle and read again. If you want me to continue, I beg you sir, READ what I post because I am fully reading everything you're posting.

Graycoder:


Please sir, let us be clear and always read each other's post to hold on to the truth and learn a great deal.

Asking me this question is as a consequence of you not reading my epistle. I explained a lot there. I explained how cats and dogs and other animals alike see. And I went further to explain how we have been able to see what they see using the radiation they use. Please, go back to the epistle and read again. If you want me to continue, I beg you sir, READ what I post because I am fully reading everything you're posting.

I read you perfectly sir, but it now confuses me as to whether it is your opinion or A FACT.

There are some Scientists with a different opinion kindly check the link below...

http://www.petmd.com/news/health-science/what-cats-and-dogs-can-see-humans-cant-you-wont-believe-it-31380

What makes them wrong and what makes your Opinion right?

That is why I asked if you concluded by seeing the world through the eyes of a dog or cat

If Science is always correct, why are there different opinions on a single matter? Please I am not asking to prove you wrong, I just want to learn with the right facts on ground.

There is also another article on the 4th of August 2017 that has a different conclusion from yours;

http://themindunleashed.com/2017/08/can-cats-dogs-see-spirits-science-confirms-can-see-frequencies-cant.html

OkaiCorne:


I read you perfectly sir, but it now confuses me as to whether it is your opinion or A FACT.

There are some Scientists with a different opinion kindly check the link below...

http://www.petmd.com/news/health-science/what-cats-and-dogs-can-see-humans-cant-you-wont-believe-it-31380

What makes them wrong and what makes your Opinion right?

That is why I asked if you concluded by seeing the world through the eyes of a dog or cat

If Science is always correct, why are there different opinions on a single matter? Please I am not asking to prove you wrong, I just want to learn with the right facts on ground.

Good, I will now bring out my points from your link. Please endeavor to read again.

When I answered your question, I told you that humans see with the visible light spectrum, you can go back to it to confirm. I told you that other animals use UV and Infrared. I specifically answer you that there are things other animals see that we can't see, do you recall?

Then I told you that, this is where science comes in, that we study these animals vision, here is an excerpt from your link that confirms that we study them.

"UV light is the wave length beyond the visible light from red to violet that humans can see. Humans have a lens that blocks UV from reaching the retina. It was previously thought that most mammals have lenses similar to humans.

Scientists studied the lenses of dead mammals, including cats, dogs, monkeys, pandas, hedgehogs, and ferrets. By researching how much light passes through the lens to reach the retina, they concluded that some mammals previously thought not to be able to see UV actually can."

It is not a personal opinion, it is something that is happening in the scientific world. The blog you copied that from is a pet blog which is talking to pet owners, it's not a scientific related blog. You must agree to that if you are sincere.
So the blog post is referring to pet owners who may be scientific and non scientific as related to dogs and cats.


But here is a scientific website which reveals everything

http://www.sci-news.com/biology/science-humans-can-see-infrared-light-02313.html.

Please, if you have the time read it up.

PS: The website is full of scientific jargons, if you don't mind. Please don't misinterprete anything there, if there are things you don't understand come here I will explain them.

OkaiCorne:


I read you perfectly sir, but it now confuses me as to whether it is your opinion or A FACT.

There are some Scientists with a different opinion kindly check the link below...

http://www.petmd.com/news/health-science/what-cats-and-dogs-can-see-humans-cant-you-wont-believe-it-31380

What makes them wrong and what makes your Opinion right?

That is why I asked if you concluded by seeing the world through the eyes of a dog or cat

If Science is always correct, why are there different opinions on a single matter? Please I am not asking to prove you wrong, I just want to learn with the right facts on ground.

There is also another article on the 4th of August 2017 that has a different conclusion from yours;

http://themindunleashed.com/2017/08/can-cats-dogs-see-spirits-science-confirms-can-see-frequencies-cant.html

You are not understanding my points are you? I have the same conclusion as these websites. We cannot see what dogs can see normally.

But science has been able to develop instruments that enable us see what these animals see.

I don't know why you do this, but it will not favor any of us if you keep acting as if you don't understand what I am saying.

Graycoder:


Good, I will now bring out my points from your link. Please endeavor to read again.

When I answered your question, I told you that humans see with the visible light spectrum, you can go back to it to confirm. I told you that other animals use UV and Infrared. I specifically answer you that there are things other animals see that we can't see, do you recall?

Then I told you that, this is where science comes in, that we study these animals vision, here is an excerpt from your link that confirms that we study them.

"UV light is the wave length beyond the visible light from red to violet that humans can see. Humans have a lens that blocks UV from reaching the retina. It was previously thought that most mammals have lenses similar to humans.

Scientists studied the lenses of dead mammals, including cats, dogs, monkeys, pandas, hedgehogs, and ferrets. By researching how much light passes through the lens to reach the retina, they concluded that some mammals previously thought not to be able to see UV actually can."

It is not a personal opinion, it is something that is happening in the scientific world. The blog you copied that from is a pet dog who is talking to pet owners, it's not a scientific related blog. You must agree to that if you are sincere.
So the blog post is referring to pet owners who may scientific and non scientific as related to dogs and cats.


But here is a scientific website which reveals everything

http://www.sci-news.com/biology/science-humans-can-see-infrared-light-02313.html.

Please, if you have the time read it up.

PS: The block is full of scientific jargons, if you don't mind. Please don't misinterprete anything there, if there are things you don't understand come here I will explain them.

I'll be back later in the evening to continue with you. I am in transit right now.