The question is why are doctors crying all over the media for things that will benefit other profession?
What do they wish to gain?

The thing is, nobody is listening to your bullsh!t anymore cos they can smell from mile afar

OgaInnocent:

Point of correction. Doctors can disrespect other health professionals because they are not their rivals. But if there is disrespect by nigerian doctors to JOHESU, it is simply reactionary due to their (JOHESU) continued challenge of the doctors. Imagine a graduate of medical laboratory science hanging stethoscope on his neck and saying he is a diagnostic doctor. Can u imagine that? Does that happen in your civilized setting?

In Nigeria, every one working in the hospital is answering a doctor. Doctors can't just fold hand and watch them. So any action by the doctors is reactionary. Otherwise, what does a doctor gain by victimizing a nurse who has done him no wrong. But when a nurse starts claiming he /she can do what d doctors can do...I wonder!! My brother, just reason that.

Pride is written all over your write up and this particular comment. Be humble

Just passing

Do you really know the full terms of their strike? As much as u can complain doctors are paid well for Nigerians,u may argue its not enough but do not compare with Canadian doctors this is Nigeria not Canada we learn to walk before flying . You should be theirs compatriots as doctors but when health workers are on strike the doctors feel superior .let me tell you a hospital cannot function without d people on strike,do not trample on people fighting. for their right u overpampered so-called professionals, the soldiers dying for you are not paid 5million a year and doctors take 10mill ,teachers, and more after politicians,doctors are next u make @least 500k per month nd peeple trying to improve their 150k salary u either join them or let them fight for their right.15years in school does not compare to 2years military training all have their pro nd cons.do not condem 1 for fighting their right

Amarabae:

Why not.
I read it.

You started from a neutral point and then end up being sentimental.

Government are not treating medical professionals well in this country, I agree .

My postulation in that thread is about the N.M.A Cold War with Johesu.
We support them demanding for better treatment from the government the same way johesu expect them to support us.

Whatever agreement we johesu have with the government or whatever our demands are should not be a treat to them.

They have been kicking against johesu interest secretly for years now through the ministers of health who are doctors.

We need partnership,
They support us,
We support them.

In Canada, there was a protest by doctors over being overpaid and for the welfare agenda of other health professionals to be met.
That's mutual respect and cooperation.
.
I have no issue with doctors, I have many of them as friends in my work place and I have worked with them a lot.
The man who fathered me is also one.
Plus two siblings in the profession.

But we have to put things in place.
Them themselves are being exploited in Nigeria,
What a doctor in Europe is earning a month is far superior to what a doctor is earning in Nigeria,
That's why many of them are leaving.
.
Johesu is not in any war with NMA.
.
As for your later part,
You don't expect a medical lab people to allow microbiologists to take over their job.
You said that you read microbiology In your first degree, you thought you will compete with med lab guys but reality dawned on you.
Maybe you are now in the medical school and you now deem it fit to be antagonizing anything med lab.

.
Secondly.
We university graduate nurses have no issue with school of nursing trained nurses,
A nurse is a nurse except Auxiliaries.

.
Everybody is important in the health sector.
Even the gateman at the hospital gate.

Thanks.

Imagine, dis one na ordinary 9ja nurse and go dey make noise like say she be qualified M.D.

Chai... Just imagine if she be M.D.

Listen and listen good. It took me ~+8yrs of progressive medical school and training (residency included). So, keep mum when real pple dey yan, abeg.

Thanks!

Our health sectors has always been in shambles so nothing new about this.

This issue is so complex.. so so complex and gets more difficult to resolve day-by-day.

You need one another.

Don't do my job; I wouldn't do yours.

Don't head my department, I wouldn't head yours.

I blame Obasanjo and Kuti really.

Glitzcaret:
@ogalnnocent
Its pride that is killing the some black nations....
I currently practice in the U.S and doctors don't have this backward mentality (superior to other health professionals).
It a shame that Nigerian train doctors lack respect for others.
I deal with facts so name any civilized nation that behave like you guys.

Bros, You've finally nailed it. Nigerian doctors are the most demented reasoning homo sapiens have ever come by. Why can't they fight for there right without interference with other surbordinate?. Guess what, Ask those doctors what was there reason for the last strike they embarked on? You will be shocked . All they know is how to write epistle of John on nairaland.

Follygunners:



Listen and listen good. It took me ~+8yrs of progressive medical school and training (residency included). So, keep mum when real pple dey yan, abeg.

Thanks!

your reply lacks intelligence.
And it's meaningless and it's bereft of logical analysis.
If you like stay 200years in school and training , it's not Oriaku Amarachi business.


Nobody cares.
Thanks

I have never seen a group more selfish than the NMA.


I don't understand why anytime the other health professional seek for better work conditions, pay, proper placement in scheme of service and ability to progress, it is seen by them as a threat.
The most intelligent come back they have is talk about JAMB like every other person not in medicine must be a dunce. Pathetic reasoning.

This silly rivalry in the health sector is very nauseating. At the end of the day you need every part to function for maximum output.

NMA is an arrogant entity. If you think the only way to remaining relevant is by suppression and subjugation go have a rethink. The health sector in Nigeria is in a mess because the international standard is not followed. Health care is multidisciplinary. Mutual respect for all the team members. Your candle can't get brighter by putting out other people's candle light. Since the medical doctors have been in charge nothing has improved in our health sector. How many of our leaders patronize your hospitals? Shame!
I know how many lives that have been saved at the hand of incompetent doctors by the intervention of a nurse,pharmacist and the others the paid OP is castigating.

OgaInnocent:
I was prompted to script this piece when I read yesterday from the comment of certain moniker here called amarabae, that the problem the Joint Health Sector Union (JOHESU) put themselves is being orchestrated by the Nigerian Medical Association (NMA /Doctors) .
#(screenshot below) #

Inasmuch as the veracity of such claim by such an anonymous online user remains inconsequential, I still wish to educate the unsuspecting public on certain things of paramount and topical significance.

Before I continue, I thought it worthwhile to introduce myself, so that you take cognizance of my biases, if any. I am NOT a medical doctor, at least for now, thus, suffer not yourself in trying to tag this as "espirit des corps" game.

Now, it is no longer news that JoHESu is on strike for reasons bordering on salary and hospital hierarchy.
The news is here:
... https://www.nairaland.com/4456282/federal-health-workers-under-umbrella/3#66805229

ON SALARY:

I wouldn't comment on that because that is the business of the the govt. But let it be on record that if someone should complain of salary, it is the doctors. Nigerian Doctors cannot talk in the presence of their colleagues practicing abroad. They are the most underpaid persons with relation to the value offered. You can imagine the amount Canadian doctors are paid that made them to protest last time. An average consultant doctor in canada receives about 500,000 (about 180 million naira) dollars yearly. A consultant in nigeria is struggling with 10million naira yearly. Hence the reason 90% of Nigerian doctors are jetting out of the country, with many on the way out also. Even the few that are staying, are doing so, due to some supplementation coming from private practice. Otherwise, with the rate at which other countries are ready to issue visa to doctors, Nigeria may soon run out of doctors.
The truth is everyone needs a salary increase because cost of goods have increased, starting from teachers. However, the issue of salary still remains their business with the govt, but note that if your salary is increased to that of a doctor, the doctors will seek their own increase. It is natural to act that way.

ON HOSPITAL HIERARCHY

I heard they want to be given consultant nurse, consultant physiotherapist, consultant Med Lab Scientist etc.

People need to understand something. The hospital is structured in such a way that every treatment /instruction must be directed from the Consultant Physician or Consultant Surgeon. No patient receives anything in the hospital unless the doctor says so. The reason is not far-fetched. It is in the best interest of the patient, so that he/she is not malhandled. Imagine when we introduce a consultant nurse, a doctor will give his own instructions and the nurse will also like to execute his own consultancy expertise by giving his own instructions, at the end, the patient, is at the receiving end. The practice is that the doctor is and must be the head of the patient management team.

Most nurses are clamoring for consultancy because of the knowledge they acquire by virtue of working in hospital for years. They feel they can now challenge the doctor.

I will give an analogy: In Catholic church, we have the parish priest, we have the catechist. By virtue of working at the alter for about 10years, the catechist can comfortably celebrate the mass. Infact he can even celebrate more than the priest if given opportunity. He can also be more prayerful than the priest. But no matter the condition, the catechist can never celebrate mass or be equated to the priest simply because he can do what the priest can do if given the opportunity. There is formal way of becoming a priest, and it is open to everyone, thus, if the catechist wishes to be celebrating mass, he should simply enroll into the seminary, and boom, he becomes a priest. That is the formality.

Nurse vs Nurse Dichotomy

There are two types of nurses, we have those that attended school of nursing(Registered Nurse. RN). we also have those that are studying nursing in university (B. Sc). The truth is that the BSc holders are paid far higher than the RN holders. Why is it so? In terms of work, I need not tell you that, the RN holders are the ones that do the major suffering in the hospital, and JOHESu will not harmonize their salaries so that all nurses are paid parallel amount. But they want to be paid what doctors (mbbs) are paid. That's hypocrisy.


Medical Laboratory Scientists vs Medical Laboratory Technology

The way Medical lab scientist (Bsc) discriminate against the Med lab technologist (HND) is another case study. You and I know that those polytechnic guys are more practical oriented and cannot be equated with university counterparts. But yet, the Bsc holders still lord it over the HND holders. They claim superiority over them, and yet want equality with doctors. Another hypocrisy.


Med Lab Scientist vs Microbiologist.

I happened to study microbiology in my first degree. As a microbiologist, you cannot have a lab on your own. You must work under a med lab Scientist. Even when the knowledge base is the same among the two disciplines.

Last time on Facebook I saw some graduates of med lab from ABSU hanging stethoscope on their neck, calling themselves diagnostic doctors. Thats so laughable. And that has been the delusion that has been making them think they are equal with doctors. That you can see bacteria in urine in the lab does not make you diagnose a patient of infection. A doctor makes 95% of the diagnosis from history and physical examination, just right in the consultation room. The lab tests are to confirm diagnosis and also check for the other systems that the patient may not be complaining of. Also every med lab Scientist works under a Consultant Chemical pathologist, consultant micro biologist, consultant Histopathologist, or Consultant hematologist as the case may be.


The Way OUT

The truth is that, there should not be the need for all these fracas if everyone remains to his job description and prescription. There is already a job description for doctors, nurses, med lab Scientists etc. If you are not comfortable with the job you do, you can switch and follow the formality laid out for that profession. There shouldn't be need for being a nurse and wanting to do the job of a doctor, or being a doctor and wanting to do the job of a nurse.
A doctor needs a nurse, a nurse needs a doctor, a med lab Scientist needs a doctor and vice versa.

In addition to that, every job has a salary scale, most times the salary does not justify the work they do, but only justifies the time and process it took to get there. The people that take the highest salaries in Nigeria are the people that do nothing. They only go to offices to enjoy the AC and go home at the end of the day. When the month ends, they collect millions. Its unfortunate society has made it that way. Let us have a rethink, and be human. Everyone needs salary increase, starting from teachers to doctors to JOHESU (except our senators ***winks***). The problem is getting it right at the electoral polls.

sscripturas@gmail.com

Ignorance is all I see
Concerning salary, aren't all health workers paid better outside the country?
Have you bothered to find out if their pay commemorates with their input at work?
That's what I feel you should stress and not your loopsided analogy

Concerning the consultant issue.
Each profession has its specific roles in the health system.
Why can't other professionals be allowed to get to the peak of their career?
Even in sane environment there are nurse consultant.
So you saying that all decisions regarding a patient is solely from the physician faults your analogy, you also said nurses wants to take decision because they have clinical experiences alone is just mere assumption and should be discarded. There are nurse consultant if you don't know.

I like your conclusion anyway, but you got some fact wrong.

Thanks

I just watched the Doctors(NMA) Attack Juhesu on TV Unnecessary while the dispute was supposed to be between the government and Juhesu. Now understand the series of challenges other health workers face and believe its their rights they are fighting for.

Most Nigerian doctors are so immature...and they call themselves leaders of the healthcare team.

Look at how they argue ignorantly and only know how to massage their over bloated ego.

The ones who even went to world-class schools abroad are not this prideful but those who studied in this country with so many ASUU strikes and inadequate tools for training are making mouth up and down...

Smh..

Very childish


Abeg, I no wan vex this evening...

Follygunners:


Imagine, dis one na ordinary 9ja nurse and go dey make noise like say she me qualified M.D.

Chai... Just imagine if she be M.D.

Listen and listen good. It took me ~+8yrs of progressive medical school and training (residency included). So, keep mum when real pple dey yan, abeg.

Thanks!

I barfed when I read your post. I am a graduate nurse like the lady you quoted and I attended anatomy, physiology, clinical chemistry, biochemistry, microbiology lectures with students of medicine, pharmacy, Med lab etc uptill 300 level.
I don't know the kind of muchroom backwater school you graduated from, where you, as a doctor cannot string together a readable sentence in English. So I'd like to remind you that next time when you argue with people, you'd better get your facts right.
If it took you eight years to graduate from medical school then you must be very dull, medicine is a six year course.

nairalanders...M in need of a job,I studied microbiology,please help a sister You can contact me via my gmail ojoarececilia94@gmail.com thanks in anticipation

Vindarlo:
NMA is an arrogant entity. If you think the only way to remaining relevant is by suppression and subjugation go have a rethink. The health sector in Nigeria is in a mess because the international standard is not followed. Health care is multidisciplinary. Mutual respect for all the team members. Your candle can't get brighter by putting out other people's candle light. Since the medical doctors have been in charge nothing has improved in our health sector. How many of our leaders patronize your hospitals? Shame!
I know how many lives that have been saved at the hand of incompetent doctors by the intervention of a nurse,pharmacist and the others the paid OP is castigating.

I love that quote.
Your candle can't get brighter by putting other people candle off.
The funny fact is that when you try to correct them on things,
The next thing you hear is that you are jealous of them and wanted to read medicine but jamb stopped you
.
To them, all nurses,pharmacists,med lab scientists etc wanted to read medicine but Jamb stopped them.
Hahahahahahaha.
.
It's very funny.

Follygunners:


Imagine, dis one na ordinary 9ja nurse and go dey make noise like say she me qualified M.D.

Chai... Just imagine if she be M.D.

Listen and listen good. It took me ~+8yrs of progressive medical school and training (residency included). So, keep mum when real pple dey yan, abeg.

Thanks!

That statement tells a lot about the kind of doctors we have in this country.

You do not want to be discriminated against yet you have no qualms with discriminating against other medical personnel. You do not want them to head your departments, yet you want to head their departments, the hospital and the entire medical sector.

The hospitals of the advanced nations you guys are always whining about fleeing to are headed by a CEO, who is usually a nurse or an administrator The CEO is never a doctor.

Please educate yourself and stop being backward. Spending 8 years in school does not necessarily mean that you are enlightened. http://www.healthcareadministration.com/becoming-a-hospital-ceo/

This write up is reeking ignorance and stupidity

Doctors cannot disrespect other health professional. If you are in the medical profession because you want to continue to be a bully, I hope you get what you deserve. Arrogant prick!

OgaInnocent:

Point of correction. Doctors can disrespect other health professionals because they are not their rivals. But if there is disrespect by nigerian doctors to JOHESU, it is simply reactionary due to their (JOHESU) continued challenge of the doctors. Imagine a graduate of medical laboratory science hanging stethoscope on his neck and saying he is a diagnostic doctor. Can u imagine that? Does that happen in your civilized setting?

In Nigeria, every one working in the hospital is answering a doctor. Doctors can't just fold hand and watch them. So any action by the doctors is reactionary. Otherwise, what does a doctor gain by victimizing a nurse who has done him no wrong. But when a nurse starts claiming he /she can do what d doctors can do...I wonder!! My brother, just reason that.

Nigerian Doctors are local champion, none of Nigeria doctor have successfully carried out kidney transplant, yet they compare themselves to doctors in a civilized nation. Nurses sell more in civilized nation. Doctors has abandoned clinical practice to administration, while some people red hospital management, nobody is saying that doctors is head of medical team, but shouldnt suppress other professionals, other paramedics still want to grow in their own carrier. Nurses spend 7yrs in the University with nysc and internship inclusive likewise pharmacy, medical lab. Doctors spend 8yrs, just 1 yr different. Then entry point for doctors GL 13,pharmacy and medical lab 10,graduate nurses 8.when circular came nurses to be upgraded to 10,doctors will sit on it. In outside world, in US a nurse is the surgeon general. What johesu is asking is fairness, I feel this can be resolved by round table discussion, health sector can be better by absolute team work. My opinion.

A very disheartening and biased submission. Can somebody educate this fellow that his/her analysis is myopic and selfish. Before I am misconstrued, i am not a health worker and will never desire to be one. How can a sane person begin to compare the salary of a Canadian Dr to that of a Nigerian Dr? Can the fellow also compare service delivery of both Drs in public hospitals? Am sorry to say that an average Nigerian Dr from Junior Registrar to Chief Consultant is not passionate about lives. Better still, is not bothered about saving lives but particular of earnings.

It's even more worrisome to observe that some medical Drs hide on the premise of team or unit to be earning monthly salaries without any contribution during ward round. I am talking from experience. Is it the one that some so called Senior registrar will recommend drugs that have no impact on diagnoses. In this regard, I have met some nurse who are more informative than our so called Nigerian Drs whose pride and ego will not allow them to learn.

Finally, these ego inflated guys hardly see other health workers as team mates. They try to lord over other health workers as if those ones didn't acquire any form of formal education. They hardly want to know that each profession in health sector has its own relevance. And doesn't require interference by medical Drs.

naijaking1:


It's not about pride, but capability. Oh, I forgot to tell you that one of classmates was a Pharm. D, today she doing better after completing Ob/Gyn residency. She is able to manage the patient from pharmaceutical, anatomical, physiological, and even nursing point view. You go siddon there and shout, because you are in Nigeria.

Your point of view is lame you guys need to move out to visit other countries then you will understand the difference between the role of a Pharmacist and a doctor.
The execute and legislative arm of govt does not have thesame role bro...grow up.
If she doesn't love Pharmacy then she made the perfect move.....Pharmacy is a independent professional course...use your Google idiot!!!

CEO is not usually the nurse. You should read your reference.

Mobsync:


That statement tells a lot about the kind of doctors we have in this country.

You do not want to be discriminated against yet you have no qualms with discriminating against other medical personnel. You do not want them to head your departments, yet you want to head their departments, the hospital and the entire medical sector.

The hospitals of the advanced nations you guys are always whining about fleeing to are headed by a CEO, who is usually a nurse or an administrator The CEO is never a doctor.

Please educate yourself and stop being backward. Spending 8 years in school does not necessarily mean that you are enlightened. http://www.healthcareadministration.com/becoming-a-hospital-ceo/

All I know is that the op has no understanding of what Consultancy means. Basically a consultant cardiologist is a master in that field which is what Nurse consultants, pharmacy consultants etc. are all about.
In the Nigerian medical profession, one group lords it over others and try to slow or inhibit their growth. Which begs the question, since doctors have been lording it and heading every head able position (and creating more for themselves), have the Nigerian health sector improved? We all know how we came to this sorry state in our health sector and we all know how to get out of it.

I think we need to start having hospital CEO's/administrators who are not medical doctors but who studied healthcare management or other health discipline instead of allowing Medical doctors to do the job.

There will be more sanity in the system.

.

Mobsync:


That statement tells a lot about the kind of doctors we have in this country.

You do not want to be discriminated against yet you have no qualms with discriminating against other medical personnel. You do not want them to head your departments, yet you want to head their departments, the hospital and the entire medical sector.

The hospitals of the advanced nations you guys are always whining about fleeing to are headed by a CEO, who is usually a nurse or an administrator The CEO is never a doctor.

Please educate yourself and stop being backward. Spending 8 years in school does not necessarily mean that you are enlightened. http://www.healthcareadministration.com/becoming-a-hospital-ceo/

please always arm yourself with information before talking.
I have been an onlooker silently viewing this threads for days but couldnt stomach It any longer.
This advanced world have CMDs who is a doctor, always a doctor, then a board consisting of other people, which is headed by the CEO or board chairman [as is obtainable in nogeria[]..so its the same thing here too, the board or CEO os just an oversight function.
But the management is left to the CMD.

Glitzcaret:
@naijaking you sound ignorant so let me educate you,
×As a Pharmacist you must attend West Africa college of Pharmacist, undergo a residency programme in an accredited institution e.t.C before you become a consultant
×Consultancy in Pharmacy is not a Nigerian invention, is practice all over civilized nations and doctors don't feel threatened.

why not choose another title , must it be "consultant". they could use expert or whatever. It'inferiority complex if you ask me!!

Medical professionals are the only professionals that earn more in the public institutions than private company,they are so good in using the poor as pawn they sacrifice as ease.

If the govt privatize all public health care all this nonsense will stop.

Hospital In streets can’t pay their doctors 100k.

Amarabae:

You de mind them?
Only them are educated in the health sector, others are not.
Let me mind my business before they say that I am envying them .
.

i knew u will come here. Always against doctors. Better go and buy jamb form b4 ur frustrations kill u

Sterope:
CEO is not usually the nurse. You should read your reference.

How do Hospital CEOs get to where they are?

In studying this list of “20 New Hospital CEOs to Know”, it seems that most of the CEOs have a couple things in common:

They served as COOs of hospitals before. COO, the Chief Operating Officer, delegates day to day operations and reports to the CEO, who is usually too busy to review production quotas and operations daily.

They held a Masters in Healthcare Administration, Business Administration or Nursing from an accredited university.

They held previous positions in strategic management, business and executive leadership. (Meaning medical expertise isn’t all CEOs need to have!)
They had about 15 or more years of experience in healthcare before they became the CEOs of major hospitals. (Patience is a must.)