vaxx:
yes you are right but how reliable it is is the bone of discussion, i mean the evidence that can be gotten from youtube. if you may want know, YouTube videos cannot provide the content in detail because videos has got it's own limitations. You cannot get into the mind of an author just by watching YouTube videos. If you want a detailed information which an author is trying to convey, then reading books is definitely the best option.

Watching YouTube videos will give you a gist of knowledge, whereas reading books will give you a detailed information of that knowledge which you are trying to acquire. it is better as an educated mind to decend on books while watching youtube video to validate it. that is how it is done in an academic cycle.



with the italic aspect, you must be joking, education is not limited to the Europeans nor white folks alone. we have our educational system in African too. we learn and educate ourselves even before the adventure of the western. not having a formal education system does not mean equate illiteracy. in fact formal education system is a late comer. education start in African right from from homes. scholarly is based on what was done under rigorous research in which does not let Africans alone. instead of you relying on smear internet campaign , you yourself can as well take this approach on your kind self and personally come up with findings that will be both welcome and accept among scholars who also go thru the same method. so it is not for white supremacy as you said.


And to the rest of your point, it is founded on shaky foundation. it does not in anyway disqualified jesus existence but a mere campaign to attack Christianity. WHERE IS IT IN THAT OF BOOK THAT WAS WRITTEN AFTER 200 YEARS THAT STATE JESUS NEVER EXIST.

I think you don't understand how we got the education we have now. So, you really believe the education you have now is the type of education you would have had; if we did not have an encounter with Europeans?

If so, you're probably the only person who don't know that upon our encounter with Europeans, we lost everything in education and the language to acquire that education- which is why you and I are locked in using English a foreign language to talk about ourselves and scholarly matters. Let me tell you; you as an African CANNOT publish anything to disprove Jesus, even if it is accurate enough to disprove Jesus. The Jesus story is not your story!. You are a spectator!.

On books, I have provided books and can share with anyone who need those that I have now.

More books disproving Jesus, and general history of religion.

101 Myths of the Bible: How Ancient Scribes Invented Biblical History- GaryGreenberg

Bible myths and their parallel in other religions- T.W Doane

Pagan Origins of the Christ Myth by John G. Jackson 1941 (this is just a pamphlet, and its available)

Ancient Egypt the light of the world- Gerald Massey

vaxx:
his book name pls

Google him up.

musicwriter:
Now, Moses has delivered the Jews/Israelites out of the hands of the Pharoah.

After achieving this feat, the people (not Moses) regarded Moses as their ''deliverer'', ''savior'', ''redeemer'', ''messiah''.

It was natural for the Jews/Israelites to think of Moses as their ''messiah'' since they must attribute their successful exit from the government of pharaoh as the good work of their new found belief.

When they got to their new location (the environs of today’s Palestine) they lived there permanently. So many times, their new land was invaded by various occupying forces who enslaved and colonized them, just like Britain, France, Portugal, Spain, occupied Africa during slavery and colonialism.

Kenya, Uganda, Tanzania and environs were once colonized by Germany, before Britain took over East Africa from Germany. Togo republic and Cameroun were both also once colonized by Germany before France took over. Such was the situation in Palestine and environ when the African Jews/Israelites first got there in ancient time.

Below is a brief timeline of their presence and struggle in their new land (now called Jerusalem, Judea, Palestine and environ).

721 BC Assyrians conquer Israel
605 BC Babylon exerts influence over Judah
597 BC Babylon attacks Judah
586 BC Babylon destroys Jerusalem and Temple
586-573 BC Babylon king Nebuchadnezzar attacks Tyre
539 BC Cyrus the Great conquers Babylon
538 BC Cyrus releases the Israelites from Babylonian Captivity
536 BC Work begins to rebuild Temple
516 BC Second Temple is dedicated
333 BC Greeks begin rule over the land of Israel
331 BC Alexander conquers Tyre (Phoenician Empire)
250 BC The Old Testament is translated into Greek
175 BC Greek ruler Antiochus Epiphanes torments the Israelites
164-63 BC Israelites have independence during Mattathias Hasmonean the Maccabean Rule Period
63 BC Romans take over the land of Israel

Once Rome got there, they imposed taxes on them and ruled them with an iron hand, same way Britain, France, Portugal, Spain, occupied Africa during slavery, colonialism and ruled Africa with oppression. The people of Palestine and environs began to revolt against this foreign occupation to no avail. Thousands of people were killed.

At a point, they began looking for another ''deliverer'', ''savior'', ''redeemer'', ''messiah'' who will save them from the hands of the Roman empire.

Many messiahs and movements did come forward to save the Jews/Israelites and their leaders were either killed or the movement scattered. So, many people and movements were quashed by Rome.

About 5BC to 30 AD, another man came forward and was killed; just like many other saviors that have attempted before to save their people from colonialism (I will not call him Jesus because Jesus is an invention). I will get to that.

so can you tell us who this person who appeared at as that time is, if not yeshua?

However, let me call him XYZ for now. XYZ was killed because he was criticizing both the Roman government and his fellow Jews/Israelites, accusing them of corruption and collaborating with the Roman government to exploit the people using Jehovah (Religion).

He was anti-establishment and was not into any religious nonsense, as he believed there should be no middle man between him and God. He accused the ruling class among his brothers as being corrupt and collaborators with the Roman colonialists.

if this isn't an assumption, why would you conceal the name of the actual person carrying the activities you outlined..?

Or are you saying what you outlined didn't happened?

vaxx:
i have seen this one in particular i can tell you it is not taken seriously. i will post the review of his work here if you wish. while i will let the audience try to view the rest by themselves

Until you open your eyes and realize the Jesus story is not your story and that the scholarship around it puts you as a spectator, you won't understand the depth of your enslavement.

dalaman:


Google him up.

this embarrassing pls. the proof is on you

Humchi:

so can you tell us who this person who appeared at as that time is, if not yeshua?

if this isn't an assumption, why would you conceal the name of the actual person carrying the activities you outlined..?

Or are you saying what you outlined didn't happened?

Read on and you'll see subsequent pages answered the question of who was that XYZ now called Jesus. There were thousands of JesusES, but the bible Jesus did not exist.

musicwriter:


Until you open your eyes and realize the Jesus story is not your story and that the scholarship around it puts you as a spectator, you won't understand the depth of your enslavement.

you just shot yourself in the foot with this statement, then while are you arguing he never existed. is it you own story?

vaxx:
this embarrassing pls. the proof is on you

https://www.richardcarrier.info

That's his personal website. You'll see all the books he has written there.

vaxx:
you just shot yourself in the foot with this statement, then while are you arguing he never existed. is it you own story?

@vax plz leave ur questions till Op conclude his write up, u can note them for now. thanks

PAGAN9JA:



people like you are the reasons for our problems today . you know what you practice is wrong yet you do it. This is called slavery.

huh?

vaxx:
you just shot yourself in the foot with this statement, then while are you arguing he never existed. is it you own story?

I opened this thread to inform us we don't have to concern ourselves with the Jesus story anymore. You are the one telling us otherwise.

When European missionaries got to India and wanted to convert the Buddhists and Hindus to Christianity, they replied the Europeans, thus: "Brethren, if you white men murdered the son of the Great Spirit, we Indians have nothing to do with it, and it is none of our affair. If he had come among us, we would not have killed him. We would have treated him well. You must make amends for that crime yourselves."

That's what should be our attitude henceforth, and that's what I am trying to pass here, but you become a problem to our freedom.

musicwriter:


I think you don't understand how we got the education we have now. So, you really believe the education you have now is the type of education you would have had; if we did not have an encounter with Europeans?

If so, you're probably the only person who don't know that upon our encounter with Europeans, we lost everything in education and the language to acquire that education- which is why you and I are locked in using English a foreign language to talk about ourselves and scholarly matters. Let me tell you; you as an African CANNOT publish anything to disprove Jesus, even if it is accurate enough to disprove Jesus. The Jesus story is not your story!. You are a spectator!.

On books, I have provided books and can share with anyone who need those that I have now.

More books disproving Jesus, and general history of religion.

101 Myths of the Bible: How Ancient Scribes Invented Biblical History- GaryGreenberg

Bible myths and their parallel in other religions- T.W Doane

Pagan Origins of the Christ Myth by John G. Jackson 1941 (this is just a pamphlet, and its available)

Ancient Egypt the light of the world- Gerald Massey

bro am done with u. focus on the topic(jesus is not real and muhammed is fake) you are just jumping from one discussion to the other. if you are interested on why africans is backward intellectually. create a thread on it i will honor you and besides stop reading pseudo intellectual books. i do a lot of review before reading and not just because the books speaks my mind. i must say i am disappointed, your thread is not educative at all. no new things to learn

vaxx:
bro am done with u. focus on the topic(jesus is not real and muhammed is fake) you are just jumping from one discussion to the other. if you are interested on why africans is backward intellectually. create a thread on it i will honor you and besides stop reading pseudo intellectual books. i do a lot of review before reading and not just because the books speaks my mind. i must say i am disappointed, your thread is not educative at all. no new things to learn

I got into that aspect to let you know we neither created the education to provide the scholarly proof, nor did we create the religion. Religion or education, you're bound.

musicwriter:


I opened this thread to inform us we don't have to concern ourselves with the Jesus story anymore. You are the one telling us otherwise.

When European missionaries got to India and wanted to convert the Buddhists and Hindus to Christianity, they replied the Europeans, thus: "Brethren, if you white men murdered the son of the Great Spirit, we Indians have nothing to do with it, and it is none of our affair. If he had come among us, we would not have killed him. We would have treated him well. You must make amends for that crime yourselves."

That's what should be our attitude henceforth, and that's what I am trying to pass here, but you become a problem to our freedom.

it is same thing you just shoot yourself in the foot. i am not on your thread to tell people to accept jesus but to debunk your unfounded claim that he never existed. your claim is cracky like the websites you reccomend

dalaman:


https://www.richardcarrier.info

That's his personal website. You'll see all the books he has written there.

yet, you still do not answer my question? what is the name of his book. let start from there

vaxx:
it is same thing you just shoot yourself in the foot. i am not on your thread to tell people to accept jesus but to debunk your unfounded claim that he never existed. your claim is cracky like the websites you reccomend

More than enough information has been provided. But as they say ''you can take a horse to the stream, but you can't make it drink''. You may have chosen to be a slave, and I know why, but please stop derailing this thread for those who have positive reasons to be here.

Student125:

@vax plz leave ur questions till Op conclude his write up, u can note them for now. thanks

ok sir. i am sorry

vaxx:
yet, you still do not answer my question? what is the name of his book. let start from there

What do you want? He has many books. You can check them out on the website. Are you that lazy?

dalaman:


What do you want? He has many books. You can check them out on the website. Are you that lazy?

lol. am doing it for the purpose of everybody on this thread who will be interested. since you claim the man did wrote an established book that counter the existence of Jesus, you should be able to name the book the author wrote. that will be interesting. remember this is a discussion forum not classroom . WHAT IS THE NAME OF THE BOOK.

Student125:

plz leave ur questions till Op conclude his write up, u can note them for now. thanks

I don't think I'll be making further post, the one you quoted has derailed the thread. However, I think every info anybody need to free themselves is one the thread. The rest will appear in my upcoming book.

vaxx:
lol. am doing it for the purpose of everybody on this thread who will be interested. since you claim the man did wrote an established book that counter the existence of Jesus, you should be able to name the book the author wrote. that will be interesting. remember this is a discussion forum not classroom . WHAT IS THE NAME OF THE BOOK.

OK.

The tittle of the book is "On the historicity of Jesus: Why we might have reason for doubt.

Written by Richard Carrier. He is a well respected scholar and has debated people like William Craig(who only debates scholars ).

musicwriter:


I don't think I'll be making further post, the one you quoted has derailed the thread. However, I think every info anybody need to free themselves is one the thread. The rest will appear in my upcoming book.

there is different between derailing and exposing. what i did is exposing your ignorance by telling the readers that the websites and book you rely upon is base on pseudo intellectual and can not be trusted. derailing on the other hand is you. you are the one who derails your own thread by talking out of topic. let the readers judge who truly derails between me and you. anyway may be next time you will prepared well.

dalaman:


OK.

The tittle of the book is "On the historicity of Jesus: Why we might have reason for doubt.

Written by Richard Carrier. He is a well respected scholar and has debated people like William Craig(who only debates scholars ).

thanks for your honesty. i will try to go thru the reviews and if i found it fascinating i will order for it. he is an atheist right?. the book title sound much like a skeptic rather than a confirm or affirm statement like the op.

dalaman:


OK.

The tittle of the book is "On the historicity of Jesus: Why we might have reason for doubt.

Written by Richard Carrier. He is a well respected scholar and has debated people like William Craig(who only debates scholars ).

You don't have to bother yourself to tell him/her all that. Remember you're talking to a Christian zealot. Such a person is already deeply hooked on religion and don't read beyond their theology class. Every book I provided are from scholars of repute.

Stay tuned, I'll make more posts later in the day.

musicwriter:


You don't have to bother yourself to tell him/her all that. Remember[b] you're talking to a Christian zealot[/b]. Such a person is already deeply hooked on religion and don't read beyond their theology class. Every book I provided are from scholars of repute.

Stay tuned, I'll make more posts later in the day.

PLEASE I AM NOT A CHRISTIAN.stop repeating this, i see as a personal attack on me. i am not a Christian bro. i understand you now

vaxx:
PLEASE I AM NOT A CHRISTIAN.stop repeating this, i see as a personal attack on me. i am not a Christian bro. i understand you now

You can tell that to the mountains!!.

musicwriter:


You can tell that to the mountains!!.

lol. just note that the more you split ignorance here, the more i debunked it.

Mrsnake1:
with the story you've rewritten. Enslaved or not, religion is not force on anyone right from our ancestors. am not preaching to you about any religious.
To use the world "fake" entails many things,is it that Muhammad and Chris was not sent by GOD? do find any loophole about existence of Muhammad in Qur'an along side with Christ in the Bible. do really think that religion has made us lagged in development of our society .
We all think we are right with our opinion or ideas of about anything, let listen to other, consult the expect on field and take the one that is GOOD.

Go and read about the crusade and Jihad movement and tell me religion was not forced on us(although some people convert through trading).

It was even portray in Marco Polo series (season 2).

musicwriter:


I don't think I'll be making further post, the one you quoted has derailed the thread. However, I think every info anybody need to free themselves is one the thread. The rest will appear in my upcoming book.

Nothing was said about Mohammed...

vaxx:
lol. just note that the more you split ignorance here, the more i debunked it.

This is a discussion I am highly interested in,I think you will be doing the followers of this thread a big favour by coming up with scholarly research that prove the existence of Jesus Christ.This will make the argument to be balanced.

dalaman, i am watching Richard career debate now with David Marshall which took place in Alabama, i will like you to see how he lost the debate with a wide gap.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooXCaMwTGD8




well. i am yet to read the review of his work . he was educated at Colombia university interesting.

denziz:
This is a discussion I am highly interested in,I think you will be doing the followers of this thread a big favour by coming up with scholarly research that prove the existence of Jesus Christ.This will make the argument to be balanced.

go thru the thread i forward to dalaman. and if you are yet satisfy. you can ask me further question