₦airaland Forum

Deadlytruth:
Tell us why the spirit screamed as it was leaving the body of the mad man in Mark if it was not due to being subjected to torment by Jesus? Jesus Himself mentioned repeatedly that an eternal fire has been prepared for the devil and his angels. So if an evil spirit could ask Jesus whether he had come to torment them before time, then it means those spirits themselves are aware that they have a date with the eternal fire which Jesus had told people of.

Mark 1:24 Have you come to destroy us?

Destruction is their end not torment. Physical fire can't harm a spirit being..

In Exodus, the angel was the fire itself. See it below:

There the angel of the LORD appeared to him as a flame coming from the middle of a bush. Moses saw that the bush was on fire but that it was not burning up.

Now according to you, spirits alone can't burn. So we can conclude that the bush was a spirit since it wasn't burnt up by the fire. See yourself?

Exodus 3:2

There the angel of the LORD appeared to him in flames of fire from within a bush. Moses saw that though the bush was on fire it did not burn up. NIV

Presence of the angel In the fire is why the bush can't burn, Just like presence of an angel in Nebuchadnezzar fire didn't allow fire burn Shadrach , Meshach , Abednego .
Again, physical fire can't affect a spirit being

And we all know that it takes having a tongue to speak or scream. Then the spirits who asked Jesus questions in Mark 5 were not really spirits since they could make speeches....an act doable only with fleshy tongues. So the book of Mark is now lying, right?

Spirit do not need a tongue to speak. They are not fleshy beings Mr Deadlytruth . Tongue is a flesh, a means of speaking by earthly humans, Going by Bibles statement that spirit don't have flesh. Explain why the rich man has flesh ? Either jedide lied that spirit don't have flesh or he Is correct.

Meanwhile you have still not answered why Jesus did say the fire in the wheat and tares parade was Hades during his literal interpretation.

Jesus said fire because fire represent second death. Elsewhere he compared it to Darkness .
Matthew 8:12
But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Darkness to tell you fire Is a picture of death.


But am asking again: if its spirit that go to your imaginary hell , how come disembodied spirit will have teeth ( bone ) to gnash when Jesus said spirit doesn't have bone ?

achorladey:
CAPTIVATOR: Instead of you to cry,

Achorladey: Why should I?

CAPTIVATOR: u are not intelligent enough

Achorladey: You want to start your own lectures on ADJECTIVES like your Friend bah?

CAPTVATOR: to know sit at home ministry

Achorladey: Sit at home MINISTRY is still a "MINISTRY"

CAPTIVATOR: is an APPELLATION for SOMEONE who doesn't ATTEND any MEETING with others, just SITTING at HOME.

Achorladey: who does not ATTEND any MEETING is DIFFERENT from SOMEONE who MINISTERS to people WHO visit such SOMEONE at HIS HOME, such MEETING as it were becomes a CLASSIC sit at HOME ministry. That SOMEONE minister to those visiting that SOMEONE at HOME.

Take a look at this........Acts 28: 30 - 31.....

30 For two whole years Paul stayed there in his own rented house and welcomed all who came to see him. 31 He proclaimed the kingdom of God and taught about the Lord Jesus Christ—with all boldness and without hindrance!

Oga CAPTIVATOR sit at home MINISTRY is POSSIBLE and not a bad THING to do.

Paul would never forsake meetings - Heb 10:24,25. The act u cited , he was under house arrest as a prisoner from Jerusalem . don't twist scripture here .

CAPTIVATOR: Here is a good report on non denominational trend.

Achorladey: Okay, let me get a look.


CAPTIVATOR: "There is actually no such thing. When a church claims to be “nondenominational”, what they are really doing is refusing to label their denomination. That church will still take stances on controversial issues of scriptural interpretation. The stance on a given issue may be that that issue is unimportant, but that claim is highly controversial in its own way: Who gets to decide which parts of the Bible are “unimportant”?

Now, what do so-called “nondenominational” churches do differently? Well, that depends. Which “nondenominational” church are we talking about? And differently compared to whom? " - Ronald Kimmons ,

Achorladey: You have started by running to "RONALD KIMMONS". Well done. All I can pick from here is you are in essence telling me is that the CHRISTIAN CONGREGATION of JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES is a DENOMINATION of the CHRISTIAN CONGREGATION. Very good of you.

He clearly exposed your tricks, didn't he ? Read it over and over again

Deadlytruth:
Read the entire passage first before you argue. That verse is silent on whether he was buried or not buried. Where the Bible is silent, you don't speak for it. Rather you allow it speak for itself.
It neither said 'and the angels took him up to Abraham without being buried first'' nor did it say 'and he was buried before the angels took him up to Abraham'. Speaking for the Bible where it is silent is one of the evil attributes of the JWs and it is through such means they cook up human laws which they portray as biblical truths to the unsuspecting and the gullible.
For such cases of silence, you rather allow the Bible speak for itself by reading the entire passage or reading a little further at least.
In verse 27 the rich man asked Abraham to send Lazarus back to his father's house to warn his brothers of his situation.
In verse 30, Abraham refused and argued that if they would not listen to the prophets, even if Lazarus were to rise from death they would as well not listen.
Now, how do people rise from death? Is it not through the return of their spirits and souls to their physical bodies on earth? That clearly means Lazarus' physical body was buried on earth or else the question of him returning to the earth as a person in the flesh wouldn't have arisen if it was his physical body the angels carried up to Abraham.
Put in another way, the point the rich man was trying to make is that his brothers would believe the testimony of a dead man who returned to the earth in the same physical body with which they knew him while he was alive with them. So the mere fact that the rich man demanded Lazarus return to earth and Abraham disapproved it means they both acknowledged that Lazarus' physical body was left behind on earth.

Lying is in your blood. Where do you see Lazarus was buried in that story ?

" Now in the course of time, the beggar died and was carried off by the angels to Abraham's side . "
He was carried off bodily oga .

" Also, the rich man died and was buried " so different
.

This will expose the bold, the rich man ask for water , physical water or spiritual water ? how could Lazarus dip fingers into a physical drinkable water if he wasn't bodily ?

Tell me why Angels don't carry dead body from mortuary today

achorladey:
Ma je ki oro mi sun e.......

MEANING OF THE WORD "HEAD".......

1. the upper part of the human body, or the front or upper part of the body of an animal, typically separated from the rest of the body by a neck, and containing the brain, mouth, and sense organs.

2. a thing resembling a head either in form or in relation to a whole.

3. the front, forward, or upper part or end of something.

4. a person in charge of something; a director or leader.

5. a person considered as a numerical unit.

6. to place something at the beginning or top of (something) in order to introduce or categorize : to put something at the head of (something, as a list) Each page was headed with thewriter’s name.

How does this APPLIES to the PICTURE below and the LIST CONTAINED in the PICTURE below?


" A PICTURE is WORTH a THOUSAND WORDS " is an English language - idiom. It refers to the notion that a complex idea can be conveyed with just a single picture, THIS PICTURE CONVEYS its MEANING or ESSENCE more EFFECTIVELY than a DESCRIPTION DOES.

Barristter07 on Feb 04 @ 5:50pm

Show me one single publication where it's stated that governing body is the head of the Christian congregation I belonged . # Quoted A5. I demand an answer or be shown a LIAR

Barristter07: SHOW me

Achorladey: Response in PICTURE

Barristter07: One single publication

Achorladey: Not two, not three, not four but Just ONE, take it to CBN that picture is from the WATCHTOWER magazine

Barristter07: where it's STATED GOVERNING BODY is the HEAD of the CHRISTIAN CONGREGATION I BELONGED . # Quoted A5. I demand an answer or be shown a LIAR.

Achorladey: A look at the PICTURE once again this time CONCENTRATION should be focused on the list STATED there in and the definition of the WORD "HEAD" above.

Oga Barristter07,

what position are the CONGREGATIONS?

What POSITION is the GOVERNING BODY?

Bonus question: Which position you dey Barristter07?

NOTE the EMPHASIS on your word "I BELONGED (CHRISTIAN CONGREGATION of JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES)" quoted by ME as YOU posted it on February 04 @ 5:50 pm.

It says " Earthly " , Jesus is in heaven directing things from there. That same watchtower you twisted says.

" IT IS awe-inspiring to contemplate that we are part of a vast universal organization. The visions recorded in Ezekiel chapter 1 and Daniel chapter 7 vividly portray Jehovah maneuvering matters to a grand climax. Jesus is taking the lead in directing the earthly part of Jehovah’s organization to focus on preaching the good news, to care spiritually for those carrying out this work, and to promote the true worship of Jehovah. What confidence this gives us in Jehovah’s organization!​—Matt. 24:45."

Seems something is affecting your eyes. As for the heavenly part of the picture , its a combination of image presented by Ezekiel chapter 1 and Daniel chapter 7 as explained.

No wonder Bro Barrister07 calls you a liar .

CAPTIVATOR:
It says " Earthly " , Jesus is in heaven directing things from there. That same watchtower you twisted says.

" IT IS awe-inspiring to contemplate that we are part of a vast universal organization. The visions recorded in Ezekiel chapter 1 and Daniel chapter 7 vividly portray Jehovah maneuvering matters to a grand climax. Jesus is taking the lead in directing the earthly part of Jehovah’s organization to focus on preaching the good news, to care spiritually for those carrying out this work, and to promote the true worship of Jehovah. What confidence this gives us in Jehovah’s organization!​—Matt. 24:45."

Seems something is affecting your eyes. As for the heavenly part of the picture , its a combination of image presented by Ezekiel chapter 1 and Daniel chapter 7 as explained.

No wonder Bro Barrister07 calls you a liar .

He is one of the "nonedenominational brotherhood" who has NO soild agreement to bind them together other than all been opposed to JWs. So discussing with him is a total waste of time since he is only here to prove that "no religious group is good enough to belong to Christ,and so every religious group is OK as long as you believe that somebody lived on this earth some 2000 years ago called Jesus" therefore to Most Superior Evangelist,Prophet,Dr achorladey of NO particular group, all religions is are good to go EXCEPT Jehovah's Witnesses who are ever trying to set matters straight with their neighbours!

CAPTIVATOR:
Mark 1:24 Have you come to destroy us?

Destruction is their end not torment. Physical fire can't harm a spirit being..

Mark 5:7 says: ...And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not.
Rev. 20:10 says: Then the Devil (a spirit), who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

The lake of fire is clearly described here as a place of eternal torment for the devil (a spirit) will be thrown into. If the lake of fire means mere grave, then how come the devil and his angels will be tormented in it forever?

quote author=CAPTIVATOR post=75580481]
Exodus 3:2 There the angel of the LORD appeared to him in flames of fire from within a bush. Moses saw that though the bush was on fire it did not burn up. NIV....[/quote]The use of 'in' there contextually means 'in the form of a flame' not 'inside the flame' as you would have us assume. In one of your organization's publications titled 'My book of Bible Stories' the story of Moses and the burning bush is depicted as a flame sorrounding a bush without any pictures of an angel inside the flame...meaning that even your organization understands the verse in question to mean that there was no angel inside a flame but that the angel was the flame itself. Or are you now suggesting and admitting indirectly that your organization uses misleading pictures in its publications?

quote author=CAPTIVATOR post=75580481]
Presence of the angel In the fire is why the bush can't burn, Just lik presence of an angel in Nebuchadnezzar fire didn't allow fire burn Shadrach , Meshach , Abednego .
Again, physical fire can't affect a spirit being [/quote]Wrong! It was not angel that joined Shadrach, Meshach and Abegnego in the flame, but the Son of God Himself. Read that passage again thoroughly.
Here it is:
He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

CAPTIVATOR:
Spirit do not need a tongue to speak. They are not fleshy beings Mr Deadlytruth . Tongue is a flesh, a means of speaking by earthly humans, Going by Bibles statement that spirit don't have flesh. Explain why the rich man has flesh ? Either jedide lied that spirit don't have flesh or he Is correct.

Revelation tells us souls spoke in heaven asking God for Justice. They spoke with tongues. Even though they were had no physical bodies, they could still feel the pain of injustice. It only means that it is not only the physical fleshy body that can feel pains. So the tongue of the soul of the rich man could feel the pain of the torment of heat.

CAPTIVATOR:
Jesus said fire because fire represent second death. Elsewhere he compared it to Darkness .
Matthew 8:12
But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Darkness to tell you fire Is a picture of death.

Rev. 20:10 says: Then the Devil (a spirit), who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

CAPTIVATOR:
But am asking again: if its spirit that go to your imaginary hell , how come disembodied spirit will have teeth ( bone ) to gnash when Jesus said spirit doesn't have bone?

Check the previous response. I already answered this there. Stop speaking where the Bible is silent. Read further to know what Jesus meant.

CAPTIVATOR:
It says " Earthly " , Jesus is in heaven directing things from there. That same watchtower you twisted says.

" IT IS awe-inspiring to contemplate that we are part of a vast universal organization. The visions recorded in Ezekiel chapter 1 and Daniel chapter 7 vividly portray Jehovah maneuvering matters to a grand climax. Jesus is taking the lead in directing the earthly part of Jehovah’s organization to focus on preaching the good news, to care spiritually for those carrying out this work, and to promote the true worship of Jehovah. What confidence this gives us in Jehovah’s organization!​—Matt. 24:45."

Seems something is affecting your eyes. As for the heavenly part of the picture , its a combination of image presented by Ezekiel chapter 1 and Daniel chapter 7 as explained.

No wonder Bro Barrister07 calls you a liar .

I thought jesus Christ is the head of the church. Lol.
The church is in heaven. Lol. So jesus is not the leader on earth. He only directs things from heaven. Lol

You just dey fumble. I know how difficult it is for you to defend that pix. It's only the heavenly part that is in the Bible. Lol
The earthly part is not in the Bible.
This is the funniest reply I have ever seen.

So your jehovah earthly organization isn't even in the Bible?

TATIME:
He is one of the "nonedenominational brotherhood" who has NO soild agreement to bind them together other than all been opposed to JWs. So discussing with him is a total waste of time since he is only here to prove that "no religious group is good enough to belong to Christ,and so every religious group is OK as long as you believe that somebody lived on this earth some 2000 years ago called Jesus" therefore to Most Superior Evangelist,Prophet,Dr achorladey of NO particular group, all religions is are good to go EXCEPT Jehovah's Witnesses who are ever trying to set matters straight with their neighbours!

To even give name of denomination early Christian churches were called you can't even mention one. Something not even mentioned in the Bible is now what you guys have made a criteria in gaining salvation. Lol

Deadlytruth:
Mark 5:7 says: ...And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not.


Rev. 20:10 says: Then the Devil (a spirit), who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

The lake of fire is clearly described here as a place of eternal torment for the devil (a spirit) will be thrown into. If the lake of fire means mere grave, then how come the devil and his angels will be tormented in it forever?

quote author=CAPTIVATOR post=75580481]
Exodus 3:2 There the angel of the LORD appeared to him in flames of fire from within a bush. Moses saw that though the bush was on fire it did not burn up. NIV

The use of 'in' there contextually means 'in the form of a flame' not 'inside the flame' as you would have us assume. In one of your organization's publications titled 'My book of Bible Stories' the story of Moses and the burning bush is depicted as a flame sorrounding a bush without any pictures of an angel inside the flame...meaning that even your organization understands the verse in question to mean that there was no angel inside a flame but that the angel was the flame itself. Or are you now suggesting and admitting indirectly that your organization uses misleading pictures in its publications?

quote author=CAPTIVATOR post=75580481]
Presence of the angel In the fire is why the bush can't burn, Just lik presence of an angel in Nebuchadnezzar fire didn't allow fire burn Shadrach , Meshach , Abednego .
Again, physical fire can't affect a spirit being

Wrong! It was not angel that joined Shadrach, Meshach and Abegnego in the flame, but the Son of God Himself. Read that passage again thoroughly.
Here it is:
He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.





Spirit do not need a tongue to speak. They are not fleshy beings Mr Deadlytruth . Tongue is a flesh, a means of speaking by earthly humans, Going by Bibles statement that spirit don't have flesh. Explain why the rich man has flesh ? Either jedide lied that spirit don't have flesh or he Is correct.
Revelation tells us souls spoke in heaven asking God for Justice. They spoke with tongues. Even though they were had no physical bodies, they could still feel the pain of injustice. It only means that it is not only the physical fleshy body that can feel pains. So the tongue of the soul of the rich man could feel the pain of the torment of heat.



Jesus said fire because fire represent second death. Elsewhere he compared it to Darkness .
Matthew 8:12
But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Darkness to tell you fire Is a picture of death.

Rev. 20:10 says: Then the Devil (a spirit), who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.


But am asking again: if its spirit that go to your imaginary hell , how come disembodied spirit will have teeth ( bone ) to gnash when Jesus said spirit doesn't have bone ?


Check the previous response. I already answered this there. Stop speaking where the Bible is silent. Read further to know what Jesus meant.

His own is to assume questions and assume answers.

CAPTIVATOR:
Lying is in your blood. Where do you see Lazarus was buried in that story ?

" Now in the course of time, the beggar died and was carried off by the angels to Abraham's side . "
He was carried off bodily oga .

" Also, the rich man died and was buried " so different
.

This will expose the bold, the rich man ask for water , physical water or spiritual water ? how could Lazarus dip fingers into a physical drinkable water if he wasn't bodily ?

Tell me why Angels don't carry dead body from mortuary today

OK Lazarus died became unconscious and was carried in his unconscious body immediately by angels (spirit) to abrahams bossom. According to you.
Bible didn't say whether angels carried Lazarus bodily you just assumed o.

If The body went missing on earth or decayed or birds ate the carcass we don't know.

Last last you dey assume. Your stock in trade.

Hairyrapunzel:
To even give name of denomination early Christian churches were called you can't even mention one. Something not even mentioned in the Bible is now what you guys have made a criteria in gaining salvation. Lol

What he and his organization don't even know is that the first century Christians did not give names to churches, rather they identified them with geographical names (the names of the cities in which they were located), e.g. The Church in Ephesus, The Church in Philadelphia, The Church in Smyrna, etc which Jesus Himself approved of by using same names to identify the churches while speaking to the churches in Revelations chapter 2. But in total violation of this order and biblical tradition, these clowns reject the name "church" and give to themselves a human invented name of a proper noun not found anywhere in the Bible, yet they claim they are following exactly in the footsteps of first century Christians. Hypocrites!

CAPTIVATOR:
Lying is in your blood. Where do you see Lazarus was buried in that story ?

" Now in the course of time, the beggar died and was carried off by the angels to Abraham's side . "
He was carried off bodily oga .

" Also, the rich man died and was buried " so different
.

This will expose the bold, the rich man ask for water , physical water or spiritual water ? how could Lazarus dip fingers into a physical drinkable water if he wasn't bodily ?

Tell me why Angels don't carry dead body from mortuary today

How do you know he was carried of bodily? Assumer. Lol

CAPTIVATOR:
Lying is in your blood. Where do you see Lazarus was buried in that story ?

" Now in the course of time, the beggar died and was carried off by the angels to Abraham's side . "
He was carried off bodily oga .

" Also, the rich man died and was buried " so different
.

This will expose the bold, the rich man ask for water , physical water or spiritual water ? how could Lazarus dip fingers into a physical drinkable water if he wasn't bodily ?

Tell me why Angels don't carry dead body from mortuary today

Lying is the very blood flowing in your veins. Where in that passage did you see it written that 'Lazarus died, but without being buried, the angels took his body straight up to Abraham'?
So "he was carried off" now means same thing as "he was carried off bodily"? You have smuggled 'bodily' into the statement so fast. Thief!
If it was Lazarus'body that was carried up while that of the rich man was left in the grave on earth, then how could the rich man have been able to see Abraham and Lazarus in heaven from his grave on earth?
If a physical fire was going to torment the devil and his angels as Jesus clearly stated in Revelations 20:10, then why wouldn't a soul being tormented by heat also assume that physical water would quench it? And did Abraham replied him that there was no physical water there to cool his tongue?

CAPTIVATOR:
Paul would never forsake meetings - Heb 10:24,25. The act u cited , he was under house arrest as a prisoner from Jerusalem . don't twist scripture here .



He clearly exposed your tricks, didn't he ? Read it over and over again

CAPTIVATOR: Paul would never forsake meetings - Heb 10:24,25.

Achorladey: He encouraged us all to do so. People visiting Paul at home is that not an opportunity open to Paul not to forsake gatherings?

Jumping from SIT AT HOME MINISTRY to FORSAKING MEETINGS. Hahahahahaaha!

CAPTIVATOR: The act u cited , he was under house arrest as a prisoner from Jerusalem.

Achorladey: At that moment in time, circumstances made Paul become who? A SIT AT HOME CHRISTIAN. YES or NO. A sit at home Christian who carried out his MINISTRY CONTINUOUSLY therefore a SIT AT HOME MINISTRY . YES or NO. Sit at home ministry is possible?

Your friend brought the Idea, you supported him and also went ahead by citing Ronald Kimmons, I used the scriptures to show its possibility as seen in Paul's case.

CAPTIVATOR: don't twist scripture here.

Achorladey: I am not willing to do so.

CAPTIVATOR: He clearly exposed your tricks, didn't he? Read it over and over again

Achorladey: I read your post repeatedly and I told you what I could make of it in line with the discussion so far that you have in essence use that cited material to prove what you and your friend that do not want us to believe or accept that the CHRISTIAN CONGREGATIONS of JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES is one out of the CHRISTIAN denominations is indeed one of the Christian denominations.

Please do reveal the TRICK I want to play on you.

Deadlytruth:
Mark 5:7 says: ...And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not.
Rev. 20:10 says: Then the Devil (a spirit), who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

The lake of fire is clearly described here as a place of eternal torment for the devil (a spirit) will be thrown into. If the lake of fire means mere grave, then how come the devil and his angels will be tormented in it forever?

quote author=CAPTIVATOR post=75580481]
Exodus 3:2 There the angel of the LORD appeared to him in flames of fire from within a bush. Moses saw that though the bush was on fire it did not burn up. NIV....
The use of 'in' there contextually means 'in the form of a flame' not 'inside the flame' as you would have us assume. In one of your organization's publications titled 'My book of Bible Stories' the story of Moses and the burning bush is depicted as a flame sorrounding a bush without any pictures of an angel inside the flame...meaning that even your organization understands the verse in question to mean that there was no angel inside a flame but that the angel was the flame itself. Or are you now suggesting and admitting indirectly that your organization uses misleading pictures in its publications?

quote author=CAPTIVATOR post=75580481]
Presence of the angel In the fire is why the bush can't burn, Just lik presence of an angel in Nebuchadnezzar fire didn't allow fire burn Shadrach , Meshach , Abednego .
Again, physical fire can't affect a spirit being
Wrong! It was not angel that joined Shadrach, Meshach and Abegnego in the flame, but the Son of God Himself. Read that passage again thoroughly.
Here it is:
He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.





Spirit do not need a tongue to speak. They are not fleshy beings Mr Deadlytruth . Tongue is a flesh, a means of speaking by earthly humans, Going by Bibles statement that spirit don't have flesh. Explain why the rich man has flesh ? Either jedide lied that spirit don't have flesh or he Is correct.
Revelation tells us souls spoke in heaven asking God for Justice. They spoke with tongues. Even though they were had no physical bodies , they could still feel the pain of injustice. It only means that it is not only the physical fleshy body that can feel pains. So the tongue of the soul of the rich man could feel the pain of the torment of heat.



Jesus said fire because fire represent second death. Elsewhere he compared it to Darkness .
Matthew 8:12
But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Darkness to tell you fire Is a picture of death.

Rev. 20:10 says: Then the Devil (a spirit), who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.


But am asking again: if its spirit that go to your imaginary hell , how come disembodied spirit will have teeth ( bone ) to gnash when Jesus said spirit doesn't have bone?

Check the previous response. I already answered this there. Stop speaking where the Bible is silent. Read further to know what Jesus meant.

Firstly, am just a follower on this thread. But the highlighted red part is a stupid comment, you accuse the other guy of speaking where your holy book is silent, but here you are doing the same. Is tongue not a part of the physical body ? I leave you to answer that, something is wrong either you guys are right or Bible Jesus Is wrong to say Spirit don't have a physical body . one must be true. Even if we are to go by what your Bible said, a spirit should not even have a teeth to gnash, since spirit don't have bone.

Deadlytruth:
Lying is the very blood flowing in your veins. Where in that passage did you see it written that 'Lazarus died, but without being buried, the angels took his body straight up to Abraham'?
So "he was carried off" now means same thing as "he was carried off bodily"? You have smuggled 'bodily' into the statement so fast. Thief!
If it was Lazarus'body that was carried up while that of the rich man was left in the grave on earth, then how could the rich man have been able to see Abraham and Lazarus in heaven from his grave on earth?
If a physical fire was going to torment the devil and his angels as Jesus clearly stated in Revelations 20:10, then why wouldn't a soul being tormented by heat also assume that physical water would quench it? And did Abraham replied him that there was no physical water there to cool his tongue?

Another stupid analysis, Who told you Abraham and Lazarus are in heaven? Of course , John 3:13 Is now removed from your holy book I think. Your Jesus must be lying or are you the one telling lie ?
NL Xtians are the worst have seen

Deadlytruth:
What he and his organization don't even know is that the first century Christians did not give names to churches , rather they identified them with geographical names (the names of the cities in which they were located), e.g. The Church in Ephesus, The Church in Philadelphia, The Church in Smyrna, etc which Jesus Himself approved of by using same names to identify the churches while speaking to the churches in Revelations chapter 2. But in total violation of this order and biblical tradition, these clowns reject the name "church" and give to themselves a human invented name of a proper noun not found anywhere in the Bible, yet they claim they are following exactly in the footsteps of first century Christians. Hypocrites!

After Romans capture Jerusalem in 70AD. Christianity experience drastic split, Gnostic Christianity and Pauline Christianity , until Constantine united it in 313AD as the Catholic church. From there sprang Protestant movement and the Reformation. If you talk about early church Or Christians you will be talking about the Catholic church which united the faith. Do you agree with the Catholic church ? If no, you are a separated denomination. Nothing like non denominational Churches. Most teaching of Protestantism also stem from the Catholic church, so don't bring that idea of they don't have aname, that ended after the fall of Jerusalem

Deadlytruth
Wrong! It was not angel that joined Shadrach, Meshach and Abegnego in the flame, but the Son of God Himself. Read that passage again thoroughly.
Here it is:
He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

Don't try to divert that solid evidence, I don't think the fellow quoted it to show it was Angel or son of God, if he said angel, he is still correct , didn't your Bible call angels Sons of God at Job 38 or so? Check it . so his point is still valid broz.

Deadlytruth
Rev. 20:10 says: Then the Devil (a spirit), who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

how can an imagination beast be thrown into a real fire ? Enlighten me

Peacefullove:
how can an imagination beast be thrown into a real fire ? Enlighten me

How far the bible verse where they said pharaoh and herod who did birthday were pagans?
.
How can an unconscious dead person know he is in agony in fire?

Peacefullove:
After Romans capture Jerusalem in 70AD. Christianity experience drastic split, Gnostic Christianity and Pauline Christianity , until Constantine united it in 313AD as the Catholic church. From there sprang Protestant movement and the Reformation. If you talk about early church Or Christians you will be talking about the Catholic church which united the faith. Do you agree with the Catholic church ? If no, you are a separated denomination. Nothing like non denominational Churches. Most teaching of Protestantism also stem from the Catholic church, so don't bring that idea of they don't have aname, that ended after the fall of Jerusalem

Sheybi this is encyclopedia? I don't think it's in the bible. Tell us the name of the denomination na. You want to force your doctrine of salvation gotten by joining watchtower organization and unquestionably obeying the men who lead the company called governing body only. Reference your work

Peacefullove:
Another stupid analysis, Who told you Abraham and Lazarus are in heaven? Of course , John 3:13 Is now removed from your holy book I think. Your Jesus must be lying or are you the one telling lie ?
NL Xtians are the worst have seen

They are still on earth sir.

Peacefullove:
Firstly, am just a follower on this thread. But the highlighted red part is a stupid comment, you accuse the other guy of speaking where your holy book is silent, but here you are doing the same. Is tongue not a part of the physical body ? I leave you to answer that, something is wrong either you guys are right or Bible Jesus Is wrong to say Spirit don't have a physical body . one must be true. Even if we are to go by what your Bible said, a spirit should not even have a teeth to gnash, since spirit don't have bone.

It's the dead unconscious body of the rich man. If spirits don't have teeth then angels shouldn't have foot and hand. God shouldn't be able to talk because he is spirit.

Peacefullove:
Firstly, am just a follower on this thread. But the highlighted red part is a stupid comment, you accuse the other guy of speaking where your holy book is silent, but here you are doing the same. Is tongue not a part of the physical body ? I leave you to answer that, something is wrong either you guys are right or Bible Jesus Is wrong to say Spirit don't have a physical body . one must be true. Even if we are to go by what your Bible said, a spirit should not even have a teeth to gnash, since spirit don't have bone.

You are just spewing emotions without making any sense. I doubt if you thoroughly read the comments you are responding to.
For example, I used the geographical naming of churches in the Bible by the first century Christians (in the sense of the Apostles themselves who got Jesus's approval) but you are talking of how Catholic came about. If first century Christians of your own idea named gave unscriptural names like Catholic, Protestant, etc to churches as against the purely geographical names the Apostles gave them with Jesus approval as seen in Revelations, shouldn't that tell you that those first century Christians (your own idea of who they were) were not infallible hence your organization's insistence of following in their footsteps a wrong doctrine? You are only muddling up issues and drawing the hands of the clock back.
Go and follow the debate from the very beginning rather than just jumping in to start quoting my last five responses.

Deadlytruth:
You are just spewing emotions without making any sense. I doubt if you thoroughly read the comments you are responding to.
For example, I used the geographical naming of churches in the Bible by the first century Christians (in the sense of the Apostles themselves who got Jesus's approval) but you are talking of how Catholic came about. If first century Christians of your own idea named gave unscriptural names like Catholic, Protestant, etc to churches as against the purely geographical names the Apostles gave them with Jesus approval as seen in Revelations, shouldn't that tell you that those first century Christians (your own idea of who they were) were not infallible hence your organization's insistence of following in their footsteps a wrong doctrine? You are only muddling up issues and drawing the hands of the clock back.
Go and follow the debate from the very beginning rather than just jumping in to start quoting my last five responses.

Don't mind him. The other day on one thread he was saying encyclopedia and bible said the same thing on birthdays celebrated by pagans only. I called him out on this telling him to show me where the bible said pharaoh and herod who celebrated birthday were pagans. He ran away from that thread.


On another occasion he was trying to justify their doctrine of salvation gotten only by joining watchtower organization and unquestionably obeying the gb. He even quoted a verse removing a key word from it on purpose. When I called him out on that he said I wasn't an intellectual. He is cunning

Hairyrapunzel:
To even give name of denomination early Christian churches were called you can't even mention one. Something not even mentioned in the Bible is now what you guys have made a criteria in gaining salvation. Lol

Hmmmmmmmm don't mind those Jehovah's Witnesses jare,their palavah too much. Anything you believe with your Daddy and Mummy Gos is OK!

TATIME:
Hmmmmmmmm don't mind those Jehovah's Witnesses jare,their palavah too much. Anything you believe with your Daddy and Mummy Gos is OK!

It's only zombies like you that will agree over non biblical or personal preferences of their cult leaders.

Hairyrapunzel:
It's only zombies like you that will agree over non biblical or personal preferences of their cult leaders.

You're 100% correct joh. I don't know why those JWs are sticking to their leaders decisions.
Perhaps they're afraid of what Jesus said to those leading His congregation "whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven,and whatever you loosen on earth will be loosened in heaven". Matthew 16:19
So help me counsel those JWs that a christian can overlook or even ignore the decisions of the GOVERNING BODY selected by Jesus! Act 15:28,29
Let people know that when those supervising the activities and giving directions or specific orders to the Church are talking,it should be taken as things of PERSONAL PREFERENCES!

TATIME:
You're 100% correct joh. I don't know why those JWs are sticking to their leaders decisions.
Perhaps they're afraid of what Jesus said to those leading His congregation "whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven,and whatever you loosen on earth will be loosened in heaven". Matthew 16:19
So help me counsel those JWs that a christian can overlook or even ignore the decisions of the GOVERNING BODY selected by Jesus! Act 15:28,29
Let people know that when those supervising the activities and giving directions or specific orders to the Church are talking,it should be taken as things of PERSONAL PREFERENCES!

If I tell you to show me where governing body is mentioned in the Bible you will start running helter skelter.

When did jesus select the governing body of your watchtower organization? Self appointed people now even lie that Jesus Christ chose them. Lol

Anybody using the NIV is playing in the devils workshop and is giving him a foothold. Don't be deceived. Do your research!!! You have been warned!!!!

Hairyrapunzel:
If I tell you to show me where governing body is mentioned in the Bible you will start running helter skelter.

When did jesus select the governing body of your watchtower organization? Self appointed people now even lie that Jesus Christ chose them. Lol

It's like that doesn't matter. Since Daddy or Mummy GO also does not appear in the Bible,so let's just know that while each church today has one Chris,Eunoch,Joshua,William,Johnson and so on as their SINGLE GO, JWs on the other hand has a group of OLDER men{Titus 2:2} serving as a 'Governing Body' that's speaking as a TEAM of overseers. Act 15:28,29
Though some may feel that it's not appropriate for OLD men to lead God's people!

I had showed a friend about his NIV bible-he didn't realise-the missing links, I like the KJ's..
{Matthew 13:14?-15} “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to. 14
15 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are.

QnVee:
Anybody using the NIV is playing in the devils workshop and is giving him a foothold. Don't be deceived. Do your research!!! You have been warned!!!!