₦airaland Forum

LordReed:
How can non-existence be demonstrated?

How can existence be demonstrated?

Ihedinobi3:
How can existence be demonstrated?

By measurements and observations. Now answer the question and stop attempting to dodge.

LordReed:
By measurements and observations. Now answer the question and stop attempting to dodge.

Did you measure the thoughts you had when you were writing this post? What were their dimensions and weight?

Ihedinobi3:
Did you measure the thoughts you had when you were writing this post? What were their dimensions and weight?

Stop dodging and answer the question.

LordReed:
Stop dodging and answer the question.

Are you admitting that your answer was wrong?

Ihedinobi3:
I completely agree with you that it is nonsense. That is precisely what I have been demonstrating to you.

Obviously as well, you still live in a fantasy world where your own "arguments" for the non-existence of God have any kind of validity by themselves that opposing arguments lack.

Finally, exactly what makes you think I am interested in convincing you or anybody else of something so obvious that only insanity denies it?

Your dishonesty stinks. ALL you do here is serve as your God's mouthpiece. You are ALWAYS trying to convince people and even telling them WHY your God does things. Now you are dishonestly trying to deny ALL that you do here. You tell people why God does cretain things, why he permits certain things and how he even think in some cases. You even claim to know why God doesn't appear to people for example here is a direct quote from here explaining away with your inaginations why God doesn't appear to people and and provide evidence for himself

Ihedinobi3:
God shields them from that revelation of Himself that makes it impossible for them to do anything but submit to Him. That is, He lets men today have the choice to deny His Reality and Power.

You do this all the time, explain God away and try to tell people how and why it acts, apart from the fact that NO God has ever appeared to you and told you anything, these are just your fabricated tales and imaginations that you got from your head. On the other thread you wwrw telling the guy that asked the question why Jesus didnt appear to many people after he resurrected by saying he didn't have to. Who told you that or how did you know that? Did Jesus tell you that? You ALWAYS self project yourself as God and tell people what you feel God does or shouldn't do with out any God ever telling you anything about itself personallyor ever telling you to make any case for it by telling people why it does or doesn't do anything. You always speak for your God because you KNOW very well that it can't speak for itself. Your God lives inside your head so you always self project yourself as him and tell people things about it. Things you make up inside your head.
If God is obvious then why is it that only fabricated arguments that you have to show for his obvious existence and not objective evidence?

[/quote]I don't think you know at all how the United States developed.

1. When were church and state mixed in the US and when did they separate?

2. When was America not capitalist? And in what way did religion at the time cause it?

3. When was America undemocratic and how was religion responsible for that?

4. When did America industrialize and how did religion oppose it and how was it neutralized to allow industrialization to occur?

5. Same as #4 above.

6. In what way did religion have anything to do with gun culture and how was it neutralized to allow it to flourish?

Again, it is a straw man that you made up that religion helps any country to develop. Did I make this argument at all?

As for your claims, why should I care about them? What does religion have to do with science or economics?

You said it yourself that you never said any country has ever developed because of religion. American did NOT develop because of any religion that much is true.

Glad you admitted that I asked a question. Now, in what way was it asinine and how does it suggest that I think you want people to make you their centerpiece?

Because that is exactly what your question is? You asked if I want people to make me their center piece of their lives. Or are you now trying to deny the question you asked?

Ihedinobi3:
Are you admitting that your answer was wrong?

Stop dodging and answer the question. I answered your first question straight meanwhile you have asked me 3 questions without answering my first question. Tomorrow you start whining about dishonesty but here you are on full display.

dalaman:
Your dishonesty stinks. ALL you do here is serve as your God's mouthpiece. You are ALWAYS trying to convince people and even telling them WHY your God does things. Now you are dishonestly trying to deny ALL that you do here. You tell people why God does cretain things, why he permits certain things and how he even think in some cases. You even claim to know why God doesn't appear to people for example here is a direct quote from here explaining away with your inaginations why God doesn't appear to people and and provide evidence for himself




You do this all the time, explain God away and try to tell people how and why it acts, apart from the fact that NO God has ever appeared to you and told you anything, these are just your fabricated tales and imaginations that you got from your head. You ALWAYS self project yourself as God and tell people what you feel God does or shouldn't do with out any God ever telling you anything about itself personallyor ever telling you to make any case for it by telling people why it does or doesn't do anything. You always speak for your God because you KNOW very well that it can't speak for itself. Your God lives inside your head so you always self project yourself as him and tell people things about it. Things you make up inside your head.

If I may be so bold, might I advise you to actually think about the things you post before you post them? It would probably make it easier to treat your posts with seriousness. As it is, I am sorely tempted to laugh at you. If I did, it would annoy you (chances are that my advice is annoying you anyway).

Your response here, like all the others you made in your earlier posts, defeats itself. This account has only three threads, and it is the only one I still use. None of them offers an argument for God's Existence. One teaches Bible studies. Another shares conversations I have had with other people answering questions and challenges to the Bible. The third educates Christians on apologetics. In other words, you are complaining about answers I have offered to questions and challenges directed at the Bible on threads authored by other people. That is, you are not complaining about any argument that I volunteered independently. So, how could I be "trying to convince people" of anything? If I was, I would be producing threads like you atheists do. Not that I can't try to convince people of what I believe without creating threads, but I always offer answers and move on unless someone challenges my answers or asks for clarification of anything in them. They are always given on a take-it-or-leave-it basis.

Then again, obviously I always reference the Bible as my source authority. So, I have never offered an answer on my personal recognition. My answers are therefore made up only in so far as the Bible itself is made up. Since also I did not author the Bible, I can hardly be called God's mouthpiece unless it is with reference to my role of accurately interpreting what God Himself says. Finally, if the Bible exists, then unless you can prove that it is not God's Own Words, you cannot say that God does not speak, and "God does not exist" is not a proof.

dalaman:
You said it yourself that you never said any country has ever developed because of religion. American did NOT develop because of any religion that much is true.

Of course I didn't say so. Neither did I say that it did not. The whole argument is happening in your head. If you are asking my position on it, then what people believe informs the decisions they make. Therefore, no human activity can be completely divorced from religion and philosophy.

As for your huffing and puffing, you will prove it before I concede that religion impeded America's progress.

dalaman:
Because that is exactly what your question is? You asked if I want people to make me their center piece of their lives. Or are you now trying to deny the question you asked?

It is asinine because you say it is? Who died and made you God?

I did ask you that but that was not therefore a declaration. If you are asking why I asked it, then it is because you made it your right to tell others what to believe.

LordReed:
Stop dodging and answer the question. I answered your first question straight meanwhile you have asked me 3 questions without answering my first question. Tomorrow you start whining about dishonesty but here you are on full display.

I'll take your response as a yes then. In so far as there are things which exist which you cannot measure or observe (physically, I presume), your answer was at least not completely right.

As for demonstrating the non-existence of things, both measuring and observation are means by which to demonstrate it, but so also is reasoning.

Ihedinobi3:
If I may be so bold, might I advise you to actually think about the things you post before you post them? It would probably make it easier to treat your posts with seriousness. As it is, I am sorely tempted to laugh at you. If I did, it would annoy you (chances are that my advice is annoying you anyway).

Your response here, like all the others you made in your earlier posts, defeats itself. This account has only three threads, and it is the only one I still use. None of them offers an argument for God's Existence. One teaches Bible studies. Another shares conversations I have had with other people answering questions and challenges to the Bible. The third educates Christians on apologetics. In other words, you are complaining about answers I have offered to questions and challenges directed at the Bible on threads authored by other people. That is, you are not complaining about any argument that I volunteered independently. So, how could I be "trying to convince people" of anything? If I was, I would be producing threads like you atheists do. Not that I can't try to convince people of what I believe without creating threads, but I always offer answers and move on unless someone challenges my answers or asks for clarification of anything in them. They are always given on a take-it-or-leave-it basis.

Then again, obviously I always reference the Bible as my source authority. So, I have never offered an answer on my personal recognition. My answers are therefore made up only in so far as the Bible itself is made up. Since also I did not author the Bible, I can hardly be called God's mouthpiece unless it is with reference to my role of accurately interpreting what God Himself says. Finally, if the Bible exists, then unless you can prove that it is not God's Own Words, you cannot say that God does not speak, and "God does not exist" is not a proof.

The bible is a book written by ancient and primitive men. There is nothing inside the bible that could not be written by ancient men and their ridiculous superstitions. Their ancient ways and thoughts are all written down for all to see. From their ignorance to their limitations and outright fables and superstitions. If by God you mean the men that wrote the bible then surely, they existed and they are all dead. The Bible remains the writing and works of ancient men that didn't know much. It is now up to you to show that it is the work and writings of something other than men. Just show me how the bible is NOT the writings of men. Demonstrate it to me. The bible is the writings of men. If you claim it was only inspired by God then it's nonsense because all religious books are also inspired by their Gods, from the Koran, to the Egyptian book of the dead to the Hindu Verdes etc.

I can still show you how silly your question is using the Quran. Muslims believe it is the word of God too. As long as the Quran exist, and unless you can prove that it is not God's own final words and revelations then you can not prove that God doesn't speak his final words to mankind through it. Saying that it is a false book isn't proof. Hope you see how silly and empty your assertion is.

Of course I didn't say so. Neither did I say that it did not. The whole argument is happening in your head. If you are asking my position on it, then what people believe informs the decisions they make. Therefore, no human activity can be completely divorced from religion and philosophy.

As for your huffing and puffing, you will prove it before I concede that religion impeded America's progress.

Religion has nothing to do with any countries progress. But it has a lot to do with a countrys lack of progress. Nigeria is a prime example. You are mentioning America but religion has nothing to do with their progress and they never put religion at their forefront. The alays believed in the separation of church and state and that has been their founding principle.

It is asinine because you say it is? Who died and made you God?

I did ask you that but that was not therefore a declaration. If you are asking why I asked it, then it is because you made it your right to tell others what to believe.

After claiming you didn't say so now you've admitted, well, I don't tell others what to believe, I always ask people to give reasons why they believe ot think their religious fables are true.

Ihedinobi3:
I'll take your response as a yes then. In so far as there are things which exist which you cannot measure or observe (physically, I presume), your answer was at least not completely right.

As for demonstrating the non-existence of things, both measuring and observation are means by which to demonstrate it, but so also is reasoning.

Because you are dishonest you'd do that. Thank you for confirming how dishonest you are.

Name things which exist that cannot be observed apart from your fairytales.

So reasoning is sufficient to demonstrate your god doesn't exist?

dalaman:
The bible is a book written by ancient and primitive men. There is nothing inside the bible that could not be written by ancient men and their ridiculous superstitions. Their ancient ways and thoughts are all written down for all to see. From their ignorance to their limitations and outright fables and superstitions. If by God you mean the men that wrote the bible then surely, they existed and they are all dead. The Bible remains the writing and works of ancient men that didn't know much. It is now up to you to show that it is the work and writings of something other than men. Just show me how the bible is NOT the writings of men. Demonstrate it to me. The bible is the writings of men. If you claim it was only inspired by God then it's nonsense because all religious books are also inspired by their Gods, from the Koran, to the Egyptian book of the dead to the Hindu Verdes etc.

I can still show you how silly your question is using the Quran. Muslims believe it is the word of God too. As long as the Quran exist, and unless you can prove that it is not God's own final words and revelations then you can not prove that God doesn't speak his final words to mankind through it. Saying that it is a false book isn't proof. Hope you see how silly and empty your assertion is.

And he promptly attacks the Bible. With foot-stamping tantrums and the typical "there are other Words of God too" argument.

Obviously, your saying that the Bible is this or that will not make it so.

Obviously, the existence of opposing claims does not mean that the Bible is not the only Word of God.

dalaman:
Religion has nothing to do with any countries progress. But it has a lot to do with a countrys lack of progress. Nigeria is a prime example. You are mentioning America but religion has nothing to do with their progress and they never put religion at their forefront. The alays believed in the separation of church and state and that has been their founding principle.

Perhaps if you say it a few more times with a bit more vehemence, it'll magically become true.

dalaman:
After claiming you didn't say so now you've admitted, well, I don't tell others what to believe, I always ask people to give reasons why they believe ot think their religious fables are true.

What exactly did I admit?

Are you forgetting what you just said:

"I find it ridiculous because people are wasting their lives relying on made up mythological tales and fables that keeps failing them all the time"?

Where does the above lead logically?

LordReed:
Because you are dishonest you'd do that. Thank you for confirming how dishonest you are.

Name things which exist that cannot be observed apart from your fairytales.

So reasoning is sufficient to demonstrate your god doesn't exist?

I just interpreted your evasiveness, that was all. And it was clearly a private opinion that was expressed for correction, if necessary. If you wish to correct it, do so. Otherwise, it is not an illegitimate conclusion to draw.

Other than your thoughts which I mentioned earlier?

I don't understand your last question. What did you mean to ask or say?

Ihedinobi3:
And he promptly attacks the Bible. With foot-stamping tantrums and the typical "there are other Words of God too" argument.

Obviously, your saying that the Bible is this or that will not make it so.

Obviously, the existence of opposing claims does not mean that the Bible is not the only Word of God.

You've failed to show me that any thing apart from men wrote the book down. Why should I believe your empty claims? Just because you said so ? Others have made the same claim with regards to their own holy books. The Quran is the only word of God regardless of the lies the bible says about it being the word of God. No matter how you keep screaming it, the Bible remains a book written by ancient superstitious men that don't even know what the stars are, men that believe in empty magic and promised their followers empty magic.

Perhaps if you say it a few more times with a bit more vehemence, it'll magically become true.

Religion alone has not been used to develop any country in the world but religion has held the progress of many nations in the world one of which is Nigeria.

What exactly did I admit?

Are you forgetting what you just said:

"I find it ridiculous because people are wasting their lives relying on made up mythological tales and fables that keeps failing them all the time"?

Where does the above lead logically?

The above is a statement of fact. Nigerians ate very religious and keep relying on this fabled God to do things for them and it keeps failing them all the time.

dalaman:
You've failed to show me that any thing apart from men wrote the book down. Why should I believe your empty claims? Just because you said so ? Others have made the same claim with regards to their own holy books. The Quran is the only word of God regardless of the lies the bible says about it being the word of God. No matter how you keep screaming it, the Bible remains a book written by ancient superstitious men that don't even know what the stars are, men that believe in empty magic and promised their followers empty magic.

But I don't care what you believe, dalaman. Didn't I already say so?

dalaman:
Religion alone has not been used to develop any country in the world but religion has held the progress of many nations in the world one of which is Nigeria.

A few more times yet.

dalaman:
The above is a statement of fact. Nigerians ate very religious and keep relying on this fabled God to do things for them and it keeps failing them all the time.

Evasion. Didn't you say that you don't tell others what to believe, that you ask them to justify their beliefs to you? The question is how are these two things true? Do you tell others what they must believe or do you leave people to make their own decisions?

Ihedinobi3:
But I don't care what you believe, dalaman. Didn't I already say so?

You do care what I believe because you've taken your time to explain many things to me about
your God before, you've taken time to explain to me why you feel.my beliefs are wrong amongst other things , if you don't care you wouldn't have done that. You woldnt even respond to me. Your first statement to me here was you trying to find out about what I believe. Read your first statement to me on this thread.

Evasion. Didn't you say that you don't tell others what to believe, that you ask them to justify their beliefs to you? The question is how are these two things true? Do you tell others what they must believe or do you leave people to make their own decisions?

Once people go about making empty claims like you do, I ask them to prove it. That's all I do. .

dalaman:
You do care what I believe because you've taken your time to explain many things to me about
your God before, you've taken time to explain to me why you feel.my beliefs are wrong amongst other things , if you don't care you wouldn't have done that. You woldnt even respond to me. Your first statement to me here was you trying to find out about what I believe. Read your first statement to me on this thread.

This statement?

So, dalaman, it's not that God doesn't exist, it's just that you atheists want to excise Him from the Universe like oncologists try to cut out or eliminate cancers from human bodies, correct?"

Why does that mean that I care what you believe? I only answer all these arguments you people make for the sake of other believers.

dalaman:
Once people go about making empty claims like you do, I ask them to prove it. That's all I do. .

Your earlier words don't agree with you.

XxSabrinaxX:
My belief is: WE DON'T KNOW!! NO ONE DOES!!
We don't have a 100% confirmation of how the universe came to be. All we have is theories.
We have the scientists' theory (the big bang). And of course we have the religionists' theories (creationism: the creation of the earth by a deity)
When we have these theories to consider for the universe's origin, it is only sensible to look at the theory which has more evidence, is more logical and makes fewer assumptions. This is where The Big Bang edges creationism.
So while I don't believe 100% in The Big Bang, it is a more logical option than creationism because it has more evidence and makes lesser assumptions. The truth is there may be other possibilities to the universe's origin. But no one knows 100%. This is just my opinion. It is silly to not only attribute the origin of the universe to a "god", but also make up stories, rules, dimensions, and assign multiple attribute to this god to support its existence. Go research on deism. I find that even more logical than theism (christianity, islam).

if you don't know, how did you know there is no God?

you are just rumbling in ignorance, making a case out of ignorance.

Ihedinobi3:
I just interpreted your evasiveness, that was all. And it was clearly a private opinion that was expressed for correction, if necessary. If you wish to correct it, do so. Otherwise, it is not an illegitimate conclusion to draw.

Other than your thoughts which I mentioned earlier?

I don't understand your last question. What did you mean to ask or say?

When will you stop projecting? I asked you a simple question instead of answering directly you launched into a series of evasive questions refusing to answer the my initial one even though I answered your own. i won't correct it because I won't waste my time attempting to sweep the cobwebs in your head.

We have been over this with thoughts. All things that we can not see but know exist have their interactions we can observe or measure. Not being able to see something is not in the same ballpark as it not existing.

You:

Ihedinobi3:
As for demonstrating the non-existence of things, both measuring and observation are means by which to demonstrate it, but so also is reasoning.

So reasoning is sufficient to demonstrate the non existence of the god?

Ihedinobi3:
This statement?

So, dalaman, it's not that God doesn't exist, it's just that you atheists want to excise Him from the Universe like oncologists try to cut out or eliminate cancers from human bodies, correct?"

Why does that mean that I care what you believe? I only answer all these arguments you people make for the sake of other believers.

If you don't care what I believe then why ask? You were clearly seeking for clarification as to what I believe, if you don't care you won't even bother to ask or seek clarification. Who are you to answer questions for the sake of other believers? Who made you an authority? How do yu know that other bekievers dont know need answers from you? What do yu know that other believes don't? Your response here always show you trying to explain things to the atheist that throw questions at you always. Always telling them why God does things and how he acts etc. .

Your earlier words don't agree with you.

LordReed:
When will you stop projecting? I asked you a simple question instead of answering directly you launched into a series of evasive questions refusing to answer the my initial one even though I answered your own. i won't correct it because I won't waste my time attempting to sweep the cobwebs in your head.

Sure. All right.

LordReed:
We have been over this with thoughts. All things that we can not see but know exist have their interactions we can observe or measure. Not being able to see something is not in the same ballpark as it not existing.

Exactly. There's your answer.

LordReed:
You:



So reasoning is sufficient to demonstrate the non existence of the god?

Yes, it is.

dalaman:
If you don't care what I believe then why ask? You were clearly seeking for clarification as to what I believe, if you don't care you won't even bother to ask or seek clarification. Who are you to answer questions for the sake of other believers? Who made you an authority? How do yu know that other bekievers dont know need answers from you? What do yu know that other believes don't? Your response here always show you trying to explain things to the atheist that throw questions at you always. Always telling them why God does things and how he acts etc. .

Yes I was seeking clarification, not merely for what you believe though, but for the argument you seemed to be making. I am interested in atheistic arguments because they always threaten to undermine the faith of weak believers.

I am, by spiritual gifting, a pastor-teacher in the Body of Christ. When I have been fully trained and properly tested, I will be a shepherd of the sheep too. What I do now is both part of my training and part of my responsibility in the Church. If I don't do it, I will answer to the Lord Jesus Christ for my failure.

As for what I know that other believers don't, compared to the vast majority of believers, I actually know what the Bible teaches. Not many of us actually bother to learn the Bible. Until they do decide to, I'm holding the fort.

Ihedinobi3:
Yes I was seeking clarification, not merely for what you believe though, but for the argument you seemed to be making. I am interested in atheistic arguments because they always threaten to undermine the faith of weak believers.

I am, by spiritual gifting, a pastor-teacher in the Body of Christ. When I have been fully trained and properly tested, I will be a shepherd of the sheep too. What I do now is both part of my training and part of my responsibility in the Church. If I don't do it, I will answer to the Lord Jesus Christ for my failure.

As for what I know that other believers don't, compared to the vast majority of believers, I actually know what the Bible teaches. Not many of us actually bother to learn the Bible. Until they do decide to, I'm holding the fort.

You've always said that God is very obvious that only insanity denies it. Now you are saying that atheistic argumenta threaten to undermine faith of weak believers. That alone means that your claim of God being obvious is false since even Christians can be swayed by atheistic arguments.

As for answering to Jesus for your failure, why a should Jesus even depend on your to explain anything to anybody about him when he can do that himself? The bible talks about the holy spirit teaching people things, no where do it mention your name or the name of anybody, it says the holy spirit is the one believers are to call when they need clarification and guidience. It does not mention your name so who are you? Why should Jesus rely on you when you have consistently failed to even convince anybody? How many atheist have you been able to.convince? How.many Christians that disagree with you have you been able to convince?

As for.knowing what the Bible teaches better than others that remains your own making, you don't know the bible better than anybody, remember that other time where you claimed that the Bible says that the first universe that was created was destroyed by water and a Christian here came and told you that it was the ewrth and you kept insisting that it was the universe. Another Christiana came and laughed at your claims. So you see, you claim the universe was destroyed by water two Christians came and disagreed, in your delusion, your OWN interpretation is the right one and your own interpretation is the true one even though it's totally meaningless and ridiculous. How does a universe get flooded and destroyed by water? Where did the water come from? You just imagine things and claim that's what the Bible says and claim you read it better than others. You don't know the bible better than others, you only interprete it differently from others, that's all there is to it. . .

dalaman:
You've always said that God is very obvious that only insanity denies it. Now you are saying that atheistic argumenta threaten to undermine faith of weak believers. That alone means that your claim of God being obvious is false since even Christians can be swayed by atheistic arguments.

Non sequitur.

Weak faith exists when people have a reason for not wanting to trust God. Usually the reason is a sinful habit that is also very pleasurable. When a weak believer finds the sin very difficult to ignore, they become vulnerable to the temptation to ignore God and His Judgment so that they can indulge to their heart's content. That can lead to apostasy. In fact, one atheist on this board confessed to becoming an atheist that way.

Another reason people lose faith is that the hardships of life discourages them. If such believers took pains to grow spiritually, they would be better able to contextualize these realities and deal with them. But a failure to grow spiritually makes them vulnerable bitterness and anger against God that eventually leads to apostasy if left unchecked.

So, this is not about God's Existence lacking at all. Rather it is about rebellion that results in apostasy.

dalaman:
As for answering to Jesus for your failure, why a should Jesus even depend on your to explain anything to anybody about him when he can do that himself? The bible talks about the holy spirit teaching people things, no where do it mention your name or the name of anybody, it says the holy spirit is the one believers are to call when they need clarification and guidience. It does not mention your name so who are you? Why should Jesus rely on you when you have consistently failed to even convince anybody? How many atheist have you been able to.convince? How.many Christians that disagree with you have you been able to convince?

It is not my argument that the Lord Jesus needs me to do a thing. He does not. Every task that He gives me is a privilege to me. I get to participate in what He is doing and even earn rewards for it. He does not need me at all. In fact, to be able to teach or answer anything I do, I need His help far more than I could possibly describe to you. He gives each one of us tasks as a way of allowing us to make choices about how much we love Him and trust Him. As we believers demonstrate these things through our obedience or disobedience, He accumulates rewards and rebukes that He will give to us when we assemble before His Judgment Seat at His Return.

Regarding teaching, Ephesians 4:11-14 demonstrates how believers grow spiritually. The Holy Spirit is in each one of us, yes, but the Church exists to edify herself. That is why we all have unique gifts that must be put to work to build each other up. Some of us are gifted to be pastor-teachers like me. And it is such people who are responsible to teach the Bible to others. The Holy Spirit in them confirms the things we say especially through the Bible when they read it for themselves.

As for convincing, that is not the job of any believer. Free will means that no one can be convinced or persuaded about anything that they don't want to be convinced or persuaded about. That is why it is never my goal to convince anyone about anything. I just teach the Truth in the Bible. Hearers are free to decide what they will do about it, same as the hearers of the Lord Jesus in His Day were free to decide what they would do about what they heard from Him (in fact, at one point, every one except the twelve left Him because they did not like what He said).

dalaman:
As for.knowing what the Bible teaches better than others that remains your own making, you don't know the bible better than anybody, remember that other time where you claimed that the Bible says that the first universe that was created was destroyed by water and a Christian here came and told you that it was the ewrth and you kept insisting that it was the universe. Another Christiana came and laughed at your claims. So you see, you claim the universe was destroyed by water two Christians came and disagreed, in your delusion, your OWN interpretation is the right one and your own interpretation is the true one even though it's totally meaningless and ridiculous. How does a universe get flooded and destroyed by water? Where did the water come from? You just imagine things and claim that's what the Bible says and claim you read it better than others. You don't know the bible better than others, you only interprete it differently from others, that's all there is to it. . .

So, basically, I don't know the Bible better than other people because other people disagree with what I say? Why is this any kind of reasonable argument? Is it unreasonable to think that those who disagree do so because they don't know the Bible as well as they should?

The Lord Jesus Himself also had the same problem with His contemporaries. The Pharisees and Saducees were the major teachers of the Law and they differred in interpretation from themselves and from the Lord in some places. The Apostles themselves later had to deal with pompous heretics who were teaching contradicting things. It has always been the case that conflicting interpretations of the Bible exists. It doesn't therefore mean that there is no correct one or that a given teacher cannot have the right interpretation. It rather means that every believer is given a choice to labor to find the right teaching authority to listen to and to submit to that authority or not.

dalaman:
You've always said that God is very obvious that only insanity denies it. Now you are saying that atheistic argumenta threaten to undermine faith of weak believers. That alone means that your claim of God being obvious is false since even Christians can be swayed by atheistic arguments.

As for answering to Jesus for your failure, why a should Jesus even depend on your to explain anything to anybody about him when he can do that himself? The bible talks about the holy spirit teaching people things, no where do it mention your name or the name of anybody, it says the holy spirit is the one believers are to call when they need clarification and guidience. It does not mention your name so who are you? Why should Jesus rely on you when you have consistently failed to even convince anybody? How many atheist have you been able to.convince? How.many Christians that disagree with you have you been able to convince?

As for.knowing what the Bible teaches better than others that remains your own making, you don't know the bible better than anybody, remember that other time where you claimed that the Bible says that the first universe that was created was destroyed by water and a Christian here came and told you that it was the ewrth and you kept insisting that it was the universe. Another Christiana came and laughed at your claims. So you see, you claim the universe was destroyed by water two Christians came and disagreed, in your delusion, your OWN interpretation is the right one and your own interpretation is the true one even though it's totally meaningless and ridiculous. How does a universe get flooded and destroyed by water? Where did the water come from? You just imagine things and claim that's what the Bible says and claim you read it better than others. You don't know the bible better than others, you only interprete it differently from others, that's all there is to it. . .

Ihedinobi3 is holy spirit part 2 LMFAO!