₦airaland Forum

ThinkFreely:
First of all, we have to be reasonable here.
1. A freewill package flaws the omniscience nature of god, it becomes a prediction game since probabilities have been involved.

How?

EMILO2STAY:
no you did not, but however you have given them a choice to make.

Them now knowing fully well the consequences of eating the candy now have the free will by themselves to disobey you or obey.

Can “omniscience” and “choices” not be mutually exclusive?

I am surprise as to how to tend to proof that an omniscience nature includes to ability to predict between two options.

Dtruthspeaker:
How?

Read my article completely. I can’t be repeating statements. It’s very stressful doing that.

I buttressed my point in this same post you quoted.

ThinkFreely:
First of all, we have to be reasonable here.
1. A freewill package flaws the omniscience nature of god, it becomes a prediction game since probabilities have been involved.

I asked how here because I rebut that it does not. So Prove the how?

ThinkFreely:
2. It’s impossible to make a concrete plan while regarding freewill as a factor. This means that god cannot stick to a particular plan. He’s guessing and not sure of the final outcome

You do know that man has very limited moves he can freely make?

ThinkFreely:
3. Regarding these two points, god is currently not even sure of how many people will make heaven, he doesn’t have a figure to plan with for now. That’s a big blow to his omniscience nature. He is depending solely on the activities of his preachers to garner followers for him. He doesn’t know anything for sure currently. He’s not even sure you will make heaven finally.

Is this the kind of god you are following?

You do realise that You are Talking about a God who made this house that we call the world and that has catered for millions and millions of people and animals over thousands of years?

Is there anything that He can not Do, if He wills it?

Dtruthspeaker:
I asked how here because I rebut that it does not. So Prove the how?



You do know that man has very limited moves he can freely make?



You do realise that You are Talking about a God who made this house that we call the world and that has catered for millions and millions of people and animals over thousands of years?

Is there anything that He can not Do, if He wills it?

What has all the statement you made got to do with the topic?

We are doubting the omniscience nature of something, you have not proven that and your are circulating another argument?

Bro, that’s not how to present your points. You have not answered anything here, you have not made a single point.

You have successfully committed a fallacy of special pleading.

You have to first of all convince me of his omniscience nature before presenting the argument of what he can and cannot do.

ThinkFreely:
What has all the statement you made got to do with the topic?

We are doubting the omniscience nature of something, you have not proven that and your are circulating another argument?

Bro, that’s not how to present your points. You have not answered anything here, you have not made a single point.

You have successfully committed a fallacy of special pleading.

You have to first of all convince me of his omniscience nature before presenting the argument of what he can and cannot do.

Do you see, I separated the point for you to address, you said you addressed it in your post.

Now I have addressed your post on the whole, now you are saying I did not address omniscience nature, which was what I asked you to explain.

Can you explain what is the issue of the omniscience nature, then I could address it?

ThinkFreely:
Can “omniscience” and “choices” not be mutually exclusive?

I am surprise as to how to tend to proof that an omniscience nature includes to ability to predict between two options.

that's what am talking about. That God is omniscience does not influence the choices of man.

EMILO2STAY:
that's what am talking about. That God is omniscience does not influence the choices of man.

Omniscience means he knows the precise outcome. Precise outcomes doesn’t come with choices, it has to be only one definite option.
You are confusing everyone.

I don’t think you are getting it.

If I know that Barcelona game is gonna start by 9pm, it’s a precise outcome and doesn’t have an option. If any second option comes, it begs to question the accuracy of my knowledge.

You can’t be omniscience and at the same time be giving options.

EMILO2STAY:
that's what am talking about. That God is omniscience does not influence the choices of man.

This statement is a complete oxymoron and you don’t have to sound unreasonable in your attempt to defend this.

Read the statement again carefully and think about what you just typed.

“God is omniscience does not influence the choices of man” it doesn’t make any sense.

Think about this statement very well.

ThinkFreely:
This statement is a complete oxymoron and you don’t have to sound unreasonable in your attempt to defend this.

Read the statement again carefully and think about what you just typed.

“God is omniscience does not influence the choices of man” it doesn’t make any sense.

Think about this statement very well.

ok maybe you should try to explain how omniscience can influence choices.

EMILO2STAY:
ok maybe you should try to explain how omniscience can influence choices.

Nope, I’m done arguing.

Doesn’t make any more sense. We won’t get anywhere. You keep committing fallacies.

ThinkFreely:
This statement is a complete oxymoron and you don’t have to sound unreasonable in your attempt to defend this.

Read the statement again carefully and think about what you just typed.

“God is omniscience does not influence the choices of man” it doesn’t make any sense.

Think about this statement very well.

pls answer this, does foreknowledge influence choices, yes or no. If yes then explain?

ThinkFreely:
Nope, I’m done arguing.

Doesn’t make any more sense. We won’t get anywhere. You keep committing fallacies.

then that means you don't know what your talking about.

EMILO2STAY:
pls answer this, does foreknowledge influence choices, yes or no. If yes then explain?

You should really learn how to present argument. You just committed another fallacy of black and white.
You cannot ask me direct questions and limit the options to just two. It’s simple, omniscience knows everything, he knows the final outcome of everything, he doesn’t have to give choice. No need beating about the bush.

Learn how to argue first.

EMILO2STAY:
then that means you don't know what your talking about.

see another fallacy you committed

EMILO2STAY:
then that means you don't know what your talking about.

You just committed another fallacy.
Black and white fallacy, you do it and you don’t even know.

Learn how to present your argument else you will be busy arguing back and forth on this platform without meeting objective or convincing anybody. Unless many you just like unwarranted argument.

ThinkFreely:
You should really learn how to present argument. You just committed another fallacy of black or white.
You cannot ask me direct questions and limit the options to just two. It’s simple, omniscience knows everything, he knows the final outcome of everything, he doesn’t have to give choice. No need beating about the bush.

Learn how to argue first.

the bone of contention here are those two options so what are you talking about? You have asked and I answered, but I have asked instead of providing answer your busy beating about the bush.

If you disagree with my answer then explain how the two mutually exclusive bone of contention Can influence one another. If you can't then keep quiet and stop talking about what you have no answer or idea about.

EMILO2STAY:
the bone of contention here are those two options so what are you talking about? You have asked and I answered, but I have asked instead of providing answer your busy beating about the bush.

Of you disagree with my answer then explain how the two mutually exclusive bone of contention. Can influence one another. If you can't then keep quiet and stop talking about what you have no answer or idea about.

The bone of contention wasn’t even two, you created the yes or no option based on one aspect of an omniscience which you feel comfortable to argue about, you did without first exhausting and understanding all the features of an omniscience.

You stylishly eroded the definition of an omniscience, created another argument with a yes or no option and what me to stay there. That’s fallacious.


It’s simple, omniscience knows everything which means he knows the outcome of everything before it even happens. If one is destined to go to hell, an omniscience will know before it happens and it won’t depends on the choices that person makes. The plans of an omniscience cannot change, that plan is suppose to be precise and accurate and no form of freewill and choice will influence it. If one would go to hell and The omniscience had a plan already and knows this before even the person is born then the person’s choice should not be able to change the plan.

Stop committing fallacies upandan and tackle this points I have raised.

EMILO2STAY:
the bone of contention here are those two options so what are you talking about? You have asked and I answered, but I have asked instead of providing answer your busy beating about the bush.

If you disagree with my answer then explain how the two mutually exclusive bone of contention Can influence one another. If you can't then keep quiet and stop talking about what you have no answer or idea about.

If an omniscience had a plan, he knows this plans will work and later says this plans also depend on the choice some other people makes. That’s logically incorrect.

Everything is suppose to be certain in a plan extrapolated by an omniscience. If he has known me before I was born, he should know if I will go to hell or not, it doesn’t have to depend on the choice I make. Since he knows this already, he would have planned for this outcome.

If an omniscience has to wait for me to make my choices before making his plans then his omniscience nature should be questioned.

Stop running from pillar to post asking fallacious questions.

ThinkFreely:
The bone of contention wasn’t even two, you created the yes or no option based on one aspect of an omniscience which you feel comfortable to argue about, you did without first exhausting and understanding all the features of an omniscience.

You stylishly eroded the definition of an omniscience, created another argument with a yes or no option and what me to stay there. That’s fallacious.


It’s simple, omniscience knows everything which means he knows the outcome of everything before it even happens. If one is destined to go to hell, an omniscience will know before it happens and it won’t depends on the choices that person makes. The plans of an omniscience cannot change, that plan is suppose to be precise and accurate and no form of freewill and choice will influence it. If one would go to hell and The omniscience had a plan already and knows this before even the person is born then the person’s choice should not be able to change the plan.

Stop committing fallacies upandan and tackle this points I have raised.

.

You are still running around in circles here saying the same over and over.
I already said before that even if God is omniscience that doesn't mean his omniscience influences the choices of man. Yes he is all powerful and knowing yet what has to be had to be without God influencing the outcome.
From the beginning he saw that man will fall yet he a way of salvation for from the same beginning.

From the begining he has seen those who will be disobedient and reject his salvation and command by choice, This does not mean he made them that way so they can go to hell For he does not delight in the death of the wicked. Rather seeing that they will be disobedient provided a way of salvation from the very begining to save them but they made a choice of rejecting it as God cannot make your choice for you.

Gods foreknowledge is an attribute of his sovereignty this is why he always makes a way of salvation. Foreknowledge does not equal to influencing or manipulating in any way. This is what you have to understand and stop going around in circles.
He knew you will be disobedient and made a way of salvation to still save you yet when you were born as a grown adult known ng fully well the meaning of your actions rejected his salvation and walked according to your own heart. God cannot make your choices for you. So don't blame God for the choices you make knowing fully well what you do.

EMILO2STAY:
.

You are still running around in circles here saying the same over and over.
I already said before that even if God is omniscience that doesn't mean his omniscience influences the choices of man. Yes he is all powerful and knowing yet what has to be had to be without God influencing the outcome.
From the beginning he saw that man will fall yet he a way of salvation for from the same beginning.

From the begining he has seen those who will be disobedient and reject his salvation and command by choice, This does not mean he made them that way so they can go to hell For he does not delight in the death of the wicked. Rather seeing that they will be disobedient provided a way of salvation from the very begining to save them but they made a choice of rejecting it as God cannot make your choice for you.

Gods foreknowledge is an attribute of his sovereignty this is why he always makes a way of salvation. Foreknowledge does not equal to influencing or manipulating in any way. This is what you have to understand and stop going around in circles.
He knew you will be disobedient and made a way of salvation to still save you yet when you were born as a grown adult known ng fully well the meaning of your actions rejected his salvation and walked according to your own heart. God cannot make your choices for you. So don't blame God for the choices you make knowing fully well what you do.

ok, Does God know the total number of people that will make heaven from the onset?

Please answer the question, don’t give me long explanations.

ThinkFreely:
ok, Does God know the total number of people that will make heaven from the onset?

Please answer the question, don’t give me long explanations.

yes

John 6:39And this is the Father's will who has sent me, that of all that he has given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

EMILO2STAY:
yes

John 6:39And this is the Father's will who has sent me, that of all that he has given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

If he knows from the onset that I won’t make heaven so what’s the essence of the freewill he’s giving me?

And why does he need you to convince me to make heaven since he already know that I won’t make it?

ThinkFreely:
If he knows from the onset that I won’t make heaven so what’s the essence of the freewill he’s giving me?

And why does he need you to convince me to make heaven since he already know that I won’t make it?

God is a just God. He does not act without a cause. The essence of the freewill is for you to make a rational decision and choose by yourself which side you want to be.


He had seen before hand that your heart is hardened and will not make heaven because of the side you choose by your self but still needs me to convince you so as to try to save you in order for you not have an excuse on the day of judgement .

Remember God being all knowing does not mean he made you to go to hell.

Even if God wasn't all knowing the result will still be the same.

EMILO2STAY:
God is a just God. He does not act without a cause. The essence of the freewill is for you to make a rational decision and choose by yourself which side you want to be.


He had seen before hand that your heart is hardened and will not make heaven because of the side you choose by your self but still needs me to convince you so as to try to save you in order for you not have an excuse on the day of judgement .

Remember God being all knowing does not mean he made you to go to hell.

Even if God wasn't all knowing the result will still be the same.

ok bye

Chai! See how my people are destroying Jehovah's backward philosophies back to back

Aonkuuse:
So complicated

..


That's 4 Wrong Assumptions by the OP tgede