₦airaland Forum

Tcwork:

So because David did not have eternal life you believe that Abraham and Moses and Elijah suffered the same faith. Pls quote for me. I am listening.
Now you quote John 3.16 to show what really. In case you don't know, every single prophet knew and testified of Jesus Christ. You are not the first to know Christ.
Please read
Acts 10.43
To him all the prophets bear witness,+ that everyone putting faith in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.”+
Even before the birth of Christ the prophets believe in him read your bible.
The old testament testified of Jesus Christ John 5.39 “You are searching the Scriptures+ because you think that you will have everlasting life by means of them; and these are the very ones* that bear witness about me.Still quoting your bible, you learn that the prophecies were all inspired by the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Revelations 19.10
At that I fell down before his feet to worship him. But he tells me: “Be careful! Do not do that!+ I am only a fellow slave of you and of your brothers who have the work of witnessing concerning Jesus.+ Worship God!+ For the witness concerning Jesus is what inspires prophecy.
So never you think that these holy prophets did not believe in Christ and are lost?

I’m very very very, very busy today but I’ll give you a suitable reply nonetheless.
Yes, all those ancient Hebrew prophets all had a thing or two to say about the Messiah.
See Deuteronomy 18:15, Psalm 2:6, Isaiah 42:1, 53:8-12, Jeremiah 23:5, Daniel 9:26, Ezekiel 21:26-27, Micah 5:2, Zechariah 9:9 etc
BUT none of them saw the fulfillment of those prophecies. Hebrews 11:39
So how could they have exercised faith and obeyed someone that had not come at the appointed time? Galatians 4:4-5

I intentionally used John 3:16 because it is a popular scripture used by your churches. Most of you people think “everlasting life” means going to heaven but fail to realize that Adam had the same prospect if he had remained obedient.
Genesis 2:17

No one ever said those prophets are lost and forgotten, Jehovah will surely remember and resurrect them to perfect human lives here on earth. John 5:28-29, Acts 24:15

Next you try to connect Matthew 26:52 and John 18:36 but still the scripture do not share your view. Again I wouldn't spoonfeed you. Go and read again.

So let me ask you now. During the WWII, when the Axis and Allies powers were pitted against each other. Didn’t we see German Catholics kill Italian Catholics, German Protestants kill Italian Protestants and so on? Which Lord approved of those churches going to war to slaughter their members please?

Your Bible said that what Peter, James and John saw was a vision. Matthew 17:9. Please what is a vision. A vision does not mean they saw things that do not exist. You could just use you dictionary to find the meaning of a vision.
Now you don't understand the meaning of a parable. A parable is not a fable.
Don't forget Elijah went to heaven as a living man. Think about that. That alone proofs your teachings wrong.
Go back and read the old testament. There is nothing you know about Jesus Christ that the prophets of old did not know double.

Moses and Elijah were long dead.
Psalm 146:4, Ecclesiastes 9:5-6
They were represented in the vision but only Jesus Christ was literally present. Most people like you don’t know the real meaning of 2Kings 2:11. You assume that Elijah went to the “heavens” when there are actually different types of heavens such as the sky. See Genesis 1:8
Elijah couldn’t have gone to the spiritual heavens for the following reasons in John 3:13, 1Corinthians 15:36 & 1Corinthians 15:50 but that’s by the way.
If the latter part of Luke 16 is to be taken literal then you’ll have no problem explaining these?

DappaD:
1. Since the rich man died and was buried, why wasn't Lazarus buried? So angels normally carry people after they die now?
2. What did Lazarus do to merit going to Abraham’s bosom and what wrong did the rich man commit? Because the account simply said that the rich man received good things and there was no mention of any crime he did.

Tcwork:

Boss, I just laugh when you talk like this. You may not believe it but I actually like you guys and I understand why you are coming from.
Half the time, I laugh when I read your responses especially when some of you get abusive.
But generally I like you guys

Even the Jews who listened to Jesus liked his manner of teaching and they were even astounded by the wisdom portrayed in his words.
Matthew 7:28-29, John 7:46
But how many of them were willing to follow the Messiah even if it meant facing opposition from family and society? Matthew 16:24
John 12:42-43 says that those men though, they knew Jesus was the Messiah refused to acknowledge him publicly because of fear of the oppressive religious leaders in their day. So if you want to REALLY follow Jesus Christ, you must be willing to break free from false religious ideologies and teachings. Revelation 18:4

Of course everyone love Jesus {Luke 4:22; 11:27} it's the utterances from his mouth that's causing trouble for him {Luke 4:23-29} if we also keep quiet without saying a word and you're just observing the way we do things, no one will hate us but due to the gbangbajous message Jesus infused in our brains that we're uttering out most people hate us! John 17:14

Nevertheless we love everyone including those who pose themselves as our enemies! Matthew 5:43-48

Tcwork:
Boss, I just laugh when you talk like this. You may not believe it but I actually like you guys and I understand why you are coming from.
Half the time, I laugh when I read your responses especially when some of you get abusive.
But generally I like you guys

MaxInDHouse:
Of course everyone love Jesus {Luke 4:22; 11:27} it's the utterances from his mouth that's causing trouble for him {Luke 4:23-29} if we also keep quiet without saying a word and you're just observing the way we do things, no one will hate us but due to the gbangbajous message Jesus infused in our brains that we're uttering out most people hate us! John 17:14

Nevertheless we love everyone including those who pose themselves as our enemies! Matthew 5:43-48

Baba calm down no one hates you. No need to feel that important.
Not everyone would accept your message doesn't mean we hate you. Some of my best friends till this day are JW members. I have contributed to your books and have visited your church a number of times.

DappaD:
I’m very very very, very busy today but I’ll give you a suitable reply nonetheless.
Yes, all those ancient Hebrew prophets all had a thing or two to say about the Messiah.
See Deuteronomy 18:15, Psalm 2:6, Isaiah 42:1, 53:8-12, Jeremiah 23:5, Daniel 9:26, Ezekiel 21:26-27, Micah 5:2, Zechariah 9:9 etc
BUT none of them saw the fulfillment of those prophecies. Hebrews 11:39
So how could they have exercised faith and obeyed someone that had not come at the appointed time? Galatians 4:4-5

I intentionally used John 3:16 because it is a popular scripture used by your churches. Most of you people think “everlasting life” means going to heaven but fail to realize that Adam had the same prospect if he had remained obedient.
Genesis 2:17

No one ever said those prophets are lost and forgotten, Jehovah will surely remember and resurrect them to perfect human lives here on earth. John 5:28-29, Acts 24:15




So let me ask you now. During the WWII, when the Axis and Allies powers were pitted against each other. Didn’t we see German Catholics kill Italian Catholics, German Protestants kill Italian Protestants and so on? Which Lord approved of those churches going to war to slaughter their members please?



Moses and Elijah were long dead.
Psalm 146:4, Ecclesiastes 9:5-6
They were represented in the vision but only Jesus Christ was literally present. Most people like you don’t know the real meaning of 2Kings 2:11. You assume that Elijah went to the “heavens” when there are actually different types of heavens such as the sky. See Genesis 1:8
Elijah couldn’t have gone to the spiritual heavens for the following reasons in John 3:13, 1Corinthians 15:36 & 1Corinthians 15:50 but that’s by the way.
If the latter part of Luke 16 is to be taken literal then you’ll have no problem explaining these?

H
What is your point.
You stated that the prophets of old did not believe in Christ I have showed you that they did. What more do you want to say.
You claim they are not entitled to eternal life. But that is your opinion. The bible never said so.
So what is your point?
If they did not have faith in him, they wouldn't have prophecied about him. Did the bible ever say that they did not have faith in Christ or is it your opinion?
I respect your opinion on the visit of Moses and Elijah but it's your personal opinion. And please could you give scripture that correlate with what you say. Not one of the scriptures you give correlate with what you say. It's really unfair.

DappaD:
Even the Jews who listened to Jesus liked his manner of teaching and they were even astounded by the wisdom portrayed in his words.
Matthew 7:28-29, John 7:46
But how many of them were willing to follow the Messiah even if it meant facing opposition from family and society? Matthew 16:24
John 12:42-43 says that those men though, they knew Jesus was the Messiah refused to acknowledge him publicly because of fear of the oppressive religious leaders in their day. So if you want to REALLY follow Jesus Christ, you must be willing to break free from false religious ideologies and teachings. Revelation 18:4

You need a mirror. Your words really apply to you

DappaD:
Even the Jews who listened to Jesus liked his manner of teaching and they were even astounded by the wisdom portrayed in his words.
Matthew 7:28-29, John 7:46
But how many of them were willing to follow the Messiah even if it meant facing opposition from family and society? Matthew 16:24
John 12:42-43 says that those men though, they knew Jesus was the Messiah refused to acknowledge him publicly because of fear of the oppressive religious leaders in their day. So if you want to REALLY follow Jesus Christ, you must be willing to break free from false religious ideologies and teachings. Revelation 18:4

DappaD D
We are talking about many things at the same time. Let's take it one by one. You said the prophets did not have much faith in Christ. Please could we disuss that first.
And please stop using scripture that don't apply to what you are saying.

So you're the one to teach us what hatred means shey?
Guy the people who killed Jesus often invites him to come and eat dinner with them in their homes {Luke 7:35} of course you have no reason to hate us if not because of the teachings that makes us different from all of you! John 15:19
The man Jesus told that he must become one of his followers weighed the price and walked away not because he hated Jesus as a person (otherwise he wouldn't have come to Jesus) but the idea that there is no way he can enter God's kingdom without joining Jesus' group of humble and lowly hearted Jews! Luke 18:18-23
From that very day he will hate the man who gave him a condition that doesn't sound palatable to him as what he must do to gain everlasting life {John 6:66} do you think if it's just to donate money this man would decline?

Tcwork:
Baba calm down no one hates you. No need to feel that important.
Not everyone would accept your message doesn't mean we hate you. Some of my best friends till this day are JW members. I have contributed to your books and have visited your church a number of times.

All those prophets are not yet qualified for everlasting life!
First think of how they were all anticipating the arrival of this Prophet, they were filled with high expectations but they never had the opportunity to listen to what he is coming to TEACH whereas Moses whom they all had respect for told their forefathers that whoever wants to gain everlasting life must listen to the Christ! Deuteronomy 18:19
So nobody can say this is how those prophets will react to the counsel from Jesus, even John the baptist whom Jesus himself declared as greater than all those prophets began having doubts whether Jesus could be that promised Christ! Matthew 11:2-3
That's why all of them are not better than their people who hated Jesus for the utterances of his mouth and his unpalatable counsels. Apostle Paul made it clear that people must hear the teachings of Jesus before they can be in line for everlasting life! Romans 10:14
So it's after the resurrection of all the dead that Christians on planet earth will TEACH all those people from Abel to John the baptist what Jesus taught us, by then angels will be moving around to write down the names of those who respond positively to what the Christians are teaching {Malachi 3:16} they must all BOW to Jesus' counsel or they are doomed! Revelations 20:14-15

Tcwork:
DappaD D
We are talking about many things at the same time. Let's take it one by one. You said the prophets did not have much faith in Christ. Please could we disuss that first.
And please stop using scripture that don't apply to what you are saying.

MaxInDHouse:
So you're the one to teach us what hatred means shey?
Guy the people who killed Jesus often invites him to come and eat dinner with them in their homes {Luke 7:35} of course you have no reason to hate us if not because of the teachings that makes us different from all of you! John 15:19
The man Jesus told that he must become one of his followers weighed the price and walked away not because he hated Jesus as a person (otherwise he wouldn't have come to Jesus) but the idea that there is no way he can enter God's kingdom without joining Jesus' group of humble and lowly hearted Jews! Luke 18:18-23
From that very day he will hate the man who gave him a condition that doesn't sound palatable to him as what he must do to gain everlasting life {John 6:66} do you think if it's just to donate money this man would decline?

Relax no one is killing you

Tcwork:
Boss, I just laugh when you talk like this. You may not believe it but I actually like you guys and I understand why you are coming from.
Half the time, I laugh when I read your responses especially when some of you get abusive.
But generally I like you guys

Why will one go the way of insults when the insight about the person you are in discussion with is clear to you. You look and smile since you understand the mindset the person has already

They don't want to accept people out there really understand how their religious organization operates.

Tcwork:
I am so happy, you are coming around.
Now your point has changed. So according to you. We can only go to war against non Christians. We are allowed to kill those who do not worship the same God.
Also we can fight to protect our worship and our homes.
At least you are begining to shift that's a good one.
Now to what's happening in China. Sorry to say but your agent friend is ignorant.
The Uyghur Muslims habe been one of the most peaceful groups till date. And the abuse by the Chinese government is one of the worst in 100 years.
There organs are being harvested. Entire communities have been converted to concentration camps.
Oga you need to read on your own to understand what is happening to the Uyghurs. Just forget your agent friend.
If you want I would send you some links. They really need our prayers.
Well thanks for your need stand. At least you now agree that some wars are righteous.
I am ok with that. Now you see that in Matthew 26.52...Christ was not talking to Abraham or Moses or Samuel, he was talking just to peter.
Now so you know Abraham went to war to rescue lot.
Samuel killed an unarmed, defenseless king whom Saul had spared.
Moses went to battle to revenge a tribe that refused to give them passage.

And you got no response to the above because the CONTRADICTIONS made by Max to whom the post is meant for has been laid bare for him to see . In reality JWs are not PACIFIST. He had only made another confirmation


We can only go to war against non Christians. We are allowed to kill those who do not worship the same God.

MaxInDHouse:
All those prophets are not yet qualified for everlasting life!
First think of how they were all anticipating the arrival of this Prophet, they were filled with high expectations but they never had the opportunity to listen to what he is coming to TEACH whereas Moses whom they all had respect for told their forefathers that whoever wants to gain everlasting life must listen to the Christ! Deuteronomy 18:19
So nobody can say this is how those prophets will react to the counsel from Jesus, even John the baptist whom Jesus himself declared as greater than all those prophets began having doubts whether Jesus could be that promised Christ! Matthew 11:2-3
That's why all of them are not better than their people who hated Jesus for the utterances of his mouth and his unpalatable counsels. Apostle Paul made it clear that people must hear the teachings of Jesus before they can be in line for everlasting life! Romans 10:14
So it's after the resurrection of all the dead that Christians on planet earth will TEACH all those people from Abel to John the baptist what Jesus taught us, by then angels will be moving around to write down the names of those who respond positively to what the Christians are teaching {Malachi 3:16} they must all BOW to Jesus' counsel or they are doomed! Revelations 20:14-15

If I get you. You are saying that these prophets did not know the teachings of Jesus Christ?
Could you kindly show me one verse that says so.
I pointed out Rev 19.10
10 At that I fell down before his feet to worship him. But he tells me: “Be careful! Do not do that!+ I am only a fellow slave of you and of your brothers who have the work of witnessing concerning Jesus.+ Worship God!+ For the witness concerning Jesus is what inspires prophecy
The last sentence teaches that their prophecies were inspired by the witness of Jesus Christ. So just one scripture to show that they did not have his words please.
These men had the testimony of Christ just like you and I. I would believe all that you say if you have just one verse of scripture that shows that these prophets did nothe have the word of God as quoted in Romans 10.14
Pleas no longer your opinion, just one scripture and I believe you and I would follow you.
One scripture to show that the prophets were ignorant of Christ.
Galatians 3.8-9
Now the scripture, foreseeing that God would declare people of the nations righteous through faith, declared the good news beforehand to Abraham, namely: “By means of you all the nations will be blessed.”+ 9 So those who adhere to faith are being blessed together with Abraham, who had faith.
Abraham had the gospel of Jesus Christ and he is being bleased for it. Abraham had faith in Jesus Christ.
With just one scripture, direct, no bending of scripture show me that Abraham did not have faith in Jesus Christ. That the good news was not taught to Abraham and I would become a JW.
Jesus Christ was the lamb slain before the foundation of the world. It was not until he came to earth that men had faith in him.
Just one verse and I would follow you.
But if you don't have the verse don't beat about the bush and waste our time.

achorladey:
And you got no response to the above because the CONTRADICTIONS made by Max to whom the post is meant for has been laid bare for him to see . In reality JWs are not PACIFIST. He had only made another confirmation


We can only go to war against non Christians. We are allowed to kill those who do not worship the same God.

My brother I am really having a great time with our JW friends.
I have received insults and ridicule from many of the yet the claim to be the ones facing persecution.
But really I am enjoying myself.
At a time I had an entire horde of them on me
MaxInDHouse has been mostly decent but many that came and fell by the way had been not as nice.
Overall, I study human nature and I know how defensive people are when it gets to religion

MaxInDHouse:
Learning is great and humility is a key but those proving obstinate will not get anything out of the message of Christ. When Abraham and other servants of God engaged in bloodshed
were they fighting against people worshiping the same God?
what was the name of the God worshiped by the enemies that God's people engaged in battle?
was God supporting some of his worshipers against others who are also his worshipers?


I'll use the case of Israelites and Egyptian army, before the war when JEHOVAH proved to be the God of armies destroyed the Egyptian forces, what led to the battle?
Well i'll remind you, JEHOVAH told Pharaoh "let MY PEOPLE go, so that they can WORSHIP me" {Exodus 5:1} note those two key words!
All the wars JEHOVAH has ever led HIS PEOPLE to win was based on WORSHIP and place where he was protecting from Invaders so that his own worshipers may practice pure worship in peace. So JEHOVAH is not a bloodthirsty God who just feel like seeing people killing people Sir!


You love deceit more than anything!
I've told you "if you're not ready to worship our own God there is no wahala, go and worship the God of your choice"
I was a Muslim and i know what happens when Islam gain the majority anywhere, Muslims will not leave the minority to practice any other form of worship, once they gain upper hand in the affairs of any community it's a faceoff with all other religionists. I told you i was an agent with the intelligence, the last time i spoke with a fellow agent about the condition of things in China she told me so many secrets about what what their government is planning to do so that no religion can overrun others in China, Muslims are intolerant towards other religions that's why China quarantined over 1,000,000 Muslims as people infected with insanity so you have no point Sir!

was God supporting some of his worshipers against others who are also his worshipers?

You always go about with the HUMILITY SHOUT all others should humble and learn from your ONE and ONLY ORGANIZATION, but had you really show your humility, you will have seen that indeed your ORGANIZATION is not an island of KNOWLEDGE and you too as well. The reality before you and I is your organization don't have ACCURATE Knowledge of the scriptures as well . If you like accept or reject. It remains your palaver.

JEHOVAH had supported battles where his WORSHIPPERS CONFRONTED each other and killed one another MERCILESSLY.


Here is your question again to show your HUMILITIMETER,

Has JEHOVAH ever supported his WORSHIPPERS fighting one ANOTHER?

Were those people calling on the same JEHOVAH?

A. Yes

B. No

C. I look away.

DappaD:
All those aforementioned, though servants of Jehovah according to the understanding they had then, do not qualify for everlasting life yet that’s why Peter said David was still in the dust of the earth! Acts 2:29,34
So how many of them saw Jesus Christ and exercised faith in him? John 3:16
Those faithful men will be resurrected here on earth since they DO NOT qualify for everlasting life yet. Acts 24:15



Try and connect Matthew 26:52 and John 18:36 you’ll see the point I’m driving at. I do not need to spoonfeed you.



My own Bible said that what Peter, James and John saw was a vision. Matthew 17:9



So where is Abraham’s bosom please? You called it a parable yet you want to interpret it literally. If you want to miscontrue the latter portion of Luke 16 you’ll run into a number of problems because for one, what wrong acts did the rich man clothed in purple do to suffer torment and what good acts did Lazarus do to go to Abraham’s bosom?



You’ll not find a single verse in the Old Testament—Not ONE—where Jehovah ever promises anyone going to heaven. Whenever his faithful servants were about to die, God usually said: “You will be gathered to your people” that is, they are to return to the dust not heaven. Compare Isaiah 26:19



Jesus asked his disciples to BUY those swords so that he would teach them a lesson on meekness. Read Luke 22:36-38 carefully.
Please stop twisting the scriptures to fit your own thinking it won’t augur well with you. 2Peter 3:16

All those aforementioned, though servants of Jehovah according to the understanding they had then, do not qualify for everlasting life yet that’s why Peter said David was still in the dust of the earth! Acts 2:29,34


So how many of them saw Jesus Christ and exercised faith in him? John 3:16
Those faithful men will be resurrected here on earth since they DO NOT qualify for everlasting life yet. Acts 24:15


You will still come and boast about the ONLY ORGANIZATION that have TRUE FAITH JOY LOVE and PEACE and the HUMILITY


Had you understood what FAITH was all about as defined in the scriptures you carry you would have deleted the post highlighted above but you won't because you swallow what had been given you without taking another look at it.

Here is where your eyes need to shine on the palaver before you.....

"So how many of them saw Jesus Christ and exercised faith in him?"....... DappaD


Did you DappaD see Jesus? Did Moses see Jesus?

Did you DappaD exercise faith in Jesus? Did Moses exercise faith in Jesus?

You went ahead downgrading other Christian denominations use of John 3:16 whereas the BASIC input the word FAITH as captured in that scripture your HUMILITY cannot FATHOM.

Jesus himself said WHOSOEVER

and he(JESUS) added in other places HAPPY ARE THOSE WHO DO NOT SEE AND YET BELIEVED.... NWT


Oga DappaD no be you go give or grant people EVERLASTING LIFE jare. Baba e bo le ni be

DappaD:
I’m very very very, very busy today but I’ll give you a suitable reply nonetheless.
Yes, all those ancient Hebrew prophets all had a thing or two to say about the Messiah.
See Deuteronomy 18:15, Psalm 2:6, Isaiah 42:1, 53:8-12, Jeremiah 23:5, Daniel 9:26, Ezekiel 21:26-27, Micah 5:2, Zechariah 9:9 etc
BUT none of them saw the fulfillment of those prophecies. Hebrews 11:39
So how could they have exercised faith and obeyed someone that had not come at the appointed time? Galatians 4:4-5

I intentionally used John 3:16 because it is a popular scripture used by your churches. Most of you people think “everlasting life” means going to heaven but fail to realize that Adam had the same prospect if he had remained obedient.
Genesis 2:17

No one ever said those prophets are lost and forgotten, Jehovah will surely remember and resurrect them to perfect human lives here on earth. John 5:28-29, Acts 24:15




So let me ask you now. During the WWII, when the Axis and Allies powers were pitted against each other. Didn’t we see German Catholics kill Italian Catholics, German Protestants kill Italian Protestants and so on? Which Lord approved of those churches going to war to slaughter their members please?



Moses and Elijah were long dead.
Psalm 146:4, Ecclesiastes 9:5-6
They were represented in the vision but only Jesus Christ was literally present. Most people like you don’t know the real meaning of 2Kings 2:11. You assume that Elijah went to the “heavens” when there are actually different types of heavens such as the sky. See Genesis 1:8
Elijah couldn’t have gone to the spiritual heavens for the following reasons in John 3:13, 1Corinthians 15:36 & 1Corinthians 15:50 but that’s by the way.
If the latter part of Luke 16 is to be taken literal then you’ll have no problem explaining these?

Jehovah will surely remember and resurrect them to perfect human lives here on earth.


Draw your attention to the RESURRECT THEM TO PERFECT HUMAN LIVES


This is what those feeding you say about it as captured in their magazines below......



During the Thousand Year Rule of Christ, all of Jehovah’s earthly children will have to make changes to please him. So all of them will have true fellow feeling as they help the resurrected ones to combat sinful tendencies and to live by Jehovah’s standards. (1 Pet. 3: No doubt those who come back to life will be drawn to Jehovah’s humble people, who will also be “working out [their] own salvation.”​—Phil. 2:12.


9 Jehovah promises that no one living under Christ’s rule will say: “I am sick.” (Isa. 33:24; Rom. 6:7) Thus, those who are raised from the dead will be re-created with healthy bodies. However, they will not immediately be perfect. If they were, they might seem unfamiliar to their loved ones. It seems that all mankind will gradually grow to perfection during the Thousand Year Reign of Christ. It is only at the end of the thousand years that Jesus will hand the Kingdom back to his Father. Then the Kingdom will have accomplished its work completely, including the raising of mankind to a perfect state.​—1 Cor. 15:24-28; Rev. 20:1-3.

Tcwork:

H
What is your point.
You stated that the prophets of old did not believe in Christ I have showed you that they did. What more do you want to say.
You claim they are not entitled to eternal life. But that is your opinion. The bible never said so.
So what is your point?
If they did not have faith in him, they wouldn't have prophecied about him. Did the bible ever say that they did not have faith in Christ or is it your opinion?
I respect your opinion on the visit of Moses and Elijah but it's your personal opinion. And please could you give scripture that correlate with what you say. Not one of the scriptures you give correlate with what you say. It's really unfair.

Tcwork:

DappaD D
We are talking about many things at the same time. Let's take it one by one. You said the prophets did not have much faith in Christ. Please could we disuss that first.
And please stop using scripture that don't apply to what you are saying.

There’s actually no need for much deliberation. Paul has already summarised everything about this discussion in Hebrews 11:39.

Moreover, those going to heaven to rule along Jesus are partakers of the new covenant.
Luke 22:28-30, Hebrews 8:8-12
And if I can remember clearly, Moses, Samuel, David, Solomon etc were all under the old covenant when they died. Exodus 19:5
So what’s the essence of God establishing a new covenant that is completely different from the former if those under the old one will still benefit from the new one? Jeremiah 31:31-34

All you need to do is understand what “everlasting life” is, so that you’ll stop mistaking it for life in heaven.

God is the creator, he is not part of creation....

DappaD:
There’s actually no need for much deliberation. Paul has already summarised everything about this discussion in Hebrews 11:39.

Moreover, those going to heaven to rule along Jesus are partakers of the new covenant.
Luke 22:28-30, Hebrews 8:8-12
And if I can remember clearly, Moses, Samuel, David, Solomon etc were all under the old covenant when they died. Exodus 19:5
So what’s the essence of God establishing a new covenant that is completely different from the former if those under the old one will still benefit from the new one? Jeremiah 31:31-34

All you need to do is understand what “everlasting life” is, so that you’ll stop mistaking it for life in heaven.

None of the scriptures you use correspond with your points.

Tcwork:
None of the scriptures you use correspond with your points.

All this one just to dodge the discussion abi. You won’t just admit that there’s nothing else you have to say on the matter. Indeed, the wisdom—which God gives[James 1:5]—is vindicated[proved righteous] by works/actions. Matthew 11:19

DappaD:
All this one just to dodge the discussion abi. You won’t just admit that there’s nothing else you have to say on the matter. Indeed, the wisdom—which God gives[James 1:5]—is vindicated[proved righteous] by works/actions. Matthew 11:19

Honestly sir
You say something but quote something else.. for example you quoted
Hebrews 11.35
Women received their dead by resurrection,+ but other men were tortured because they would not accept release by some ransom, in order that they might attain a better resurrection.
This verse speaks about women receiving their husbands who died as martyrs. Ok?

How does this relate to anything you said.
I only want you to make yourself more clear. Ok
I may not be as smart as you are and many others on the tread may not be that smart so do us all the favor and show us how these scriptures reflex your views

Tcwork:
None of the scriptures you use correspond with your points.

He is not ready to accept that. Their must be something called SCRIPTURAL ABUSE

achorladey:
He is not ready to accept that. Their must be something called SCRIPTURAL ABUSE

He is confusing me

Tcwork:
Honestly sir
You say something but quote something else.. for example you quoted
Hebrews 11.35
Women received their dead by resurrection,+ but other men were tortured because they would not accept release by some ransom, in order that they might attain a better resurrection.
How does this relate to anything you said.
I only want you to make yourself more clear. Ok
I may not be as smart as you are and many others on the tread may not be that smart so do us all the favor and show us how these scriptures reflex your views

Here is another

So how could they have exercised faith and obeyed someone that had not come at the appointed time? Galatians 4:4-5...........from Mr dappa

But when the set time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, 5 to redeem those under the law, that we might receive adoption to sonship


He cited a scripture and can't see that those under the law are REDEEMED by Christ. Didn't the scriptures say the LAW is leading them to CHRIST?


These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.


By faith Moses, when he was come to years, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter;

25 Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season;

26 Esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward.

Tcwork:
Honestly sir You say something but quote something else.. for example you quoted Hebrews 11.35
Women received their dead by resurrection,+ but other men were tortured because they would not accept release by some ransom, in order that they might attain a better resurrection.
How does this relate to anything you said.
I only want you to make yourself more clear. Ok
I may not be as smart as you are and many others on the tread may not be that smart so do us all the favor and show us how these scriptures reflex your views

Hebrews 11:39,40 NWT
“And yet all of these, although they received a favorable witness because of their faith, did not obtain the fulfillment of the promise because God had foreseen something better for us, so that they might not be made perfect apart from us”

I know this scripture will be giving you severe headache by now but this is strong proof that not one of the faithful men and women before Jesus Christ are yet qualified for everlasting life. Paul refers to all of them as the “great cloud of witnesses” meaning they are also of great value to Jehovah but are not qualified to receive the gift of everlasting life yet. Hebrews 12:1
Just take your time to digest it slowly so you don’t run into further problems.

DappaD:
Hebrews 11:39,40 NWT
“And yet all of these, although they received a favorable witness because of their faith, did not obtain the fulfillment of the promise because God had foreseen something better for us, so that they might not be made perfect apart from us”

I know this scripture will be giving you severe headache by now but this is strong proof that not one of the faithful men and women before Jesus Christ are yet qualified for everlasting life. Just take your time to digest it slowly so you don’t run into further problems.

The scriptures you cited always gives others headache and you have been told you keep citing scriptures that do not correlate with your points, you look elsewhere.

Moses didn't see Jesus, You didn't likewise. What is the difference between you and Moses?


They might not be made PERFECT apart from us still dey in front of you and still dey point HEADACHE

Tcwork:
Baba calm down no one hates you. No need to feel that important. Not everyone would accept your message doesn't mean we hate you. Some of my best friends till this day are JW members. I have contributed to your books and have visited your church a number of times.

Be careful not to allow pride becloud your reasoning. Matthew 6:2

DappaD:
Hebrews 11:39,40 NWT
“And yet all of these, although they received a favorable witness because of their faith, did not obtain the fulfillment of the promise because God had foreseen something better for us, so that they might not be made perfect apart from us”

I know this scripture will be giving you severe headache by now but this is strong proof that not one of the faithful men and women before Jesus Christ are yet qualified for everlasting life. Paul refers to all of them as the “great cloud of witnesses” meaning they are also if great value to Jehovah but are not qualified to receive the gift of everlasting life yet. Hebrews 12:1
Just take your time to digest it slowly so you don’t run into further problems.

Claim down but like I said you quote does not in any way indicate that. First your quote shows that these were men of faith. They had faith in christ and because of that they where promised eternal life. But they could not obtain it yet until Christ came and paid the price. How does this scripture have a bearing with anything you are saying.
He never said that they were not qualified. That's your addition

Tcwork:
He is confusing me

Colouring the conversion with REMARKS about you everywhere rather than face what is before him. Hoping those remarks will make you back off

DappaD:
Be careful not to allow pride becloud your reasoning. Matthew 6:2

Pride kwa...ok sir I heAR you

achorladey:
Colouring the conversion with REMARKS about you everywhere rather than face what is before him. Hoping those remarks will make you back off

I believe he is trying to express something but does not have the right words yet. He should calm down and collect himself. He is all over the place.