Myer:


But the problem is God doesn't even speak to Christians too.
At least if God speaks to you, you can be different from others but take the Covid19 pandemic for example, no one knew about it talkless of what to do. Even Pastors where caught unawares talkless of ordinary christian members.

I'm certain God revealed it to certain persons but not those popularly known so that when you hear it you will not want to believe.


Now it is not the revelation that matters it's the reaction(s) by the so called christians. The drama and comedy that erupted afterwards.

Take a look at Elisha and the Shunammite woman when she brought her dead son to him. What was his reaction?

bixton:



I'm certain God revealed it to certain persons but not those popularly known so that when you hear it you will not want to believe.


Now it is not the revelation that matters it's the reaction(s) by the so called christians. The drama and comedy that erupted afterwards.

Take a look at Elisha and the Shunammite woman when she brought her dead son to him. What was his reaction?

Was it revealed to you?

Myer:


Can God leave his children and climg to unbelievers?
Really?
Why were the Jews (God's chosen through promise to Abraham) rejected and the Gentiles (Unbelievers) chosen?

Like I always say, the inconsistency of God is undisputed except on the basis that you do not want to acknowledge it.
I've presented other scenarios in the Bible where this is so. In fact most believe the God of the old testament must be different from the God of new testament cos apparently he changed due to the sacrifice of Jesus.

Bro, I won't have to be showing you everytime how much of the scriptures you misinterpret.

You already mixed up things again.
Work of Salvation was never through Gentile. What you will see through the scripture is

Abraham to Israel to Jesus. Rejection of Israel was only defined in God's work and plan of salvation, hence they were rejected in that work and Jesus had to fulfill what Israel refused to fulfill (The covenant). Israel was not rejected in receiving salvation as salvation is for all and that include the gentiles too. Israel wasn't rejected for gentile Sir. Israel themselves rejected the salvation provided for them.

You must know how to separate issues in the scriptures. You are mixing alot together.

Gentile doesn't even have a play in the work of Salvation. They only benefitted from it. Israel is to have a play, a responsibility in God's plan of salvation which they rejected and Jesus was the one who filled same that Israel rejected .

So, Abraham played his part, Israel is to fulfill that which Abraham set ahead but Israel failed, Jesus came and fulfilled the same. That is the rejection of Israel to make Jesus the chosen.
No Gentiles in this at all. Bible called gentiles godless.

Now what Jesus fulfilled is available for both Jews and Gentiles, so Israel is not rejected from receiving salvation. I have explained this to you earlier when you were speaking about covenants.

---

But just take this, try to be reading books of the bible not verses or just a part. You must read all together.

The scriptures must be read together to make a total sense to you.

hoopernikao:


Bro, I won't have to be showing you everytime how much of the scriptures you misinterpret. But just take this, try to be ready books of the bible not verses or just a part.

The scriptures must be read together to make a total sense to you.

How exactly do you think I read the Bible?

I've completed the Bible once or twice, the Synoptic gospels even more times.

You will only see the inconsistencies in the Bible if you ever study it from a non-religious perspective.

Anything done in the name of religion is done blindly and absent sense because you're not allowed to question the so called word of God no matter how ludicrous it is, across religions. Muslims and Jews likewise believe their divine books are perfect just like Christians do and cannot be questioned.

Just as a Christian can easily pick the errors in the Quran, that's exactly how the Bible's inaccuracies and inconsistencies abound.

That language is uncommon my brother!

bixton:

I'm certain God revealed it to certain persons but not those popularly known so that when you hear it you will not want to believe.


Now it is not the revelation that matters it's the reaction(s) by the so called christians. The drama and comedy that erupted afterwards.

Take a look at Elisha and the Shunammite woman when she brought her dead son to him. What was his reaction?

Myer:


Was it revealed to you?

Someone told me and also spoke of the variants that will accompany it and it will defy all medical vaccines.

hoopernikao:


Bro, I won't have to be showing you everytime how much of the scriptures you misinterpret.

You already mixed up things again.
Work of Salvation was never through Gentile. What you will see through the scripture is

Abraham to Israel to Jesus. Rejection of Israel was only defined in God's work and plan of salvation, hence they were rejected in that work and Jesus had to fulfill what Israel refused to fulfill (The covenant). Israel was not rejected in receiving salvation as salvation is for all and that include the gentiles too. Israel wasn't rejected for gentile Sir. Israel themselves rejected the salvation provided for them.

You must know how to separate issues in the scriptures. You are mixing alot together.

Gentile doesn't even have a play in the work of Salvation. They only benefitted from it. Israel is to have a play, a responsibility in God's plan of salvation which they rejected and Jesus was the one who filled same that Israel rejected .

So, Abraham played his part, Israel is to fulfill that which Abraham set ahead but Israel failed, Jesus came and fulfilled the same. That is the rejection of Israel to make Jesus the chosen.
No Gentiles in this at all. Bible called gentiles godless.

Now what Jesus fulfilled is available for both Jews and Gentiles, so Israel is not rejected from receiving salvation. I have explained this to you earlier when you were speaking about covenants.

---

But just take this, try to be reading books of the bible not verses or just a part. You must read all together.

The scriptures must be read together to make a total sense to you.

The Jews were rejected by God as was prophesied. Even Paul acknowledged this. Thats how salvation came to the gentiles. Like you said, of course Jews who also chose to follow Christ are saved.

Romans 11:11-15
So I ask, did they stumble in order that they might fall? By no means! Rather, through their trespass usalvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to make Israel jealous. 12 Now if their trespass means riches for the world, and if their failure means riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their full inclusion2 mean!

13 Now I am speaking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch then as vI am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry 14 in order somehow to make my fellow Jews jealous, and wthus save some of them. 15 For if their rejection means xthe reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance mean but life from the dead?

MaxInDHouse:
That language is uncommon my brother!

I do not know what you mean by uncommon.

bixton:


Someone told me and also spoke of the variants that will accompany it and it will defy all medical vaccines.

Meaning it was not revealed to you.
Lets not mistake revelation for predictions.

There are several conspiracy theories that have shared better predictions on Covid -19. Even some pastors like Oyakhilome are teaching such conspiracies.

I asked if God revealed it to you. I asked because it is a major phenomenon that shook the whole world. Yet it wasn't revealed to God's special children? Some of whom have now met their untimely death in the hands of Covid?

The bible tells us in so many instances whenever such plagues would happen, God reveals it to his prophets/friends and even gives them the chance to plead on behalf of the people in order to avert it.

I'm just wondering why this isn't the case in a generation that boasts of walking in the prophetic, dining with Jesus, etc.

Myer:


The Jews were rejected by God as was prophesied. Even Paul acknowledged this. Thats how salvation came to the gentiles. Like you said, of course Jews who also chose to follow Christ are saved.

Romans 11:11-15
So I ask, did they stumble in order that they might fall? By no means! Rather, through their trespass usalvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to make Israel jealous. 12 Now if their trespass means riches for the world, and if their failure means riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their full inclusion2 mean!

13 Now I am speaking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch then as vI am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry 14 in order somehow to make my fellow Jews jealous, and wthus save some of them. 15 For if their rejection means xthe reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance mean but life from the dead?

For me to understand you clearly. Can you confirm this is exactly what you mean by the bold above.

That Gentiles would not have seen salvation nor gentile be saved if Israel has not rejected God? So that means salvation will be for Israel alone?

So, it means salvation was meant only for Jews if not for their rejection? Bro, fear God o.

And I have told you before, that the way you misquote Paul regularly, he may stand against you at the "gates of heaven" to deny you access

Myer:


Meaning it was not revealed to you.
Lets not mistake revelation for predictions.

There are several conspiracy theories that have shared better predictions on Covid -19. Even some pastors like Oyakhilome are teaching such conspiracies.

I asked if God revealed it to you. I asked because it is a major phenomenon that shook the whole world. Yet it wasn't revealed to God's special children? Some of whom have now met their untimely death in the hands of Covid?

The bible tells us in so many instances whenever such plagues would happen, God reveals it to his prophets/friends and even gives them the chance to plead on behalf of the people in order to avert it.

I'm just wondering why this isn't the case in a generation that boasts of walking in the prophetic, dining with Jesus, etc.

So, how did you know it wasn't revealed to anyone?


Likewise, dont still forget the below. Read it well and act of it. A Christian dont make bogus claim and assumptions. We arent as thought like that.

Philippians 4:5
5 Let your moderation be known unto all men. The Lord is at hand.


So, read this well and act properly.

Is like the computer age has made you to believe that if something is not online, it doesn't exist. It's a fallacy of this age. You already bought it.

How many Christian do you know out of the billions for you to reach your conclusion, how many churches do you know in villages, huts, hamlet, caves, hills even in houses. You have assumed for all of these.

When we see things only through our own eyes or coverage we will always make a wrong assumption.

There are billions of persons around the world today with no access to internet. You have already spoken for them here with your assumptions. Christianity is not online.


Also note this and take good note of it. Not all churches or Christians go to media or seek media fame to disclose what was revealed or known or received. The church aren't sent to do that. But since we are in the age of media craze, we believe if it's not in media it doesn't exist.

Bro, repent from your assumptions. Always speak based on what you know and the distance of your eyes.

hoopernikao:


So, how did you know it wasn't revealed to anyone?

Was it revealed to you?

Myer:


How exactly do you think I read the Bible?

I've completed the Bible once or twice, the Synoptic gospels even more times.

You will only see the inconsistencies in the Bible if you ever study it from a non-religious perspective.

Anything done in the name of religion is done blindly and absent sense because you're not allowed to question the so called word of God no matter how ludicrous it is, across religions. Muslims and Jews likewise believe their divine books are perfect just like Christians do and cannot be questioned.

Just as a Christian can easily pick the errors in the Quran, that's exactly how the Bible's inaccuracies and inconsistencies abound.

The bold is absolutely false.

A proper study of the Bible leads to critical thinking. The scriptures is a mind engaging writings. When read well, you will understand that critical thinking is not about finding inconsistency but understanding the essence, reasons for God's actions and the truth expressed through it.

Even in our days, The texts of the scriptures which is over thousands of years in age, it's composition, expression and literacy will stand above the best of our modern literatures. And the writers will rate among the best scholars in our days.

The inconsistency you see are still product of not understanding the scriptures well. But I trust God you will in due times.

hoopernikao:



For me to understand you clearly. Can you confirm this is exactly what you mean by the bold above.

That Gentiles would not have seen salvation nor gentile be saved if Israel has not rejected God? So that means salvation will be for Israel alone?

So, it means salvation was meant only for Jews if not for their rejection? Bro, fear God o.

And I have told you before, that the way you misquote Paul regularly, he may stand against you at the "gates of heaven" to deny you access

I meant their rejection of Christ made God also reject them and choose the Gentiles.

What did you read in the scripture I shared?

Now Jews who were God's chosen were rejected while the Gentiles (whom Jesus forbade his disciples from preaching to) were chosen. And thus began the ministry of Paul and Barnabas. Acts 13:2-3

Myer:


I meant their rejection of Christ made God also reject them and choose the Gentiles.

What did you read in the scripture I shared?

Now Jews who were God's chosen were rejected while the Gentiles (whom Jesus forbade his disciples from preaching to) were chosen. And thus began the ministry of Paul and Barnabas. Acts 13:2-3

Bro habaa.

Jews rejection is what I have explained to you above. It has nothing to do with Christ. Christ death is for all. Both Jews and Gentiles. Jews were to bring that same salvation in Abraham to all nations but they rejected it.


Christ came to fulfill that. Hence both Jews and Gentiles now need salvation and has to be saved in Christ.

How will you sya Jews rejection of Christ brought salvation to Gentiles. This is the reason I told you that you must read the scriptures as a whole.

The plan of God for all the earth is all over the scriptures.
God's plan has always been about all humanity, all the earth. Even before the time of Jews and Gentiles.

You will see this being repeated by God's all through the scriptures. You only need to pay attention.

Gen 1:26-28. ... Multiply, Replenish the EARTH. that's God's plan even from days of Adam.

Gen 22:18.... In you shall all the NATIONS OF THE EARTH be blessed.

Hab 2:14... Glory of the lord shall cover the EARTH as the waters.....

Joel 2:28... Pour out my spirit upon ALL FLESH..

Matt 28: 18-19.... GO...YE... Make disciples ALL NATIONS

Mark 16:15... Go into ALL THE WORLD....

Acts 1:8-9 Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria and TO THE UTTERMOST PART OF THE EARTH

The promise never changed.

You will see this on and on. God's plan for all. It didn't start in Matthew.

God's plan and promise never changed, also his words never changed. It is you that need to be available to understand fully his plan, thoughts and words.

Myer:


Meaning it was not revealed to you.
Lets not mistake revelation for predictions.

There are several conspiracy theories that have shared better predictions on Covid -19. Even some pastors like Oyakhilome are teaching such conspiracies.

I asked if God revealed it to you. I asked because it is a major phenomenon that shook the whole world. Yet it wasn't revealed to God's special children? Some of whom have now met their untimely death in the hands of Covid?

The bible tells us in so many instances whenever such plagues would happen, God reveals it to his prophets/friends and even gives them the chance to plead on behalf of the people in order to avert it.

I'm just wondering why this isn't the case in a generation that boasts of walking in the prophetic, dining with Jesus, etc.

Like I said.....someone(a pastor) told me it was revealed to him and he even told it to his congregation. I am not a member of his church.

Everything is at the discretion and perogative of God.

Compare their boasting to that of Apostle Paul.....

Are there conspiracy theories in the Scripture!!!!

Like I said again the covid-19 issue is just one of such proofs that shows Christians are not ready for rapture. They are enjoying life and the world and leaving the actual work of God.

Though God is raising new sons and daughters to take His work.

hoopernikao:


Bro habaa.

Jews rejection is what I have explained to you above. It has nothing to do with Christ. Christ death is for all. Both Jews and Gentiles. Jews were to bring that same salvation in Abraham to all nations but they rejected it.


Christ came to fulfill that. Hence both Jews and Gentiles now need salvation and has to be saved in Christ.

How will you sya Jews rejection of Christ brought salvation to Gentiles. This is the reason I told you that you must read the scriptures as a whole.

The plan of God for all the earth is all over the scriptures.
God's plan has always been about all humanity, all the earth. Even before the time of Jews and Gentiles.

You will see this being repeated by God's all through the scriptures. You only need to pay attention.

Gen 1:26-28. ... Multiply, Replenish the EARTH. that's God's plan even from days of Adam.

Gen 22:18.... In you shall all the NATIONS OF THE EARTH be blessed.

Hab 2:14... Glory of the lord shall cover the EARTH as the waters.....

Joel 2:28... Pour out my spirit upon ALL FLESH..

Matt 28: 18-19.... GO...YE... Make disciples ALL NATIONS

Mark 16:15... Go into ALL THE WORLD....

Acts 1:8-9 Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria and TO THE UTTERMOST PART OF THE EARTH

The promise never changed.

You will see this on and on. God's plan for all. It didn't start in Matthew.

God's plan and promise never changed, also his words never changed. It is you that need to be available to understand fully his plan, thoughts and words.

Romans 11:13
Now I am speaking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch then as vI am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry 14 in order somehow to make my fellow Jews jealous, and wthus save some of them. 15 For if their rejection means xthe reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance mean but life from the dead?

What is your understanding of the above scrioture? Emphasis on vs 15.
I take it you believe the scriptures are inspired by God hence it was God speaking through the apostle Paul.

Myer:


Was it revealed to you?

I am just one out of billions of believers all around the world.

Is like the computer age has made you to believe that if something is not online, it doesn't exist. It's a fallacy of this age. You already bought it.

How many Christian do you know out of the billions for you to reach your conclusion, how many churches do you know in villages, huts, hamlet, caves, hills even in houses. You have assumed for all of these.

When we see things only through our own eyes or coverage we will always make a wrong assumption.

There are billions of persons around the world today with no access to internet. You have already spoken for them here with your assumptions. Christianity is not online.


Also note this and take good note of it. Not all churches or Christians go to media or seek media fame to disclose what was revealed or known or received. The church aren't sent to do that. But since we are in the age of media craze, we believe if it's not in media it doesn't exist.

Bro, repent from your assumptions. Always speak based on what you know and the distance of your eyes.

How does it sound if some claim Myer doesn't exist in the whole world just because he never seen you online or social media. There are many Myers that doesn't even have access to internet and some that won't even make use of it.

bixton:



Like I said.....someone(a pastor) told me it was revealed to him and he even told it to his congregation. I am not a member of his church.

Everything is at the discretion and perogative of God.

Compare their boasting to that of Apostle Paul.....

Are there conspiracy theories in the Scripture!!!!

Like I said again the covid-19 issue is just one of such proofs that shows Christians are not ready for rapture. They are enjoying life and the world and leaving the actual work of God.

Though God is raising new sons and daughters to take His work.

Ok, you didn't mention that it was a personal experience.
If truly it was revealed to him, then that is a good thing. That's how it's meant to be according the the Bible.

As in response to your last paragraph, I believe the challenge lies in some portions of the gospel through Paul. Some believe once confession is made and they're converted, God doesn't necessary require any acts of righteousness. In fact any attempt at righteousness by works is subject to returning to the curses of the law.

Yet like I always say, if Christians will only live and act like Christians just for 4 years, the world would definitely be a better place.

The missionaries took their Christianity seriously and even Nigeria benefitted from it.
Unfortunately, the lust of the world, lust of the eyes and pride of life continue to make Christianity no different from any other religion.

hoopernikao:


I am just one out of billions of believers all around the world.

Is like the computer age has made you to believe that if something is not online, it doesn't exist. It's a fallacy of this age. You already bought it.

How many Christian do you know out of the billions for you to reach your conclusion, how many churches do you know in villages, huts, hamlet, caves, hills even in houses. You have assumed for all of these.

When we see things only through our own eyes or coverage we will always make a wrong assumption.

There are billions of persons around the world today with no access to internet. You have already spoken for them here with your assumptions. Christianity is not online.


Also note this and take good note of it. Not all churches or Christians go to media or seek media fame to disclose what was revealed or known or received. The church aren't sent to do that. But since we are in the age of media craze, we believe if it's not in media it doesn't exist.

Bro, repent from your assumptions. Always speak based on what you know and the distance of your eyes.

How does it sound if some claim Myer doesn't exist in the whole world just because he never seen you online or social media. There are many Myers that doesn't even have access to internet and some that won't even make use of it.

All this epistles, and you didn't answer the simple question.
Was it revealed to you?

Myer:


Romans 11:13
Now I am speaking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch then as vI am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry 14 in order somehow to make my fellow Jews jealous, and wthus save some of them. 15 For if their rejection means xthe reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance mean but life from the dead?

What is your understanding of the above scrioture? Emphasis on vs 15.
I take it you believe the scriptures are inspired by God hence it was God speaking through the apostle Paul.

Bro, I won't be reading scriptures for you. You have to do the reading yourself.

To understand the verse you quoted go and start from Chapter 9 verse 1. That is where this discussion started from. Read it through chapter 10, then read chapter 11 patiently. You will understand Paul's flow of thought.


He already told you in

Rom 10:1

Brothers and sisters, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved

Hence this is speaking about salvation in Christ. So when you say rejected by God, it must be defined in this. It's their rejection of salvation offered in Christ.

Verse 10 already showed you what they rejected.

10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.


They rejected the faith in Christ.

11 As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.”

Observe he said ANYONE.

Verse 12 expanded that for you

12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him,

Same salvation, for both.

13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”[f]

Everyone includes Jews.


Hence they rejected it.

But not all Jews rejected. Some did accept.

Verse 16 But not all the Israelites accepted the good news

Note, 'the goodnews'

21 But concerning Israel he says,

“All day long I have held out my hands
to a disobedient and obstinate people.”


So, Jews were the one who rejected the gospel not God rejecting them. Understand the flow well.

The gospel is for all, Jews still rejected it.


Chapter 11:1

I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means! I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God did not reject his people,

This clearly showed you that God wasn't the one who rejected Israel.

In salvation, God doesn't reject anyone. Israel wasn't rejected in receiving salvation.


They rejected it. But not all of them

7 What then? What the people of Israel sought so earnestly they did not obtain. The elect among them did, but the others were hardened

So it should be clear to you now that it's not God who rejected Israel from receiving salvation, Israel did reject it themselves just as anybody can. It's their choice not God's choice.


Now observe patiently

Vs 11
11 Again I ask: Did they stumble so as to fall beyond recovery? Not at all! Rather, because of their transgression, salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious

The bold is not in Greek text, it was inserted by translator and I believe this affected your view.

The word "has come" is better put as "is preached".

So Israel rejected, the Apostles take it to the Gentiles.

Why? He told you, "to make them envious" . Envious why? To provoke their acceptance.


Vs 15.
For if their rejection brought reconciliation to the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead

Now, this should be clear to you.

The word "their" will be referring to who? God or Israel? Of course Israel. You have seen from Chapter 9 till now that Paul emphasized who is doing the rejection. Not God but Israel.

So it's better written...
For if Israel rejection....

Hope this is clear.


Now again in this verse .

Same thing as verse 11. The word brought wasn't in Greek text. It was inserted. This insertion already give you an interpretation that you hold to.

Even at that, it's the rejection by Israel that made gospel preached to the Gentiles EARLY. Israel is to be saved first, not last. But their rejection here means the preacher will go to the next city. It's not God issues here. It's Israel issues.

Remember Jesus said.

... But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another:.... Matt 10:23

.... The first shall become the last... Matt 20:16


So in conclusion
Did God reject Israel for Gentiles in salvation in Christ? No. Israel was the one who rejected it.

So, can God reject his children and go for enemies children? I already told you, that it takes a bad father to do such.


Please Bro, always read scriptures from where the very discussion starts from. Read through. Sometimes it takes reading 6 chapters together to understand, sometimes reading the whole book, even atimes reading the whole bible.

Myer:


All this epistles, and you didn't answer the simple question.
Was it revealed to you?

Okay Yes . Any issue with it?

hoopernikao:


Bro, I won't be reading scriptures for you. You have to do the reading yourself.

To understand the verse you quoted go and start from Chapter 9 verse 1. That is where this discussion started from. Read it through chapter 10, then read chapter 11 patiently. You will understand Paul's flow of thought.


He already told you in

Rom 10:1

Brothers and sisters, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved

Hence this is speaking about salvation in Christ. So when you say rejected by God, it must be defined in this. It's their rejection of salvation offered in Christ.

Verse 10 already showed you what they rejected.

10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.


They rejected the faith in Christ.

11 As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.”

Observe he said ANYONE.

Verse 12 expanded that for you

12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him,

Same salvation, for both.

13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”[f]

Everyone includes Jews.


Hence they rejected it.

But not all Jews rejected. Some did accept.

Verse 16 But not all the Israelites accepted the good news

Note, 'the goodnews'

21 But concerning Israel he says,

“All day long I have held out my hands
to a disobedient and obstinate people.”


So, Jews were the one who rejected the gospel not God rejecting them. Understand the flow well.

The gospel is for all, Jews still rejected it.


Chapter 11:1

I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means! I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God did not reject his people,

This clearly showed you that God wasn't the one who rejected Israel.

In salvation, God doesn't reject anyone. Israel wasn't rejected in receiving salvation.


They rejected it. But not all of them

7 What then? What the people of Israel sought so earnestly they did not obtain. The elect among them did, but the others were hardened

So it should be clear to you now that it's not God who rejected Israel from receiving salvation, Israel did reject it themselves just as anybody can. It's their choice not God's choice.


Now observe patiently

Vs 11
11 Again I ask: Did they stumble so as to fall beyond recovery? Not at all! Rather, because of their transgression, salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious

The bold is not in Greek text, it was inserted by translator and I believe this affected your view.

The word "has come" is better put as "is preached".

So Israel rejected, the Apostles take it to the Gentiles.

Why? He told you, "to make them envious" . Envious why? To provoke their acceptance.


Vs 15.
For if their rejection brought reconciliation to the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead

Now, this should be clear to you.

The word "their" will be referring to who? God or Israel? Of course Israel. You have seen from Chapter 9 till now that Paul emphasized who is doing the rejection. Not God but Israel.

So it's better written...
For if Israel rejection....

Hope this is clear.


Now again in this verse .

Same thing as verse 11. The word brought wasn't in Greek text. It was inserted. This insertion already give you an interpretation that you hold to.

Even at that, it's the rejection by Israel that made gospel preached to the Gentiles EARLY. Israel is to be saved first, not last. But their rejection here means the preacher will go to the next city. It's not God issues here. It's Israel issues.

Remember Jesus said.

... But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another:.... Matt 10:23

.... The first shall become the last... Matt 20:16


So in conclusion
Did God reject Israel for Gentiles in salvation in Christ? No. Israel was the one who rejected it.

So, can God reject his children and go for enemies children? I already told you, that it takes a bad father to do such.


Please Bro, always read scriptures from where the very discussion starts from. Read through. Sometimes it takes reading 6 chapters together to understand, sometimes reading the whole book, even atimes reading the whole bible.

You make too many assumptions for some one who i perceievd to be intelligent. Cos assumption is actually the bases form of intelligence.

Why should I quote the whole of the chapters Romans 8-11 before you know I read them?
The point of emphasis of our discussion is clearly stated in Romans 11 which I extracted for you. But in your usual manner you can't admit to being wrong and why you continue to digress. You my friend seem to have mastered the strawman argument.

My point has been made on this issue. God rejected the Israelites and chose the Gentiles in response to make them jealous as he had already prophesied in the old testament which Paul clearly also confirmed.

hoopernikao:


Okay Yes . Any issue with it?

What exactly was revealed to you?

Myer:


Ok, you didn't mention that it was a personal experience.
If truly it was revealed to him, then that is a good thing. That's how it's meant to be according the the Bible.

As in response to your last paragraph, I believe the challenge lies in some portions of the gospel through Paul. Some believe once confession is made and they're converted, God doesn't necessary require any acts of righteousness. In fact any attempt at righteousness by works is subject to returning to the curses of the law.

Yet like I always say, if Christians will only live and act like Christians just for 4 years, the world would definitely be a better place.

The missionaries took their Christianity seriously and even Nigeria benefitted from it.
Unfortunately, the lust of the world, lust of the eyes and pride of life continue to make Christianity no different from any other religion.

Take a look at Philippians 2:12-15 as regards the bold.

1 Corin 1:18: For the gospel of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

Compare both bolds in the above Scripture. It's in the continuous present form. It's a daily thing. Do a comparison to that in Philippians as quoted above.

While there is a misconception in interpretation about acts of righteousness by works being under the law. But I would not want to delve much in that.

I'll tell you this God is not interested in what works one does per se but our intentions/ motives for doing them.

Do we do works to glorify God or we do works because it's right to do it that we might be justified!!? Take a cue from Jesus.

Myer:


What exactly was revealed to you?

Firstly let me know, in what capacity and role you are asking this.

Are you the supervisor of the Body of Christ or an hovering spirit over the angels of the churches. Which capacity are you Sir.

Myer:


You make too many assumptions for some one who i perceievd to be intelligent. Cos assumption is actually the bases form of intelligence.

Why should I quote the whole of the chapters Romans 8-11 before you know I read them?
The point of emphasis of our discussion is clearly stated in Romans 11 which I extracted for you. But in your usual manner you can't admit to being wrong and why you continue to digress. You my friend seem to have mastered the strawman argument.

My point has been made on this issue. God rejected the Israelites and chose the Gentiles in response to make them jealous as he had already prophesied in the old testament which Paul clearly also confirmed.

Bro, i am not assuming it that you didnt read properly, especially the Chapters, i am giving you an affirmative statement. Your interpretation gave you away because if you have READ PROPERLY, you wont have come to the conclusion you came to.


The word READ, when discussing the scriptures doesnt mean you have seen or read the scriptures, even an unbeliever is likely to have read them. But the word usually means YOU HAVENT READ PROPERLY. When use in scriptures, it is usually from the Greek text anaginosko. Which translates as "to read again and again". It is used for proper reading to understand. This is what you havent done.


Jesus used the same word severally for Pharisees, i hope you know a Pharisee is a teacher, scholar of the scriptures, Yet Jesus told them to read or havent he read. Read there mean to read properly Bro.

Matt 19:4 “And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read,
Mark 12:10 And have ye not read this scripture;
Matt 12:5 Or have ye not read in the law,

So, telling you, you didnt read is not an assumption or abuse, its a call for you to read properly. Hence, you should go back and read properly.
When you have dont this, you will see the scriptures clearly.

There is a reading of the scriptures and there is a PROPER reading of the scriptures. The gap between this is thin but the effects is as wide as the red sea.

Myer:


How exactly do you think I read the Bible?

I've completed the Bible once or twice, the Synoptic gospels even more times

Its not how many times one reads the Scripture that matters but what the individual gains from reading it. How is your understanding after each reading? The Scripture is not necessarily for cramming and quoting.


You will only see the inconsistencies in the Bible if you ever study it from a non-religious perspective
Those who find inconsistencies in the Scripture are seeing it because they made their minds to see it. The Scripture is not a literature book and everything written is not exactly for literal purposes.



Anything done in the name of religion is done blindly [/b]and absent sense because you're not allowed to question the so called word of God no matter how ludicrous it is, across religions. Muslims and Jews likewise believe their divine books are perfect just like [b]Christians do and cannot be questioned

Well to those who play religion it may be done blindly.
It is written .... Isaiah 1:18: Come now and let us reason together, says the Lord..........(is this not like a question and response session).

Ask God a question that will bring you edification or add value to your existing.
Do you know of any teacher/lecturer that responds to stupid questions asked by pupils/students in school?




Just as a Christian can easily pick the errors in the Quran, that's exactly how the Bible's inaccuracies and inconsistencies abound.

Please don't compare the Bible to the Qur'an. The Bible is self explanatory for those who truly desire knowledge and understanding.

Those who read the Qur'an have the Hadith as correspondence to understand what is written in the former.

Myer:


The point of emphasis of our discussion is clearly stated in Romans 11 which I extracted for you. But in your usual manner you can't admit to being wrong and why you continue to digress. You my friend seem to have mastered the strawman argument.

My point has been made on this issue. God rejected the Israelites and chose the Gentiles in response to make them jealous as he had already prophesied in the old testament which Paul clearly also confirmed.

You know the reason i took my time to explain is because it is you. If you are observant, i have tried to even avoid having to do much explanation or quoting scriptures since on this thread. I have my reasons. I have known you for someone who receives God's word as it is and make correction without pride. So dont let that change.

Hence firstly, you will need to stop hiding behind the first bold statement above, as it will not allow you see the truth. I gave you scriptures and even go extra length to explained and pointed out the key areas you missed. The right thing for you to do is to humbly go back and read. Or better still point out where you think i misinterpret. Show scriptures, that is how bible students discuss.


But you still cling unto what wasnt written, Paul clearly showed you that Israel rejected the gospel, which you can see over over again in the 3 Chapters, yet to said it is not so but its god who rejected Israel. Bro, this is how rebellion to God's word starts. It is not about winning arguments, its a bout seeing things the way they were written down and hold to it.

I beg of you, desist from wrestling with scriptures especially when it is obvious you are wrong.

bixton:



I'm certain [/b]God revealed it to certain persons but not those popularly known [b][b][/b]so that when you hear it you will not want to believe.


Now it is not the revelation that matters it's the reaction(s) by the so called christians. The drama and comedy that erupted afterwards.

Take a look at Elisha and the Shunammite woman when she brought her dead son to him. What was his reaction?

"I'm certain God revealed it to certain persons but not those popularly known so that when you hear it you will not want to believe."

I strongly believe the above

KNOWMORE56:


"I'm certain God revealed it to certain persons but not those popularly known so that when you hear it you will not want to believe."

I strongly believe the above

This year is a year of extra ordinary things be it positive and negative.

To those who are believers should make themselves available to the Holy Spirit.

God is going to pour out His Spirit on His children. But only on those who are prepared to accept Him truly.

But people should also be mindful and steadfast because the adversary will deceive many into believing they are filled with the spirit of God.

bixton:


This year is a year of extra ordinary things be it positive and negative.

To those who are believers should make themselves available to the Holy Spirit.

God is going to pour out His Spirit on His children. But only on those who are prepared to accept Him truly.

But people should also be mindful and steadfast because the adversary will deceive many into believing they are filled with the spirit of God.

I guess the question becomes what is the difference between those with the outpouring of the Holyspirit and those without?