₦airaland Forum

MariaGoretti:
mine was splendid.....yours?

Speaking about novennas, is it a must to attend mass each day of the novenna??

I guess not... And it depends on the novena... You can decide to start your own 9 or even 1mnth mass novena, wch means you got to attend mass for the days of the novena... Just ur choice. The last one I did, mass isnt part of it.

Empiree:
You just proved my point. What's the point of being apologetic with unbridled attitude of yours. I have no time to waste with you.
Let me ask you a question. If you are christian, what exactly you people learned in sermons?. Don't they teach you people "christian eschatology" and a branch of knowledge, epistemology?

Sometimes i weep for you people for lack of guidance

Plz stop playing the victim here... Islam is only tied with terrorism as a result of wat most of its followers do. No one is saying muslims are the only once who are bad... Every religion/tribe have their own share of bad pple. But watch the diff btw all of them. Its only the bad muslims that uses religion to justify their act of violence and the good ones dont do much to dissociate themself from the act. Now show me which other religion have pple used to justify their act of violence...? Its the muslim that brought all these upon themselves...

@Sameera... My conclusion so far based on our first discussion is that "if what you are telling me is the truth, then majority of muslims (judging from everday occurance) are practicing a corrupted version of Islam...

sameera025:
I am from Northern Nigeria, my relatives are in the north, I visit yearly, I schooled in the North so you can't say I know nothing of it. I also commend yoruba muslims for their peace and exemplary practices. I am not here trying to convert anyone to Islam. I am asking for peace between muslims an Christians. I've provided a platform for questions to be asked about Islam for those who want to understand it.

I think am done asking about what Islam teaches on death penalty and punishment... Now this your reply bring me to the next question, TOLERANC...

What is the teaching of Islam on allowing non muslims leave in their land. I want know what Islam teaches on tolerance...

sameera025:
She was not, the point is that she is surrounded by muslims, her parents are very religious. She let everyone know her decision, and nothing has been done to her.
I know if she had done this in some village with extremists they might have acted unjustly towards her.
Her reasons for leaving were that she didn't like praying 5 times a day, covering her hair. She liked to party and drink and islam frowns upon such.
Being a muslim is not easy. You have to make tons of sacrifices and abstain from worldly things, but is it worth being patient and doing what Allah tells us is good in order to please him.

In conclusion, I will say the muslims who are better educated are less violent than those who are... Cos taking frm the statistics where muslims take on violence, it can be seen that its coming from less developed/educated area/countries.. Eg... Pakistan,Afgan, northern Nig... But come to think of it, such still happen in saudia...

sameera025:
A friend of mine denounced islam a few years ago. She is very open about it. I do not agree with her decision but I do not resent her either. I just hope one day she will revert back. Nothing has happened to her. She is a Northern Muslim. So many people know about it and no one has attacked her in any way. The muslims you are hearing and reading about are not the majority of muslims.

Was she in the north when she denouced Islam openly...

sbaks:
Sharap! You know other things wey dem done do to me? I just cited an example

guy... We dey quarrel ni...

Vicotex:
Na dat white man be the 9ja army?

lol... Abeg help me ask am...

sbaks:
Imagine a lecturer denying me my rightful marks because I AM CHRISTIAN

lol... But guy, you knw say that one na personal beef btw two of una... So chill...

sameera025:
The quran doesn't state a punishment for such. Remember we are told to follow the rulings of the quran. What is written on such people is:
"Neither the Jews nor the Christians will be pleased with you (O Muhammad) till you follow their millah. Say: “Surely, the guidance of God is the (true) guidance”. And if you were to follow their desires after what has come to you of knowledge, then you would not have any protector or helper against God. (2:120)
So, it says if you leave islam after practicing it then you will face God. So if anything I take this to mean they should be left for Allah to handle.

If truly what you are telling me is what the koran teaches... Then am sorry to say, you are the only muslim that i have come across... *dats if you do as you are telling me*
We all knw that muslims world wide will hunt and kill any one that denouces Islam... *dont ask me for proof, cos we have seen it and exp it*... Back in kano, I now how many pple my church have to send out of the diocese cos of threat to their life as a result of them denouncing islam.

So, i can still repeat my earlier statement... If what you are telling me is true... Then this current muslims are practicing another brand of Islam.

sameera025:
They broke laws set by their country. Laws are laws. Whether we agree with them or not. And we know that if we break them, we have to face the penalties set in motion. Say there weren't laws set against these actions and they were wrongly prosecuted that would be a different argument.

I dont really knw when the Nigerian constitution allow the killing of some1 for abusing a prophet cos countless pple have fallen victims to such act here in Nigeria. Even in Afgan/Pakistan, we have seen fanatics forcing their way into police station to pick out and kill victims who are under police protection cos they commited blasphemy...

Anyway, dont want us to continue argueing on this issue. Lets move on to my next question...

What is the Islamic stand on a muslim who converted to another religion. Is the person supposed to be killed or left alone...?

sameera025:
I cannot just why the actions of this because it isn't islamic. This is one of the issues of culture coming to play. The fact remains that islam encourages knowledge and spreading knowledge as I do now. No muslim I have met as ever been denied these rights and it is because I was fortunate enough to grow up where it is accepted in the culture.

Maybe its cos you grew up in the west... In saudia, jst last week, a man was detained and sentence to prison with a thousand lashes for blogging. In iran, some pple where arrested for uploading the new dancing skills in youtube... To mention but a few...

sameera025:
You cannot generalize countries as a whole.
Some muslims practice the teachings of the quran more than others. Just as as some Christians are more religious than others and there are many different sects of christian who all have different beliefs and follow different rulings. Same as muslims. Culture also always comes into play as well. It should not be confused with religious rulings.

Why I said so is that, most of the teachings that you proved wrong here are actually what some muslim countries (esp the ones i listed) uphold as their main islamic teaching backed by their scholars.

toobasky:
I just want to say finally here that RELIGION isn't the problem its the people who follow them. Heck religion isn't the only thing that divides us now, what of TRIBE, RACE, etc? Why religion is an issue is because it has a large divide of people and this is what is needed to cause mischief in the land by the devil's advocates. Like it or not if there was no religion in the world today, the Devil and its advocates will still use other things to cause mayhem in God's planet earth. So let's stop all these condemnation of religion and focus on the devils advocates using it as a weapon people like that animal called shekau nd others una digg?

You just said it all... Pple commit crime and then they find ways to justify it. Though some pple are busy condeming islam, am not here to do so... Just want to have a better understanding of their religion...

Rich4god:
@Sameera025... You talked about islam been in love with education... But why is it that most islamic nation clamp down on this that brings about a good and better education such as freedom of speech, the use of internet and their likes.

@sameera025: i still need response to this...

sameera025:
There is no ruling on blasphemy mentioned in the quran. My quotes have shown that the quran doesn't support unjust killings either. So the rulings that have been derived on blasphemy have come from people and not the quran. I only support that which is in the quran. Anything else is unislamic.

More quotes:
…Let not a people’s enmity incite you to act otherwise than with justice. Be always just, that is nearer to righteousness… (Ch.5:V.9)

But Islam does not only condemn the blaspheming of God. It also protects the feelings of polytheists, by forbidding Muslims from attacking their idols. On this point, the Holy Qur’an states:

And revile not those whom they call upon beside Allah, lest they, out of spite, revile Allah in their ignorance.… (Ch.6:V.109)

In other words, Islam teaches Muslims to be sensitive to the sensibilities of others—no matter how strongly they disagree with them. The implication of this verse is that if it is not permitted for Muslims to slander false idols, it certainly cannot be permissible for Muslims to defile other sects within Islam or other religions.

http://www.reviewofreligions.org/5002/what-is-the-punishment-for-blasphemy-in-islam/#sthash.Y9uTSiSF.dpuf

Deducing from your statement, can I conclude that the version of islam countries like Nigeria, Saudia, Pakistan, Afgan and co practice is an adultrated type of Islam and not the one passed down by the prophet.

AgentOfAllah:
They have failed to call their people to order? Listen to what you're saying. You're Nigerian, I presume? So how many crime peddling 419 Nigerians have you called to order for their crimes? How many times have you gone out to protest the criminality of Nigerians that give Nigeria a bad name? You need to be realistic with your demands, and stop pontificating.

It is the responsibility of the law to deal with anybody who commits a crime. I don't expect you to call your 419 Nigerian brother to order, and I am not angry at you if you wish not to take responsibility for a crime you haven't committed either.

Now take a look at your comment and carefully analyze it so that you can see the loop holes...
If someone is into 419, he or she is doing so for his own personal gain and the police force are there to call him to order cos its their duty and that of the govt. And yes, if the person is your brother/frnd, its your civic duty to explain to the person about the dangers of his actions. If police raid a kidnappers den and you are found among them, you still have to answer your way out on what you are doing there at that moment. Thats why we need to dissociate ourslf frm bad gangs.... Same way true muslims shld try and dissociate themselves from bad muslims.

Now when a person decides to commit crime in the name of his religion, its the duty of his religion leaders to caution him, condem his act and deter others from doing same. Believe me, if there used to be a rally across the muslims world condeming such attacks, the number of new recruits joining terrorist cells will drop with a significant number. Why is it that in a country like ours, anytime there is a form of dialogue against violence, all religion leaders are invited. Cos they have a big role to play in controling the mind of their follower.

AgentOfAllah:
Yes, we may also excuse the fact that they went on rampage massacring Many innocent Jews and Muslims in the process. Not to dwell much on that, what I find especially astounding is that you are perfectly willing to excuse the crimes of the crusaders (who killed in the name of their god) because they were responding to perceived injustices from the Muslims in the middle east (a political reality at the time), yet, you're unyielding when I propose that many Muslims are now doing the same in light of current political realities that make Western powers come across as oppressive. Did you read the article I shared of Karen Armstrong? It's here (http://www.salon.com/2014/11/23/karen_armstrong_sam_harris_anti_islam_talk_fills_me_with_despair/) if you missed it the first time. It puts a lot of things in perspective.

To be clear, I do not excuse any of the groups. I'm just putting things in perspective for you, as you seem to miss my point.

Gosh... Am not excluding their sins... Its like accusing Nigerian Army of killing innocents citizens know fully well that they were caught in the cross fire. Get my point, if islamic jihadist didnt provoke pple, there wont have been crusade... Same way if BH didnt start this insurgency, the north east wont have been a ghost states by now.

When you talk about western power oppressiveness, if taliban and co attack US military function during war, no one calls that a terrorist... But when you go out, attacking and killing pple of your own in the name of religion jst because they have a different religion orientation, then, its a no no...

sameera025:
The quran says:
"...If anyone kills a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he killed all people. And if anyone saves a life, it would be as if he saved the life of all people" (Qur'an 5:32).
And
"...Take not life, which God has made sacred, except by way of justice and law. Thus does He command you, so that you may learn wisdom" (6:151)

Anyone who doesn't adhere to this is not following the rulings of the Quran.

If I get you right, the koran condems the killing of someone who desecrated the koran or abused the propet...?

Now, some muslims countries have what we call blasphemy law wch issues a death penalty to pple who fall short of the law. So many pple have fallen victim to this law in middle east esp...

Now, these laws are been uphelp by islamic scholars of the country and the muslims all rally around to ensure that the offender faces the penalty. Now if am to deduce logically, does it mean that the muslims in those country are practicing anoda brand of islam...?

@agentofallah... This is an example that i have pointed earlier on... There is an on going protest in turkey, condenming charlie hebdo latest cover picture... But how come there have not been an outright condemnation of the Yemeni branch of al qaeda that just claimed responsibility for the attack.

AgentOfAllah:
Listen mate, I'm the wrong person to aim your vile questions at. I can list as many things in the bible that makes the Christian holy text just as violent as the Quran, but that's not my problem today. Somebody is trying to start a sane interfaith dialogue, so you're expected to reciprocate with a sense of decorum, not hurling provocative nonsense and demanding answers. Neither Sameera025 nor myself owe you an answer or an apology. Feel free to bask in your retrogressive, belligerent mind set. You're not my cup of tea!

plz, i did expect you to have ignored that comment for now...

I want to let you knw that all religions have pretty much bad pple including xtianity, but its the way the general body handle the bad ones that matters. Pple are annoyed against muslims, not because all muslims are bad, but because they have failed to call their pple to order.

sameera025:
If you scroll up you will see that I corrected the fabricated verses. They were very inaccurate. I will never turn down an opportunity to give the correct message.

plz, i still have some pending questions that you have not answered... I tagged you in them... Will be waiting...

AgentOfAllah:
I'm not having this discussion with you. Go read a little bit on history of the Crusades. In the process, thousands of innocent Jews and Muslims were massacred.

o common... Even the link you gave made it clear that the first crusade was in response to bynzantine emperor call for help against the islamic jihadist... What else do you want to hear...

Alfranco:
The Crusades? People should research why the Crusaders were at war. Besides we've past the dark ages of 1090s to about 1100 Crusades. This is 21st Century where religious strife of any kind cannot be justified. And what has innocent folks of Nigeria in black Africa got to do with that in modern day?

Forget dark ages or... The crusade was in retaliation of what the islamic jihadist were doing to the holy land.

AgentOfAllah:
You're wrong! George Bush justified one of the greatest tragedies of modern history in the name of his god in the name of his god . Yet he invaded the middle east purely for political reasons. The crusaders of yesteryears, remember them? They also committed their crimes in the name of their lord. The Buddhists of Myanmar, they murder Muslims in the name of their religion.

I dont knw when bush justified his war act by claiming it was God who sent him...
Dont even talk abt the crusades, cos it was as a direct consequence of the islamic war against the holy land and other christian countries... Though i knw that at a time it went out of way, but i believe that if islamic worriors didnt start taking over pples land and forcing them to convert, there wont have been any crusade.

sameera025:
This thread was meant to be a peaceful one for me to have civil discussions with my Christian neighbors who have questions about Islam. I opened up my story and have answered a number of questions but I think at this point it has just turned into a thread of insults. I would just like to say one last time that Islam and terrorism is different. Islam teaches peace. Most of us (note that 1.7 billion muslims in the world) believe in peace. To answer the question about the quran being burnt or my prophet being insulted, it makes me unhappy but not angry and violent for I know that this world is but temporary and the best punishment can only come from God. The prophet (saw) spoke of the khawarj "rebels", "terrorists" and called them the dogs of hell fire. Thank you Rich4God and AgentofAllah for your polite discussions. We can use an alternate means of discussing without all the distractions from those who are merely here to insult.

You can continue the discussion by ignoring comments you deemed insultive.

btoks:
Happy new year all.I trust it's been a wonderful start for all.May this year and beyond bring us even more joy.May we continue to trust in the Lord Jesus and love others as he commanded us.God bless.

Wish you same my brother...

AgentOfAllah:
When I was a Muslim, I wrote an article thanking Terry Jones, that American pastor who threatened to hold a mass Quran burning rally, for putting more money in the hands of Quran printers. Crucially, I never for once, imagined the pastor's inciting threats represented the views of other Christians. So even if Sameera claims she'll react violently, I don't see why that should be an objective gauge of Islam anymore than Terry Jones should be an objective gauge of Christianity.

Maybe the question you really should ask is: What point is anybody who threatens to burn a religious text of another religion trying to make? It comes across as exceptionally hypocritical when you claim you're a pacifist.

Nice write up... But note this... There are as bad pple in Islam as there are in Christianity and other religion. But do you knw the diff... Its only in islam that the bad guys kills in the name of their religion. Pastor terry never said God asked him to burn the koran and even at that, there were immediate condemnation is his action by pple around the US and outside. But take a look at what ISIS, BH, Al Qaeda, Al Shabab... All have one thing in coming, killing in the name of Islam. Asari Dakubo is a muslim, but never for once has he been termed an Islamic terrorist/militant. Cos what he attack his men are carryn out, he doesnt do it in the name of Islam.

Hope say they wont deliver it to BH like they do with some of our armoury... Anyway, goodluck to them in the fight... Victory is sure for Nigeria...

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