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#teamASA/9icealtheway....... Oda artistes na longtin

Adonbilivit

M

Gay alert

GEJ come hear dis one ooooo

K

What else do u expect?? Our presido isn't a clueless man

Annunaki:
Go and ask the jehovah witness and deeper life were they learnt their doctrines from

..... Ok

Samunique:
Brother pls, make sure u always do your research properly before u come to a forum like this for discussion!!!

You know why?

JW, Deeper life and Catholic use musical instruments.
Pls get your facts right, go to JW.org and download their hymns.


Meanwhile @ concerning the way they prayed in the Bible:

I know your arguement is that some people prayed with their faces on the ground?

Good, the question is did they do so according to divine injunction bidding on them that they must worship God that way? The answer is NO.

It will be very hypocritical of us to concentrate on their "positioning" while living aside other ritualistic aspects that constitute the completeness of their worship as far as OT worship is concern.

So for u to consentrate only on " they fell with their faces on the ground" as a mode of worship in the Bible and living behind the complete pattern and ordinances that accompanied entirety of their worship like singing "praises" to God and other ritualstic aspects, is not only half-baked but malicious and misleading, maybe u are doing that to justify the Islamic way of worship but i tell u, it's like comparing white and black, they have no similarity!!!

Pls go and study the book of exodus and numbers.

Concerning NT worship, Jesus told us clearly how to worship God.

John 4:23-24, But the hour cometh, and NOW is, when the true worshipers shall worship the father in "spirit" and in truth: for the father seeketh such to worship Him.
For God is a spirit: and they that worship Him must worship Him in spirit and in truth.

For the use of musical instruments and singing pls read Psalm 100, 150, Rev 14: 2-3.

Note: If your are not yet satisfied, then u will have to tell us where God/Jesus in the Bible specifically passed an injunction that we should worship/pray, "falling down with our faces on the ground.

Remain blessed bro!!!

............ Well, we are all learning.... I don't mean to denigrate any religion here. The choice is yours. You can choose to serve anything you feel like. I only told you what I know and it was not intended to defame or bring down any religion.....

dolphinheart:
Bro , first of all, ur question on singing and use of instrument is different from your question on how jesus prayed. Worship and praise are two different things though praise can be termed as a form or part of worship.

On the use of instrument in a religious gathering .- one of the initial statements I made when replying you on this is that churches today have different ways, means and process of offering praise through the use of musical instruments, and that you should not lump up all christians mode of praise based on the one you have seen . The bible should be used as a guide to determine if a particular church method is right or wrong.

I then told you that using musical intruments is not wrong cus the bible showed us that other prophets of God used it, it was used in the temple, and even God had a say in the arrangement of music and musical instruments in his worship.
I told you that is is not said that jesus used musical instruments, but we know that he and his disciples sang. We also know that his apostles used to sing as part of their worship to God. The use of instrument is used in the future to sing praises to God in heaven as used in the past, these shows that it is not wrong to use it in the present.
But how do you use it in the present- you use it with modesty, respect and humility, bearing in mind the importance or what you are doing.

God does not like this form of worship1)when you use musical instruments and sing to God without considering others in the area.
(2) when you use musical instruments and sing in a way that portray worldly methods and ideas
(3) when you use musical instruments and sing in a way that shows you are more concerned about the effect of the instruments and the voice of the singer(s) than the actual praise .

I did this explanation is such a way that you can now go back and look at the different church mode of praise again and see if they follow guidelines. So that you can assess them individually.

I dnt know why they used korede Bello but I can tell you that God will not listen to someones praise and worship more than another person just because that someone has a better voice Bro.

On question that relates to how jesus prayed, jesus did not always pray with his face to the ground. Pls note the word always . In the old days, people normally worship by putting there face to the ground towards the one they are worshiping, even pagans and idol worshipers do that too. But the bible did not give a direct order on how to position ourself during prayer, but rather layed emphasis on what you should pray about and the purpose of ur prayer. Its the heart condition that God looks at and not ur physical position or the distance between ur head and the ground.

............ Access them individually to know who is doing it right or wrong? Noted!...... How come Jehovah Witness, Deeper Lifers, Catholic churches do not use musical instruments? Could we say they read a different version of the bible which is supposed to pass one message across to all Christians

Annunaki:
This is how Jesus taught us to pray and there is no mention of falling on the face like muslims and pagans do there.



Matthew 6:5-16

Prayer
5 “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. 7 And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. 8 Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

9 “This, then, is how you should pray:

“‘Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,
10 your kingdom come,
your will be done,
    on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us today our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts,
    as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation,[a]
    but deliver us from the evil one.[b]’
14 For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.

....... Pardon my manners, I know about the lord's prayer..... What are the sources of the aforementioned quotes as said by Jesus If its the bible, where is it......... Proof that prophets/servants of God/Messengers who came before and after Jesus fell on their face and prayed..................................................................................... "And he (Jesus) went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt." - New Testament (Matthew 26:39)
 
"And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid." - New Testament (Matthew 17:6)
 
"And Abram fell on his face: and God talked with him, saying," - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Genesis 17:3)
 
"Then Abraham fell upon his face, and laughed, and said in his heart, Shall a child be born unto him that is an hundred years old? and shall Sarah, that is ninety years old, bear?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Genesis 17:17)
 
"And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped." - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Exodus 34:
 
“And Moses and Aaron went from the presence of the assembly unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, and they fell upon their faces: and the glory of the LORD appeared unto them.” - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Numbers 20:6)
 
"And the LORD spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying, Separate yourselves from among this congregation, that I may consume them in a moment. And they fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of the spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt thou be wroth with all the congregation?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Numbers 16:20-22)
 
And Ezra blessed the LORD, the great God. And all the people answered, Amen, Amen, with lifting up their hands: and they bowed their heads, and worshipped the LORD with [their] faces to the ground. - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Nehemiah 8:6)
 
"And he said, Nay; but as captain of the host of the LORD am I now come. And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and did worship, and said unto him, What saith my Lord unto his servant?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Joshua 5:14)
 
"And it came to pass, while they were slaying them, and I was left, that I fell upon my face, and cried, and said, Ah Lord GOD! wilt thou destroy all the residue of Israel in thy pouring out of thy fury upon Jerusalem?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Ezekiel 9:
 
"And Jehoshaphat bowed his head with his face to the ground: and all Judah and the inhabitants of Jerusalem fell before the LORD, worshipping the LORD." - Old Testament (Tanakh) (2 Chronicles 20:18)
 
"And it came to pass, when I prophesied, that Pelatiah the son of Benaiah died. Then fell I down upon my face, and cried with a loud voice, and said, Ah Lord GOD! wilt thou make a full end of the remnant of Israel?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Ezekiel 11:13)

dolphinheart:
Bro, seems you are Mixing up ur questions o,question 3 and 4 as asked by you are totally different. and it seems you did not read my reply on singing and use of instrument as it is done then and today.

How can a congregation invite celebrity? To come and do what? To help them sing?
If you have read my post, you would have seen the words humility and modesty, words that a Christian must exhibit in all things, even when singing praise Bro, you do not know how I worship and praise my God, you should not have used the word " you guys".

.......... Brother, you are contradicting yourself! Quite alright I have not seen you worship. Are you kidding me? Are you telling me that the way you call on your God is different from the way Christians call on their God? Why can't I use "you guys"?? Aren't u a christian? They call on celebrities to entertain the congregation when they are bored!!!! We have recently seen churches where some of our celebrities were invited to perform.......Korede performed in a church of late. The thread even made front page... We have also seen churches where comedians were invited to perform.... Acapella is an example!.... I watched it, I was not told.....

dolphinheart:
Bro, seems you are Mixing up ur questions o,question 3 and 4 as asked by you are totally different. and it seems you did not read my reply on singing and use of instrument as it is done then and today.

How can a congregation invite celebrity? To come and do what? To help them sing?
If you have read my post, you would have seen the words humility and modesty, words that a Christian must exhibit in all things, even when singing praise Bro, you do not know how I worship and praise my God, you should not have used the word " you guys".

.......... To entertain the congregation when they are bored!!!! We have recently seen churches where some of our celebrities were invited to perform.......Korede performed in a church of late.... We have also seen churches where comedians were invited to perform.... Acapella is an example!

Samunique:
Bros, I've diligently followed u, and i must commend u that u've done more than enough for these people most especially Teekrayne but he ( they ) are just bent on repeating the old question that has been answer severally to justify their own ways of worship which were pre-islamic pagan practices.

Pls sir, since he insists that we are not worshiping the right way that we must prostrate with our faces on the ground , ask him to show us where in the Bible Jesus specifically ask us to do so, or better still he should show us how Jesus ask us to worship God in the Bible, if he cannot , then i will suggest u forget about the guy.

God bless u sir!!!

......... Buhahahahaahahahah....... Wetin dis one dey talk again? Ehhhen, for your mind now, u don throw punchline How sure are u that he has done justice to my questions Can you show me where it is boldly written in d bible that you should also do the aforementioned? Let me quote the verses for u to know that I am not the so called "guy" you are thinking!!.... All prophets/servants of God/messengers that came before and after Jesus prayed while bowing down/falling on the ground with their face..... It is better for you to belt up and allow the person you are defending to continue with me. Better still, if you want to come into the picture and assist your brother, you are welcome! ...................................................................................."And he (Jesus) went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt." - New Testament (Matthew 26:39)
 
"And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid." - New Testament (Matthew 17:6)
 
"And Abram fell on his face: and God talked with him, saying," - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Genesis 17:3)
 
"Then Abraham fell upon his face, and laughed, and said in his heart, Shall a child be born unto him that is an hundred years old? and shall Sarah, that is ninety years old, bear?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Genesis 17:17)
 
"And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped." - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Exodus 34:
 
“And Moses and Aaron went from the presence of the assembly unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, and they fell upon their faces: and the glory of the LORD appeared unto them.” - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Numbers 20:6)
 
"And the LORD spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying, Separate yourselves from among this congregation, that I may consume them in a moment. And they fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of the spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt thou be wroth with all the congregation?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Numbers 16:20-22)
 
And Ezra blessed the LORD, the great God. And all the people answered, Amen, Amen, with lifting up their hands: and they bowed their heads, and worshipped the LORD with [their] faces to the ground. - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Nehemiah 8:6)
 
"And he said, Nay; but as captain of the host of the LORD am I now come. And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and did worship, and said unto him, What saith my Lord unto his servant?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Joshua 5:14)
 
"And it came to pass, while they were slaying them, and I was left, that I fell upon my face, and cried, and said, Ah Lord GOD! wilt thou destroy all the residue of Israel in thy pouring out of thy fury upon Jerusalem?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Ezekiel 9:
 
"And Jehoshaphat bowed his head with his face to the ground: and all Judah and the inhabitants of Jerusalem fell before the LORD, worshipping the LORD." - Old Testament (Tanakh) (2 Chronicles 20:18)
 
"And it came to pass, when I prophesied, that Pelatiah the son of Benaiah died. Then fell I down upon my face, and cried with a loud voice, and said, Ah Lord GOD! wilt thou make a full end of the remnant of Israel?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Ezekiel 11:13)

Annunaki:
The levites were the priestly class and they had singers and instrumentalist amongst them as far back as the old testament. David is also recorded to dance to worship God.

2 chronicles 5:12
All the Levites who were musicians--Asaph, Heman, Jeduthun and their sons and relatives--stood on the east side of the altar, dressed in fine linen and playing cymbals, harps and lyres. They were accompanied by 120 priests sounding trumpets.

......... How come Jehovah witness and Deeper life shuns using musical instrument Or do they read a different bible? Don't they call on the same God just like other Christians

dolphinheart:
I know that jesus fell with his face to the ground to pray, but never heard of jesus fall to the ground to pray like muslims do . Mt 26:39.

Bowing with there face to the ground have also been done by orientals who worshiped idols before islam .

.......... That doesn't answer my question young man! Did jesus worship(dance, invite celebrities to come and perform, sing, play guitar, piano etc) the way u guys worship now

Demmzy15:
Are you trying to be smart or what? This thread was debunked to the core, let the brother read up everything from page one to the last. Bera be careful o, you guys were whooped up here too https://www.nairaland.com/2464342/muslims-clear-these Bro Teekrayne please visit those links completely, this guys are trying to be smart by repeating already refuted arguments.

......... Ma sha Allah.... I just did. No matter how hard you try to convince them, they'll still come up with bogus stuffs.... Jazakallah khaeran

Demmzy15:
I came to expose your deceit!



Yes after the greatest news of Ishmael, the good news of Isaac was a great news but not as that of Ishmael.



Of course yes, an old woman to give birth at that age is indeed a great miracle.



Supernatural to mean he's a god? Noo, but supernatural that God almighty intervened that his mother became pregnant at that old age. I wouldn't call it supernatural but a miracle. Remember that miracles are God's work to test our faith.



Abraham's only son who was Ishmael at that time. No need to run into stories. It's simple!




Why are you pained?! Ever since we exposed you, you've been emotional. You use jokes and laughing emojis to cover up. Hope everything is alright?!

......... No matter how hard you try to convince them, they'll never objectively accept the truth. I have responded to the thread as regards "the mountains" and I have not received any response from any of them..... Thanks

plainbibletruth:
So what have you said here?
1. Was Abraham promised Isaac ?
2. Was Isaac's conception miraculous by divine intervention?
3. Do these make the circumstances of his birth 'ordinary' or 'supernatural'?
4. If God were to ask Abraham to sacrifice a son which would touch him more - the son of promise or any of his other many sons?

If you're unable to answer you may leave it to others to do.

........ Call a spade a spade! Read u my comments. If you are ready to debate, let me know..... I'll make myself available. All this wouldn't help u

Ayomivic:
God is a supreme being. The Almighty Creator.

The Bible does not contradict itself, it's you that have little knowledge of the scripture.

Do you know that this question you are asking about Jesus being God or not had been asked Jesus himself by Jews when he was on earth? What answer did Jesus gave to them ?I know his answer to that question will be hard for you to believe
let read the verses iam taking about

" i and my father are one. Then the Jew took up the stones again to stone him
Jesus answer them, many good works have i shewed you from my father; for which of those works do you stone me?
The Jews answered him, saying, for a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou being a man ,makest thyself God
Jesus answered them, is it not written in your law, i said, you are gods?
If he called gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken
say you of him, whom the father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, thou blasphemest; because i said, iam the son of God? John 10:30-36


" I have said, you are gods and all of you are children of the Most High" Psalm 82:6

why did God called human being gods?

You and i know that God formed the first man and woman (Adam and Eve) with soil but they have'nt be living being until God breath to thier nosrils the breath of live and he became alive.
God is lmmortal, therefor nothing of him can die, his breath we share from him that is in us cannot die. That is why, if we die it is only our body that decayed ,the soul would return to God, it cannot die. That is why the Bible refers to our body as temple of God.

But in the case of Jesus, his body and soul are pure word of God and the word of God is life. Quran and Bible testified to Jesus being the word of God. When Jesus died,he did not decay in grave like we human being before he rose up to God. God gave birth to Jesus by word not by intercouse. Not only this, God had given Jesus authority over everything he created include us as he made us to have dominion over other things he created as we see it in Genesis1:28-30 and gave him name above all name.

Psalm 138-2 said " I will worship toward thy holy temple and praise thy name for thou hast magnified the word above all the name"

which word does God magnified above all name if not Jesus the word of God?

Or Are you saying that the word of God is not god?

............. 20 SIMPLE REASONS WHY JESUS IS NOT GOD...
•
1- God Doesn’t Change His Nature (Malachi 3:6)
•
2- GOD Almighty is Greater than Jesus. (John 14:28 )
•
3- No one is "Good" including Jesus. Only GOD is" Good" (Luke 18:19)
•
4- Jesus said he doesn't know when the Hour (Judgment Day) will come. Only GOD Knows. (Mark 13:32)
•
5- Jesus said that" OUR God is One GOD" (Mark 12:29 )
•
6- Jesus also said "My GOD and your GOD" (John 20:17)
•
7- Jesus fell on his face down to the ground and prayed to GOD Almighty (like the way Muslim pray to God). (Matthew 26:39)
•
8- Jesus was tempted by Satan for 40 days (Matthew 4:1), while GOD Almighty cannot be tempted (Jacob 1:13)
•
9- Jesus said he is a man (John 8:40)
•
10- God is neither a man nor a son of a man (Numbers 23:19)
•
11- No one can see god (1 John 4:20) but people saw Jesus
•
12- God is the living and everlasting (Habakkuk 1:12)
•
13- Jesus always confessed he is just a prophet sent by God (Matthew 21:10-11)
•
14- God Declare Himself to be God, Jesus didn't (Ezekiel 20:20)
•
15- Jesus told his real mission was to preach not sacrifice (Mark 1:38)
•
16- Jesus desired Mercy not Sacrifice (Matthew 9:13)
•
Jesus referred himself as:
17) - A Servant: Matthew 10:24, 24:45, 12:18 John 13:16
•
18)- A Prophet: Matthew 8:20 13:16,21:11, Mark 6:15, 6;4, 9;37, Luke 7:16, 9:8, 9:19, John 13:17, 7:16, 6:14, 7:40
•
19)- Son of Man: Matthew 5:9, 17:22, 8:20, 18:11, 26:2, Luke 9:22, John 5:27
•
20- Slave: John 13:16, Matthew 10:24

dolphinheart:
BRO, I still dnt understand you o, is my answer correct , in relation to the question you asked ? If its not, can you kindly rephrase the question.

I have not seen ur oppinion on my answers to the other questions. Ill like to hear ur view on my answers.

........... I can only answer the ones I can answer

dolphinheart:
To answer ur question, you have to tell me what muslims recite when they pray, and if such recitation can be in any language

Modified: scratch the above. I misunderstood ur post. But pls can you expanciate on what you mean by jesus praying the way muslims do?

......... I repeat, I said I only used "muslims" for u to understand my question......

Annunaki:
Meaning islamic praying method is copied from the pagans.

............ Ok!

malvisguy212:
lies, the hadith say and I quote:

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60,
Number 23:
... “We used to consider
(i.e. going around) them a custom
of the Pre-Islamic period of
Ignorance, SO WHEN ISLAM CAME, we
gave up going around them..

They have been performing safa between marwa and tawaf long BEFORE islam came,the people know ,this ritual belongs to the pagan, so they are confused , here is muhammed answer:

Then Allah revealed, ‘Verily, Safa and
Marwa (i.e. two mountains at
Mecca) ARE AMONG THE SYMBOL OF ALLAH . So it is not harmful of those who perform the Hajj of the House (of Allah) or perform the Umra to
ambulate (Tawaf) between them.’” ( Surah 2:158) [End of Quote]


Surah 2:158: “Lo! (the mountains) As-
Safa and Al-Marwah are among the
indications of Allah. It is therefore no
sin for him who is on pilgrimage to
the House (of Allah) or visiteth it, to
go around them ( as the pagan
custom is).” (Pickthall)

The only explanation you need to do is " how is this very same ritual which the pagan do become a symbol of Allah ?

........ If you need clarification, let's know. You mustn't call someone a liar before proving your point......

truthman2012:
I doubt if any of them will attempt them. They run away from such questions, pretending they have answered them before in another thread. Lie! To give a link to the thread, they cannot.

........ Do you think you just made some sense?....... What's the question and let's hear..... Is everyone as jobless as you are Sleeping on Nairaland?

jcross19:
I love this discovery and is going to open a mind of those who want the truth to reason very well. Islamic clerics please we need your attention!!!!!!!!!
Kudos to you bro.

............. We are here! We are just trying to follow the teachings of (Proverb 26:4) that says we shouldn't answer a fool, so that we don't look like a fool as well....... And another one says we should answer a fool for a fool to know that he/she is a fool....... What baffles me most is that some people do not know and they don't know that they don't know.... You think we are that jobless? Please do us a favour! Do sort out the contradictions in the bible and call on us if you are ready to objectively debate..... Then and until then we'll shed more light on your "self-created" verse of the Qur'an. .... Peace be upon you all.

Annunaki:
Pagans have always prayed with their face facing the east like muslims do.

Ezikiel 8:16
He then brought me into the inner court of the house of the LORD, and there at the entrance to the temple, between the portico and the altar, were about twenty-five men. With their backs toward the temple of the LORD and their faces toward the east, they were bowing down to the sun in the east.

........ Meaning that?

lexiconkabir:
salamualaikum bro, the word there should be JINN not angel

........... Wa alaikum salam warahmatullah......... Jazakallahu khaeran..... Am grateful bro.

INJESUSNAME:
No. Jesus prayed not like muslims; Jesus did not face mecca, He never recited what the muslims recite. He had authority and power over satan and his demons as they are always trembling at His presence. Even when Jesus sent His disciples out to preach, He gave them power over evil spirit, and they were able to cast out demons in Jesus name. muslims alway mention satan when they start prayers and they raise their hands, bow and sit on the floor several times. Jesus never did that or teach His followers to do it.

........ Thank you very much @INJESUSNAME....... Let me quickly clarify your doubt as regards the issue of muslims mentioning satan's name when they pray. They not only do it when they want to pray, but they mention it every now and then to avoid temptation from satan; the accursed! Hear what they say.... "Authu billah mina Shaytan(satan) rajeem...... Meaning.... "I SEEK REFUGE FROM SHAYTAN(SATAN) THE ACCURSED" .... Satan is very nefarious in nature! Satan wants everyone to go astray; he wants to distract you in everything you do, hence making muslims seek refuge from his temptation here and there. Do you get it now?........ My question is this! Is there a proof in the bible that the disciples of jesus christ prayed in his name to cast out demons?.... No. 2, is there a proof in the bible that corroborates the fact that christians should pray using "in jesus name"?..... If just like the bible says that jesus fell on his face to the ground and pray(not like the muslims anyways), why do christians employ the use of musical instruments during their services? I have never come accross it that jesus played any musical instrument......

dolphinheart:
I know that jesus fell with his face to the ground to pray, but never heard of jesus fall to the ground to pray like muslims do . Mt 26:39.

Bowing with there face to the ground have also been done by orientals who worshiped idols before islam .

.......... Perhaps my question was not clear enough! I never meant to say he prayed like muslims by reciting what muslims recite when they are about to pray. I only used "muslims" for you to understand my question. Do you get it?