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Cherophobia- The Fear Of Happiness. / Money And Happiness / Happiness And Emptiness (2) (3) (4)

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Re: -- by spendogram: 8:58am On Sep 04, 2012
@Kobo,
truly,no one size fits all. However, there are certain things that can instantly increase or reduce happiness. e.g a person that can not afford to feed himself but who must depend on others about 5 out of 7 days in a week will have his happiness increased if other things in his life remain the same and in addition he can now feed himself at least 6 out of 7 days. Furthermore we can also take an example of a person who suddenly suffers a life threatening disease. He will have his happiness temporarily reduced. The only way to bring his level of happiness up is to increase some other things that also give him happiness. Another example: If you move from an environment where there is gross insecurity to an environment where he feels safe,if all other things remain the same you will notice that your happiness level will increase.

Some years back I actually made for myself a happiness index. I measure myself against it so as to know when I am derailing.Also, to find ways of increasing each of the factors therein.

@OP,
Feeling that you are in a secure environment is not on your list.
Re: -- by Kobojunkie: 11:57am On Sep 04, 2012
spendogram: @Kobo,
truly,no one size fits all. However, there are certain things that can instantly increase or reduce happiness. e.g a person that can not afford to feed himself but who must depend on others about 5 out of 7 days in a week will have his happiness increased if other things in his life remain the same and in addition he can now feed himself at least 6 out of 7 days.
What you describe above is not true happiness, but a sense of accomplishment, not to be confused with happiness. Also, it is possible to be happy even when you have to depend on others for 24/7 for your survival. True happiness transcends whatever situation you find yourself in, in life.

spendogram:
Furthermore we can also take an example of a person who suddenly suffers a life threatening disease. He will have his happiness temporarily reduced. The only way to bring his level of happiness up is to increase some other things that also give him happiness. Another example: If you move from an environment where there is gross insecurity to an environment where he feels safe,if all other things remain the same you will notice that your happiness level will increase.
Some years back I actually made for myself a happiness index. I measure myself against it so as to know when I am derailing.Also, to find ways of increasing each of the factors therein.

All your examples are of the fickle feel-good feelings people usually use to mask their lack of true happiness It is possible to be deathly sick and still be happy . . . . Happiness does not come in the environment you moved to or the bottle of whiskey on your kitchen shelf.

Let me share my personal experience here. I have experienced true happiness and what I have experienced is not based on anything I do, or feel or see or taste or touch.

True happiness is a choice made every single second of the day. A choice to rejoice even when going through life's hell. A choice to be glad, especially when you are faced with a battle you know you are likely not going to win. A choice to be happy when all your friends choose to abandon you, especially in your time of need. It is a choice to accept that report that you may never use your limb again. True happiness is found in the choices you make, not to do things but to be happy every through life's circumstances. I have been never been able to measure it and I don't think I ever want to do that and I would not even know how to. Being happy and at peace . . . the best feeling, I believe, in the whole wide world. Not boasting, but it replaces all other feelings perfectly.
Re: -- by spendogram: 3:02pm On Sep 04, 2012
Kobojunkie:
What you describe above is not true happiness, but a sense of accomplishment, not to be confused with happiness. Also, it is possible to be happy even when you have to depend on others for 24/7 for your survival. True happiness transcends whatever situation you find yourself in, in life.
While

While the bolded sounds nice. It doesn't work so practically. Accepting your fate is not the same as being happy. Also,you may have overlooked that I mentioned "If all other things remain the same." True,you may be happy even if you depend on others 24/7 but the happiness is derived from other sources.Such sources are not necessarily material.In some cases it may just be hope of a good afterlife. Whichever way you look at it it is always about what you think you are getting out of life.

You have never felt the need to measure your happiness. Some people too have never felt the need to mention how many children they have. They say "You don't count children for their parents". In my opinion, everything is measurable so long we have attained the level of civilization and have the right technologies to do so.

Importantly,there is no human being whose happiness remains the same irrespective of the situation. Some people just chose to accept their fate with a hope that in the future life or death will bring higher happiness. Others have their happiness level drop so much and so fast that they commit suicide as they feel life isn't worth living anymore.
Re: -- by Kobojunkie: 10:43pm On Sep 04, 2012
spendogram:
While

While the bolded sounds nice. It doesn't work so practically. Accepting your fate is not the same as being happy. Also,you may have overlooked that I mentioned "If all other things remain the same." True,you may be happy even if you depend on others 24/7 but the happiness is derived from other sources.Such sources are not necessarily material.In some cases it may just be hope of a good afterlife. Whichever way you look at it it is always about what you think you are getting out of life.

If you read up all religious literature that speaks to you of happiness, you will find that one thing they all have in common is that in describing/defining happiness, you will find that each literary work does not attempt to tie happiness to material world or to any circumstance in the lives of the characters in the books. Each time happiness is addressed it is described as coming from within the persons.

I can tell you that what you are doing is what many people do, conclude that what you have never experienced is impractically even before really experiencing it. Happiness has absolutely nothing to do with accepting fate. On the contrary it is what you need to believe your current situation is just a phase.

The only source of happiness you need is yourself. It comes from within.

spendogram:
You have never felt the need to measure your happiness. Some people too have never felt the need to mention how many children they have. They say "You don't count children for their parents". In my opinion, everything is measurable so long we have attained the level of civilization and have the right technologies to do so.

Why in the world would you measure what comes from within you? I mean do you measure your hunger index? Do you measure your breathing index? Your love index? I just do not see the gain in engaging in such vain exercise.

I don't think you should compare your claim that you measure your happiness index with peoples paranoid delusions. That does not fit anywhere in this discussion.
spendogram:
Importantly,there is no human being whose happiness remains the same irrespective of the situation. Some people just chose to accept their fate with a hope that in the future life or death will bring higher happiness. Others have their happiness level drop so much and so fast that they commit suicide as they feel life isn't worth living anymore.

That you keep bringing up fate when talking of happiness, leads me to believe you probably have never experienced true happiness . . what you have experienced is likely what the fickle emotions that are tied, again, to material world. I don't it is reasonable to make CONCLUSIVE statements of what you are obviously not experienced in.
Re: -- by spendogram: 12:07pm On Sep 05, 2012
@kobojunkie,
Kobojunkie:

If you read up all religious literature that speaks to you of happiness, you will find that one thing they all have in common is that in describing/defining happiness, you will find that each literary work does not attempt to tie happiness to material world or to any circumstance in the lives of the characters in the books. Each time happiness is addressed it is described as coming from within the persons.
I can tell you that what you are doing is what many people do, conclude that what you have never experienced is impractically even before really experiencing it. Happiness has absolutely nothing to do with accepting fate. On the contrary it is what you need to believe your current situation is just a phase.


The only source of happiness you need is yourself. It comes from within.

Why in the world would you measure what comes from within you? I mean do you measure your hunger index? Do you measure your breathing index? Your love index? I just do not see the gain in engaging in such vain exercise.

I don't think you should compare your claim that you measure your happiness index with peoples paranoid delusions. That does not fit anywhere in this discussion.

That you keep bringing up fate when talking of happiness, leads me to believe you probably have never experienced true happiness . . what you have experienced is likely what the fickle emotions that are tied, again, to material world. I don't it is reasonable to make CONCLUSIVE statements of what you are obviously not experienced in.

Which religion?Did you not read that God was unhappy when he saw how ungodly human behaviors became? Did you not read that God was happy when Noah offered a sacrifice after the flood and then decided never again to completely wipe off the human race? Did those emotions not emanate from the situations at the time? I have used God so that you can see that your theory does not have any basis even in the Abrahamic religions. Now, which character in any religion had his /her happiness unchanged in all situations. Please give examples if you can find one.I will like us to examine such together.

Truly, I agree that that happiness comes from within.However,it is dependent on your interaction with the world.

YOU do not see the gain in engaging in such measurements but some other humans do in fact believe that it should be measured.In fact some other stuffs that are much more hideous are also measured.It is all about whether you believe in systematization or not. Those of us who believe in systematization believe we are happier than those who don't.We in fact believe that those who shy away from it are like ostriches burying their heads in the sands. Even in religion it is always easier to say "i believe in God". But you see that you are always required to do things outside mere assertions to "prove" it.

I am happily married and it will remain so because I can easily hear the alarm if a threshold is about to be breached.

My observation:
You think certain things are too hideous to be measured. I think everything can be systematized.

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Re: -- by miredia(m): 4:25pm On Sep 05, 2012
What kobojunkie described is identified as peace. Happiness is subtle bustling. Peace is tranquil. Man is rarely or almost never happy in the midst of turmoil but can be at peace even in the most boisterous circumstances of life. Do not mistake happiness for peace.
Re: -- by spendogram: 4:30pm On Sep 05, 2012
miredia: What kobojunkie described is identified as peace. Happiness is subtle bustling. Peace is tranquil. Man is rarely or almost never happy in the midst of turmoil but can be at peace even in the most boisterous circumstances of life. Do not mistake happiness for peace.

Thank you so much. That has been my exact point all along.I just love your summary.
Re: -- by Kobojunkie: 5:19pm On Sep 05, 2012
miredia: What kobojunkie described is identified as peace. Happiness is subtle bustling. Peace is tranquil. Man is rarely or almost never happy in the midst of turmoil but can be at peace even in the most boisterous circumstances of life. Do not mistake happiness for peace.

I don't believe that is what I have described so far. If anything I have described peace AND contentment. TRUE Happiness itself IS peace, and contentment. So, it is possible to be happy even in the midst of turmoil given that it is possible to have peace even in the midst of turmoil.

If that subtle bustling feeling can in some way be tied to an EXPERIENCE, or your current environment, then you can rarely ever be happy in turmoil. However, if that feeling is independent of what you experience, then it is possible to be happy even in the midst of turmoil.

Again, True happiness is peace and contentment. And you do not need material things to have that.
Re: -- by miredia(m): 6:20pm On Sep 05, 2012
Kobojunkie:

I don't believe that is what I have described so far. If anything I have described peace AND contentment. TRUE Happiness itself IS peace, and contentment. So, it is possible to be happy even in the midst of turmoil given that it is possible to have peace even in the midst of turmoil.

If that subtle bustling feeling can in some way be tied to an EXPERIENCE, or your current environment, then you can rarely ever be happy in turmoil. However, if that feeling is independent of what you experience, then it is possible to be happy even in the midst of turmoil.

Again, True happiness is peace and contentment. And you do not need material things to have that.
I'll try one more time to explain. Peace equates to rest. Happiness equates to elation. This rather disturbing example should encapsulate my theory. No human will be HAPPY watching his 8yr old daughter being sexually abused but he can possibly have peace. Happiness is subjective to events, certain events or circumstances can heighten or decelerate ur happiness. Peace on the other hand can thrive irrespective of how tempestous situation gets. In summary,Pls kobo, there is no such thing as true happiness sweetheart, since feigned happiness was never happiness.
Re: -- by mrprolifeeq(m): 9:39pm On Sep 06, 2012
/p2woCJ-O something useful too.
Re: -- by fitnesslover1(m): 12:50am On Sep 22, 2012
awesome post

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