My purpose of opening this thread is not to argue like the other threads but i want to learn the truth about tithe personally, just me alone. Pls i dont want intruders. I hereby invite Frosbel, goshen 360, pastor kun and others who are on the tithe emancipation campaign to answer my questions about tithe one after the other while jot down vital point that could be beneficial to me. Pls it is only the anti-tithers i need here ok.

If this question is elaborately answered by them, i will proceed to the next and so on. Mine is just to ask questions and nothing more. Now i start first by this question

1. What is tithe and how did it started?.

The first man that pay tithe was abraham go and read book of genesis.

omoayeni1: The first man that pay tithe was abraham go and read book of genesis.

Pls i dnt want spurious, celerous, random and haphazard answers like the one u just gave. I want clear, lucid, explicite, intelligible and clear-headed answers free from vagueness, mendacity, perfidiousness, crudity and obfuscation.

I think you have to ruminate on my first post before commenting. Thanks

Let me just ask all the questions i have 4 you guys to save your time. I have already asked question one in my first post. Let me continue.

2. What is pre-law and tithing in the law?
3. How was tithing done in the old testament?
4. Is there any difference you
u noticed between tithing in the bible and the one being
practiced now?
5. Does malachi 3:8-12 support tithing?
6. Does matthew 23:23 support the tithe teaching in the new testament?
7. Who is mechizedec in the bible?
8.what is Hebrew 7 all about? Is it supporting tithing?
9. Does tithing negate the message of grace? how?
10. If we are sons of Abraham by faith, and Abraham pay tithe does that not imply that we should pay tithe?
11. Does anyone who doesn't pay tithe a robber?
12. How can the work of God move on without tithing?
13. How did the bible suggest we should give?
14. Is it tithing that brings about God's blessing or what?

I want clear answer to the above questions one after the other. If i am convince beyond doubt i will join the tithe emancipation crusade. Thanks.

@goshen360, where art thou? Seriously following!!!

I am still waiting?

I really this answers here for myself only

It seems like they ar nt around o

Seems Anti-tithers are nt in d house again o

^ Any of us can attend to your questions when ready.

Goshen360: ^ Any of us can attend to your questions when ready.

i wud be glad to know the totality of this tithe thing that is preached every sunday in church. I need to be convinced first b4 i join ur crusade . I nid answers to those basic questions.

Why all the tithe recycling? All of those questions have already been answered by the same guys you call out and more. It is obvious that you are a pro-tither hence you want to start the argument all over again! SMH

Those guys have given us 1 Million and one reasons why tithing is not for Christians. If you want to continue.. Na your money! the choice is yours.

Next thread please!

Ukuts gp: My purpose of opening this thread is not to argue like the other threads but i want to learn the truth about tithe personally, just me alone. Pls i dont want intruders. I hereby invite Frosbel, goshen 360, pastor kun and others who are on the tithe emancipation campaign to answer my questions about tithe one after the other while jot down vital point that could be beneficial to me. Pls it is only the anti-tithers i need here ok.

If this question is elaborately answered by them, i will proceed to the next and so on. Mine is just to ask questions and nothing more. Now i start first by this question

1. What is tithe and how did it started?.

Sorry I am just seeing this thread else I would have responded earlier. Tithes started as an ancient babylonian custom which was also practised in Egypt. (You may wish to google "babylonian tithe" to learn more about it). It is quite instructive that the first man who was recorded to have tithed in the bible(Abraham) came from the land of Ur in babylonian so we can safely conclude that he tithed based on the customs of his people then and not as a religious obligation. Of course we know that the babylonian civilization preceded the Jewish nation bt thousands of years.

2. What is pre-law and tithing in the law?

Pre-law tithing can be said to be tithing based on the local customs of that time as the babylonians and Egytians both of whom pre dated the Jews and had heavy influence on them are recorded to have practised tithing long before the Jews. And their tithing was mostly given to Kings or local rulers. In the case of Melchizedek he was given tithes becos he was the King of Salem.

Whilst Law tithing is tithing as instructed by God in Deut 14:22-29

Deuteronomy 14:22-29

22 Be sure to set aside a tenth of all that your fields produce each year. 23 Eat the tithe of your grain, new wine and olive oil, and the firstborn of your herds and flocks in the presence of the Lord your God at the place he will choose as a dwelling for his Name, so that you may learn to revere the Lord your God always. 24 But if that place is too distant and you have been blessed by the Lord your God and cannot carry your tithe (because the place where the Lord will choose to put his Name is so far away), 25 then exchange your tithe for silver, and take the silver with you and go to the place the Lord your God will choose. 26 Use the silver to buy whatever you like: cattle, sheep, wine or other fermented drink, or anything you wish. Then you and your household shall eat there in the presence of the Lord your God and rejoice. 27 And do not neglect the Levites living in your towns, for they have no allotment or inheritance of their own.

28 At the end of every three years, bring all the tithes of that year’s produce and store it in your towns, 29 so that the Levites (who have no allotment or inheritance of their own) and the foreigners, the fatherless and the widows who live in your towns may come and eat and be satisfied, and so that the Lord your God may bless you in all the work of your hands.

Kindly note that even this law tithing requested by God is totally different from the scam/sham preached today as God's tithe.

3. How was tithing done in the old testament?

Tithing was done in the old testament as instructed in the deuteronomy passage above.

4. Is there any difference you
u noticed between tithing in the bible and the one being
practiced now?

Question should be is there any similarity between biblical tithes and what is practised now. The answer is a resounding NO. Tithing practised now is totally different from the scriptural type and was only derived by fraudulently manipulating the biblical version to arrive at the sham preached as tithes today.

5. Does malachi 3:8-12 support tithing?
6. Does matthew 23:23 support the tithe teaching in the new testament?

Yes Malachi 3:8-12 supports tithing according to the law, however christians are not under the law so it's not applicable to us. Whilts in Matthew 23:23 Jesus was also speaking about tithes with regards to the law. He was addressing those who were under the law and christians don't fall into this category.

7. Who is mechizedec in the bible?
8.what is Hebrew 7 all about? Is it supporting tithing?

Not much is known about Melchizedek in the bible but he was described as the King of salem and a priest of God. Hebrew 7 was written primarily to express that the priesthood of Jesus was superior to the levitical priesthood and the references to tithes there was just to explain a function of levitical priests. However Hebrews7 makes it clear that the levitical priesthood along with the laws supporting it have been abolished. Since tithing was a law that was meant to support the levitical priesthood, we know it has been abolished with the priesthood.

9. Does tithing negate the message of grace? how?

Yes it completely negates and contradicts the grace gospel because it gives an impression that you have to pay for God's blessings, this is completely against the grace gospel

10. If we are sons of Abraham by faith, and Abraham pay tithe does that not imply that we should pay tithe?

We are not called to emulate Abraham as christians and there several things Abraham did that falls short of what is expected of a christian today. For instance, Abraham lied, committed adultery engaged in animal sacrifices e.t.c should we as christians do all this just becos Abraham did them Also remember that Abraham's tithe was a one off voluntary exercise from goods that weren't even his own as opposed to the mandatory monetary tithe from income being used to fleece believers today

11. Does anyone who doesn't pay tithe a robber

Absolutely no one pays the biblical tithe today and we as christians were never even required to pay it so you can't be a robber for not paying it.

12. How can the work of God move on without tithing?

It would move by free will voluntary givings as taught by the apostles and God is always capable of meeting all the needs of his work without man helping him by twisting scriptures to justify monetary tithe.

13. How did the bible suggest we should give?

We are to give as we purpose in our heart 2 corinthians 9:6
-7

14. Is it tithing that brings about God's blessing or what?

Tithing does not bring any blessing other than deny the grace of the finished works of our lord Jesus Christ.

Demain_man: Why all the tithe recycling? All of those questions have already been answered by the same guys you call out and more. It is obvious that you are a pro-tither hence you want to start the argument all over again! SMH

Those guys have given us 1 Million and one reasons why tithing is not for Christians. If you want to continue.. Na your money! the choice is yours.

Next thread please!

do u think i have time to read those arguments in d other threads? This is my own thread where i want answer to questions without any interferance of those for tithing. This is where i can get clear and lucid answers to my questions on tithe so let it be ok. I ve to see their own side of the debate first and write down some information. Dat is what pastor kun has just done though he just rushed it without breaking down the scripture verse by verse. Anyway i hv picked something from what he wrote up there. The others can add to what he has said.

Ukuts gp: do u think i have time to read those arguments in d other threads? This is my own thread where i want answer to questions without any interferance of those for tithing. This is where i can get clear and lucid answers to my questions on tithe so let it be ok. I ve to see their own side of the debate first and write down some information. Dat is what pastor kun has just done though he just rushed it without breaking down the scripture verse by verse. Anyway i hv picked something from what he wrote up there. The others can add to what he has said.

Thanks for your mature reply. Others would have lambasted me for writing what i did.

I belief the issue of tithe is a simple one. Jesus gave conditions for a man to get save and inherit eternal life and non of those conditions included TITHE. Jesus asked us to substitue all the GOD's commandment with this one, LOVE, which covers everything (Why is TITHE not one of the ten commandments?).

Jesus told us to go out and spread the good news and do miracles in his name. He did not ask us to go and collect TITHE in his name. If tithe was that important he would have said so!

The only time Jesus mentioned tithe was to ridicule the Pharisee that they do things that are not important while leaving important things undone.

It is just like someone admonishing you for sticking to a tradition like breaking of Kolanut if you are of Igbo tribe while leaving the more important things like respect for elders. This is just the analogy i can think of, there are more.

Others will claim they are tithing the Abraham tithe and then their Oga @ the top will use MALACHI tithe to put fear into them

Most people understands the natural law of equal and opposite which is if you give, you will receive. It works for believers and unbelievers alike because it is a law of nature. But please do not substitute TITHE for 'freewill' giving because tithe is legalistic and so it cannot be said to be freewill.

At the end of the day, it is your choice whether you want to continue to be a PHARISEE by paying tithe or you want to be a CHRISTIAN by looking unto Jesus, the Author and Finisher of your faith.

God does not need your money. He owns the whole world you know? God needs you 100%. SALVATION IS FREE. YOU CAN'T BUY IT

Demain_man:

Thanks for your mature reply. Others would have lambasted me for writing what i did.

I belief the issue of tithe is a simple one. Jesus gave conditions for a man to get save and inherit eternal life and non of those conditions included TITHE. Jesus asked us to substitue all the GOD's commandment with this one, LOVE, which covers everything (Why is TITHE not one of the ten commandments?).

Jesus told us to go out and spread the good news and do miracles in his name. He did not ask us to go and collect TITHE in his name. If tithe was that important he would have said so!

The only time Jesus mentioned tithe was to ridicule the Pharisee that they do things that are not important while leaving important things undone.

It is just like someone admonishing you for sticking to a tradition like breaking of Kolanut if you are of Igbo tribe while leaving the more important things like respect for elders. This is just the analogy i can think of, there are more.

Others will claim they are tithing the Abraham tithe and then their Oga @ the top will use MALACHI tithe to put fear into them

Most people understands the natural law of equal and opposite which is if you give, you will receive. It works for believers and unbelievers alike because it is a law of nature. But please do not substitute TITHE for 'freewill' giving because tithe is legalistic and so it cannot be said to be freewill.

At the end of the day, it is your choice whether you want to continue to be a PHARISEE by paying tithe or you want to be a CHRISTIAN by looking unto Jesus, the Author and Finisher of your faith.

God does not need your money. He owns the whole world you know? God needs you 100%. SALVATION IS FREE. YOU CAN'T BUY IT

no wahala. Just following

@OP you may want to check out this thread for more understanding https://www.nairaland.com/1480358/concerning-tithes-giving-etc-expose

@pastorkun @ goshen360

Pls what's ur take on this

www.nairaland.com/1483670/those-against-prosperity-gospel-whats

Ukuts gp: i wud be glad to know the totality of this tithe thing that is preached every sunday in church. I need to be convinced first b4 i join ur crusade . I nid answers to those basic questions.

I sense you are someone who sincerely wants to know the truth and by God's grace you will know it and it will set you free. I have thought to resign from tithes debates on this forum and focus on my blog were I find people visiting to learn truths. But how can one not respond to a sincere seeker. I will try to respond to you questions one after the other, although I see that Kun, my Oga at the top, is doing a good job already but I will add my little cent.

Ukuts gp:
1. What is tithe and how did it started?.

I want to say that my definition of the tithe before I stopped was: a tenth of my income or any financial increase. When I came to the this forum I was made to understand that there is no such thing. The tithe, by biblical definition, Leviticus 27:30-32, were tithing under Moses' laws is first mentioned, is a tenth of agricultural products obtained from the land God gave to the Israelites. This tithe is holy unto the Lord because it obtained from the holy land of God given to His chosen people, the Israelites. That is how the religious tithes mentioned under Moses started.

However, the first mention of tithing or a tenth, is in Genesis 14:20 when Abram gave a tenth of war spoils to Melchizedek. And as Kun has rightly mentioned, it was in keeping with the custom of his time to give a tenth of spoils to Kings and Preists in a land. But, when we come to discuss Hebrew 7, we shall realize there was more to that action of Abram than just keeping a tradition or custom.

Ukuts gp:
2. What is pre-law and tithing in the law?

Pre-Law tithing: This is tithing mentioned and practised before Moses or before Leviticus 27. The two pre-law tithing we have is that of Abram in Genesis 14 and Jacob in Genesis 28. Abram gave his own tithe but there is no record of Jacob giving the tithe he promised although God reminded his of his vow, God did not demand a tithe from him then.

Tithing in the Law: This is tithing according to the laws of Moses as mentioned in Leviticus 27, Numbers 18, Deuteronomy 14 and Malachi 3.

Ukuts gp:
3. How was tithing done in the old testament?

People tithed in the old testament according the laws of Moses. Apparently they tithed off the produce of the land both husbandary and agricultural products. Gary Arnolds in his webstie www.tithing101.org explained that God asked for the tithes from Israel off products on the land because those products were the result of his own efforts. God did not demand a tithe from these people's income bc an income is reward for man's effort but he wanted them to tithe from the increase that came by his divine efforts. When you sow a grain of wheat or rear an animal and get a bag of wheat or hundreds of offstrings from that animal, the result is not from your effort but from God's effort. So God said give a tithe of whatever increase I give you that came by my effort. There is no record of anyone paying a tithe on his income under Moses.

Ukuts gp:
4. Is there any difference you
u noticed between tithing in the bible and the one being
practiced now?

Tithing as practiced according to scripture was strictly tithing of agricultural products; tithing in our time is strictly on one's income. In the bible Abram tithed war spoils and he did so once. We do not collect Spoils of war today and if you check the times when Israel waged war, there was never a time God demanded the people to tithe spoils of war. The story in Numbers 31, or so, were God asked for war spoils to be divided, we see clearly it was according to certain proportions and they were never tithes. Many times war spoils are abominable to God. How tithing of agricultural products from God's holy land became tithing of salary is what only pro-tithers can tell you but the bible does not record such lessons. To show that tithing was never money, there is a passage in Deut 14, I think, that says that if were you live is too far from were you are to give the tithe, you should convert it to money; then take it there and then purchase those products back and add a fifth of its value to it (as if to discourage such conversions). If God wanted cash tithes, he would never have given such directions.

Ukuts gp:
5. Does malachi 3:8-12 support tithing?

Yes. Malachi supports tithing but tithing under Moses' laws. If we are a redeemed people under grace and the NT, we are not obliged to keep any of Moses' laws. Let us quote that scripture and permit me to lay some emphasis:

8 Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings. 9 Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation. 10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. 11 And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts. 12 And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the LORD of hosts.

Please note that what God demanded in this scripture are tithes and offerings. Both of them are in the plural. A careful study of Numbers 18 and Deuteronomy 14 shows that there are atleast 3 types of tithes and that by the time the Isrealite would finish paying the tithes they would have given about 23% of their harvest. There were tithes to be given directly to the Levites; there were tithes to be given to widows and orphans; and there were tithes to be eaten by the tither himself; there were tithes to be given once after a harvest; there were tithes to be given once in three years. All of this tithes was what God demanded. All the tithes: note the plural. Question is which of these tithes should we pay? Answer: non! why? Because the tithes being demanded here were tithes required under Moses. Laws that are not applicable to Christians today. Even pro-tithers agree that this passage was directed at Israelites not Christians and the smart ones never use it to debate for tithing. On the other hands the offerings demanded by God here are the ones that are well documented in Leviticus 1ff: Meat offering; sin offering; purification offering; etc. I think the point is clear.

The NT does not demand that Christians give tithes and even offerings. Not once were offerings collected in the NT church. The closest we have to offerings are the collections Paul made for poor Christians in Jerusalem.

Ukuts gp:
6. Does matthew 23:23 support the tithe teaching in the new testament?

Read the scripture properly. Jesus was speaking to scribes and pharisees who were under the law. Understand that Jesus, the progenitor of grace, was born and lived under the law. This was done so he may fulfill the law and so that the righteous requirement of the law may be given to us. While he had not gone to the cross, Jesus lived the law and could not encourage anyone to break the law by saying they should not tithe. But note that our Lord was very concerned about some weighty matter of the law. Tithing was apparently not one of them. If you check Jesus life and ministry well, you will realize that he came to show us how to keep the weighty demands of God. There is no weightier demand than for us to love God and our neighbors. Tithing was of the law and after his death and Resurrection the law has been declared null and void (Hebrew 8:13). We are under a new law of liberty: the law of love. We are not to cirucumcize, tithe, keep the sabbath or anyone of Moses laws.

Note also, that the products that Jesus spoke of mints and cummins, were agricultural products. Even in Matthew 23:23 Jesus never asked anyone to tithe his salary.

Ukuts gp:
7. Who is mechizedec in the bible?

Melchizedek is recorded to be King of Salem or Priest of the Most High God in Genesis 14. We see him recorded as a King and Preist in other parts of scripture including Hebrew 7. In truth and verity no one can say of certaninty who Melchizedek is. mko 2005 gave an excellent piece in another thread on Melchizedek being Jesus. And I applaud him for that but even if Melchizedek was Jesus, it is still not a reason for Christians to tithe today.

We see in Hebrew 7 that Abraham paid tithe to Melchizedek and so Levi also gave tithe, bc he was in Abraham loins. Jesus is said to be a descendant of Judah, who is a son of Abraham too and so Jesus paid tithe, like Levi, to Melchizedek in Abraham's loins. What does this mean? It means what we already know: that Jesus came to fulfill the law that the righteous requirement of the law (Rom 8:4) could be given to us. JESUS PAID TITHES TO MELCHIZEDEK SO WE ALL HAVE PAID TITHES TO MELCHIZEDEK AND NEED NOT PAY ANYMORE. That is what it means to fulfill or establish the law. So regardless of who Melchizedek is, Jesus has paid it all and no one is under any obligation to a pay a tithe to anyone under this dispensation.

Ukuts gp
8.what is Hebrew 7 all about? Is it supporting tithing?

Let us quote the first four verses of Hebrew 7:

1 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him; 2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace; 3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually. 4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.

The bolded is the purpose of Hebrew 7: to show the greatness of the priesthood of Melchizedek. A priesthood so great that Abraham paid a tithe to him. If Abraham paid a tithe to him, then even Levi and the Aaronic priesthood paid a tithe to Melchizedek and Melchizedek even went further by blessing Abraham. It is the greater that blesses the lesser. So Melchizedek priesthood is great and greater than Aaron's.

This line of argument needed to be pursued to help the Hebrews to whom this letter is written to grasp the greatness of the priesthood of Christ. Christ priesthood is compared to that of Melchizedek and we see that Melchizedek priesthood is greater than Aaron's, so Jesus' priesthood is greater than Aaron's. The Hebrew saw the High Priest as the highest spiritual authority in the land and if it can be shown that Jesus' priesthood was greater than Aaron's then the priesthood of Jesus can be better appreciated.

Then verse 11-12 seals the discuss:

11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron? 12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

1. Aaron priesthood could not bring perfection. Only Jesus priesthood can.

2. With a change of priesthood also came a change of laws.

3. The levites had commandment or laws (v.5) to take tithes from Israel. However, with a change of laws also came a change of that law also. There is no more a law to collect tithes.

I want to go further by saying that Hebrews was written AD64 or thereabout. By AD70 Jerusalem had been ransacked by the Romans bringing an end to the order of the levithical priesthood. By the time the Jews were restored to their land in 1948, not one person could trace his ancestry line to the Aaron. God himself ended the levithical priesthood as stated in verse 11-12. Today Jews can trace their line to Judah, Benjamin and a few other tribes but not one person can trace his line to Aaron. Why? Because there is a new order.

Even Jews no longer pay tithes to anyone. The reason why tithes were never mentioned with the apostle was bc only the levites collected tithes and neither Jesus, Paul or any of the apostles were levithes. How our modern pastors and churches have suddenly turned Levithical is the eight wonder of the world!

Ukuts gp:
9. Does tithing negate the message of grace? how?

Yes it does and that is the biggest reason to contend against it. If we are asked to pay a tithe and made to understand that it is obligatory, then what happens to what Jesus did on the cross? Why is it that what Christ did to purchase or redeem us from sin is not enough? Why do we have to pay a tithe to complete our redemption? We must understand that in every generation, the grace of God has always been contended against. In the days of Paul it was circumcision. And the circumcision argument was solid, in fact even more solid than that of tithing. Circumcision also was before the law. Circumcision had the express command of God in Genesis 17, with God saying anyone that is not circumcised is cut off from Israel. Circumcision was the very mark of being a Jew and of one having a covenant with God but Paul in Galatians argued boldly that anyone who sought to be circumcized to be accepted by God after knowing Jesus had fallen from grace (Galatians 5:4). Circumcision was both pre law and under the law. Same with tithing: which is both pre law and under the law.

The biggest argument against the law: ie, circumcision and tithing do not even come from Paul but from Jesus. Our Lord made it clear that no one could put new wine in old wine skin; neither can you put old wine in new wine skin. It will produce a wreck. This he said in response to the pharisees protest against his disciples living the new covenant lifestyle albeit under the law. The Old Testament were marked by laws of tithing, circumcision, etc but the new covenant are not marked with such laws, but with the law of love. To bring the old into the new is to make void the grace of God. So, yes, tithing negates the grace of God. It gives the impression that we can buy God's blessing, when in reality we are debtors to his grace and mercy and cannot pay for anything He gives us, save to receive them with thanksgiving.

Ukuts gp
10. If we are sons of Abraham by faith, and Abraham pay tithe does that not imply that we should pay tithe?

Abraham did many things my brother and if we are to do those things we will make a shipwreck of our faith. Abraham lied. Abraham slept with his house help. Abraham had concubines. Etc. It is Abraham's faith we called to imitate and not every minute detail of his life. The reason why Abraham gave a tithe to Melchizedek was prophetic. So that a day will come when the Hebrews could understand that there is a greater priesthood to the one they have and submit themselves to the One who represented that priesthood which is Christ. Abraham also did other things that were prophetic: like his purchase of a burial site; which will turned out to be the place from which the dead will arise when Jesus died and many others. Abraham faith (Romans 4; Genesis 15:6; Galatians 3) is what we are to imitate.

Ukuts gp
11. Does anyone who doesn't pay tithe a robber?

It very interesting to me when ministers rail from the pulpit that anyone who doesn't pay a tithe is robbing God. First it shows that they are taking there justification for tithing from the law, ie Malachi, which is an extenstion of the law. Next, it shows their lack of understanding of scriptures. Jesus called only one set of people robbers in the bible and they were not innocent worshipers; rather they were religious leaders like our ministers today. Jesus said they had turned his Father's house to a den of theives (robbers). When Pastor drive luxury cars; fly private jets; wear expensive suits; live in mansions; etc, with the source of their livelihood from the tithes, offerings and seeds of innocent and poor worshipers, who do you think is robbing God?

The true robbers of God's treasury know themselves and God knows them. They are certainly not those who do not subject themselvs to a law of bondage that brings them to tithe today.

Ukuts gp
12. How can the work of God move on without tithing?

This is a treatise on its own. But I would attempt it. How was God work funded in the NT?

1. We had proof that ministers like Paul worked as tent makers; could it be that our own Pastors need to work also and fend for themselves and their families and not have to look up to the church to give them money and thus cook up scriptures to legitimize fraud?

2. The NT encourages believers to give to their ministers. But we must judge their work before we do this: those who have labored in doctrine are worthy of a double portion. God's people should judge the minister's work and decide by themselves what to give him.

3. In an organized church setting were the people can afford to employ a minister, that minister is worthy of a pay.

4. Ministers themselves should live by the faith they teach their members. Jesus and his apostles were neither part time or full time ministers; they were both. There was no such thing in their time. They were so consumed with the enormity of the work that they plunged into it: money or no money. But God is faithful and saw to it that they lacked nothing. Our ministers can imitate this.

5. The church should concern itself with what the apostles were concerned about next to ministry and that is to take care of the poor. The collection mentioned under Paul was only for the poor and not for ministers. Let us get our priorities right; let God consume his people and let us watch him move them to give gracefully without coercion, witchcraft or out of obligation in the name of tithing.

Ukuts gp
13. How did the bible suggest we should give?

Hundreds of ways: but the central theme there is FREE WILL OFFERING OR GRACE GIVING.

Ukuts gp
14. Is it tithing that brings about God's blessing or what?

Ephesians 1:3, says we are blessed bc of our position in Christ and not because of what we do. We cannot purchase God's blessing. It is incumbent on God to bless his children. I have children and they never worry about food, school fees, cloths or any such thing. Last two months my wife emptied her account to purchase cloths for our first child. There she was beaming in her new cloths but not realizing the sacrifice that have gone into it. Same with God and us. God will bless bc it is his nature to and how much more will He give us His children: Oh, you of little faith. Read Matthew 6:19ff all over again and grasp God's providence to all men and his particular provision to His own.

I really hope you have gotten something out of this discuss. I am resigning from tithe debates on NL but will respond to anyone who desire to know truth in the inward man. I invite you to read through my blog below at my signature. There is an article there: "I Cannot Afford to be A Christian" that is causing a lot of trouble for me in my local assembly. This position of not tithing is very unpopular and God knows how much I have suffered (and is ready to suffer) to uphold the truth. This is what Paul call the offense of the cross: our commitment to upheld the grace of God and to ensure it is untainted by the law!

No matter how u explain or breakdown dis tithes issue dey wi sti come wit a recycling questions on y u must pay tithe.
D question i want 2 ask u if truely u r a christain. R u UNDER GRACE or UNDER D LAW?
If u r under grace it means u av being accepted by God just d way u r by d finished work of our Lord Jesus Christ. N his death has profited u alot.
But if u r sti operating UNDER LAW it means u r not qualify 4 God grace n u MUST met all d demands of ALL 613 laws n not just one dat suit u but ALL. N be it known 2u Dat d death of Jesus Christ has not Benefited u nothing.
My friend d truth of d mata is dat tithe n every oda laws got EXPIRED on d CROSS OVER 2000yrs ago.

@drummaboy. Thanks 4 ur wonderful exposition. It is nice, i am definitely savouring every bit of it. I am following.

Thank you, Drummaboy. Loved d way u clarified these questions. benefitted immensely. Would like to thank others who have contibuted time, efforts and Megabytes to clarify these tithes issues. I'm finally free, even my husband cos I took time to explain it all to him. Such a big relief after 15years of legalism. Thanks y'all. God bless u plenty.

made2fit: Thank you, Drummaboy. Loved d way u clarified these questions. benefitted immensely. Would like to thank others who have contibuted time, efforts and Megabytes to clarify these tithes issues. I'm finally free, even my husband cos I took time to explain it all to him. Such a big relief after 15years of legalism. Thanks y'all. God bless u plenty.

me too o

I am very glad to see the responses to the posts above. Growth in the kingdom is through understanding; when we understand the gospel of Christ, it is easy to grasp God with faith: Faith commeth by hearing and hearing the word of God.

Apart from www.tithing101.com by Gary Arnold, this web book first posted by frosbel (where is he?), helped me a great deal: http://tekoapublishing.com/books/tithing/index.html. Nerramore answered some frequently asked questions on tithing and I recommend that you read it up. It is so easy to read.

The preface of the book offers a fine summary on it:

Preface

This book is about much more than tithing or not tithing. It's about setting people free from a wrong, religious mindset so they can experience the reality of New Covenant life in Christ. It's about recovering a glorious spiritual inheritance that Christians have been defrauded of, exposing wrong doctrines that negate Christ's finished work on the cross. It's about living like a righteous, new-creation son of God, born again through spiritual union with Jesus Christ by his resurrection from the dead. This book is just a beginning. Tithing is just the tip of the iceberg of carnal mentalities that dominate most of Christianity.

I was taught to tithe as a child and did so for many years without question. It was never a problem to me, spiritually or financially. I thoroughly agreed with the teaching and wasn't looking for any reason to contradict it. However, after many years of seeking God and studying his word, I have come to see the doctrine of tithing, and all other financial giving as well, in a new light—the revelation of the mystery of being in Christ.

I have two objectives in writing this book. One is that Christians would wake up and realize that tithing is part of the old carnal religious way of life and put it aside to enter the New Covenant way of living. The New Testament's description for this way of living is, in Christ. Religious traditions that man has created are the biggest obstacle to the glorious life of God that we were created to enjoy. Tithing is one of those well-meaning-but-misguided traditions.

Another objective is to equip Christians with a solid scriptural foundation to answer the constant barrage of teaching that is promoting tithing and keeping the church in a low-realm, religious mode of living. The doctrine of tithing has been mindlessly taught and accepted for so long that some of the most outstanding Christian leaders do not recognize how it contradicts the very foundation of the gospel they are preaching.

This book may challenge some of your deepest beliefs. It may contradict your most esteemed spiritual leaders. But no brother or sister in Christ is being personally judged or attacked. I appreciate those who have given their lives in service to the Lord and his church. The Bible tells us to "esteem them very highly in love for their work's sake" (1 Thess. 5:13). However, their teachings are at all times to be examined in the light of scripture.

This book exposes the error of some very popular teachings but does not accuse those who are teaching them. No names are ever mentioned, but you may recognize some statements. There are many well-known ministers, whom I greatly respect, that I have to disagree with when it comes to the subject of tithing.

Paul the apostle said in 1 Corinthians chapter 13, “we know in part” and “we see through a glass, darkly;” therefore, we can never expect perfect doctrinal unity. However, we can pursue a better knowledge of the truth and we can extend the love of God to one another in the process. If we disagree, we can do so respectfully. Each person must walk with God in the best way they know.

I ask you to lay aside preconceived ideas and traditional thinking, and prayerfully consider the message of this book. Its purpose is to move the church toward the highest and best that God has provided in Christ. I pray that it will be the beginning of a spiritual revolution in your life.