AmunRaOlodumare: We can see the language relationship between various Niger-Congo languages in the following image. Basically, Bantu languages share the same Benue-Congo family branch with Yoruba, Igbo, Nupe and other languages. That is at one time, there possibly was a population speaking a language we can call proto-Benue-Congo who then migrated to different location, creating language differentiations (Eastern/Western Benue-Congo, for example).

AmunRaOlodumare: We can see the language relationship between various Niger-Congo languages in the following image. Basically, Bantu languages share the same Benue-Congo family branch with Yoruba, Igbo, Nupe and other languages. That is at one time, there possibly was a population speaking a language we can call proto-Benue-Congo who then migrated to different location, creating language differentiations (Eastern/Western Benue-Congo, for example).

macof:


What evidence do u have that people came into sub-saharan Africa from Ethiopia/Sudan/Egypt??

Every single human migration theory (that isn't based on Jewish scriptures) that is held as a fact speaks of an Out of Africa migration, not into Africa migration

I admit sub-Saharan Africa has relations with Egypt/Sudan..like..
DNA of the early dynastic kings of Egypt match with sub-Saharan Africans, West Africans especially.
The sub-Saharan cultures are seen in the early times of the nile valley eg. Divine kingship, burying a slave with the king to assist in the journey to the afterlife, keeping the king's body parts preserved(you should know Ife, Bini, itsekiri are known for this, especially with the head) etc
cognitive words

But west Africa has been inhabited for 11,000 years at least(going by available evidence) which is long before any northern African land

every logic points Sub-Saharan Africa as the origin of black population of northern Africa, blacks didn't go South they went North

Ihuomadinihu:
One cannot possibly touch on bantu without treating igbo.

Bantu is just a mini aspect of a bigger family.

AmunRaOlodumare:

You can always study ethnic groups on their own. You can do the same for town, villages, family and individual people. There's both differences and similarities between various people of Africa and the World in general.

For example, you can study the Zulu people on their own, or you can study their relationship with other Niger-Congo speakers for example, like the Igbo or N-C populations in general.




Bantu are part of a larger family but not that mini. Bantu are pretty widespread.

AmunRaOlodumare: ^^^ I knew we generally agreed with each others. I just added my own opinions and analysis to your own to elaborate on some aspects. Mostly related to the wording (especially if taken out of the context of this thread).

Ihuomadinihu:
Truth be told some tribes in Sub-saharan Africa claim to come from the North. It's easy to term it reverse migration....
Am not familiar with origin of Ekoid tribes but they claim they migrated to Nigeria from Egypt. It's important to let people search for their origins without undue pressure from an opposing school of thought.

macof:

Ekoid?? a people found in cross river area??
Wat "Egypt" do they have in their culture? Language? Or oral history?

Ihuomadinihu:

Osa stands for God in a few Southern Nigerian languages. E:g Osanobue- Edo.
Osakwe- Igbo.
Osadebe-Igbo.
There are also variants like Olisa, Orisa or Orisha(Yoruba).
I believe osa is derived from Olisa/Orisa.

Ihuomadinihu:

Thanks. That's what i have tried to stress in this thread and previous ones. We tend to give too much attention to this bantu stuff. Bantu,igbo,yoruba etc are part of the same linguistic group. Speakers of bantu languages only split from that family and migrated to different geographical zones thereby creating a distinct language group. Similar circumstances exists between igbo and Yoruba. At the end of the way,bantu is very much related to the aforementioned languages and other benue -congo languages.
One cannot possibly touch on bantu without treating igbo. Bantu is just a mini aspect of a bigger family.

alanmwene:

Bantus don't share anything with igbos.yorubas,hausas,etc.........All genetic studies have proven this point time and time again.Bantus are on their own in Africa!Igbos and yorubas have a lot in common coz they belong to the same sudano-sahelian race.I don't know where you get the idea that bantus are somehow related to igbos and yorubas.

alanmwene:

Bantus don't share anything with igbos.yorubas,hausas,etc.........All genetic studies have proven this point time and time again.Bantus are on their own in Africa!Igbos and yorubas have a lot in common coz they belong to the same sudano-sahelian race.I don't know where you get the idea that bantus are somehow related to igbos and yorubas.

Ihuomadinihu:

Sorry to bust your bubbles! Bantu cannot be on its own. Bantu,Igbo and Yoruba belong to the same Linguistic family - The Niger Congo Group,hence the similarities in culture and language.
What is Sudano Sahelian race biko?

alanmwene:

lets suppose that bantu languages belong to the same linguistic family with Igbo and Yoruba.I have few questions for you:
1-Why is it impossible to found a single name or word with the "gb" particle in core bantu language(Swahili,kongo,luba,shona,kikuyu)?Words like IGBO,GBAGBO,ADEGBOLA,etc.....don't exist in these languages and the only time you may find them is in bantu languages that have been in contact with Sudanese languages(semi-bantu languages in cameroun or ethnic groups of Sudanese origin like the gbandis in north congo)

2-There are no bantu word or name that start by a R like in ROTIMI or RONKE.How can you explain that?

3-Neither in Igbo nor in Yoruba is the plural formed by prefixing "ba".
bachinois=Chinese people
bakenya=Kenyan people
etc......

4-You will never found a single word or name in core bantu languages(Swahili,kikongo,luba,kikuyu..) with the particle "kp" like in ekpe or ending with a "ong" like in sarpong,effiong,etc....The only people with these types of names are camerounese.

We can go on and on
genetic studies
http://biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2014/02/18/002808.full.pdf

TonySpike:



You might be mistaken! At least 80% of African population came from a singular genetic source. The genetic pool became differentiated over thousands of year due to the effect of adaptation and local climatic factors. Language itself also became differentiated having undergone several evolutions in this same period. The languages we have now have in Africa is a process that has taken over 5,000 years to be differentiated. Therefore, I can tell you that the Yoruba language spoken about 700 years ago is not the same spoken now. Even English has undergone transformation in structure and spelling in the last 300 years! Take the Old King James Bible for example and compare the words used with the New International Version: the difference is clear! Bro, are you assuming that African languages have remained the same for the past 5,000 years for instance?

I'll tell you something, never use anglicized alphabets to project your point. In some parts of Nigeria and parts of Africa, "p" sound is written as "kp" or "b", "f" sound is written as "ph", "f" sound could also be written as "v", "o" sound is written as "Ho", "c" sound is written as "k" and so on. It is even worse when you consider how French use theirs in Africa language. You should also know that language acquisition could be as a result of assimilation, cultural admixture and colonization irrespective of the actual haplogroup.

itstpia8:
@ topic

i think the middle beltans say they migrated from eastern Africa some centuries ago, maybe the same time the Fulani moved to Nigeria from the western African coast, or some decades/centuries apart.

muafrika:
@AlanMwene
Are you disputing the West African origin of the Bantu people. Or do you just believe they did not leave any relatives behind.
*The Kikuyu language has alot of words starting with "R"
* Not all Bantu languages use the prefix "ba" to make a word plural. Swahili doesn't. It uses many, like wa, ma, Vi, same like many other Bantu languages. The Swahili synonym for "bantu" is "Watu".
There are some common West African/Bantu Words. Like Mema, which means good(plural) in Swahili. West African tribes use variations of the Swahili word "Mwenye" which is a word referring to or bestowing ownership.
Most genetic studies are done by outsiders who use more speculation than facts.

Radoillo:
It took me only a few seconds to find Southern African Bantu names starting with 'R': Reneilwe, Rataba, Ramotape, Ramaseatsane, etc.

Am I to assume that these names got there R's from the Nilotes, too?

Radoillo:
I'm going to try and avoid getting into a lengthy debate on this because I do not think that anything will come out of it.
First, it is clear you do not understand West African cultures well. If you did, you would know that they don't all have elaborate pantheons of deities. Some do not have well- defined gods like the ones you mentioned: they recognise a high god, some spirits and pay particular attention to venerating the ancestors.
Second, related peoples do not have to have identical cultures. In the course of hundreds or thousands of years of separation, their cultures will tend to grow apart and show marked differences with only overarching similarities. What you are doing is fixating on the narrow differences and overlooking the broad similarities within the Niger-Congo group (a.k.a Bantu + West Africa group). That approach is amateurish.
Third, I see where you mentioned genetics. Yes, it makes sense that Bantu groups will have some collective genetic difference(s) from West Africans. When a people move away and become isolated from a 'parent' or a related stock, they will tend to develop genetic peculiarities of their own through processes like gene mutation and all that. On a more removed level, Bantus are still genetically 'cousins' with West Africans.
You can look at this paper for the genetic commonalities of all Niger-Congo groups (including Bantus):
http://m.mbe.oxfordjournals.org/content/28/3/1255.full
Also did you imply that ritual killings and ritual mutilations do not exist in the Congo and Bantu Africa? Bwahahaha! Bro, please!
You didn't give an answer as why bantus don't have cult of deities like igbos or yorubas.Why is that the worship of god/gods is inexistent in bantu groups?
It is a truism to say that bantus are related to west Africans coz all Africans are related anyway.But to suggest that bantus are cousins to yorubas and igbos is an aberration.Maybe you should start looking towards Ghana coz you stand a better chance to find cousins there.Genetic studies have consistently show that bantus are a race which is distinct from other races in Africa.This a fact not a fiction!
Last but not least,have you ever heard of a young Congolese man/woman caught with human heads/parts?
As Africans,we must accept that Africa is diverse and blackness is multiple.We aren't the same coz we have the same skin color.

Ihuomadinihu:
Lol,i'm tired to say the least.
All i see is someone trying so hard to seperate himself from his Parent family eventhough Genetics,Linguistics and traditions are against him!
Bantus migrated out of West Africa,displaced and even absolved whichever people they came across. It's obvious they would display peculiar cultural,genetic and linguistic features which may or may not be found in West Africa.
Swahili is a result of the interaction with non Bantu groups,the language contains words borrowed from Arabic language. There are also few words from Hindi and Portuguese in Swahili. Even in my culture,there is nothing like a homogenous Igbo people. People pick up certain things born out of growth/change or interactions with foreigners. Does that make anyone less Igbo?
I don't know much about Northern Africa but ritual killings occur in Nigeria,Congo,Tanzania to South Africa etc

This type of argument is tiring.

alanmwene:

Bantus don't share anything with igbos.yorubas,hausas,etc.........All genetic studies have proven this point time and time again.Bantus are on their own in Africa!Igbos and yorubas have a lot in common coz they belong to the same sudano-sahelian race.I don't know where you get the idea that bantus are somehow related to igbos and yorubas.

alanmwene:


1-You said bantus share the same culture with igbos and yorubas.Why is that there isn't a single bantu group that has deities in its pantheon?
Igbos and yorubas have Ogun,Ikenga,Oya,etc......but bantus have zero deities.This is a fact that has always baffled whites colonizers .It is can be said that bantus know that god exists but they don't worship him.