I really did not want to say anything because this issue has been flogged numerous times here.
@lady
I loved your analogy about the child beating scenario, it was really really good but I think the mistake we keep making is that God is responsible for all this, and this is not about boxing God into what I think he should be but because those murders were plain wrong. I could go on to challenge you if you know what the constitution of Nigeria is on child welfare but I don't want us to derail this thread. Murder is a grey area, it is taking somebody's life, it is a serious issue. Let me give you an analogy, if say I was born in calabar when the killing of twins reigned supreme and my wife gave birth to a set of twins who were murdered, it does not make it any less wrong because it was the culture of the town. It is plain and simply wrong, whether or not we should blame them becomes another issue entirely that bears on this one because they were men who believed they were doing the will of the gods just as you believe moses and his goons were doing the will of God, it does not make the issue any less wrong.
Now case scenario one is that Moses did it all on his own following the laws of the land as made by the limited knowledge of man, then Moses is to blame in part because they were wrong regardless of if he thought he was doing the right thing.
The other scenario is that God really did instruct him as depicted in the bible, in this case God is to blame, because senseless murder of innocent children and women and men is wrong no matter how you cut it.
But hold on, we are talking about God here, he is supposed to know way before hand that murder was wrong!
@sahel lady
Welcome to nairaland, please can you tell me what jephtah was supposed to do to the first thing that comes out of his house?

I loved your analogy about the child beating scenario, it was really really good but I think the mistake we keep making is that God is responsible for all this, and this is not about boxing God into what I think he should be but because those murders were plain wrong

see this is why i keep asking you why you bother when you have already made up your mind. you completely missed the point. the point is that the girl was not murdered but given to the temple of the Lord as a virgin to serve the Lord in the temple and in the temple she died naturally as all humans end up doing.

the point of my analogy was not just to get you to see that you are taking the Old Testament out of context, but also to show that the girl really was taken to the temple instead of being murdered.

and here you are talking about God ordering the murder, when that didn't even take place. also God didn't request the girl, the father of the girl made a vow, that is a lesson to be learned there. God has said numerous times be careful the vows you make, don't just make vows randomly as if they are nothing. But the man did, and not once did God speak, he didn't lay a command. It was the father that did the speaking, the father made the vow, and the father told his daughter that he cannot go against his vow, and the daughter willingly accepted, not God.

This story is a lesson to be learned. Don't make vows for the sake of making a vow.

Murder is a grey area, it is taking somebody's life, it is a serious issue

murder isn't really a grey area.

Let me give you an analogy, if say I was born in calabar when the killing of twins reigned supreme and my wife gave birth to a set of twins who were murdered, it does not make it any less wrong because it was the culture of the town. It is plain and simply wrong, whether or not we should blame them becomes another issue entirely that bears on this one because they were men who believed they were doing the will of the gods just as you believe moses and his goons were doing the will of God, it does not make the issue any less wrong.

First of all this is the wrong analogy. The murdering of twins is not the same as punishment under law. That is where the problem comes in. You think that those people were put to death for no reason, they were put to death for breaking the law of the land, for voluntarily breaking the law of the land. if this is the case then the death penalty for a man who rapes and kills a 6 yr old girl is also considered murder (the church fights against the death penalty although so that all may be given the chance to repent). Giving birth is involuntary, it was the belief that the evil one is trying to come into the world through the birth of children. It is a superstitous belief. However, being pounished for breaking the law isn't superstitous belief.
The law of the land at that time was that crime basically is punishable by death, it was barbaric. That was the law. not just the law of God, but the law of the land. So whatever Moses said went, especially since he was the friend of God. God didn't come up with the punishment, the men of the land did, God just let them know what they were to be punished for. When someone breaks the rule, the men came up with the punishment.
It's like this, the government makes a rule and says that you will be punished for it, the judge comes up with the punishment. God is the government, Moses is the judge.
The government said thou shall not steal, kill, blah blah blah, the judge says oh you've stolen, killed, blah blah blah here is your punishment.

So these same things are still punishable today, it's just that the punishment today is different than then. You still get punished for murder, and steal, blah blah blah. But you just don't get punihsed the same way.

Welcome to nairaland, please can you tell me what jephtah was supposed to do to the first thing that comes out of his house?

he was to make a sacrifice to God. don't make the mistake of thinking that a scarifice must include blood, because my mother makes a sacrifice everyday for her children and she hasn't shed any blood.
sacrifice is giving something up. plain and simple and it comes in different ways. jephtah sacrificed his bloodline when he gave his daughter to God. You know very well that that is the pride of men. That is why men want sons to carry on their name and legacy, back then women could do the same.
his sacrifice wasn't to cut his daughter's throat.

No self-respecting Christian would argue that God does not accept a human sacrifice.

The ultimate human sacrifice, in the person of Jesus, was needed to redeem mankind.

And there were specs; no other regular human would do; it had to be one from the belly of a virgin, and his death had to be sacrificial, not natural; blood had to be spilled, and invoking the blood (as we would have in "Blood of Jesus" would be a powerful formula in prayer.

How would a Christian argue that God doesn't accept human sacrifice when the Christian faith is dependent on one such sacrifice??
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