Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? - Islam for Muslims - Nairaland
Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Islam for Muslims / Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? (5674 Views)
The Issue Of Shortening Salah (salat-ul Qasr) During NYSC Camp / Ramadan Check: Tarawih Is Bid'ah (innovation) / Muslim Divers Observing Salat(prayer) Under The Sea (2) (3) (4)
| Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 1:45pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
MISCONCEPTION OF (SALAT) TARAWIH Tahajjud or Qiyam Layl is a late-night prayer (Nawafil) which was made obligatory for the holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah upon him and his Ahl al-Bayt) but not for his Ummah (community). The exemplary Prophet never left it till Allah called him. In fact, it was among those acts of worship that elevated him to the zenith of spiritual realm, maqama mahmuda, as Quran puts it. Some sahaba (companions) joined the Prophet uninvited in the midst of his normal obligatory Nawafil of Tahajjud, in the middle of the night. This specific action repeated itself for three consecutive nights until he dispersed them on the fourth night fearing it became obligatory. The holy Prophet however enjoined his Ummah to continue observing it individually at home. This particular incident happened during the holy month of Ramadhan as documented in the Book of hadith. However after the demise of the Prophet and the first Khalif, Abu Bakr; during few years of the second Khalifa, Umar Ibn al-Khattab, in the month of Ramadhan, precisely after the obligatory Salat Ishai, a non-obligatory 20 Rakah called “Tarawih” was established by Umar Ibn al-Khattab on the premise that people were praying individually in the mosque thereby making noise. Umar then gathered them under one Imam to pray in congregation. Umar dubbed this establishment of his,“Bid’at Hassana (Good Innovation).” Late after this, it has been argued that “Tarawih” is the same as “Tahajjud” on the mere fact that certain companions prayed it in congregation alongside the Prophet as explained ealier. The fact that nonetheless, it was offered in “Jama’a (congregation)”, there is a view that Umar Ibn Khattab simply “revive” this in congregation. The practice “Tarawih” continues till date during the month of Ramadhan in every local mosques. Is Tarawih really Tahajjud as Ahl al-Sunnah Scholars propounded? This is what we intend to investigate in this write up. Nearly all Ahl al-Sunnah Scholars (except for a few) are of the opinion that it is the same, and argument put forth are simply the same. We however respond to the argument of Sheik Saalih Fawzan in his Huqooq al-Nabi bayna al-Ijlaal wa’l-Ikhlaal. ******************************** ONE - {*Sheik Saalih Fawzan: These people have no proof that there is any such thing as a “good innovation” apart from the words of ‘Umar (radiallaahu ‘anhu) concerning Taraaweeh prayers, “What a good innovation this is.” (Saheeh al-Bukhaari, 2/252, no. 2010 mu’allaqan; al-Fath 4/294).} NB; Sheikh Fawzan was actually ‘refuting’ argument of those who graded Mawlud Nabiyy celebration’ as “Good Innovation”relying on the fact that Umar Ibn Khattab himself invented a practice not established by the Prophet and then named it “Bid’at Hassana (Good Innovation)” #RESPONSE: Ma sha Allah, let's see how sheik performed in this argument below: TWO - {*Sheik Saalih Fawzan: The response to that is that these matters had a basis in Islam, so they were not newly-invented.} #RESPONSE: So what's the basis? Sheik Fawzan submits below: THREE - {* Sheik Saalih Fawzan: ‘Umar said: “What a good bid’ah” meaning innovation (Bid'ah) in the linguistic sense, not in the shar’ee sense.} #RESPONSE: This is where Sheik Fawzan blown everything. Indeed his argument is "flimsier than spider's web" First, there's no evidence from Umar for that sheiks' interpretations. So such interpretation without evidence from the originator of the Bid'ah, is thrown into thrash bin. Second, does Umar's Bid'ah has a basis in Islam? The answer is absolutely NO as we shall expose later on, in sha Allah. Third, after Umar admittance of establishing a Bid'ah, he actually proved it why it was Bid'ah. Umar says: "...What a good Bid'ah (i.e. innovation in religion) this is (i.e tarawih prayer); BUT THE PRAYER WHICH THEY DO NOT PERFORM BUT SLEEP AT ITS TIME IS BETTER THAN THE ONE THEY ARE OFFERING.’ He meant the prayer in the last part of the night (Tahajjud)." ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 32, No 227 What is better is the Sunnah of Muhammad (peace be on him and his household). * Observe the above (in Block letters) quotation of Umar testified he established this Bid'ah after salat Ishai because of the word "but sleep at its time...". Here, 'Aisha introduced the timing of Prophet's Tahajjud: Narrated ‘Urwa: That he was informed by ‘Aisha, “Allah’s Apostle went out in the MIDDLE OF NIGHT(i.e. For Tahajjud) and prayed in the mosque ..." ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 32, No.229 Prophet never prayed Tahajjud whether during Ramadhan or other months after Salat Isha (as we shall also soon). In fact the instruction from his Lord which he complied with reads: "And in some parts of the night (also) offer the Salat (prayer) with it (i.e. recite the Quran in the prayer), as an additional prayer for you (O Muhammad). It may be that your Lord will raise you to Maqaman Mahmuda(Exalted station)" ~sura al-Israi:79 In fact sura al-Mudassir clarify further that one needs to sleep first and rise up to pray Tahajjud: "O you wrapped in garments (i.e. Prophet Muhammad)! STAND/RISE (to pray) in the night, except a little. Half of it, or a little less than that, Or a little more; and recite the Quran (aloud) in a slow, (pleasant tone and) style. Verily, We shall send down to you a weighty Word. Verily, THE RISING BY NIGHT (for Tahajjud prayer) is very hard..." ~sura al-Mudassir verse 1 - 6 + This is what Umar too acknowledged by saying (Tahajjud, Qiyam Layl) is better than this one (Tarawih i.e nawafil after Ishai) they are praying. + Interestingly, Umar himself never participated in that Bid'ah of his. NB: This highlighted ayah made Tahajjud compulsory for the holy prophet ALONE. FOUR - {* Sheik Saalih Fawzan: The Prophet (salallaahu ‘alaihi wa sallam) led his companions in praying Taraaweeh for a while then he stopped doing that, lest that become obligatory on them.} #RESPONSE: This is a misconception by Sheik Fawzan (and others like him) in the desperation to defend Umar's Bid'ah of Tarawih and link the act to the Prophet. * It is interesting how the Sheik sounds as if Prophet himself gathered the sahaba and led them in prayer. * Besides, What the holy Prophet Prayed was Tahajjud/Qiyyam Layl (Late Night/Rise at Night Nawafil) as indicated in the 'Aisha's hadith and orders of Allah, NOT Tarawih (Ishai umar's established ramadhan nawafil) The hadith in full reads: Narrated ‘Urwa: That he was informed by ‘Aisha, “Allah’s Apostle went outin the MIDDLE OF NIGHT(i.e. For Tahajjud) and prayed in the mosque and some men prayed behind him. In the morning, the people spoke about it and then a large number of them gathered and prayed behind him (on the second night). In the next morning the people again talked about it and on the third night the mosque was full with a large number of people. Allah’s Apostle came out and the people prayed behind him. On the fourth night the Mosque was overwhelmed with people and could not accommodate them, but the Prophet came out (only) for the Morning Prayer." ~Sahih Bukhari, Vol.3, Bk 32, N 229 * Does this hadith indicated the Prophet prayed "Tarawih"? * Does this hadith indicated he himself gathered the sahaba as Jama'a and led them? * Infact Prophet was praying ALONE in his "small room made of palm leaves" inside the mosque. Because Tahajjud is meant for him ONLY as wajib (compulsory). 'Aisha's narration left some vital information to discern the true picture of what actually happened in that four nights. Perhaps, she was inside the room of her blessed husband and could not get the whole gist. The following hadith shed clearer light of the whole scenario: "Narrated Zaid bin Thabit: Allah’s Apostle made a small room (with a palm leaf mat). Allah’s Apostle came out (of his house) and prayed in it. Some men came and joined him in his prayer. Then again the next night they came for the prayer, but Allah’s Apostle delayed and did not come out to them. So they raised their voices and knocked the door with small stones (to draw his attention). He came out to them in a state of ANGER, saying, “You are still insisting that I thought that this prayer might become obligatory on you. SO YOU PEOPLE, OFFER THIS PRAYER AT YOUR HOMES, FOR THE BEST PRAYER OF A PERSON IS THE ONE WHICH HE OFFERS AT HOME EXCEPT THE COMPULSORY (CONGREGATIONAL) PRAYER" ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 73, No.134 What else does a follower of truth wants in the Tarawih vs Tahajjud saga? It is obvious one is Sunnah (Tahajjud) and the other was Bid'ah (Tarawih). Prophet said it is BEST to pray it at home individually! Umar too concur. Some Sahaba complied with the instruction of the Prophet to pray it (furad - singly) at home or mosque for a long time after the death of the Prophet, Abu Bakr until Umar brought his Bid'ah. The hadith reads: Narrated Abu Huraira: Ibn Shihab (a sub-narrator) said, “Allah’s Apostle died and the people continued observing that (i.e. Nawafil offered individually, not in congregation), and it remained as it was during the Caliphate of Abu Bakr and in the early days of ‘Umar’s Caliphate.” ‘Abdur Rahman bin ‘Abdul Qari said, “I went out in the company of ‘Umar bin Al-Khattab one night in Ramadan to the mosque and found the people praying in different groups. A man praying alone or a man praying with a little group behind him. So, ‘Umar said, ‘IN MY OPINION, I would better collect these (people) under the leadership of one Qari (Reciter) (i.e. let them pray in congregation!)’. So, he made up his mind to congregate them behind Ubai bin Ka’b. Then on another night I went again in his company and the people were praying behind their reciter. On that, ‘Umar remarked, 'WHAT A GOOD BID'AH (i.e. innovation in religion) THIS IS; BUT THE PRAYER WHICH THEY DO NOT PERFORM BUT SLEEP AT ITS TIME IS BETTER THAN THE ONE THEY ARE OFFERING.’ He meant the prayer in the last part of the night (Tahajjud)." ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 32, Number 227 |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 1:48pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
TAHAJJUD vs TARAWIH: no of Rakah? The Sunnah of the Prophet: There are many Ahadith [in Sunni Sources] that our Rasool (peace be on him and his household) offered only 8 Rakah during Tahajjud (with an additional 3 Rakahs of Witr, thus making a total of 11 Rakahs). Umar's Tarawih bid'ah was however 20 - 23 rakah. Narrated Abu Salma bin ‘Abdur Rahman: I asked ‘Aisha, “How is the prayer of Allah’s Apostle during the month of Ramadan.” She said, “Allah’s Apostle never exceeded eleven Rakat in Ramadan or in other months; [i.e. throughout whole year] he used to offer four Rakat– do not ask me about their beauty and length, then four Rakat, do not ask me about their beauty and length, and then three Rakat.” Aisha further said, “I said, ‘O Allah’s Apostle! Do you sleep before offering the Witr prayer?’ He replied, ‘O ‘Aisha! My eyes sleep but my heart remains awake’!” ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 2, Book 21, No.248 UMAR ORDERED 20 RAKAH A. In Muwatta Imam Malik, from Yazid bin Rooman: “People used to offer twenty three (23)Rakah Salat during the time of Umar Ibn Khattab”. B. Bayhaqi from Sa’ib bin Yazid:“Twenty (20) Rakah Salat in Ramadhan was offered during the times of Umar Ibn Khattab”. C. Mussanif Ibn Abi Shayba from Yahya bin Saeed: “Umar ordered a person to offer twenty (20) Rakah Salat”. D. Musnaf Ibn Abi Shayba from Abdul Aziz bin Rafi’i: “Abi Ibn Ka’ab used to lead people in Jamah for twenty Rakah Tarawih and three Rakah Witr”. E. Musnaf Ibn Abi Shayba from Ata’a:“Ata’a said he found people offering twenty three Rakah Salat including Witr”. F. Bayhaqi narrated from Abu al-Khaseeb:“Sowaid bin Ghafla (a Sahabi) used to do abulution in Ramadhan and offer five resting periods of twenty Rakah.” G. Mussanif Ibn Abi Shayba from Sa’eed bin Abaid: “Ali bin Rabia used to lead us in give “Tarweehas” and three Witr during Ramadhan”. How Dare Any Truth-seeker To Claimed Umar's Bid'ah of Tarawih is equal and the same as Muhammad's Sunnah of Qiyyam Layl! |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Maakhir(m): 1:51pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
Taraweeh, was not a Bidaa and was practiced during the prophets saw lifetime. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 1:56pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
Maakhir:  Perhaps you want to teach Umar ibn al-Khattab who retort:"...What a good Bid'ah (i.e. innovation in religion) this is (i.e tarawih prayer); BUT THE PRAYER WHICH THEY DO NOT PERFORM BUT SLEEP AT ITS TIME IS BETTER THAN THE ONE THEY ARE OFFERING.’ He meant the prayer in the last part of the night (Tahajjud)." ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 32, No 227 Perhaps you prefer what is better than what is not. Kindly be civil, read the OP submission, respond appropriately and stop showing desperation. Salam. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Maakhir(m): 2:01pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
AlBaqir: When did I show desperation. I shall respond tomorrow. BTW, I did read the OP Submission and you did not put much thought into it, relying on the opinion of one 'sheikh' |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 3:32pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
Maakhir: When you said it is not a Bid'ah whereas Umar said it is. May Allah make it easy for you to respond. Maakhir: Ma sha Allah. Whether I put much thought to it or not will be reveal, in sha Allah, in your promised responds. Sheik Fawzan's opinion is the same for almost all Sunni, Salafi-wahabi's opinion except for Ibn Taymiyyah who further reasoned that "Since, the prophet ordered we should follow the Sunnah of his Rightly Guided Khalifs and Umar is one of the 'rightly guided khalif, then the Tarawih is valid" * That sounds tantalizing. It is however a claim without support. There is no single hadith or report where the holy prophet ever made Umar to be one of his "Rightly Guided Khalif". It is a mere conjecture and wish list of Ibn Taymiyyah and many Sunni Ulama. In fact, the holy Prophet (peace be on him and his household) emphatically made it clear that Khalifa is ONLY from his progeny. Allama al-Bani document as quoted by Imam Ahmad ibn Hanbali: "I left behind over you TWO KHALIFAH (khalifatain); the Book of God...and my progeny, my ahl al-bayt. Both shall not separate from each other until they meet me at the hawz" I hope in your response you bring this up again for proper elaboration and clarification. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Nobody: 5:26pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
AlBaqir: all what u've been saying since didn't entice me, but the most tragic of all is when you wrote ill about Seyidina Umar. Since you didn't accept Umar (a.s) as a rightly guided caliph, why then did you believe in his words. The only hadith you've quoted so far about your claims that there is bid'ahatu hassan (good innovation) is from Umar. Since you don't believe in him, why then did you believe in the sayings of Umar? |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 5:56pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
2undexy: Its a free world. Nabi Noah preached for 965years yet very few believed in him. Even his family rejected him. Truth is truth whether one believe or not. Those who will believe will believe. 2undexy: Where's the ill I wrote about Umar? He said he established Bid'ah. I quoted him, and his reasons. Is that "ill"? 2undexy: @underlined, Qur'an urged us to verify. Umar's statement was true for it confirmed the statement of the holy prophet: "...SO YOU PEOPLE, OFFER THIS PRAYER AT YOUR HOMES, FOR THE BEST PRAYER OF A PERSON IS THE ONE WHICH HE OFFERS AT HOME EXCEPT THE COMPULSORY (CONGREGATIONAL) PRAYER" ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 73, No.134 It is still remain Sunni's headache to provide prove how Umar was a "Rightly Guided Khalif". A Rightly Guided Khalif will never contradict Qur'an and the Sunnah. Apart from the issue of Tarawih, here's another narration among MANY others: ISSUE OF TAYYAMUM (Dry Ablution) Allah says in his Book concerning Tayyamum: "O ye who believe! when ye prepare for prayer, wash your faces, and your hands (and arms) to the elbows; Rub your heads and your feet to the ankles. If ye are in a state of ceremonial impurity, bathe your whole body. But if ye are ill, or on a journey, or one of you cometh from offices of nature, or ye have been in contact with women, and ye find no water, then take for yourselves clean sand or earth, and rub therewith your faces and hands, Allah doth not wish to place you in a difficulty, but to make you clean, and to complete his favour to you, that ye may be grateful." ~ Surah al-maidahh: 5 UMAR's OPPOSITION "Abd al-Rabmin b. Abza narrated it on the authority of his father that a man came to ‘Umar and said: I am (at times) affected by seminal emission but find no water. He (‘Umar) told him NOT to pray. ‘Ammar then said. Do you remember, O Commander of the Faithful, when I and you were in a military detachment and we had had a seminal emission and did not find water (for taking bath) and you did not say prayer, but as for myself I rolled in dust and said prayer, and (when it was mentioned before) the Apostle (may peace be upon him) said: It was enough for you to strike the ground with your hands and then blow (the dust) and then wipe your face and palms. Umar said: ‘Ammar, fear Allah. He said: If you so like, I would not narrate it. ~Sahih Muslim Book 003, Number 0718 Shaqiq reported: I was sitting in the company of Abdullah and Abu Musa when Abu Musa said: 0 ‘Abd al-Rahman (kunya of ‘Abdullah b. Mas’ud), what would you like a man to do about the prayer if he experiences a seminal emission or has sexual intercourse but does not find water for a month? ‘Abdullah said: He should not perform tayammum even if he does not find water for a month. ‘Abdullah said: Then what about the verse in Sura Ma’ida:” If you do not find water, betake yourself to clean dust”? ‘Abdullah said: If they were granted concession on the basis of this verse, there is a possibility that they would perform tayammum with dust on finding water very cold for themselves. Abu Musa said to Abdullah: You have not heard the words of ‘Ammar: The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) sent me on an errand and I had a seminal emission, but could find no water, and rolled myself in dust just as a beast rolls itself. I came to the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) then and made a mention of that to him and he (the Holy Prophet) said: It would have been enough for you to do thus. Then he struck the ground with his hands once and wiped his right hand with the help of his left hand and the exterior of his palms and his face. ‘Abdullah said: Didn’t you see that Umar was not fully satisfied with the words of 'Ammar only? ~Sahih Muslim, Book 003, Number 0716 Such a Khalif is not "Rightly Guided". |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Nobody: 8:10pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
AlBaqir: so because of these your so called misconception that's why u defied him?? It was reported that when Umar embraced Islam, jubree (as) descend and said " O Muhammad (S.a.w), |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 9:00pm On Jan 07, 2015 |
2undexy: "..so whoever follows the right way, it is for his own soul and whoever errs, he errs only to its detriment..." Hmm...you pay too much attention to Albaqir rather than the truth@bold. If you follow personality in searching the truth, you will never find it. "Follow the truth and you will recognize its people"~Imam Ali. 2undexy: Who am I? Haven't you read the Qur'an? "...And whoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed - then it is those who are the disbelievers. ...And whoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed - then it is those who are the wrongdoers. ...And whoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed - then it is those who are the defiantly disobedient." ~sura al-Maidah: 44 - 48 What I showed you so far is 1 out of 10s. Here's Muhammad (peace be on him and his household) before he died: Anas b. Malik reports: "The Prophet, peace be upon him, said, "Some persons from amongst those who kept me company will meet me at the Lake-fount. I will see them, and they will be presented to me. Then, they will be forced away from me. I will say: 'O my Lord, my Sahabah! My Sahabah.' It will be said to me: 'You do not know what they INNOVATED after you.'" ~Sahih Muslim, vol. 4, p. 1800, #2304 (40) 2undexy: Allahu Akbar! |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by sino(m): 1:06am On Jan 08, 2015 |
@Albaqir, may Allah (SWT) Bless you and make you a better Muslim and everyone of us ameen. You have good arguments about Milad, to me, whether we like it or not, The Prophet’s (SAW) birthday is a remarkable day, and if not for anything, we should make his life known to the world in the day/month that he was born and most importantly in everyday of our lives by following his Sunnah. AlBaqir, you sometimes can’t help it I have noticed, you always like looking for the misguidance of Umar (ra) and Abu Bakr (ra). In your subsequent posts to argue in favour of your views, you decided to go the way which I must say is distasteful…May Allah (SWT) guide us aright amen. First, I would like you to read and digest this narration below… عن الصادق عن آبائه عن علي عليه السلام قال: «أوصيكم بأصحاب نبيكم لا تسبوهم، الذين لم يحدثوا بعده حدثاً، ولم يئووا محدثاً؛ فإن رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم أوصى بهم الخير Ali(as) said:“I order to you regarding the Companions (ra) of Muhammad (SAW), don’t criticize them, They were the people after the Prophet (SAW), who did not bring any innovation in the deen and never supported any innovation and the Prophet (SAW) ordered to behave well towards them” Bihar al-Anwar 22/305 Honestly I have no intention to go on a long debate with you on this issue, I just felt like pointing out few things I observed… 1. So you say taraweeh is different from tahajud, the hadith of Umar(ra) says Sahabas were praying in the mosque individually, and in small groups, what were these sahabas praying?! Was it Taraweeh or tahajud before Umar united them behind one qari (reciter)? Are both not offered after salatul isha?! These hadiths are under the ramadhan/fasting /taraweeh heading, do you think the compilers of these hadiths do not know what they were talking about?! 2. For someone who agrees that we can do more than what was prescribed by the Prophet (SAW), is the Tahajud of the Prophet (SAW) not a nawafil, is there any narration that the Prophet (SAW) fixed number for it? Did Umar(ra) made it mandatory to pray 20? 3. On tayammum, may Allah grant you the understanding of that which you write ameen. Are you not also the front runner of the fact that not everything is documented?! Do you know the conditions that warranted Umar (ra) to give the ruling to the questioner? Is this how you come to conclusion about these sahabas?! Please read the below hadith from Sahih Bukhari about the same issue… Narrated Shaqiq bin Salama: I was with 'Abdullah and Abu Musa; the latter asked the former, "O Abu Abdur-Rahman! What is your opinion if somebody becomes Junub and no water is available?" 'Abdullah replied, "Do not pray till water is found." Abu Musa said, "What do you say about the statement of 'Ammar (who was ordered by the Prophet to perform Tayammum). The Prophet said to him: "Perform Tayammum and that would be sufficient." 'Abdullah replied, "Don't you see that 'Umar was not satisfied by 'Ammar's statement?" Abu- Musa said, "All right, leave 'Ammar's statement, but what will you say about this verse (of Tayammum)?" 'Abdullah kept quiet and then said, "If we allowed it, then they would probably perform Tayammum even if water was available, if one of them found it (water) cold." The narrator added, "I said to Shaqiq, "Then did 'Abdullah dislike to perform Tayammum because of this?" He replied, "Yes." (Sahih Bukhari volume 1 hadith no. 342) 4. I now ask you Albaqir, did Umar (ra) die a kafir? Why would you want to attribute misguidance to him without any benefit of a doubt?! Do you ever find excuse for your brother (as instructed by the Prophet (SAW)) who had preceded you in faith?! We know the Sahabas were human, thus were fallible, how did Allah (SWT) say we should address such in the Qur’an? Allah says in the Quran: Those who have come after them say, Our Lord, forgive us and our brethren who preceded us in faith. And do not put in our hearts rancour towards the Believers. Our Lord, You are Most Kind, Most Merciful.” Quran (59:10). Where do you leave the narrations of the Prophet (SAW) about his companions O AlBaqir?! The Prophet (صلّى الله عليه وآله وسلّم) said: “Allah, Allah! Fear Him with regard to my Sahabah! Do not make them targets after me! Whoever loves them loves them with his love for me; and whoever hates them hates them with his hatred for me. Whoever bears enmity for them, bears enmity for me; and whoever bears enmity for me, bears enmity for Allah. Whoever bears enmity for Allah is about to perish!” (Narrated from Abdallah ibn Mughaffal by Al-Tirmidhi, by Ahmad with three good chains in his Musnad, al-Bukhari in his Tarikh, al-Bayhaqi in Shu`ab al-Iman, and others. Al-Suyuti declared it hasan in his Jami` al-Saghir #1442). ن الرضا ، عن آبائه عليهم السلام قال : قال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله : من سب نبيا قتل ، ومن سب أصحابي جلد Imam Reza has narrated through his forefathers that the Prophet (saw) said : One who kills a prophet should be killed, and one who talks ill about his companions should be flogged. [Bihar al anwar, Vol. 76, p. 222] Shaikh ul Islaam Ibn Hajr al-‘Asqalaani Rahimahullah in the preface of al Isaabah quotes Imam Abu Zura’h ar-Razi Rahimahullah (d.264 H) he said: When you see a man who criticizes any one of the companions of Rasoolullah (Sallalaahu Alyhi wa Sallam) then know that he is a zindeeq (Disbeliever who claims to be Muslim). The reason is that the Rasoolullah (Sallalaahu Alyhi wa Sallam) is Truthful and the Quraan is Truthful and what Rasoolullah (Sallalaahu Alyhi wa Sallam) was sent with is the Truth, and these things have been brought to us by the Sahaabah (Radhi Allaahu Ta’ala ‘anhum). The Sahaabah (Radhi Allaahu Ta’ala ‘anhum) are our witnesses to this therefore whosoever discredits or ridicules any one of them intends to discredit the Quraan and the Sunnah. Therefore these people are themselves worthy of criticism and they are Zanaadeeq. Albaqir you only quote one hadith which is this… Anas b. Malik reports: "The Prophet, peace be upon him, said, "Some persons from amongst those who kept me company will meet me at the Lake-fount. I will see them, and they will be presented to me. Then, they will be forced away from me. I will say: 'O my Lord, my Sahabah! My Sahabah.' It will be said to me: 'You do not know what they INNOVATED after you.'" ~Sahih Muslim, vol. 4, p. 1800, #2304 (40) I think this is an issue way beyond you; it is a matter of hereafter, the ghayb which only Allah (SWT) knows. Do you think these sahabas didn’t learn about this narration? Or do you have the lists of these sahabas that innovated, and you are sure of their innovations in the deen? Can you vouch for yourself that you are rightly guided before contesting the guidance of Umar (ra) who saw the blessed face of our beloved Prophet (SAW), ate and drank with him, fought battles with him and learnt directly from him?! Assalam alaykum. And Allah (SWT) Knows Best. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Empiree: 1:14am On Jan 08, 2015 |
sino: First, I would like you to read and digest this narration below… 1 Like |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Empiree: 1:21am On Jan 08, 2015 |
@sino: 2. For someone who agrees that we can do more than what was prescribed by the Prophet (SAW), is the Tahajud of the Prophet (SAW) not a nawafil, is there any narration that the Prophet (SAW) fixed number for it? Did Umar(ra) made it mandatory to pray 20?Absolutely not What do you mean by not doing more nawafil? I got this... On the authority of Abu Hurayrah raDiy-Allahu-anhu.gif may Allah be pleased with him, who said that the Messenger of Allah said: Allah - may His Majesty be exalted ! - said: "Whosoever shows enmity to someone devoted to Me, I shall be at war with him. "My servant draws not near to Me with anything more loved by Me than the religious duties I have enjoined upon him, and My servant continues to draw near to Me with supererogatory works so that I shall love him. "When I love him I am his hearing with which he hears, his seeing with which he sees, his hand with which he strikes and his foot with which he walks. "Were he to ask [something] of Me, I would surely give it to him, and were he to ask Me for refuge, I would surely grant him it. I do not hesitate about anything as much as I hesitate about [seizing] the soul of My faithful servant: he hates death and I hate hurting him." It was related by al-Bukhari. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Empiree: 1:24am On Jan 08, 2015 |
In a similar tradition, the Messenger of Allah said: "Allah said, 'I will declare war against him who shows hostility to a friend* (walî) of Mine. "And the most beloved things with which My slave comes nearer to Me, is what I have enjoined (frD) upon him; and My slave keeps on coming closer to Me through performing nawâfil (praying or doing extra deeds besides what is obligatory) till I love him, "so I become his sense of hearing with which he hears, and his sense of sight with which he sees, and his hand with which he grips, and his leg with which he walks; "and if he asks Me, I will give him, and if he asks My protection (Refuge), I will protect him; (i.e. give him My Refuge) and I do not hesitate to do anything as I hesitate to take the soul of the believer, for he hates death, and I hate to disappoint him." Narrated by Abu Huraira in Bukhari, vol 8, hadith 509 * "Friend of Allah" (walî) is sometimes translated as "pious worshipers of Allah", thus degrading their rank, diminishing their importance for the believers and the whole of the Ummah. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Empiree: 1:26am On Jan 08, 2015 |
Comment on the above traditions by Shaykh Ibn Ata` Allah raDiy-Allahu-anhu: "Lend a close ear, then - may Allah be gracious unto you - to what this tradition conveys about the abundance of the saint's power and eminence of the rank which the Truth (al-Haqq) has granted him. The Prophet MHMD declared: "Whosoever shows enmity to any of My friends, has declared war upon me." For the friend of Allah has gone from disposing of his own affairs to relying upon Allah's disposal thereof; from defending himself to allowing Allah to defend him; from (trusting in his own) power and strength to (trusting in Allah's) by his sincere reliance on Allah. As Allah- may His Majesty be exalted ! - declares, "for everyone who places his trust in Allah, He (alone) is enough." Sura 65-3 He likewise declares. "... for We had willed it upon ourselves to succor the believers." Sura 30-47 This (distinction) was theirs because they had made Allah their ultimate concern, as a result of which He drove back from them all that was other than He, fulfilling the obligation which He had set for Himself to come to their defense. KLM30/31 Note, I dislike the use of "saint". I'd stick to waliy, preferably 1 Like |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Empiree: 1:51pm On Jan 08, 2015 |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 5:28pm On Jan 08, 2015 |
sino: Illahi ameen. Thanks for the du'a brother. I appreciate it and pray more for you and all muslims. sino: Ma sha Allah. May Allah purify your heart more for the love of Muhammad (peace be on him and his household). Rabiul awwal 12th - 17th is usually declare Unity week in Iran. Here, the government used to invite scholars from various sects and Nations, Christians and Jewish scholars too are never left out. And the deliberation is nothing other than personality of Muhammad. Isn't this a good act than declaring Mawlud to bid'ah? ********** sino: You have misjudge my point of argument in these posts pertaining to "Mawlud Nabiyy". MrOlai also misjudge perhaps due to initial accusations. Why does Umar came into the fore? Its about his classification of Tarawih under "Bid'ah Hassana (good innovation)". I believe truly in that. Last year tbaba1234 ironed out this tarawih misconception at maclatunji's side talk show. I stated it clearly there that I do not see any evil in observing tarawih, only that it is not a sunnah of Muhammad as sunni want us to believe. www.nairaland.com/1794405/islam-muslims-side-talk-station/1#down However when sheik like Saalih Fawzan and his likes continue arguing there's nothing like "good innovation", that Bid'ah is Bid'ah; and that what Umar meant by the statement is just linguistic, then I found it disgusting and dishonest. So technically I used Umar's "Good Innovation" to support my argument (about Mawlud) rather than condemning him. *********** sino: First, the translation of this hadith is faulty. It is "CURSE" not "criticize"@underline. Whoever has translated that did it deliberately to support his belief. Besides, the hadith is daeef at the least. Looking at the full sanad, there are lots of names classified as "Majhool". Please read more here: shiaonlinelibrary.com/ Second, if we accept this daeef hadith, it is still crystal clear in its message "Do not curse those who never innovated any innovation after him (the prophet) and they never supported any innovation". THIS EXCLUDE THE INNOVATORS. There are plenty Sunni ahadith that exposed many sahaba who innovated, and other ahadith from the prophet who foretold some known sahaba will innovate after him, and he will disown them on the day of judgment. Third, Shi'i Mujtahid have repeatedly and continously declared CURSE sahaba (righteous or not) publicly as HARAM. Whatever you do at your private life, is between you and your lord. IN MY NL HISTORY SO FAR, ALBAQIR HAVE NEVER CURSE ANY SAHABA Here's my thread on the fatwa of Shi'a Ulama that forbid Cursing sahaba: www.nairaland.com/1903995/religious-authority-sistani-condemns-cursing sino: Please anytime you comment or reply a thread, try to see beyond yourself. Threads and posts are viewed beyond two people. That has always been my approach to responses. However, Hot or cold, long or short, in sha Allah I will try to be concise to avoid derailing from the main topic. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 5:57pm On Jan 08, 2015 |
sino: Whatever they are praying, which to me is not condemnable, is definitely not Muhammad's commanded and practiced Qiyam Layl. First, there is no doubt many Sahaba innovated after the demise of the holy prophet (peace be on him and his household). Imam al-Bukhari: Ahmad b. Ishkab - Muhammad b. Fudayl - al-'Ala b. Al-Musayyab - his father (al-Musayyab): "I met al-Bara b. Azib and I said, "Congratulations to you! You kept company of the prophet, peace be upon him, and gave him ba'yah under the tree.' As a result of this, he replied, "O son of my brother, you do not know what WE HAVE INNOVATED after him." ~Sahih al-Bukhari vol.4 p. 1529, #3937 NB: But we need to be extra careful as not all "innovations" can be condemned. Some are good. In fact I do not even see anything Nawafil as Bid'ah just because we don't see evidence that prophet did it unless for what is obvious like reciting salat fatih instead of sura al-Fatiha. Second, the statement of Umar "That which they will sleep before praying is better than this one they are praying" testify they are not praying Tahajjud/Qiyam layl. Whatever they are praying is born out of their discretions, No Problem here. Third, there are excuses we can infer as well. * Those sahaba might be among the ahl saffah - the destitute whose house is the Prophet's mosque. * Some might secluded himself in the mosque, being Ramadhan, and the adab of staying in the mosque is do not be redundant. Find something rewarding doing. * These are my excuses for them especially when we dissect the prophet's specific saying "So, you people should go and pray at home, for the prayer of a person at home is BEST except the obligatory prayers". sino: Don't try to be cunning brother. Technically both are prayed 'after' salat Ishai. The difference is highlighted even in the wording of Umar himself when he said: {BUT THE PRAYER WHICH THEY DO NOT PERFORM BUT SLEEP AT ITS TIME IS BETTER THAN THE ONE THEY ARE OFFERING.’He meant the prayer in the last part of the night (Tahajjud)."} ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 32, No 227 * And that is the command of Allah in the Qur'an as highlighted in the OP. And that is the Sunnah of Muhammad. Sleep after salat Ishai then wake up to pray. (or delayed till mid-night): 1/2 of the night, 1/3 of the night, 1/4 later part of the night = all these are specified in sura al-Mudassir. * Tarawih of Umar, even as seen being followed till date has nothing to do with Tahajjud of the Quran and Sunnah of Muhammad. sino: There are lots of hadith placed by the compilers under an heading yet have nothing to do with the headings. Then, there are lots of headings giving to set of hadith that do not fit the content of those ahadith. If you do study books of ahadith, you can easily confirm this. * It might be deliberate or not deliberate by the compiler especially the former when such hadith has things to do with his aqeedah. sino: Yes there is specific number for Prophet's Tahajjud. Anything outside it is definitely not Tahajjud but other form of personal or among other prophet's nawafil e.g You might decided to observe Salat Tasbih (4rakah), Salat Hajah (2rakah) in the mid-night before Salat Tahajjud. All of them are among Prophet's Sunnah. As per Tahajjud, here's 'Aisha: [color=990000]Narrated Abu Salma bin ‘Abdur Rahman: I asked ‘Aisha, “How is the prayer of Allah’s Apostle during the month of Ramadan.” She said, “Allah’s Apostle never exceeded eleven Rakat in Ramadan or in other months; [i.e. throughout whole year] he used to offer four Rakat– do not ask me about their beauty and length, then four Rakat, do not ask me about their beauty and length, and then three Rakat.” Aisha further said, “I said, ‘O Allah’s Apostle! Do you sleep before offering the Witr prayer?’ He replied, ‘O ‘Aisha! My eyes sleep but my heart remains awake’!”[/color] ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 2, Book 21, No.248 *************** sino: What athar reported is Umar established 20Rakah, but technically especially going by his ruling on Mut'a where he attached punishment of stoning for whoever practice it, we can infer he made it no obligatory. But you can "appreciate" how much importance people attached to it today esp in places like Saudi Arabia, and our local society et al. People even go as far as completing the whole Qur'an during Tarawih for the month. sino: Aamin to your prayer while I prayed the same, even more for you akhi. Yes not everything is documented but in the case of Umar and Ammar vs Tayammum, ALL we need to know regarding conditions of Tayammum is documented coupled with explicit order of the Qur'an. sino: @Bolds kindly follow me while we analyze what is OBVIOUS except we intend to close the door of our reasoning just for emotional feeling for some persons. ********** Tayammum is documented with its condition CLEARLY STATED in the holy Qur'an. Twice, Allah mentions Tayammum. So there's no excuse whatsoever for anybody. The statements of Allah on Tayamum reads: "O you who believe! When you intend to offer As-Salat (the prayer), wash your faces and your hands up to the elbows, rub your heads, and your feet up to ankles. If you are in a state of Janaba, purify yourself. But if you are ill or on a journey or any of you comes from answering the call of nature, or you have been in contact with women AND YOU FIND NO WATER, then perform Tayammum with clean earth and rub therewith your faces and hands. Allah does not want to place you in difficulty, but He wants to purify you, and to complete His Favour on you that you may be thankful." You can even appreciate how other sahaba cited the Sunnah of the Prophet and a clear ayah of Tayammum for the sahaba who ruled NO prayer. And amazingly, his defence was the fact Umar did not satisfy with Ammar's reminder. Qur'an is emphatic concerning Allah's divine ruling: "...And whoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed - then it is those who are the wrongdoers. ...And whoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed - then it is those who are the defiantly disobedient." ~sura al-Maidah: 44 - 48 This is my submission. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 6:19pm On Jan 08, 2015 |
sino: Kafir? Absolutely NO! He definitely died a Muslim with all the conditions of being a Muslim. Anything outside this, I do not believe. Imam ibn Hibban (d. 354H) records the Treaty of al-Hudaybiyyah (6AH): "So, Umar ibn al-Khattab, may Allah be pleased with him, said (about the Day of al-Hudaybiyyah): "By Allah! I never doubted since I accepted Islam EXCEPT on that day. So I went to the Prophet, peace be upon him, and said, 'Are you not truly the Messenger of Allah?" ~Sahih Ibn Hibban bi Tartib Ibn Balban, vol. 11, p. 216, #4872. 'Allamah al-Albani comments: Sahih Sheik Shua'ib al-Arnaut: It is sahih. [Both as annotators of the above reference] This is doubting the Prophethood of Muhammad. Conversely, Qur'an says: "The Mu'min are those who have believed in Allah and His Messenger, and do not doubt afterwards..." ~Quran 49:15 So there's difference between Muslim and Mu'min. * Oh Oh Oh...he has repented after that, and Allah has forgiven him...! #Is there evidence of this? The reverse is the case as far as Qur'an and ahadith are concern. What came to mind are Battle of Khaybar (7AH), he ran away; Battle of Hunain (8/9AH), he was among the runners; then, incident of surah al-Hujurat (9AH); at the deathbed of the Prophet; Even of Saqifa of Bani Saidah after the demise of the holy Prophet. {I reserve my comments brother lest you accuse Albaqir of cursing or abusing Umar}. sino: Did I formulate anything about Umar myself? My crime as always been I do not buy the interpretations of Sunni Ulama to justify many ahadith that expose him. You see the difference between you and I is that Albaqir search the truth at the expense of any personality. My Mawla and the Mawla of every believers says {"Search the truth, and you will recognize its people"}. On the other hand, you want to reach the truth through personalities. Only Muhammad (peace be upon him and his household) fit that category. "And mix not truth with falsehood, nor conceal the truth while you know." ~sura al-Baqarah:42 The position Umar ibn al-Khattab occupied made him centre of attraction. One can turn apostate or believer in the character of Umar's Khilafa, if not carefully study. This is the issue of Khilafa whose obedience is synonymous to the holy Prophet as stated in the Qur'an. The chaos, fights and sectarian muslims find themselves today was originated by him and his like thinking the "evil" had been averted. Imam al-Bukhari records: "Ibn Abbas: I used to teach qirat to some men...'Abd al-Rahman came to me and said, "If only you had seen a man who came to Amir al-Muminin today, saying: "O Amir al-Muminin! What do you say about so-and-so? He says, "When Umar dies, I will pledge allegiance to so-and-so, for, I swear by Allah, the pledge of allegiance given to Abu Bakr was nothing but an ERROR and it succeeded" So, Umar became angry...sat on the pulpit...praised Allah as He deserved. Then he said: "I have been informed that a speaker amongst you says, 'When Umar dies, I will pledge allegiance to so-and-so.' One should not deceive oneself by saying that the pledge of allegiance given to Abu Bakr was an error and it succeeded. NO DOUBT, IT WAS SURELY LIKE THAT. However, Allah saved from its EVIL...Ansar opposed us and gathered, all of them, at Saqifah Bani Sa'idah; and 'Ali, al-Zubayr and whoever was with them both, also opposed us; and the Muhajiruns gathered towards Abu Bakr..." ~Sahih al-Bukhari, vol. 6, p. 2503, #6442. In fact, same Sahih al-Bukhari documented 'Ali NEVER recognized the Khilafa of Abu Bakr until after six months, ONLY when people were expressing animosity towards him.{Sahih bukhari Volume 5, Book 59, Number 546}. Yet after that conditioned allegiance and recognition of Abu Bakr's Khilafa, Imam Muslim in his Sahih documented Imam 'Ali's thought of the two. Sahih Muslim quotes 'Umar saying to both Imam 'Ali and al-Abbas: "When the Messenger of Allah, peace be upon him, died, Abu Bakr said: "I am the wali of the Messenger of Allah, peace be upon him."...So both of you ('Ali and Abbas) thought him (i.e Abu Bakr) to be a LIAR, SINFUL, a TRAITOR and DISHONEST. And Allah knows that he was really truthful, pious, rightly-guided and a follower of the truth. Abu Bakr died and I became the wali of the Messenger of Allah, peace be upon him, and the wali of the Abu Bakr. So both of you thought me to be a LIAR, SINFUL, a TRAITOR and DISHONEST. ~Sahih Muslim, vol. 3, p. 1376, #1757 These are very long ahadith, but my point is the Evil their Khaliphacy brought to this Ummah was never averted. It continues till date to the point of bloodshed. Prophet was clear in his statement {"I left for you TWO KHALIFAs so long you follow them, you will NEVER go astray; the Book of Allah...and my progeny, my ahl al-bayt..."}. ***************** sino: Sadaqa 'Allahu al-Kareem. Here Allah clearly highlight@underline. Who are the "believers"? I have given you an ayah before : *They do not doubt after they have believed. There are other attributes spelt out in the Qur'an as well. So it depend on who meet those attributes based on what is documented about them. sino: First, If the message of Muhammad (peace be upon him and his household) is timeless, then the first receipents of the message are the sahaba themselves. So the Prophet was actually addressing and warning his companions about "his companions"  * This give a clue that the word "my companions" in this hadith, and other ahadith {e.g hadith that says some companions will be showed the way to hell-fire, whereby the prophet will exclaim: MY COMPANIONS, MY COMPANIONS! And it will be said to him "They have Apostatized and innovate after you left them}, do not refer to every tom, dick and harry sahaba. Second, Qur'an repeatedly exposed that there are Munafiq (hypocrites) among the companions of the holy Prophet; Allah not only rebuked them but also cursed them. There are also these 12 - 14 sahaba who planned to assassinate the holy Prophet until Allah exposed them. Then, there are also those sahabas who accused the Prophet of Madness and talking nonsense, on his death-bed...Are those also part of the above-mentioned sahaba we are warned not to hate, talk ill about, Mr Sino? Third, the hadith is crystal clear for the Prophet conditioned their love with his. Thereby, these "companions" must be a true follower of Prophet, a true lover of the Prophet not those who doubt his prophethood, ran away from war thereby exposed prophet to severe danger, plot against him, accused him of madness etc. A Case Study Of That "My Companion" Imam Muslim in his Sahih under the "Merits of Ali", document that Mu'awiyyah Ibn Abi Sufyan ordered Sa'd Ibn Abi Waqqas to CURSE 'Ali ibn Abi Talib (as). Sa'd refused to do so and he tender 3 "exceptional Merits"(in his words) of 'Ali that makes it difficult for him to curse or abuse 'Ali. Does 'Ali deserve and continue to deserve this merits is subject to scrutiny! *There are so much examples in this regard. ***************** sino: Here's the footnotes to this hadith: بل السند ضعيف جدا It is a da'eef chain" http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/ But for the sake of Argument, should the hadith be Sahih/Hassan, it has to be treated in line with the previous hadith you posted in Bihar al-Anwar. ******************* |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 6:37pm On Jan 08, 2015 |
sino: I wonder what Ibn Hajar's verdicts will be for those who Curse or Abuse the sahaba. Really that's Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani's opinion as a Sunni who believed in 'Infallibility' of the companion. However, the holy Prophet (peace be upon him and his household) is crystal clear in this regards: "Narrated AbuHurayrah: The Prophet (peace be upon him) said: The gravest sin is going to lengths in talking unjustly against a Muslim’s honour, and it is a major sin to abuse twice for abusing once." Sunnan Abu Dawud, Book 41, Number 4859 Do I criticize "these companions" unjustly? Do I tried to find 1001 reasons and excuse to justify their rash acts before criticized? Does their criticism born out of the evil consequences of their acts, or just personal emotional reasons? sino: Well, that's your thought perhaps with a believe that ALL sahaba are righteous. Hadith in this regards are plentiful with clear words. Qur'an too is crystal clear in this regard. Then there is personal and historical confessions of some sahaba themselves for their Innovations after the death of the Prophet. Some even went extra miles in killing the family of their prophet. There's nothing Ghayb in this. Qur'an has given them judgment. Then there's nothing Ghayb (hidden) here especially when you choose to emulate the character of a Sahabi, then it become mandatory for you to know such a Sahabi. If you see evils in his character and you bury it, or you see truth yet you fail to recognize and embrace it or you equate evil and good together, then Allah warns: "..so whoever follows the right way, it is for his own soul and whoever errs, he errs only to its detriment..." How many are those learn and know the truth but do not follow it! Please Let it be known that Shi'a or Albaqir only criticized the hypocrites and evil ones among the sahaba. We respect and pray a lot for the righteous among them. So do not make it sound as if I criticize or hate ALL sahaba with no exceptions. ***************** sino: How many are those who learnt but do not follow! How many are those who are commanded but do not pay heed! How many are those who believe then revert! Haven't you read ahadith where the Prophet (peace be upon him and his household) foretold the Apostacy of some companions? sino: What you have documented inside your sahih books are enough to know the innovators. Yet, you either re-interpret their innovations or see nothing wrong in it. Unto Allah is our final abode, and He is the best judge. sino: Since when is it a guarantee and direct passport for salvation and paradise {"whoever saw the blessed face of Muhammad, ate and drank with him, and learnt from him"}? In fact, the criteria for salvation and paradise as stated by Allah and His Prophet out of these your set criteria. Are the polytheist, the jews, the christians, the Munafiq not saw the holy Prophet and his manifest guidance and message, ate with him and learnt from him? Yet, not ALL believe in him. The path I choose for myself is the path of the Legacy left by Muhammad (peace be upon him and his household): "I left behind over you TWO KHALIFAH (khalifatain); the Book of God...and my progeny, my ahl al-bayt. Both shall not separate from each other until they meet me at the hawz" "I left behind over you TWO WEIGHTY THINGS so that if you adhere to it, you will NEVER go astray; the Book of Allah...and my progeny, my Ahl al-Bayt..." There's no guarantee for anything outside this for the exclusive words of Muhammad is the Truth. Personally, I pray and hopeful Allah will have mercy on my insignificant works for the sake of Muhammad and his household. sino: Wa alaykum salam. Thanks for your time wa Fi amanillah. sino: He knows best, and the little clarity man knows, he is left to choose the path of guidance or conceal the truth. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Empiree: 6:52pm On Jan 08, 2015 |
What do you mean @bold Albqir?. Do you mean some people recite salat fatih in place of sura al-Fatiha at the beginning of 5 daily salat etc?I never saw anyone do that. Thats pure misguidance and bid'ah if there is. NB: But we need to be extra careful as not all "innovations" can be condemned. Some are good. In fact I do not even see anything Nawafil as Bid'ah just because we don't see evidence that prophet did it unless for what is obvious like reciting salat fatih instead of sura al-Fatiha. I dont quiet understand sino's intention by his statement which i tackled earlier. Is he saying nawafil is wrong and bid'ah?. I found this strange. 2. For someone who agrees that we can do more than what was prescribed by the Prophet (SAW), is the Tahajud of the Prophet (SAW) not a nawafil, |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 10:32pm On Jan 08, 2015 |
Empiree: Yeah! There are some groups like that stem from this modern day Sufi-tariqa. Empiree: Sino's intention is that: He thought Albaqir's point of arguments are that Tarawih, a non-obligatory Nawafil, is a Bid'ah of misguidance that leads to Hell-fire. Therefore, he found my arguments inconsistent with my initial arguments and campaign that "anything Nawafil, dhikr etc outside what is documented are not Bid'ah; that they are just personal efforts to Ibaadat". So, he misunderstood completely and not knowing I was using Tarawih to justify my arguments on Mawlud since both falls under "Bid'at Hassana" if we are to follow Umar's and other mainstream Sunni scholar's viewpoint. So while Sino stood my his "don't do outside what is documented", he tried to use my submissions against my arguments. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Empiree: 10:45pm On Jan 08, 2015 |
[quote author=AlBaqir post=29620026] So while Sino stood my his "don't do outside what is documented", he tried to use my submissions against my arguments.I see Yeah! There are some groups like that stem from this modern day Sufi-tariqa.As for this, is what are clearly bid'ah that should be condemned not pettiness within shariah. Although i have not see anyone does this but clearly, it's against established sunna in the obligatory salat. There is absolutely no excuse whatsoever for this. Also it's no excuse for others to condemn all sufi over this silly thing.I am sure their % are minimum. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by sino(m): 1:34pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
AlBaqir:Ameen, Jazakumullahu khayran  AlBaqir:Indeed, it is a laudable effort, in the Masjid i offer Jumu'ah, what my Sheikh usually do every month of milad, is to devote the khutbah for the biography of the Prophet (SAW), and this is no bid'ah. But making the day a eid, a holy day, is what is being contested, and rightly categorized as a bid'ah and i will present the argument in my subsequent posts... AlBaqir: Sheikh Ibn Taimiyah in his book “The Right Way” states: “Innovations are always undesirable. This point should be grasped as general rulings and principles of the religion. However, some people tend to categorize innovations under two heads: good and bad. In order to substantiate their claim they refer to this remark of Umar about Taraweeh prayer: “How good this innovation is?” ….As to the opponents they may take only the two positions: Either they should hold that once it is established that some innovations are good and others are bad, the bad one is that which has been forbidden by Shariah. As to the innovations about which Shariah is silent, they are not bad but may possibly be good. Or, they should say that such innovations are good in view of such and such advantages. That is, they do not hold the faith that each innovation is error. Our stance is that it is reported in authentic Hadith: “The worst deeds are innovation. Each innovation is error.” These are unmistakable statements of the Prophet (SAW) regarding innovations. It is not, therefore, proper for anyone to reject Hadith. One guilty of it is in error. The opponents may, however, argue that if something is endorsed by Shariah, it cannot be regarded as innovation. Given this, a general principle (each innovation is error) will be followed without making any exception. Or a practice of which sanctity is established, would be taken as an exception. And it is well known that the general principle is always applicable except in its exceptional cases. Otherwise every innovation would be held as an error according to the general ruling. So those who believe that certain innovations are exceptions, the onus lies on them for producing sound argument in defence of innovations. Otherwise every innovation would be held as an error according to the general rule. It should be realized that the arguments which exempt something from general principles should be based on Shariah. In orther words, these should be drawn from The Qur’an, Sunnah and consensus, whether directly or by implication. The views and practices of certain communities and persons cannot in any way supersede the Prophet’s saying.” “taraweeh prayer is not an innovation. That it is Sunnah is evident from Prophet’s words and deeds, for he said: “Allah has made fasting in Ramadan obligatory; and prayer therein is sunnah.” In the early part of Ramadan the Prophet (SAW) led congregational Taraweeh prayer three nights and he repeated the same on the last nights of Ramadan, saying: “when one prays behind Imam and stays till Imam finishes, he gets the reward for praying for the whole night.” The above hadith is reported by many Muhadditheen; and Imam Ahmad has inferred from the same that it is better to offer Traweeh prayer in congregation than individually. This hadith obviously exhorts us to offer Taraweeh prayer in congregation hence it is a clear Sunnah. Moreover, the Prophet (SAW) did no object to the companions praying Traweeh in congregation. His silence and the continuance of the practice are themselves a proof that it is Sunnah. As to Umar’s remark about Taraweeh that it is a good innovation, it leaves little room for the opponents to draw a fallacious conclusion. For, if on other occasions a religious command is mentioned with reference to the statement of Umar or any other companion, the very same persons declare that a companion’s statement is not a clinching argument. If this is the principle, Umar’s statements which contravenes the Prophet’s Sunnah cannot be a clinching argument. Moreover, those who regard a companion’s statement as a sound basis do concede the point that a statement which is contrary to Hadith cannot be reckoned. In any case it is not proper to cite a companion’s statement in opposition to Hadith. This is no doubt true that if a companion’s statement is not objected to by anyone, it may be used for making an exception to the general principle of hadith. In the light of the above what can be established, at most is that a particular innovation can be proved good. However, it leaves out other innovations. We must reiterate the point Umar branded Taraweeh prayer as good innovation. He, however, used a literal expression, not a Shariah one. It is common knowledge that innovation stands for such acts which are done without precedence. In Shariah terminology, innovation signifies an act which does not have any basis in Shariah. So, if one practices an act in the light of the Prophet’s conduct after his death and follows the same, for example, a practice initiated by Abu Bakr, (issuing a book of charity) it may be literally described as innovation in that it did not have any precedence….However, an act which is endorsed by the Qur’an and Sunnah is not an innovation according to Shariah, though it may be literally considered as innovation. For the literal meaning of innovation is much more wide ranging than its definition in Shariah. Obiously, in the Prophet’s statement: “Each innovation is error,” innovation is not taken in its literal sense…on the contrary, the Prophet’s reference is to such acts which are not prescribed by Shariah. Same holds true for treating the Prophet’s birthday as a sacred day. Muslims do so in imitation of the Christians who celebrate with much pomp and show Jesus’s birthday. They do so out of their love and respect for the Prophet (SAW). Allah would reward them for their love for the Prophet (SAW), but not for their innovation. Nonetheless, it should not be celebrated as a holy day. First, there is divergence of opinion about the exact date of his birth. Moreover, early Muslims did not celebrate it as a holy day though they could do so and there was apparently no obstacle to it. Had it been a really good thing, early Muslims would have celebrated it. For they loved the Prophet (SAW) more than us and were more virtuous than us. Yet they did not do so. (Sheikhul Islam Ibn Taymiyah.The Right Way, A summarised translation) AlBaqir: I find it quite interesting the ease of “daeefness” of narrations in your books that seems in synch with the sunni’s views, but what do I know about the shi’a’s science of hadith… There is absolutely no fault in the translation of the word “sabb” to mean criticize, in my dictionary, these are the translations given: to insult, abuse, call names, revile, rail, to curse, to blaspheme, curse, swear some of these words are related to criticize….When you criticize someone wrongly and dubiously, then you have insulted, abused and reviled that person. In fact if I was to translate this narration, I would have used “abuse”. There is also another hadith where the Prophet (SAW) was reported to have said “The abuse of a Muslim is a sin, and killing him is disbelief.” Take note of the word Muslim in the above narration. In this hadith, the same “sabb” word is used, you cannot abuse an ordinary Muslim, even if he sins, this was also the teaching of the best of mankind (SAW) when a sahabah abused a sinner (drunk) and the Prophet (SAW) reproached him not to do so but help his brother Muslim. All in all, you are not allowed to abuse an ordinary Muslim, talk more of a companion of the prophet (SAW). AlBaqir: Please can you list the innovations of these "Sahabahs" that deserved to be cursed and the list of the sahabahs to be disowned by the Prophet (SAW) on judgement day? i am interested in their names... AlBaqir: True, but in most cases, i can only speak for myself even though i know a lot of people share my beliefs. I know this is an open forum, posting here means it is not a discussion between me and you alone, the reason i find time to reply even when i am busy like a bumble bee ...Thanks for not derailing, but you have made some points that needs to be addressed a little which i believe is in line with the discussion at hand. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by sino(m): 1:55pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
AlBaqir: Please can you list the innovations this Sahabah was referring to? Was he referring to himself alone or the entirety of the sahabas? And Alhamdulilah you placed the note, but I would say, perhaps what he (ra) thought to be innovations, were matters that has nothing to do with the deen From what I have learnt about the Sahabas, they were the most cautious in regards to the deen and the most humble of people, who fear praise and any form of actions that would taint them in front of Allah (SWT), they feared innovation and would warn against it. As it was presented by Ibn Taymiyah, Bid'ah is either defined literally, or thechnically, which is the Shari'ah's definition. AlBaqir: Narrated Abu Huraira I heard Allah's Apostle saying regarding Ramadan, "Whoever prayed at night in it (the month of Ramadan) out of sincere faith and hoping for a reward from Allah, then all his previous sins will be forgiven." (Sahih Bukhari) Narrated Abu Huraira Allah's Apostle said, "Whoever prayed at night the whole month of Ramadan out of sincere Faith and hoping for a reward from Allah, then all his previous sins will be forgiven." Ibn Shihab (a sub-narrator) said, "Allah's Apostle died and the people continued observing that (i.e. Nawafil offered individually, not in congregation), and it remained as it was during the Caliphate of Abu Bakr and in the early days of 'Umar's Caliphate." 'Abdur Rahman bin 'Abdul Qari said, "I went out in the company of 'Umar bin Al-Khattab one night in Ramadan to the mosque and found the people praying in different groups. A man praying alone or a man praying with a little group behind him. So, 'Umar said, 'In my opinion I would better collect these (people) under the leadership of one qari (reciter) (i.e. let them pray in congregation!)'. So, he made up his mind to congregate them behind Ubai bin Ka'b. Then on another night I went again in his company and the people were praying behind their reciter. On that, 'Umar remarked, 'What an excellent Bid'a (i.e. innovation in religion) this is; but the prayer which they do not perform, but sleep at its time is better than the one they are offering.' He meant the prayer in the last part of the night. (In those days) people used to pray in the early part of the night." These two hadiths from sahih bukhari clearly shows the prayers the sahabas were offering was qiyam layl (also known as tahajjud), the merit of this prayer is established, and in this case, in the month of Ramadan hence the yearning of the sahabas towards it in ramadan. The sahabas prayed with the Prophet (SAW) in congregation before he instructed them to pray at home, and the reason being the fear of such prayers becoming obligatory on them. I wonder where the bid’ah in regards to what had taken place during the life time of the Prophet (SAW). Do we need to start defining night to understand that the prayer is the same? Trying to say they are different prayers, is what seems deceitful. We can see that a plausible reason for the comment of Umar (ra) was as a result of them praying early, and then sleeping at the time the Prophet (SAW) usually observed it. And this buttressed what I had written on the jinn thread about the fact that what the prophet (SAW) prescribed/observed in non obligatory acts, is far superior to whatever anyone can bring. Umar (ra) understood this, and thus his statement, but he didn’t rebuke them for it was Ramadan, the nights are for qiyam, while the days are for fasting, and the rewards are enormous…Now we can understand why some Islamic scholars such as Sheikh Fawzan et al., would never classify this act of Umar(ra) as a bid’ah in the shari’ah definition, but rather say what was meant is in the literal definition. So using this to support other innovations such as eid maulud which has no basis in the shari’ah, is wrong and farfetched. And when I say eid (festival), I mean the eid as defined in the shari’ah, an act of worship with rules and guidelines. AlBaqir: Seriously?! Hadiths with Ramadan or fasting in its content gives us the clue that it is being in the right category, also, these compilers are not just some regular dude with no knowledge, agreed, they may make mistakes, but they are scholars, who traveled wide, and studied deep, I don’t think they just come up with flimsy excuses to put an hadith under a particular heading without proper research and understanding of what that hadith is talking about. AlBaqir:Abegi give me a narration where the Prophet (SAW) fixed the number of rakah for tahajjud, any other talk is theory, in which I can counter, is tahajjud obligatory on us?! If no, then if we pray more than what the prophet did, is it bid’ah? Did we not agree that we can do more non obligatory prayers if we have the capacity? Didn’t the Prophet say in a particular hadith that he makes istighfar 100 times in a day, if I do more than that, is it bid’ah?! Now you should get the difference between the shari’ah definition and the literal definition… AlBaqir:Bro it is Ramadan, who wants to be left out in Allah’s bounties?! If there is no narration that Umar(ra) made it mandatory, then there is no issue. In the Masjid I pray and behind my Sheikhs and ustaz, we observe only 10, in fact, we do not finish the Qur’an, we use selected chapters and verses… is there a reason why 20? It can be due to the fact that they intend to finish the whole Qur’an in a month or want to increase their ibadah in the month of ramadan AlBaqir:Ameen, Jazakumullahu khayran for the prayer. I believe this is a fiqh issue and should be looked at carefully my emotions are not important, and should I remind you of the reasons given about the narrations of the Imams in some shi’a books about mut’a being haram (forbidden) even when the shi’a believed it to be permitted by Allah (SWT) in the Qur'an? Cleanliness (At-taharah) is an aspect of fiqh, we know that water is the best for purification, and dust is used only when water cannot be found or when such an individual is sick and cannot use water for purification. You do not know the conditions that warranted Umar’s statement to the questioner. Or do you? Even, salah, the five obligatory prayers can be haram for someone, so unless you get the facts, quoting just one hadith, and then jumping into conclusion in regards to Umar (ra), is plainly shallow I must say. “…Muslim (368) narrated that a man came to ‘Umar and said: “I have become junub and I cannot find any water.” He said: “Do not pray.” ‘Ammaar said: “Do you not remember, O Ameer al-Mu’mineen, when you and I were on a campaign and we become junub, and we could not find any water? You did not pray, but I rolled in the dust and prayed, and the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, ‘It would have been sufficient if you had struck the ground with your hands then wiped your face and hands with them.’” ‘Umar said: “Fear Allaah, O ‘Ammaar!” He said, “If you wish I will not narrate it.” ‘Umar said: “We accept what you say.” According to another report, ‘Ammaar said: “O Ameer al-Mu’mineen, if you wish, because of your position, I will not tell it to anyone.” ‘Umar (may Allaah be pleased with him) had forgotten that event. “ ‘Umar said: ‘Fear Allaah, O ‘Ammaar!’” – What this means is that ‘Umar said to ‘Ammaar: Fear Allaah with regard to what you are narrating, for perhaps you have forgotten or become confused. With regard to ‘Ammaar saying, “If you wish I will not narrate it,” what this means – and Allaah knows best – is: If you think it is better for me to refrain from narrating it than to narrate it, then I will refrain, because it is obligatory for me to obey you so long as that does not involve sin. The basic principle with regard to conveying knowledge had already been fulfilled, and if he had withheld this hadeeth after that, he would not have come under the heading of those who withhold knowledge. It may be that he meant, ‘I will not broadcast it so that it becomes well known among people, rather I will only narrate it rarely.’ This was stated by al-Nawawi. “ ‘Umar said “We accept what you say” – i.e., the fact that I do not remember it does not means that it is not true, and I have no right to stop you narrating it. This was stated by al-Haafiz in Fath al-Baari.” http://islamqa.info/en/40204 I have not read anyone ruling (in our present time) that you cannot perform tayamum based on Umar's ruling... And Allah SWT knows best |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by sino(m): 2:37pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
AlBaqir: Oh you don’t need to write more, you had already written enough, so in your own words, Umar (ra) is just a Muslim, and not a Mum’in because he doubted, well, I can’t be a party to such statements, for I have read and learnt the following… "Yet another example is when Ibrahim said: "My Rabb! Show me how you give life to the dead." He replied: "Have you no faith in this?" Ibrahim humbly submitted: "Yes! But I ask this to reassure my heart." Allah said: "Take four birds; train them to follow your direction, cut their bodies into pieces and scatter those pieces on hilltops then call them back; Allah will bring them back to life and they will come to you right away. Thus you will know that Allah is All-powerful and Wise." (Q 2:260) Al-Bukhari recorded that Abu Hurayrah said that the Messenger of Allah said, (We are more liable to be in doubt than Ibrahim when he said, "My Lord! Show me how You give life to the dead.'' Allah said, "Don't you believe'' Ibrahim said, "Yes (I believe), but (I ask) in order to be stronger in faith.'') The Prophet's statement in the Hadith means, "We are more liable to seek certainty.'' A Yoruba proverb says “a gbo ejo eti kan da, agba oshika ni” meaning basing a judgment on just one person’s narration, is a great evil or wickedness, you have presented a narration from Umar (ra) which looks incomplete, there is no report of where the Prophet (SAW) gave a response nor does it show that Umar still continued to doubt the Messanger, are you trying to say the Prophet (SAW) would ignore such a question from his sahabah and leave him in doubt? What are you trying to insinuate Albaqir?! That the Prophet (SAW) didn’t care?! (audhubillah!). Sometimes I become perplexed by some of your submissions, the danger in your statements are far greater than the wrong of the person in which you are criticizing. And if indeed it was certainty Umar (ra) was seeking from the prophet (SAW) as Ibrahim (as) did in the Qur’an, what then would you say when you stand in front of Allah (SWT) on judgement day? Alhamdulilah you said you believe Umar (ra) died a Muslim; tell me Albaqir, what are your responsibilities towards your Muslim brother, dead or alive as instructed by Allah (SWT) and his Prophet (SAW)?! عَنْ هِشَامِ بْنِ الْكَلْبِيِّ ، قَالَ قَالَ جَعْفَرُ بْنُ مُحَمَّدٍ إِذَا بَلَغَكَ عَنْ أَخِيكَ الشَّيْءُ تُنْكِرُهُ فَالْتَمِسْ لَهُ عُذْرًا وَاحِدًا إِلَى سَبْعِينَ عُذْرًا فَإِنْ أَصَبْتَهُ وَإِلا قُلْ لَعَلَّ لَهُ عُذْرًا لا أَعْرِفُهُ 7853 شعب الإيمان للبيهقي السابع والخمسون من شعب الإيمان وهو … فصل في ترك الغضب وفي كظم الغيظ والعفو عند Hisham ibn Al-Kalbi reported: Ja’far ibn Muhammad said, “If you hear something from your brother that you reject, then make an excuse for him up to seventy excuses. If you cannot do it, then say: Perhaps he has an excuse I do not know.” Source: Shu’b Al-Iman 7853 Narrated Aisha The Prophet (p.b.u.h) said, "Don't abuse the dead, because they have reached the result of what they forwarded." Narrated Anas bin Malik The Prophet was not one who would abuse (others) or say obscene words, or curse (others), and if he wanted to admonish anyone of us, he used to say: "What is wrong with him, his forehead be dusted!" (Sahih Bukhari) Narrated Sa'id ibn Zayd ibn Amr ibn Nufayl Rabah ibn al-Harith said: I was sitting with someone in the mosque of Kufah while the people of Kufah were with him. Then Sa'id ibn Zayd ibn Amr ibn Nufayl came and he welcomed him, greeted him, and seated him near his foot on the throne. Then a man of the inhabitants of Kufah, called Qays ibn Alqamah, came. He received him and began to abuse him. Sa'id asked: Whom is this man abusing? He replied: He is abusing Ali. He said: Don't I see that the companions of the Apostle of Allah (peace be upon him) are being abused, but you neither stop it nor do anything about it? I heard the Apostle of Allah (peace be upon him) say--and I need not say for him anything which he did not say, and then he would ask me tomorrow when I see him --AbuBakr will go to Paradise and Umar will go to Paradise. He then mentioned the rest of the tradition to the same effect (as in No. 4632). He then said: The company of one of their man whose face has been covered with dust by the Apostle of Allah (peace be upon him) is better than the actions of one of you for a whole life time even if he is granted the life-span of Noah (Sunan Abu Dawood) In his speech to Mufaddhal ibn `Umar, Imam Ja`far ibn Muhammad as-Sadiq (peace be upon him) said: مَنْ رَوَى عَلى مُؤْمِنٍ رِوٌايَةً يُرِيدُ بِهٌا شَيْنَهُ وَ هَدْمَ مُرُوؤَتَهُ لِيُسْقِطَهُ مِنْ أَعْيُنِ النٌّاسِ أَخْرَجَهُ اللٌّهُ مِنْ وِلاٌيَتِهِ إِلـى وِلاٌيِةِ الشَّيْطٌانِ “A person who talks about a believer’s conduct hoping that through this act, he is able to lower the other person’s value and worth in the eyes of others will be taken out of the guardianship of Allah and will be placed in the guardianship of the Shaitan.” Al-Mahajjat al-Baydha, Volume 5, Page 155. AlBaqir: Indeed you may not formulate, and I will not bother responding to the narrations you have presented for I have been able to come up with counter arguments to narrations presented prior these ones. And from the Qur’an and sunnah, as well as from your Shi’a books I had and will still show how to relate with Muslims, especially the companions of the Prophet (SAW). Please tell Albaqir, how did Ali (ra) relate with Umar (ra)? Did he call him an innovator? Did he call him a less Muslim than himself? Did he even revert or criticize any of the so called innovations and atrocities Umar (ra) and other caliph that preceded him committed? I am most interested in such narrations. Ali (ra) says: لقد رأيت أصحاب محمد صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم، فما أرى أحداً يشبههم، لقد كانوا يصبحون شعثاً غبراً، وقد باتوا سجداً وقياماً، يراوحون بين جباههم وخدودهم، ويقفون على مثل الجمر من ذكر معادهم، كأن بين أعينهم ركب المعزى من طول سجودهم، إذا ذكر الله هملت أعينهم حتى تبل جيوبهم، ومادوا كما يميد الشجر يوم الريح العاصف خوفاً من العقاب ورجاءً للثواب I have seen the companions of the Prophet but I do not find anyone resembling them. They began the day with dust on the hair and face (in hardship of life) and passed the night in prostration and standing in prayers. Sometimes they put down their foreheads and sometimes their cheeks. With the recollection of their resurrection it seemed as though they stood on live coal. It seemed that in between their eyes there were signs like knees of goats, resulting from long prostrations. When Allah was mentioned their eyes flowed freely till their shirt collars were drenched. They trembled for fear of punishment and hope of reward as the tree trembles on the day of stormy wind. [Nahjul Balagha, sermon 96] وروى المجلسي عن الطوسي رواية موثوقة عن الإمام علي كرم الله وجهه أنه قال لأصحابه: أوصيكم في أصحاب رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم: لا تسبوهم؛ فإنهم أصحاب نبيكم، وهم أصحابه الذين لم يبتدعوا في الدين شيئاً، ولم يوقروا صاحب بدعة، نعم! أوصاني رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم في هؤلاء Shia scholar Majlisi has narrated from Tusi who has narrated a Muwathaq tradition, from Ali that he said “I order you regarding the companions of the Prophet (s) , don’t criticize them, because they are the companions of your Prophet (s). They are his companions, they didn’t start any bidah in the religion, nor given honor to any innovator. Yes! The Prophet (s) has ordered me regarding them. Hayat ul Qulub , Vol. 2, p. 621 The above is the same narration you said is daeef due to some majhul (unknown) chain, but reported here to be thiqa (trustworthy) chain… Sheikh Saduq (a shi’a scholar) in his book “Khisal” narrated: كان أصحاب رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله اثنى عشر ألف رجل 28-5 حدثنا أحمد بن زياد بن جعفر الهمداني رضي الله عنه قال: حدثنا علي ابن إبراهيم بن هاشم، عن أبيه، عن محمد بن أبي عمير، عن هشام بن سالم، عن أبي عبد الله عليه السلام قال: كان أصحاب رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله اثني عشر ألفا ثمانية آلاف من المدينة، وألفان من مكة، وألفان من الطلقاء، ولم ير فيهم قدري ولا مرجي ولا حروري ولا معتزلي، ولا صحاب رأي، كانوا يبكون الليل والنهار ويقولون: اقبض أرواحنا من قبل أن نأكل خبز الخمير. THERE WERE TWELVE THOUSAND COMPANIONS OF THE PROPHET 28-5 Ahmad ibn Zyad ibn Ja’far al-Hamedany – may God be pleased with him – narrated that Ali ibn Ibrahim ibn Hashim quoted his father, on the authority of Muhammad ibn Abi Umayr, on the authority of Hisham ibn Salim that Aba Abdullah as-Sadiq (alaihi salam) said, “There were twelve-thousand companions for God’s Prophet (sallalahu alaihi wa ali). Eight-thousand of them were from Medina, two-thousand of them were from Mecca and another two-thousand of them were the free atheist who had become Muslims. There were no Qadarites, Marajites, Kharajites, Mo’tazelites, nor any who act according to their own opinions. They cried day and night and said, ‘O God! Please take away our souls before we eat barley bread”. The above are all from Shi’a books, all narrations I have read from both sunni and shi’a have used companions (generally), they didn’t segregate them, they didn’t say some were this and others were that, and I don’t know how you get those you need to curse and criticize, for I leave that to Allah (SWT), they are dead, and their deeds are well recorded with Allah (SWT) and they are being rewarded. The rule of not criticizing/abusing the companion is general! If by narrations in which we can argue back and forth, criticize to be weak or even fabricated are what you base your license to curse and abuse and criticize some sahabah, then you are on your own…if I choose to pray for all the companions of the prophet (SAW) (and not curse some of them in which the shi’a curse), have I become a kafir?! I pray for Nigeria generally, some are kafirs who are even plotting against Islam; would that withhold Allah’s punishment for such?! Abu Lahb is continually cursed because Allah specifically revealed a surrah on him and his wife, so is Shaitan (la), Albaqir, give me the names of these sahabas to be cursed, give me a narration from Ali (ra) or the Imams where they cursed these sahabas, even when the Prophet (SAW) was stoned at taif by the Mushriks and he bled till his shoes were filled with blood, he didn’t curse them, he rather prayed for them…I want to be like Muhammad (SAW), He is my example, the best of example to emulate and follow. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by sino(m): 2:37pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
AlBaqir:Indeed, you have shown some of those that you criticize on here, but I see the reasons you have given here to criticize some of these companions (such as Umar (ra)) as inadequate and shallow. For example, Allah (SWT) says there were hypocrites amongst them, did He (jalla jalaaluhu) mentioned them by name?! Do you have the list of hypocrites from the companions of the Prophet (SAW)? I am very interested in this list as well if you have… Here is an insightful post on hypocrisy and how to talk about it, using the Qur’an and Sunnah. A few points to note i. You and I can NEVER judge someone as a hypocrite, we do not have that right, It does not matter how clear their actions are… We do not have the license to call anyone a hypocrite. This religion did not give us that sanction. There are two kinds of hypocrites a. Hypocrites that know that they are not muslim, they are only prtending to be muslim ex: spies b. The second type of hypocrite is the one that has no idea that he is a hypocrite. This is the scarier kind because it could be anyone of us… None of us are safe… So i. you can’t label anyone a hypocrite ii. We can’t keep ourselves safe from that label… We can’t assume that we are safe from hypocrisy.. Al-Hasan Al-Basri said about hypocrisy, “No one fears it but a believer, and no one feels safe from it but a hypocrite.” ‘Umar ibn Al-Khattaab used to ask Huthayfah ibn Al-Yamaan saying, “Did the Messenger of Allaah , mention me to you among (the names of) the hypocrites?” Huthayfah replied in the negative. The prophet gave Huthayfah the names of hypocrites and umar was scared, he was part of them… This is Umar that was guaranteed Jannah. That is a believer. It is narrated in a Hadeeth (narration) that Ibn Abi Mulaykah said, “I have witnessed thirty of the companions of the Prophet , all of them feared falling into hypocrisy.” [Al-Bukhaari] iii. You might see attributes of hypocrisy that are mentioned in the Quran in people but you are still not allowed to call them hypocrites. This is clear from a hadith where the muslims were involved in a battle (a raid) and usama bin Zaid and an ansar killed a man even after he said his shahada because they felt he was not sincere and he was just doing it to save himself. When the prophet heard about this, He (the Holy Prophet) said: Did you check inside his heart to find out whether he said it (out of fear) or not? In another narration he said: Did you kill him after he had made the profession that there is no god but Allah? He was upset and kept on repeating this such that Usama wished he had not embraced Islam before that day. ( the narration can be found in Bukhari & muslim) (Muslim Found in: Faith (Kitab Al Iman) Hadith no: 176 &177) Obviously the man is trying to save his skin but even in this clear instance, you cannot say he is a hypocrite. So when we hear these things about hypocrites, there are two attitudes, a. you start thinking of someone else or b. you look within yourself. The believers attitude as he is reading this is : Is this me? This is correct attitude…. May Allah protect us from hypocrisy… you can read more here: https://www.nairaland.com/1152172/hypocrisy-discussion-surah-baqarah AlBaqir:Okay i see, and so my reply to your post about the previous hadith also stands for this as well. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by sino(m): 2:57pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
AlBaqir: i do not think sunnis belief the sahabah to be infallible, but we are working with authentic narrations in defending the honor of the sahabahs and not giving room to people to start a fitnah in looking for the flaws of this sahabah or that sahabah. If you say they are not companions of the prophet (SAW) and that they have become kafirs, then the onus lies on you to proof that and remeber, the Prophet as warned that when you call a Muslim a kafir and he is not, then you become a kafir.... AlBaqir: The following are from shi’a collections… وعن موسى بن جعفر عن آبائه عليهم السلام قال: قال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم: (القرون أربع: أنا في أفضلها قرناً، ثم الثاني، ثم الثالث، فإذا كان الرابع التقى الرجال بالرجال والنساء بالنساء، فقبض الله كتابه من صدور بني آدم، فيبعث الله ريحاً سوداء، ثم لا يبقى أحد سوى الله تعالى إلا قبضه الله إليه بحار الأنوار: (22/309) From Musa bin Jafar from his fathers who said: The Messenger of Allah (saw) said: There will be 4 generations, the best of generations is the one in which I am living, then the second, then the third [Biharul Anwar Volume:22 Page:309] In the Shia book ‘Muruj al zahab’ by Masudi states that Abdullah ibn Abbas [r.a] said: إن الله جل ثناؤه وتقدست أسماؤه خص نبيه محمداً صلى الله عليه وسلم بصحابة آثروه على الأنفس والأموال، وبذلوا النفوس دونه في كل حال، ووصفهم الله في كتابه فقال: رحماء بينهم Indeed Allah is the One with pure names, who bestowed His Prophet Muhammad [s] with such Sahaba who sacrificed their lives and wealth on him, and left everyone accept him. The God Almighty mentioned their qualities in the Holy Quran in the words ‘compassionate amongst themselves’ [Muruj al zahab, Vol. 3, p. 52] Also in Shia book, Al-Khisal: 7-6 حدثنا محمد بن جعفر البندار قال: حدثنا أبوالعباس الحمادي قال: حدثنا أبوجعفر الحضرمي قال: حدثنا هدبة بن خالد قال: حدثنا همام بن يحيى قال: حدثنا قتادة، عن أيمن، عن أبي امامة قال: قال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله: طوبى لمن رآني وآمن بي، طوبى ثم طوبى يقولها سبعالمن لم يرني وآمن بي. Muhammad ibn Ja’far al-Bindar narrated that Abul-Abbas al-Himady quoted on the authority of Abu Ja’far al-Hazrami, on the authority of Hodbat ibn Khalid, on the authority of Homam ibn Yahya, on the authority of Qitadeh, on the authority of Aymen, on the authority of Abi Imamat that God’s Prophet (saw) said, “”Blessed be those who saw me and believed in me, and blessed be those who believed in me without having seen me”. He repeated it seven times.{Al khisal, page 554}. Majlisi graded it mutabar in Hayat ul Quloob: ابن بابويه به سند معتبر از ابى امامه روايت كرده است كه حضرت رسول (صلى الله عليه و آله و سلم) فرمود كه: خوشا حال كسى كه مرا ببيند وايمان آورد به من؛ پس هفت مرتبه گفت: خوشا حال كسى كه مرا ببيند و ايمان آورد به من [Hayaat ul Quloob, Vol. 2 , p. 913] AlBaqir: My previous quoted narrations are all from Shi’a books, they praise the attributes of the sahabah, there are more in Sunni collections about the virtues of the sahabah, that is what I want to remember them with, that is what Muslims should remember them with, rather than working with ambiguities, suspicions, assumptions and irrelevancies in the documents we have in regards to their lives. indeed, unto Allah (SWT) is our final return, and each shall give account of his deeds Allah (SWT) says in the Qur’an “O ye who believe! avoid suspicion as much (as possible): for suspicion in some cases is a sin: and spy not on each other nor speak ill of each other behind their backs. Would any of you like to eat the flesh of his dead brother? Nay ye would abhor it...but fear Allah: for Allah is Oft-Returning Most Merciful.” (Q 49:12) AlBaqir: No, you don’t get it, I am not talking about what guarantees Janah. Isn’t there a reason why Allah (SWT) says As-Sabiquna Sabiqun? Umar (ra) a Muslim who accepted Islam from the best of mankind, and then happened to witness the miracles, the hardship, the battles and learned directly as the revelations came, can never be compared to you Albaqir or anyone of us, no matter how you want take talk am, them these people pass you. Allah (SWT) chose them for his Prophet (SAW), their guidance is intact, as long as you accept they are Muslims! You or anyone of us are not in the position to criticize their actions or inaction, it is just like a primary school student criticizing a university student for having a carry over, on what basis I ask? Leave judgement to Allah (SWT), Allah (SWT) did not give us the responsibility to judge their actions, whether they are Muslim, Mu’min or Muhsin, Allah (SWT) says when narrating about pharaoh and Moses: He (Moses) said: "Our Lord is He Who gave to each (created) thing its form and nature and further gave (it) guidance." (Pharaoh) said: "What then is the condition of previous generations?" He replied: "The knowledge of that is with my Lord duly recorded: my Lord never errs nor forgets (Q 20:50-52) May Allah (SWT) guide us to the true path and give us much understanding and lots of wisdom in spreading the truth of Islam. Ameen Jazakumullahu khayran for your reply. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by sino(m): 3:02pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
@Empiree Assalam alaykum, I did not mean we cannot do more nawafil, i was just saying that since we can do more in non obligatory acts, which tahajjud is part of, doing more cannot be classified as a bid'ah, so we cannot say 20 rakah of taraweeh is bid'ah technically. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by Empiree: 7:09pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
sino:walaykum salam okay. Now, you are understood. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 8:28pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
@Sino, 1. I found the view of Sheik Ibn Taymiyyah quite interesting and amusing sometimes. However, as usual the sheik is not consistent with his wording in the desperation to cover Umar's "Bid'ah". Just as Ibn Taymiyyah opined, my firm believe is: Its either something is Bid'ah or its not Bid'ah (provided there's a support for it in the Shari'ah) if we are to go by the word "ALL BID'AH" (kulun bid'ah) just like "kulun Nafs dha'iqatil mawt (ALL NAFS will die). On the other hands, anything good and praiseworthy even if prophet did not practice it will come under "good innovation". That's why I didn't fault "tarawih" . Other issues: desperation that prophet 'led' the sahaba in the alleged tarawih has already been dealt with at the OP. One thing I was expecting from your quoting of Sheik Ibn Taymiyyah is his argument of Umar being one of the "khulafau Rashidun" thereby sheik used that to validate his Bid'a of Tarawih. All in all, try again later. 2. Sinooooooooooo What's the meaning of CRITICISM as against CURSING?Criticize: Indicate the faults of someone Curse: An appeal or prayer for EVIL or misfortune to befall someone So there's absolutely fault which you simply don't want to admit in that translation. Even if you were to use the word "ABUSE", it still doesn't = CRITICIZE. 3. Interestingly you asked me to name sahaba that innovate and probably with the chain list of their innovations *Prophet told you some among them will innovate and he will disown them on the day of judgment. You said its Ghayb * A Sahabi confirmed THEY innovated after the demise of the prophet. You said no * Allah Himself CURSED the Munafiqs among the sahaba in the Qur'an. Yet you said no * Prophet also cursed some Munafiq's sahaba who plotted to assassinate him. Yet no * Even one of your Sheik (Ibn Taymiyyah) CURSED the killers of Imam Hussain (as) and the ahl al-Bayt of the Prophet (peace be upon him and his household); and many many of your books listed the names of these murderers and there are names of sahaba among them. Infact, your scholars need to redefine the word "Sahaba" because it doesn't fit every tom, dick and harry. Your books confirm sahaba who used to drink alcohol, fornicate (adultery) etc yet if a Shi'a criticize, you cry foul. It is even an insult to righteous sahaba when you say "Radi'Allahu anhum ajmain". Allah clearly distinguish between goodness and evil. Sino, its a lost case except we are simply being trying to be polite. 4. As per the hadith of al-Bara ibn Azib and his confession. Abdullah ibn Abbas (RA) was crying bitterly one day (towards the end of his life). And he was asked why? He said "tell me a single practice the prophet left that has not been tampered with today" The person said "as-Salat". Ibn Abbas was reported to have looked at him and said "Even that has been corrupted". {Citation and ref. In sha Allah will come forth} So it is funny when you said what al-Bara b. Azib intended as per "Bid'a" is not something pertaining to Deen. If you believe sahaba are fallible, then why protecting at all cost? Like I said earlier, we can only keep mute for courtesy sake. For brevity and not to derail I wouldn't cite any example. 5. Sino, all your submissions to protect "Tarawih" or equate it to "Tahajjud" is null and void as far as Qur'an and Sunnah clearly defined Tahajjud, the timing, the number of rakah etc. The hadith of Abu Hurairah you cited, I have told you whatever they are praying that night is GOOD but its definitely not Tahajjud. Take it or leave that's the plain truth, and you can see desperation of Sunni world trying to match-make. 6. As per your insistence on narration on No. of Rakah for prophet's Tahajjud, is the narration of Aisha not sufficient? The onus is on you to research what your Ulama says on that hadith or on the numbers of Tahajjud Rakah. As per Umar's 20 rakah. I'm a bit disappointed brother. 8 vs 20? Yet you are telling me "does he make it obligatory? My point is to expose the lies that Tarawih is the same Tahajjud. Period. You've known my aqeedah pertaining non-obligatory acts. If you like pray 1000 rakah per night in Ramadhan. So long you are capable of it and will not affect your wajibat. No problem. Please drop it my brother its a lost debate. 7. As per Tayamum issue, I can see how labored you are to protect Umar's verdict. What is the conditions that made Umar gave such verdict? Sino, the fact that the questioner clearly stated his predicament for Umar, yet he gave that verdict, kill off whatever excuse you can bring forth to protect Umar's fatwa.. It takes courage and sincerity to submit to the truth brother for indeed Truth hurt. 8. As per the case of treaty of al-Hudaybiyyah vs Umar's doubtfulness. It is fantastic and rather insulting trying to lure it with Nabi Ibrahim (as) and his seeking of Bayyina (manifest practical example). Why can't you use Nabi Musa's demand to see his Lord? Doesn't he believe in His existence? Please don't try that again brother. The episode of Umar's ...at Hudaybiyyah is a long episode. What he did was unimaginable. I once opened a thread titled "Cold Truth About Umar Ibn al-Khattab". All these were highlighted there. Unfortunately the big boss deleted it after 3 days. So I am not interested going there again. 9. Imam 'Ali's report in Nahj al-Balagha. That's Imam's ideal definition of "Sahaba of the Prophet" not the definition and aqeedah of Sunni that accommodate every sundry that include munafiq, apostate, hiding munafiq etc. Do you even know Nabi Isa (as) was a Sahabi of Nabi Muhammad (peace be upon him and his household)? I remember Imam Ali's definition of his "Shi'a (follower and supporter)". The criteria and standard of being "sahaba" or "shi'a" which Imam 'Ali (as) describe is too high to accommodate every sundry. Like Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, his own definition of "Sahabi" is anyone who sees the holy Prophet (peace be upon him and his household). Ahlu Sunnah bus is very generous accommodating whoever but Shi'a bus is selective based on qualitative evident-based merit not "merit" acquired on dreams or "merits" that can never stand the light of Qur'an and historical facts. It is obvious you know Nadah about Mawla Amir al-Muminin 'Ali Ibn Abi Talib al-Murtadha (alaihi salatu wa salam). 10. Please anytime you wanna quote Shi'a hadith, kindly ALWAYS give its GRADING and cite full references. So if you can qoute shi'a narration, never hesitate to put what I requested. That's what Albaqir does in Sunni's case. Thanks. 11. You are here with weird types of Hypocrites Sura al-Tawbah: 101 kill off the arguments. 12. All other submissions are just kinda repetitions or waste of energy thereby derailing the main topic which we've already does anyway. That's why I didn't touch them. Many thanks for your time sir. Fi amanillah. |
| Re: Misconception Of Salat Tarawih: Bid'a or Sunnah? by AlBaqir(m): 8:37pm On Jan 10, 2015 |
Topic continues... ************ WHAT WAS PROPHET's FEAR? Just when some men (sahaba) were anxiously waiting for the prophet to rise up of his small room for his usual late-night prayer (Tahajjud) as they had followed him for 2-3 nights (without his permission), they began to throw pebbles and making noise to alert him. The hadith report afterward: "...He (the prophet) came out to them in a state of ANGER, saying, “YOU ARE STILL INSISTING THAT I THOUGHT (FEAR) THAT THIS PRAYER MIGHT BECOME OBLIGATORY ON YOU. So you people, offer this prayer at your homes for the best of prayer of a person is the one which he offers at home except the compulsory prayer" ~Sahih Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 73, No.134 {* Sunni Submission: Prophet feared the prayer might become obligatory on them since they have not accustomed with it. But when time elapsed, people have gotten their acts together and now fully understand thereby, Umar seeing this understanding gather people back to be praying in congregation} #RESPONSE: The above submission is just a conjecture with no evidence whatsoever. First, it is crystal clear the holy Prophet (peace be on him and his household) was praying Tahajjud ALONE in the middle of the night in his usual "small room made of palm leaves." Second, the prayer, Qiyam layl has been made obligatory on him ALONE (sura al-Mudassir: 1 - 6; sura al-Israi:79) Third, he expressed his fear for this men who are hell-bent praying (tahajjud) behind him (in congregation) lest it become obligatory on them too. Fourth, the fear (of making it obligatory) was no other than the statement of Allah: "Verily, the rising by night (for Tahajjud prayer) IS VERY HARD..." ~sura al-Mudassir: 6 And indeed, had Tahajjud was made obligatory, muslims would have been compelled to wake up in the middle of the night to pray either singly or in congregation. That will no doubt be VERY HARD and burdensome. Tarawih after Ishai (before you sleep)in congregation has never been a difficult task unless one choose not to pray at all. Fifth: He therefore disband these group of sahaba from converging for the Tahajjud in congregation, and emphasized its individual choice for them, at their respective homes. |
Reading Suratul Yasin In The Morning Or Evening, Sunnah Or Not Sunnah / Ayatul Kursi - The Ayah Of The Throne / Difference Between Interest-based & Islamic Bank
(Go Up)
| Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 391 |