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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Islam for Muslims / It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades (1086 Views)
Essential Parts, Obligatory Actions & Sunnahs Of Hajj / Actions Will Be Judged According To Intention (2) (3) (4)
It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Demmzy15(m): 6:17pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
Salamu Aleikum and Good day brothers and sisters. I promised I was going to create a thread about today's terrorists also know as Khawaarij. I intentionally created this thread here for healthy interaction because not all are welcome in 'Islam For Muslims'. |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by feldido(m): 6:17pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
HAAA... Wrong thread... Runs out |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Demmzy15(m): 6:17pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
ORIGINS OF THE MODERN-DAY KHĀRIJITES |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by jcross19: 7:15pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
What's your problem if you don't want anyone to comment on your thread. Now you have shown from your instinct that terrorism runs in your damn blood. |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Demmzy15(m): 7:27pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
jcross19:I never said no one should comment, I only said behave maturely. Is it hard to ask?! watch ur words! |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Rilwayne001: 8:08pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
and "They recite the Qurʾān but it does not go beyond their collar-bones," indicating ignorance and false scholarship. Hmmmm...Indeed. 1 Like |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by jcross19: 8:15pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
Demmzy15:the worst you can do is to ban right huh abi please get away. |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Demmzy15(m): 8:22pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
jcross19:Pained nigga! |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by jcross19: 8:25pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
Demmzy15:"k" |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by onetrack(m): 9:30pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
It is not for you to declare if someone is Muslim or not. This is forbidden in Islam, and in fact this is what the Kahrijites did. If someone says he is a Muslim, then you should accept it, even if they engage in certain non-Islamic behavior. However, they are basing their actions on the Quran itself: Read the whole of the 9th sura, At-Tawbah. This is the second to the last sura in terms of the time it was written. Thus it abrogates other earlier verses that may conflict with it, such as 2:256 "no compulsion in religion". That verse has been abrogated and no longer applies. Quran 9:29 "Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled." If you look at the tafsir (ibn Kathir) you will see that this was a command for Muhammad to go and attack the Byzantine Empire. ISIS holds this verse to be true until the entire world is ruled by the Muslims, because that is what the Quran says. Notice it does not say to kill all non-Muslims, but if they refuse to pay the annual tax, then they can be killed. Quran 5:32 "Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely." There is an error here (god did not tell the Jews this and it appears in no prophecy or holy book, it was written by a rabbi in a commentary), but the error does not really affect this because the key phrase is 'corruption in the land'. For ISIS this corruption means anyone or any government which opposes sharia law. In other words, for them, Muslims who oppose strict sharia law are spreading corruption in the land and may be killed. This is why ISIS and Boko Haram are killing Muslims--they believe they are corrupt, and the Quran justifies their killing. It's unfortunate that the Quran has such a vague expression allowing people to be killed because virtually any behavior can be categorized as 'corruption within the land'. That's how the jihadis justify their actions. Straight from the Quran. If you have a problem with them, take it up with them. I'm not Muslim (I'm atheist), and I also realize how religions with as much conflicting material as Islam and Christianity can basically be manipulated to say whatever anyone wants it to. So those people who support peace among nations and peoples can call themselves Muslims, and those people who call for jihad are also Muslims. 1 Like |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Demmzy15(m): 10:56pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
onetrack:I didn't make takfir on them alone, the scholars who know more than me did. Contemporary scholars like Sheikh Abdulaziz Ibn Abdullah ibn Baz the former mufti of Saudi Arabia declared them to be Non-Muslims based on the hadith of the Prophet in which he said "they leave the religion just the way an arrow pierces through its game" so they aren't my words rather that of the Prophet and Scholars. However, they are basing their actions on the Quran itself:From this comment of yours, it shows you didn't read the article. Everything you're saying here has been explained already! [s]Read the whole of the 9th sura, At-Tawbah. This is the second to the last sura in terms of the time it was written. Thus it abrogates other earlier verses that may conflict with it, such as 2:256 "no compulsion in religion". That verse has been abrogated and no longer applies.[/s]Lmaooooo! When did you become 'Mufassir' for you to know which verse abrogates the other?! You funny o! Quran 9:29 "Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled."The verse never stated you should blow up the limbs of innocent men, women, and children shopping in markets. It never told you to behead someone on camera shouting Allahu AKBAR. So I don't get your point here! If you look at the tafsir (ibn Kathir) you will see that this was a command for Muhammad to go and attack the Byzantine Empire. ISIS holds this verse to be true until the entire world is ruled by the Muslims, because that is what the Quran says. Notice it does not say to kill all non-Muslims, but if they refuse to pay the annual tax, then they can be killed.Lol how many Christians are in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Egypt?! Are these countries not ruled by Muslims?! The case of the Byzantine Empire is a totally different one. You can read this article http://discover-the-truth.com/2014/06/03/examining-quran-929-does-islam-sanction-the-killing-of-christians-and-jews/ Quran 5:32 "Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely."@emboldened, I don't need any Jewish book or tanakh to authenticate the Quran for me. So I don't care if it's not found in their book, I know for sure that the Quran came to correct the errors of the older books and therefore perfect! but the error does not really affect this because the key phrase is 'corruption in the land'. For ISIS this corruption means anyone or any government which opposes sharia law.So ISIS are now credible scholars right?! Please read this article and stop spilling sh't. So because a Muslim Government follows democracy then they're apostates?! You were the same person that said I have no right to declare them Non-Muslims, but you support them declaring us as Non-Muslims. What a double standards! In other words, for them, Muslims who oppose strict sharia law are spreading corruption in the land and may be killed. Please read the article! This is why ISIS and Boko Haram are killing Muslims--they believe they are corrupt, and the Quran justifies their killing. It's unfortunate that the Quran has such a vague expression allowing people to be killed because virtually any behavior can be categorized as 'corruption within the land'.These are what the Prophet said about great sins. Sahih Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 83, Number 10: "Narrated Anas bin Malik: The Prophet said, "The biggest of Al-Kaba'ir (the great sins) are (1) to join others as partners in worship with Allah, (2) to murder a human being, (3) to be undutiful to one's parents (4) and to make a false statement," or said, "to give a false witness." That's how the jihadis justify their actions. Straight from the Quran. If you have a problem with them, take it up with them. I'm not Muslim (I'm atheist), and I also realize how religions with as much conflicting material as Islam and Christianity can basically be manipulated to say whatever anyone wants it to. So those people who support peace among nations and peoples can call themselves Muslims, and those people who call for jihad are also Muslims.So with this post of yours are you justifying their actions when in fact they are totally contradictory to islam?! Because I don't get the point of this your post/comment, everything is clearly explained in the article and you come and say "the jihadist do this, they do that, so the Quran supports them". I seriously don't get your point! 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Nobody: 11:26pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
I comment ma reserve |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Demmzy15(m): 11:38pm On Jul 13, 2015 |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by onetrack(m): 12:01am On Jul 14, 2015 |
Demmzy15: There are many versions of Islam just like Christianity. The jihadis will simply tell you that you are the one who has gone astray, and they have verses and hadiths that they use to support what they are doing, depending on how you intepret them. Just like the Sunni/Shia divide, which is quite profound. Your argument is with them not with me as I think all religion is man-made. |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Demmzy15(m): 11:44am On Jul 14, 2015 |
onetrack:Of course there are sects in Islam in which the Khawaarij is one. The Prophet said islam would divide into 73 sects with all in hell except one! The jihadis will simply tell you that you are the one who has gone astray, and they have verses and hadiths that they use to support what they are doing, depending on how you intepret them. During the time of Aliyu, the fourth Caliph. The Khawaarij of then also claimed "judgment is with Allah alone" . They actually had proofs from the Quran, but Aliyu told Ibn Abbas to have a debate with them in which he countered all their points. So them having knowledge of the Quran shows nothing because it doesn't go beyond their collar bone Just like the Sunni/Shia divide, which is quite profound. Your argument is with them not with me asThe Sunni/Shia issue is a totally different case in which I wouldn't deal with now! @strikeout your opinion though and it carries no weight! |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by onetrack(m): 2:12pm On Jul 14, 2015 |
When it comes to an issue like this, a decentralized religion like Sunni Islam has difficulty resolving this problem. No one has a recognized authority to declare another person a non-Muslim. This is the same as Christianity, though the Roman Catholic Church does have to authority to declare someone a non-Catholic; not sure about the Shia though I know they have a religious hierarchy. If the Ku Klux Klan calls themselves a Christian organization, there is no real way of telling them they are not, since no one 'controls' Christianity. Same with atheism. Anyone can all themself an atheist. And given that 99% of humans are going to hell anyway according to Muhammad, why even try to separate the 'true' Muslims from the non-true Muslims? |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by Demmzy15(m): 6:28pm On Jul 14, 2015 |
onetrack:http://islamqa.info/en/85102 And given that 99% of humans are going to hell anyway according to Muhammad, why even try to separate the 'true' Muslims from the non-true Muslims?99percent?! Bro you're better this now! |
Re: It Is Criminal And Unjust To Ascribe The Actions Of The Khārijite Renegades by onetrack(m): 7:00pm On Jul 14, 2015 |
Demmzy15: Narrated Abu Huraira: The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "The first man to be called on the Day of Resurrection will be Adam who will be shown his offspring, and it will be said to them, 'This is your father, Adam.' Adam will say (responding to the call), 'Labbaik and Sa`daik' Then Allah will say (to Adam), 'Take out of your offspring, the people of Hell.' Adam will say, 'O Lord, how many should I take out?' Allah will say, 'Take out ninety-nine out of every hundred." They (the Prophet's companions) said, "O Allah's Apostle! If ninety-nine out of every one hundred of us are taken away, what will remain out of us?" He said, "My followers in comparison to the other nations are like a white hair on a black ox." http://www.sunnah.com/bukhari/81/118 |
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