johnydon22:


Even angels are not omniscient, you were busy drilling dalaman over this thing all over this page with over confident alacrity but now let's really drill it enough.

These extra-terrestrial beings are just a class of civilization that are way past our level in intellect, you could not see man coming up with everything they know on their own so you bring up the "Extra-terrestrial beings taught them"

now this extra-terrestrial beings are neither eternal or omniscient which means at a certain point in their evolution they learnt about these knowledge, therefore we have gone back to the first problem, how did they get to learn it.

if they can without having to be taught by another extra-terrestrial civilization higher than they are in intellect, then surely humans can without needing extra-terrestrial influence.

That is not the issue for now. We may as well extend the argument to who created them or how they evolved.

I can't go beyond what I know.
In those days, there were Nephilims: (Hybrids), men of reknown...It is possible that the ancient technologies were sired through them from the Pyramid, the planetary systems (how on earth did the ancient know about Mars, Venus, etc). How did they cut massive stones at an age when iron shouldn't have been invented? How did the Mayan's arrive at their calender? Could their be some element of truths in the Greek gods narrations or they were just brilliant stories.

How come evolution cannot account for the Paracas skulls?

The point is, there are two many unknowns which are impossible to find without proper scientific equipment. I honestly do not think that the ancients should know about other planets except telescope wasn't a recent invention.

All these suggests that man had some outside help. And that's my point.

correctguy101:

@d bolded
Really
Believe me, everyone and everything experiences what you call born again. Albeit you think being born again in strictly Christian terms.
I've been born again severally and will still be born again in this same single existence.

I wasn't the least surprised you were Christian.

Third eye? A real fancy name. Like I said earlier, I only believe in designing and redesigning of the brain, call it every fancy name, pineal gland, third eye et all.

My own understanding of what the spirit realm or the spiritual is makes me aware that the deception lies in believing all what we've been told about the spirit realm, making it our truth or what we make our own truth.

wonderful morning to you

Correction:
One can only be Born Again only Once.

I assume you are equating being Born Again with Reicanation. No! They are different things. Being born again is an instruction to the living: for a purpose!

correctguy101:


Correct. The first cause problem.

Just as Edison made many mistakes before perfecting his bulb. Today it will seem easy but no one was there when he was tasking his brain to do A n B, making mistakes. We only know he made a bulb.

Iron smelting can be, or must have been a well thought out process, though mistakes must've been made till the process was perfected and the perfected knowledge passed from peoples to peoples.

But I guess Ogun taught men to make iron as the saying goes, lols

Morning John

here we go, if iron smelting can be a thought out process that undergoes series of trials and error in the course of it's evolution towards perfection, why would shadeyinka be here arguing with dalaman that humans cannot come up with such craft on their own?

if those extra-terrestrials beings can, surely humans can.

it's that simple.

shadeyinka:


That is not the issue for now. We may as well extend the argument to who created them or how they evolved.

exactly the point, when ever you try to assume such explanations to fill a gap left by your ignorance or inability to comprehend a most likely natural process, you will always run into more problems than you aim to answer and one of such is always the problem of infinite regression.

If you aim to save a step for the causality of their knowledge by using that phrase "Thats not the issue now"

then surely we could still save that step when faced with the causality for human knowledge by employing that same method "Thats not the issue now"

what is good for the goose is good for the gander.

so the questions still stands, how did these beings learn theirs before teaching humans

I can't go beyond what I know.

but you don't know this actually, there is a difference between knowledge and belief and so far this so called "what you know" is proving unable to withstand a little bit of scrutiny

In those days, there were Nephilims: (Hybrids), men of reknown...It is possible that the ancient technologies were sired through them from the Pyramid, the planetary systems

And the question goes back to, how did these nephilims learn these technologies?

if they can learn it on their own then man certainly can, if man cannot then how did they do it?

(how on earth did the ancient know about Mars, Venus, etc).

Simple, they observed the night sky. we live in a planet with clear skies where we are graced with overwhelming lights from outside, if we lived in such a cloud ridden planet like venus then your argument would hold but not here on earth.

we could see the stars (some of these points of lights in the night are in fact these planets), surely we could study the stars we see. why didn't these Naphilims teach about all the 64 moons of Saturn, only planets visible from earth. haaaa

that you don't know how ancient people built or knew stuff doesn't mean aliens taught them, it means you don't know

How did they cut massive stones at an age when iron shouldn't have been invented? How did the Mayan's arrive at their calender? Could their be some element of truths in the Greek gods narrations or they were just brilliant stories.

Simple answer: You don't know

How come evolution cannot account for the Paracas skulls?

genetics can in fact, there are variations in many humans, deformities and anomalies that genetics can account for when studied not appeal to broad theories like evolution

The point is, there are two many unknowns which are impossible to find without proper scientific equipment.

The point should be that something is unknown doesn't mean it is impossible, you don't know how they did it, simple and that is it.

assuming up such answers will end you in a more complex loop than when you started creating more problems for you.

I honestly do not think that the ancients should know about other planets except telescope wasn't a recent invention.

I think they should, they kept star chats and monitored the movement of these stars and the planets have a more strange movement than their starry counterparts.

All these suggests that man had some outside help. And that's my point.

No, all these suggests you don't know how man did it so you assume up an outside help. i repeat not knowing how something was done is not a clutch to bring up any absurd answer and argue it to be true.

Your point do not have valid enough arguments to support it

Mankind's search for God

johnydon22:


here we go, if iron smelting can be a thought out process that undergoes series of trials and error in the course of it's evolution towards perfection, why would shadeyinka be here arguing with dalaman that humans cannot come up with such craft on their own?

if those extra-terrestrials beings can, surely humans can.

it's that simple.

I guess you don't get it yet.
What you insinuate was that man just did some random process and sometime, beneficial side effects come out of it.
But
You forget the law of probability. All in the remote parts of the world use similar techniques.

If I have seen smelting of iron ore before, it makes sense if I use series of trials and error to recreate it.

Humans achieve great results in incremental steps: I ask that you
1. show me inceamental steps in iron ore smelting technologies.
2. Show show me migrational pattern of the spread of iron technology.

It would interest you to know that several communities who never passed through the bronze age still managed to have iron technology. For your information,Bronze melts at about 600oC and iron melts at about 1200oC. These are not common temperatures.

johnydon22:


exactly the point, when ever you try to assume such explanations to fill a gap left by your ignorance or inability to comprehend a most likely natural process, you will always run into more problems than you aim to answer and one of such is always the problem of infinite regression.

If you aim to save a step for the causality of their knowledge by using that phrase "Thats not the issue now"

then surely we could still save that step when faced with the causality for human knowledge by employing that same method "Thats not the issue now"

what is good for the goose is good for the gander.

so the questions still stands, how did these beings learn theirs before teaching humans



but you don't know this actually, there is a difference between knowledge and belief and so far this so called "what you know" is proving unable to withstand a little bit of scrutiny
And the question goes back to, how did these nephilims learn these technologies?

if they can learn it on their own then man certainly can, if man cannot then how did they do it?




Simple, they observed the night sky. we live in a planet with clear skies where we are graced with overwhelming lights from outside, if we lived in such a cloud ridden planet like venus then your argument would hold but not here on earth.

we could see the stars (some of these points of lights in the night are in fact these planets), surely we could study the stars we see. why didn't these Naphilims teach about all the 64 moons of Saturn, only planets visible from earth. haaaa

that you don't know how ancient people built or knew stuff doesn't mean aliens taught them, it means you don't know


Simple answer: You don't know



genetics can in fact, there are variations in many humans, deformities and anomalies that genetics can account for when studied not appeal to broad theories like evolution

The point should be that something is unknown doesn't mean it is impossible, you don't know how they did it, simple and that is it.

assuming up such answers will end you in a more complex loop than when you started creating more problems for you.

I think they should, they kept star chats and monitored the movement of these stars and the planets have a more strange movement than their starry counterparts.



No, all these suggests you don't know how man did it so you assume up an outside help. i repeat not knowing how something was done is not a clutch to bring up any absurd answer and argue it to be true.

Your point do not have valid enough arguments to support it

Your naivity in this matter will not allow me to continue.
It will be a waste!

Good night

shadeyinka:

Your naivity in this matter will not allow me to continue.
It will be a waste!

Good night

Lol

shadeyinka:


I guess you don't get it yet.
What you insinuate was that man just did some random process and sometime, beneficial side effects come out of it.
But
You forget the law of probability. All in the remote parts of the world use similar techniques.

If I have seen smelting of iron ore before, it makes sense if I use series of trials and error to recreate it.

Humans achieve great results in incremental steps: I ask that you
1. show me inceamental steps in iron ore smelting technologies.
2. Show show me migrational pattern of the spread of iron technology.

It would interest you to know that several communities who never passed through the bronze age still managed to have iron technology. For your information,Bronze melts at about 600oC and iron melts at about 1200oC. These are not common temperatures.

So? aliens did it because you have no idea how it came about, guy go and sleep....

johnydon22:


So? aliens did it because you have no idea how it came about, guy go and sleep....

Aliens?!

shadeyinka:


I guess you don't get it yet.
What you insinuate was that man just did some random process and sometime, beneficial side effects come out of it.
But
You forget the law of probability. All in the remote parts of the world use similar techniques.

If I have seen smelting of iron ore before, it makes sense if I use series of trials and error to recreate it.

Humans achieve great results in incremental steps: I ask that you
1. show me inceamental steps in iron ore smelting technologies.
2. Show show me migrational pattern of the spread of iron technology.

It would interest you to know that several communities who never passed through the bronze age still managed to have iron technology. For e information,Bronze melts at about 600oC and iron melts at about 1200oC. These are not common temperatures.

My friend just read up on the history of iron smelting. The ancients weren't smelting iron at such high temperatures. They used a process called bloom, which then has to be consolidated with a hammer to produce wrought iron. They weren't heating up the iron and using it the way we are using it now. The technology for that came over time. You are just making ridiculous assumptions.

johnydon22:


So? aliens did it because you have no idea how it came about, guy go and sleep....

He did not even study the history of iron smelting and he's here asking inane questions.

dalaman:


My friend just read up on the history of iron smelting. The ancients weren't smelting iron at such high temperatures. They used a process called bloom, which then has to be consolidated with a hammer to produce wrought iron. They weren't heating up the iron and using it the were we are using it now. The technology for that came over time. You are just making ridiculous assumptions.

You read up something on the internet and suddenly you've become an expert.

Dohgon:
Open your minds and understand this.

Life is a single conscious entity. Conscious meaning it knows its creations such as people different from trees but it's awareness is limited, meaning it doesnt know exactly what it is or what created it. Therefore it is on a quest for self awareness or universal awareness. LIfe is afraid of death so diversifies and multiplies. It feeds on itself and uses 1 basic driving mechanism and that is Desire. For example' Fruits only have 1 purpose and that is to deliver new life yet all we see is the sweetness of that frut. We eat the fruit and destroy the seed. How can we be Life same as the tree and not see that? It's because Life lacks Universal Awareness.

When it comes to religion that is a separate thing. Religion first starts out as a Spiritual inclination to a greater power. All cultures and tribes of the world feel it. It is the Electromagnetic energy of the universe. It existed before matter and because our awareness is limited we call it god. We first marveled at it when we saw Lightning flash and Thunder roll accross the sky and began to interpret it as anger for the things we do in daily life. We began to make Idols to represent the different energies but it wasnt until Hebrew slaves in Egypt came up with an (Unseen god) and gave it power over their moral inclinations that the single god concept ot today became so powerful in controlling peoples lives.

All cultures developed gods but perhaps only the Muslims still understand why it must remain a mystery. It must have no images or representations, not even in one's mind to retain its power. Africans are the only people who have abandoned our Spiritual ideas for the beliefs of others. Therefore still we suffer

yes I agree with you. this is where Islam and IFA odu agree. olodumare have no physical representation. Islam to me has a lot of brilliant idea.

shadeyinka:

You read up something on the internet and suddenly you've become an expert.

You read some Jewish mythology about some imaginary beings that fell into the earth from some fictitious heaven and interacted with humans and you think you have monopoly of knowledge.

shadeyinka:


Correction:
One can only be Born Again only Once.

I assume you are equating being Born Again with Reicanation. No! They are different things. Being born again is an instruction to the living: for a purpose!

Like I said, you are stuck with only the Christian version of things.

Remember, there was not always Christianity.

And no, I wasn't referring to reincarnation.

When a man stands in front of you, you only see his front thoroughly. You don't see his back and you don't see his right and left sides properly.
Such is humans' experience with God.
Judaism face God. Islam watch God's back. Others see God by His sides left or right.
Christianity see everything, every parts and every sides of God. Jesus walked this Earth 2050 years ago. Christians saw him wholly and have been walking with Him since then. Luke1:1-4

dalaman:


You read some Jewish mythology about some imaginary beings that fell into the earth from some fictitious heaven and interacted with humans and you think you have monopoly of knowledge.

The demons in charge can't help but hate their sworn enemy. Good day!

correctguy101:


Like I said, you are stuck with only the Christian version of things.

Remember, there was not always Christianity.

And no, I wasn't referring to reincarnation.

Being BornAgain is a Real event NOT a change in behavioural pattern.

Its like having ones name REGISTERED with God, the registration is only once. Intact, if a person perchance loose this registration, it is impossible to be re-registered (although is not easy to loose it).

So, what does your bornagain mean? (Since Jesus was the first to use and define the phrase)

shadeyinka:


Being BornAgain is a Real event NOT a change in behavioural pattern.


Its like having ones name REGISTERED with God, the registration is only once. Intact, if a person perchance loose this registration, it is impossible to be re-registered (although is not easy to loose it).

So, what does your bornagain mean? (Since Jesus was the first to use and define the phrase)

Here we go again.
But I feel I'm in the mood for this.

First, let me still state that you are strictly talking about Christianity's version of born again.
@d bolded, you make me smile and shake my head. Even in Christianity, there's a change in character when anyone claims to be born again. or at least the person tries to do things differently.

Secondly, Jesus wasn't the first to use that term.
The ritual of "Raising" has been practiced for long among the Essenes and at the end, each candidate is declared born again and a new creature.
Paul somehow got wind of the ritual and weaved it into the infant religion he was propagating then. He and Petras

Before I forget, What you say born again isn't is exactly what it is. I don't get to limit it to what Christianity calls it for it's same everywhere.

muslim is the best for life

shadeyinka:


The demons in charge can't help but hate their sworn enemy. Good day!

Now you've gone to the realm of imaginations. What are demons? Have you met one before? How do they look like? Descibe one for me and tell me how I can encounter one in an objective and clear way. I don't have time for your fictional and mythological beings. You went ranting about how iron smelting wasn't a human discovery without even studying about its history. Now you are talking about fictional demons. Carry on your imaginations waka abeg.

orunto27:
When a man stands in front of you, you only see his front thoroughly. You don't see his back and you don't see his right and left sides properly.
Such is humans' experience with God.
Judaism face God. Islam watch God's back. Others see God by His sides left or right.
Christianity see everything, every parts and every sides of God. Jesus walked this Earth 2050 years ago. Christians saw him wholly and have been walking with Him since then. Luke1:1-4

These are just your empty and puerile claims. Christianity is just list Islam and all the other religions in reality. Jesus was just a Jewish hippie who was killed and his followers later reared a mythology and legend after him by raising his status as God many years after he died.

correctguy101:

Here we go again.
But I feel I'm in the mood for this.

First, let me still state that you are strictly talking about Christianity's version of born again.
@d bolded, you make me smile and shake my head. Even in Christianity, there's a change in character when anyone claims to be born again. or at least the person tries to do things differently.

Secondly, Jesus wasn't the first to use that term.
The ritual of "Raising" has been practiced for long among the Essenes and at the end, each candidate is declared born again and a new creature.
Paul somehow got wind of the ritual and weaved it into the infant religion he was propagating then. He and Petras

Before I forget, What you say born again isn't is exactly what it is. I don't get to limit it to what Christianity calls it for it's same everywhere.

Of course, there is a change of character AFTER or as a CONSEQUENCE of being BornAgain. Its like, behaving like a student after you have been given an admission.

The ritual of raising!
Do you mean Baptism?
For Christians, there are two types of Baptism
1. Water Baptism
2. Spiritual Baptism (Born Again)
Jesus definition of BornAgain was about the Spiritual not the Physical.

Even, John the Baptist practiced water baptism.

dalaman:


Now you've gone to the realm of imaginations. What are demons? Have you met one before? How do they look like? Descibe one for me and tell me how I can encounter one in an objective and clear way. I don't have time for your fictional and mythological beings. You went ranting about how iron smelting wasn't a human discovery without even studying about its history. Now you are talking about fictional demons. Carry on your imaginations waka abeg.

You simply don't know when a conversation is dead!

shadeyinka:

You simply don't know when a conversation is dead!

I simply know when you are talking NONSENSE!

shadeyinka:


Of course, there is a change of character AFTER or as a CONSEQUENCE of being BornAgain. Its like, behaving like a student after you have been given an admission.

The ritual of raising!
Do you mean Baptism?
For Christians, there are two types of Baptism
1. Water Baptism
2. Spiritual Baptism (Born Again)
Jesus definition of BornAgain was about the Spiritual not the Physical.

Even, John the Baptist practiced water baptism.

The Raising ritual has nothing to do with water baptism.
Know anything about the Essenes?
It's still the ritual that brought some core beliefs of Christianity.

I just wander how Paul got wind of it being a Herodian, an outsider, for was a guarded secret.

correctguy101:


The Raising ritual has nothing to do with water baptism.
Know anything about the Essenes?
It's still the ritual that brought some core beliefs of Christianity.

I just wander how Paul got wind of it being a Herodian, an outsider, for was a guarded secret.

I know a little of the Essenes. They practiced Baptism. Baptism ritual was quite common at the time of Jesus.

I don't know of Paul as a Herodian: he was a Pharisees bit that's not even the point. The point is that Paul didn't originate the act/process of being BornAgain. Paul concentrated his teaching to those who are already BornAgain and identified with a congregation. It was all of Jesus.

Looks like you've got a lot of gnostic gospel literatures.

If everybody followed the same road to Hell, the. GO-SLOW would be EPIC!

oaroloye:
If everybody followed the same road to Hell, the. GO-SLOW would be EPIC!

oaroloye, did you just make a post with just one sentence?

what year is it guys?

SHALOM!

correctguy101:


The Raising ritual has nothing to do with water baptism.
Know anything about the Essenes?
It's still the ritual that brought some core beliefs of Christianity.

I just wander how Paul got wind of it being a Herodian, an outsider, for was a guarded secret.

PAUL HAD ALL THE INFORMATION HE NEEDED FROM THE 500 EYEWITNESSES AND OTHER CHRISTIANS HE ARRESTED AND BROUGHT TO TRIAL.

Why does everybody ignore that?

SHALOM!

dalaman:


Now you've gone to the realm of imaginations. What are demons? Have you met one before? How do they look like?

DEVILS are a GLOBAL Phenomenon.

As far as I know, only the Native American Sect of NEW SEERS Carlos Castaneda was apprenticed to had the Discipline to see their True Forms.

They are capable of disguising themselves with Holograms, and do so, because it is very bad for them, if we can SEE their True Form, and figure them out.

It emerges that they look like mummified serpents.

Descibe one for me and tell me how I can encounter one in an objective and clear way. I don't have time for your fictional and mythological beings.

See: THE FIRE FROM WITHIN, by Carlos Castaneda.

https://archive.org/details/carlos-castaneda-all-books-in-one

You went ranting about how iron smelting wasn't a human discovery without even studying about its history. Now you are talking about fictional demons. Carry on your imaginations waka abeg.

DEVILS ARE CAPABLE OF INFLUENCING HUMAN THOUGHT TO INSPIRE INVENTIONS - or else pretend to have done so.