Please this topic is mostly for christians, but thoughts and opinions from other really cool people like MyJoe are welcome.
I have heard, read, considered all kinds of different views and explanations on several of the prophecies that are spoken of not only in the book of Revelation, but also in Daniel, Ezekiel etc. Everything from the two witnesses, to the great tribulation, to armageddon etc etc etc . . . Now my opinion on this is still being molded, hence the query.

-Can we truly know for certain which of these various interpretations are accurate?

-Should we even be trying to figure out these prophecies? when for the most part they seem unsearchable? (that is answers may never be known until the events actually occur). 

-Are there any practical applications (for todays christian) from any knowledge that may be gleaned from studies on end-time prophecy?

-Or is the passionate, fervent study[b] itself[/b] (and not necessarily the achievement of solid answers) the reward? I'm inclined mostly towards this position based on 1Pet below:

Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to you, searched intently and with the greatest care, trying to find out the time and circumstances to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when he predicted the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow. It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves but you, when they spoke of the things that have now been told you by those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven. Even angels long to look into these things.

JeSoul:

Please this topic is mostly for christians, but thoughts and opinions from other really cool people like MyJoe are welcome.

Is this an attempt to exclude me from this thread? ? ?

Are you insinuating that i am not a "really cool person? ? ?"

How dare you.

For this I am going to hijack this thread.

Deep Sight:

Is this an attempt to exclude me from this thread? ? ?

Are you insinuating that i am not a "really cool person? ? ?"

How dare you.

For this I am going to hijack this thread.

Lol . . . Deepsight, didn't you know? that you are so stupendously, ridiculously, enviably cool, that if I had included your name up there, the entire thread woulda frozen over and I would get no replies?

_{*blushing* . . . thanks for your sarcasm . . .} . . . but i am still going to hijack the thread.

There have been about three or more Earthquakes within the last six weeks alone. . .

I am worried that the Earth may be entering a period of heightened siesmic instability. . .

My worry is not helped by the fact that I have had a dream THREE TIMES in recent weeks showing the same image. . . a large ball of fire in the sky hurtling towards the earth. . .

I just hope that Mayan calender has nothing to it sha. . . because the planetary alignment comes up in 2012, and the last time there was such an alignment 70% of living species went extinct. . .

Deep Sight:

_{*blushing* . . . thanks for your sarcasm . . .} . . . but i am still going to hijack the thread.

Sarcasm? where? I am serious about your "coolness".

There have been about three or more Earthquakes within the last six weeks alone. . .

I am worried that the Earth may be entering a period of heightened siesmic instability. . .

My worry is not helped by the fact that I have had a dream THREE TIMES in recent weeks showing the same image. . . a large ball of fire in the sky hurtling towards the earth. . .

I just hope that Mayan calender has nothing to it sha. . . because the planetary alignment comes up in 2012, and the last time there was such an alignment 70% of living species went extinct. . .

I'm curious, what do you as a theist make of those dreams? just a subconcious manifestation of subject matter your physical brain has been occupied with? or something[i] else[/i]?

Some of the prophecies in Daniel have already occured.

davidylan:

Some of the prophecies in Daniel have already occured.

I'm enquiring more about end-time prophecies, particularly those in Revelation.

^^^ Jesoul, the book of Daniel contains end time prophecies as well.

What do you make about the dream of the King of Babylon about a huge statue with feet of clay and other parts in bronze, gold and silver?

Do you remember Daniel's interpretation of that Dream?

Deep Sight:

^^^ Jesoul, the book of Daniel contains end time prophecies as well.

Yeah you're right (David ditto). Brain freeze there.

What do you make about the dream of the King of Babylon about a huge statue with feel of clay and other parts in bronze, gold and silver?

Do you remember Daniel's interpretation of that Dream?

Yes I remember those. But I'm tyring to steer you fellas away from that

I'm more concerned about prophecies that right now are interpreted in several ways and speak of events that are yet to happen (symbolically or actually - whichever one people hold).

which in particular is JeSoul interested in?

davidylan:

which in particular is JeSoul interested in?

Oga I don talk am now

JeSoul:

I'm more concerned about prophecies that right now are interpreted in several ways and speak of events that are yet to happen (symbolically or actually - whichever one people hold).

Like the battle of armageddon, the two witnesses, the tribulation period, the bowls/seals/trumpets and the events that unfold etc etc . . .

It will be good if you take them one by one and provide references. thanks.

davidylan:

It will be good if you take them one by one and provide references. thanks.

Thanks David. However I'm not really looking to get into "interpreting" those prophecies. I'm asking more in a general sense of end-time prophecies. See these questions again:

-Can we truly know for certain which of these various interpretations of prophecies are accurate?

-Should we even be trying to figure out these prophecies? when for the most part they seem unsearchable? (that is answers may never be known until the events actually occur).

-Are there any practical applications (for todays christian) from any knowledge that may be gleaned from studies on end-time prophecy?

-Or is the passionate, fervent study[b] itself [/b] (and not necessarily the achievement of solid answers) the reward? I'm inclined mostly towards this position based on 1Pet below:

I think it is important that we know some of these prophecies and actively seek their interpretation. the bible admonishes us to "watch" and pray . . . it means there will be observable signs to warn of the nearness of His coming.

Jehovah's Witnesses Interpretation

In the Jehovah's Witnesses' interpretation of Nebuchadnezzar's dream,[19] the statue is said to represent the following kingdoms:

1.The gold head - Babylon
2.The silver breast and arms - Medo-Persia
3.The copper belly and thighs - Greece
4.The iron legs - Rome
5.The feet partly of iron and partly of molded clay - Anglo-American dual power

The Anglo-American power is seen as the last dominant world power, emerging from a part of the Roman Empire (the iron legs) first as the British Empire, and then with the formation of the United States of America, to develop into the present-day special relationship between the United States and the United Kingdom. The dual nature of iron and clay (hard and soft), seemingly incompatible materials, is said to indicate the dual aspects of 'hard' and 'soft' power - military strength and diplomacy - both of which have been used to full effect by the USA and UK, while also hinting at inherent differences and even weaknesses in the relationship between the two powers.

The "kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and , not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand forever", in verse 44 of the prophecy, is said by Witnesses to be the heavenly kingdom established by God, with Jesus as appointed King, which will ultimately bring to an end human rulership.

Jehovah's Witnesses also believe that the sequence of world powers in Nebuchadnezzar's dream parallels that given in the vision in the Book of Revelation Chapter 17, verse 10 which speaks of "seven kings: five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet arrived". (Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Medo-Persia and Greece having "fallen" by the time Revelation was written; Rome was the world power at the time - "one is" - while the British Empire and subsequent emergence of the United States and their later alliance was then yet to come, hence "the other has not yet arrived".)

JeSoul:

-Can we truly know for certain which of these various interpretations are accurate?

I think it is best not to interpret these prophecies at all. my answer is deduced from my personal life.
personally, the biggest challenge I am facing today in my xtian life is the personal revelation of the ontological nature of God I have believed all my life. I have been taught that God is omnipotent, scient, present, puissant and sapient. getting closer to God and seeing these very natures of God is really really very scary. my ability to see visions before they attain reality is a scary exercise.

These visions are not for distant or future events alone, but for daily events that occur all through life about myself and the world around me. The visions do not strike me, what strikes me is their ability to come to pass. when these visions are about me, they come to pass without any slight input from me. . .implying that with or without my consent. . .these visions (which may also involve actions from me) come to pass.

My personal reaction is that. . . No one knows 1% about God. for clarity I would say that there is a big external force outside of existence that controls all things in existence. . .His biggest strength is that He lives outside of existence. Life as we see it today is a stage managed affair, when u consider the potency of visions and prophecies. what explanation would one for the manifestation of a future vision or prophecy given donkey years ago? . . . . the manifestation can easily be linked to the one who made the prophecy in the first place. . God. God also has a far "over-bearing influence" in our individuals. . . . but for my faith in God, I would have resented God because of the potency my visions and my inability to prevent any of it from happening.

Another good example is the biblical Peter. when Jesus foretold peter's denial. . .peter rebuked such claims stating that he'd rather die with the Lord than betray Him. . . , peter only remembered this encounter after he'd denied the Lord thrice. did peter really have a say in influencing the prophecy made by the Lord? . . . , And also the only psychological explanation to the fact that the disciples did not pick up arms against their persecutors was because Jesus foretold their persecution in sordid details. .  . .my submission is that Jesus knows far too much than we think.

To answer ur question. . . there is no point interpreting these prophecies. . cos they are hardly meant to be understood (at least not for everyone). . . . .many times I do not understand my visions or words of revelations until they have attained manifestation. . . .this readily implies that perhaps they were not fully meant to be understood.

if every one knew how exactly the 666 mark would come about. . . , no one would take it. but how are u sure that by using a debit/credit card, u are not carrying a 666 mark?

-Should we even be trying to figure out these prophecies? when for the most part they seem unsearchable? (that is answers may never be known until the events actually occur). 

The general populace CANNOT at any given time understand the implications of biblical prophecies. This is simply because it was not meant to be. IMO most of the commonly held end-time notions are wrong. . .as no man knows the times or season for events to happen. . .  .I doubt anyone would really notice the rapture. . . .as hollywood is subtly informing us of alien kidnaps. . . .neither would anyone notice the last 7 years. . ,  . as the world would be too concerned about having peace.

These prophecies seem unsearchable simply because God has  the exclusive preserve of times and brings about the manifestation of these prophecies in an "uneventful" way.

-Are there any practical applications (for todays christian) from any knowledge that may be gleaned from studies on end-time prophecy?

The major prophecy IMO for latter day believers should be that "it is appointed to for men to die and after which judgement follows".
many extra-biblical sources including biblical interpretations have ulterior motives. . , .how do u explain the many xtain claims that George Bush was the anti-Christ? now they say it is Obama. . .some say prince Charles. . . . .the last 4 popes have been called anti-Christ. the term "anti-Christ" is now unfortunately synonymous with success. ,  . .why then should anyone succumb to the ill conceived prophetic interpretations of some "theological" illiterates.

The best source of such knowledge is from God, . . . .and many times He refrains the recipients from disclosing such revelations.

-Or is the passionate, fervent study[b] itself[/b] (and not necessarily the achievement of solid answers) the reward? I'm inclined mostly towards this position based on 1Pet below:

Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to you, searched intently and with the greatest care, trying to find out the time and circumstances to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when he predicted the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow. It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves but you, when they spoke of the things that have now been told you by those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven. Even angels long to look into these things.

My deduction from the above passage is that times and seasons remain the exclusive preserve of God. . .as not even angels know of the several seasons, .  . . , seasons here refers to time for the manifestation of prophecies.

The 7th Day Adventist view -

JeSoul:

Please this topic is mostly for christians, but thoughts and opinions from other really cool people like MyJoe are welcome.

Now, I feel really cool.    . No mind Deep Sight - he won't hijack nothing.

But Revelation is one hard nut to crack because there are usually many possible interpretations. What can be stated without doubt is that most parts of the Bible contain applications for everyone. For example, there are many practical lessons to be learnt from the letters the angel carried to the seven churches in Asia Minor - the dangers of covetousness, disloyalty, sectarianism and various acts of immorality are spelt out.

I will like your thoughts on what Deep Sight wrote above.

Noetic16, i seem to have a different opinion to yours.

Luke 21: 25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;

26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.

27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.

28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

What are these signs? How are we to know when they come to pass?

Deep Sight:

Jehovah's Witnesses also believe that the sequence of world powers in Nebuchadnezzar's dream parallels that given in the vision in the Book of Revelation Chapter 17, verse 10 which speaks of "seven kings: five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet arrived". (Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Medo-Persia and Greece having "fallen" by the time Revelation was written; Rome was the world power at the time - "one is" - while the British Empire and subsequent emergence of the United States and their later alliance was then yet to come, hence "the other has not yet arrived".)

Thanks DS. Well, this is one of many many interpretations . . . who's right?

MyJoe:

Now, I feel really cool. . No mind Deep Sight - he won't hijack nothing.

But Revelation is one hard nut to crack because there are usually many possible interpretations. What can be stated without doubt is that most parts of the Bible contain applications for everyone. For example, there are many practical lessons to be learnt from the letters the angel carried to the seven churches in Asia Minor - the dangers of covetousness, disloyalty, sectarianism and various acts of immorality are spelt out.

I will like your thoughts on what Deep Sight wrote above.

Exactly.
My question is (well for christians I guess) is this a nut we should be attempting to crack?

davidylan:

Noetic16, i seem to have a different opinion to yours.

Luke 21: 25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;

26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.

27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.

28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

What are these signs? How are we to know when they come to pass?

with regards to the above and other EXPLICITLY stated prophetic words . .  . I do agree with you as to us knowing when they come to pass. . . .simply because Jesus was explicit. .  .He told of wars and signs.

but the case of Daniel and revelation are not so. . . .they refer to objects and dates and days and symbols many of which cannot be easily deciphered. it is in this regard that I also view some dreams I see. .  . should one dismiss the symbols and objects?. . or what meaning should one make of them?

let me ask u. . . . .do u subscribe to Deepsights post stating the Jehovah witness interpretation? . . . .and why?

2. I believe many of these prophecies can best be known after they have come to pass. . . . .despite us from seeing such visions.

Noetic,
    thank you for this heartfelt response. Several things I'd like to touch on:

   

noetic16:

I think it is best not to interpret these prophecies at all. my answer is deduced from my personal life.
personally, the biggest challenge I am facing today in my xtian life is the personal revelation of the ontological nature of God I have believed all my life. I have been taught that God is omnipotent, scient, present, puissant and sapient. getting closer to God and seeing these very natures of God is really really very scary. my ability to see visions before they attain reality is a scary exercise.

These visions are not for distant or future events alone, but for daily events that occur all through life about myself and the world around me. The visions do not strike me, what strikes me is their ability to come to pass. when these visions are about me, they come to pass without any slight input from me. . .implying that with or without my consent. . .these visions (which may also involve actions from me) come to pass.

I'm gleaning from the above that you have the gift of prophecy and visions. And I find the bolded part most interesting . . . it holds parallels for many biblical prophecies.

My personal reaction is that. . . No one knows 1% about God.

  Truer words have never been spoken.

Another good example is the biblical Peter. when Jesus foretold peter's denial. . .peter rebuked such claims stating that he'd rather die with the Lord than betray Him. . . , peter only remembered this encounter after he'd denied the Lord thrice. did peter really have a say in influencing the prophecy made by the Lord? . . . , And also the only psychological explanation to the fact that the disciples did not pick up arms against their persecutors was because Jesus foretold their persecution in sordid details. .  . .my submission is that Jesus knows far too much than we think.

Correct me if I'm misunderstanding you here, you partly hold that since we cannot influence or change prophecy then -

there is no point interpreting these prophecies. . cos they are hardly meant to be understood (at least not for everyone)

until the time of its fulfilment. Did I quote you right?

. . . . .many times[b] I do not understand my visions or words of revelations until they have attained manifestation[/b]. . . .this readily implies that perhaps they were not fully meant to be understood.

Exactly. I quoted that verse in 1 Pet cos it showed how the prophecies given to the prophets were not for them and they could not understand it - until it was fulfilled.
  Your next statement is tricky, but I think correct. The key word being "fully understood". Again this is the indication we get from 1 Pet.

if every one knew how exactly the 666 mark would come about. . . , no one would take it. but how are u sure that by using a debit/credit card, u are not carrying a 666 mark?

Just yday I heard a sermon where the preacher gave his view that the 666 may not even be a literal "666" but a mark or code for something else etc.

IMO most of the commonly held end-time notions are wrong. . .as no man knows the times or season for events to happen. . .  .I doubt anyone would really notice the rapture. . . .as hollywood is subtly informing us of alien kidnaps. . . .neither would anyone notice the last 7 years. . ,  . as the world would be too concerned about having peace.

Can you briefly name a few?

davidylan:

Some of the prophecies in Daniel have already occured.

four hundred after the events had occurred, the book was written. quite convenient1

Hi Jesoul. The book of revelation is purely a spiritual book clothed in earthly words and in my own perception, it is 100% accurate and do contain the blueprint for what has happened, is happening and will happen. But we must realise that it deals with happening far beyound the conceptional capacity of even the most gifted human being, that is why it is a revelation in the first place. Any attempt at interpreting the book of Revelation or given a time frame when some of the prohecies will occure is doomed to failure. Many have done so in the past and many will also do so in the future but both them and their followers will end up with bitter disappointment for their interpretations will come to naught. But it is still possible that some sections of it can be revealed to a human being by God, and thus even with the highest calling and grace, the blessed one can only have part knowlege. It will be unwise and even dangerous to put up an interpretation based on part knowlege. My view is that their are more than enough signs in the universe and its various inhabitants to show that the end time is near or that we are already in the end time. The mechanisms on how it will unfold is left to God and his will. What we human beings should do is to see that at this moment, we are living absolutely in the sense of the will of God so that we are not found wanting  when the trumpets of God sound. One of our major weakness is that we spent enormous energy and time pondering what we will not understand even if it was explained to us and forget to do things that God require such as love of God, love fellow human beings, love of Gods creation, purity, chastity, humility, compassion, truthfulness etc. I am convinced that when the trumpet sounds, God will not judje us on how we interpret Revelation but whether or not we have lived our lives according to the will of God. Stay blessed.

noetic16:

with regards to the above and other EXPLICITLY stated prophetic words . .  . I do agree with you as to us knowing when they come to pass. . . .simply because Jesus was explicit. .  .He told of wars and signs.

but the case of Daniel and revelation are not so. . . .they refer to objects and dates and days and symbols many of which cannot be easily deciphered. it is in this regard that I also view some dreams I see. .  . should one dismiss the symbols and objects?. . or what meaning should one make of them?

let me ask u. . . . .do u subscribe to Deepsights post stating the Jehovah witness interpretation? . . . .and why?

2. I believe many of these prophecies can best be known after they have come to pass. . . . .despite us from seeing such visions.

Interestingly i do subscribe to that interpretation of Daniel chapter 2 for the following reasons:

1. Daniel correctly identifies the various symbols on that statue as kingdoms. Infact he makes it pretty easy for us to understand the interpretation of this dream.

2. The head of Gold is identified as babylon . . . Dan 2:37 Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for t[b]he God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory.[/b]
38 And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold.

At this time, Nebuchadnezzar was the ruler of the vast Babylonian empire.

3. Daniel says the second kingdom as the bosom and arms of silver that will come after the fall of the Babylonian empire - Dan 2:39. Not surprisingly this is identified as the Medo-Persian empire that overthrew Nebuchanezzar's son, Belshazar.
Dan 5:28 PERES; Thy kingdom is divided, and given to the Medes and Persians.
30 In that night was Belshazzar the king of the Chaldeans slain.
31 And Darius the Median took the kingdom, being about threescore and two years old.

4. Dan 2:39 also says the kingdom of brass will come directly after the Medo-Persian empire . . . this empire is identified as the Grecian empire under Alexander the great which overthrew the Medo-Persian empire in 550BC (not sure of the dates now).

5. The legs of Iron is the Roman empire which came following the death of Alexander the great and the subsequent decline of the Grecian empire.

6. The toes are made up of partly iron (this indicates it would probably morph from the remnants of the Roman empire) and clay.
- I would wager that the toes made of partly iron and clay signifies the rise of the Anglo-American empire. Follow the fall of Rome, the British empire took over and exists till today partly in alliance with the US (the only super power left on earth).

An important point to note is that Daniel leaves us a clue again as to what times we live in . . .

Dan 2:44 And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.

Daniel prophesies that in the days of these kings (verse 43 was talking about the kingdoms of the 5 toes of clay/iron) shall the kingdom of heaven be established (i.e. the last days will be during these clay/iron kingdoms).

JeSoul:

My question is (well for christians I guess) is this a nut we should be attempting to crack?

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Do we then choose what part to read and which to ignore?

Hi Nwankwo,

as usual, you have said a truckload that is sooo applicable. Thank you.

m_nwankwo:

Hi Jesoul. The book of revelation is purely a spiritual book clothed in earthly words and in my own perception, it is 100% accurate and do contain the blueprint for what has happened, is happening and will happen. But we must realise that it deals with happening far beyound the conceptional capacity of even the most gifted human being, that is why it is a revelation in the first place. Any attempt at interpreting the book of Revelation or given a time frame when some of the prohecies will occure is doomed to failure. Many have done so in the past and many will also do so in the future but both them and their followers will end up with bitter disappointment for their interpretations will come to naught. But it is still possible that some sections of it can be revealed to a human being by God, and thus even with the highest calling and grace, the blessed one can only have part knowlege. It will be unwise and even dangerous to put up an interpretation based on part knowlege. My view is that their are more than enough signs in the universe and its various inhabitants to show that the end time is near or that we are already in the end time.

Very true. One question tho:

The mechanisms on how it will unfold is left to God and his will.

Why did God give us the book of Revelation then? back to the title of the thread: what is the purpose of giving us those prophecies if we cannot even understand them?

What we human beings should do is to see that at this moment, we are living absolutely in the sense of the will of God so that we are not found wanting when the trumpets of God sound[b]. One of our major weakness is that we spent enormous energy and time pondering what we will not understand even if it was explained to us and forget to do things that God require such as love of God, love fellow human beings, love of Gods creation, purity, chastity, humility, compassion, truthfulness etc[/b]. I am convinced that when the trumpet sounds, God will not judje us on how we interpret Revelation but whether or not we have lived our lives according to the will of God. Stay blessed.

I agree wholeheartedly with this.

davidylan:

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Do we then choose what part to read and which to ignore?

  I don't think its necessarily advocating "ignoring" a certain chunk of scripture. I did submit the searching and looking into these prophecies by christians may be the "purpose" of them - not necessarily being able to decipher and interpret them fully.

We don't go about using and quoting from the book of Numbers everyday and in instructing and reproving and correcting ourselves in our walk. It is scripture, but not scripture we christians really use . . . unless you're of the persuation there are hidden numbers and codes and signs in the geneaologies etc. I think its purely a historical segment that simply shows God pays attention to details. It doesn't mean I "ignore it". Makes sense I hope.

JeSoul:

Noetic,
    thank you for this heartfelt response. Several things I'd like to touch on:

    I'm gleaning from the above that you have the gift of prophecy and visions. And I find the bolded part most interesting . . . it holds parallels for many biblical prophecies.
  Truer words have never been spoken.
Correct me if I'm misunderstanding you here, you partly hold that since we cannot influence or change prophecy then -  until the time of its fulfilment. Did I quote you right?

Rightly so. . ,  and this is largely due to my personal spiritual experiences. . . . .man has little or no influence over these things.
The ability to correctly understand these prophecies is on its own a gift. . . . .the ability to decipher what spiritual season we are in now is another gift on its own.

Take for instance Paul talks about the manifestation of the sons of God (romans 8:19). . . .John talks about those who Jesus gave the power to become the sons of God (John 1:12) and Paul also talks about those who truly are the sons of God (romans 8:14).
So we know from (john1:12 and romans 8:14) those who Paul was talking about in romans 8:19.

A literal deduction from the above is that the "adopted" sons of God through Christ Jesus would excel right here on earth. how would they excel? what does it mean to excel?. . .would they hold positions of influence? would they be financially bouyant? would they become very powerful like Joseph or Daniel? would they become world leaders?
How does this prophecy by Paul reflect on the gospel of the many thieves and charlatans in the church whose only message is prosperity? could they be right after all? . . .when is this season Paul was talking about?. . . . .it is definitely before the anti-Christ.

From Paul's prophecy.  . . . .it is obvious that the sons of God would excel exceptionally. This means that perhaps we are not yet in the season of the anti-Christ, or in the purported last days.

of course I might be wrong. . . .but who exactly can tell as to what spiritual season we are in? there are too many prophetic revelations in the bible. . . .that have no chronological order. It is in lieu of this that I believe that the best shot is not to try to interpret these prophecies with mere human theological knowledge. . . .these interpretations do more harm than good. innocent people have been ignorantly labelled anti-Christ.

Can you briefly name a few?

I do not speak as a spiritual authority. . .but neither do I subscribe to many end-time notions.

1. the case of the rapture. The biblical description of the rapture by the Lord is too "unclothed". if two people walk and one suddenly disappears, there would be global panic and many would know that the rapture has taken place. . . . .and this IMO does not convey the message Jesus was trying to teach. He was IMO simply talking about the unexpected nature of the rapture (and His subsequent return) and the context does not convey that the world would know of the rapture.

2. the Anti-Christ. who really is the anti-Christ? is he a person, a nation, group of nations or an institution. many people have been labelled anti-Christ. but yet there are billions of anti-Christs walking all over this planet,  . . . .my take is that God has a far deeper message to us concerning the anti-Christ. do I know this message. . . no I dont.

3. 666. No one would willingly collect the 666 mark. . . . .so it might come in the form of a necessary innovation. . . .a necessity we just cannot do without,  like the internet, our debit or credit cards. oyster cards and many other necessities.
would anyone willingly receive the 666 mark, knowing fully well that it is a 666 mark? regardless of whether they are xtians or not, the fact that it is the much mentioned 666 is a bad selling point for the anti-Christ.

4. End of the world. when exactly is the end of the world? . . . . .my take is the world like all other creations are coming to an end. . . but we are not yet at the very end. I might be wrong. . but the end all persons should be looking out for is the one stated in hebrews 9:27.
This should be the end that should concern every individual.

5 the judgement of God. many times many preachers try to prick on the emotions of people to say that certain wicked persons in society would receive judgements from God with immediate effect. I have learnt that this is FALSE. The persecution xtians suffer usually has the signature of God on it. . .largely within the plan of God. . that explains what was stated in psalm 34:19 that "many are the afflictions of the righteous, but the Lord delivers Him from them all" . . . . .I was once being persecuted at work. . . I prayed about it, I was going to confront my managers. . . guess what God told me . . , He said "do not confront anyone, see me working through them to make u a better person". . . . .This singular persecution turned out for good and changed my understanding of events.

JeSoul:

  I don't think its necessarily advocating "ignoring" a certain chunk of scripture. I did submit the searching and looking into these prophecies by christians may be the "purpose" of them - not necessarily being able to decipher and interpret them fully.

We don't go about using and quoting from the book of Numbers everyday and in instructing and reproving and correcting ourselves in our walk. It is scripture, but not scripture we christians really use . . . unless you're of the persuation there are hidden numbers and codes and signs in the geneaologies etc. I think its purely a historical segment that simply shows God pays attention to details. It doesn't mean I "ignore it". Makes sense I hope.

Good point. But i believe the idea that we can simply skip the prophecies because we dont understand them is not the way to go. There was a lot (parables, prophecies) the disciples could barely comprehend too . . . they didnt just gloss over it. There is room for searching the scriptures and asking God for interpretation . . .

Of course we dont go around quoting the book of Numbers but you'd be surprised at how incredibly useful the information it contains can be. We christians always say that the new testament is the old testament revealed . . . there is plenty of symbols in Numbers or Leviticus that helps you understand the message of salvation much much better. I must admit Leviticus in particular makes for very painful reading though.

i like noetic16's last paragraph . . . i think i have a different viewpoint on somethings there . . . i shall be back to leave a comment.