Salaam Alaikum.

The question is, if Allah hate evil so much and he's all-good, how come evil exist?

tintingz:
Salaam Alaikum.

The question is, if Allah hate even so much and he's all-good, how come evil exist?

To start: what is evil in your definition?

AlBaqir:


To start: what is evil in your definition?

According to Google,

Evil - profoundly immoral and wicked.

tintingz:
According to Google,

Evil - profoundly immoral and wicked.

Every general calamity, looked from the religion's view-point, is good if it visits the evil ones, who create mischief in the earth; but the same will be seen as evil and bad if it attacks a believing and good community.

 Eating food is good and lawful, if it is prepared from one's own money; and the same will become evil and unlawful if it is a part of another man's property taken without his permission. Why? Because it lacks obedience to the prohibition in respect of eating other people's property without permission; or the obedience to the imperative order of restricting oneself to those things only which Allãh has allowed. Sexual intercourse between a man and a woman is good and lawful if it follows marriage; and is evil and sin if it is illicit, without marriage – because the latter lacks conformity with divine commandment.

In short, good is a positive aspect of things and actions, and evil is their negative aspect, although the thing or action itself is the same in both cases.

[Allah] Who made good every thing that He has created (32:7). Thus, every created thing is good, and this goodness is an integral part of creation which cannot be separated from it; if it is Allah's creation, it is good.


On the other hand, man may create evil for himself. Knife, for example is used to peel yam, orange etc which is good. If used to kill or injure, it becomes evil created by man's handiwork.


"Whatever benefit comes to you, it is from Allah, and whatever misfortune befalls you, it is from yourself (4:79); And whatever affliction befalls you, it is on account of what your hands have wrought, and (yet) He pardons most (of your faults) (42:30); Surely Allah does not change the condition of a people until they change their own condition (13:11); This is because Allah does never change a bounty which He has conferred upon a people until they change their own condition (8:53)

AlBaqir:



Every general calamity, looked from the religion's view-point, is good if it visits the evil ones, who create mischief in the earth; but the same will be seen as evil and bad if it attacks a believing and good community.

 Eating food is good and lawful, if it is prepared from one's own money; and the same will become evil and unlawful if it is a part of another man's property taken without his permission. Why? Because it lacks obedience to the prohibition in respect of eating other people's property without permission; or the obedience to the imperative order of restricting oneself to those things only which Allãh has allowed. Sexual intercourse between a man and a woman is good and lawful if it follows marriage; and is evil and sin if it is illicit, without marriage – because the latter lacks conformity with divine commandment.

In short, good is a positive aspect of things and actions, and evil is their negative aspect, although the thing or action itself is the same in both cases.

[Allah] Who made good every thing that He has created (32:7). Thus, every created thing is good, and this goodness is an integral part of creation which cannot be separated from it; if it is Allah's creation, it is good.


On the other hand, man may create evil for himself. Knife, for example is used to peel yam, orange etc which is good. If used to kill or injure, it becomes evil created by man's handiwork.


"Whatever benefit comes to you, it is from Allah, and whatever misfortune befalls you, it is from yourself (4:79); And whatever affliction befalls you, it is on account of what your hands have wrought, and (yet) He pardons most (of your faults) (42:30); Surely Allah does not change the condition of a people until they change their own condition (13:11); This is because Allah does never change a bounty which He has conferred upon a people until they change their own condition (8:53)

You're mixing things up.

My argument is not about after creation, my argument is about before creation, God is omniscient, all good and hate evil that he's ready to punish someone for eternity. The opposite of good is evil.

How come evil exist?

Is it part of his plan for evil to exist?

What about Satan, did he know beforehand he's going to be the master of evil?

Or is God malevolent?

Here is an argument from Epicurus also known as Epicurean paradox or trilemma.

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"

tintingz:
You're mixing things up.

My argument is not about after creation, my argument is about before creation, God is omniscient, all good and hate evil that he's ready to punish someone for eternity. The opposite of good is evil.

How come evil exist?

Is it part of his plan for evil to exist?

What about Satan, did he know beforehand he's going to be the master of evil?

Or is God malevolent?

First, your question NEVER addressed "before the creation", and you don't expect me to know your intention.

Second, your question was "does God hate evil?". The only thing I find interested there was asking you a part of the question "what is evil in your definition".

Unfortunately, you gave "Google definition", and I gave you Islamic concept of "evil".

Wherever you are planning to drag your question to is none of my concern. Next time, you present your argument against other ideology, then, whoever wishes to defend will reply.

tintingz:
Here is an argument from Epicurus also known as Epicurean paradox or trilemma.

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"

These questions become nothing when we explore the meaning of "evil" as we have done above in a glance.

For a fact, evil is not real rather it is relative. A wolf is bad for a sheep, but not for itself or for a plant [for example]; just as a sheep, with respect to a plant that it eats and destroys, is bad, but with respect to itself, human beings, or a wolf [for example], it is not bad.

Rumi says,

Snake-poison is life to the snake, (But) it is death in relation to man."

# Man has been given intellect and freewill: he knows for example gravity: if he obeys and respect it (law of gravity), he will not hurt himself. If he choose to disrepect and disregard it, he will hurt himself; therefore, with his intellect and freewill innate in him, why would God prevent "evil" he choose and created for himself from him?

"God will not do for man what he can do for himself" - Oddessy

AlBaqir:



First, your question NEVER addressed "before the creation", and you don't expect me to know your intention.

How come something exist is talking about it origin.

If Kunle mother is barren how come she gave birth.

You should understand the question now.

Second, your question was "does God hate evil?". The only thing I find interested there was asking you a part of the question "what is evil in your definition".

Unfortunately, you gave "Google definition", and I gave you Islamic concept of "evil".

So?

Wherever you are planning to drag your question to is none of my concern. Next time, you present your argument against other ideology, then, whoever wishes to defend will reply.

I've already presented my argument which is questioning your God attributes, I don't need to write an epistle on that, the question doesn't require an epistle.

So can you address the premise again?

AlBaqir:


These questions become nothing when we explore the meaning of "evil" as we have done above in a glance.

For a fact, evil is not real rather it is relative. A wolf is bad for a sheep, but not for itself or for a plant [for example]; just as a sheep, with respect to a plant that it eats and destroys, is bad, but with respect to itself, human beings, or a wolf [for example], it is not bad.

Rumi says,

Snake-poison is life to the snake, (But) it is death in relation to man."

# Man has been given intellect and freewill: he knows for example gravity: if he obeys and respect it (law of gravity), he will not hurt himself. If he choose to disrepect and disregard it, he will hurt himself; therefore, with his intellect and freewill innate in him, why would God prevent "evil" he choose and created for himself from him?

"God will not do for man what he can do for himself" - Oddessy

Evil is real, when someone do bad to a fellow human that's evil, now the applications surrounding what evil is are different. What is evil to you might not be evil to me, but we all know there is evil. If evil is not real then there shouldn't be punishment.

Now God knowing beforehand evil will exist, he has his own concept of evil and hate it so much he's going to punish someone for eternity. For God to be all good, evil should never exist.

Now the question is how come evil exist? The Epicurus argument is a very valid argument.

And God has no choice than to give humans freewill and also inate evil with it when he hate it evil? God giving humans freewill made evil to exist, this is something he knew will exist beforehand, therefore it's either God is malevolent or impotent if he's willing to stop evil but not able or he's able but not willing.

If God could watch when a man is raping a girl and did nothing, is this what he wants and malevolent is this case, is the man raping the girl not infringing the freewill of the girl?

tintingz:
Evil is real, when someone do bad to a fellow human that's evil, now the applications surrounding what evil is are different. What is evil to you might not be evil to me, but we all know there is evil. If evil is not real then there shouldn't be punishment.

What you have explained make "evil" relative, not real or created by God.

Concept of punishment is different from evil. Dont muddle them up. Punishment and reward come as a result of your action.

tintingz:

Now God knowing beforehand evil will exist, he has his own concept of evil [s]and hate it so much he's going to punish someone for eternity[/s]. For God to be all good, evil should never exist.

Now the question is how come evil exist? The Epicurus argument is a very valid argument.

God never created "evil". Everything He created is good in their essence and respective nature. Misapplication of those things is what leads to negative effects which man understand as "evil".

Tests of God is sometimes mistaken as "evil" when we fail to rationalize their aim and purpose.

Like I said earlier the so called Epicurus argument is useless as far as definition of "evil" is understood.
Man with his intellect and freewill is able to reject good and create "evil" for himself. It is not compulsory for God, the giver of good, intellect and freewill to prevent unpleasantness created by man for himself.

"Corruption has appeared throughout the land and sea by [reason of] which is the result of men's handiwork so He may let them taste part of [the consequence of] what they have done that perhaps they will return [to righteousness]." - Sura Rum, verse 41

tintingz:

And God has no choice than to give humans freewill and also inate evil with it when he hate it evil? God giving humans freewill made evil to exist, this is something he knew will exist beforehand, therefore it's either God is malevolent or impotent if he's willing to stop evil but not able or he's able but not willing.

Are you quoting atheist scripture or you are force your false idea on "God" in order to arrive at your goal that, "God doesn't exist"?

# The fact that God knew man will reject "good" He created for him therefore plundering into "evil" does not meant He created evil. Knowing that something will happen doesn't meant you "created" it when it eventually happens.

In fact, the purpose of "intellect and freewill" given to man is to allow him to chose and the consequences has been spelt. How can you blame a good teacher for the failure of an unserious student when other serious student passed and the teacher knew for a fact that unseriousness leads to failure? A failed student might get serious later on. If the teacher had passed him, he will never get serious. It is not obligatory for God to prevent result of man's handiwork.

tintingz:

If God could watch when a man is raping a girl and did nothing, is this what he wants and malevolent is this case, is the man raping the girl not infringing the freewill of the girl?

If the girl obeys the law of God by not revealing her body to attract men, there won't be consequence of rape. If parents are not selling their girls child as "house help", there won't be abuse of those girls. Again, evil is as a result of man's handiwork based on his rejection of good created by God.

AlBaqir:


What you have explained make "evil" relative, not real or created by God.

Concept of punishment is different from evil. Dont muddle them up. Punishment and reward come as a result of your action.

Why is there punishment if evil is not real? If I stab you for no reason am I not being wicked, won't I be punished?

Doing bad or evil is real, we observe them and can be proven!

Now the applications surrounding what evil is can be different. E.g killing apostate is an evil act to me but to Muslims it's good, a Muslim doesn't know this is evil until same is done on him. This is where empathy comes in.

Punishment and reward are not always accurate, the world is not perfect to have an accurate consequences.

God never created "evil". Everything He created is good in their essence and respective nature. Misapplication of those things is what leads to negative effects which man understand as "evil".

If God didn't create evil then where cometh evil that he's unable to stop? What it's role of Satan? I thought God is the creator of All?

Tests of God is sometimes mistaken as "evil" when we fail to rationalize their aim and purpose.

God is omniscient, what then is the purpose of testing when he already knows the results?

The argument is not even about testing, God hate evil yet he allowed it to exist.

Like I said earlier the so called Epicurus argument is useless as far as definition of "evil" is understood.

The opposite of good is evil.

Can you define "evil" for me again?

If evil is not real then good is not real.

Man with his intellect and freewill is able to reject good and create "evil" for himself. It is not compulsory for God, the giver of good, intellect and freewill to prevent unpleasantness created by man for himself.

How ridiculous, why did God give man freewill when he knows evil will exist with it?

Is there not a possibility God given man freewill and not innate evil with it?

"Corruption has appeared throughout the land and sea by [reason of] which is the result of men's handiwork so He may let them taste part of [the consequence of] what they have done that perhaps they will return [to righteousness]." - Sura Rum, verse 41

How absurd, it seems God doesn't know man will be corrupt.

Are you quoting atheist scripture or you are force your false idea on "God" in order to arrive at your goal that, "God doesn't exist"?

Lol, which atheist scriptures.

This argument is not even about God existence, it's about God omnipotent paradox, it imperfectness.

# The fact that God knew man will reject "good" He created for him therefore plundering into "evil" does not meant He created evil. Knowing that something will happen doesn't meant you "created" it when it eventually happens.

Again If God didn't create evil then where did evil come from that God is unable to stop it?

You're beginning to contradict the believe God created all.

In fact, the purpose of "intellect and freewill" given to man is to allow him to chose and the consequences has been spelt. How can you blame a good teacher for the failure of an unserious student when other serious student passed and the teacher knew for a fact that unseriousness leads to failure? A failed student might get serious later on. If the teacher had passed him, he will never get serious. It is not obligatory for God to prevent result of man's handiwork.

A teacher is not omniscient, he's not perfect, he's just like the students, the reason test is conducted in schools is because both the teachers and students are not perfect. God who's perfect and all-knowing already knows the end of everything, he knows the destiny of everyone long before creation, test is useless here.

Now God who is able to shape the future, he knows humans will err because of evil he allowed to exist, so also because of freewill he gave and there will be serious cruel punishment waiting, no matter what he does to warn them these things will still happen(destiny), a good merciful God who doesn't want this went ahead with this plan or destiny.

Abeg who's to be blame for everything, God who is the creator, omnipotent, perfect and has shaped this destiny or human who are imperfect?

If the girl obeys the law of God by not revealing her body to attract men, there won't be consequence of rape. If parents are not selling their girls child as "house help", there won't be abuse of those girls. Again, evil is as a result of man's handiwork based on his rejection of good created by God.

Oga, this is nonsensical. Little girls are raped even in their house, did she caused it to herself? Hijabi women are raped despite following your God command, is that fair?

Even a woman who dressed half-nàked does not deserve to be raped because she has her freedom, if God doesn't want this and want her to dress all covered up so she won't be punished, it that not infringing her freedom? It seems God is confused.

If God cannot stop a rapist from raping a lady(which is evil) and only watch because he gave freewill, why then society wants to reduce evil when God gave us freewill?

I wonder who still take this one serious........

More like saying why does the school have to conduct an exam for us when she knows some will pass and many will fail.

I pray one day you come to the realisation that you are in dire need of His mercy to save you from drowning in your own folly.

adejaresalami1:
I wonder who still take this one serious........

More like saying why does the school have to conduct an exam for us when she knows some will pass and many will fail.

I pray one day you come to the realisation that you are in dire need of His mercy to save you from drowning in your own folly.

School does not know who will pass and who will fail reason exam is conducted. A teacher in a school is not perfect to point out which students will pass and which students will fail. God who is perfect, omniscient/all-knowing knows every decision humans will make beforehand(before creation), he already knows the end of everyone(destiny), what then is the essence of testing?