My opinion is that foreign countries and organizations like to malign Africans with facts that downgrade us both intellectually and emotionally.

$2 / day = 300naira per day  = which is ~ 10000 monthly.

Now let's consider cost of living in Nigeria:

Average Meal - N150 (N300 per day for two square meals)

I haven't even added cost of transportation, accommodation, etc and the 10000naira is already gone.

Does this mean 80% of Nigerians eat just once a day?
Does this mean 80% of Nigerians don't live in houses?
Does this mean only 20% of Nigerians own Mobile Phones? If no, how do the remaining recharge?
Does this mean only 20% of Nigerians have places to live in? If no, where do the rest stay in?
Does that 80% figure include children and young adults? If yes, then these people don't have any income and shouldn't be factored in.

Lagos and Kano hold approximately 20% of Nigeria's population, with 30+M residents out of Nigeria's 150M. If I choose to include states like Ogun, FCT, Oyo, Imo, Anambra, where the average person can afford @ least two square meals, how true then is the 80% of Nigerians are poor theory.

Or are the foreign bodies counting Almajiris (the only people who are really poor in my books) to be 80% of our population?

Lastly, if I can get 2 square meals, housing, etc all for 300 naira per day. Does this make me poor?

What are your thoughts?   

Disclaimer: I have been to the poorest of places in Nigeria, the remotest locations, as well as the richest locations in Nigeria too. So I know how the really poor people live. And trust me, even they eat two square meals.

Nigerians are far poorer than this your incorrect indices. We only survive by smartness

Iolo:

My opinion is that foreign countries and organizations like to malign Africans with facts that downgrade us both intellectually and emotionally.

$2 / day = 300naira per day  = which is ~ 10000 monthly.

Now let's consider cost of living in Nigeria:

Average Meal - N150 (N300 per day for two square meals)

I haven't even added cost of transportation, accommodation, etc and the 10000naira is already gone.

Does this mean 80% of Nigerians eat just once a day?
Does this mean 80% of Nigerians don't live in houses?
Does this mean only 20% of Nigerians own Mobile Phones? If no, how do the remaining recharge?
Does this mean only 20% of Nigerians have places to live in? If no, where do the rest stay in?
Does that 80% figure include children and young adults? If yes, then these people don't have any income and shouldn't be factored in.

Lagos and Kano hold approximately 20% of Nigeria's population, with 30+M residents out of Nigeria's 150M. If I choose to include states like Ogun, FCT, Oyo, Imo, Anambra, where the average person can afford @ least two square meals, how true then is the 80% of Nigerians are poor theory.

Or are the foreign bodies counting Almajiris (the only people who are really poor in my books) to be 80% of our population?

Lastly, if I can get 2 square meals, housing, etc all for 300 naira per day. Does this make me poor?

What are your thoughts?   

Disclaimer: I have been to the poorest of places in Nigeria, the remotest locations, as well as the richest locations in Nigeria too. So I know how the really poor people live. And trust me, even they eat two square meals.

You have raised a lot of valid questions.

True - There is poverty in Nigeria, and it needs to be addressed.
Also true - A lot of Nigerians have been brainwashed by statistics that seem to be baseless, and you will see people attacking you very logical points with sentiments and irrational reasoning.

The bolded statement is really worth thinking about, for all ye that swallow whatever other people (Oyinbo) say without reasoning.

okosodo:

Nigerians are far poorer than this your incorrect indices. We only survive by smartness

Mr Man, the poster was very logical with his points, so you should at least try small and not just make statements that seem to be coming from thin air.

For example, how are Nigerians far poorer than his indices. Are the points he raised false? Unless we begin to think for ourselves, we will never progress!!

Yeah they do. Our problem is we like to bundle facts in Nigeria. Rather than fighting the problem, you are fighting the messenger. This is a thread where comptroller of prisons say Nigeria prisoners feed on 200 Naira a day nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-794618.0.html
Now compare it with what is obtainable elsewhere. Do you know the amount spent on prisoners in UK or US.
And then the so called almajiri's and other wretched Nigerians in rural and urban centers-those who sleep under the bridge. Do you know how many people and families feed from hand to mouth in Nigeria? Its just illiteracy that is killing the country, thats why people are suffering and smiling.

Mr. Globe:

Yeah they do. Our problem is we like to bundle facts in Nigeria. Rather than fighting the problem, you are fighting the messenger. This is a thread where comptroller of prisons say Nigeria prisoners feed on 200 Naira a day nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-794618.0.html
Now compare it with what is obtainable elsewhere. Do you know the amount spent on prisoners in UK or US.
And then the so called almajiri's and other wretched Nigerians in rural and urban centers-those who sleep under the bridge. Do you know how many people and families feed from hand to mouth in Nigeria? Its just illiteracy that is killing the country, thats why people are suffering and smiling.

The poster made valid points and for Gods sake we are talking about Nigeria here, why are you comparing Nigerian prisoners with UK and USA? Do you think white people, especially British people are as rich as they claim?
Since you brought UK to this let me tell you, I have been to many developed countries especially UNITED KINGDOM on several occasions, most British people are in SERIOUS debts. They buy ALMOST everything on CREDIT? For instance, most Nigerians have more than 1 phone and we pay 100% for it everything that we buy or own, in England they buy on credit and it takes them years to pay off. Everything I have in this world belongs to me 100%, from houses to clothes and cars etc, but in UK they claim to own cars and houses while in the real sense most people there cant afford to buy car or house in cash, therefore they buy on credit and it usually takes them 15 to 35 years to pay off their mortgages and car loans.

The British family friend i usually visit is about 65 years old and has debt of 46,000 pounds mostly from betting/football pools. His first daughter is in debt of over 35,000 pounds and the other people i know in UK are all in debt. How did i know? Because we are family friends and we do talk about our economies. What am trying to say is this. White people usually quote figures to discredit us. These people don't like us, and they are part of our problems. WHEN YOU GO TO ENGLAND YOU NOTICE THAT ALMOST EVERYONE IS WORKING JUST TO PAY OFF THEIR DEBTS

You said some Nigerians sleep under the bridge? Is that news? Name any country on earth that doesn't have street people? In USA and UK some of their WHITE CITIZENS sleep under the bridge just like some Nigerians do. Some white people are as poor as church rats. I know we are poor but we are not as poor as they claim. A white bastard once asked me if we have good houses and hotels in Nigeria? You know why? Because probably he still thinks we live in CAVES, hell yeah that's what they show them on TV over there.

When I go to my village and look round, I don't see anyone living on less than 2$ a day as claimed by them white supremacists. We have no oil and gas in my village, but everyone in my village has large farmlands and cash crops, we are hard working and able to produce enough food to feed our families, sell and make money. Almost every family in my village has two or 3 graduates or under graduates, now if you are that poor and wretched how can you afford university education? Over 35% of houses in my village have bore hole which costs more than 350,000 naira. I am using my village for just for example. I am yet to see any village or city where 80% of the people live on less than $2 a day. It could be possible in the north but whats their population anyways?

Here we go again. Comparing ourselves to Developed world who are developed to have a system such as credits.

$2 a day for the avg person? Not good. Poster made a lot of valid points there.

Atleast some are getting paid. GEJ's personal helpers are currently complaining of non-payment salary of 6 months now.

^ lol.
@Ross you clearly missed the point. Ok, the poster put it at 10000 a month. Lets ask ourselves, how many Nigerians can afford to spend #10,000 a month. Minimum wage #18000 for a man with wife, children and family. Ve seen conductors/'touts' load buses in Nigeria for #20 which pains my heart. Now how many #20's make #300 and times it by the number of people competing to load these buses. The nursing mother who sells pure water, the ones who dont even have any hope of eating. Over 70% unemployed population (u may still doubt this), how do they live? If we had the credit system in Nigeria, do you think there will be this huge inequality of wealth? I think the 80% estimation is even generous. Ve driven around Nigeria and am sensitive when I see poverty. The people are wretchedly poor. Very poor standard of living and they have adapted to this cuz of illiteracy.

Am tired of people screaming west conspiracy whenever they publish facts about us. Nigerians are lazy inefficient and not equipped to carry out research and when others do it for them, they scream conspiracy. Is there no poverty in Nigeria? Is it not widespread? Am not also trying to side with the west but it should be weird and bizzare to them that there is no electricity in a full country, no industries, bad and unmotorable roads etc. Poor standard of living. The poorest oil producing nation. Why dont they post these images about S.A when there are slums in S.A? This 80% stuff is supported

Mr. Globe:

^ lol.
@Ross you clearly missed the point. Ok, the poster put it at 10000 a month. Lets ask ourselves, how many Nigerians can afford to spend #10,000 a month. Minimum wage #18000 for a man with wife, children and family. Ve seen conductors/'touts' load buses in Nigeria for #20 which pains my heart. Now how many #20's make #300 and times it by the number of people competing to load these buses. The nursing mother who sells pure water, the ones who dont even have any hope of eating. Over 70% unemployed population (u may still doubt this), how do they live? If we had the credit system in Nigeria, do you think there will be this huge inequality of wealth? I think the 80% estimation is even generous. Ve driven around Nigeria and am sensitive when I see poverty. The people are wretchedly poor. Very poor standard of living and they have adapted to this cuz of illiteracy.

Bus conductors and agberos are far from the poorest people in Nigeria, and trust me most of them that work hard especially the ones here in Lagos earn more than N20000 monthly. The question is what do they do with their income? They drink, womanize, and faagi. Have you seen the wives of these so-called conductors and bus drivers? You might be surprised to see some of them wearing gold chains.

My point is agberos are def not the poorest people in this country. They feed fat. Their only problem is illiteracy, poverty mentality (which prevents them from tushing up).

And how are 70% of Nigerians unemployed? Am amazed when people say this. Does this mean 70% Nigerians sit down @ home and wait for social checks (we don't have) or that 70% Nigerians depend on others for feeding.

What we have is an underemployment problem amongst the general population. Unemployment is mostly amongst our graduates who can't find jobs, but have you any graduate who left school @ 23 years and is presently 32+years and without a job?

So how many youths are between 23 years and 32 years in Nigeria? Add this figure to the number of almajiris and then ever other person without a job (minus people in the village) and you won't get more than 40million Nigerias.

My calculations are pretty rough and generalized, but they make sense to me.

Can anyone even tell me how these guys arrived @ the 80% figure?

In the developed world, they have job statistics and the rate of unemployment is usually derived from the number of those who make jobless claims versus the number of jobs created in the economy monthly or yearly.

In Nigeria, we don't know how many jobs the Federal Government has created (thru civil service - MDAs), we don't know how many jobs the private sector has created, we don't know the amount of vacant positions.

So how then do these guys come up with the 80%?

Or is it just random sampling? Go to Ajegunle, these guys aren't looking fresh so its 95% poverty for them. Go to Kano, the Almajiris are too much let's give them 99% unemployment?

My problem is when Nigerians sit back to swallow such figures. Am amazed the Federal Govt doesn't do its own calculations cause this is bad brain washing from the whites.

Again, someone please tell me how they got the 80% figure.

Just discovered that we have 90M mobile phones in Nigeria.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of_mobile_phones_in_use

It becomes clear how Nigerians get fed with lies and we just believe and keep quiet. Otherwise how does a person who lives on less than $2/day take care of a phone.

The very fact that in Nigeria we live on cash and not credit means a lot. The whites spend what they don't have and boast about it - that they are richer than us.

But before I digress the fact that we don't spend credit logically means there's less money to spend, we'll live on less funds than our white folks. But does that make 80% of us poor? NO.

Even Nigerian ministers quote the same stats, you are assuming everyone pays house rent or take transport
and also that everyone eat on a pay as you go basis

prior to  the minimum wage to 18,000, what was the minimum wage before?

hmmm pathetic,

@Op

what is the stats from the official bureau of statistics?

I remember Madam Dora challenging one UN official after making a statement regarding maternal mortality, the women meekly responded she was actually quoting the figures from OUR Ministry of Health  

okosodo:

Nigerians are far poorer than this your incorrect indices. We only survive by smartness

my friend,Do you smoke cheap and expired snuff?

@Iolo
always knew this.

CNN(christian porfey) and co dont seem to help matters though. They over sentimentalise our affairs.

we are not rich nor enjoying at all, but we are as well not suffering as they seem to portray it.

Worse still our political class(all them inclusive) make matters worse for us with their mismanagement of resources too.

What are we saying here? I think we are talking about average= sum/no. A system where 20 people earn 100,000mth while the rest makes 500/month will definitely give us a very low avg. you need to travel length and breath of this country to be able to appreciate how poor Nigerians are.
If Nigeria population pyramid is a broad based one, I don't expect the index to be far from the truth.

Yes, Nigerians are really poor. Maybe not 80% but consider this, many are unemployed. That is they don't have a means of getting N1000 a month, how do you think those people survive.

usbcable:

@Iolo
always knew this.

CNN(christian porfey) and co dont seem to help matters though. They over sentimentalise our affairs.

we are not rich nor enjoying at all, but we are as well not suffering as they seem to portray it.

Worse still our political class(all them inclusive) make matters worse for us with their mismanagement of resources too.

So what do Nigerian Reporters do, what figures do they quote? We have nigerian news channels and Nigerian reporters dont we?


WHAT IS THE OFFICIAL NIGERIAN FIGURE---THAT IS THE QUESTION, Whats figures do the proffessors in our university quote, the market researchers, the economist in Nigeria etc what do Nigerians themselves quote?

OP
That is not true at all,yes nigerians are poor but many are not wretched,someone gave an instance with phone,these days sef,even beggars on the streets own phones too.
What the hell is 300 naira(not even enough for my daily airtime).that idea they have is very wrong.

Just because you are privileged enough to earn N10,000 a month, does not mean others are that lucky. There are people in remote towns and villages who depend on fruits for their survival. During yam season they will eat yam morning, afternoon, evening. During Mango season, mango will be in the menu morning, afternoon, evening. The same happens during seasons for maize, pineapple, oranges, water melon, etc.

It is also not just food and housing that a man needs what about health care and sanitation. How many can afford hospital emergencies. Some Nigerians prefer to go to church when they are sick because they can not afford hospital bill. They only remember hospital only when it is very very very very serious.

It is this class of people that we are talking about. Most of us using NL are not in this class and most of our relations may not also be affected, so it is not surprising that some of us are still in denial. However, it is wicked of us to deny the reality, just because we are comfortable. How then are we better than our leaders?

I think to end this debate, this is what we should do.

Calculate the following:

Number of people in Federal Civil Service -
Number of people in States & Local Govt. Civil Service -
Number of people in Military, Police, Civil Defense, EFCC (every other Fed worker that isn't in Ministry) - ~ 1 million people

Number of people working in the private sector (around the country) - ~ 20M (half of lagos population o)

Already I'm sure of 21M people who don't collect anything less than 18000 monthly. Does this mean the Fed Civil and State Civil Service commissions in all the 36 states employ less than 9M people?

20% of 150M = 30M people, which is all I need to disprove that statistic that isn't a fact but a figure being thrown around.


When I say 10000. Please don't consider it as money received month end. Just ask yourself, Do these people spend less than 10000 naira (cumulatively) a month? A person may make 500, 100, 300, 1000, 700 (for example, agberos, market people, bus drivers etc) from Monday to Friday. That person doesn't earn monthly salary but still makes (spends) more than 10k monthly when you add everythin up.

@Op, I already gave you the indices. The index is based on estimates and its correct. I believe it. Don't mistake patriotism for f'oolishness. Mediocrity seem to be the new standard in Nigeria. I asked you, how many people do you think on more than 10K a month in Nigeria? 25% of the 170 million population at best

Yes 'some' Nigerians live on less than $2 dollars daily. But and I mean BUT, majority live on more than $20 daily!

passyjango:

Just because you are privileged enough to earn N10,000 a month, does not mean others are that lucky. There are people in remote towns and villages who depend on fruits for their survival. During yam season they will eat yam morning, afternoon, evening. During Mango season, mango will be in the menu morning, afternoon, evening. The same happens during seasons for maize, pineapple, oranges, water melon, etc.

It is also not just food and housing that a man needs what about health care and sanitation. How many can afford hospital emergencies. Some Nigerians prefer to go to church when they are sick because they can not afford hospital bill. They only remember hospital only when it is very very very very serious.

It is this class of people that we are talking about. Most of us using NL are not in this class and most of our relations may not also be affected, so it is not surprising that some of us are still in denial. However, it is wicked of us to deny the reality, just because we are comfortable. How then are we better than our leaders?

Please, without assuming, what's the remotest, poorest place you've been to?

I use myself as an example. I served in Jigawa (a very poor state), did INEC registration in a community that was 3hours from the LG secretariat. 3hrs on desert land o? No cars can make it thru, but 4x4 pickups, the ancient Toyota hilux and co lik u see on Discovery.


In the village where I worked, millet is the staple food. They eat it Morning, Afternoon, Night (3 square meals o). They also have a saying that if you stopped eating Millet, then you are a lazy farmer (farming community). These guys have No Cell Phone, No cars, about 10 Bikes in a community of 1000+, few of the kids go to school - they are the poorest of the poorest.

But  - Do you mean to tell me that if these guys have to buy the Millet they eat Day and Night, they won't spend more than 300 daily? Then add costs of Firewood, Cooking materials.

And then finally compare: the 80% of Nigerians is - LIVE on less than $2/day and not SPEND less than $2/day. If the statement said spend, I won't be disturbing myself.

Let's not forget that a huge proportion of our population are under the age of 18. With childhood poverty very clear for all to see.

Yes. if Julius Berger is paying N600 for a worker per day, then the family of father, mother and 2 children will leave on less than $2 in a day.

what stops Naija from carrying out its own survey, don't we have researchers in naija?

Mr. Globe:

@Op, I already gave you the indices. The index is based on estimates and its correct. I believe it. Don't mistake patriotism for f'oolishness. Mediocrity seem to be the new standard in Nigeria. I asked you, how many people do you think on more than 10K a month in Nigeria? 25% of the 170 million population at best

Good thing is am not head strong about my position. I just need to see concrete evidence that its truly 80% (120M) that live on less than $2/day. If I can come across a superior argument based on facts, figures, and reliable data, I'll be willing to give up my position.

Ok. Did you read thru my last 2-3 posts? Where I estimated the number of people in civil service (Fed and state), privately employed etc.?

What's your opinion?

Approximately 50% of Nigerians are urban dwellers. At least 24 cities have populations of more than 100,000.

+

0-14 years: 40.9% (male 32,476,681/female 31,064,539)
15-64 years: 55.9% (male 44,296,228/female 42,534,542)
65 years and over: 3.1% (male 2,341,228/female
2,502,355) (2011 est.)

The 40.9% of children in my books are the ones who can reasonably live on less than $2/day - and not all of them do because school fees (remember it's live on, which means cumulative expenditure and not just feeding) is part of the $2/day figure. Include the retired ones (65years and over) less say they can manage to survive with less than $2/day.

It doesn't still add up to 80%.

We have 90M mobile phone lines, and they are mostly owned by those 15years and above (about 60% of the entire pop).

Culled from - en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Nigeria