Naming Names
December 8, 2011

"Their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus; Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some" (2 Timothy 2:17-18).

Many Christians decry the citing of actual names of those Christian leaders who teach heretical doctrines, saying that such an act is "unloving." Paul, however, considered it an important evidence of true love to warn against those who would "overthrow the faith of some," realising that generalities would be useless.

Not only did Hymenaeus and Philetus make Paul's list, but so did Demas (2 Timothy 4:10), Alexander the coppersmith (2 Timothy 4:14), the Cretians (Titus 1:12), another Alexander (1 Timothy 1:20), and even Peter (Galatians 2:11-14) when he began to teach legalism. Likewise, the apostle John warned against Diotrephes (3 John 9) and the Nicolaitans (Revelation 2:6).

On the other hand, Paul was much more generous with name recognition when he was giving out commendations (e.g., Romans 16:1-15; Colossians 4:7-17). We undoubtedly need to follow his example in appreciating by name those who are faithful in teaching and living the truth.

Likewise, we need to be ready and willing to name those individuals, churches, schools, and other organizations that are denying biblical inerrant authority, compromising the doctrine of special creation, requiring humanistic works for salvation, or bringing in other heretical doctrines. We obviously need to be sure of our facts when we do this and also to bring such charges only if motivated by genuine concern for those apt to be led astray if we don't speak out. But then we must, indeed, "mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them" (Romans 16:17). HMM

For more . . . .

You haven't named any names. Practise what you preach. Or is it that you know your name should be the first on the list?

italo:

You haven't named any names. Practise what you preach. Or is it that you know your name should be the first on the list?

Wait for it! It is only those who read and hear what I preach and do that can make the righteous judgment whether I should be on that list, but they must come with their facts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axxlXy6bLH0&feature=player_embedded

Let the body of Christ pray for Robert Schuller, Billy Graham and many others who are confused as to what the biblical gospel is. Pray that God will open their eyes to the truth before it is too late!

Is it possible that you aren't really a Christian? Examine yourselves whether you are still in the faith.

you want names? kunle is a name that readily comes in.

OLAADEGBU:

Many Christians decry the citing of actual names of those Christian leaders who teach heretical doctrines, saying that such an act is "unloving."

I don't know if OLAADEGBU is making reference to my posts here .I want you to get me clearly. Im not against judging doctrines  by the word of God or condenning false doctrines and wrong doing.  But condemning a wrong act or utterance or teaching  is different from condemning a person or not to talk of a minister of God. No man is perfect . No church doctrine is perfect to a great extent When you say so and so is a FALSE prophet or pastor etc . Because he teaches something  contrary to your  church . He may be right and he may be wrong. It is a big thing and it is not right. Let us assume they made a wrong statement , will you condemn the entire work of a mans ministry just because of one thing . We can condemn an action or doctrine  but not a man.

^
Dem neva call your name for this thread. . .abi you dey report yourself?

One moment Joagbaje,

We Catholics believe the doctrine of the Church is perfect.

Spare us the benefit of the doubt.

^^^^
Doctrines evolves according to revelation of truth. The early church had doctrinal issues to deal with.There are greater truths and lesser truths. Most doctrines are based on certain truths, but it may not be perfect truth. Especially if a greater truth has overriden it. It becomes outdated because its based on a lesser truth and by that it becomes false doctrine even though it once was true.

There are false doctrines also and doctrines of devils. Which are perversion and lies.

I agree with OP , for the simple reason that to refuse to identify the wolves means that we are aiding and abetting their deception , especially when lives are involved and the eternal destiny of such.

While I agree that there are those who are not fully aware of their falsehoods, there are also those who are conmen, outright charlatans, and knowingly so.

To the former we humbly point out their errors, but to the later we rebuke and expose.

@Joagbaje, sorry to dissappoint you. Catholic doctrine doesn't change - has never changed. Not one doctrine, in all 2011 years or existence. Sorry.

^^^
@italo
Does that mean that the catholic doctrine of 'sale of indulgence' is still in force? That is apart from the fact that they introduced the fraudulent doctrine of tithes into christianity in 586 AD which they later conceded was not mandatory for christians.

The Catholic Church has been , is and ever will be, the greatest threat to Christianity, we have to give them this recognition.

Brilliant thread, my only problem is the hypocrisy being exhibited by the OP cause he is also notorious for teaching and spreading false man made doctrines that fit his biases on this forum.

@Pastor Kun,

The doctrines of 'sale of indulgence' and 'tithes' have never existed in the Catholic church. They only exist in your head.

I suggest you first find out what a Catholic doctrine means. You can't say any meaningful thing on it until you know exactly what it is.

If after finding out, you still think you know even ONE catholic doctrine that has ever changed, please provide credible proof.

Show us evidence of where the doctrine has ever been in the catechism of the Catholic church or any relevant doctrinal document and show us evidence that it has changed.

5solas:

The Catholic Church has been , is and ever will be, the greatest threat to Christianity, we have to give them this recognition.

Good! So you know the Catholic Church will ever be - never cease to be. That says a lot. It was Jesus that gave that assurance: "on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades[c] will not overcome it." "And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age"

OLAADEGBU:

[flash=500,400]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axxlXy6bLH0?fs=1&hl=en_GB[/flash]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axxlXy6bLH0&feature=player_embedded

Let the body of Christ pray for Robert Schuller, Billy Graham and many others who are confused as to what the biblical gospel is.  Pray that God will open their eyes to the truth before it is too late!

Is it possible that you aren't really a Christian?  Examine yourselves whether you are still in the faith.

Thanks for the above. I have had my own reservation about Graham since I read some parts of this book,''The Legacy of Billy Graham the liar'' on this site, http://www.sovereignpotter.com/The_Legacy_Of_Billy_Graham_Index.html. Amongst his sins are:

1.Billy Graham Insists That Modernists Be Included on Crusade Committees

2. Billy Graham Also Includes Catholics and Jews on His Crusade Committees and

3.Converts Are Sent Back to Liberal Protestant and Catholic Churches as Well as the Jewish Synagogue.

Quite obviously he is seduced by works.

5solas:

The Catholic Church has been , is and ever will be, the greatest threat to Christianity, we have to give them this recognition.

italo:

Good! So you know the Catholic Church will ever be - never cease to be. That says a lot. It was Jesus that gave that assurance: "on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades[c] will not overcome it." "And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age"

Good? That the Catholic Church will always be[b] anti-Christ?[/b] 

So you consider the anti-Christ to be a "threat" to the Church? It just shows that whatever 'church' you belong to is not the same one Jesus was talking about when he said "on this rock I'll build my church and the gate of hades will not overcome it".

Besides what makes you say the Catholic Church is the anti-Christ? Is that what is written in the Bible? I thought you believed in 'sola scriptura'.

italo:

So you consider the anti-Christ to be a "threat" to the Church? It just shows that whatever 'church' you belong to is not the same one Jesus was talking about when he said "on this rock I'll build my church and the gate of hades will not overcome it".

Besides what makes you say the Catholic Church is[b] the anti-Christ?[/b] Is that what is written in the Bible? I thought you believed in 'sola scriptura'.

I said the Catholic Church is anti-Christ , not[b] the anti-Christ[/b]. I will not be surprised though if it is the anti-Christ or out of it comes the anti-Christ.

I am surprised you are not so touchy about your spiritual family today.What's the secret?.

5solas:

Thanks for the above. I have had my own reservation about Graham since I read some parts of this book,''The Legacy of Billy Graham the liar'' on this site, http://www.sovereignpotter.com/The_Legacy_Of_Billy_Graham_Index.html. Amongst his sins are:

1.Billy Graham Insists That Modernists Be Included on Crusade Committees

2. Billy Graham Also Includes Catholics and Jews on His Crusade Committees and

3.Converts Are Sent Back to Liberal Protestant and Catholic Churches as Well as the Jewish Synagogue.



Quite obviously he is seduced by works.

Exactly, his declearation in this video shows how confussed he really is.
But, If he can deny Jesus openly, of what point does it makes to pray for him? Just wondering!

Miles Munroe
Eddie Long
Jimmy Swaggart
Creflo Dollar
Tye Tribbet
Joel Osteen

5solas:

I said the Catholic Church is anti-Christ , not[b] the anti-Christ[/b]. I will not be surprised though if it is the anti-Christ or out of it comes the anti-Christ.

I am surprised you are not so touchy about your spiritual family today.What's the secret?.

Whether 'anti-Christ' or 'the anti-Christ', the fact that you consider it a threat says a lot about whatever 'church' you belong to. You know its not built on rocky ground but on sinking sand.

Why I'm not touchy? You don't always give adversaries what they expect.

Sometimes you aggressively chase away a mad man. Other times, you just let him do what he knows best: display his madness and fade away.

And you haven't showed me where scripture says the Catholic Church is anti-Christ, Mr sola scriptura.

Billy graham may be right and he may be wrong. Why don't we have the full video to see his explanation. Some people will definitely get to heaven without being Christians so long as they walk by the light they had especially if they never had opportunity to hear the gospel ,as long as their heart feel after God and they walk with a pure conscience .

This however is different from a man who outrightly rejects Christ after hearing this gospel. For such ,they are condemned already .

John 3:18
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

What about our home based mega pastors flying in jets?

Image123:

you want names? kunle is a name that readily comes in.

He comes in different forms of ID's. If not KunleOshob, or Jagoon, he will come as Pastor Kun (God have mercy on his faithfuls). Who knows how many other ID's he uses?

Joagbaje:

I don't know if OLAADEGBU is making reference to my posts here .I want you to get me clearly. Im not against judging doctrines by the word of God or condenning false doctrines and wrong doing. But condemning a wrong act or utterance or teaching is different from condemning a person or not to talk of a minister of God. No man is perfect . No church doctrine is perfect to a great extent When you say so and so is a FALSE prophet or pastor etc . Because he teaches something contrary to your church . He may be right and he may be wrong. It is a big thing and it is not right. Let us assume they made a wrong statement , will you condemn the entire work of a mans ministry just because of one thing . We can condemn an action or doctrine but not a man.

Your post reminds me of the proverbial "Elefo aatan." It is good that you are reporting yourself before I do. Only God knows how many folks faith have been overthrown by your doctrines and may the Lord reward you for your works. I hope you can say Amen to that.

aletheia:

^
Dem neva call your name for this thread. . .abi you dey report yourself?

I wonder why he had to report himself, could it be that his conscience is pricking him?

italo:

One moment Joagbaje,

We Catholics believe the doctrine of the Church is perfect.

Spare us the benefit of the doubt.

Do you mean your dogmas and traditions?

Joagbaje:

^^^^
Doctrines evolves according to revelation of truth. The early church had doctrinal issues to deal with.There are greater truths and lesser truths. Most doctrines are based on certain truths, but it may not be perfect truth. Especially if a greater truth has overriden it. It becomes outdated because its based on a lesser truth and by that it becomes false doctrine even though it once was true.

There are false doctrines also and doctrines of devils. Which are perversion and lies.

Can you tell us what doctrines evolved according to the revelation of truth? and are they still evolving? Whatever doctrinal issue that the early church had was sorted and left for us to teach and practice. What do you mean by greater truths and lesser truths? Truth is not a concept it is a Person. He was concealed in the OT and revealed in the NT.

5solas:

The Catholic Church has been , is and ever will be, the greatest threat to Christianity, we have to give them this recognition.

For them to give birth to Islam, Nazism and Communism deserves a Nobel peace award and to think that they are now trying to gather all religions in the ecumenical meetings says so much about them.

Pastor Kun:

Brilliant thread, my only problem is the hypocrisy being exhibited by the OP cause he is also notorious for teaching and spreading false man made doctrines that fit his biases on this forum.

You new that you will be exposed as one of the false teachers that now wishes to be known as Pastor Kun. Your case is also like that of the proverbial thief who quickly accuses the owner of the farm before someone accuses him of stealing. "ai tete mole ole mu oloko"

You call yourself a Pastor and you don't believe in Jesus is God, you don't believe that the Scriptures are inerrant and infallible, you don't even know what it means to be born again, you don't believe Christians should be going to an organised church, that you can be given to wine and filthy lucre. It is a pity that many fine Christians have eaten of your leaven and it has leavened the whole lump.