johnydon22:
Ok guys please nobody should derail this sweet thread with emotional straw mans and insults please.

Let's keep in interesting and educating!!! HardMirrow, urahara no more insults no matter how pissed off you get please bosses.

In a way that scepticism is applied in the issue of public concern like religion there is a always an unsaid tendency to belittle and condescend and ignore the facts that deluded or not supporters of superstitions and pseudoscience are humans with feelings too who like all are also trying to figure out how the world works and what our role in it might be.

Their motives and ideas sometimes are consonants with science and realities but since these cultures has not provided them everything they need, let us therefore tamper scepticism with kind words.

None of us comes fully equipped.

If we take this condescending part, it will never turn out well.

Ok . uncle johnny

urahara:


Nigerians are more inclined to read books like possessing your possession. God of overnight mirqcle. And prayerpoints against witchcraft

I am considering writing one of those soon ... lol..

HardMirror:

I am a published writer and I did not publish or market my book in Nigeria. So will cross that huddle when I get there. Make nigerians no kill my career.

Hahahahaha eheee better!!!

urahara:

U STRONG MAN , SITTING ON MY FINANCES. ROAST BY FIRE !!!!!!

Kikikikiki I laughed so hard, tears streaming down my eyes

freecocoa:
Devil that he was supposed to be quarrelling with o, btw.

How can you chase someone out of your kingdom for insubordination, yet entertain that person's request to try and shame you?

Very serious tales by the moonlight

JustCurious:
Guard your heart with ALL diligence.
Guard your heart with ALL diligence.
Let him that thinks he stands, take heed lest he falls

#These scripture verses keep popping up on my mind.

I am reading this thread, no more.

Signs out of here!!

Change your moniker. It doesn't suit you.

johnydon22:


Not really sir i think you are the one assuming i am on self defence thereby going on self defence.

I am sure my question was very simple..

Why do you think a creator of universal causality should only be 1 and not a whole race of such beings just like humans are creators but we are 7billion not 1 ?

I hope you reply

OK I got that.

We humans are the measure of the universe, get it.

I believe your premise is from the look of things as with "human race".

If the creator is of the same descriptions as humans, as regards to race, then he is the godfather of gods.

As long as you ascribe to "race", then your present argument favors one or more race for gods.

If human beings is a race, god being are also god race, their number increases like our numbers.

This makes gods extraterrestrial intelligences that exist in the space,

a different species of "man kind" (intelligent life) in other planet(s).

I'm trying to map your concept of gods to establish a framework of discourse.

Davidovinci:
I'm not religious but one thing i know for certain is that "GOD IS REAL"

Deny him at ur own perile(Mathew 10:33)


Y'all should know Salvation is a personal thing.....


No time to debate,argue or even quarrel. Believe what you want, but "On that day" We go know how far!...

If you've read the book of revelations and you still have no idea what's happening to this world (plus OP's post)....OYO!

I'M A CHRISTIAN AND I'M PROUD!

Peace-out!

Stay repping Bro. Christ in my chest like the S sign.
To my fellow Christians on here, i'd advice you un follow the thread or even stop commenting/arguing. It's needless. Because Everything the OP is doing on here is plugged. You don't need to raise the roof to convince nobody. Why?
"Do not speak to fools the scorn the words of your wisdom"

absoluteSuccess:


OK I got that.
We humans are the measure of the universe, get it.
I believe your premise is from the look of things as with "human race".

If the creator is of the same descriptions as humans, as regards to race, then he is the godfather of gods.

As long as you ascribe to "race", then your present argument favors one or more race for gods.
If human beings is a race, god being are also god race, their number increases like our numbers.
This makes gods extraterrestrial intelligences that exist in the space,

a different species of "man kind" (intelligent life) in other planet(s).
I'm trying to map your concept of gods to establish a framework of discourse.

Let me just simplify the premise for you.

Since you think there can exist 1 creator to cause the universe, since there can be such a being and not nothing at all since the odd rests on a 50/50 chance.

Then how are you to think that if there can be 1 of such there cannot be 100,000,000 of them all as uncaused as the one you assumed for the universe and all unanimous in the causality of the universe.

Do you think 1 makes less of an assumption than 1000? if there can be 1 then there can be 10000000 of them..

Lolz c them frustrated atheists calling me chidish, illiterate, daft, etc. All it'll take God is just a flip of his thumbs and you guys'll seize to exist, then maybe ur spirit man'll get to see all the answers you seek, but the worst part of it is, you'll regret your decisions for eternity. Choice has been given 2 everybody, use it wisely

johnydon22:


Let me just simplify the premise for you.

Since you think there can exist 1 creator to cause the universe, since there can be such a being and not nothing at all since the odd rests on a 50/50 chance.

Then how are you to think that if there can be 1 of such there cannot be 100,000,000 of them all as uncaused as the one you assumed for the universe and all unanimous in the causality of the universe.

Do you think 1 makes less of an assumption than 1000? if there can be 1 then there can be 10000000 of them..

what percentage of info on the universe do you think mankind have?

zzzzy:
what percentage of info on the universe do you think mankind have?

what has that got to do with my question or what i am discussing exactly?

johnydon22:


what has that got to do with my question or what i am discussing exactly?

just wanted to mention you. That was the closest post.

HardMirror:
Am I implying that Insincerity, selfishness and ignorance is what is keeping Christians as christians.
The answer is a BIG YES!
The moment I began asking god the questions such as the one in my last post, that very moment I began to discover the falsehood of christianity.
If you are sincere and truely concerned about your fellow man, you realize god is more wicked, stupid and incapable than the presumed devil.

This was the genesis of my transition to agnosticism. It is very difficult to be a humanist and still remain a christian.

I remember when I was in the university, I was very passionate about helping people. In the course of denying myself of many stuffs while helping people, I lost my laptop. My laptop was stolen because I took a 5 mins nap. I was so tired because I sacrificed my entire day to help some students know a difficult topic better.

After my laptop was stolen, it was as of my life wanted to crumble. I had so many stuffs in there. My final year project was in there. 98% of my life's work was in there. I was devastated. I became furious, and rage was burning in me. I wanted revenge and I was ready to sell my soul to anything just to have my revenge.

I have always heard from friends that Ilara mokin is notorious for voodoo. I went there and met with all manners of people who were d
ready to help me take the soul of the culprit. I later met with an old man and he gave me substance that I should wake up in the midnight and recite some stuffs that within three days I'd see the blood of that person. That was where I started becoming uncomfortable. I didn't see myself taking the life of another. I couldn't stomach it. I'm the kind of person that I will never hurt a fly. The humanist side of me overwhelmed me and I told the baba that I can't . That I do not want anything to happen to the person again. I paid him and left. It was a very painful experience.

My point is - if a mere mortal like me cannot stomach the thought of hurting someone or taking someone else's life, how much a 'loving father' that has been painted as the most loving and the best thing that has ever happen to mankind. How could such a person now chose to roast people in hell for not believing in him and for a meagre offence. This is the height of barbarism. How could a person be so blood thirsty.
And it's not as if he will burn them for a short time. He will burn them forever. Haba! Even if I make even, I'll never be comfortable that some people are actually burning. God and I will have to slug it out

zzzzy:
just wanted to mention you. That was the closest post.

Alright you just and i know we do know up to 5% of what is to know about this vast deep and weird cosmos..

Anything else sir?

johnydon22:


Alright you just and i know we do know up to 5% of what is to know about this vast deep and weird cosmos..

Anything else sir?

what percentage do you know yourself?

Pyrrho:
Change your moniker. It doesn't suit you.

hahaha. I thought of that too (my moniker). Well, curiosity brought me here!
But, I'm not curious anymore.
I could see the end of this thread from the beginning, Moreso, I must obey my 'inner being' which says, FLEE. Basically, not all knowledge are helpful. :p

zzzzy:
what percentage do you know yourself?

If you have anything to say just go right ahead and bring it out cus i am sure there is no known statistic to what i personally know about the cosmos.

Let me hope this won't be another appeal to ignorance argument.

JustCurious:
hahaha. I thought of that too (my moniker). Well, curiosity brought me here!
But, I'm not curious anymore.
I could see the end of this thread from the beginning, Moreso, I must obey my 'inner being' which says, FLEE. Basically, not all knowledge are helpful. :p

No qualms. But I'm sure you'll come around if you considered yourself "curious" when you chose that moniker for yourself.

johnydon22:


If you have anything to say just go right ahead and bring it out cus i am sure there is no known statistic to what i personally know about the cosmos.

Let me hope t[b]his won't be another appeal to ignorance argumen[/b]t.

It ll go like this

........................... Johnny since u have admitted u dont know everything about the universe , doesnt that prove that there is a jewish god who hates gays and loves the smell of meat.

Hahahaha funny thread! Your opinion tho....God is so real, He exists and answers prayers!!!!!!

God has done so much for me, made the impossible possible and He has really proven Himself in my life so many times....in fact everyday!!!! I'd be a fool to think He doesn't exists.


I loooooove You soooooooo much Baba God! Keep doing Your Great works!!!!

urahara:


It ll go like this

........................... Johnny since u have admitted u dont know everything about the universe , doesnt that prove that there is a jewish god who hates gays and loves the smell of meat.

I am used to that argument "if you don't know this then God did it" that is a sad appeal to ignorance using "God" not as an answer but as a placeholder for ignorance.

Once that problem is solved God shatters from the equation and moves on to the next curtain of ignorance.

I have always told them: Gods may exist or not, we do not know but they are not needed to explain the cosmos or other random natural manifeststions

If you cannot find some other places to place your God(s) except behind the curtain of scientific ignorance then just as history as proven "God" will always remain an ever receding factor in the face of scientific breakthrough.

Once upon a time humanity thought hurricanes was because God(neptune) was pissed off, we now know the cause of hurricanes and God (neptune) has been canceled from that equation.

the appeal to ignorance and employment of God of the gap argument never works brother

swaggzo:





MY MAN CATHOLICS SAY THEIR SUPREME MASTER THE POPE, IS WITHOUT SIN. EVERYTHING HE SAYS IS PERFECT BECAUSE GOD CHOSE HIM TO BE POPE.



TILL DATE I WONDER WHY THE LAST ONE RESIGNED.. . GOD CHOSE THE WRONG PERSON? ?


THAT MEANS EVEN GOD CAN MAKE MISTAKES?


THAT MEANS HE'S ALSO NOT PERFECT AND CAN END UP LIKE OTHER INPERFECT PEOPLE, IN HELL?

Perhaps!

At least, he created it, he shld also have a taste of his own medicine

Alokendra:

This was the genesis of my transition to agnosticism. It is very difficult to be a humanist and still remain a christian.

I remember when I was in the university, I was very passionate about helping people. In the course of denying myself of many stuffs while helping people, I lost my laptop. My laptop was stolen because I took a 5 mins nap. I was so tired because I sacrificed my entire day to help some students know a difficult topic better.

After my laptop was stolen, it was as of my life wanted to crumble. I had so many stuffs in there. My final year project was in there. 98% of my life's work was in there. I was devastated. I became furious, and rage was burning in me. I wanted revenge and I was ready to sell my soul to anything just to have my revenge.

I have always heard from friends that Ilara mokin is notorious for voodoo. I went there and met with all manners of people who were d
ready to help me take the soul of the culprit. I later met with an old man and he gave me substance that I should wake up in the midnight and recite some stuffs that within three days I'd see the blood of that person. That was where I started becoming uncomfortable. I didn't see myself taking the life of another. I couldn't stomach it. I'm the kind of person that I will never hurt a fly. The humanist side of me overwhelmed me and I told the baba that I can't . That I do not want anything to happen to the person again. I paid him and left. It was a very painful experience.

My point is - if a mere mortal like me cannot stomach the thought of hurting someone or taking someone else's life, how much a 'loving father' that has been painted as the most loving and the best thing that has ever happen to mankind. How could such a person now chose to roast people in hell for not believing in him and for a meagre offence. This is the height of barbarism. How could a person be so blood thirsty.
And it's not as if he will burn them for a short time. He will burn them forever. Haba! Even if I make even, I'll never be comfortable that some people are actually burning. God and I will have to slug it out

As in...
The irony of it

There so many "door-holes" through the walls of religious-teachings that combines, or sparks a man's consciousness to the idea atheism.

For the muslims... The biography of Mohammed is good enough. (Hadith and Quran)

For the Christians...
*star from Adam and Eve
*Cain and Abel
*Metuselah
*Noah and his Ark...
*Pharoah...
*The entire journey of Israelites...
*Sodom and Gomorah...
*King Ahab
*David
*Uzah
*Joshua and the "standing sun"...
*Satan and God
*The compilation of the Bible
*Other religious beliefs, Zeus, Dyaus, Odin,

If you aren't curious enough you can't find the loopholes. If you deceive yourself at that, no objectivity.

johnydon22:


If you have anything to say just go right ahead and bring it out cus i am sure there is no known statistic to what i personally know about the cosmos.

Let me hope this won't be another appeal to ignorance argument.

what I'm trying to say is that we do not have enough information to rule out the existence of God. We haven't even found out enough information about oyr own earth. Recently, i read an article about blackholes eating stars more than physics would allow. I actually took that as how we think physics will allow. We are lacking much info

johnydon22:


I am used to that argument "if you don't know this then God did it" that is a sad appeal to ignorance using "God" not as an answer but as a placeholder for ignorance.

Once that problem is solved God shatters from the equation and moves on to the next curtain of ignorance.

I have always told them: Gods may exist or not, we do not know but they are not needed to explain the cosmos or other random natural manifeststions

If you cannot find some other places to place your God(s) except behind the curtain of scientific ignorance then just as history as proven "God" will always remain an ever receding factor in the face of scientific breakthrough.

Once upon a time humanity thought hurricanes was because God(neptune) was pissed off, we now know the cause of hurricanes and God (neptune) has been canceled from that equation.

the appeal to ignorance and employment of God of the gap argument never works brother

#the gaps are getting smaller everyday

BecaciaBarbie:
Hahahaha funny thread! Your opinion tho....God is so real, He exists and answers prayers!!!!!!

God has done so much for me, made the impossible possible and He has really proven Himself in my life so many times....in fact everyday!!!! I'd be a fool to think He doesn't exists.


I loooooove You soooooooo much Baba God! Keep doing Your Great works!!!!

If god is so real, you wouldnt have to tell us

zzzzy:
what I'm trying to say is that we do not have enough information to rule out the existence of God. We haven't even found out enough information about oyr own earth. Recently, i read an article about blackholes eating stars more than physics would allow. I actually took that as how we think physics will allow. We are lacking much info

Exactly! Neither is our lack of information necessary to invoke a God in the equation...

That we don't know doesn't mean a deity did it, it simply means We don't know

So let us be sincere and accept we don't know than invoke primitive superstitions to fill a gap left by ignorance going exactly the same road the ancient men went.

we are far better than that..

We are lacking much info yes it is true and this calls for more study, observation and scrutiny.

not an avenue to simply assume up a god and fill the gap marring our ability to probe and know what actually happened.

Like i told urahara above

Gods may exist or not, we do not know but they are not needed to explain the cosmos or other random natural manifestations.

If you cannot find some other places to place your God(s) except behind the
curtain of scientific ignorance then just as history has proven "God" will always
remain an ever receding factor in the face of scientific breakthrough.

Once upon a time humanity thought hurricanes was because God(neptune) was
pissed off, we now know the cause of hurricanes and God (neptune) has been
canceled from that equation.

Lack of information is a call for study not for assumption!!!

urahara:


If god is so real, you wouldnt have to tell us

Only a man made God need man to make itself known to man. . . . All religions boast of the WORD OF GOD(s) but always notice that humans are the ones doing the talking and the writings for it.

zzzzy:
what I'm trying to say is that we do not have enough information to rule out the existence of God. We haven't even found out enough information about oyr own earth. Recently, i read an article about blackholes eating stars more than physics would allow. I actually took that as how we think physics will allow. We are lacking much info

Nobody is ruling out the existence of god thatz the point in being an agnostic atheist.

Science in a short span of time as done a lot in find in out about the world around us and the universe. We are lacking info is we are lacking info which work is done to discover presently.

The god of the gaps argument is a very weak argument for every thing which has been attributed to a god (lightening, earthquakes and hurricanes , etc) is now been attributed to nature .

rawgame:
The blind man was not healed because your faith was smaller than the mustard seed. Instead of growing your faith you drew back. Heb. 10:38'now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him'

Have you ever seen a mustard seed?! Do yu knw how small it is?!

Guess not!

So far yu believe yu can pray for someone to get healed, yu already have a faith thousands times bigger than mustard seed. What hapns next in yur mind doesn't matter