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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind (3723 Views)
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Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 1:01pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
asalimpo: You are splitting hairs. When the OP says nothing he is referring to the rather common objections to porn, not to an absolute standard that completely absolves it of any fault. I will grant you that he is assuming that everyone recognises what he is referring to, an assumption that is rather the norm in our day to day communications. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 1:13pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
IAmSabrina: It looks that way. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by TruthinAction: 1:23pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
LordReed: Language develops over years. There are words we use today that were not in existence years back. So you don't have to see the word porn to know that the Bible condemns it. If you are aware of a crime and you don't report it, you can be punishes just like the person who committed the crime. If the Bible condemns fornication, then it condemns porn. Most of those involved in it are committing fornication and you taking delight in watching it is equally guilty. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 2:17pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
TruthinAction: This is exactly what I am saying. You can use it to justify any position or condemn another. The bible itself has some pretty gory stuff in it so does that mean you are guilty of delighting in it? 1 Like |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by TruthinAction: 2:35pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
LordReed: Go ahead if you want to. I doubt it if you are born again. Otherwise you won't talk this way about porn that even ungodly people condemn. Make sure you introduce your children into it also. Also permit your children to watch you when making love with your wife or partner. If you are not married yet, permit your younger ones to watch while you have sex with your partner. Also film yourself making love and post on Instagram. Don't be selfish. If you watch others, permit others to watch you also. Also make love in public places. The Bible also never condemned it. At least Adam was naked and not ashamed at the beginning of creation. I am sure you are happy now. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by asalimpo(m): 4:35pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
LordReed:i am not splitting hairs just being a little more rigorous on the approach to this issue. Without d rigor,a wily questioner will easily take you into many gray areas and lose in dank dark alleys because of the ambiguity inherent in the assumptions of the moral STANDARD. E.G When he says there is nothing wrong-he implies a non-religious standard, because by religious standards such claims fail right out of the door. But by non-religious standards, it's hit or miss. Many hav responded,shooting from the religious observatory-they're quoting bible verses. But they are already wrong nd wasting their typing time because that's not the assumed standards the op is employing. If he's using the formal legal standards. It's ok. If he's using semi-amorphous loosely defined informal non-religious humanistic standards,it's hit nd miss. The secular humanistic standard can b back-handed as hypocritical inherited legacy baggage of tradition. People are bubbling with lust yet pretending it doesnt exist.Why not "express" yourself? |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 5:04pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
TruthinAction: I am an atheist who is an ex-christian. Yes I am happy because at least you've admitted that nudity is the default state of man. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 5:08pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
asalimpo: Look its fine to split hairs sometimes, it makes people realise there is a nuance to life that black or white pronouncements do not capture. I just wanted to chime in with my own hair splitting. LoL. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by TruthinAction: 6:39pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
LordReed: Ok. I am sure you can sleep with your mother also for the world to watch. Make your sister your sex partner and see nothing wrong with it. Unless you repent, you will not escape the damnation of Hell. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by asalimpo(m): 6:46pm On Mar 18, 2019 |
LordReed:itz alright. Philosophers do it for a living us we earn nothing other than increase nairaland's page counts. 1 Like |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 5:57am On Mar 19, 2019 |
TruthinAction: Abeg go and rest and stop displaying your stupidity to the world. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by TruthinAction: 7:22am On Mar 19, 2019 |
LordReed: Time will tell who is the real stupid person. When you land in the pit of hell, you will realize how stupid you were. 1 Like |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 8:11am On Mar 19, 2019 |
TruthinAction: Hell will be living with dunces like you for an eternity. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by Ihedinobi3: 11:20am On Mar 19, 2019 |
LordReed:How exactly would the Bible talk about pornography in modern terms given the times and cultures it was written in? The question would be: is there some way that the Bible addressed the nature of pornography in those times? The answer is yes. Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body. 1 Corinthians 6:18 NIV Porneia is the Greek word that is translated "sexual immorality" in this passage and anywhere else in the New Testament. Another word used to translate it is "fornication". The former is a better translation because "porneia" is a larger word than fornication. It was a catch-all for every type of sexual impropriety. It included adultery, for example. As it is, "pornography" as a word has its roots in "porneia" and "porne", both Ancient Greek words with the latter referring to prostitutes. So, the very practice that it connotes is at least very close to what 1 Corinthians 6:18 talks about. In fact, it is a no-brainer that "pornography" is part of "porneia". Every sexual behavior or action or thought that is not occurring within the context of marriage is sexual immorality. Within marriage, all sexual activity between a couple to please each other is proper and sanctified (Hebrews 13:4; 1 Corinthians 7:3-5). Outside of marriage, no sexual activity at all is proper. Thus, pornography is a sin. Now, even a baby Christian knows this. Also, Christians are more troubled by their own strong temptations to disregard the Bible in this than uncomfortable with sex as a thing in itself. In other words, rather than making the Bible say something to justify their discomfort with sex, it is far more to be expected that Christians would try to use it to justify sexual misbehavior. So, you really have things upside down in that regard. Finally, why on earth it is any business of yours what the Bible says about it given your dismissal of it is weird, to say the least. The only way I see to explain it is that you wish to use Christians to justify your own misbehavior. Is it not enough that you reject the Bible? Since you do, whether it does or does not condemn pornography should be immaterial to you. As it is, it clearly condemns it. The answer I gave is short. That is because the entire thread is in itself a travesty. A Christian who is deceived by this thread is one who wants to be deceived by it, because even ordinary human conscience tells anyone willing to listen that sexual activity not restricted to a married couple is wrong. The Bible only reiterates this. If it was actually needed - and it isn't - a longer, more comprehensive answer with references to several parts of the Bible could still be made. But if that is necessary at any point, it would probably be a worthless exercise. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 11:57am On Mar 19, 2019 |
Ihedinobi3: Wrong. Human instinct is driven to procreate, society however teaches us not partake in sexual activity outside of marriage. Your holy book only attempts to reinforce social mores, it does not validate of any sort of conscience or instinct. As for whether the bible mentions porn specifically one can approach the matter in a variety of ways. Is the god not capable of knowing what is to come in future? Why is it incapable of mentioning specific actions it knows in the future will be detrimental if that it is the way it views it? Yes, indeed it is immaterial if the bible condemns it or not because it is the encapsulation of the social mores of a certain group of people so it has no authority to dictate to any person who doesn't want to follow its dictates. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by Ihedinobi3: 12:15pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
LordReed:In so far as we speak of instinct, then as much as we have an instinct to procreate, we also have an instinct to do so in orderly fashion, that is, in clearly delineated families. Social mores, after all, did not happen out of nothing, as you seem to think. As for porn, your argument, just like the first one, is very ignorant. God was speaking as much to the people of the times in which the Bible was written as to us living today. Your fantasies about the Bible are well known to me and completely unfounded as always. Clearly, you have a problem ignoring what the Bible says in spite of your claims. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 1:22pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
Ihedinobi3: Social mores arise from a need to protect either individuals or societal structure. They are very separate from our instincts even though they can arise from our instincts. Yes because men like you are telling us what the god says. It is your holy book that is a fantasy, I am merely reporting the fact of it. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by TV01(m): 1:29pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
This is garbled - and in so many ways LordReed:The heathen continuously insists on degrading humans to the level of brute beasts. Humans are not driven by instinct... LordReed:...which is what enables us to develop and maintain sophisticated and complex societies. Of which one requirement is to moderate the sexual urge. And, if possible channel it into something that benefits said society - hence marriage! LordReed:No, the bible instructs and, is a source of objective morality regardless of and without recourse to what society deems acceptable. There are numerous social mores that contravene, contradict or at best, only mimic biblical direction. LordReed:So why choose a way that is at best bloody-minded and at worst nonsensical. The bible outlines a clear sexual ethic, the lens of through which pornography is clearly haram. LordReed:More heathenish raging. It's immaterial if you choose to disbelieve and disobey the bible. To those that do not it is essential. Further, contravention of biblical morality always has an outworking - which is clearly evident. Attempting to sanitise perversity by creating an imagined scenario - faulty in itself - which presents it as "harmless", is not evidence of anything but the depths to which human degeneracy can sink. I may well owe those brute beasts an apology. As dumb as they are, I cannot imagine them indulging in or arguing for an instinctive desire for porn consumption . Saint TV |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 2:08pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
TV01: When did I don't agree turn to garbled?
Humans are driven by instinct, we have only become more sophisticated because of higher capacity for cogitation. You cannot deny the nature of what you are, if you like call me heathen for telling the bare-faced facts. ...which is what enables us to develop and maintain sophisticated and complex societies. Of which one requirement is to moderate the sexual urge. And, if possible channel it into something that benefits said society - hence marriage! Civilisation has nothing to do with your bible, it develops inspite of.
Let me assume you mean it espouses an absolute morality because objective morality has a different usage where I am coming from. Even the so called absolute morality is broken over and over again in the very same bible, either by the god itself or the agents it "accredits".
For which you have to interpret and declare to us the word of the god, yes we know.
More religious gibberish. Who cares what the bible says? Its dictates are worthless to those who do not follow it no matter how hard you calll us heathens.
Again who gives a flying Bleep what your bible says?
You should. They don't have delusions of self righteousness. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by Ihedinobi3: 2:50pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
LordReed:Where does that need come from? Where does the societal structure come from? Your second paragraph is not clear. What does it have to do with anything? You are hardly reporting anything but your own fevered dreams, LordReed. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 5:21pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
Ihedinobi3: From men. It is the trust of my first post. You are interpreting to us what the god says, like its always been done. LMFAO! I am not the one who believes the universe was flooded. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by Ihedinobi3: 6:14pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
LordReed:So, men created this need to preserve individual existence and societal structures? And they also created these societal structures themselves? Are you not speaking of an instinct then? In what way is that not the conscience I spoke of? Your first post was amply demonstrated to be incredibly ignorant. Nor am I the one who is confusing himself about needs and instincts. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 6:23pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
Ihedinobi3: I said "From men", did I say anything about creation? Abeg don't rope me into your creationism mantras. In what way is it ignorant? Your fairytale book or god does not mention porn but you guys interpret it to condemn porn and then say I am ignorant? Of what exactly? I am glad to be confused of real things, not of magic sky daddy and its cohorts. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by Ihedinobi3: 6:32pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
LordReed:I asked you where the need and societal structure came from, and you said, "from men". How does that not mean that the need and societal structure were created by men? And you neglected to mention that until now even though I explained to you that pornography was addressed as much as any other sexual depravity through the instruction to "flee porneia"? You realize that you are being dishonest now, don't you? Indeed. A need that came from nowhere and an instinct that is self-existing, well done. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 7:36pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
Ihedinobi3: I need to avoid uses of creation around you before you start claiming I want to usurp the god's position. Of course needs are not "created" by men, it arises from nature however societal structures are indeed made by men. Gosh, na wa for this guy. Is porneia a specific mention of pornography? It is you who are telling us that porneia refers to pornography, the writer was not talking about PORNOGRAPHY. BTW the root of the word pornography is not porneia but pornographos "(one) depicting prostitutes," from porne "prostitute," originally "bought, purchased" (with an original notion, probably of "female slave sold for prostitution", related to pernanai "to sell" (from PIE *perə-, variant of root *per- (5) "to traffic in, to sell" + graphein "to write". LMFAO! Now you've jumped to some absurd nonsense I don't know where you got them from. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by Ihedinobi3: 7:48pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
LordReed:So, the nature of human beings themselves is the source of the social mores you spoke of. Good, I agree. As I said before, the human conscience alone is sufficient to tell us what is right and wrong. That is the source of the social mores you are fighting. In other words, it is not some nebulous quantity called society that tells us that pornography is wrong, it is our collective conscience. Read my first response to you again. I discussed the etymology there. No, you seemed to be suggesting that social mores have no source. Atheism is always fighting hard to decouple things from a source that forces acceptance of the existence of God. Well, if social mores don't self-exist, they come from somewhere. If they come from human nature, as you have finally admitted, then they are the product of human conscience - which can also be called a set of moral instincts. The human conscience is very strong proof of the existence of a Moral Authority from which source it derives its objective moral imperatives. That Moral Authority is, by definition, God. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 8:49pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
Ihedinobi3: You aren't born with a developed conscience if that is what you are suggesting. Every man has his conscience developed by the environment and people he finds himself. So now you are going to go to 'read my first post'? I think I should start telling you that and save myself some trouble. Where did I make such a suggestion? There is no decoupling going on because it wasn't coupled in the first place. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by HardMirror(m): 9:33pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
NnennaG6:intelligent and detailed. Weldone. |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by Ihedinobi3: 10:07pm On Mar 19, 2019 |
LordReed:I am not sure what your first paragraph is saying. Are we born with a conscience, only it's undeveloped? What would that mean exactly? Then again, how do the environment and other people develop the conscience? If I gave you a discussion of the etymology there, is it reasonable to demand that I address it again now as though I never did before? Still, the point was this: I accounted for what you said there. In other words, social mores have no source? What really is your position? Do social mores have a source or not? |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 8:31am On Mar 20, 2019 |
Ihedinobi3: It means exactly that, conscience is a developed trait which is influenced by the society and people in your environment. Every child learns first by emulating the people it first encounters, usually the parents then assimilating the culture of the wider society, these are the things that develop the conscience. If a child grows up in a society where eating pork is the norm for example, it will not develop a conscience that tells him/her that it is wrong while the a child who grows up with the notion that eating pork is wrong will have a conscience that niggles him/her whenever pork as food is mentioned. Yes it is reasonable you discuss it because I have brought new information that counters what you posted before. It is an unreasonable response to ask me to go look at your first post in the light of the new information. The question was, where did I suggest such a thing? Are you are being dishonest now? |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by TV01(m): 1:26pm On Mar 20, 2019 |
LordReed:Ok - I don't agree and I found it garbled . LordReed:As if this higher cogitative capacity cannot and does not marshal any purely instinctive behaviour – especially given some of the possible outcomes. Speaking of which, please provide examples of this instinctive drive in humans. LordReed:I did not make any such claim. It is man’s God given higher cogitative ability and, the primacy of it, that allows civilisations to form. Don't let your anxiety around the scripture and your discomfort with God befuddle you. LordReed:Either, or - semantics unnecessary. You are free to your view on God and the scriptures. LordReed:As you are welcome to yours and to comments about mine - a right I am happy to apply in return. LordReed:You do - clearly LordReed:At all - I just don't hide behind instinct and point to dumb beasts, whilst in possession of a higher cogitative capacity and being created in the image of God. SuperSaintly TV |
Re: There's Nothing Wrong In Watching Porn. Change My Mind by LordReed(m): 1:40pm On Mar 20, 2019 |
TV01: LMFAO while SMDH. Nothing worth responding to here really except the bolded. Examples: a child knowing how to suck, never missing your mouth when you eat, your eyes noticing movement in your peripheral vision, etc. All of them built from survival mechanics aka instincts. |
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